Good Life Project - Tapping Alter-Egos to Unlock Hidden-Potential: Todd Herman

Episode Date: January 29, 2019

What if there was a pill that would give you instant access to your greatest potential every time you needed it most?What if that pill was free, had zero side-effects and worked in nearly every domain of life. Especially the ones where so many struggle, from public-speaking and socializing to high-stakes decision-making, sports and nearly any other endeavor where being at your best mattered? And, what if you had an endless supply in your pocket, 24-7, for the rest of your life?According to this week's guest, founder and elite-performance advisor, Todd Herman, there is. But, it's not a pill. It's something you do, a peak performance power-tool he's taught his clients for decades, from Olympic and pro athletes to CEOs, founders and performers. It's what he calls the "Alter Ego Effect," and it's all about tapping the power of secret-identifies, creating and stepping into them to change not only the way your brains works, but also the way your body performs in an instant.Todd shares the entire Alter Ego methodology, along with the science behind it and a wide-array of case-studies in his new book, The Alter Ego Effect (https://amzn.to/2RECL1n). In this week's conversation, we explore what shuts so many of us down when we most need to be at our best, how Todd came to understand and then develop the power of alter egos, and how we can tap their power in work, play and life.For a deeper-dive into Todd's "origin story," check out our 2016 conversation (https://www.goodlifeproject.com/podcast/todd-herman/)----------Have you discovered your Sparketype yet? Take the Sparketype Assessment™ now. IT’S FREE (https://www.goodlifeproject.com/sparketypes/) and takes about 7-minutes to complete. At a minimum, it’ll open your eyes in a big way. It also just might change your life.Thank you to our super cool brand partners. If you like the show, please support them - they help make the podcast possible. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

So we've all had those moments where all we want to do is show up and be at our absolute best, whether it's as a parent, partner, in your professional life, as a performer, an athlete, an executive, an artist, whatever it may be. We have those windows of time where everything's on the line. Sometimes they're the blink of an eye. Sometimes it's an entire season of our life. But we need to access everything that we have to show up with everything that we've got and perform at a level that we hope we're ready for. And I have always been deeply fascinated with how we do that and how some people seem to have the ability to do it on a much higher level and much more frequently. I got really curious about that. A longtime friend of mine, Todd Herman, has been on the show before as we explored sort of his personal journey, but he also earns his living working with many of the highest performing people across all domains in the world and has spent decades deconstructing the psychology, the behavior change, the mindset, the belief systems that allowed people to go to that place where magic happens to access it more readily

and to stay there for longer. And he has been doing work around the concept of alter egos that I have become kind of fascinated by. He has a new book out called The Alter Ego Effect, which deep dives into it. But I asked Todd to come back into the studio because I wanted to explore this with him and really understand what this thing is, how this tool works, how I might integrate it into my life and also deconstruct it a bit to share with you how it might help you. Really excited to share this conversation. I'm Jonathan Fields, and this is Good Life Project. The Apple Watch Series We need him. Y'all need a pilot. Flight risk. The Apple Watch Series 10 is here.

It has the biggest display ever. It's also the thinnest Apple Watch ever, making it even more comfortable on your wrist, whether you're running, swimming, or sleeping. And it's the fastest-charging Apple Watch, getting you eight hours of charge in just 15 minutes. The Apple Watch Series 10. Available for the first time that we have hung out in the studio here at GLPHQ. Second jam time together.

Right. And so for those of you who would love to dive deep into Todd's sort of like own personal journey, we'll certainly link in the show notes to that sort of deep dive. I asked Todd to come in today because there is kind of a secret project that he's been working on for, I guess, really decades. Yes, it is. It's 15 years. Yeah, which kind of blows my mind.

And it is one thing that you do that is an astonishing lock key to a certain extent for performance. And you've shared bits and pieces of it with me over the years. And even with the little nuggets you've dropped, I'm like, tell me more, tell me more, tell me more. Like what is really going on here? So you've now spent a chunk of time turning this into a book. And I kind of wanted to go deep into this with you and share it with everybody here. So it's all around this idea of secret identities.

Let's zoom the lens out just for a heartbeat too. You spend the vast majority of your day and you have spent the vast majority of the last two decades of your life working with people who are at the top 5%, top 1% of their fields across all domains. Yeah. I would put it probably in that top, yeah, top 2% definitely. So why did they come to you? Well, the nature of, I think, doing anything that demands that you're at the top level,

not even the top level, just anytime you're trying to make change happen, the greatest factor that's going to stop that from happening is typically yourself, like you getting in your own way. And so people come to me for really just mental, mental toughness strategies and being able to perform at your absolute peak level of performance and allowing all of the capabilities and skills that you've developed that you truly have inside of you right now, show up on your field of play without, you know, the restrictions of the way that you think about yourself or the judgments and worries of others or imposter syndrome or any one of these other little hidden forces that the enemy likes to use to pull you and keep you on the sidelines and not show up like you know that you can. Yeah. I'm so consistently blown away by how much of that actually is internal limitations

versus structural limitations or physical limitations. I mean, when you hear stories about, I was actually listening to an elite runner sharing a story about how he had spent years trying to break the four minute mile and he finally did. And he got down to like 350 or something like that. But then he spent like another five years trying to get past that and he couldn't. And then he was running a race one day and like his halfway mark,

somebody held up a card showing he was on pace for like 10 seconds faster than he had ever run, which seemed impossible. So he got done. And in fact, at the end, he was, he didn't just break his best by one second, he broke it by like 10 seconds. And then people were like, what happened?

Like, how did you do that? And he's like, well, I saw, you know, halfway through you held up the card that shows that I was like faster than I ever was. So I just kept on that pace. And they were like, actually, I saw, you know, halfway through you held up the car that shows that I was like faster than I ever was. So I just kept on that pace. And they were like, actually, that was a mistake. Like you weren't any faster. You picked it all up.

Like something happened. And it was, he didn't train differently. Yeah. Something happened in his brain. That was the only difference. Yeah. There's a strategy that we work with when we're working with like triathletes or marathon runners that, you know, everyone talks about that 21st or 20th mile breakthrough kind of point where just-

Yeah, the wall. The wall, right? Yeah. And I talk about just the power of what the mind can do and how you can actually take a rest and let someone or something else take over. So what we do is if you were standing, if you had your back to me, I'd get you to stand up and lean back

and I'd put my hand in the middle of your back. And then I would start pushing you forward. But I want you to keep leaning into my hand and feel like I am carrying you with my power forward. And so we do that as a visualization strategy or an imagination strategy of when you start to feel like you wanna take a break, you can absolutely take a break.

Just lean back and imagine a hand resting on your back and pushing you forward. And I have, just me doing a speech on that at a runner's room in Edmonton, Alberta, Canada, there were eight people who looped back around 10 days later and said they had their absolute best, personal best time because of just that idea that someone else, and I mean, people can say that, and they do, I like giving

people a strategy and then not telling them who or what is holding them up, but people would be like, I was imagining. So if they're spiritual religious people, it'd be God or Jesus. Or if it was someone who had a deep connection to another mentor, it was their mentor pushing them forward or as a grandma or mom or dad or something like that. And just the power of what the mind can do. Yeah, it's really mind blowing, right? But it's also so hard. I think it's one of those things

where until you have experienced it, like you hear about it, come on, like, isn't that just blowing smoke? Like, isn't that, like smoke? Like, you know, isn't that like there, you know, we are who we are, you know, we have the same body, the same limitations, the same skill set, the same knowledge base. And how could it be that quote easy that that's really, you know, there's this one switch that you have to flip and everything changes. Because, I mean, you know, people are like, well, if it was that easy, everybody would be doing it. Well, I mean, it's all, it's all sitting there for people to untap. Definitely. Like it's the idea that I think most people in their lives in different areas of their lives are operating with the emergency brake on at some level,

whether it's pulled straight up and you're revving the engine as fast as you, or as hard as you possibly can. And you feel like you're not getting a return on the amount of effort that you're putting into things and you're wearing yourself out. Well, there is something, you know, internally, there's an internal battle or friction point that's there. And so my job is to come in and just, you know, pop that button on that emergency brake and just start to release it down. And literally with the same amount of effort and energy that people are putting in, a completely different result happens. And so I'm looking at trying to shift paradigms, get people to see things in different ways, see themselves in a different way, or in what we were talking about before with secret identities and alter egos, instead of me trying to change you, I'm not gonna touch you.

Instead, we're going to allow you to step into someone or something else that has the superpowers or the characteristics of the way that you wanna be operating already. And you operate through that. And it's been proven out by tons of science and different studies and experiments. Plus the great thing about this, and I say it in the book is,

this isn't me that's inventing a new concept for you. The great thing about this is, this is a remembering. Like that's how I kind of really feel about this book. And you know, the movement I want to push behind this is that this is like this great remembering of like, you have done this. We have all played with this idea in the past of whether we were kids and we were, you know,

playing a cowboy or we were playing a fireman or we were playing a nurse or we were playing some sort of superhero. We all do that. And it's actually the one great power that human beings have. It's actually the one, one of the few things that makes us unique on this planet, which is the ability to suspend disbelief about who and what we are and step into something completely different. You know, we can make a heaven from hell and a hell from heaven. Only human beings can do that. And that's because we're gifted

with this creative imagination. And so this was always one of my number one tools I would use with athletes or any performer that I'd working with, whether they were on Broadway or in the arts or their're business owners and entrepreneurs is, no, no, I'm not here to try to fix you. Because that idea is that you are somehow broken. I don't see it that way at all.

I think that there is a whole group of different skills you just haven't tapped into yet, or you've forgotten what that I'm just gonna give to you. And then it's gonna release what's already there. So it's like you show up with a toolbox that helps people slowly ratchet the emergency brake from partially to fiercely engaged down as close to completely open as possible.

It can be slowly or it can be immediate. Like it's, I had an experience with this one young hockey player that I was working with and worked with him on a Wednesday. And he was going away for a weekend camp where all of the different collegiate coaches were at to kind of, you know, vet the kids and who they were going to give scholarships to and all that kind of stuff. So there's like a ton on the line. Ton on the line. Yeah. And so that was going to be a Friday, Saturday and Sunday in Las vegas so we flew down from canada for this thing and his dad called me it was saturday um at lunchtime is when he called and uh he said uh what did you talk to justin about uh and i was like in my head i was like oh

boy what did i do i somehow messed him up i broke him i broke him like damn um and and i said uh why you know the whole let me get clarification before I actually admit to anything. Um, and he said, uh, Todd, I've never seen him play like this before. It's, he is standing on his head and he is performing way beyond any of the other guys that are on the ice. And these are literally the best of the best hockey players coming out of high school, going off onto the

collegiate level. And, and I said, well, it's really, you can ask, you can ask him about it and he can tell you, but I just simply gave him, you know, maybe a different person to operate through other than, you know, the, the kind of self that he was taking out there that was kind of wounded and dented and all that kind of stuff. And yeah, he ended up getting a full ride scholarship offers to many schools and ended up playing that kind of stuff. And yeah, he ended up getting a full ride scholarship offers to many schools and ended up playing at University of Vermont. Yeah.

I mean, it's kind of interesting too, because it's the type of thing where I think if you're alive on the planet and you're striving towards something big in some way, shape or form, or, you know, like over and over in different domains of your life, at some point, I think we all,

we feel moments like that. You know, sometimes it's last a second, sometimes it lasts an hour, sometimes it lasts a day, sometimes it lasts a season. But very few of us, me included, raising my hand, understand what just happened and how do I replicate it? How do I actually make this continue to happen? Because I have no idea. I just know something changed. There's magic happening. I'm performing the gap between what I know to be my full capabilities and where I'm operating has somehow closed dramatically, but I don't know how or why, and I don't know how to sustain it. And maybe even it just left and I have no idea how to get it back. Yeah. So is the question there,

how do we do that consistently? Yeah. I mean, and I think is, I guess the sense is like, you can't actually do that consistently unless and until you know what's actually happening. Well, I think that's the dangerous thing when it comes to performance and kind of unpacking this stuff. Okay. And that is that we want to try to figure it out. And like, so that we can, so that we think that in the figuring out, we can replicate it. And yet it's the very opposite of how flow state and zone state ever happen. Because the moment you try to make it a conscious process, you've now moved the, you've moved the needle away from even coming close to getting that center point of the zone and the flow. Like you're, you're, you're forcing it and it's an allowing,

it's a letting happening. And, and the term allowing doesn't sound like that's the term that someone in like the peak performance, you know, world would be talking about, or, you know, top athletes around the world, because, you know, they're strong and they're powerful and all that kind of thing. But really there's a trust that has to happen. And that's really the one word that I'm always focused on when I'm working with anyone who I'm trying to help them with their performance is how can I get them to fully

and completely trust themselves? And when you think about how daunting of a challenge, that's a really daunting challenge for anyone because people have personal traumas in their past. There's wounds that sit there that, you know, they use to help define them or hold them back or they hold onto them because it serves them in some way. There's narratives of family and, you know,

the world around them that ends up shaping people's personalities. And then there's, you know, the classic imposter syndrome stuff that people don't feel like they're good enough or smart enough or they're not skilled enough or not enough accolades or whatever the case is. So just the idea of getting someone to trust themselves is a very difficult thing. However, it is 100% where I'm always focused because when I can get that person to trust themselves, then everything that they've got, that they've worked on can flow out of them. And so going back to your kind of statement around, you know, figuring it out or like, how do I do this again? It's, it's a dangerous kind of rabbit hole to go down. Whereas just know that it's there and you can access it. And so the attitude is more of,

I wonder when it's going to happen again. And then it's that passive seeking, which again, these are all terms, like frames of reference that people, when they hear me talk about it, are like, that doesn't sound like something that you would be saying. Right. It's like, what about the striving? What about the pushing?

What about the aggressive movement towards? Yeah. And that's going to get you a result, definitely. But if your whole focus and the initiative is to get to that beautiful kind of zone state and flow state where just you're almost observing yourself in the activity, there has to be an allowing and there has to be a wondering that needs to be there. And it's more of an exploration of it. Like there's a relaxed tension that's there. And it's amazing when you get there, but it can only be found typically when you completely trust yourself.

And actually, this is the funny thing. I was gonna say this to you earlier. I thought this is where you're going with the story of the marathon runner. I had a client I was talking to the other day who's a player in the NHL, so National Hockey League. And he was not feeling, he was really sick actually that day. And internally, I get really, really excited anytime one of my clients tells me that they've got the flu, specifically

the flu, not a cold, but the flu. And it's because if they go and they perform, undoubtedly it'll be one of their greatest personal performances they will ever have. Why? Because the level of expectation that they have, that they're going to go out there and do anything that's good is completely gone. And they're going out and they're surviving. That's it. They're going out to survive and survival is this magical place where the flow in the zone state loves to hit. And I mean, Michael Jordan's one of his, and he says it's his greatest performance of his career was when he had the flu and he played against the Utah Jazz in the NBA finals. And he had, it was the one where he stopped short on John Stockton and, you know,

lobbed up the jump shot to win it all kind of thing. And he had to be carried off the court. And it's just, you're out there. It's, I mean, I get the chills just thinking about it. Every time. It's so fascinating to hear you say that, you know, I've never performed at that level, right? But when I think about moments in my past, when I have been where there is a moment, there's something that I need to show up and do,

and I need to be at my best. And I have felt like death, you know? So I have, for my whole life, I've gotten headaches. And every once in a while, a time coincides where I need to be on, and my head is, it feels like it's gonna explode out of me, or I'm really, really sick, like you said.

But there's a moment where there are 90 minutes where my job is to show up and be exceptional. And I'm having flashbacks while you're saying this because I'm thinking to myself, okay, so there had been these freaky moments where even back when I was teaching yoga and there would be like a room wall to wall with bodies who are surrendering 90 minutes

of their hard earned time to me. My job is not to show up and be like mopey and complainy and low energy. It is to give them what, like to give everything possible to them. And I'm remembering these moments where I was like, I felt like death. And I was like, you know what? I just, I have to go. This is what I'm here to do, but I need to just surrender to whatever come, like whatever can come out of me, it's just going to happen. And those invariably would be the times where like time would fugue.

During that 90 minute window, I would lose track of the fact that I was actually feeling like death. I'd feel like that again the minute after. And then people would be like lined up afterwards saying to me, what just happened in that room? What happened to you? Like what, that was what?

It's amazing. Like what? And I'm like, I don't know, but right now I need to crawl back into bed. So it's so interesting you share that. But you used a really important word. Another way to kind of just verbalize it is you talked about surrendering to it, right?

Yeah. And that's what we're, you know, it's the allowing, it's the trusting. So it's that surrendering to that moment that's there. And so, you know, I talk about the, you know, the easiest analogy that I can use when it, you know, I talk about the, you know, the easiest analogy that I can use when it comes to an athlete is, is a skier just from like the danger perspective. You know, they're standing at the top of a ski hill with a, a grade that looks like

it's the side of a cliff kind of thing. And they're supposed to, you know, wrap or, you know, chase their skis around, you know, these flags going down at a rate of speed that is going to pass any vehicle on a freeway. And if they have seeds of doubt, you know, now the chances of their edge of their blade of their ski catching, you know, a puff of even snow and sending them careening off into the orange gate goes way up. So it's about surrendering to the moment. And then you can only surrender to it when you trust your practice routine, when you trust the plan that you put in place, when you trust your skills and capabilities. And you trust, again, that plan and that path

that you've laid out and you just go, and we have these trigger words that we use. So it's like, some people say at the, so the last words out of their mouth going from their kind of conscious mind is let go and let God for some of them. Cause there are a lot of people that are athletes are deeply spiritual, religious,

or it's just let's go or let it rip. Like the word let comes up a lot. And I always say, and I actually got this from one of my mentors, Jim Rohn, that the most powerful word in leadership is the word let's. Instead of you go do it, let's go do it. And even for parenting, instead of like, you go clean your room, let's go clean your room, right?

Just subtle little thing. But the word let is, that's that allowing, that's that surrendering. That's so interesting. The Apple Watch Series 10 is here. It has the biggest display ever. It's also the thinnest Apple Watch ever, making it even more comfortable on your wrist,

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Mayday, mayday. We've been compromised. The pilot's a hitman. I knew you were going to be fun. On January 24th. Tell me how to fly this thing. Mark Wahlberg. You know what the difference between me and you is? You're going to die.

Don't shoot him, we need him. Y'all need a pilot. Flight Risk. So when you think about the toolkit that you bring to any interaction with anyone that you're working with, and also I think it's probably important in the context of this conversation. Yes, you were working with all of these elite performers, but it's the exact same experience and the exact same set of tools with anybody who simply wants to understand how to show up at their best at any given moment, any given experience, whatever it is in life. So this is like, this is, this applies to everybody. Yeah. It's a universal concept. This has nothing to do with it being now it's something that is people go, you know, Oh, that makes sense that an athlete would do that. Or that makes sense that, you know, uh, Beyonce Knowles is going to use Sasha

Fierce to go out there. David Bow Bowie is gonna use Ziggy Stardust to go out there and allow their creative expression to get out of them. But I'm a consultant or I'm a teacher or I'm a, yeah, but everyone's performing. We're all tasked with some responsibility that is upon us to get a certain result. And many people aren't getting the best result

that they could, even though that they know they can. I mean, I know you and I know the type of people that you hang out with and I know the people that you're gonna be attracting onto this podcast. And there are probably a great majority of the people here that have got a lot of skill. But when they look at the end of their week or their end of the

month and they go, gee, that doesn't feel like I, I I'm getting the return on what I know I can be doing. I'm not getting as much out there as I want to be producing or something like that. Or simply like, like I know, like there were five moments where I had so much more to give. I was capable of so much more and yet I wasn't showing up in that way. Yeah. And so we call those moments of impact. You know, a game has a moment of impact. When you're competing against another competitor, there are these moments of impact.

And those moments of impact, which are typically when the white hot light of performance shines its brightest on you. You know, it's the moment when as a salesperson, you're supposed to say, so should we move forward? Right. And then how many people don't say those words? That's a moment of impact. And depending on how you view that, uh, that role of being a salesperson or how you view other people where you're just like, oh, I don't want to be pushy, you know, and all that narrative, it's not true. There's, there's no, there's no truth in the fact that just simply by asking someone to move forward, that that's a bad thing, but to you, it might be a bad thing. And so that's a moment of impact where you're sort of shirking your performance responsibility. Well, that's a great moment to, you know what, leave yourself on the sidelines, like that self

that you're kind of identifying with right now. And let's bring out Wonder Woman. Let's bring out a grizzly bear. If it's for some people, let's bring out a completely different character. I've got Ziva David, who is the female character in the show NCIS. There's a young squash player that I coached and that was hers. She's a young Jewish girl. She loved the idea of using Ziva David as her alter ego or her secret identity because she just, it was everything that she wanted to be, but she didn't feel like, feel like she was. And so she would let other athletes basically beat her up on the court, despite the fact that she had phenomenal training and skill. And so she took Ziva David out on her, on the court for the first time. And she didn't win the tournament that weekend,

but she made it to the semifinals, which was like two levels higher than anything that she had ever done before. And that's who she took out there was Ziva David. So when you're talking about this idea of stepping into an alter ego, stepping into a different being, a different identity, what's important about, you know, and so so, A, why do we really do it? I mean, is it because it allows us to step out of, you know, the constraints, the restrictors

of who we feel that we are and allow it to step into maybe an identity that we assume doesn't have those constraints or has different capabilities? Yeah, it's tapping into just the way that the human mind works. We all take a look at someone else and go, oh, their life looks easier over there. No one knows how hard I've got it right now. Right. That's just what we do as human beings. And we all do. It's the grass is greener on the other side thing many times, you know, even to people that when we've heard their incredible story on 60 minutes or any other amazing documentary that have gone through some incredible trial and tribulation, and we'll still go, oh, she learned all of that mental toughness

or internal fortitude from that experience. I wish I had something like that. Cause then I would be stronger too. Like it's, it's just what human beings do. So all we're doing when we're using and leveraging an alter ego secret identity is we're leveraging the grass is greener on the other side effect of, wow, like we desire to have those superhero characteristics from that other person or those superpowers.

And we're exactly, we're leaving that insecurity that we have about what we can do on the sidelines. And we're gonna now perform through those characteristics. And that's a natural thing. Like this is not about being fake because being fake is really when you're not taking all that you can do

out onto the field and letting it really just show up for you. That's being fake because now the world around you is judging you not on truly who and what you can do and what you really are. And so, I mean, if this is a trick that we're going to use and deploy to help you to get out there and do what you want to do, then who cares if you're leveraging Wonder Woman or you're using Batman or you're using Ziva David or, you know, Anne of Green Gables or whoever it might be. Yeah. I mean, when you talk about it that way, I can, I completely get it. And at the same time, I also wonder whether, um, not only are you not being fake, but this person or whoever it is, whether it's

made up, whether you just assigned the identities, the name, whatever it looks like, that is a part of you. That is a hundred percent in there. It has always been in there. And it's sort of the gateway to allow you to step into a fuller set of potentials, but it's so trippy. It's so different. Maybe you associate ego or something else with it that we just won't let ourselves step into it if we feel like it's actually us. Yeah, and I love to just challenge people with the idea. What does you even mean?

Like, who are you? Because you have been shaped by tens of thousands of little subtle moments over your entire life by many other people that you adopted into your unconscious as just who you are. And all I'm saying is, is if the, who you are, if there is some tension between, because if you don't have any tension right now between what is truly happening in your world and the results that you're getting and who and how you define yourself,

then don't use an alter ego then. That's okay. But for those people- I don't think I've met that person. I don't think I have either. At least in like being honest with themselves. Yeah. And again, and that's not to say that you're a bad person if you're doing that.

It's very much a human thing. Like we're naturally intrinsically motivated for growth and always sort of expanding outwards. Because we all know fundamentally there's just a polarity on the opposite end of that, which is decay. You're either growing or you're decaying. There is no in between there. Because it defies nature if there wasn't in-between because in nature things grow or they decay. That's it. And human beings operate the same way. So yeah, you've got that natural, it's just a natural tension of, I want more of what I have in me to show up out there because fundamentally human beings

are very good people. Despite what we hear and see on the news all the time, that is extraordinarily small percentage of humanity that operates that way. And so a lot of the big reasons why we want to get out there and perform better is simply because it's going to allow us to make an impact on other people are the people that we care about, or the communities that we care about, or whatever the case might be. And I have yet to see someone deploying and using an alter ego in my world,

and I've done this now for 15 plus years, it hurt or harm them in any way. Because, jeez, if the worst thing that happened was someone was actually a little bit more playful with life and a little bit easier on themselves, because the great thing about using these alter egos, I've got many tennis players that I've worked with over the years that have played at the highest level. And when they're out there on the court and they're operating through their alter ego, one of my clients, she's in the book when I talk about her, how one of her core values is fairness. Okay. And fairness is a great quality to have, but when you're in competition,

fairness can get in your way. And so when you are always, if you see yourself as a single self with all the same values that are operating on every single field that you live on and operate in vocation and, youation and sport and fitness or health and wellbeing or spirituality and family and on and on and on. Some of these values can actually get in the way of you performing to your capability. And so hers was fairness.

And what would happen is she was just an extremely great tennis player. She would get up on people very quickly, but then that little unconscious value system would start to kick in. And she would start to feel bad that she was beating someone so bad. It's like, you're not supposed to run up the score.

It's like, it's okay to win. Yeah. But it's like the coach pulling the A team and like putting it because we don't want to beat them that badly. Yeah. Because she would just automatically start to feel for that other person on the side.

And then she would just unconsciously start to pull back. And the worst thing that can happen in sport is momentum. Because an inferior player with momentum can beat a superior player anytime. And that's what would happen is she would, that was her moniker, was the classic, she should be winning more majors, but she's not. And so anyways, we started working together and I noticed her fairness come up when we were, it was a lunch here in New York City

at one of my favorite places over on the East side called Penelope's. It's got the best BLT in the city. It's amazing. And when it came time for the check to come, I grabbed it right away and she was like she started like tugging on it with me it was like weird

and awkward and I was like no no no I've got this I've got this Rachel and she's like no no you got the last two I have to get this one and then just sort of a bunch of other events happened in my head sort of quickly of some of our interactions and I'm like fairness that is that one of those of our interactions that I'm like, fairness, that is

that one of those hidden little forces that has pulled her onto the sidelines when it comes to her performance. And so we created an alter ego that didn't value that specific thing. And then that went out on the court. And so anytime fairness started to creep up in her performance, immediately what happens, and we talk about in the book, just how healthy it is to actually be able to have a conversation in your head between your alter ego and sometimes the hidden enemy. And we name the enemy sometimes as well. Well, most of the time we do because it's really healthy to call something a name. Because the moment you give shape and form to something, it's no longer that kind of, you know, black hidden ghost that's lurking in the corners. When you give form and shape to something,

now you can touch it, now you can feel it, now you can push it to the sidelines and all that. And so when she would start to have this kind of vent of taking her foot off the gas, she would say, listen, this is my court. This is my field. You get to the sidelines and we would use typically a lot more colorful language because we're in the heat of competition because that's where you live. Fairness lives out there. It does

not belong on this court. You know, I'll be done soon kind of thing. And it's about really claiming what that field is about for you. It's super powerful and like really uplifting to the person. So, and this is literally the alter ego talking to you. Yeah. Or the enemy. Cause it's not that you, because I'm not- Right, talking to like the part of you that's constraining or holding you back or tripping you up. Just that natural shadow, that natural enemy, that natural force that is always in all of us, that we're always kind of going to battle with that wants to just keep us safe. Cause it's that, you know, whether it's that wounded child that's inside of us or something like that, that doesn't want us to, you know, have the bright, hot, white spotlight on us.

I mean, it's interesting. You mentioned how important it is to name that. You call it, you call it the enemy. The enemy is part of you. And yet you're, you're almost disembodying it and giving a separate identity, which to a certain extent lets you battle it, but you're dissociating it. So it's not like you're shaming yourself. That's the biggest thing. So interesting. It's so big. Because in the beginning, I didn't have that distinction.

And so we were kind of shooting arrows back at ourselves in the beginning. And then I was like, wait a second. No, this isn't. I'm not yelling back at Todd. And again, this is from my own experience because I use these alter egos for myself when I played football, wait a second, no, this isn't, I'm not yelling back at Todd. And again, this is from my own experience because I use these alter egos for myself when I played football, then college football. And so I would be talking at Todd that way,

but it wasn't Todd that was the enemy. Todd was being pulled as well by this hidden force, this enemy as well, which we all live with. And so then we give it a name. And so mine, I just gave it the name Gremlin, which is not a fairly unpopular term but um rachel her enemy's name was dave and dave was uh like many of my clients we use when we find bullies in their past and and that's what the enemy is it's a bully it's there to kind of you know know, mute and dim your light in some way.

And when you think of it, like the enemy's now name is Dave. Okay, like that seems a fairly accessible thing for me. It's like, Dave, get to the sideline. Like that's just as a conversation in your head, extraordinarily healthy. Yeah, and all of a sudden, like you're having, like you have a host of people living in your head

while you're stepping into this place, but which brings up like another question for me. So one of the things that you offered earlier was that so often the magic happens when you just, when you get out of your head, when you stop the cognitive process and you allow yourself to sort of like drop into this blissful barrier, you know, obliterating state of flow when you're in the zone. How do you balance the idea of being in that space where everything feels like it's just ethereal and you're completely out of a cognitive process with this sort of much more deliberate conversation between parts of yourself. Well, the one thing that it isn't doing to you that is going to pull you into a conscious trap is trying to think your way out of it consciously where I'm going to like, you know, when you're not using something like this and you're kind of defining your field of play where, you know, this particular performer, alter ego, identity, you, whatever you want to call it, a persona is going to go and exist. If you don't have that kind of great delineation between it, now you're going to try and outthink your way from an unconscious process because you don't even realize that this hidden force is there.

Like when I've shared with many sports communities that fairness is actually typically one of the core enemies of performance. I've had, you know, I was on a panel once with a former pro athlete. Yeah, I bet that didn't go over well. No, no, no. It went like, no, they started to cry. Right. Like right there. Cause they were like, oh my God, where were you?

Right. It's like, wow. That is exactly now I get myself. And so having that conversation, because there is so much passion and energy typically behind it of like, no enemy, you get to the sidelines. It's that talking tough. Like it's that you're taking complete ownership of the space that you're standing in. That alone is such a powerful mindset to be in because what you're actually doing and the intent of it is that you are trying to protect also that ability to get into that zone and flow state.

And it's that, you know, classic guardian at the gate that that alter ego is doing to protect the core self, the core self, which is this complete place of unlimited possibility for you from creative expression standpoint. Again, like I said at the very beginning, that one of the things that makes us truly unique on this planet is our creative imagination and what is possible from it. But we just put so many limiters on it because of who and how we define ourselves and what we're capable of.

And who am I to like just all these different things. But when you truly honor that there is something that's brewing up inside of you and the alter ego can be the guardian at the gate that protects that pure source of energy. I just get chills thinking about it because I've seen it so many times where people are shocked at what they're able to do now.

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Tell me how to fly this thing. Mark Wahlberg. You know what the difference between me and you is? You're going to die. Don't shoot him. We need him. Y'all need a pilot. I've asked the question of myself in the past when I'm struggling with something and when there's a moment I have to sort of lean into it or make a big decision. I would ask myself, what would success do?

And I think what I was trying to get at is what would that alter ego of mine who I sort of like, if I gave it sort of like a person that was named success, but like an actual identity, what would that person do in this moment in time? You just use the word core self. And I know that underlying sort of like this idea of creating and stepping into an alter ego in order to be able to perform at your best level is an entire behavioral model

that you have sort of developed over the years. There's these five layers, the core self being at the base. Can you kind of walk me through? I know it can get pretty complex, but I think it might be helpful to just say, okay, so here's sort of like the five layers from the core out to the- Yeah, And the easiest way for you as a listener

to think about this is let's say that we're unpacking the earth's core. Okay. And so in the very center of this core we have, so the very center ball that's there is this idea of the core self. And we're going to come back to that in a second. And then there's another layer that sits outside of that layer. And that layer is where we have, it's a very hidden layer. And it's where we have things like our family values, things that end up shaping us at a very unconscious level. We take on these beliefs and these attitudes because of, again, you know, our family is a very powerful part of how we get shaped. Our nation sits there, our religions sit there, or the religious group that you're a part of, because you start acting like a Catholic or acting like a Jewish

person or whatever the case might be for someone. And, and then you start saying, well, I can't do that because I'm X and it happens very often. But then, so then, so that's a, that's a very powerful layer. Then the layer that goes out the outside of that is the belief layer. So the belief layer is where we have our attitudes, our beliefs about things, our perceptions about that we've learned very much over time as well. And that layer as well is extremely powerful because the moment that you start saying, I am something, you're creating and shaping this identity of who you are. And how we know something is a belief, by the way, is if something is true for you, but it's not true for me, then it's a belief. Like if we're walking outside

and we're both walking on a sidewalk, that's truth. That's true. I mean, we're both walking on a sidewalk, but if you see an older woman with a blue dress on and you go, man, like older women in blue dresses are just unattractive. Like, but that's not true.

That's true for you, but not true for me. So that's a belief that you would have, right? So, I mean, that's just a silly example, but, and I'm always trying to be mindful of like, what are some of these beliefs that people are kind of carrying with them that don't make any sense? Because we can shift and change those things.

Then beyond that, after the belief layer, then we get to this player or this layer, this action layer. Action layer is where you've got the skills that you've honed over time, the knowledge that you have, your capabilities. And that is then translated into your behaviors. And that's going to be determined by the following layer, which is the field of play, which is the environment that you're standing on, the situation that you might be in. That's why we talk about moments of impact are so important. And so we have many fields of play in our lives.

You know, we've got the field of play for our vacation or our work. We've got the field of play of like my home life and my family. I've got the field of play of my friends and how I interact there. And we all know, we all know that we're slightly different people

when we're around our kids than we are when we're around our friends or around our, our workplace. And so we have multiple selves that do show up in our world. And that's what this whole concept helps to unleash with people is to just notice and realize that there are many you's that go out there in the world and participate. The Todd that's with his three little kids at home is very different than the Todd that shows up in work and in my business. And my kids do not need, when I think about who shows up in my business, when I was first starting out, I was 21 years old. I looked like I was 12 years old and I was completely insecure about going out there and getting my message and my business in front of people because I just fundamentally felt like who's going to believe me because I look like I'm too young. Despite the fact that I was

really good at what I was doing, which was coaching young amateur athletes. Cause that's who I was skilled enough to work with at the time on mental toughness stuff, the stuff that I was very naturally good at. It was kind of my, um, my skill that I'd honed over time, but I just couldn't get myself to get out there and do anything. I wasn't marketing myself and doing what I needed to do. However, I did use an alter ego when I played football and I played football at a high level. I played badminton at a high level. I was a nationally ranked badminton player as well.

And I thought to myself, well, geez, if I could use it in sport, why can't I use it in business too? So I thought for a second, well, who would I wanna be? And it's typically the different person that I am right now, which I wanna be confident. I wanna be decisive. I wanna be articulate.

And then immediately I thought, okay, well, confident, decisive, articulate people, they wear glasses, which isn't true, right? Like me confident, articulate, and decisive people also don't wear glasses. But so I went out and I bought a pair of non-prescription glasses from LensCrafters up in Canada, where I'm from.

And where I was from, where I grew up. And when I would put those glasses on, that's who I was intentionally stepping into. And I was intentionally stepping into being Richard because that's actually my first name. And I thought Richard just sounds like more of a business name. Todd sounds like a younger person,

so I'll be Richard. And I was being very deliberate. Now, getting back to my kids, they don't need a confident, decisive and articulate dad. They need fun, playful, get on the ground and roll around with them and dad. And so, you know, that kind of alter ego that I adopted for my, my, my parenting was Mr. Rogers, just how, I mean, I don't know of another human being that could engage with young children better than him. And so when I'm home, that's what I'm influenced by is that.

So these five layers help us to identify the different fields that we perform on. And then it's also extremely helpful in me diagnosing where someone is tripping themselves up, you know, because if you actually have all of the skills and knowledge that's at the action layer, then that means there's something deeper deeper or it could be something on the field of play. Like, are you only showing up that way when your boss enters the room? So if you're articulate in meetings with the rest of the team, but then the moment the boss shows up in the room, well, okay, that's the one factor that has now changed in the circumstance. Well, now what, how are you looking at yourself or how are you looking at your boss? That's causing you to now kowtow or not show up like you can. And then we can adopt an alter ego

or a strategy to overcome that. And that probably also refers back into the inner layers because like, okay, so that's the circumstantial layer of the field the play layer but then is there is there a like a a third layer of belief or is there a deeper you know like value yeah which is somehow rippling out and informing that and show the values later as an example because i had a client that was like that was he grew up in a um an army family and was taught to never you know speak up or talk back to, not even talk back, but speak up or at anyone who's in a superior position of power. And that was the actual sticking point with them

when they were working with their boss and they didn't realize that it was that values layer, that deeper inner layer that was stopping them on that, or in that circumstance or that field. And then even then, just because they're aware of it, didn't mean that that was going to help them get over it.

So, you know, we adopted a different alter ego for them to be acting through in that moment to, you know, release what they wanted to, they wanted to speak up and say things. They just weren't doing it.

Yeah. I mean, it's so interesting. It's almost like the visual that pops into my mind is that the, the deeper layers are like your DNA and the, the outer layers are the environmental, the circumstance things. It's like the epigenetics that have the ability to, to turn off or turn off something in your DNA. And, you know, the understanding it is sort of like, like you said, understanding it gets you like,

you know, like part of the way there, but it doesn't actually change anything. Yeah. And the question becomes, okay, so how do I, how do I change the field of play? How do I change something deeper or more internal in myself? And the answer like, or one possibility

of actually stepping in, it's almost like you're stepping into a different DNA in order to actually be able to operate differently in that same field of play. Yeah. That's why I said, just go back to the beginning of the conversation where I said, the ability to suspend disbelief is so powerful for people. Again, that's why adopting the alter ego or the character or the persona of someone or something else that fundamentally doesn't have the same inner layer makeup that you do, but is now going to be able to express what you want to express, which is the stuff that you've worked hard at,

those skills, the knowledge, and the behaviors that you've developed. That's really powerful for people. I mean, and the behaviors that you've developed, that's really powerful for people. I mean, we already know that. Just because someone's aware of something doesn't mean that they're going to be able to change or that change occurs because of it.

No, it's like, if Derek, I love Derek Siver's quote. He's like, if information was the answer, we'd all have six pack abs and be billionaires. Like knowing it is not the, like it helps. Like it's the first step in. You mentioned a lot earlier in a conversation that there's actually research around some of these ideas. So one of my favorite things that I share in the book is the power of something called enclosed cognition. Okay. So one of the core principles of the alter ego model and this alter ego effect is that we always give you a totem or

an artifact. We want you to either wear something, have something with you that allows you to trigger that kind of alter ego. That's a representation of the power of that secret identity. And for me, it was those glasses. When I put those glasses on, I was being extremely intentional about who was going to show up out there. I was not going to take that, you know, insecure version of myself out there that was so concerned about what other people was thinking of them or were thinking of me. And I'm going to show up as someone who's confident that is decisive and is going to articulate my point for people so that I can help them get the result that they're looking for. But the moment that, because you can do this, the moment that that internal part of you starts to wind itself back into that negative behavior area, my glasses came off immediately. Because I would never allow Richard to be insecure.

I needed to protect that alter ego at all costs. Richard wouldn't even have the thought of being insecure. Just like, you know, one woman would never have the thought that she couldn't fundamentally in the end, get the job done, that she couldn't face down that, you know, evil enemy kind of thing. So you need to honor that alter ego. And it turns out there's a lot of power in it. And this idea of enclosed cognition, the Kellogg School of Management did a study around this and they brought a bunch of students into a room and they had this kind of word puzzle on the wall. And I don't know if anyone here has ever practiced with this before, but there's a puzzle that has the word of a color,

and then the color is different, then the word that it's colored in is different than the word itself. So if it was yellow, it would be printed in orange, and if it was blue, it would be done in brown and all that. And so what you need to do is go through the puzzle and say the word as it's written instead of the color that you're seeing. It's extremely challenging.

I've done it. I've done that. It's brutal. Wait, I'm smarter than this. And it was like a five by five grid. So there's like 25 boxes on there. So they brought these students in and they timed them to see how quickly they could get through the puzzle. Then they bring in another group and they hand them a white coat. And the white coat, they said, this is a painter's smock.

Okay. And they wanted to see how fast they were going to be able to do it. So they timed them as well. And then they brought in another group and they hand them the exact same white coat as the painter's smock. So it's the same coat. They just called it a lab coat. Okay. So here's a lab coat. Can you put this on and then do this? Recorded the results. So the data comes back and the people who were wearing the painter's smock did not go through that puzzle any more quickly and with any less errors than the people who just wore street clothes. However, the people who were given the white lab coat went through and they did it in less than half the time, we put meaning around the things that we wear or the things that we will see. So it's called in clothed cognition.

There's clothing that you can wear that lab coat, you're automatically going to display the qualities of someone who's going to be more deliberate, more methodical, higher concentration skills. Now convert, they did the exact same thing again. This time they had to do an artistic, they do something creative expression. Well, the people who wore the white lab coat didn't show anything more creative than the people who were wearing their street clothes, but the people who were told that it was a painter's smock were far more creative and expressive through the task as well. You know, and that's a great example of an alter ego. You know, we don't, we're not wrapping a big story around it, but you're enclosing yourself in a new meaning as being a, you know, a mad scientist in a lab. And just because you're doing that, you're going to become more methodical and

concentrate better and stuff. And then there's another one. There's another great study that was done from a lady who, from the information that I was told, a friend of hers saw me speak on this topic of alter egos and then told her about it. I haven't been able to connect with her yet to figure out if this was actually true, but either way, she did this great study on children. And it was a group of four to six yearolds, brought them into a room to work on a puzzle. Now, the puzzle was actually unsolvable. There was no way that you could actually complete this puzzle. But they wanted to see how long they would stick it out for before they would quit.

And so they tracked all the information, you know, the seconds and minutes that they tried working on this puzzle. Then they brought in a couple of costumes. One was a Batman costume, the other was a Dora the Explorer costume. And they said to the young kids in the room, everyone, you know, pick out your favorite costume. And so they did. And then they brought in another puzzle

for them to work on. Well, the level of grit and perseverance of those young kids went up. And how do you measure grit and perseverance? Well, how long, how much extra time did they spend on that puzzle? of those young kids went up. And how do you measure grit and perseverance? Well, how long, how much extra time did they spend on that puzzle? And they spent a lot more time working on the puzzle.

But the other side of it was, which is really, really powerful, and something that parents should kind of take note of, is that their, that healthiness of their self-talk went way up as well. Meaning that they would say to themselves, well, Batman won't quit, so I'm not gonna quit. I'm not a quitter either.

Like a few seconds ago, they were quitters. Now they're not quitters anymore. Simply by adopting the persona of Batman or Dora the Explorer. Like it's so powerful. And I mean, we do it. I mean, we've got a chest at our apartment here in New York city for our kids with tons of costumes in it. And we do it with the kids

all the time. And it's funny how each, each kid will actually associate different skills with different super superheroes. Like, you know, my oldest daughter, Molly looks at Wonder Woman very differently than Sophie does. And so that's the power of this whole alter ego idea is there is no one right or wrong weighted or one right or wrong persona to adopt. It's a very personal thing to you. And there's so many stories that I've got in the book from just leaders throughout history that have adopted just what you would say, well, why would they use that character? Doesn't matter. Whatever their personal association was, that's what matters. That's what matters.

That's what matters. It's so interesting that it can be, I mean, on the one hand, you can work with somebody and say, let's map this out. And like, I know this is part of your process when you're actually working with someone. This is what you write about. It's like, okay, let's walk through the entire process, like step one, step two, step three, let's define it, let's define all these things, which I guess just makes it stronger and stronger and stronger and stronger.

But it's so fascinating to me that even the most essential expression of that, which is, you know, like wearing something, whether it's a token, whether it's a shirt, whether it's a lab coat, whatever it may be, that tiny shift or the glasses for you, like that small thing actually has, it creates a measurable external effect.

It's kind of funny because as you're sharing this, I'm thinking about just before you came here today, we've actually been editing my speaker reel. So I've been looking through footage of me on stage for the last chunk of years. And my wife was looking through this or like the near final rough cut. And she's like, you know, it's kind of funny. It almost looks like, you know, this is like, you know, like 10 different clips from 10 different talks, but it could have been the same one

because you're wearing the exact same thing in every single one. And I was like, huh. And I know it's intentional. I always wear the exact same thing when I speak no matter where I am. And it is like when that shirt goes on and when the sneakers that I only wear when I'm on stage go on, there's something that happens. And I'm different on stage.

And I have been told that so many times. Because hanging out, I mean, you know, this we're friends. I'm pretty laid back. I'm pretty quiet. I'm introverted. You know, I chime in only when I feel like it really makes sense. And I'm very in my head. When I'm on stage, I'm not that way.

No, you're not. I'm like, it's like somebody wound me up. Yeah. And I've actually literally had people come up to me afterwards. And they're like, dude, I've known you for a couple of years. And they're like, you're really funny on stage, but you're really not funny in real life. And I'm like, I'm not entirely sure how to take that. But-

I don't find that to be true. Yeah, so it's so interesting because, you know, what you're describing is just making more explicit and intentional what I have experienced over a period of years, but never really just deconstructed on that level. Yeah, and I mean, that's what I have experienced over a period of years, but never really just deconstructed on that level. Yeah. And I mean, that's what I tell people like with the book and, and what you just were talking about other people that have now gotten the early copies of the book, they have

come back with, there's so much that makes so much sense now about the way that I've operated. And except now what happens is people go, except I'm going to just dial up and amplify that even more because, you know, I was doing it, but now I know the power of it. And I'm going to do more of that. And I'm going to actually apply it in another area of my life as well, instead of just that one stage. Cause when you think of it, we are, we, we don't like to think of it this way, but we are performing a role like Like my, to my kids, I am performing the role of dad. And I personally take that very seriously. Other people, you know, they're, you know, great sort of mission in life isn't to be a phenomenal father or whatever.

They're not as, you know, big on parenting, but for me, that's it. That's my number one role to play. And I take it seriously. And so I do be, I'm very much more intentional there than I think maybe what other people might do. I mean, that's the seed that you're planting with me right now too. It's like, now I kind of want to look at the different domains and say, huh. And I also, but I think maybe the starting point for me is going to be, since I know that I kind of step into it in a less intentional way when I'm speaking, when I'm forward-facing in public, now you've got me wanting to flesh that out more. Like now I want to give that person a name. Now I want to actually give them more of a personality. And now I want to do the work of understanding like where's the enemy part that lies inside of me and how can I, how can I embody and almost like dissociate and create

an identity for that? That's actually one of the, I mean, even though there's so many different parts of it, the different, I mean, that book took me a long time to write. And I think the best thing that I've gotten out of it just for myself is being very, very, very happy with the end result of what I actually created with it, because I was, you know, there was a large part of the process where I wasn't happy with it. And then in the end it all worked out, but is just how powerful the, the naming of something that you've struggled with for a long time, that hidden force, that enemy can be,

and just giving it a label and form how much it can really shift people in their own heads. Cause it disassociates you away from, because again, when something bad happens, you go, I'm such an idiot. No, no, no, no, no, no. Dave was the idiot there. You're not, you're all good. Don't worry about it. You know? Um, it's just a powerful thing for people. Yeah. It's so interesting. So this also feels like a good point for us to start to come full circle as well. So I've asked you this question once before, but I'm asking because I think it was probably a year or two ago, maybe longer than that ago.

So we're hanging out in this container of the good life project. If I offer out the phrase to live a good life, what comes up? To live a good life what comes up to live a good life um for me it's about being very intentional about understanding that i'm the one holding the the paintbrush and i'm going to design it and make it look how i want and i I'm not gonna be ruled by any one of those other four or five other layers and just truly operate from a place of I'm creating it. Like that for me, like just is staying in that place that the moment that I feel like I'm giving up control and power to someone or something else, that's not me living a good life.

That's me doing it for other reasons that aren't coming from me trying to connect to like my core of creatively trying to express my, you know, best self in a cliche term in some way. But to give you a real tangible thing for myself to live a good life is spending a lot of time with my kids and spending a lot of time with people like you. Like just the more and more I can just be around. I'm a people person. You and I are, we're actually,

I'd say this to other people who know both of us that we're actually very, very, very similar human beings. We just express ourselves personality-wise very differently, obviously. And so that's a good life is, is, and again, now there's just so many studies that just show that the quality of someone's life is completely dependent upon the power of the relationships that they have. So yeah, I don't know if that's a very good answer or not, but it's the right answer for me. Awesome. Thank you. Thanks, bud.

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10 is here. It has the biggest display ever. It's also the thinnest Apple Watch ever, making it even more comfortable on your wrist, whether you're running, swimming, or sleeping. And it's the fastest charging Apple Watch, getting you 8 hours of charge in just 15 minutes. The Apple Watch Series X, available for the first time in glossy jet black aluminum.

Compared to previous generations, iPhone Xs are later required. Charge time and actual results will vary.