Green Light with Chris Long - Bill Barnwell! Houston Has Problems. NFL QB Carousel. What's Next For Wentz? Where Does Watt Go? Football-Less Sundays.

Episode Date: February 16, 2021

(01:00) - Welcome and JJ Watt Out of Houston. (26:45) - ESPN's Bill Barnwell on NFL QB Carousel, Fitzpatrick's Next Destination, and Landing Spot for Wentz and Deshaun. (1:09:19) - Football-Less Sundays. Sign up for your DraftKings account at https://www.draftkings.com/sportsbook and use promo code : Greenlight Green Light with Chris Long: Subscribe and enjoy weekly content including podcasts, documentaries, live chats, celebrity interviews and more including hot news items, trending discussions from the NFL, MLB, NHL, NBA, NCAA are just a small part of what we will be sharing with you. http://bit.ly/chalknetwork Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The Raiders. Okay, real quick. What are they doing and why do people hate Derek Carr so much? I have a theory. I think it's because his last name's Carr and people don't like his brother. Yes. I think that's a significant part of it. I also have been thrown off by Derek Carr's accent, which is really surprising to me. Like, for Richard de Grope in Bakersfield, he has like a thick, like, very rich, like, southern storyteller accent, which I was really surprised by when I heard him talk for the first time. Happy Tuesday, everybody. This is the Greenlight Pot. I'm your host, Chris Long. I got Bill Barnwell. today who I love we've talked about my attention span reading can be a challenge I know how to read can I read for a while I can read Bill Barnwell for a while and you're going to have to because he writes some like it's like the Iliad and the odyssey up in this motherfucker um but it's all quality I love

bill and so we're going to get him on uh you know from ESPN.com ESPN uh ESPN uh, um, to talk about the dumpster fire that is the Houston Texans football franchise, which dovetails nicely into QB movement. I feel like if you're trying to track QB movement this year, it's kind of like standing in the middle of an interstate and watching cars go by. I don't know, it's too fast. It's too furious.

There's just too much going on. There's too much to look at. So that's why we're getting Bill in here. I couldn't tackle this day alone. I couldn't tackle this discussion alone. So we'll get Bill on to talk about that. And on the back end, I want to talk about a product that I want to endorse. And as you know, it's not like I have a paid partnership with a lot of these products.

I'm just organically really into as a consumer some of these things I get on Amazon Prime at this point. And this one didn't come from Amazon Prime. It came from a website called Planet of the Vapes. So that's a little hint. could be the official green light pod method of consuming cannabis. It's a little early, but I want to talk about it. And I have an embarrassing admission. I feel like making.

There's a movie I haven't seen until this weekend that is just shameful, judging by all the pop culture references that have existed for 36 years, the better part of 36 years over my lifespan. And I've just kind of been that guy when this movie's brought up smiling and nodding, but with nothing to add to the conversation because I haven't seen it until this weekend. First, I want to talk about JJ Watt. Everybody knows he asked for his release last week. The decade-long fixture in Houston is on the move because they granted it.

One of the best players I've ever seen play football. So who is he now? As he enters free agency, I think the first question is, is who is this guy? Because a lot of times what we struggle with with players with, are there a lot of baggage behind them? Or players who were tremendous Hall of Fame type players, we either overvalue or undervalue them.

Really, we've got to talk about right now. Obviously, who he is in the locker room carries some clout, right? He walks into a locker room. He's a celebrity. He's a football celebrity. So that means something. It means something to have a guy that, if you believe in his leadership style and you think that he's good for a locker room,

he's got everybody's ears automatically. So that first off, he's not the defensive player of year candidate he was once. I think most people know that. He's not a 20-sac guy. Hell, he might not even have another double-digit sack year the rest of his career. I mean, I hope I'm wrong. I think he might. I think he might have one, maybe two if he plays another long while in the right situation.

but he's 32 coming off of quote unquote one of his worst seasons statistically i keep hearing that and somehow the public keeps overvaluing him so with all that having been said i think the truth about j j watt is somewhere in the middle there five and a half sacks 19 quarterback hits okay some people might say relative to his production elsewhere that's pedestrian his pressure rate is way down uh and when you when you look at a pressure rate it's how many times you know you 60 rushes or 100 rushes, how many of those are going to result in pressures. But when you look at pressures, which are a tremendous statistic, but still an incomplete marker for how good a rusher is,

a pressure and landing a pressure, just like it's sacked to a degree is dependent on coverage behind you, how quick the opposing quarterbacks getting the ball out. So the pressure rates down. And another thing that factors in that is double teams. He gets a lot of double teams, and the coverage is really bad behind him. so the pressure rates down.

The win rate is way up. Top 15 win rate. So if you look at his win rate, that's how many times the players winning a rush in a reasonable amount of time that's streamlined across all rushes. I mentioned the double teams.

I think he can still rush. In fact, I think he's a pretty damn good left end on third down and on first and second down. I talked to one executive who said when he turned on the tape, he was shocked at how good he played inside still. I think the question is going to linger for JJ How much does he want to play inside?

I'll give you more on that in a second. He's still great, and this is what that guy mentioned. He's still great at the top of the rush, which is something that is very underrated for the novice or just surface level football fan. Winning rushes with great handwork, winning rushes with a clean move, two, three yards off the line,

or even at four or five yards is one thing, but then being able to stay tight to the trajectory of that arc or the hoop you're trying to run at eight yards or seven yards or whatever the quarterback drop target is, he is very good at turning a move where he wins at seven into a rush where he tackles the quarterback at six, if that makes sense to you.

Some guys will win at seven and get washed to nine. As soon as you got a hand on your back, you don't have the balance, so you don't have the hip mobility to do that. Even with all his injuries, he's still very good at that. When he was younger,

he was good enough, JJ, to just justify allowing freelancing. If you watch JJ tape from seven, eight years ago, they just let him do whatever he wanted to do in the run game, in the past game, and this allowed him to make his boomer

bus plays. Sometimes you might trade the safety or the defensive integrity of your defense for top end plays and negatives. He's not going to be that somewhere else because he's not good enough anymore to trade, to make that trade off, you know, to allow him to do the things that's going to get those gaudy numbers. He won't be that somewhere else. As I said, piece of the puzzle, not the straw that serves the drink. That same guy I talked to said maybe one, one year deal, 10, 12 million, definitely do the one year deal thing if you're JJ. As somebody who's been there before, I opted for a one year deal in New England for that very reason, okay? And when my year was up, I was damn glad I could get out of there. That

wasn't to say I hated my year, but just for the rest of my career, 33 and on, that wasn't going to fly for me, just schematically. So I had to make a decision, but luckily I took the one year deal instead of signing a longer deal with them or someone else. And some people might look at that deal and be like, yeah, it doesn't look that sexy on paper, but he doesn't need the big guarantees, the big money. He's made his money. He needs the freedom. You know, a lot can change year to year in the NFL.

You go sign with Seattle. What if Russell Wilson walks? You know, you're stuck there for three, four years in obscurity. So get that freedom, that one-year deal. I think that's a consideration. you have to take when you're trying to cash in on a great career. And conversely, when it came time to negotiate with Philly a year after I left New England, I thought, oh, this must be the place.

Let me make this the old homestead. I would love an extra year for security. Well, I'm a dumbass because I would love it if that extra year was never tacked on. Because I'd probably still be playing, right? I'd have the freedom as a free agent to go pick my spot rather than to have to force my way out of Philly because I didn't like my situation. I don't want to be an asshole as an old man. People don't like old men assholes

who aren't like the best players. If you're old and you're like a real good player or a good player and you're not a star and you start acting like an asshole, it's a bad look. So you get handcuffed. Don't do it if you can help it. And a lot of that reason I'm kind of handicapping his value isn't necessarily age.

It's lots of rushers that rushes well into their late 30s. with success are a little bit different than JJ. The lowering of his ceiling I'm doing from a value perspective is due to the tread on the tires. And a lot of that is due to, like, if you judge, you know, Jared Allen, let's say, or DeMarcus Ware. Okay, their second acts were, you know, they vary from very good years to not so great years like Jared Allen in Chicago. Nobody remembers that.

Demarcus Ware had multiple double-digit seasons in Denver. That's all well and good. And guys like Kevin Green or Julius Peppers went on and on getting buckets. Show me guys that played inside and out because that's what JJ's done. So the tread on his tires have put him in this situation. This very situation he's in is because of the way he's played the game and where he's had to line up. And so he's lost a bit of Twitch. so I'm not just worried about

the injuries in the past but also forecasting that there'll be more injuries because over the last five years he's only played in two full seasons interesting with him 100 sacks 10 years 85 of them came in his best five years so 15 and the other five

that's that speaks to what a beating he's taken but it also speaks to how unbelievably fucking unstoppable he was for a number of years talking about years we hit 20 20 16 and a half you see guys get 20 but they don't get 20 again like he got 20 he came right right back and got 20 a year or two later and they had 16 and a half one year and next year it's 17 and a half or whatever it is but the reality is this speaks to a durability issue and i'm not this isn't a personal thing

15 the other five seasons. So if you project that out, why would you think he's going to get healthier into his 30s? You know, if he plays 16 games historically, he goes double digits, except his rookie year and this past year. And those are the bookends to a Hall of Fame run in Houston. So you have to take that into consideration.

It hasn't helped that the guy has dealt with bad coverage behind him. It hasn't helped that he's gotten double-teamed or has not had the production around him, but he's still winning rushes. The biggest anchor on his value is durability because he can still play when he's healthy. And when you look at the injuries, there's obviously been the back. When you talk about a back injury, listen, I play with guys who hurt their back and they were never the same. It is a miracle to me that JJ is still as productive after the back issues he's had at the age he's at.

And with a lot of the other issues, like I remember Robert Quinn, who was hell on wheels, dude. It was like about JJ Watt. J.J. Watt's tremendous. I've never seen anybody rush the edge in person like Robert Quinn, dude. How unorthodox and athletically gifted he was that 20thack year in St. Louis when he broke the franchise record. Front row seats. I had front row seats for that, and I had front row seats for him floating around in the therapy pool with a couple floaties because he couldn't even stand up. And they were trying to give his disc space.

And once a guy's in that position, again, Robert Quinn, so freakish that he's able to come back and be productive in different places, but it definitely anchors your value going forward. But JJ's also had a litany of other injuries, tibial plateau, the peck. Little injuries add up. I'll give you an anecdote. When I was in St. Louis, I played through a high ankle sprain. It was my contract year. It was the year I had to cash in, and I did. I had to shoot that thing up every week. I couldn't walk during the week and I played on Sunday. It was dumb. It wasn't hero ball. I was thinking of cashing in. It was hero ball because I have pride and I want to be tough. But playing through something like that and I guarantee you JJ's played through a number of

things. My ankle lost centimeters of ankle flexion. If you know what ankle flexion is, it's like if your foot's like a lever straight out and back towards you, how far back can you push that your toes and how little space can you create between the top of your foot and the front of your ankle? The less space, the better. That means you're flexible. How much ankle flexion do you have? When you're a rusher, that is an extremely big thing.

I lost those couple centimeters. I never rushed the edge the same way. I compensated, I changed things, but that's kind of the beginning of the end for Prime Me. Prime JJ has been battling, little injuries, big injuries for years. These things add up. So don't expect the same guy. He's played inside and out.

And that takes a toll on guys. And the guys you compare in a second act to a Hall of Fame level players, the guys I just ran through, take that with a grain of salt. JJ is different. So what's the perfect destination? Again, I was no JJ Watt in St. Louis, but I went through this bad team for a number of years.

He's been in the playoffs and that sort of thing. We won 34 games in eight years. When I was released, it was just as merciful in St. Louis, but it wasn't as big a deal. You know, longtime fixture, star in the city, productive years dwindling due to injuries and became a cap casualty. I'm chasing two things, okay? I'm chasing restoring my ego because I damn sure wanted to prove I wasn't washed up and winning. JJ is chasing one of those things. He has nothing to prove as an individual.

And so while I was doing a balancing act in my mind trying to pick between, teams like Washington who I visited or Dallas, who I was in the airport getting ready to go to Dallas and Richmond when Bill Belichick called a second time and I just fucking left the gate. I almost forgot my bag. I just left. Or it was the two teams that came down to, Atlanta or New England. It's about handicapping. Once you decide that you want to go all in for winning, which I did and JJ will not have to think it through, he's probably going straight to the winning. thing. It's all about handicapping. So when I joked and said, you know, on Twitter that JJ doesn't want to play for your team, that was a tremendously open-ended tweet. I wasn't thinking

about anybody in particular. People took offense. I had a New England fan say he's talking about us. You need to get used to this in New England. We won't be talking about you like every single week, especially when it comes to players going in ring chasing because you literally don't have a quarterback right now. So no offense, maybe you should like move on. Or Philly. Love Philly fans. I had some Philly fans being taking it personal. I'm like, listen, you're not even in the conversation. It's a burning building in Philly right now. Not to say they can't put it out, but do you think a Hall of Famer is going to run to a, from one burning building to the next burning building? I mean, he's not doing this to

to be a mentor to guys in struggling programs he wants to win and he wants to play and so you know like when I said that unless Vegas likes your team JJ probably doesn't like your team

and that's what he's after now there's a scheme consideration because I think this is a crapshoot that's the one thing I was talking to somebody about this like it's simply you go pick the best team not everybody picked the two teams his finalist in his first chance at free agency that went to the Super Bowl.

People are like two times Super Bowl champion. I'm like, well, one time I was a pretty good handicapper. Not everybody's a good handicapper, right? This is a total crapshoot. You have no idea who's going to win at the beginning of the season. So at least be in the right scheme. You know, two schools of thought late in your career. Rush inside more as an edge rusher, because as you lose explosiveness,

you don't notice it as much, right? just relative to the other guys inside and the distance is closer. So if JJ has lost a step, it's not going to look like he's lost the step effectively or on film if he's a three technique because the guard's right there. If you lose a step at tackle,

I remember at the end of my career just running as fast as I fucking could and I was a technical mastermind at that point, like a galaxy brain, but I was like high knee running in place trying to get to the tackle, beat him to that spot. That's the difference between rushing inside and out late in your career. That's one school of thought.

The other is just don't fucking rush inside because after 32, 33, that's going to expedite the physical crash. And the reason I didn't play in Atlanta, and I don't know if I've ever said this publicly, was sitting in Dan Quinn's office and he was like, I want you to be Michael Bennett. And I was like, man, I'm really very flattered because I love Mike. but Mike is an inside rusher and he's like, yeah, I'm like, nah, like, you know, like the meeting was over. You know, like, so that's the consideration you have to take in.

And only JJ knows what he wants to do. Now, Vegas likes Pittsburgh, 4 to 1, Green Bay, 9 to 1, Houston, 100 to 1. Let's get the teams without a chance out of the way. Anybody without a chance to win a Super Bowl, forget about it. And that includes maybe some teams that JJ deems teams that he doesn't believe in to win a Super Bowl. Like, people float Seattle. They just lost to Jared Gough, okay?

You got a quarterback who's talking about wanting out. Maybe he doesn't want to go play for a team that he's not sure can beat Green Bay, can beat Kansas City. Conversely, you might look at the bucks. There's a team I sound like I'm describing, right? I saw tweets, though, this week, like, Barrett, JPP, Sue, Watt, like, wow.

where do you reckon he rushes there? You know what I'm saying in that group? If he's going to just rush inside, I could see him possibly rushing next to Sue. And there is a consideration there that, you know, like maybe they don't re-sign Barrett. If they don't resign Barrett,

that's a slam dunk. But in my handicap and brain, I would say, when's the last team to repeat back-to-back Super Bowls, the 2003-2004 Patriots? So it's been a while. So yeah, it's plausible.

Some people would have to leave, but he's not better than Jack Barrett at this juncture. He's not better than JPP at this juncture. And Sue gives you a down-in, down-out presence. So that's first and second down and third down. He's still rough and ready to play three downs without a worry about him tearing his body up. J-J, you know, there's some considerations there in Tampa. Maybe he makes Sue expendable. But again, I'm not sure what he's thinking as far as rushing in the time.

inside. Now, Pittsburgh's won, okay? In the Seattle category for me, I picked Pittsburgh to win the Super Bowl this year. They fell short. This was the year. Okay, they're 30 million over the cap next year. I don't think they're truly like slam dunk contenders. And the brother thing's great, you know, it sounds good. People always used to tell me, go play with your brother. I'd be like, okay, when there is a fight that breaks out, like I've been there on the field when he's beating the shit out of one of my best friends. And you're kind of like, what do I do? you know, William Hayes, he jumped William Hayes in the middle of a Rams Bears game. And I got a piece of Kyle's jersey in my hand because this grizzly bear won't let go of my buddy.

And the jersey, I'm trying to come off the sideline to pull him off William. It's the most awkward thing in the world. Imagine that in practice. You know, like, what do you do? And guess what? Brothers don't always get along. There's days where me and Kyle don't feel like even talking to each other. That's part of being a brother.

You know, it's just not like, you know, it's kind of an overrated thing to think that, oh, he's going to mortgage his football future just so he can see his brother every day. Have you heard of FaceTime? And second fiddle to TJ, I don't know if he wants to do that. You know, like, TJ's going to be the guy there. And that also mean TJ's going to run rush left end. It would be kind of cool to see TJ Watt at left end and JJ inside rushing next to, oh, well, here's another problem.

Stefan Tewitt and Cam Hayward Great players So like Bud Dupree might leave And you think of him as an edge player And JJ is an edge player They're different players So like I don't know if it works there

From a winning culture standpoint But the culture is great But from a winning standpoint The cap standpoint doesn't make sense And I think the brother thing might be a little overrated Although Vegas doesn't think so Tough to tell your brothers no Maybe that's what they're banking on

Now teams like Indy San Francisco go, the Rams, Baltimore, they all intrigued me on a level. I personally don't like him in Baltimore because they don't win one-on-ones there. They just run games. If you look at it, you know, like Russia's numbers go down there. You know, Yonick was like three sacks this year. Callais Campbell, who's older now, the numbers haven't been eye-popping. Judon's a guy who wins a lot of one-on-ones, but outside of him, I don't know. And Judon is a free agent, so we'll see. might see judan in tennessee how awkward would that be a former raven on the titans that's a hell of a rivalry indies great but no qb so you mentioned buffalo i'm intrigued by them but for instance if it's

going to be cold as fuck and you get frostbite at practice you might as well be home you might as well be close to home and they're not better than green bay so that's why i love green bay i mean i talked about this all the the way back in the fall. Number one, close to home, okay? It's your best bet to win a Super Bowl, possibly on paper. I don't know what Vegas has to say about that. It's a little early for the futures, as far as I'm concerned,

if you're trying to buy a good team to win in 2022. A hungry Aaron Rogers, a fun new look with Joe Barry running that defense, who is a great dude. And most importantly, to me the defensive front is really stout and can accommodate his skill set. Preston Smith is on his way out, right?

You're alpha in that room who has to be willing to be deferential at times to a Hall of Famer. You might not be Zadaria Smith anymore, but Zadaria Smith is going to want to accommodate you because he respects you. You know, again, on a smaller scale, not even comparing.

But when I was in, in Philly, an older guy who's not who I once was, a player who at this juncture is better than me and Brandon Graham was really cool to me and we moved around and he accommodated me because he respected me.

And he was a good dude and I think, you know, Zadaria Smith is a guy that rushes everywhere right off the bat. You'll see him floating. You'll see him at right end. You'll see him at left end. You'll see him moving around. He can rush anywhere. Kenny Clark,

He's going to rush inside. You could pop down and rush next to him. You could kick out and rush on the left edge. And they'd have a nice little group there. Again, close to home. Best chance to win a Super Bowl, in my opinion. And a freshman who looked defensively. Preston Smith is out.

I really like Green Bay. So we'll see what happens with JJ Watt. But, man, still a market for him. Houston did the right thing. love to see him get a ring so many great players um one of the reasons i don't like the whole two-time super bowl champion thing or you know you're a super bowl champion like that differentiates me from you know bruce smith you know what i mean like there have been some great great players who that confetti eluded and i would hate to see jj b won and all he has to do now is handicap

So this is first foray into betting in a way. And we'll see how good of a gambler he is. Let's get Bill Barnwell on and we can talk more about Houston and the mushroom cloud he is exiting. Bill Barnwell is joining us and man, it felt like yesterday you were on the show, but that was like over the summer. A lot has transpired. A lot continues to transpire. I don't know if I remember a worse run for a sports city than Houston. Oh my God. Like think about it.

the Astros, James Hardin, and then to put a bow on it, this whole mess. What's the worst anecdote you've heard out of Houston? We've all read the articles. We've read in-depth about this whole mess. Is there something you heard with your trained ear that you said, this is a barometer for a hellfire? Well, what I've heard is that this really all goes back to, the Bob McNair comment.

And I know that that's public. There are some things about that. I have some insight into here. But just to remind people, 2017, Bob McNair, the owner of the Houston Texans, infuriates his players by saying he doesn't want inmates running the asylum,

according to ESPN reporting by Seth Wickersham. So that I think I was there, by the way. Really? I was in the room. Really? So then you can confirm that was said? I mean, let me go back in my head pictures here, Bill.

But I think that was the, we were, you know, like players were talking about social justice. Yep. And we were in the room with all the owners. And the fact that that didn't, that didn't shock me, it should have shocked me way more, I guess I'll just say. Right. I was like, dudes were like, what?

But then we moved on to the next thing because owners are fucking crazy. Of course. I mean, the next thing was Jerry Jones defending, you know, saying that the owners are the ones who have grown the league to a multi-billion dollar business as opposed to the player. That'll get you ahead with your employees. That checks out. Yeah, that exactly helps out a lot. So what I can tell you is that not only that that leads to a near walkout among the Texans players, but then eventually it led the Texans to trade Drain Brown.

That was directly the reason they traded Dwayne Brown, their star left tackle, to the Seahawks. Yep. They were not going to get a deal done there. So then two years later, that leads to the Laramie Tunsell trade because I don't have a left tackle. So they trade two first round picks. they trade a huge amount of draft capital to the dolphins for Laramie Tunsell and Kenny Stills. And then, of course, now on top of that, one of those picks is now the third overall pick in the 2021 draft, which is going to the Miami Dolphins.

So, I mean, that one sort of stupid comment by McNair led to a disastrous series of runs, these trades that didn't work out for the Texans, and now a team that is just totally fractured, unsurprisingly. And I think there's actually, the thing that really comes to mind from here, I don't know how you feel about this, is I keep thinking more about how important it is to have an owner who knows what they're doing.

Absolutely. It's just something that the status quo of the sports landscape, we just assume that they're rich guys and that you can get by with a quirky owner, like they all have their own personalities. That's just owner X or that's just owner Y. But like, when you look at some of the most successful franchises. What they have is they have owners who support the GM and the coach and the

coach and the GM are in lockstep. And there's an organizational vision or they just get the fuck out of the way and let a football guy do it. There's a couple ways you could do it. I would prefer you do it the second way. Yes. But let's just say you're a guy who has a football vision on some level. You can't meddle too much. you can't you can't be buddy buddy with certain guys i mean like yeah this is a greater conversation on what is the role of an NFL owner as well because of the the trickle-down effect you just mentioned is huge and it's a it's a ticking time bomb any number of places right and now think about who takes over for bob mcnair so he has that comment in 2017 he dies in 2018 his son cal takes over. So here's Cal McNair's resume for running a multi-billion dollar organization. Yeah. He plays at

UT. He's a four-year letterman at UT, apparently, according to his bio, which may not be accurate, but I'm going to go off that. Four years at UT, he gets an MBA from Rice, and he spends his entire adult life working for his dad's companies. He works for his dad's power company in Texas. He eventually takes over working for the Texans and then takes over the job running the Houston in Texas. It's wild. Yeah, like that's not the resume you need to run a multi-billion dollar organization. No, and we've lowered the bar in the NFL for some reason because this is a sport.

And we don't look at it like it's a business, even though it's very clearly a business. So why would you not have somebody who's come up in that business in that position? Well, that's the hard part, you know, because of the, you know, what it takes to become an owner and the capital you have to have and how many football people are sitting. Arthur Smith maybe one day could be an owner. That's true. You know, like there's maybe your one anomaly down the line, but how many football people have the capital to purchase a team?

And that's why when you hear somebody like a Russell Wilson say, I wouldn't own a team one day. Well, that's a provocative idea. But at the same time, players have not always made the best GMs. Players have not always made the best coaches. So finding that sweet spot upstairs, as we like to call it, and beyond. because when the owners don't either, they're not even upstairs. They're there at some other office somewhere.

Filling those positions accordingly is it's, it's kind of a, you know, not to use the F word again, but it's a mind fuck. There's a mind fuck. And I think at this point, I actually went and counted because I'm, I do research for the Chris Long show. I don't think of my own show,

but for the Chris Long show I do. 16 teams right now. Yeah. The primary person running those teams is someone who inherited it from their parents. And I mean, we're seeing a league right now where there are more people who want to buy NFL teams than there are NFL teams because these teams are going up dramatically in value, which, by the way, the players are not realizing, even though they are being blamed for us getting to making too much money, which is constantly the ridiculous thing that happens. I don't know how,

you know, an NFL team can go up from like $850 million a decade ago to $2.5 billion in net worth now and somehow players need to be. Fans are okay with the really rich guys. They're just not okay with the pretty rich guys. That's not a conversation. You know what I mean? That's a totally different conversation. I think there's something to that.

But let's say like, you know, taking this process down the line and Nick Casario shows up. Obviously, we know all about Jack Easterby. And I think we'll know more and more as this thing continues to unravel, which is always interesting. Let's say Nick Casario was Ernie Adams. Sure. Did it just have to be anybody from New England and Deshaun was like, no way? I don't know. I mean, it feels like that, though, no.

I mean, I don't know Deshaun Watson well enough to say. I don't know him at all. But, I mean, there is this whole conversation happening. I think we're going to talk about when it comes to, you know, player empowerment and players having meaningful situations. And you brought up. I mean, players don't always make good GMs or great coaches or even make great decisions. And I think, you know, one of the classic examples we saw this year is Patrick Mahomes sort of getting involved with the chiefs process, which I think was a healthy way, but of encouraging them to take Clyde Edwards-Alair, who, you know, not that Clyde Edwards-Aler costs in the Super Bowl or anything, but he looked like a, you know, an okay running back. Wasn't like he was a big difference maker. He's still a rookie. There's still plenty of time to see what he's going to be. But like, you know, it's not as if Patrick Mahomes unlocked, you know, the next Emmett Smith at the end of the first round. Like it was just, you know, he was part of that process, but I don't think he was the final voice. And I think that.

You know, whether it was taking a guy from the Patriots, whether it was specifically Casario, who was a guy that, of course, they tried to bring in under Bill O'Brien the prior year and ended up with tampering charges, if I don't remember correctly. It just sort of felt like, you know, that he was not a part of that process in a meaningful way. I mean, they had hired a search firm. They ignored the search firm. They had, you know, sort of doubled down, it seems like, on, you know, Jack Easterby's expertise. And I think that, you know, certainly publicly, maybe privately, they know more, but publicly, it's hard to see a lot of evidence of that expertise. I mean,

I feel like the video. It's funny. I'm like a Houston Texan's insider because I used to eat breakfast with Jack Easterby all the time. And he used to sit at me and Marty Bennett's table. I don't know if he was trying to save us or something. But, you know, I enjoyed Jack, man. Like, I thought he was a good dude. And here's the thing is like, I think people, because people are totally unqualified to do what they're doing now or because they're terrible at pro football doesn't make them bad people. What they do with that opportunity, whether they're conniving or backstabbing or whatnot, that makes some good or bad people. That's how I judge people's character. I thought Jack was cool as a chaplain. When I heard, when I first read this past fall, I had never, I didn't even know he had matriculated to

the upstairs portion of the building. And when I heard he was doing that down in Houston, I was shocked, man. I was shocked. And that's nothing against him as a guy, but I was shocked. Bill said the same thing, right? Like he was like, you know,

Jack is not someone we would consider to be a personnel person, right? And I mean, you know, let's leave Jack Easter be aside as a person. Because while I don't know the person, obviously you don't much better than I do. Well, I'm not vouching for anything he's doing. Houston. I'm saying he was cool to eat breakfast with. That's fair.

You know? Bill, let's leave that. Let's leave it. Let's leave him aside. Let's just say in terms of how he's been. He's good at breakfast. He's good at breakfast. And that's important. Most important meal of the day. Most important meal of the day.

Everybody should eat breakfast together in Houston. But like, this has been a totally opaque thing. Like this person who does not have a traditional background, which is fine, comes into the organization, has some sort of murky role under Bill O'Brien. Bill O'Brien gets fired. He sticks around there. has some sort of bigger murky role that's never been defined publicly. And then bad things happen.

And I think naturally he's going to get blamed for that right or wrong, meaningful or not meaningful. But this is also the organization's fault. I mean, when they hired Cully and had their press conference, they didn't take any questions about Jack Easterby or about the front office. They actually took a question from a fan about the front office and then gave kind of a generic answer and then shut down the press conference when they cut j j watt last week man they he hadn't talked on records since september you know so like you're hiding this guy who's at the middle

of this hurricane um i guess my question would be is this meteoric rise this kind of like nebulous meteororic rise that jack easterby has enjoyed is it totally unprecedented can you think of another upstairs dude in the past that's had this sort of rise to power? That's a good question. I don't know. Thinking of people who are not football people, I mean, like cat guys get GM jobs.

And I don't think there's anything sort of, like I think that can work out fine if you have great people around them. If you know your role. Right, exactly. Like I think that's the tough part here. That's what I want to say about Easterby is that and about McNair as well. It's like, it's one thing to say that a guy like Easterby is not qualified for this job.

That's fine. You can say the same thing about McNair. I don't think he's qualified to be the owner. And I think when you get to Deshawn Watson, like the idea that he's not qualified to make personnel, have any personal insight or insight into what makes a good coach. When there are these other people who are not necessarily qualified for their jobs, you know, being able to do their jobs, I feel like is difficult. I can't think of one where it was this high up.

The only people I could think of are sons or daughters. of owners who have meaningful roles because they inherited their teams. But otherwise, I think like in terms of like, there's no one who had Jack Easterby's like path to a job. Like you can never tell someone, hey, go be a team chaplain, you know, bounce around colleges for a while. And then eventually you'll run an NFL team's personnel department somehow. Divine intervention, man.

I read an SI article about Easterby in general. And this was from Jenny Vrentas and Greg Bishop. and it was a really good piece, but one player likened the dynamic to a Game of Thrones situation. And Bill, I think you watch Game of Thrones,

yeah? Off and on, but you know the basic plot line. Exactly. Brian Gain is Rob Stark. He was 17 months and he's fired. He was supposed to be the heir to the throne. Bill O'Brien's Joffrey,

maniacal, cutting people's heads off, shit like that, and he gets poison. Jack used to be his Littlefinger, which is the last guy you want to be on Game of Thrones. It's like the worst possible metaphor. So who's Deshaun Watson?

What's like the logical end here? Is he Sansa? Like who is Deshaun? Is he going to be able to escape? That's the gist of the question. Is he aria? It could be aria. I feel like it might be aria.

Here's the thing about the show. Watson, right? Like at the end of the day, if he does not want to play in Houston, he's not playing. I mean, like, We've seen this now for a decade. More than a decade.

I think we've seen it for a long time now. Like I think about Carson Palmer. Like once Carson Palmer got the idea in his head that he was done with the Cincinnati Bengals, he was done. He was not coming back. He was waiting to get traded. He'd made a lot of money. He was cool sitting on the sidelines until he got traded.

Trent Williams last year the same thing where Trent Williams and Washington said, okay, I don't want to be here anymore. I don't trust the people who run this organization. I'm going to sit out until you guys traded me. He got traded. I think with Deshaun, it's kind of the same thing where he's going to be able to escape if he wants to escape. I think it's just, you know. How Doug Ann is he, too?

I mean, you've got to be willing to sit there and lose some money on the front end, right? 100%. I think he'll be fine in the long run. This is the guy who's so talented. He's going to make a ton of money. I think it's more about losing like a year of your prime as a player. You know, I think that hurts. But like, if you're going to go back there next year and play for a coach you don't believe in with an offensive line that, you know, has Larry Rundsel.

Otherwise, it's pretty inconsistent. that's lost a bunch of talent at wide receiver that has major holes up and down the roster because the team has made so many bad contracts and made so many bad trades and given up on so many draft picks. Like, do you necessarily want to go play for a six and 10 team?

Is that going to help you? Well, it's not going to. And you talk about foregoing a year of your prime, but the risk you take in running out there, any given play at any position is that your prime could be shortened. And then additionally, you mentioned those issues on the offensive line. And Deshawn's,

If Deshawn has one propensity that I don't like, he comes about it honestly because they've stripped him of all his weapons. And that's trying to play hero ball and extending plays and getting hit. So, you know, like my big thing is if you're in that situation and you know you want to play well, you're going to have to buy time. You're going to be throwing to dudes that didn't have a picture in the program. There were shadow guys in the program. you're going to be playing in a dysfunctional setting, you know, this tough pill to swallow, which people forget.

Carson Palmer swallowed this pill. Seemed that everybody has amnesia on that when criticizing Deshaun. He's just got to be willing to dig in. And I guess the question is when it comes to a Deshawn Watson or a Russ who sees this and he's like, oh, I kind of like this quarterback empowerment thing. If you're good enough to do it, does Russ have a point and what are the odds he retires

Seahawk if you had to set them. Oh, boy. I was on expecting that second question. I got to think about that one. Does Russ have a point about his complaints about the offensive line, correct? Yes, which he does, but how much of it does he have to own and how much of the Seahawks have to own? I mean, the nerdy answer is that he has to own a fair amount of it because every bit of research we've done, you know, not we maybe, but at least I've done, says sacks are a quarterback sat, like consistently

year after year, even as the offensive linemen change, you're going to attract sacks as a quarterback. And I think when you watch Russell Wilson play, it takes about two seconds to realize how much of the impact on him is Russell Wilson extending plays, Russell Wilson being Russell Wilson, and sort of like, you know, towing that thin line between extending a play to get somebody open to do something incredible and extending a play and taking a 14-yard sack and blowing up your team's drive or fumbling 20 yards down, like 20 yards behind the line of scrimmage. Like that stuff happens. I think that's, you know, you would never tell Russell Wilson stop doing that.

Just like you never told Patrick Barham. I sure wouldn't. He made me a lot of money. I mean, fuck, dude. He was, I mean, we'd go up to Seattle and we'd be like, everybody's eating today. We might not win the football game, but my man is going to be back there trying to make plays. And to make his point for him, you know, no disrespect to a Brenno Jocomini, who I've always said was a guy respected the hell out of because he got after you in the run game.

The top Brenno in the NFL history to me. He's definitely a top Brenno, dude. And we could do a list another day. But, but, you know, these guys were dogs in the run game. But when it came to protecting him, they weren't as good. So I get his point, but I also see it as it's different than a Deshaun situation where Deshaun has drawn his line in the sand. And he's saying, I'm out if I can help it. Russ, like might be under center next year, likely under center next year.

He could be under center after his out. The risk he runs is alienating maybe some of the dudes who are blocking him. for him and saying like, look at the dog shit that you guys have, have, have arranged for me. And then he's got to go back to OTAs. Did you see Jermaine Affetti's tweet after? What did Jermaine say? Just like a prayer emoji, I think. Just like, thank you for finally having this conversation.

But that's, that's the hard. There's some really hard parts about this quarterback mobility discussion. And, you know, player mobility in general, general and player empowerment, like, we all want that. You know, like, I don't think we'll ever get to the NBA. where I'm sure football fans are afraid of, you know, I get it. Familiarity, your favorite team, you want to look like your favorite team every year, but I don't think Bucks fans are complaining this year.

Nope. So there is going to be a happy medium there. I guess the question would be, these two guys are elite, and they can complain about whatever they want to, really, when it comes down to it, because they're not making a bunch of Russell's or Deshawns. Where is the Mendoza line?

Let's set it right now. The quarterback Mendoza line from a court of public opinion that says, I don't want to hear it. You are player X or south of player X. I was thinking Tanna Hill is kind of the Mendoza line.

What's say you? I might say Jared Gough is the Mendoza line. Oh, you got it a little bit lower than... Because I... Right, I feel like, you know, when Jared Gough didn't have the best offensive line around him this year, when receivers didn't always help him out.

They did a good job, but, you know, having Shaw McVeigh around him, people were kind of just like, eh, like not only people, but also Sean McVeigh himself seemed to be like, Yeah, we're sick of you. Like we'll be fine. Like, like, you know, we would maybe rather play John Wolford.

Well, they would. They would have because they told us all we needed to know going in the playoffs. I mean, dressing golf and making him number two. That means you think he can take a snap. Right. Because as Jamal Adams illustrated, you're a snap away. By the way, I didn't answer your Russell Wilson question about his chances. Yeah, come on.

Set some odds here, Bill. I would say 95%. Although I will say it's always been weird. Like even when he negotiated that first contract, his agent came out and was like, oh, maybe Russ is going to go play baseball. Maybe if he doesn't get a good deal. And it's like you hit like 220 in AA. Like you're not going to play baseball.

Yeah, people overplay that stuff. I mean, they just, it's the low hanging fruit. The only reason I could see him want to leave. I do think Russ looks at himself as football plus. And, you know, you talk about New York. You know, you talk about Sierra and like, this is very relevant stuff, even though people might laugh at it. You know, he's got Russell Wilson money and Sierra money.

So money at some point is not going to be a big deal. It's the same thing for Tom Brady this year and going forward. This year for Tom was about being happy. So I guess the question to me weaving these couple guys together is Brady's path. Is that an anomaly going forward? Are we over forecasting the mobility that these quarterback's going to have? and the success that you can have in the offseason just snagging a veteran quarterback because over the last 10 years, by my count, Tannahill, Carson Palmer,

Alex Smith on a level because he coached up Patrick Mahomes and Nick Foles. But they didn't plan on Nick Foles being the guy he'd be. They just thought they were getting a serviceable backup. So as far as starting quarterbacks are concerned, I'd say Tannehill and Palmer were successes. But outside of Brady, there haven't been a lot of guys through free agency or trades that you could get on the market and fix your team right away. Here's the tough part of this.

I think we're seeing this now with Goff getting traded, with Carson possibly getting traded, and we're going to see this with the next round of guys as well as that I think more and more teams are realizing, hey, we could go out and win with a guy on a rookie deal. And for the first three years of that rookie deal, I mean, it wasn't the same bargain 20 years ago. It is such an enormous bargain now when you can get a guy like, like, you know, Josh Allen this year making $7 million something like that, as opposed to, you know, guys on on veteran deals getting $25, $30 million.

You can do so much more with your roster saving that money. And I think, you know, in the past, when you had a quarterback who was at all competent, you wanted to keep him around for as long as possible. And I think what if we see more of the Wences struggle and the Goff struggle on their second deals, I think you're going to see teams come out and say, you know what? Like, we're good. Like, we're going to trade this guy. and we're going to build around someone cheaper.

We're going to go out and get a Tana Hill and say, okay, you know, we can spend $25 million a year more on our offensive line because we didn't go out and invest all that much of quarterback. And Tando's making a lot of money now, but, you know, that formula is going to change. Those guys are going to seem less valuable because you can get a successful quarterback for a significantly reduced salary. Whereas when Matthew Stafford came into the league, like he was, I believe, the highest paid quarterback in the history of football, the moment he signed his rookie contract. not that I'd know anybody who came into the league on the old CBA. Yeah, no, I mean, it would have been nice. It was a lot better than coming into the league on the new CBA. I wonder this though, Bill, and this is like out of left field, but at some point,

it's good for the NFL to have charter franchises, you know, or like not charter franchises, but fixture franchises that you're like, okay, I can associate this brand, this guy with this franchise. we're seeing too much player mobility. Will they ever do anything to rectify this issue at quarterback? Will they ever implement a separate cap? Like, what kind of things do you think the NFL might do to mitigate, you know, because fans might, fans like familiarity.

They like having one guy that they buy their jersey and he stays. We're going to see a lot more movement at the most important position as we're talking about. I think so. I think so for sure. I think the fact that those guys are cheaper are going to mean guys like Russell Wilson might move on at the end of their careers or Brady might move around at the end of his career. I could see like a max slot, you know, like, just like you have one guy who's not on your cap. I think MLS has something like that actually, even though there's not many NFL MLS comparisons,

sort of this is the only one, but like having one player who's off the cap where you can make basically whatever you want to pay him, 50, 60 million dollars, you know, on a typical cap now. I could see that happening. But, you know, I don't think, I think, I think, if. you have a like the guy like you have it to Sean Watson or a Tom Brady you don't want to see that guy leave you're going to pay him anyways but that second tier of guys where it is like a Carson Winston went seeking before this year or a Jared goth like there's definitely a subset of those fan bases that wanted those guys to leave I think fans are more aggressive about wanting to move on

from a guy now than they're actually right about that they're very they're more passionate about guys leaving than guys staying so like like like not only that but also like I think having social media helps where if you like maybe like in your group of friends like you were the one guy who wanted to get rid of Jared Goff now you can find hundreds of people who want to get rid of Jared yeah you find a whole circle you can go into your we should have kept Jared Goff echo chamber exactly so so looking at the draft and the rest of the field here because we've spent a lot of time on a few guys but I want to I want to talk about one through 12 and I'm talking about one through 12 because 12, obviously, the Niners at this juncture,

and they are, to me, the biggest contender that might be in play early for a quarterback. So as you look at that, let's start with out of those teams, Jacksonville, New York Jets, Miami, Atlanta, Sincy, Philly, Detroit, Carolina, Denver, Dallas, the Giants, and the Niners. Shorter list would be the teams that have zero chance of drafting a quarterback. Is that fair to say?

100%. I mean, even like, like I could see the Bengals aren't drafting a quarterback. That's who I had first. The Giants probably are drafting a quarterback. I would say no. I would say no. They still believe in Daniel Jones. That might be it. Like the Cowboys could at least consider drafting a quarterback if they think there's no way they're locking up that Prescott in the long term.

But otherwise, I would say those three teams, Giants, Cowboys and Bengals. Because I'm with you, like just going down. I mean, the biggest domino's the Jets, right? And then, you know, you just have to consider what they're doing. I have no idea what they're doing. But, I mean, that what happens at two is going to set the table for the rest of it. I'm not sure the Jets have any idea what they're doing at this point. Like, to be entirely honest with you, I think they're sort of just waiting for like the universe to reveal itself to them and give them the one option they want.

Right. I could see them trading for a quarterback. I could see them drafting a quarterback. I could see them going with Sam Darnold. Like anything and everything is on the table there. And I think that can be scary. But like if you trust the people who are running your organization, that's a good situation to be it.

So if you're San Francisco, how aggressive are you? Okay. So here's the thing. I think they have a right to be more aggressive than just about anybody else. And there's a couple of reasons why. Number one, we know their ceiling, right? They were a Super Bowl team last year with Jimmy Garoppolo, who I think is a good quarterback.

I think I would say he's maybe not like a top tier, you know, like game changing quarterback, but you can clearly win with him. So he's making $25 million next year. It's all unguaranteed in a year with a reduced cap. And for whatever you want to say about Jimmy Garoppolo, like he isn't a Patrick Mahomes type where he's super, you know, like would work in any scheme above any level talented. He's not cheap at $25 million. And he's not very healthy.

It's tough to rely on him being a guy who starts for all 16 games just to stop and healthy for most of his pro career. So can you commit that much money to him as a quarterback when you can't count on him to be a solid guy for 16 games? That's tough to ask. And then I think on top of that, they have a ton of free agents. I mean, they have guys like Richard Sherman, Jason Ferrette, who are free agents. Trent Williams is a free agent. You know, they have a lot of guys they want to keep. And so for Fred Warner, I think also a free agent.

They have guys that want to keep. And so like, you know, they're either going to have to keep Garoppolo and spend $25 million a quarterback. they're going to trade for someone like it, to Sean Watson. Maybe they were going to Matthew Stafford and spend a lot of money that way, or if they trade up and get a guy and can pay him $5 million in year one, well, now maybe you can keep Sherman, maybe you can keep Fred Warner or Trent Williams when if you're paying Gropolo $25 million, you probably couldn't have. So I think if they see a guy they love, I think they have so much to gain.

Not only got the quarterback position, but also elsewhere by trading up and going to get that guy. Yeah, you're absolutely right. I mean, I think that's the one team that that's got to be aggressive. Is there anybody who's really sweating because they don't have the capital in that top range? And they're sitting there and being like, our hands are tied and we don't have a quarterback and we're going to be up Schitt's Creek without a paddle. In the Patriots, like they're 15. And like, they're probably too far down to move up and get somebody. Oh, you know Bill's going to go good. You know they're going to cut Jimmy to save money. And then Jimmy's going to be right back into it. That's the one chalky storyline that I think plays out.

What would you set the odds of that happening? I'd say 50. 50? That's probably fair. I'd say 50 and that's being conservative because you have to realize New England doesn't surprise you a lot. You know, like they kind of do what you think they're going to do. And I know there's this mystique, but last year proved Bill just stays the course. And I think the course for him would be, listen, we got a lot of cap space.

We can support a tier two quarterback. that knows the system that I never wanted to get away. And he could be back here for nothing. Rather than making a trade or burning draft capital, not that they're great at putting that draft capital to work. But I think Jimmy G could end up back there for sure. And I guess outside of those teams, you're talking about New England,

because I think they're a team that can win if they find the right quarterback. I put the Saints, the Raiders, Washington, and India in that category. Let me try one on for size for you here, Bill. The Saints have a terrible cap situation. situation. They got no quarterback. It's awful. It's awful. But there's still a good football team with one of the best offensive minds in in the game's history. How do you like my man Fitzmagic in New

Orleans? I love it. I love it so much. Perfect. Perfect addition there because you know, like Fitz is we saw what he can do. You can clearly win with him. I mean, he is terrifying in so many ways. Like, Like, like, there's no, having read all those stories about Robert Griffin, the other Robert Griffin was a starter. His first year, he's like, you know, he's got to protect his body. And meanwhile, I watch Fitz and he's like diving head first, you know, inside the five yard line when he's down 24 points in the fourth quarter. He made it the toughest throw of the year with his head sideways. Mm-hmm. At 45 years old, dude.

Like, the guy is, he's got a stronger arm than Drew Breeze. He's smart so he can hang. with Sean Payton. He's tough. He doesn't mind being dicked around either. His whole career he's been the bridge guy. He could be a bridge guy on a really good contending team

and he's not going to mind when Taysam Hill goes in there and throws a pick or takes a sack and fucks up the drive. He's going to be okay with it because he's a team guy. What he went through last year, if he went to New Orleans, he'd be happy as a clam.

And I think it would work out for them on the field. I just love the idea of Ryan Fitzpatrick having a tombstone one day that said, Ryan Fitzpatrick, you know, 1970 to 2050, didn't mind being dicked around. That's what you want. I also like the fact that you just, you just scattershot 1970. Like he was alive when the TVs were black and white. The Raiders, okay, real quick, what are they doing and why do people hate Derek Carr so much? I have a theory.

I think it's because his last name's Carr and people don't like his brother. Yes, I think that's a significant part of it. I also have been thrown off by Derek Carr's accent, which is really surprising to me. Like for Richard to grow up in Bakersfield, he has like a thick, like, very rich, like, you know, like Southern storyteller accent, which I was really surprised by when I heard him talk for the first time. I think that's part of it. But I think this is a guy who's consistently been for the past couple of years, a top 10 quarterback, like bottom half a top 10 for sure. But like that offense works. I mean, we saw them against the Chiefs.

I think the one knock would have been like, oh, they're conservative. They get the ball out quick. You know, he's not really like a big, deep thrower. They hit bombs against the chiefs in that game. He's not the problem with that football team. And I think, you know, if they want to go out and get somebody, they can. And John Gruden has had wandering eyes for quarterbacks before. But like, the problem with that team is the defense.

It's not their car in the slightest. He can't keep his clipboard in his pants. He just, he just, he's got the wandering eyes. I like the way you put that. Washington, I think there with that defense could be a contender tomorrow if they hit on a quarterback, but we're running out of options here. Let me ask you, if you're the Lions, and you've seen, of course, you were part of the Matthew Stafford trade where you got two first-round picks for Stafford for Stafford to return plus Jared Gough.

And I mean, and I know, you know where I'm going. And let's say Carson Wentz goes for a first-round pick. Let's say that other quarterbacks go on the move for significant capital. I know you told Jared Gough he was going to be your guy. But do you at least think about trading Jared Goss for, you know, like for a first draft pick and then say, okay, like go to Washington. They have a great defense. They have Scott Turner there.

You can win on that offense. We're going to draft a guy at seven. Like, you know, we'll refund anyone who bought a Lions golf jersey, all 12 of you bought the Lions golf jersey. Hell yeah. We're rebuilding. It seems like it makes sense to me. It makes so much sense.

Now, I don't know if it makes as much sense for the Washington, football team, but Scott Turner might see something in him where we've got some players that you can get the ball to underneath. We've got exciting young players. We have, you know, leaders on that team. Like, they have the bones of a big boy football team. They just don't have that one piece. And I think in Detroit,

you just keep stacking up draft capital. Hell, if you like Trey Lance, go get him. You know, like... And if you can't trade Jerr Gough, the point I made is he's been a real pro about this whole process. I'll say that. like to pile on him. Like he's a good dude and he would treat whatever quarterback you brought in the building really well and tutor him because, you know, because he couldn't execute things live bullets in L.A.

Doesn't mean he didn't know the game inside and out. A lot of guys are not decision makers under the gun. He might know everything there is to know in the classroom and could really help a young guy. Also, one thing about Jared Kauf, and I feel like this happens with a bunch of guys. Like, he ain't that bad. You know, this is not like, it's not like. It's not like he is like a guy off the street who ran that offense. Like I watched that Vikings game a couple of years ago.

I watched that. The Vikings game was unbelievable. Literally the day the Vikings game happened, I wrote an article for ESPN about how the Rams and other teams should consider trading their young quarterbacks at the end of their contracts and just starting over with a new quarterback. And of course, the poster boy for that article,

Jared Goff, throws five touchdown passes that night to prove what an idiot I am. They were beautiful throws to. When he gets hot, he is an awesome throw. When he knows what to see on defense, like he knows when he's what's coming on defense, when he's comfortable in the pocket, he is a phenomenal thrower.

Another thing is that once the McVeigh relationship goes sour, people don't understand how hard it is to win in the NFL anyways at any position, but when you don't like your coach and your coach doesn't like you, you're fucked unless you're great, unless you're transcendent great. So if you're Detroit, find out what you got,

what you think of him, because they might actually think he's very serviceable. I think he is too Yeah yeah because I would agree We mentioned the Eagles they could draft a QB In fact if I'm them I do trade Carson And draft a QB And then let Jalen and him duke it out

That's the way I do things if I'm the Eagles Because you've already ruined the relationship with Carson Carson ruined it too by not playing well this year But you like I just If you're the school of thought That the Eagles didn't undermine Carson at all you're wrong I think and if you're the school of thought that Carson should have been untouchable

as well. The truth lies somewhere in between there, but the relationship is broken. Get what you can and get him out the door. And part of that is me rooting for a guy I don't, I like that I played with. Fresh start would be great. Is Chicago the place? That's what I keep hearing. I agree with you 100% on Carson. I mean, again, it's a lot like Jared Gough. We're like, is he that guy who was like an MVP candidate in 2017? Probably not. Is he the guy who looked like he couldn't get out of his own way in 2020. No. Also probably not.

There's a middle ground in there in 2018 and 2019 where dude was good. Like he wasn't with bad talent. I mean, you know, and that's a big deal. So, you know, I think you end up somewhere where you have some weapons. If you put him in Denver or something, which isn't going to happen, you know, he'd be like, holy shit, what are these toys? I mean, the thing is you're looking at people freaked out about Aaron Rogers and the Jordan love thing.

Okay. Carson is quite literally not on the same. planet as Aaron Rogers and very few have ever been on the same planet as Aaron Rogers. We lamented him having to overcome that lack of investment resources. Carson didn't have a Devante Adams or an Aaron Jones and they drafted a guy two months after they read him up. You know, like, and everybody wants these football players to be these, and especially former players, man.

Oh, you got to be tough. You can't let any weakness enter. When you get broke off and then they draft. the guy like two, three months later, I don't care who you are. You can pretend that doesn't get in your head. It gets in your head. So, you know, I think that relationship's broken. And Ryan, Ryan Pace, he was sweating Carson hard on draft day. That's what people don't remember. They were going to take him. Absolutely. And it's like they didn't have a plan when the Eagles traded up. But I don't think he's going to Indy because I think Ballard's too stingy with draft capital.

I agree. I could see him in Chicago. And you got Flip out there, D. Filippo. That's true. Keeby coach. I, you know, from the bear's perspective, I think it makes total sense, right? Like, this is an organization where until you figure out that quarterback situation, you are defined as we're the guys who traded up for Mitch Trubisky instead of drafting,

DeShon Watson, or Patrick Mahomes. And you can, you know, like, that's. after the fact that's unfair, but it's the reality of the situation. And they went 8 and 8 this year with Mitch. We know they can win with, you know, better quarterback play.

They have Alan Robinson as a free agent that obviously something they're going to have to do something about because their wide receiving court is gross without him on the roster. But like they're not, they're not in their jobs after this year. Like there's a moral hazard there of like their future draft picks, Chicago's future draft picks mean a lot more to the Bears than they mean to Matt Nagy and Ryan Pace.

Like they should be happy to give away those future draft picks. If it means getting a quarterback situation that's solved right now. It might save your job. It's going to save your job. It's going to get you an extension. Like, like, you know, just as Carson Wentz is thinking about his future and his job, when he has someone coming up behind him, same thing with, with a Ted coach and a general manager who are stuck in the same situation.

And I think that, you know, their future picks mean a lot more to Chris Ballard and the Colts than they do to Matt Nagy and Ryan Pace with the Bears. So I think even if you're hesitant to give up your first round pick in 20, I think you're at least thinking about a 2022 first. It's like, that's something we're comfortable getting up. We might not be there. Exactly. So like, you know, if you're back working for the saints, you're good.

Like, you don't need to worry about that thing. And I think for Carson's side of things, like, I don't know if the bears are my first pick. I'd much rather go to the Broncos, the team you mentioned in terms of having pieces around them. But like, it's not an unreasonable deal. Like Carson Wentz, if you're trading for Carson Wentz, basically you're locked into paying him 47, million dollars over the next two years, which is a lot of money. You're making a two-year commitment. But like that's $5 million more than Teddy Bridgewater got as a free agent. And I think a lot of people, I love Teddy Bridgewater at like, you know, I have a shrine of Teddy Bridgewater in my

home in terms of how much I love Teddy Bridgewater. But like Carson Wentz is, I think most people would say it's got a higher ceiling. He's got a higher ceiling. I mean, for sure. And that's the thing is like when a player shows you what they're capable of, as long as that player is not unwilling to work, which Carson is not, he doesn't have a work ethic problem. If you read the tea leaves, and this is again, because I haven't been there in a couple years, he's stubborn, okay? For sure. And listen, guess who else is stubborn?

I say this every time I talk about it, this guy in this fucking chair right here. And some of the D-line coaches I had in my career, if I were a quarterback and it was that scrutinized a relationship, the things they would have wrote about me if I was important. You know what I'm saying? When you're on your six coach, like you got to give the guys, some stability and he needs to be in a situation now where you actually whether people think it's right or wrong and this isn't feeling bad for Carson but if you want the best out of him it ain't

going to be in Philly anymore that's what I think and so we'll see Bill Barnwell thank you so much man love reading your stuff as always I remind you that every time you come on so um folks check him out at ESPN and uh really as a player who played the game analytics people numbers people who lean into that stuff. You can trust this guy, man. He's the man. So appreciate you, Bill. I was waiting for you to say analytics people. Go fuck yourselves. I know. I was it. Everybody but Bill Barnwell. No, that's not true. Thank you so much, Bill. Thanks, buddy. All right. I want to take a minute to thank draft kings, our great partner for the 2020 football season. And we also want to shout out Stanford, Steve, for being a big part of that. We had some laughs, made some buckets, and had a lot of fun along the way.

But while the football season may have ended, the 2021 sports calendar has just gotten underway. Had a terrific Super Bowl, might I add. So if you haven't already, head over to Draft Kings, America's top-rated sportsbook app, and enter the code Greenlight and start firing away. Well, you heard it there. Fits magic to the Saints.

We broke it first. It's going to happen. I'm going to will it to happen. I just want Fitsy to get placed somewhere where he gets an opportunity to really win this year. That's what I hope for him. Enough football. Bill Barnwell is a marvel dude.

Love having that guy on. I'll talk to you about malt liquor, okay? Remember what we did last week? We had the malt liquor tasting. We had a hurricane round with Jason Kelsey. I love that. I hope we do it again sometime. I just want to say that malt liquor more than any

vessel that you can poison your body is an absolute time in place buzz you get a malt liquor buzz i was 23 i was 24 i was 25 i was 26 but i stopped around 26 it's a time and a place it is nostalgia in a bottle dude i got home of course cavalry drove me home because and he can attest that my drunk ass was sitting there in the car about two 40s deep cowboy reeds drive me home in a in a blizzard and uh i walk in the house you know hi kids i'm like a 1940s dad you know it's exactly how i pictured dads in the 1940s they get home and they smell like liquor and they've been out of the office and uh they do the best they can to get the kids to bed and be a functioning member of uh the household. So my wife, who's really understanding, didn't make a big deal about it. She didn't make a big

deal about the fact that when I woke up the next morning, you know, our fridge is, it's like, you know, pouches. If you're a dad of young kids, you know, a lot of the foods they eat, they don't even chew. It's like they're basically eat smoothies in a pouch for every meal. Pouches, vegetables, you know, Greek yogurt, the type of things my lovely wife likes to eat, and then like a brown bag with a bottle of schlitz in there. And it just did like that time and a place that I lived, you know, 10, 12, 15 years ago. It was great. I like going back to it, but I think the fridge is a nice metaphor. I just thought of this. I think the fridge is a nice metaphor for how 40s just don't quite sync up with my 35 year old father of two lifestyle. That's not to say every once in a while,

like when we make great content here with compelling guests over 40 ounces of malt liquor, I won't get that buzz again. I'll get it again. But it's just not something that's sustainable for me. I think we'll more air on the side of the Will Blackman wine buzz. Okay? I can do that. I had a couple glasses of red a couple weeks ago in the wake of that Will Blackman pod.

listen i texted kelsey at 2 a.m or i texted him actually at like 2 30 in the morning i said man i'm still up i'm on 40 number three he texts me back the next day he said you know that warm fire that i was sitting next to about 3 a.m i woke up outside and the fire was out so jason kelsey woke up outside uh after doing our podcast and that's what makes this thing special um anyways i do want to circle back to one thing Jason Kelsey said. The whole not washing your hands after you urinate in the bathroom, I don't support that. Okay, I was, I listened back to the pod and I feel like I kind of sat there idly and didn't really let him know how disgusting that was to hear about a friend who I've dapped up thousands of times. If you think about the amount of handshakes and hugs, I mean,

and Kelsey. I mean, like shit, when we climb Kilimanjaro, I'm assuming everybody's got bad hygiene. You get a lot of elbow bumps and, and knuckles and that sort of thing. But I just never thought that at the Eagles end of the year Christmas party,

Kelsey in a sport coat walking out of a bathroom, hasn't washed his hands after he took a leak. And the rationale for him is, again, as long as you don't piss on your hand, it's fine. I'm not okay with that. I know it was said on this podcast. It's actually offensive, thinking back.

So, yeah, I think it's also a little bit genius because if you're Jason Kelsey, and you like fans, and you're classy when you run across him, but big crowds, autograph signings, if I'm him, I get that out there. People don't want to shake your hand anymore. Kind of smart.

First weekend with no football was absolutely glorious. I just want to say that. Best weekend I've had in 20 plus weeks. And I don't know if like the NFL media makes, takes like a blood oath where you have to act like you're sad. You're not having like a fucking seizure looking at 18 TVs all Sunday, just hemorrhaging money. You're staring at all these TVs and you're disoriented and you're going to be up until

3 a.m. doing a podcast that everybody's going to read all bright-eyed and bushy at 9 a.m. And they're going to judge the fuck out of your podcast because they watch only one game. There's a lot of gravity there. And I don't know. Either these people are carrying out the blood oath and tweeting, you know, every year seven days from the last Sunday. Oh, what do I do it this weekend? Oh my gosh. I miss it so much. Or they're sociopaths. I have no idea. how you're not a little bit excited that you can walk the fucking dog on Sunday. I don't know. Isn't there a release there or some of you guys just sickos? It was glorious though. And a lot of why it was glorious is because I had a lot of unfinished business around the house.

There's nothing more energizing than when you get on a task. Man, you guys know what I'm talking about. And I am a taskmaster. I don't, I'm not in the zone a lot, but when I am, I crush it. And And the season, because of the workload, I just mentioned, and for me, like, doing all the pods, we were doing this, this year was, like, almost too much. And Amazon, I said, I've said that two years now. Maybe I'll do less next fall. You know, like parts of my house look like I am legend. And I just don't have time to tend to it.

I don't have time to finish the task that I, that paused for 24 weeks around, like, August 28th. I ended up upstairs doing a task. and hit it out of the ballpark thanks to a new product that I have no corporate affiliation with. This is not like an ad read. It sounds a lot like an ad read. But I just love this volcano vaporizer so much. I love it so fucking much.

I got it from Planet of the Vapes. It's a really cool name for a website. I was hitting my volcano bag in front of my wife going, like get it, Planet of the Vapes. So fucking stupid. But I love the website, dude. I love it. And I love the volcano vaporizer.

Listen, I had a Pax for years. I had a Pax, which is a little vaporizer. You put some flour in, and it obviously vaporizes that shit down, so you're not breathing in a bunch of papers and, yeah, I don't know, carcinogens,

you know, burning a bunch of joints or that sort of thing or that harsh feeling after you smoke a bowl or some or some of you bongers. People got real mad. I don't know. People got mad at me because I said, on part of my take that bongs are so like your early 20s. For me, that's, you know, maybe I spoke a little bit too from personal, too much from

personal experience. I don't think bongs are in anymore when you're like a father of young children. The thing is enormous. It's glass. It looks like a lot of work in retrospect. I got nothing against bongs. I just have never been a bong guy. I really liked my packs.

I got away from it from a little bit. for a little bit. So I said, you know what? I've heard about these kind of desktop vaporizes. I don't want to smoke my pen as much as I have in the past. So I said, I'm going to order one of these bad boys and take a flyer on this. I got the gold one. Looks amazing.

Looks like a little R2D2. No, C3PO. It looks like a little C3PO shape like an R2D2. That's what my volcano looks like. It's got a dial. It's got 10 settings. You know, the heat settings. It's got a green button for blowing up the balloon.

it's got a red button for turning the heat on. This is basically a YouTube tutorial, okay, what I'm giving you right now. One-stop shop here. Check this bad boy out. You put the little balloon on top. The balloon inflates. It's way bigger than you think it is.

But don't be afraid because it takes five minutes to heat up now. Five minutes to heat up. You blow your bag up. The only tough part is that you actually have to remember to turn the heat off. And that's the thing. technology and getting stoned do not really mix so i got the cheaper one you know the the latest one is like digital and there's all these numbers and shit it's probably just fine to operate it intimidated me this little basic volcano vaporizer produces the best cleanest buzz like literally

i'm on two three bags right now um just crush in a poter podcast. Or maybe the producers are like probably not so much, Chris, but you're enjoying it. I, um, I, I love this thing. It's so clean. It doesn't last long. And thanks to this volcano vaporizer, I cleaned my entire fucking bathroom, dude. Let me tell you about my bathroom. Or normally what this process would go like. I was like sitting up there because I was doing the volcano in my bathroom. Both kids were taking a nap and I was like, you know, maybe I'll try this thing out. It's a snow day. We're snowed in. I noticed that, you know, about three bags in, I noticed that, you know, the bath towel is on the ground. So I reached down to pick up the bath towel

and hang it on the hook. And then I have this little realization that maybe I should just clean the entire bathroom. So naturally with me, this is usually how it goes. And at one juncture, this is how it went. The entire bathroom counter, and we have a big counter, there's piles everywhere. If my wife walked upstairs she would have a heart attack even by my standards but my vice drawer was fucking spotless dude well that's usually how the story ends and at that point i walked downstairs and forget and make up an excuse later um but this went a little bit differently i followed through and cleaned all the piles up dude i was listening to jeeps blues organizing a drawer that looked like a fucking bedbath and beyond I'll spare toothpaste, spare gold bond.

I haven't used gold bond in forever. I got plenty of gold bond. It's all itemized. It's right there. I got my contact lenses in one bucket. I got razors. I haven't shaved in years. I mean, it was impressive.

And eventually I had to make up some shit about two drawers. There's nothing in the two drawers. Like literally, I have excess drawers. So thanks to the volcano, I started this process. I had seven beard trimmers. Now I have two. And dudes out there know why. You need two beer trimmers, but you sure don't need seven.

So I appreciate the volcano for, thank you, volcano, for organizing the fuck out of my house. I mean, my bathroom looked like I was a Marine or something. Look like I was going overseas. Sergeant Chris, I told my lovely wife, I said, you got to call me Sergeant Chris from now on, stolen valor in this, up in this motherfucker, because like you could bounce a quarter off my bed type of organizational skills going on. and at one point my buddy texted me asked me how I was feeling

and my answer was, I don't know this much, it's all good. And I looked around and I go, wait, come to think of it, I am high. I mean, so again, the balloon takes five minutes to heat up. Tastes great. And yeah, I got the older one

because I don't like technology. Again, technology being high, don't mix. It is healthy and it is awesome. Now, one thing I did on the, the volcano this weekend and this is where I come to the shameful admission part of the show. I saw a karate kid for the first time last night in my life. Not this year, not in the past five years, not that I remember. I truly believe it's the first time I've seen any extended portion of karate kit. Reed, how does that make you feel? You should be embarrassed for giving, making so much

shit all the time. That's true. It's true. You know, it's funny. I do. give making a lot of shit, but making misses the classics and everything in between, like all the way through to the cult classics. But like definitely karate kid has been one of those movies you act like you've seen. And not because you're ashamed. Like really, I'm not ashamed. I'm offering this up to millions of people by my count, all the people listening to this podcast at this juncture in the show. It's just more that I don't feel like going through the conversation. You know, like, really? Are you kidding me? You got to do it. You got to do it. You got to. do and then they like make you watch karate kid at gunpoint like that's kind of how people are so

i just have avoided it and after a while you kind of know when somebody says put him in a body bag johnny you're like i kind of know what was happening in the movie because at some point i asked somebody to jog my memory what was that scene in the movie like i forgot i've seen the movie and then they tell you and then you act like you know what was going on at that juncture so you're in on the inside jokes but for the most part, you mostly smile and nod. You know that really uncomfortable fixed smile, like you know what's going on and you don't. That's what I've been like for years with karate kids. So I saw it last night for the first time. It's wild. It took this long. I picked it up at the scene after he does all that manual labor and he realizes what the fuck he's been doing the last couple days. Reed,

do you remember that scene? Yeah. Wax on wax off. Yeah, dude. All that shit just came to life right in front of all the times I've nodded and smiled and all that shit. I mean, there's been past rush drills where we're quoting Mr. Miyagi, right? For years. Like, I've been in pass rush drills doing wax off. I've heard people delivering the lines. And it just, it illuminated right in front of me, man. For the first time I saw it, that's a great scene to kind of pop into.

My mind was blown. And then also the fact that all maintenance men are essentially like Chung Lee, like potentially, like potentially, right? If you, like, if you're a maintenance man, you could. could be in the octagon. Yep. That's the conclusion I'm drawing from that. And then I stopped and I watched Curb for a while for a long while and picked up karate

kid on the back end, popped back in. I saw Miyagi giving Danielson some tort all, essentially, right? Is that what happened back there? Reid, what happened back there when he got kicked in the leg and then he went to the back and then Miyagi did something to him? They cut the scene right before he was like bracing and do some maneuver. You're the tort all expert, and if memory serves me right, that sounds about right. So that's essentially what he did. He shot Danielson up in the back of like a youth sports tournament,

which, to be honest, all these lines are coming to life right in front of my eyes, put them in a body bag, Johnny, and then sweep the leg and all that stuff. Like I knew loosely what we were referring to when we made those jokes for years, but to see it in motion, man, it was crazy. The most disappointing part, they should have slow-mo. that crane kick. What the fuck? There was all this buildup. And then he like in real time just kicks the shit of the guy in the chest and they're like,

winner. I don't even know how karate works. What are the rules? So yeah, I mean like awesome movie. I will go back front to back at some point and watch the whole thing. I'm sorry. But the big vagina episode of Curb was right there. If you know that episode.

Yeah, but, but definitely, like, Mr. Miyagi's getting canceled nowadays. He shot that fucking kid up, who by the way is 23 in real life at the time of the movie. He looks 16. It's insane. Ralph Machio. Ralph Machio, he's 59 now. Googled the shit out of, you know, pictures of that dude. I hadn't seen him in years.

My cousin Vinny. Yep, that's, that's where I knew him from. is he's in my cousin viny yep had to be that's exactly because i was like who the fuck is this guy i know also maybe the cobra kies are misunderstood well isn't there a tv show right now about i don't know spoilers no spoilers but i just felt like maybe they're a little bit misunderstood uh maybe there's an opportunity into a greater discussion on coaching in youth sports but miagi's getting canceled nowadays if he pulled some shit like that uh and maybe these cobra kai kids deserve second chance right?

Certainly. They should go over to Mr. Miyagi's dojo. Yep. Sons the tour at all. No tort all paint defense.

Yeah, we'll do some Karate Kid content because I know some people are going to be like what the fuck, dude?

Kind of like you just were. All right. I'll see you all Friday.