Green Light with Chris Long - Mina Kimes! NFL Free Agency, Sam Darnold in Seattle & Aaron Rodgers' FA Destination!

Episode Date: March 14, 2025

Chris Long and Mina Kimes cruise around NFL free agency and give their takes on the teams that have made the best moves, teams that are in NFL purgatory and how Aaron Rodgers fits with the Pittsburgh Steelers (if that ends up being his destination). Mina, as a Seahawks fan, also gives her take on the Seattle Seahawks paying Sam Darnold and Geno Smith finding a new home in Las Vegas! Mina, as a Seahawks fan, gives her take on the Seattle Seahawks paying Sam Darnold and Geno Smith finding a new home in Las Vegas and the two talk about Cooper Kupp's potential destination, Justin Fields in New York and where Trey Hendrickson could be traded! (00:00) - Intro (2:35) - Mina on Celebrity Jeopardy  (6:50) - Aaron Rodgers to the Steelers? (19:30) - AFCE Improvements (28:03) - Seattle Paying Sam Darnold Over Geno Smith (37:48) - Cooper Kupp (41:43) - Power Rank Most Purgatory Teams in the NFL (43:48) - This Offseason’s Zack Baun Signing (51:13) - Trey Hendrickson (53:48) - Player That A Fan Base Will Miss Most Have some interesting takes, some codebreaks or just want to talk to the Green Light Crew? We want to hear from you. Call into the Green Light Hotline and give us your hottest takes, your biggest gripes and general thoughts. Day and night, this hotline is open. Green Light Hotline: ‪[phone]‬ In need of sweet threads to vibe like Chris and the fellas? Check out https://greenlightpodcast.org/ for everything merch wise and then some! Also, check out our paddling partners at Appomattox River Company to get your canoes, kayaks and paddleboards so you're set to hit the river this summer. https://paddleva.com/ Green Light's YouTube Channel, where you can catch all the latest GL action: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCgxWFAA-wuB7osdiAJyLOcw Green Light with Chris Long: Subscribe and enjoy weekly content including podcasts, documentaries, live chats, celebrity interviews and more including hot news items, trending discussions from the NFL, MLB, NHL, NBA, NCAA are just a small part of what we will be sharing with you. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I think this is a dramatically risky bet by Seattle because essentially they're betting that that exchange is going to work out for them and get them out of purgatory. Chris, I am very skeptical of that. And I like Darnold, I want to be clear, but this is not a good situation for him. Welcome to the Greenlight podcast presented by BetMGM. If you haven't signed up for BetMGM yet, use bonus code Greenlight. And you will get up to a $1,500 first bet offer on your first wager with BetMGM. Here's how it works.

Download the BetMGM app and sign up using bonus code Greenlight. Deposit at least $10 and place your first wager on any game. If that bet loses, you will receive up to $1,500 in bonus bets. Just make sure you use bonus code Greenlight when you sign up. Welcome to the Greenlight podcast. Chris Long and Meena Kimes, two of the best football minds out there right now, ripping through NFL free agency. They talk about the teams that made the best moves, the best.

fits for players, the fan bases that are going to miss certain players the most, teams that are in NFL purgatory right now, and how would Aaron Rogers fit on the Pittsburgh Steelers, if that's where he were to end up. A fun episode for you, a great conversation. Chris and Mina cover everything in the NFL right now. Enjoy it, and we'll catch you next week. All right, she's back. She's back, ladies and gentlemen. One of the busiest people in sports media this week. She's doing a lot of Aaron Rogers segments. She's trying to keep us up to speed on what he's thinking, among others. Her name is Mina Kimes, and she joins me now on the Green Light Pod. What's up? What's another Aaron Rogers segment? I told you, I hope the news breaks while

we're taping, so we can at least get some juice out of it. Before we get into this, and we'll give him a little bit time to decide so that we can break the news. I want to ask you about Celebrity Jeopardy. What's up with that? I don't watch television. My parents had the voice on last night. I was like, what the fuck is this? I don't watch. What is this show? I don't watch any TV. So you got to tell me what's going on soup to nuts with you in Celebrity Jeopard. This isn't like you asked me to plug this. I'm really curious. Well, really quick on the voice. I don't watch those shows either, but my parents do. religious. It's like ultimate parent fodder, right? And I went home once, I think this was like, the show has been on forever. This must have been like 10 years ago. And this is so my dad,

I found a yellow legal pad where my dad was taking notes on all of the singers and writing down his thoughts. Oh. Yo. Your dad has one up my dad. My dad has like a stack like three feet high of yellow legal pads that he buys in bulk and just uses to do everything. I guess, which might explain, I don't know about this season, but he's had some strong takes in the past. Yeah, Jeopardy. I was really nervous, dude, because, well, just a million reasons, but I felt like a lot of pressure to not look like an idiot. Yeah. And also the questions of Celebrity Jeopardy are like easy. So you feel it weirdly creates. It's extra pressure because you feel dumb.

Well, people don't understand, though, and I guess people saw me freaking out about this. It's really hard to buzz in. And that's actually half the battle on the show. It's not about the questions. It's about the buzzer. What makes the buzzer difficult? You have to buzz in in like a tiny window.

And if you buzz in too early, it locks you out. And then you want to beat everybody. So it's kind of like video games, right? It's like playing Wii or something, which I don't play video games. So I don't have like that hand-eye coordination. I feel like. Did it air already?

Yeah, it did. Yeah. All right. So did you, did you win or lose? I'll deal with the spoilers. Just did you win or lose? I did win. Yeah.

I won the first round, yeah. That's awesome. I don't know if this is a big deal or not. Feels like a big deal. You ask me a question like a world geography question. That, you know, like one that if I get it wrong, I'm not going to feel stupid, but one that's like Jeopardy class. Okay. Well, there's Celebrity Jeopardy class and there's regular Jeopardy class.

But, um... Oh, shit. So Celebrity Jeopardy is like a little bit, it's... Yeah, it's a little dumber. I can ask you a geography question that was on my episode last night. Okay. Hit me. Let me make sure if I got the...

Well, I don't remember the exact wording of it, but basically the gist of it was, do you know the name of a river in India that is sacred? It's like considered to be a holy... River. It was a little tricky, I guess. Yeah, what is outside my wheelhouse? I can't do that one. You know, Africa. Yeah, yeah. I'm not real. See, it's not that easy to be on Celebrity Jeopardy, man. You know, you're giving yourself not enough credit. Well, that's good. So you were a little bit nervous, but you won round one. When are we going to see you again on Celebrity Jeopardy Jeopardy? The semifinals, I am told air in mid-April.

So I don't know the exact date yet. How do you study? I actually bought, I don't know, it's right there. This book. Do you remember BrainQuest? Did you ever do those growing up? Like the trivia with like the little flip cards? Obviously not.

Yeah, we might have had slightly different paths. So they make these like books of like facts. So I bought a book of U.S. historical facts and just read it. It's like for junior high students. It actually was quite helpful, to be honest. I'm into that. So I might cop a, you know, one of those books there. And I don't know if I qualify as a celebrity, but one day I'm going to try to get on Jeopardy.

Definitely more of a celebrity than I am. It beat your record. All right, cool. So people want to hear all about free agency. it's like the coolest thing in the world, I guess, because it's the only thing on TV or on ESPN.com. How do we start? I guess let's start with Aaron Rogers.

Does Aaron Rogers make somebody better at this point? That's a great way of phrasing it. I think, yes, because there's a few teams that have no quarterback. So, like the best quarterback and the Giants, right now is Tommy DeVito. So yes, Aaron Rogers makes them better. He also, I think, would be an improvement upon last year as well. I think you could argue the same for the Steelers, although I love your hearing of thoughts on this, because Theo and I got into it a little bit on NFL live. Like, on one hand, Rogers, the Steelers, makes sense. They're the most linked together teams. And you

kind of understand why they'd be a little bit low to just run it back with Russ. On the other hand, to me, Aaron Rogers playing with D.K. McCaff and George Pickens is like a toxic fever dream. Like, I don't, like, am I crazy for thinking that he will lose his shit within like two quarters of playing with those dudes? Dude, I have the pictures in my head of them on the sideline arguing over a tablet. Like already, you know, I'm not really sure how that goes wrong, but I don't know. My first reaction when I saw that they traded for DK was, I'm not saying it's redundant. They're two deep threat guys. They're two home run ball guys.

I think one has like, I'm not going to compare the two players exactly because one, I think has like incredible ball skills and, you know, like his late hands are as good as anybody in the NFL. The other guy's just a big bully out there. And I don't mean to be reductive. He doesn't have the whole route tree. You know, he's just a big overpowering force. but neither guy has been able to, it seems like,

kind of keep their shit together on the sideline, you know, not to put it too bluntly. And I think that at least is part of the factor why in Seattle they wanted to just start over and let JSN be the lead dog in that room. By sealer standards, though, D.K is like the most normal wide receiver that they've ever had. And he's also going to look like the scariest wide receiver they ever had in that uniform.

Like, can you imagine him with a dark Kaiser all of 6-6 or whatever he is, built the way he is in that black and, and gold uniform. I think it's good, like, listen, the ceiling on these two moves. Now, you got to remember, you got to round out that wide receiver core with guys like Calvin Austin, you know, speedier guys, guys who can actually run routes and that sort of thing. The ceiling on this move is great. Then you add Aaron Rogers.

And yeah, like the ceiling on Aaron Rogers, even at this age, is still pretty high. Like, I saw him last year at times make throws that I said, wow, like he's still Aaron Rogers. So all the football, if you can just keep the football, the football, I mean, this could be an improvement for them. But we both know that over the past couple of years, it's been a bit of a shit show dealing with Aaron Rogers. And I didn't bring that on him. You know, like the media didn't bring that on him. He brought that on him. And so like, I hate to have to say this and bake it into my analysis of a great football.

player but that's a reality and in pittsburgh it almost feels like tomlin loves these challenges man like i don't know what it is in tomlin's DNA where he's like yeah let me put together the most potentially toxic situation and try to try to surf this wave and i think if anybody can it's him but um if i were him i would say number one erin i need you at everything we have to build a report with this group talking about bringing in a new wide receiver who we gave up a top 100 pick four and he's got to work well with george pickens who by the way needs to take the next step in his development and we got to get this offense on the same page and we you know like you think some destinations would be too too big an opportunity in NFL terms to act like to act like shitty

you know like the jets seem to be like jets are too small a deal. it's too poor of an organization from the way it's run, the recent histories to garbage, that you would walk into that building and feel the respect that I think it would, would necessitate Aaron Rogers, like doing the right thing and saying the right thing every day. Does that make sense? I'm hoping that if he ends up in Pittsburgh, he would say, hey, like, this is the Roonies, this is Mike Tomlin, you know, missing mandatory minicamp or whatever it is, or throwing players under the bus or pouting, like, that's,

stuff is it's off the table. This is the Steelers. That's the only way this works. And that's a big presumption that it's going to work out that way. Well, we say that, but the Steelers certainly have had tolerance for a lot of players to do all that kind of stuff over the last few years. I guess I want to be clear, too, on Rogers and Pittsburgh when I kind of joked about him and those receivers. Like, I'm specifically talking about football stuff. I mean, Aaron Rogers is harder on his receivers than maybe any quarterback in the league. How many times have we seen show? shots of him throwing up his hands in frustration when a guy runs the round route or doesn't understand his hand signals or whatever.

D.K. Mekoff and George Pickens are both incredibly talented receivers. Technicians, they are not. So I just feel like that is a bit of recipe for disaster or at least some toxicity. And then the other thing, like, Chris, like, it's a weird scheme fit, right? Arthur Smith is still the play caller. We know he wants to run that under center play action. Rogers kind of wants to sit in the gun and read things out to read the ball quickly. I think they have to improve the offensive line there. If they were signing him, the run game wasn't that good last year. So I don't know.

The issue is there's no other alternatives. So we can like talk about this. But like what other paths do they realistically have? Well, they have the path of ripping off the Band-Aid and like teams that are in purgatory. Yeah. For a long time, need to decide at some point like, do we want to stay here or, you know, do we want to start the process? And I know for like Steelers fans, that's not very excited.

especially when you won eight games famously for a very long time. I do think they're one of the most purgatory teams in the NFL because in recent years, at times they've had a really good defense and that very anemic passing attack has you've been able to survive it, even with, you know, bad offensive coordinating. And eventually last year, kind of a carouselic quarterback and the pump fake with Russell Wilson, like, oh, he's the old Russ. No, he's just the new Russ. Like, I think at some point, these teams that play veteran quarterback roulette have to sit down like indie.

And they tried to do it with Anthony Richardson and say, like, we're going to do something different. But the Steelers aren't in a position to draft a guy like that. So I don't know what they do. And honestly, I think for a team to want Aaron Rogers, number one, he'd have to be bought in. But number two, like all the things that you just mentioned wouldn't be issues. Like, for me, he just came from the. Jets where the offensive line was an issue. People said he didn't have enough weapons, even though he had two good backs, Garrett Wilson, and he handpicked a lot of the players on that

roster offensively. So now you're talking about Pittsburgh where you've got these two high ceiling wide receivers who I was the first guy on the damn soapbox talking about, I was on the soapbox and pounding the table for George Pickens. I was doing both those things at the same time about he could be a Hall of Fame or people laughed at me. Now the joke is on anybody who doesn't see the potential or the tragedy and the fact that he can't keep his shit together. So like it I don't know what you make of Pittsburgh, but to me it just feels like they're a team that keeps throwing different things at the wall and hoping they stick. And also when you look at the defense, I don't think the defense is in the shape it has traditionally been in to carry like

a situation where the offense is hot and cold. Yeah, that was like, I feel like their playoff loss, it got kind of slept on how bad the defense was in that game. Terrible. Because we were also dialed into the quarterback and Russ, who actually had a few pretty decent drives against the Ravens. But the defense was awful in that game. And yeah, I don't think they're good enough to carry a mid quarterback anymore. By the way, I'm right with there with you on pickings. Can I say that?

Like, that dude, I think has as much talent as any. receiver in the NFL. Some of the catches he makes, I don't think, count on one hand, the number of guys who are even close to making those catches. But I don't know about this pairing. I'll throw out the possibility they might trade him too. I do wonder if they do this DK contract thinking they're sick of it and they want to see if they can get decent draft pick for him because it does feel a little

bit redundant. They're different players, but it's a little redundant. Yeah, and I don't, I don't want to overly boil him down. Like, I think it's a compliment to them that they're redundant. I mean, they're both home run hitters, scary for other defense for defenses to prepare for. But I think what you said, like the scheme fit to me is also a question. Like, listen, Rogers is maybe, you know, some of the parts mid quarterback at this point. But like, if you can get him doing what he does best, he can still be really, really good. But you, but it takes a lot to do that.

And I don't know that in Arthur's offense without changing some things, as you allude, to two, you're going to get that. And so it does feel kind of like a Band-Aid. And I just don't feel like the Steelers have traditionally been a Band-Aid franchise. Like in this area, it feels like they're a Band-Aid franchise, where every year they're trying to figure out something different to do. And, you know, like they got the Steelers logo on the helmet, but it kind of feels like the Colts. You know, it's like since Ben Rathesberger fell off the face of the earth, like they really haven't found their footing. That's why I kind of like respect what the Jets did this off season because not that they had that many choices, but like I kind of like it when a team

recognizes they're not actually that competitive and they're not going to try to get a band-aid like quarterback, take a fly around fields. It's basically a one-year deal. Sit out this draft. Let's not reach for a guy. I know it can be hard for fans to stomach that, but at least it keeps you out of what you're describing, which is this endless purgatory. Yeah. And, and, and, listen, the Fields thing again is like, there's still part of me that believes in him. You know, and the reality is I'm sitting here, you know, thumb in my nose at the Rogers thing. And some people are going to be like, that's Aaron Rogers. And you're sitting here caping for Justin Fields.

But there's a difference. Justin Fields is younger by a whole lot. And honestly, I still see some skills in his body that are differentiating. And if you can just get him to process quicker, which it's so easy, the heavy lifting is just, is the word, in that sentence, but like, we've seen it before where guys make jumps. And I think everybody's banking on somebody with the talent that he has to make that jump. I also think for Justin Fields, I want to point this out last year in Pittsburgh, I thought he took his medicine, not for nothing, and showed class in a situation where as a

competitor, I'm sure he wanted that job and did everything he could to be a good teammate. I agreed with Pittsburgh's move to go to Russ, you know, because of, I think like the Raiders game is a perfect example where everybody, everybody's like, well, they won the game, but did you watch the game? You know, they missed so many opportunities. And I think for him to keep that job in New York, he's going to have to make the most of those opportunities. I think they'll be out there. He reunites with Garrett Wilson.

He's got some good backs in the backfield. You know, I love Aaron Glenn. He gained a lot of my respect over the last couple of years as a coordinator. Obviously, I didn't know as much about him as a coach. But last year, the job he did in Detroit was a very important. amazing. So I'm pulling for the Jets. And as a Justin Fields fan, like a truth or lowercase T at this point, like I'm still hoping that he turns that corner. But to your point, that ain't taking a big swing. Yeah. You know, and, and, and I'm hopeful. I'm hopeful for them. Yeah, me too.

I was going to ask you about the, about the ASC East. And, you know, like, it kind of feels like Buffalo gained a lot of confidence last year. And like, hey, we don't. don't need to put the pedal of the medal to win. Like, we've realized what we have at quarterback. We love the coordinator. He didn't get plucked this year. Huge. Huge.

Defense has to get better. But I feel like they've made some under the radar moves. Are there any that you really like? Bosa is the splashy move. I like, yeah, we'll see. You know, it's hard to bet on Joey Bosa giving you a ton of games at this point in his career. Obviously, it's just a one-year deal. I love that they paid their own guys and kept everyone on pretty reasonable contracts.

I mean, this is such a boring take. But like all the deals that I like were the ones teams did with their own players. Like the Ravens with Ronnie Stanley, I thought was this deal, a free agency. Also, you keep them out of the chiefs hands, by the way. And then the same thing, the bill's paying Gregory Rousseau. Like, that contract is going to be about $20 million a year. And I think that's a great piece of business for Buffalo. He's never going to be, you know, one of those do.

dudes in the NFL. Like he's not a top 10, 15 edge rusher, but he's tremendous against the run. He's just super solid. So if they can get any juice out of Bosa and maybe a young player opposite him, I think that's going to look like a really great signing by next year especially.

I agree on the Russo re-sign. That has to get better, right? And, you know, as we parse Josh's legacy, Patrick's legacy, you saw what happened to the chiefs the very next week. Like those two quarterbacks played against very different defenses in that game. You know, the bills cannot continue to go to bat against Patrick Mahomes with defenses like this and expect to eventually pull the sword from the stone.

It's not going to happen with the secondary that they trotted out there and the pass rush that they had. So I think the Joey Bosa thing has to work out. But I think he's played in like, I don't know how many snaps over the last three years. I think I read a thousand snaps. So you have to have him available. I do love the Josh Palmer signing. Really? I do.

I just, I feel like I have a feeling that this is going to be one of those things we look at in a year and we're like, wow, that was a steal. I don't think he fully realized his potential in L.A. I'm coming around on the fact that Herbert has some growing up to do. as much as I think he's fantastic. I didn't love that offense last year. I didn't know who they were from one month to the next. Eventually they settled into being like this past happy group, but I don't feel like Palmer got the work he'll get in that offense.

And I think what's also awesome is he gets open. Like he's one of the best separators when you look at like kind of the metrics and all that next level stats that everybody's into. I was reading about he's one of the best separators in the NFL. And so I think he can be a really solid number two for them. I think he's a really solid number two or high end three. My issue with Buffalo is just like they got a bunch of those now. Not that there was one available for them,

but I really want them to add some speed to that receiving group. Maybe they'll do something in the draft. They're kind of like a whole team of like good players. You got Josh Allen and you got a bunch of just like a really good player's Rousseau, Ed Oliver, Khalil Shakir. But like on both sides of the ball, it feels like they need like a real difference maker and they're kind of missing that on both sides. See, I think I think that they're missing it mostly on defense in my opinion.

Like I think they have enough to beat the big boys with what they have offensively because they can run the ball. You know, because. Cook is a difference maker. I want to say that. I wasn't thinking of him. I think he is a difference. Cook.

Yeah, I agree. And I think Kincaid before that drop was, and he still is a difference maker as a receiving tight end. I think they've looked at it from a different standpoint, which is like, hey, depth can get it done. Spreading the ball around can get it done. And as long as we have a run game and the job that they've done up front, like the big difference maker, they just paid him $300 million, right?

And so like they have the luxury to do that offensively. They straight up just don't have the luxury to do that defensively. So to your point, I feel like that's where they really need to invest in, whether it's through the draft or free agency, somebody that makes a difference. But if you look around the AFCEs, like there's nobody that really, like the Patriots kind of scare me in a matchup standpoint. Like from a matchup standpoint, you saw how much trouble they gave them in the second game of the season. and with sneaky signings like Carlton Davis you talk about like corner with length you know who will

help in that match up Milton Williams they're racking up variable guys like you worry about playing the Patriots but there's nobody in the division that worries about that makes me worried about unseating them you know what I mean yeah yeah I think especially with Miami going the way they are having to shed players it's kind of always going to happen right with their cap the jets are obviously rebuilding the Patriots like what are your thought because I I really liked the focus on defense which was bad and injured last year but like God help Drake out a little bit like I I know they tried with Godwin and I guess he turned them down I don't know the exact reporting on that and I know also there weren't many other than like DK there weren't many options in free agency but I really

hope they can find a receiver for him because it is it is they signed a right Morgan Moses play right tackle. I just feel like offensively, they kind of didn't do a lot, didn't do enough. Especially because, hey, I would think Braebel's chasing that difference making receiver ever since they lost A.J. Brown and the way they lost A.J. Brown. Like, I feel like that's got to be definitely a sore subject. And I don't know what they have up their sleeve. But to your point, like, they're going to have to grab somebody. And I'm super impressed with Drake. I really like Drake May and had a chance to sit down with him at the Super Bowl and loved him. Isn't he just like a golden retriever?

He's great. He's like, but he's a dude. Like he's just a, he's a guy you, you can imagine playing football with. Like not like a, not like a quarterback who's off in his section. No. He struck me as like a football player, which was cool. Yeah. Well, he plays like a football.

I mean, I don't, I think people are sleeping on how impactful he was as a runner last year because it was pretty impressive. and his size. I mean, it's pretty Josh Allen, like, honestly. He's a big. He's big. He's fast. Yeah.

He's willing. But yeah, they got to help him out. Here's a question for you. Patriots, you're picking up four. There's a run-on quarterbacks, let's say Carter's off the board. Do you take Hunter and play him at wide receiver? I don't. I think Hunter, I'm no draft expert, but in talking to the people that I, that I, that I, that

trust. Like, I'm just not a big believer in, like, guy playing both ways. You know, it's hard enough to make that transition as a high pick in the NFL, like, to adjust to the speed of the game and the whole thing. And he shouldn't have a lot of trouble because he's such a damn good athlete. But I think he's so differentiating on defensive side of the football. Like, I think his abilities are really differentiating on that side of the football. That's where, that's what I've been saying. Like, he, I got some heat for saying this, but I was like, this dude could be an all crow corner in like two years like because of his ball skills but if you bring him to new england he's instantly the best receiver on the he could be so like the receiver coach is going to be

looking at him over practicing him with the dvies being like please please let us borrow this dude he could be but like how does how does borrowing work out like then do you stunt his development as a is a corner and how if the borrowing is going really well then he just stays there but you know i i if I drafted him, hey, I might have him run in some drills and seeing what he's got and that sort of thing and maybe throwing a package for him. But I don't know what you do there. All right. So let's move out West. I want to get you going here. Gino, you were really hurt by this whole thing. Tell me why. Here's my issue with this. Because what they did,

is in a vacuum defensible. Basically, they thought, they said Seattle, we don't want to be in purgatory, the kind of purgatory you and I have been talking about, because they've probably been there for the last few years, right? So we're going to move on from the quarterback, and we're going to, because we don't want to pay him, so we want to pay a little bit less,

and we want to accumulate a draft pick. It was a third rounder, so, okay. And let's take a swing. But my issue is, they didn't take a swing, right? And it wasn't a draft where I think that was defensible instead they just paid a different quarterback slightly less who I think is going to struggle in an ecosystem that's dramatically worse than the one is leaving.

And I am as, I would say dramatically right now, especially after trading Metcalf. You got JSA and you got arguably the worst, one of the worst interior offensive lines in football. And I know he was dealing with some pretty suss past protection. And by the way, you have a pretty unproven play caller in Clint Kubiak. Everybody keeps saying, oh, Clint Kubiak is going to be the same offense.

Kevin O'Connell is one of the best play callers in the NFL, like top five to me. So I think this is a incredibly risky bet by Seattle because essentially they're betting that that exchange is going to work out for them and get them out of purgatory. Chris, I am very skeptical of that. And I like Donald. I want to be clear. But this is not a good situation for him. Well, the only thing I can think of is, well, number one, like the place where I think you

and I disagree is like keeping him. And I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I gather you think keeping him would have, would have helped. I don't know what that would have cost. Like that's, we don't know yet, right? Because we haven't seen his deal with the Raiders. Yeah. And I think paying a 33, 34 year old Gino who I like Gino and I have, I have definitely got

a soft spot for a guy who got cast aside and then had to climb back into it. And I've rooted for him. And we all see the highs. The highs are really high, but then the lows are like these red zone turnovers where at times they have nothing to do with the protection. And I understand like the protection can be a compounding factor. And eventually you see ghosts. Speaking of the successor to Gino. But like, I do think they were hitting a ceiling with the group and with him.

And that's not to say I don't think Gino can elevate Vegas. Like, who knows, maybe the ceiling's higher in Vegas. I think sometimes you need a change, right? So I don't think it's too controversial to say, hey, we're going to hit the reset button. To your point, you are kind of doing the bridgy thing again, right? Like the bridge plus thing again. Like, we'll see. Maybe he can turn into the next Gino, right?

But the character arc on him at the end of last season with Gino-like protection was, yikes. The only thing I can say is Clint Kubiak will at least try to run the football, not that they ever gave Gino that luxury, right? He'll at least try to run the football. They might emphasize the run game, getting on the edge, play action pass. They might mitigate some of these protection issues. The questions I have, and I agree with you wholeheartedly is like, he's walking into a shitty situation. So you're paying a guy. Yeah. And I like Sam, and I'm pulling for Sam, and I think he can be a guy. But you're paying a guy who had one year in a very good setup.

and this setup is worse. So there's a lot of proven it out to do. I just don't know that they were really going anywhere with Gino, in my opinion, other than 10 wins, maybe one playoff win. Like I don't know that either of these guys to me feels like, hey, you can go win a Super Bowl with this guy. I think that's my issue here. It's like I get the need to shake it up a little bit.

But this is just not the right time. And they didn't, I think, in a way, that I would characterize as a high upside swing. If they had paired this move with somehow really improving the interior of the offensive line, I would feel a lot better about it. They've done Jack All there. They have been in on some of the guards and they haven't signed anyone. I'm just, Sam Darnold, God love him, is a pressure sensitive quarterback.

And we saw that at the end of the season. And this is, I'm worried for him. I'm almost like Sam. Like, really? Like, why? You know, I don't know how many options. Hey, what did Shannon say for 50 million? I go to hell.

That was my reaction to the Garrett news. People were like, wow, I guess winning doesn't matter. I'm like, the things I would do for that contract. Yeah. You could make me like broadcast out of, I don't know, I don't want to offend any city. I was going to say a city. But the worst city in America.

Yeah, no, I agree with you. Although I'm a little bit more bullish on Sam. I guess because I just don't want to do a 180. I thought that ironically, he played one of his best games in Seattle and this past season. Yeah. And, and it was, I think it was on the heels of them.

Remember they wore all white and played Chicago in prime time? And he struggled a little bit. And towards the end of the season, you saw some of the veneer kind of coming off him. And a lot of it was the protection and that sort of thing. But I also didn't think Kevin had his best. December and January. And yeah, no, and I love Kev.

Playoff game, I thought it really was, he shared some of their responsibility. No question. And so like, listen, that, that reality came down on them fast. I mean, they lost Darysaw on a freaking kneel down play at the end of the half. Should have been a kneel down play, but they were so backed up on their goal line. They couldn't just, they couldn't just kneel down. So they ran the ball and he got hurt. And I thought that's when it really started a snowball for them.

Long story short, I'm not saying, I hate the move for Sam Darnold. I'm not saying Gino's terrible. I'm just saying we're both kind of scratching our heads a little bit about, you know, like one for one. It's a little bit the same. One's cheaper. And it's a little bit more of an unknown commodity with Sam.

Gino's been doing this a couple years in Seattle. Yeah. I mean, I think John Schneider, frankly, the GM of the Seax got lucky with Gino Smith. I think when they did the Russell Wilson trade, they thought Drew Locke was going to be the quarterback. And then they lucked into this, like, unbelievable, comeback story. And this is him kind of cashing in on that win in some ways, right? I mean, he is shiter. He's been on an absolute heater when it comes to value, like,

to go from a quarterback in the third round of Russell Wilson for years, he was amazing, to a quarterback who was a reclamation project who dramatically played better than expected. Like, he's stacked up Ws. And I feel like this is him putting a lot of dip on his chip, saying, all right, I'm going to do it again, like, in a manner of speaking. I'm going to make another QB bet. I'm skeptical, but obviously as a fan, I hope it works out. Yeah, no question. If it goes terribly, then you're not in purgatory anymore. I guess that's a positive. But I love, I'll just say this, one of my favorite players in the league just signed with y'all, DeMarcus Lawrence.

Oh, yeah. Super excited about that for y'all. And, you know, a guy that was an absolute fixture in Dallas, just ass kicker in both parts of the game. I'm excited for Mafay to learn from him because they actually have a decent amount in common. Yeah. Yeah. Well, Mafei's got to get in that damn weight room a little bit before, you know, because that DeMarcus Lawrence, I don't know if anybody bullies tight ends better. Is he the best run defending edge of like our generation? Is that overstating it? He might be because there's somebody that doesn't have enough pass rush to get on the map, right? Like I play with a guy like William Hayes. like William Hayes was ridiculous okay like I believe a couple guys like that they were just like you know but in the category of elite pass rushers which clowny at his piece yeah I would put in there

yeah at different moments I thought when he was like an elite pass rusher you can call him the best majorly relevant edge player in the run game like he he was so dominant and he wasn't a pick he wasn't a pick a side guy you know he wasn't to like run around a block guy he was like i'm going to run down your shit and and i just a big fan of his so i also think mcdonald has the defense like once y'all got the linebacker thing humming last year he saw that okay i can build this thing out um i think part of this is given the keys to to kubiak and saying hey like all right i'll take the defense you want to hit the reset button that's another thing like jsn i think is good enough to be a one but they can't just have it be jsn and the guys they have

now. There's just so many needs on offense. I love directionally what they're doing on defense. I trust McDonald's judgment when it comes to personnel at this point. They were cycling through linebackers last year until they hit on Ernest Jones, safeties as well. Defense definitely trending up. But offensively, like you need IOL, you need another receiver.

You need a tight end, I would throw into the mix. Like there's so many needs. And yeah, I. I'm just skeptical of the plan on that side of the ball. But defensively, I am very optimistic about our things you're going to Seattle. Where are we placing Cooper Cup? Another NFC West topic. Is it Seattle?

Maybe. Yeah. Maybe. Wide receiver who can block. They don't have anyone like that. Seattle, I would throw out chargers. Right. Don't have to leave LA.

Places that love receivers you can block. Maybe Denver? I don't know. What do you think? I don't know. Like, honestly, and I don't know how much we should be talking about it respectfully. Like, like, a Cooper Cup was an incredible player. Like, 2021 was incredible. And I also think, like, age factors in and just a regression to the mean a little bit. And, you know, nobody loves Cooper Cup more than Matt Stafford and freaking and freaking Sean McVeigh. So like the fact that they're saying no thanks at this point, like, but he's going to have an opportunity to revive his career and finish on a high note. I think people have a lot of respect for him. And it'd be fun to see him in Seattle or in L.A. with the Chargers.

You know, the one thing, did I see this? I've missed a lot of things this week. Did Najee Harris sign with the Chargers? Yeah, he did. Yeah. Oh, one year deal. Interesting. Makes sense.

Did you see Trent Sieg signed with the Cowboys day one of he's a long snapper? They locked him up. They didn't waste any time. They made, I thought, a very puzzling decision in terms of running backs. They let Rico Dowdle walk and then signed Giovante Williams. And Dowdell got like a similar conchial in Carolina. I think Dowdell was like sneaky good back. Dottles pretty good.

Dottles pretty good. I didn't really understand that. What do you think the Cowboys, like internally, what do you take a stab at it? What do you think they say the Jones is sitting around their big star-shaped dinner table? Like what, like, are they trying to fuck, fuck it up? I don't mean that. I mean that respectfully. Like, they know people have this reputation of them in free agency and they continue

to do the same thing. Well, the thing that is so objectionable to me is not that they're going, not going out in spending a ton of money or over leveraging themselves. It's the procrastination aspect that is like insane, right? With Micah and just letting other deals pile up. And this is like you said, it's what they've been doing for years. Sometimes like old people have a certain way of doing things and don't depart from it. That's the only explanation I can come up with because there's the Micah one like,

again, maybe there's like either you're going to sign him or you're not. So why not get it done earlier? It makes no sense to me. It's almost like you're not doing it because somebody told you to do it. you're like, no, I'm going to make you wait. And then I'm going to spend even more money and screw my team over even more. Like Cincinnati is an example of this. You know, there's a few teams in the NFL right now that seem to be in this in this.

Those two teams have been really screwing this up when it comes to waiting too long to get these deals done. I am learning. What you're describing, though, I am learning now as my kid as a toddler, how to harness that for manipulation, which is, I'm like, oh, you don't want to eat this. Don't, you don't want. He's like, yes, I do. And he'll eat something. Oh, yeah.

It's like the most powerful manipulation tactic. Hey, Jerry, we've decided as an organization we shouldn't pay Michael Parsons. You're not allowed. Walk hell. Like, hell, we'll give him $100 million a year right now. All right. But yeah, it's tough because they might be the most purgatory team in the NFL. Dallas literally might be one of the most purgatory teams in the NFL now

because it's really hard to imagine them getting a lot better. This would be a great rankings, by the way, because we're always doing power rankings. Power rank them. Power rank them right now. Let's do it. Well, let's put up the teams who we, okay, Seattle, I'll throw in there as being in purgatory.

We agree the Steelers, the Cowboys. The Colts are one of the most purgatory teams in the NFL, period. They just can't get out of purgatory. They have a fetish for staff. U.S. 30-year-old white guys on their third or fourth team playing quarterback for them. Are the Saints too bad to be in purgatory? The Saints are in Cap Hell. Hell.

Yo, is Chase Young the new, uh, uh, Jadavian Clowny? Why are they doing these deals? I want to be respectful to Clowny because I think Clowny is a really fucking good player and had a good I want to be clear because when I saw that the young deal and the Justin Reed deals broke, I laughed. And I wasn't, those are good football players. Justin Reed, I did. Justin Reed has championship pedigree. Like, he's a dog.

But what the hell are the saints doing? Like, who do you think you are? Who do you think you are? It's like your broke friend who shows up with new shoes and you're just like, what do you? It's so irresponsible. What? It's so. Of any of this.

Yeah, these are Prada. Okay. Cool. So I think they're up there. Where are you going in those shoes? I think they're up there. I think Tampa escaped being in purgatory by nailing the Baker Mayfield thing. Um, Miami. Miami is is kind of purgatory. Yeah. I put Miami in there right now. Yeah. So yeah, this is the purgatory club. We'll rank them. Uh, give us your rankins at home. Put them in the comments. Um, all right. So. So. I got a fun one for you. Who do you think is going to be this year, Zach Bond? Oh, I love that. Like the under the radar free agent signing that ended up being... Changes everything. Yeah.

Okay, I'm looking at all the signings here. Yeah, because I don't have an answer right now. This is a one way, is a true one-way question. Okay. I do, I did love Puna Ford to the reins. I knew you would. You know I love Puna Ford. So I'll throw that one in there as a signing that I really liked that I think could be impactful.

Okay, I'll throw out, I want to hit your thoughts on this. You mentioned the bucks. What if it's on Reddick has a huge bounce back to the ear with Tampa? He certainly might. I mean, I think what he found out up in New York is like, it's hard to fly in any weather as a pass rusher. And, you know, if you're going to sit out most of the year, the rust accumulates. So I think Tampa will be a good destination for him. He's got to be one of the big,

and I don't mean this like to be a dick, but he's got to be one of the biggest losers as far as winners and losers. As far as like making the right move for their career and that sort of thing, like it just has not worked out. Loses out on a chance to get a ring. Probably. I think there's a real opportunity though for him to like rebuild Todd Wolfe's defense.

They've got good defensive tackles. Edge has been just been so obviously the need for them for so long. Great place to play. And I just want to say this one more time. I don't mean the guy's a loser. I think he's a great player. No, no, no. But it just has not worked out.

It's not a matter of debate. The moves he's made. I'm going to get some guy saying, Chris Long called Hassam Redick a fucking loser. Nah. The guy is a great pass rusher. I just would have loved to see him in Philly last year. Didn't work out like that.

And then the Jets, that whole thing. I mean, was a shit. I got my answer for you. Yeah. I got my answer for you. You do? Drey Greenlaw to the Broncos. I love that one.

Really? So I, and I like that one too. I like really both their. Hufonga, too. I like who Funga, but, you know, they both have some injury issues. Maybe Green Law's,

it's just recency bias. But I love Drean Law. Why do you think he's such a good fit there? Well, first of all, when he came back, Because you play in a couple games at the end of the year. He looked really good. He did.

So I was like, I don't know if he got a different Achilles from like Aaron Rogers and Kirk Cousins, but he is. Yeah. Maybe it's a position thing. Yeah. I think he is, and this is, I guess, Zach Bonn, like, he's so underrated in terms of his versatility. He can cover. He can play the run. He's, you know, he got to play next to Fred Warner.

And I actually think he obviously benefited from that. But I think he always could be like the dude in a linebacker group. And I think this situation, similar to Philadelphia with bond joining, I mean, great front, great secondary. They just needed a linebacker to unlock it. So I think he's going to like benefit from being in Vance Joseph's defense. You know, I mentioned the Josh Palmer thing. I think that could work out pretty well. I also think some of the moves that Chicago has made is, you know, I know that like activity,

period is going to get you a bunch of good grades in free agency. Like in that the way it goes always like, hey, that team knocked out of the park, they signed three guards. They brought in, you know, a daying bow who I think actually like could be a sleeper for a guy that shows up next year. And his life just got a lot better. Like really, it really did. Like coming from the defense he was in, I think his production will go up.

I think people will be patting him on the back a lot at the end of next year. Because he's only two years removed from a season where he had like, sacks, which that kind of, that eight sack and up echelon is where I'm like, okay, this guy has the ability to be an absolute dude. If we could just get that out of him again in Chicago, he's going to play with Montez Sweat and Grady Jarrett and, you know, better corners and the whole thing. Like they play a lot of soft zone, like vanilla shit and indie. I think as a rusher, his life's going to improve a great deal. And I honestly, I'm falling for it with the bears. I really am like, Are you?

Yeah, I really am like, you know, people have a hard time. You know how this is when you have a take and your take evolves and changes and you had a draft take and then I have a Caleb Williams in the NFL take. My draft take was be careful moving heaven and earth to go draft a guy and be sure that he's going to be the next Patrick Mahomes when you're not even sure who's the best quarterback in the draft year to year. And that turned out to be true last year, okay? But there's still a lot of time for Caleb Williams.

I think he was, he impressed the hell out of me last year in a lot of ways. Obviously, you want to see better deep ball accuracy. You want to see him grasp the offense, although that offense was a total shitstorm. And I couldn't wait for his sake for the year to end from a protection standpoint, the whole thing. I think this year, they take a big step forward. And it's not just the Ben Johnson thing. I think a lot of it has to do with it. I saw him in some really adverse situations.

last year lead and and have that mindset that I think is going to do him good when it all turns around. And I think this is a year they make a little jump, man. I love what they did in the offensive line. I'm falling for the activity thing, right? Like, um, although I'm kind of curious, like, if Joe Tuny at 30, what is he 32. Yeah. Is going to be the same player. Like, but I love Dalman, you go out and get Jonah Jackson. And when you look around the NFC North, there's a lot of uncertainty, in my opinion. Has Detroit really rained long enough to just be like, hey, it's their division. You know, like, it'd be one thing if their season ended and they lost the shootout to like the best team in the league. But they get dumped by the commanders.

Like, doesn't that send some messages to the people in your division that you can be aggressive and try to win this division this year? I mean, the brain drain is going to be really tough. I like, by the way, allowed Detroit's moves in free agency. I thought the DJ Reed... Love the DJ Reid pickup. But I think losing both your coordinators, people can't sleep on, especially when they're both really good. Yeah. Right?

It's not like Philly where like they fired and people want, you know, they, it would, this is, it's going to be difficult for them. And to your point at Chicago, I guess some of the signings are questioned a little bit on the, not Odeembo, I like, because I think he's a really high upside player. but the intention of just saying we're going to double down on the inside of these offensive line this is what our coach Claire is about coming from Detroit I like that and I also feel like I personally feel like I saw enough out of Caleb Williams to be excited yeah there were just certain games where I thought even if they lost he flashed he carried the team in big moments I like the way he handled it by the way mentally the way he talked the way he led I thought giving him a veteran center, that's really what I really wanted for him in free agency.

Because I just felt like too much was on his shoulders last year as a rookie. And if they can take a little bit off, I think he can play a little more free. And Ben said it. He's never had a quarterback. You can throw on the run like that. I mean, like, he is really good outside the pocket, moving the pocket. I mean, like, really impressive. Okay, one or two more things for you.

Trey Hendrickson, supposedly the price for Trey Henderson is ridiculous, even for teams willing to pay the guy. that's per Diana Rossini, our good friend at the athletic, what the hell is going on with this? And do you see a good fit for him? I see a lot of fits. Yeah, but like with the capital, they seem to be asking for,

like, who's actually going to get aggressive and go get this guy? Well, like the commanders, I was criticizing, I felt like they haven't done enough on defense. That would be the natural spot to me where they have the flexibility to pay him. No, man, they just signed de-interest,

wise. My dog from New England. They gave up draft picks in the tonsil trade though, so I don't know if they'd be willing to like completely get rid of all their draft picks here. That was a team that jumped out to me. The Pats were another team, although they've spent a lot on defense now already as a team that had money that needed edge help. The pairs were, but they've also spent draft picks.

I don't know. Like you're kind of, it's kind of crazy to me that they're, asking for a lot because I think the number of suitors is rapidly decreasing. Yeah, I saw a funny Reddit comment. I'm probably going to butcher it, but it was like, it was like, yeah, the Bengals only know the value of their players when they're shipping them out the door. And that seems to be the case. Maybe the resolution is they just pay them.

They see they can't get what they want for them. I would have thought Philly would have been a suitor. I thought Philly was going to be all over the miles. Garrett thing. That was something that selfishly I really wanted to happen. It obviously didn't happen because everybody has a price, right? But Trey, like, that's a different conversation. I got a lot of respect for Trey. I mean, he's an absolute dog, but like you give up that kind of capital from what it sounds like for a Miles Garrett. I don't know if you do it for a 30 plus year old Trey. I think Trey could be a real luxury for a team.

But until I know what the hall they're asking for is, I can't say for sure. But you can kind of see that market shrinking a little bit if the compensation is really through the roof. And the Pats still have so much money. Pats have a ton of money. I'm just looking about pulling up the cat's face. I mean, that would be pretty nasty. Trey, Milton Williams, Barmore. They bring in Landry, Keon White.

I love Keon White. And, you know, I love Bill and Williams. All right, last one. How about a player that a fan base really is going to miss? And it doesn't have to be the best player of all time. But somebody that left their team this week and you're like, you know, the fan base feels this. And you can't pick a Seahawk because that's too close to home.

Okay. I think that I mean, Greenlaw, honestly. Yeah, I was going to say Greenlaw. But that's one. I think they're going to miss him. And I think his absence was felt in his injury, right? because yeah, that really showed. Rams are going to miss Michael Hoyt.

Fans love Michael Hoyt. Is he going to get paid like a corner or a linebacker? Okay. So I think the chargers will miss Puna. Sorry to keep repeating guys I've already talked about. But that is one. I'll throw this out. I mean, Patrick McCarie has been pretty damn good for the Ravens over the last few.

I think they still had an incredible free. Like, I think keeping Stanley at the price they did was huge win. But he has quietly been a very good and versatile player for them over the years. And he's the kind of player you don't miss until he's gone. Oh, no question. When you're like, yo, there's nobody on this roster that can play that guard spot for us in a pinch. Or, you know, he played some tackle for them. And obviously, Rosen Garden turned out to be a player.

So that's why he slid inside. But yeah, I was going to throw CJ Gardner. Johnson in there. Like, I don't know. Because when you're, when the fans love you and two years ago, you were like, fuck Philly. It's the worst place on earth. Like, you got something over him, man.

And, and, and I don't blame fans for loving C.J. Gardner Johnson. I loved his energy in Philly. I thought he was a leader in that room. Like leaders come in different shapes and sizes and they have different roles. And I think for him, it wasn't necessarily the guy that was doing bed check for the younger players. But he's the type of guy that, like, he gets.

the other guys to play like missiles. And, you know, I think Houston's secondary is one of the most fun groups to watch in the NFL. That defense at home, you talk about like head hunting and I don't mean like some bounty shit. I just mean like guys are out there trying to, trying to make you feel their presence. Like that is a whole room full of those guys and he will make them even more that way. But also, but like who's blocking? Who's blocking for, yeah, for CJ Stroud? Interesting. I don't know if, do they not feel real, like, do they not feel real bullish about this year? You know, like, I know it's a math move. Yeah. Yeah. Like, it's defensible in a vacuum, the Tunsel trade, right? And certainly moving Kenyon Green Lake, it was not very good. Tunsel, too, you know, he was a little bit declining, had a lot of penalties, whatever. But you got nothing now, like, nothing. So that's putting a lot of faith in your front office to use those draft picks.

that's all I'll say. Maybe the offensive line coach was so bad and we don't know. Like sometimes in an NFL building, like there's a truth that's so evident to everybody and just people on the outside have no idea. Like maybe that was such a bad thing that they know with certainty that it's going to improve no matter who they have in there. I know they slid Fisher out there last year. Maybe he's your left tackle. You know, Titus Howard can play different spots. Like I'm not saying it's going to be pretty. But maybe just by some good old. fashion knowing where the fuck to get lined up they're going to improve i hope the crazy but the crazy thing about that like that whole situation it wasn't just the line right it was like the whole

operation was you watched them like just so unprepared for everything that defense is through at them from blitzes to game like they looked like everybody involved including the quarterback who i like, look completely surprised. Yo, the most Houston Texans moment of the entire season was Titus Howard, grabbing the football from C.J. Stroud. That was the most Houston Texans offense moment of 2024. I'll never forget that. I still don't know what the fuck happened.

And, and yeah, that was kind of the way the year went. So hopefully they'll figure it out. but Mina, thank you so much for your time. You can't get this kind of analysis anywhere else, especially not from anybody this good at Jeopardy. And we love having you on. Hopefully you come back soon. Good to see you, man.

Good to catch out. We got to talk about these edge rushers in the draft soon. Oh, I got to learn about them first. What is up? It's the Butter King Dairy Expert. This episode of the Greenlight podcast is brought to you by Dea Pizza featuring dairy-free cheese, now made with Dea Oak Cream Blend.

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