Green Light with Chris Long - Pablo Torre! Investigating NFL Collusion, Guaranteed Player Contracts & NFL Owners!

Episode Date: June 27, 2025

Investigation Friday at Green Light! Pablo Torre joins Chris Long for a deep dive into the NFL Collusion story. Pablo covers every detail from JC Tretter and the NFLPA to Russell Wilson, Kyler Murray, Deshaun Watson and guaranteed contracts to NFL owners and more. All the info you need on this subject that is interestingly not a larger story. (00:00) Intro (05:41) Pablo Torre's Investigations (12:43) NFL Collusion (33:46) Worst People at the Airport Have some interesting takes, some codebreaks or just want to talk to the Green Light Crew? We want to hear from you. Call into the Green Light Hotline and give us your hottest takes, your biggest gripes and general thoughts. Day and night, this hotline is open. Green Light Hotline: ‪[phone]‬ Also, check out our paddling partners at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Appomattox River Company ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠to get your canoes, kayaks and paddleboards so you're set to hit the river this summer. Green Light's ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube Channel⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, where you can catch all the latest GL action: Green Light with Chris Long: Subscribe and enjoy weekly content including podcasts, documentaries, live chats, celebrity interviews and more including hot news items, trending discussions from the NFL, MLB, NHL, NBA, NCAA are just a small part of what we will be sharing with you. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

It's been wild. It's been, it's been a little wild these days, man. And I'm currently typing Stan Cronky Hearst right alongside my other investigations right now. Because J.C. Treter did something that was so mind-blowing to relive in retrospect, Chris. Everybody was taking notes. This is why this thing is so wild to me. It's that, yes, it's in writing. Dude, I just love the idea that whatever it is that Chris Long does in Vegas, in between, you know, whatever. You're micro-dosing. You're hitting the roulette wheel, whatever. you're like, hey, have you seen this exhaustive deep dive into like labor relations? Yeah, dude, I'm like on the elevator.

Like, did you hear about this? Welcome to the Greenlight podcast presented by BetMGM. If you haven't signed up for BetMGM yet, use Bonus Code Greenlight, and you'll get up to a $1,500 first bet offer on your first wager with BetMGM. Here's how it works. Download the BetmGM app and sign up using Bonus Code Greenlight. Deposit at least $10 and place your first wager on any. game. If that bet loses, you will receive up to $1,500 in bonus bets. Just make sure you use

bonus code Greenlight when you sign up. Welcome to the Greenlight podcast. It's Investigation Friday here on Greenlight. We've got Chris and we've got Pablo Tori. You've seen him in the news. This NFL collusion story is big and Pablo jumps on to talk about it. He deep dives and gives us every aspect, every detail we need from J.C. Treader to Sean Watson to Russell Wilson, the Walton's in Denver and the NFL owners. A great rip of this wild collusion story. Make sure after you listen to this episode, jump over to Pablo's YouTube channel. Check out the full hour long deep dive that he did with Mike Florio. So now Pablo Tori joins me. Pablo, what's up, dude? You've been busy. Yeah, Chris. You know, if there's a knock at the door and I don't come back, just know that

I'm going to need you to tell the world my story. Don't sit in the front of any old citizens. sedans. Definitely check underneath your car. I've seen that in movies. You want to do that. Yeah. I want the chair at the Italian restaurant that faces out with the exit, just in view. That's right, dude. It's been wild. It's been, it's been a little wild these days, man. But thank you for having me. Dude, well, of course, I have a list of things that I think you should find out that I've compiled over the last 15 minutes since I woke up in Vegas. And here again, goes. Number one, there's a rumor that Stan Cronkey, owner of the Rams, drove a hearse in college. Does that interest you?

Well, done. I'm starting. The ultimate love language I have, Chris, is that I start a notes app file, and I'm currently typing Stan Cronkey Hearst right alongside my other investigations right now. Yeah, it'll be good because you can get in there and start grilling them about the collusion and then be like, hey, by the way, heard you drove a hearse. Can you give me a little bit on that? The real thing here is that I want to know about the funeral business, actually. It's a very morbid, by the way, what a morbid episode of your pod so far? You know, I got another one. Where's Jimmy Hoffa buried? You interested in that? No? Do we know yet? Supposedly under the Meadowlands?

I feel like I was going to say Meadowlands has been the theory. I'm willing to, I'm willing to take a metal detector out there. one day and see what I can dig up. Yeah. Okay. One to ten, does this peak your interest? Benching of Malcolm Butler in the Super Bowl. You know what's so funny about that? I've been doing, of course, all the Belichick stuff, Jordan Hudson stuff.

You know, I saw that, Pablo. A few episodes on that. No. Hey, Chris Long finds out older men like younger women, Pablo. But this is like this is. I could have used you on the episode. One of the episodes, plural,

one of the things that made me laugh, though, was one of the things that everybody was sort of like, I am told reliably, was bracing for when it came to the book promotion, was like, man, he doesn't want to talk about,

like, Malcolm Butler, he doesn't want to talk about other such players and controversies. And it just, none of it ever got there because of all the other stuff. So,

yeah, I am interested, actually, in some Malcolm Butler. I'm super interested in that one. I was on the other side. I know Malcolm and then the last one for me is did Wade Boggs drink that many beers on that flight like is that bullshit or what's going on there I'm I'm pretty sure that I mean 73 right I believe or 70 70 something I believe that one has a real chance okay I did do some some kicking other tires around that one And it just seems like Wade Boggs he can look what I've learned what I found out so far is that Wade Boggs can really hold his his alcohol so

Yeah, I mean, I am, I'm hopeful. I'm honestly hopeful that that one is true. It would be a real crushing thing. Yeah, that would be a shitty thing to lie about. He's not quite Andre the Giant, but he's Wade Boggs. Okay, so let's get into your newest adventure here. The brilliant piece that you did with Mike Florio, I thought it was awesome. It was an hour long.

I impressively watched it in 2X because I only had a condensed amount of time. yesterday in Vegas. And it blew my mind, man. It really, like the same way you and Florio were sitting there and you're like, is it, how could this be real? Even for the NFL, it was shocking. It's about collusion. It's about the toothlessness of the NFLPA.

It's about quarterbacks. It's about owners. Very interesting. Take it away. Can you give me a condensed version of kind of what went down and people take your time and go watch this episode of Pablo Tori finds out as well. Yeah, so thank you for watching the full thing. All I can ask is that people listen and watch the full thing.

It's on YouTube. It's on podcast platforms everywhere. The reason I say that is not just because I need the clicks to feed my daughter. It's because it's one of those stories that has just levels to it. And so the ultimate question you sort of start with is, why is there a document, a very important document that both the NFL and the NFLPA do not. want not just you fan or NFL consumer to have ever known about, but they also didn't want the players named in the document to really know about. One of the craziest things as I give you

some of the names that were involved in the closed door hearings that resulted in private texts and messages and emails and slideshow presentations and witness testimony. We're talking about Roger Goodell, Lamar Jackson, Kyler Murray, Russell Wilson, NFLPA leadership, powerful agents and executives. Eight NFL owners, almost forgot them, all needing to be on the record behind closed doors in front of this arbitrator in a grievance that the union filed about pollution against guaranteed contracts. And the reason why it's so amazing to me is because you just rarely see the league and, the union actually align on wanting to suppress this sort of a thing. Typically, some side leaks it because there's stuff to gain in the battle for leverage, right? And in this case, you said it.

Like, I just have been spending the days since it came out really pondering how crazy it is that the NFLPA and its leadership currently did not want its own membership to know everything that God said that directly impacts, directly impacts the collective interest of that union. It's nuts. And of course, J.C. Treader is one of the guys in the middle. And we're talking about the guy that he kind of shadow hired, Lloyd Howell, and that, you know, changing Article 4 to slide him in.

Can you tell me more about the shadowy process of J.C. treter kind of quid pro quo hiring this Lloyd Howell guy and the implications of that and why it's led us here. Yeah, so J.C. Treader, all of this is about March of 2022. That's when DeShon Watson got signed to the full guaranteeing contract. That's when these NFL annual meetings happened where all of this stuff got said by the league to the 32 owners about, hey, no more guarantees. That same month, J.C. Treter, who was the starting center for the Browns, had just been elected to a second term as Union president had also just gotten cut by the Browns. And you can't be the president when you're cut.

And that's the big thing. So this is a guy who everybody knows, everybody knew, wanted to be the future leader of the union. The executive director, right, which is the job that only literally less than a handful of people have done before, from Gene Opshaw, to D. Smith and now Lloyd Howell, who was the guy that J.C. kind of ushered in because J.C. Tredder did something that was so. mind-blowing to relive in retrospect, Chris. He does this thing where the search process is led by him and becomes entirely secret. So not merely does this mean that the media from the outside can't see in because everybody who is involved in the process has to sign confidentiality agreements, which had never happened before.

He amends the constitution of your union. So the Constitution used to say you need 30 days to vet to know the names. So when you show up to vote on Election Day of the executive director, like the most powerful job, the guy who opposes Roger Goodell, you need 30 days to just do some basic Googles. Ask some people who are these guys. Jay Cretter's administration ends up amending the union such that the voters, right? The board doesn't know the names of the guy they have to choose to run this union, potentially for a quarter century until the day they have to vote. And look, I'm no political scientist.

I can just tell you that's a red-ass flag. You don't want them to know who they're voting on until they don't have the time to leave the room and make some calls and do some research. And so Lloyd Howell, for those not familiar, he was eye-opening Chris because he had never worked in sports, had never worked in unions, had never worked in the law. And most crucially, as we reveal in the episode, he was also embroiled in one of the largest fraud settlements. There was some embroiling, man. It's just, it's, it's. There was embroiling going on.

He was the CFO of Booz Allen. And all you got to know about that very briefly, because I'm gasbagging a lot here, is simply that he was the CFO of a company that had to settle one of the largest financial fraud settlements in American history. And he was a character that a former, again, and this is where it just gets like central casting, right? There's a woman who became a whistleblower at Booz Allen who claimed on the news to have brought the corruption problem, which I'll let you listen to because it's a lot, to the CFO. who said, we're not going to spend time looking into that. And that CFO happened to have been Lloyd Howell, the guy that no one could research. And so it's like, why is this man being fast-tracked by J.C. Treader to run this thing? And it seems like J.C. treter, based on reporting and now a lot of evidence, had an interest in

installing Lloyd so that maybe he could be the guy to follow Lloyd. But it just goes on from there. Well, it goes on and on. And like it obviously all stems from this conversation about, you know, guaranteed contracts. Basically for a long time in the NFL, we've been fighting for them. And owners have been resisting. And then you get the, the Deshawn Watson deal that goes for like, what, five for two-thirty or something like that. And that feels like ancient history now, the way it's played out.

But closely following that deal were the eventual deals of three NFL stars, namely, Lamar Jackson, right? And then it was Tyler Murray as well. And then the third was Russell Wilson. But I think the biggest example that people would be, you know, would remember the process around would be the Lamar deal. And there was talk about, oh, I think they're colluding. Like, you know, they put them on the non-exclusive tag and nobody's calling. Like,

nobody wants Lamar Jackson, namely Atlanta, especially. Like, Atlanta picked Desmond Ritter over him that year. And a lot of us, like me, you know, not being naive, but are like, come on, like, they're just going to be colluding out in the open. They're going to be texting each other. Hey, we don't want guaranteed contracts, like, good work, not giving this guy guaranteed money. Like, these fucking billionaires who are so presumably smart and powerful and have all these

guardrails, they're not going to be texting each other. Surely they're not going to be, like, reinforcing this behavior. And they were. In this 61-page document, you see all these texts laid out. you also find out that the NFL has this NFL management council that is supposed to be this like, I don't know, how would you describe the management council ideally in this process? It's basically a central planning office. So insofar as the union has an executive committee, the counterpart is this body that the NFL has to make sure that everybody, and this is just a suggestion, Chris, it's just guidance, that they are operating according to best practices. And so the big thing that they got got for was the best practice of, hey, Deshaun Watson just got this giant fully guaranteed unprecedented contract.

Let's make sure that nobody else gets signed to this. And so that's what Roger Goodell and Jeff Pash and the NFL MC put into the slides was here's why you owners should not have guaranteed, fully guaranteed deals. And when you say, again, not to sound like, you know, I'm paraphrasing the wire, but you're taking notes on a on a conspiracy. everybody was taking notes. This is why this thing is so wild to me. It's that, yes, it's in writing. You can see the attempt. And then you can see what I would have to say, for legal reasons, the alleged outcome.

Because you got to connect that with logic. The arbitrator only found that the attempt was collusive. They could not tie the result to that alleged cause. That is, but that's such like, is that gaslighting? Like, to me, it feels like gaslighting. It feels like we're at a place in society generally and now in sports, obviously, where, like, something could be just going so wrong in broad daylight. And you don't even, the smoking gun won't even do it anymore.

And it feels like we're there with the NFL. And, like, obviously, like, we're throwing a lot at you, the viewer. You're going to want to go watch Pablo Tori Farns out and check this thing out, you know, wire to wire. But basically, it all ties together because in the aftermath, Russell Wilson and, Kyler Murray were both given standard contracts, as we know them today, without guaranteed money, right, in the wake of Deshaun Watson, in the wake of Lamar Jackson, and somewhere on the back end, and correct me if I'm wrong, this is where J.C. Treader kind of fucks himself. He starts texting all this salacious, mean shit about Russell Wilson in that he did not go get

the guaranteed money and kind of pins this whole thing on him and uses colorful language and just shits on the guy. And so he wants that buried. And so therefore, that is why this smoking gun has not been made public, which is even, it's like a twisting of the knife. It's like, hey, everybody's guarantee. Everybody's food is on the fucking table, JC, and NFLPA. And we're protecting the one guy. What does this guy have over the PA? Whose pictures does he have?

Dude, so just I will briefly recap and then I'm going to ask you a question because you are acting as a reasonable human being would. let alone a former player himself who's like knowledgeable about how this all works. So what happens after the Deshaun Watson thing and the NFL league meetings in which this collusive behavior by the arbiter is determined is that yes, Lamar gets zero offers. Tyler, there is a text chain between Michael Bidwell owner of the Cardinals and Dean Spanos under the Chargers in which they are celebrating how much, Dino, hey, Dino. Thanks, Dino. It's like you have, by the way, I just love this story because you get Dino in the text exchange. Bro, the text exchange might be my favorite part that these people are just like willy-nilly texting about collusion and they're calling each other nicknames in the process. I'm like this fucking movie shit.

And Dean and and Dino and it is. It's like it's like on the nose just like fictionalized adaptation, but it's real. Dino is saying this helps us with our quarterback referring to the fact that Justin Herbert who's going to be up next won't need the guarantees he's demanding because guess what? His comp is now Kyler Murray instead of Deshawn Watson. So all of this is happening, which brings us to Russell Wilson, who also wants full guarantees, and his Broncos owners, the co-owners, the Walmart people are also celebrating how they're not giving him the guarantees. And in fact, J.C. Treter in texts with D. Smith in discovery, because you got to give all the documents, this is discovery. This is why it's a crazy document.

He is found to have trashed Russell Wilson and to blame Russell Wilson for not getting the full guarantees that the union otherwise. of course, would want. And what's crazy about that is that, A, you have the president of the union trashing one of his own in a way that's just like, whoa, dude. Like, this is a lot. Insulting all that stuff, calling him a wuss, all that stuff. But the second thing is that it's clearly missing the real story, which is that it was the owners who were clearly coordinated, if not completely aligned in wanting no guarantees

for anybody. And so J.C. Tredder ends up giving the owners in this hearing the evidence, part evidence, that says, actually, the owners didn't do anything wrong. It was Russell Wilson not pushing for it himself. His thing becomes an exhibit, which he then recants in further testimony. But it's just embarrassing to the point where my question now becomes, if you were a player right now, Chris Long, and you, realized that your union president had done that, what would you think, what would you do? What would you say? I mean, I'm sure after I say this, somebody's going to reach out to me and say, well, you don't know the whole story or yada, yada, yada, yada, you might want to take a beat.

But if I found out that a major bargaining chip in us getting what we want is being buried to protect one person, I'd say, get this guy the fuck out of here. you know like and i got plenty of money you know i i made my money but for me the thing that makes me upset is and i understand why owners don't want to give guaranteed money you know we're we're we're like rally cars bro we're all going to break and you know the product you don't want to pay guaranteed money for a product that you know you're going to that's going to break and be sitting on the sideline i get all that from a business standpoint but this is what we want and we're not going to get it it seems like ever because now you got a smoking gun that says hey they did

collude. And the arbiter can't even, the arbiter's gaslighting us. The NFL PA is kind of looking the other way. And for something strangely personal, like something like over one person. But here's my problem, Pablo, is I think three quarters of the guys voted on the actual CBA in the last go-round. So a quarter of guys in the NFL just didn't even vote. That to me is a really bad barometer for where we're at on being an educated population and, you know, a population that's, that's into what's going on. And, like, I could have been better about leaning in and paying attention in PA meetings and that sort of thing. But, like, you know, for the players right now, they really have to get more aligned on this thing. And even if they did, Pablo, the problem is this.

We're never going to have leverage because a year of our earning potential and playing potential is too valuable to the person trying to leverage that year. in relation to owners who are just doing business and will continue doing business and have been doing business before you were fucking in high school playing football. Like to them, a year is nothing. To them, a game is nothing. We as a population in pro sports,

we are probably the people with the least leverage because there's the most players on teams. It's harder to get everybody mobilized and on the same page, as you can see as evidenced by our involvement in the last CBA. And on top of it, a fucking year, year old, do you in, dude. The average career is three years.

So, like, hey, if we really want to sit out and, like, get on the same page, good luck getting guys to do that. What we were talking about earlier, Pablo, the only way this changes, in my opinion, is if a high-profile quarterback, and, you know, J.C. treter was probably frustrated with Russell Wilson over this, but somebody high-profile, and I don't know that Russell would be be enough at this stage in his career, would have to say, I ain't fucking playing. And my question to you, Pablo, is, number one, Nobody's happier that Sean Watson sucks than the rest of the owners, right?

But how would it have gone if that was like, if that worked out like gangbusters? Yeah, yeah. It's always about quarterbacks. Right. It always is, right? Because they make the most and also because they command the most attention and also because, frankly, they are the spokesman for what the fan even begins to think about. And so something that you just said, because you gave a great rundown of the pessimism around what even matters anymore.

Yeah. The reason why, because I want to get to your question about Deshaun and quarterbacks, but I want to just frame it in this way. The reason why this story to me is so important, and I should also clarify, that J.C. Treters, Russell Wilson text was one reason why they didn't want to release it. Another reason why still along the lines of self-interest is because this was a suit filed by the previous regime. Right. So this wasn't J.C. and Lloyd. This was D. Smith, right? This is not something they could claim as a win.

Also, furthermore, when it comes to what the larger context is, you need something that the public can see and be engaged by. and you need something that the NFL would conceivably be scared of. And so when you bring up the quarterbacks, when you say, here's a document and it's Lamar and it's Kyler and it's Russ and it's Deshaun Watson and Justin Herbert's in there too. Now you get to something where I have been told if the union had real leadership, they would go, the union's based in Washington, D.C. You go to fucking Congress. You lobby the Hill. You call for the resignation of Roger. you do things, not with expectations that, oh, this is going to bring them down, but this gets us leverage because you can now make the argument in a way that's compelling to people, that something needs to change. And so when this stuff gets suppressed, right, you give it out. You give the biggest possible out.

And you suppress what I've been told is, quote, a holy grail when it comes to bargaining leverage insofar as there can be any. any of it, right? So it's always about the quarterbacks. And yeah, guess what? Deshawn being the worst contract of all time now, plus all this other stuff in which the quarterbacks involved, I mean, man, what's so crazy? Russell Wilson, Lamar Jackson, Kyler Murray did not see this document until I am told I released it. This is about their livelihoods. Justin Herbert didn't see it until I released it. This is about his livelihood. So from a pure, what is a union supposed to do? It's supposed to inform you what happens to you. And they didn't. And I am told, and this is a bit of news for you, Chris, because I haven't said this anywhere else.

I am told that those quarterbacks and their representatives named just now that at least one of them has not heard from the union since this came out. And I'm just like, they're not even reaching out about that after it comes out. Was it Lamar's microphone? Was it Lamar's broken microphone? It's such a great detail. Anytime there's like discovery, there's just like hidden gems like that where the Ravens are trying to get a hold of Lamar who put in all caps. I'm looking for guaranteed money, right? I love when Lamar types in all caps.

And then they try to get back to him. He's like, yeah, my microphone on my phone's broken. So I can't, I can't talk to me. Yeah, my phones, my phones, phones busted. But especially for somebody like Lamar, in my opinion, who's done so much for the league. Right? He's done so fucking much for the league. And everybody loves Lamar.

If you don't like Lamar, that's probably you problem. Lamar was angling directly for guaranteed money. You know, directly for guaranteed money. And of all the guys to get it first, he would be the one who would be most worthy of that. Not to mention, he's been pretty durable for a guy that fucking tucks the ball and runs sometimes. So you really don't have an argument against it other than like, hey, it's just not what we do. Right? Like it's just not what the NFL does, not the way it works.

That argument in the context of all this kind of goes away where it's like, dude, we've got 61 pages. So it doesn't matter what the norm is. Like, it's right here for you. The thing about what this meant to Lamar and his mom who represents him, this is an $85 million difference if I do the math right. This is something where it's guaranteed money, right? And so just by the way, for just the fans out there, right,

The funny laundry list of excuses that the arbiter buys from the owners so that they can't make the link between cause and effect is he's a running quarterback. You don't want to alienate your current quarterback. That's right. Maybe Lamar's asking for too much. It's all of the stuff that results in what you just said at the top, which is the Atlanta freaking Falcons. Yeah. Say, you know what? We're a Desmond Ritter team.

We're Desmond Ritter team. I'm just like. Let me tell you. It's just like, you're talking about competition and you're saying no team was interested in the literal future two-time MVP at the most important position. I just like I can't even begin to bludgeon people enough with that. It's crazy. And I also want to make this clear. And like I remember back like to when this whole thing came out, I was like, there's no way that they're, like I said earlier.

There's no way they're just out in the open colluding. Like it can't be that dumb. They can't be that br up. know, brash. But I guess when you know what you're up against in the NFLPA and the population of players like you can be, I would just say this. I don't think every team, because I did get into talking about this a few years ago, was, was morally or from a football pragmatic sense, obliged to want Lamar Jackson. I don't think it's as simple as every team needs to go get Lamar Jackson. And any team that didn't pursue him is colluding. I think that's an important detail.

in my estimation of the whole thing. But I do think Atlanta is the poster child here, you know? And then obviously with the corresponding contracts, these owners all have egg on their face. So I guess where do we go now? I see in this deal there was 594 players possibly involved. And like now players are seeking legal counsel, exploring what they might be able to do through litigation.

What's next? I think you framed the pessimism and the NFL is counting on the pessimism, right? I think about this all the time. I've never felt more like a frustrated, you know, union observer than trying to figure out what is next. Oh, guys may not even listen or read or care because in some ways it is about collective self-interest as opposed to personal self-interest. Yeah. If your money is fine, if you don't think. think this is about you, then guess what? You don't have to raise a stink. You don't have to say,

man, seems like we need new leadership, which again would be their prerogative, which is why I asked you the question instead of said, here's what you should think. It's all about what the players themselves want out of this to me. You know what the NFL wants. It's always about, hey, we can bring a horse to water, right? But do you want to actually do something about it? So I am fascinated by that question. Some players are looking for representation. Florio has already said that. That is wise. I know there's chaos at the union. That is understandable. It should be. It just needs to be. We need void.

Chris, honestly, like retired players as well as current players, just like talking about this feels like the least one might expect. That's one of the reasons I wanted to have you on, one being I'm in Vegas and I needed a fucking guest and you're the man. So I was like, let me get Pablo. But another being like, this is, this is explosive shit and it pertains directly to what I did for a living for, I'm here for the SACC summit

in Vegas. There are like 30 of the best rushers, young rushers in the NFL here. And I've come up to two or three of them and been like, you hear about this and like, people haven't heard about it. And you know, I came up to a couple of the media people that I've seen. And, you know, they say, yeah, I saw that kind of pop up on the radar screen and then it's like people aren't picking it up and it makes you go hmm and so um

you know i don't have to think too hard about this one pablo but nice work you and flora did a good job getting all the details laid out again people go watch the entire episode like this is not a substitute for that this is to hook you in and obviously it's not for clicks like this is an important thing man and so for former players man if you're watching this you need to go watch pablo's deal so um nice work on this one. I just love, dude, I just love the idea that whatever it is that Chris Long does in Vegas in between, you know, whatever, you're micro dosing, you're hitting the roulette wheel, whatever. You're like, hey, have you seen this exhaustive deep dive into like labor relations? Yeah, dude, I'm like on the elevator. You know, I just like that you're doing that.

I am, dude. I'm like, did you hear about this shit? And usually it's a no. By the way, I'm not hitting roulette. I haven't gambled at all. I came here without my wallet. I got a passport and some cash. So I'm not a gambler either. I'm not good at it. I also don't have just like the constitution for it. But I was, I'm friends with a guy named Jeff Ma. And Jeff Ma is better known as the real life protagonist of the movie bringing down the house about the MIT blackjack team. Right. It was the movie 21, all that stuff. Um, so he's banned from, oh my God. So he's like, what are they trying to do? He isn't 21. Their car, they're card counting. I can't, I can't follow it, frankly, despite all of my demographic traits.

I can't do it. But I sit down at the table. I sit down to the table as like the Asian American dude went to like whatever, a fancy school. And Jeff sits next to me and he can't like put his hands on cards, but he just tells me what to do. And I just had the experience of being like a meat puppet for like one of the greatest gamblers as I'm just like whatever.

That's pretty cool. Yeah, sure, I'll do that. But the payoff, the real payoff is what you discover when you're with a high roller fluent guy. because there is, wherever I was at Caesars or whatever, there's a secret 24-hour Chinese buffet for high rollers. And you just walk in, you should find an Asian friend, hold a lot of cash. You walk back there, dude.

And they're just like sleeping millionaires and like the best Chinese buffet that is free. Oh my God. It is, it is just like, you know, eggs. Fu Young. Yeah, just like soup dumplings, just like the finest in like you're stoned in Vegas and you find your way back there. It is the greatest. I'm fucking up some beef

and broccoli. I'm gonna get back there. It made me want to gamble. It made me want to gamble. Not gonna lie, the food made me want to gamble. Well, that's, so here we go. Before I let you go, I was going to do this alone, but I'll do it with you here. I don't like traveling, Pablo. It's like a real phobia of mine. A week before I have to go somewhere,

I get like the press, bro. I hate it. Including Vegas. Like, I hate Vegas. I do it. Once I get there, I'm like, oh, I kind of like this shit. By night, too, I'm like, yeah, I want to go get drunk again. But I do not like traveling. I made a pledge I was not going to get on a plane the rest of 2025.

But here I am. I went through Atlanta. I spent 10 hours yesterday traveling two days ago. And I compiled the definitive list of the worst people at an airport. And I wanted to know if you disagreed or agreed, okay? I'll go with number one. a guy who's mad at kids on an airplane. All right.

That is the worst guy. And he's not technically, he doesn't have to be in a fucking in the airport. He can be on the plane flying across the United States. But how do people think babies get from point A to point B? You know, should I put my toddler in a station wagon? Should we go 1883?

Should it be like a covered wagon situation? They get there in a fucking metal tube just like you, bro. have some grace and don't forget you were a baby at one point. I feel like this is a thing where either you're a parent or you're not. Like I have a five-year-old man. I was on a plane to Hawaii. I was on a work thing to Hawaii. I was by myself without my wife and kid.

And they were two crying like twins, the seats over. And I could see the person in front of me just like give up and was just like banging his head. I'm just like, dude, you got noise canceling headphones, I'm sure. you know, like this is not, this is not the parents, some parents are shitty, okay? Yeah. But in the main, most are just trying to survive what is clearly more torturous for them than it is for you. So have a little grace. Not their fault.

No, dude, there's a, we, we go on family vacation every year for like a month, right? And we're not going this summer because my daughter's too. I'm not doing that. Okay, we'll do it next year. That's how tough it is for parents. I love my vacation. But I would rather not do that. And let me tell you, it's not like I walk around looking for an opportunity to beat a guy up who's mean to a kid on a plane.

But if you're mean to a kid on a plane around me, we're going to need the fucking air marshal. I'm just telling you. Okay, number one, fucking guy that's mean to kids on planes. Okay, number two, the line skipper. The line skipper. There are lines for a reason in society. I think what you see when the train comes to the Dulles train station, and it's going to take you to be as in boy

and everybody's crowded around the fucking tube and a guy walks down late and doesn't break stride and just cuts through the fucking crowd like a hot knife through butter and squeezes in. That guy is a representation of what's wrong with society. I think it's a little preview of what will happen when and if we go off the grid. Everybody's going to act in their own self-interest.

I think that guy's dangerous. I don't like that guy. If I can profile an entire continent of people, this is a European thing as well. I just find that they don't respect lines. Those cues, as they call them. They don't respect them at all. And I'm like, America, America stands.

America doesn't stand for a lot these days. We stand for lines. But what you just articulated is a line, correct? And honestly, dude, that applied on Kilimanjaro. So when I climb Kilimanjaro, there's like narrow passages and it's like nighttime. And we have veterans. We have like wounded warriors, that sort of thing. And like, so like, you can't.

see that if you're coming up behind them but it's always the fucking german guys and the swiss guys and those northern europeans that that like squeeze right by a guy one of our guys with like one leg and like almost knock them off the mountain and we're like what the fuck and then we hear him talk and we're like oh europeans anyways number three up barefoot guy no brainer bearfoot guy nobody likes barefoot guy um bearfoot guy always has like oily rainbow sandals on and it looks like he hasn't shower in a while. And it's not usually barefoot woman, which isn't great either, but barefoot guy's a lot worse.

Yeah. You know what they say on the internet, you can sometimes smell a photo through the screen. Like, you can smell barefoot guy without seeing his feet. I just feel like it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a whole, it's just a whole way of life that is just palpably, yeah, don't be around others, I guess, in that circumstance. And this guy, this guy is usually. number four as well. Number four is loud guy at the bar in the airport.

Don't be the loud guy at the bar in the airport. Not a fan of loud guys at the bar in general, but if you're at the C terminal in Charlotte, like maybe don't be the loud guy. You want to hold court, do it respectfully at a respectful decibel level. I do love loud guy just shooting finger guns at people. Like he's like the, he's like the,

he's like the main character in this story. Yeah, dude. All right, all right. He has main character syndrome. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Right. Last one. Moving sidewalk guy. Generally unaware. These people that stand in the middle of the moving sidewalk, they breathe through their mouths. They're the people who get people killed in real life situations. They have no awareness. They're the people that take pictures of bison too close. Or they exit bold foods aisles without looking left and right. They just don't understand the natural order of things.

So I'm a New Yorker, right? So I have no sympathy for middle of the road guy, middle of the moving walkway guy. I've never felt, by the way. Someone who's also like, I show up to flights like way too late, but I've never missed one. Me too. Well, that's not true. I've missed all but one. But I've never felt more like an edge rusher than me getting, like swim moving guys.

Like I am, dude, I am like, I am right past. I am hip-checking people. I am unrepent. Oh, yeah. I'm going Chris Long on the moving walkway. You know, Baldy told me a great story this week, Baldinger. He pulled his hamstring running to the terminal yesterday. And you couldn't tell. He's walking around Vegas, like, no problem. But he definitely pulled his hamstring running through the airport yesterday. Baldi, four to six weeks. I would like a Baldi's breakdown of Baldi breaking down of ligament. It was unbelievable. It's right up near the attachment, Chris. I had to get to the B-Tor- Terminal. Hey, bro.

I listened to Baldi talk last night for three hours, bro. And willingly, like, I cornered Baldi and was like, tell me fucking stories. We were drinking beer. Baldi's my favorite person. So good. If I could summon Brian Baldinger as the voice on, like, ways, I would. If I could have him narrate my GPS, I would love that. Oh, you want to go left there?

All right. So the last two people, and you can rule on how you feel about him, because they're new. on the scene. I haven't seen a lot of these people, but there was a couple with matching shirts at the airport yesterday, and those people, listen, this is a dark rep.

We are separating families in the U.S. right now. That is a family I'm actually okay separating. There's no need to wear matching shirts at the airport. What is that for? Is it so you can't lose each other? Get a more remarkable-looking partner. Is it to make a statement? Airports aren't the right places for statements.

I'm not a big fan. I've decided by the end of my breakdown that I am anti-matching shirts. Yeah, it's kind of like being a Disney adult, but for airports. It's like you're an airport adult. Like, why are you dressing in tandem at the airport? Let's not do that, bro. Just don't do that. I don't know whose fault it is, but don't do it.

And the last person is this, Pablo. I don't know if you've seen these people. I saw two young women riding their suitcases. They were motorized suitcases. I could not disagree with you more. So let me, let me, you humble bragged, uh, climbing Kilimanjaro. Yeah. This is my equivalent humble brag.

Yeah. I was on a flight to Kauai, okay? Sitting right behind in, in first class. Yes, that's right. Yeah. First class, was, but in front of me was Jaden Smith, okay? Uh-huh. That's, dude, it was, it got, I mean, I become less relatable than more you talk to me.

Jaden Smith? Jaden Smith, Will Smith's kid, okay? He's not flying private? Exactly. So now you're in my, you're in my, you're in my, in my airspace, right? You're my mental airspace. So I'm like, why is Jaden Smith in front of me? This seems beneath him. This is insulting

to Will Smith in his name. So we get to the Kauai Airport and Jaden Smith gets his suitcase. He sits on top of it and fucking motors away. And I'm just like, I'm like, that's the coolest shit I've ever seen. It's cool when he does it. It wasn't

as cool when those two girls just fucking almost knocked me over. I'm just saying, when Jayden Smith motors away riding his suitcase. Like, it's back to the future. I'm like, this guy, okay. I'm sorry for questioning Jaden Smith. No, let's take that off the list.

I'm actually like, hey, the jury's still out. I want to see a bigger sample size. You know, I've only seen two people. You've only seen Jayden Smith? Different tech, different brands, maybe. It depends on what, anyway. There's a technology that I'm interested in investing in after seeing that happen in front of me. Dude, that's incredible.

What a story that is. I mean, that's not. I've never forgotten it. I'm just like, I want to, this is why, this is why, this is why I seek to earn a living wage so that I can afford a motorized suitcase. I'm to ride atop. Like it's, uh, hey, man. That's so good. Hey, Pablo, appreciate you coming on, breaking down your investigative journalism, which was top notch.

In this case, I was, I mean, I was enthralled in the worst way. So people definitely go check out Pablo Torre finds out, Him in Florio killed it, investigating collusion in the NFL, of which there seems to be at least a little bit of it. And thank you for sitting through my definitive list of the worst people at airports. Chris, it's a pleasure. All I can ask you to do now is have another jazz cigarette and then continue to poll the greatest rushers in America about whether they've heard my podcast. That would be great. Dude, I'm going to send it out in the group text.

Like, dudes are going to be like, what time we're meeting at the club tonight? And we'll be like, hey, take an hour before, before Zoot tonight. All right, man. Thank you so much. Thank you, dude. This is a pleasure.