Green Light with Chris Long - Stan Van Gundy! NBA Playoffs, LA Lakers & Denver Nuggets Teams to Beat? Saquon Barkley, Trey Lance & Devin White Storylines.

Episode Date: April 13, 2023

(2:18) - Green Light Softball gets a WIN! (18:00) - Stan Van Gundy Talks NBA Playoffs, LA Lakers Potential, Denver Nuggets Dominance, NBA CBA, Zion Williamson & Stories from a Storied NBA Coaching Career (1:13:09) - Saquon Barkley Declines to Sign Franchise Tender, Devin White Requests Trade, Trey Lance Trade Rumors, Aaron Rodgers Updates & Jeff Okudah Traded to Falcons (1:30:03) - Beau Allen Reviews the Top Interior Defensive Lineman in the 2023 NFL Draft Presented by Miller Lite (1:44:12) - Reid Around the World: Smallest Dogs and Broken Appendages Green Light Spotify Music: https://open.spotify.com/user/951jyryv2nu6l4iqz9p81him9?si=17c560d10ff04a9b   Spotify Layup Line: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/1olmCMKGMEyWwOKaT1Aah3?si=675d445ddb824c42   Green Light Tube YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/GreenLightTube1   Green Light with Chris Long:   Subscribe and enjoy weekly content including podcasts, documentaries, live chats, celebrity interviews and more including hot news items, trending discussions from the NFL, MLB, NHL, NBA, NCAA are just a small part of what we will be sharing with you. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Gambling problem in Arizona, call 1-800. Next step. In Colorado, Indiana, New Jersey, and Virginia, call 1-800 gambler. And at Michigan, 1-800-270-1-17. Tennessee, y'all too, 1-800-9-9-9-9. The Greenlight Podcast welcomes you. To begin the show today, you'll get a little softball recap. We got a win.

It's a big deal here. Then we're going to go right into Stan the man Van Gundy. We're talking basketball. It's the NBA playoff preview. Stan talks a little CBA and the positive impact it'll have on the league. And then also gets in some great stories from his coaching career. Things he's learned along the way, some of the great players he coached. And then after Stan, Chris Bowen, making to have a little fun.

We get back to the roots. We talk some NFL. Botox, 23 interior D-Line draftees. Who is his favorite prospects? What is he like about them? Some guys that might be under the radar. It's the Miller Light draft segment. And then we travel around the world,

heading a few news stories around the way and even bring out a little trivia. Y'all please enjoy. All right, guys, we've got a lot to hammer down today. I can't say hammer down this Pat McAfee thing. Oh. Isn't that? No.

Yeah, we got a lot to hammer out today. There you go. We've got a lot to hammer at. Hammer in. Yeah. Well, however you want to look at it, we got somebody with a big presence in the studio, Bo Allen. Hello, everyone. Hello, Macon.

Hey, Bo. Hello, Chris. So it's good to have you in town. Real quick housekeeping update before we get into a softball update. The pumpkin float that some of you all have been asking about. A lot of people have been asked about the pumpkin float. Do you know about the pumpkin float? Tell me about, oh, you're going to float down the river.

and a pumpkin like some sort of folk hero it's like a guinness book of world records thing i'm going to be a ginnis book of world records holder like this year in the year of our lord 2003 i can remember being on the toilet as a kid and reading guinness book of world records until my legs got numb and i want to be in that book and there was a guy in illinois who floated uh some river it was the missouri river i think it's a little bit intimidating for my liking big river big ass river big river big pumpkin This guy floated like, what, 38 miles in a pumpkin, almost a marathon and a half, an aquatic pumpkin marathon. And I'm going to do the same thing. The good news is Kingston got in touch with the fine folks at the University of Virginia,

one of the best public institutions in the country. Definitely probably better than Wisconsin. Yeah, I'm here on my official visit, actually. With that SAT score, I just found out of it. ACT. ACT, baby. What was your ACTT score? I got 30.

I'm pretty fucking smart. Which we calculated is like a 13 and some change. 1360 it says. Why didn't we take the ACT? It's more of a Midwest thing. Would you be richer if you didn't play football? I honestly think so. With an ACT score like that?

Probably. So anyways, we went down to the University of Virginia and Matt was poking around and asking people, hey, we got, we get this pumpkin thing. Like, can any of all help me? And would you get hooked up with the engineering team? Yeah, I got hooked up with this. They actually have a concrete canoe. building engineering team at UVA and they're excited to take on our project so we

have a whole team of people as smart as Bo helping us out yeah these people are fiat like like like I don't know buoyancy boyancy shit like that and they we're gonna be huge how large is this pumpkin like 1,200 pounds yeah well he said that our pumpkin would likely need to be significantly larger than the pumpkin that that Joane Hansen floated down the Missouri River with because you're larger than that gentleman. Now we don't know how much bigger I am than Dwayne Hanson. Photographically, it looks different.

So I could cut weight before that float. How bad do you want it? You gotta want it more than you want to breathe. So that's coming, yeah, I mean, I'm gonna want it more than I want to breathe because it's like this is my Aaron Rogers' Darkness Retreat. Like this is my version of the Darkness Retreat. Muggen Retreat, Meg, I hope you don't mind.

I'm going to be leaving for two days to float down the river and a giant pumpkin. Pull the kids up, the hat and ferry to cheer me on. You can check on me the first day, the second day. I was such a fucking idiot before I had kids.

I used to think I was going to do all this cool shit like when I had kids. I used to want to do the entire app trail. And I told Meg like, you know, one summer you can basically like bring the kids and stop in at different campgrounds we can see there's no way.

It'd be, I'm doing the app trail. It would be one summer, the fall, and then, because he's, it's like five months. Well, you, no, I would do it. I'm trying to break the record. Okay, so 40 days. 40 days. Yeah. Not that long.

So is this pumpkin. The pace is like 17 miles a day, I think, is the app trail. Is it more? The average. The average is 17. If you're trying to set the record, it's like 45 to 50. 45 miles a day? Yes.

Fucked out. These dudes that set records, they, they, literally just run, you know, move as quick as they can. But I can float. So anyways. Dumbus shit. Hard, man. There's a lot of bouncing involved. There's some core work. I'm good, bro.

I've been doing, there's a Pilate studio down there. Yeah. I want to check it out tomorrow. So anyways, softball. We're in the wing column. Ten run them last night. Yeah, we slaughtered my old team. I want to shout out the Fitzroy team.

that I basically was like the AFL. I've said this before. I was like one of these AFL teams that I broke off from the NFL. And now the chickens are coming home to roost. We slaughtered those guys. Fabio, their manager, was doing some chirping before the game. He was like, oh, you guys took our best player. And I wasn't even paying attention to whatever the fuck he was saying.

But the punchline of the joke was like, and it's not you, it's Tom. By the way, Fabio, if you're listening, that's six for our team. So that says something about the quality of your squad. Is that the Bosa brother? The third Bosa brother? No. That's J. That's J.P.

Oh, that's J.P. That guy fucking rips balls. Did you see the video of him hitting the ball? Yes. Yeah. And I saw the new video featuring our favorite Dr. Fax. Hitting Dinger. Yeah.

J.P. J.P. was chopping broccoli. Oh. Fucking. Mike. Mike. We had a lead off Homer. It was just one of those magical nights on the diamond.

I saw you. mounting the bases. You look quick. Yeah, I wasn't really running that hard. Does that translate to pumpkin floating? No, I'll be fine. Softball and pumpkin floating. Yeah, I'll be fine. Van Dygram. There's a lot of... A circle. Had Fitzroy won a game? Nope. No. So the thing I said to everybody had made it easy. Like when I, you know, because there's a lot of guys on the team I really like.

And I don't want to seem like too contentious rolling up to the ballpark. You know, it was like, hey, buddy, good to see you. Somebody's got to win tonight, right? But we knew we were going to fucking beat them. They don't score a lot of runs. these guys. So the bats were alive. We got on the board. Fax hit a home run. It was one of the most proud moments I've ever seen. We played five innings because we 10 run them and we probably had three or four three out innings like one two three. Wow. Up and down. It was good. In fact the last inning,

I don't know if this would have been a code break because they told me going to the last inning, we have to score one run before they call this thing. I was I was actually angling for the team to commit errors on purpose so we could keep playing and get more at bats. I don't know if that's a code break, but that's what I was about. I wanted to bury that team. And we did. We did. Congrats, guys.

I'm kind of upset about this softball thing, Chris. Like, you know, I'm a big FOMO guy, and I sit here and I watch you guys at these sick highlight tapes, talking about your dingers and you're chopping broccoli and all these fun of broccoli. I got broccoli. Yeah, so I'm a little pissed. I was trying to change my flight to get up here last night. It sounds like you didn't even need me. So if you guys go through another dry stuff.

All those ACT points don't know how to fucking change your phone. flight. Bring me up for some broccoli chopping. I know you can stay in front of a ball in the outfield. We've had problems like that. All right. So then I got home and the NBA playoffs have started. It's not the NBA playoffs because interestingly like when guys, they were talking about Anthony Davis and some like stat last night. And they were like he doesn't count towards the regular season or the postseason.

But he, you know. All time leading score in play in history. Yeah. And another interesting point is the Lakers have only won one home playoff game since LeBron's been there. I mean, you don't count the bubble. Right. Like in that building. And it didn't feel like the playoffs for a couple quarters.

And then the fourth quarter, you just feel that fucking dial turn up. And the Lakers defense was like, they were great. Yeah, all eight of them were amazing. Yeah. Exactly. Well, Anthony Davis is so goddamn long. That team couldn't create their own shots. Yeah.

And they missed Gobert. And there was no space. There was no space. And Anthony Edwards was terrible. They still should have won. They scored 16 points in fourth quarter and overtime. Dude, it was insane. I had the over thinking, okay, Rudy Gobert, like, he makes them better defensively,

but he doesn't make them better offensively. And so I figured, hey, you know, like, that's compounding on both sides there. Like, we're going to have an over. I think it was 233. Went to OT, and we didn't even have a shot to hit the over. No. One of the sloppiest end games I've ever seen in like a high pressure environment, just like turnover after turnover after turnover.

It was like who wanted it. Five points to, or eight seconds ago, they're down five. You know, the game's pretty much over, but you got a shot to inbound the ball and hit a three and force them to hit foul shots, which they're very good at because they have a ton of fucking practice. And they were like 19 for 20 on the fucking game. But they just sky the ball over what's his face, his head, the tallest guy on the court,

Carl Anthony Towns and it goes in the front row and then it's like ISO of that head coach up in Minnesota. Chris Binch. Yeah, it just, they're not, they didn't, they weren't well coached. No. Mike Conley was maybe the best player on the floor. He was great dude, he was, he could not miss. And then you want to talk about pressure and like having a tight asshole like as an athlete seeing the end of that game, there's nothing worse than having to hit free throws with no time left on the clock to tie the game.

And the first free throw climbed. the front of the rim to get in the in the basket so like yeah conley was awesome uh old ass lakers especially lebron who was clearly limited like had to be pissed anthony davis for that last second well brine was a little sloppy at the end of the game he looks to me like his foot is really bothering him yeah maybe so he's 38 yeah looks to me like he's like our age yeah they're playing basketball can you imagine i was thinking about this last night because this austin reeves guy was he's interesting to me. Just see a regular swagless white guy on the Lakers.

Like, how many points do you think he'd score on me if I guarded him for an entire NBA game? And they were just like, their job was... If they knew that you were on him and you couldn't switch off of him? Yeah. $55? 90? Yeah.

You're kidding me, dude. I can hold Austin Reefs at 30. No, no, no. No. This is going to be one of those things. If somebody went viral for this the other day, like they could complete a pass. I could hold Austin Reeves to 40.

Now it's 40. He's 6'5, 200 pounds. Well, 200 pounds. He's wet. Okay, well, he's got a big bruise on his right arm. I don't know what the fuck that that's about. What happened to him? I'll tell you what I'm doing.

Put a shoulder into that right bicep. And then there'd be no 40. I think they'd keep ISO in him. Okay, well, it was good to see Tristan Thompson. He looks great. Didn't see the floor. He looks great. It's just good to see Tristan Thompson.

He's not there to see the floor. just for his attitude. He's there to hang out with LeBron. I guess he's LeBron's like Somalié. Like they just go out and drink wine together. But yeah, it's fun to watch Lakers. You get Cotino Mobley showing up on the bench, right? Do you know who Catino Mobley is?

No. He was the guy that was getting buckets with white hair at the Drew. He's like 55 years old. He was out there like giving people work. But I don't watch a lot of Lakers games. They're on late at night. Okay? 10-11 is not a good start time.

I know this is something that like NBA fans are used to, even in the playoffs, but more so, I don't know what you guys think about this, I think 7.30, what did the Hawks in the heat do to deserve a 7.30 start time? Like 7.30 is like, that's prime time to me. And I know there's time zones,

and if you started the game at 6.30, people out west would complain, slippery slope, when are we going to cater to Hawaii next? Like, you know, get on the American time zone. I really do believe 7.30 is too late for my kid to watch the game. And 10-11, I shouldn't be up watching the game. So you're losing both generations with these start times.

I wish they start games at 630. How other question is that? The Big East does. Big East basketball starts at 630. What's the big deal? Yeah. It's good. What the fuck is the big deal?

Part of that, I guess, is the East part of the Big East. I understand. And people at out West are still at 1st, work at 3.30, but everybody works from home now. So what, you lose? Most people are podcasters. So what some roofers can't watch the game, you know? Yeah. That's not

the demo we're trying to grow. You know what I mean? Nothing against roofers. Maybe they want to see the heat hawks, but fuck me. 730's too late for the first game. If the second game is going to start at 10.20 in the evening. That is odd. You would

think basketball games are two hours long, yeah? Do a 7 and a nine, ten. That'd be fine. Yeah. That'd be fine. But TNT's so good at what they do, you have to leave 30 minutes for those guys to talk. Yeah.

In which Charles said, all of these Eastern Conference series are going to suck. He's the... Except for maybe Cavs Nix. That's what he said. He is like the opposite of a company man. Yeah. He will shit on the product. He told Shaq he'd bet a billion dollars that the Heat won.

Oh, boy. Well, I mean, we all thought the Heat were going to win. Yeah. I mean, they were slod. And Jimmy Butler went out there and we'll ask Stan Van Gundy about that. Stan Van. Yeah, so we got him in a couple minutes. I really did enjoy having the NBA playoffs, asterix back on.

It's going to be a fun few months. Yeah, it feels like. Yeah, lock in. I think game seven of the finals would be June 18th. Yeah. That's two months and a week from now. Yeah. So Wayland's...

This is the actual season. This is all we care about. Yes. It's Stanley Cup and the NBA. playoffs, the two marathons, and those fucking hockey players, they're just skating. You want to

talk about a really tough physical undertaking. Let's talk about the NBA players. So, he got bruises all over him. Fucking, by the way, an umpire got beaned with a ball and baseball today. Just got pissed missile to home from center field, and it

hit the fucking umpire right in the side. He got right up. Your move, hockey. But so, um, I guess what I'm saying is I'm happy the playoffs. I've kind of taken the last couple years off a little bit. I've been too busy. I feel like I'm back into the NBA and I cannot wait to settle up. Like Whalen was pissed because the temper wolves,

he was going to miss that game. I'm like, dude, like you're going to be eight years old in the fucking playoffs are still going to be going on. There's plenty of NBA ball left. Stan van. Stan van. Cash app. The easy way to send, spend, save, and invest with,

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All right, this is a treat. We got another basketball guest this week. Richard Jefferson was awesome. And now we get to look at it from coach's perspective, a longtime NBA coach and somebody who's great on TV except when he's calling Virginia games. Stan Van Gundy. What's going on, coach? Yeah, hey, look, that Virginia game, I feel bad. I'm always the type, Chris.

You know, I think I identify with the coach on the losing end of things more, you know, because you know that there's always more pain than there is joy on the winning side. And I've had great respect for Tony's father, Dick Bennett. I think he's the best college coach I'd ever seen. And so great respect for the family. And just looking at him at the end of that game when you're fifth year senior, who's one of the most solid guards in the country, just puts the ball up for grabs with a game you've basically got one.

I mean, it was stunning. Absolutely. I don't get too surprised at basketball games. We did not get surprised because we've done. this drill before as Virginia fans. We're long suffering with a national championship mixed in. Yeah, yeah, national. I was going to say, you're not that long-suffering.

But your reaction of shock and surprise was actually a little comforting. You looked sad and that made me feel better as Harlan is trying to get you guys to lay out. Yeah. Because most people hate us, so it was good that you actually had some empathy in the moment. Yeah, look, I mean, it was, I seriously don't get very surprised at Batchel basketball games and anything can happen, but that one shocked to be. I mean, you know, because of who it was, you know, if it had been just about anybody else, okay. But, you know, Kea. Clark isn't necessarily a great player.

Like, he's not going to put up huge numbers. But he's about as solid as they come. And I just felt so bad for him and so big. for their team and for and for Tony because he's the last guy you'd expect to make a play like that. Now on the other side, you had to be happy for the, well, you don't have to be, but I had to be happy for the guys at Furman because obviously that's a great win. And I told the kid, Pugues, who made that shot the next day at their practice, I told him, I said, I just want to be you for one day

back in Greenville, South Carolina. Just one day. Yep, yep. That's the magic of that tournament. And I wonder, you know, like you watch the tournament probably every year throughout your career in some level, but to be in the building and be calling these games,

especially alongside somebody like Kevin Harlan, who is one of my personal favorites in the business, and you've worked with other studs, court side there. What's that like? Did you pick things up from those guys collectively in that experience? Oh, absolutely.

I mean, I'm a guy still learning my way through the business, and guys like Kevin, who I've worked with a little bit at TNT, last year's Western Conference Finals, and a few regular season games. And then I've worked with others. Ion Eagle, Brian Anderson. Those guys have taught me a lot about the business. But the college game was something totally new.

I mean, I'd immersed myself in film, but I still, you know, I don't know the college game like those guys do. And having Dan Bonner, another Virginia guy, by the way, having Dan next to me, who's done this for 37, 38 years, the NCAA tournament, and knows the rules inside out and knows the history of the tournament. I mean, it was comforting because I only had to provide so much. And what I had to provide basically was just watch the game

and talk about what's going on at the game. Yeah, it was fun for us because we could get off the emotional roller coaster like the first day. So it was actually not the worst outcome. Like I've seen worse as a Virginia fan. Let's move on to the NBA, man. Like you got the new CBA. A lot's been made of the 65 game deal. A lot's been made of cannabis ownership of teams.

What raised your eyebrows as a former NBA coach the most when it came to that CBA? Well, I mean, I think a lot of it was good stuff. A lot of people have been critical of the 65 game minimum for awards, particularly because, you know, all NBA teams, you know, has a lot to do with how much you can make, whether you can get the Supermax contract or not. I really don't like that there's a financial part of that because it's media guys voting for that award. It's people like us. I don't see every game, every team plays. I see a lot, but I don't think we should be affecting how much money guys are eligible to make. But with that said, I thought it was a good move to establish a minimum number of games,

and the people I've talked to who voted are happy about it. Some people disagree with the number, but what they like the voters is it takes a lot of those decisions off their shoulders. You know, they don't have to say, well, I know Devin Booker's one of the best guards in the game. He should be on the all-NBA team, but he's only played 53 or 54 games. Same with Steph Curry. Where do I draw the line? Now the line's drawn for them. And so now they can just vote on what they've seen on the floor. And I think it was necessary. People look at it as, you know, a punishment of the guys who don't play enough, but I don't see it that way. I look at it as, number one, let's reward the guys who do play.

But also, look, I mean, you have to do a lot in those 53 games to produce as much as a guy who's played 77 games. I mean, there's a 24-game difference where you've produced zero for your team, zero. You know, and that guy's done whatever he's done. So I like that. I like the fact that salaries can go up a little bit higher. You know, you can increase by 140% on the extensions. I think that's helpful. You know, I like that they're not going to test for marijuana. I think it's ridiculous that we have something that's legal in more states than it's not. And we're trying to make it. illegal in our league. My point has always been on that, well, if we're going to test for marijuana, then let's give them blood tests for alcohol. Let's do the same thing. I mean, honestly, as a coach, and with my, you know, somewhat limited knowledge, which I'll admit to, but I always felt like, Chris, as a coach, if my athletes were going to have to use one or the other, I'd rather have smoking marijuana than drinking copious amounts of alcohol. Yeah, exactly. You know, I think it'll affect

performance less, the marijuana. So I was glad that that went. I thought they did a good job. The biggest thing what stood out the most is they got it done. And I think, you know, we've had lockouts and things like that and a lot of acrimony. I think getting it done and getting it done early, so everybody can go about their business for the rest of this decade was a huge move. And if you were a coach and somebody's played 64 games, like how do, how do the mechanics of like, hey, you know, could you see a situation where an owner or GM is like, hey, coach, we got to sit this guy tonight? or is it just too much of a players league? Because in the NFL, sometimes guys will get pulled before they get their incentives based on playing time.

Like I remember I was in New England. I didn't think Bill was going to play me the last game of the season because I was standing to make a quarter million dollars. And true to his word, he trotted me out there and I got my incentive and I was shocked. But in the NFL, it doesn't happen all the time. How would that happen in the NBA now? Yeah, I mean, there are those in the contract.

Not as many, Chris, because quite honestly, the NBA decides if the incentives are likely to be reached or unlikely. And if they're likely to be reached, they go on the salary cap. So the team really doesn't have a lot to gain by holding the guy out. And, you know, how do you walk in a locker room or how do you as a GM deal with your players if you're deliberately withholding money from them? and then what? You're going to ask them for maximum effort, the time out, you know, sacrifice for the team. All those things coaches talk about all the time. And you're going to deliberately pull money out of a guy's pocket.

Hopefully that wouldn't happen in our league. I've never heard of a case of it happening, and hopefully it wouldn't. Let's talk about these playoffs, man. First off, do you like the play-in structure? Sure. As a casual NBA fan, I certainly have enjoyed kind of seeing, you know, come on to the scene. I've enjoyed the games. I enjoyed the games last night. Do you enjoy it as much as some of us do? Well, at first, like I'm pretty conservative basketball guy, you know, and like, you know, why are we putting in a three point line? What's the deal with the shot clock? I mean, I'm one of those guys to get off my lawn type of guys, you know? We changed the defensive rules in the NBA long time ago. I've probably opposed every single change they've made.

And quite honestly, every change they've made has been good for the game. So, you know, I thought the play-in has been a good idea. It has increased interest. It provides a little bit of the NCAA tournament type of feel to the winner-go-home thing. and I just think it's an interesting thing. I mean, look, just like in the NCAA tournament, right? You have teams that are legitimately playing for a championship, you know, the major college teams, and then you have the teams that just getting in or maybe winning one game makes your season.

It's the same in the NBA. Like for Oklahoma City, as young as they are, to be in the play in and get that experience, successful season. And if they could ever win two games and get in the playoffs, that's their championship for this year. So I love that part. Now, it's like anything, it was a little more exciting when it was new. And this year, we got our first team who did, well, not really. So this year we got a team who didn't want to get in. You know, Dallas decided, you know, we don't watch flight. Yeah. So they tanked to get out. That sort of detracts. Last year, we had the clippers. You know, they lost their first play-in game and then sat Paul George in the second play-in game against

New Orleans, so they lost. Things like that, I think, detract from what it's supposed to be. But overall, I think it's been a good idea. I think that, you know, Adam Silver's done a good job. You know, his next thing is to try to get the play, you know, to get an in-season tournament in. I'll oppose that also. So that probably means it will turn out to be a great idea. That'll work out. Do you think that there's any, do you think that like Denver, they're the one seed, right? You know, like Denver, they might want to handpick their opponent.

Do you think that the one seat should be able to handpick the opponent out of the small pool of teams that are eligible to play them in the playoffs coming out of this plan? Yeah, I've heard that talked about. It's an interesting point and probably in the name of fairness, they should be. I'm not sure if I'd want that if I were a coach in an organization. Right. Good backfire. Yes, it could. Like, if you're clearly a lot better than somebody, okay.

But if it gets close, like let's say we get to the second round and now they get to pick and they don't want to play Phoenix. And so they say, okay, we'll take the Lakers. I mean, Chris, you've been in enough locker rooms and there's always, you're digging for locker, you know, for bulletin board material. You don't even have to dig on that one. That guy picked us to play. That's who he wants to play. I'm not sure I'd want to be part of that.

Let's just play it. I'd say, let's just play it out the way the standings are. Bottom line, you want to win a championship. You're going to have to win four series. So, you know, who you get in a. If you can't beat the eight seats. in the first round, well, you weren't going to win a championship then, so head on home. Who do you think Denver should want to play?

Ah, of the teams that are left right now? Yeah. Yeah. You know, the team that would scare me, it's going to come down to Minnesota and New Orleans now. I'd rather play Minnesota. Heck, I'd rather play Minnesota than Oklahoma City. I think they're, even though they played great last night and should have won,

they're in a little bit of disarray, I think. with all the problems they've had. New Orleans has played great at the end of the year. And Oklahoma City's got that nothing to lose, and they play hard and with great energy and spirit and like a lot of young guys, I think I'd take my chances with Minnesota. So OKC is a young team, Sacramento,

not an experienced playoff team, but really snuck up on people this year. It's almost like I had to look twice at the seating, like holy shit, they're not only still playing basketball in Sacramento, they're good. And then I'm listening to Draymond Green and he's talking about playoff experience. And he's saying, hey, you know, on his podcast, if you have a team without playoff experience, you want to jump them and you want that thing to be over early, which sounds good and everything. I remember late in my career having some playoff experience and being

asked by coaches to impart some wisdom on younger players. And I was always like, hey, man, I don't know that playoff experience is actually valuable as it's built up. to be in the NFL. Because you see good players making mistakes, bone-headed shit all the time. You see young players making great plays. At the end of the day, it's an extension of continuing to do your job.

In the NBA, what is playoff experience? And if it's real, where does it actually show up? Like, you know, the cliché is, yeah, I know the cliche, but in what parts of the game on the court, off the court, does playoff experience show up? And is it valuable? I mean, it's valuable, Chris, but I'll take talent over playoff experience.

any day of the week, you know? And I'll take a team that has built great habits throughout the season and execute and, you know, executes and things like that. I'll take that. I do think where experience gets important is number one, and it's probably only for the first quarter of your first road game, but the atmosphere is going to be different. The arenas are going to be different. to be noisier the whole thing. I think with today's young players, a big one with experiences, there's heightened scrutiny. And I don't know if you went through this as your career went on, but social media tears a lot of these athletes up right now. And they have a problem dealing with it. You know, I mean, they'll look after a game and, you know, or their boys will point out to them.

Like, this dude said this about you. And they're on there and they're taking this to heart. well, it's going to get a lot worse in the playoffs. And so if you don't have the maturity to deal with the scrutiny, you know, you can get eaten up by the playoffs. And then I think on the court where it shows up is the adjustments from game to game. And I think what young players have got to understand, they may not go out and have a great game one. Well, guess what?

They're not going to play you the same in game two. There's going to be different schemes, different defenders. you're going to have to adjust. And it takes time, I think, in your career to be smart enough and mature enough. I shouldn't say smart, but mature enough to be able to handle adjustments, be ready to adjust. You talked about bullet and board material a little bit. You alluded to it. We talked about motivation and the scrutiny.

How do you, like, how would you feel if you're one of your. best players had a podcast like Draymond's like if he handles his business on the court i do believe some players they're impervious to to that kind of you know feeling that hot lamp on them um but how do you feel do you feel like that heightens the scrutiny or is that a team that's kind of exempt from this conversation because they are so experienced yeah i mean i think you hit it on the head right there on your question chris i mean it's an individual thing i mean some people can handle it and it's not a distraction and can go out and play while others, I think need to lock in a little bit more. As a coach, bottom line is like, look, I really can't or don't think I should be inserting

myself into anything other than what's going on in the court, game practice, everything else, what happens in the locker room. But when you leave the building, I mean, there's certainly worse things you could be doing Yeah, that's true. And host in a podcast. So, you know, like, I just, these are professional athletes. I think it's what's different than college. Like, you know, we're not responsible for every area of your life, nor should we be.

And I think you treat people like men. And their responsibility is whether it's, they've got to be ready to practice, ready to prepare, and ready to play. Yeah. How about the go bear situation the other day? I know you played on some teams where it's, to the old NBA, it was fiery, it's still fiery. Like there were fights in the NFL in practice.

There's that sort of thing. How does that process go when two guys get into it? And then how does that healing process, like where do you insert yourself in that healing process? Because say Minnesota, you know, gets a win in a couple nights. They're going to have to play together. And they're going to have to go play a series together. And I wonder what the coach's responsibility is when two grown men get into it.

Or is it like, hey, this is between y'all. Y'all got to figure it out. No, I think as a coach you get into it, you talk to your team about it, you talk to both players about it, you talk to them together about it, the whole thing. But you do just move on. Look, you know it better than I do. I was never a player, so you know it better than I do. Players are better than coaches, in my opinion, about being able to move on. They get it.

Like, tempers run high sometimes. You're in there. Something happens. My experience has been players do a pretty damn good job of moving on from it and understanding that happened. And I also think professional athletes for the most part, they don't have to love the guy they're playing with. The guy just got to do his job and I got to do mine. And the Minnesota Timberwolves, you know what? They want out of Rudy Gobert.

Somebody's saying, oh, they need Rudy to explain. They need an apology. The hell they do. When Rudy gets back, they need him to block shots, rebound the ball. and catch the lobs and dunk it. They need him to perform. And that's all those guys want. They want teammates who help the team win

and help their own careers. And that's what they want out of Rudy Gobert. If you all love each other and are great friends, all the better, but it's not a necessity. And you and I have both seen teams where guys were close friends, but you didn't really see chemistry on the field or on the court. and on the other side, you've seen guys who've never spent a minute together off the field or off the court, but when they get out there, they play great together.

So I don't think the two things really have any relationship. And I think if Rudy Gobert comes back and plays Friday night, he'll be fine. And I think the team will be fine. Stan, who is the most combustible player you ever coached? Well, I actually never had anyone throw a punch at another player. in a time out, I'll say that. I had a lot of guys who wanted to punch me. I think Chris can relate to that probably with coaching.

I had a lot of guys who wanted to do that. Probably the most combustible guy I had was Rayfer Ralston in Orlando. I mean, his temper would get the best of him and things like that. He tore up a locker room once after a, You know, playoff loss. Actually, when I had him in Miami in Orlando in Miami, he tore up a locker room. And, you know, he'd have some stuff like that.

But ask anyone who ever played with Rayfer Alston, they'd want to play with him again. I mean, unselfish, played hard, smart. I loved coaching him, you know. But there's just some guys, you know. I coached Adonis Haslam his first two years. And I'd yell at him on the court, and he would go down the people.

court swearing at me under his breath, you know, all the time. And not that much under his breath, because I could hear him. But then he would do exactly what needed to be done, whether it was on offense or defense to help our team win. So, you know, people react different ways. I don't really, I never did, Chris, I'd be interested in your take. I was never really concerned about something that was said in the heat of battle. Now, if somebody came in the next morning, when he'd had time to cool off and was ripping his teammates or or something now that's a now we got a problem that's a whole different deal but in the heat of battle chris i would agree i would agree you know we had football fights and the thing was always hey don't let it go to the locker room you know leave

it on the field i mean i've gotten into with coaches where me and my position coach we're not going to speak the rest of the fucking day and at the moment it seemed like maybe the rest of the year but usually cooler heads prevail and you realize that this is that this is the same the second a high pressure business man and and even the best of us get pushed to places where we're not really proud of what we say in the moment sometimes and so i think communication is huge if you have that bedrock of good communication on your team you're going to be able to get out of these situations the way you got into them yeah absolutely and look i think i can come from that point of view because i know how many times i crossed the line with players you know and got out of conventi

certainly I was never one that was going to, you know, overreact to them crossing the line because I probably I crossed the line first and sort of instigated the whole thing to begin with. But those kind of things happen. And I think you hit it on the head to communication. And if you've built a relationship where I know that you're going to do, you're giving me everything you've got and you want to win and you know I'm doing the same, well, We're going to get past that.

Now, if there's a true lack of respect, like, I don't think you give an effort, or I don't think you're focused on what goes on, or if you don't think that I'm being honest or whatever, now we've got a problem. But a lot of times it's just heat of the battle stuff between two people who probably have great respect for each other. My guess is Kyle Anderson and Rudy Gobert have respect for each other as players and as men. But, you know, here's the other thing. People, I don't think you can understand it.

I don't think people take into account enough. You're with these people in highly competitive situations for eight months straight every single day. I don't care who you're around for every day for you. Exactly. You annoy the crap out of each other. I mean, you know, like, think of. about it in our families. I mean, we love our families, but you get annoyed with each other. You're around every day. And now you take a team and you go out in these competitive situations and you think

it's going to be all lovey-dovey all the time. It's not realistic. Yeah. If we worked in an office, it might be less healthy because some of those things never get aired out. The temperature's not high enough. And I think sometimes you've got to air those things out. If there's tension, a pipe has to burst, you know, for us to get past. it. And so I don't know about basketball. I know football in that situation. So sticking with the bubble for one second, I'm going to move on to your career because

there's so many interesting stops. You know, Jimmy Butler guarantees a win. When you read that, or that gets to your desk and your SPO, now take Jimmy Butler out of it because maybe it's like, well, Jimmy Butler can kind of do what he wants. He's earned the clout to do that. But what does that do? Like, what's the ripple effect

of that the day of the game when you read something like that? You know what? I don't, yeah, I don't think you worry about it. First of all, you're going to see it in probably most of the playoff series that we have this year. Somebody at some time is going to guarantee a win in the series. I mean, like, come on, those things have been going on forever and they don't have an effect one way or another. And as much as people, including coaches and everything else and players want to make of the bulletin board motivation, and all of that, whatever emotion it is carrying you into a game, at least in basketball, that's going to carry about four minutes into the game, you know? And then you're back to your habits and your skills and your abilities and your focus and everything else. Like you, you just can't carry emotion for 48 minutes. And that's why, from a coaching standpoint, I think what you focus on all year long is building winning habits, you know, because if you can only play well

when something external motivate you, well, you're going to be good for us for about, I don't know, 60 minutes a year out of 82 games. It's just not going to work. So a lot of talk about tanking right now with Wembe Nyama, and obviously he's a transcendent prospect. There are varying kind of opinions on what if tanking is good for the league. what have you take me inside the mind of a coach who's actually got to carry out that task not saying you've had to do it but like how do people actually do it i mean you know there's obviously you can sick guys but what goes on like in a situation where somebody's tanking it's always the front office i mean i don't know of a coach who's ever decided to tank right you know first of all

coaches are the only one that they put the record beside your name right i mean you can look up on any database. I can look at every NBA coach, and I can tell you his career record as soon as I, I can't tell you that with the GM. They never put his record on there. Like, start doing that, number one, and we'd have less tanking. You know, but these guys never have their record. So players and coaches, listen, you would never be able to tell a player or a coach, hey, we want you to go out there and lose. Like, it's just not going to happen. So what front offices do, is they work with their medical people and whatever, and they make up whatever they need to make up,

and they just sit guys out of games, you know? And now the teams who tank all year long, look, they just don't go put together a roster that has a chance to win. So, you know, Detroit, Houston, San Antonio, they didn't go into games and say, hey, guys, we don't want to win today. They simply weren't going to be good enough to win.

with what they had. So that's the tanking. I don't think the league sees it as a problem. You know, attendance, we just got word this year, all-time high. When the new media deals come up, they're going to get even more money. But I think we're being short-sighted because I think we have a number of problems in the league that if left unchecked, we'll eventually come back to haunt us. And I think players not playing games, you know, as much of the load management and guys sitting out is becoming a major problem, in my opinion. And I think, and I think this is true in every sport, I think we need to totally disincentivize losing. I don't think there should be any incentive ever to losing. So it's all for the draft, right?

So in the NBA, I've seen two proposals I like. One, get rid of the draft. No draft. Everybody coming out of college is a free agent. We've already got the salary cap. If you want to go give Victor Wimbunyama a $200 million contract, let's go ahead and do it. But there's no draft. He can pick.

The second thing is a guy in Boston, Mike Zarin and assistant GM had an idea what he called the wheel. and it would basically be a 30-year draft plan where 30 years in advance, you know where you're drafting every year. So in that 30-year time, everybody would get the first pick once, the second pick once, you know, and it would rotate through. So there would be no incentive to losing. Now, you still may choose to have a low-budget team so that you would have money under the salary cap for the coming year. Right. So you may not put together a great team or as good as you could, but there would be no incentive to just sit guys out. I mean, Portland was afraid they were winning too much and set down Damian Lillard for like three weeks. Utah did the same thing. Like, none of that would help you if under those two scenarios. You might as well just play and try to win games. I think that would help our league a lot. And you figure tanking gets harder with the 65 game rule, depending on the team you're on. Yeah.

Coach, speaking of the little numbers next to your name, you won 80% of your games at Castleton. I want to know how much money Stan Van Gundy made as a 24-year-old head coach at Castleton. That's a good question. Okay, that is a good question. So I'll tell you exactly. I got $1,500 to coach the basketball team. And I got $7,500 to run the equipment room in the gym and like set up stuff for physical education classes, line the fields for like soccer and baseball game. And I had a, you know, I managed a group of, I don't know, probably 20 to 30 student workers, you know, who are on work study.

And we did all of that work. And then I got my camp in the summer where I probably made a couple thousand more. But here's the great thing, you know. I remember one time saying to my dad who coached for 40 years, and I said, man, I said, this is going to be tough to get by on this amount of money. I mean, I'm making $9,000 for the course of year. I mean, it was 1983, but still, $9,000. And my dad said, son, you have to understand if that job paid more, you wouldn't have gotten it. That's fucking brutal.

And it was just, you know, like, I was just my wife and I were talking today about some other stuff. And I said, we all need people in our lives who will tell us the truth. Yeah. Well, my dad would do that all the time for me. That was one right there. You wouldn't. And he's right because the pool of candidates would have been different. I had two years as an assistant coach at the University of Vermont.

And I get a head coaching job. And then the other one he had to me, you know, I was really full of myself my first year. I'm 24-year-old head coach. We went 26 and 2 my first year. You know, so, I mean, I'm a genius. Like, that's an absolute genius in my own line. And I remember him, and I've used this line on a lot of different people over the years. It was great.

He said, son, when you think you've got all the answers, it's only because you don't know all the questions. Right. That's right. That's the truth. Yeah. The older I get to where that rings true, actually. No, that's exactly right. And so, you know, yeah, he put me in line with that one on the job, though,

and I was lucky to have it. And still, after all these years, the most fun I ever had coaching those three years at Castleton, it was just totally pure, you know, Division III guys playing because they loved to play. There was no BS going on. I had really good players also helps that we won a lot. you said that makes it fun and I'm still in touch with virtually all of those guys who played for me 40 years ago there they're just because I wasn't much older than they than they were and we weren't friends at the time because you can't be but as you've gotten older you know you

share a lot of things and it's fantastic it was a fantastic experience and I met my wife there the one I love to tell this is great for a basketball coach I recommended to anybody. I met my wife. I'm the basketball coach. She was the assistant director of admissions. Oh, nice. Yeah, there you go. There you go. You got to get guys into school. Yeah, even at D3. There you go. Even more so at D3 because there's no money to be made, so they're not, they're not giving you anything, you know. That's a great strategy. A little UVM here, man. I know you weren't there for very long, but do you know any UVM famous alums. Wow. Well, the only, see, there are a lot. And I knew them at the time, because you know how it is.

You'd use it in recruiting. But they do now have their first NBA player, and he's actually made a good contribution, Anthony Lamb for the Warriors. Oh, yeah. And he is actually, he was a two-way player to start the year, but he's in Steve Kerr's rotation, and, you know, his minutes will probably go down a little bit with Wiggins back, but he's really, really helped them. So that's their basketball one. Baseball, there was a guy Jack Leggett, was the graduated from there, coach baseball there at 24, went to Clemson and was in several college world series. Actually, went to Western Carolina and then to Clemson. So I only know the sports guys. Yeah, it was a lot. It was That's it.

I can't think of any podcasters. You ever heard of a guy named Ryan Rosillo? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, he's a UVM guy. I just didn't know if he was in. Is he really? Yeah, see, there you go. Yeah.

But he might be, he might be the best podcaster at a UVM. Well, there's actually, so there's one more, I worked with the guy. When I first got there, one of our other assistant coaches was a guy, Tom Perrin. And when he left, Vermont, he came down, he graduated from there and was a coach. He went to the University of Virginia. and worked under Terry Holland's. Terry Holland, when they went to the final four, got his PhD in sports psychology down there, still does some work.

He used to do some work with Bruce Arena, still does some work with Tony Bennett and has his own business down there, worked with us when I was in the NBA. So he was a UVM grad. I don't know how famous he is, but he should be. Yeah, no, that's pretty good. He just rattled off three, four people. You just mentioned sports psych is something that was on my mind when you talked about, you know, load management. Your career span, it's been interesting because, like,

I feel like athletics have changed over the past couple decades where, as it would with any, you know, with any period of time, but sports science has become more important, sports psych, you know, mental health, all that stuff. If you were coaching again at some point, and later in your career, because you have coached recently, did you start to implement a lot of that stuff? I'm sure you didn't have a choice in like New Orleans say, because that's modern basketball. But, you know, sports psych, sports science, all that stuff. And how do you think it actually helps the game in today's day and age?

Well, with the sports psych, Chris, I think it can be extremely, extremely helpful. But it's like anything, you know, the players have to want it and buy into it, you know. I don't think you can force them to do things because, you know, if you're not looking for answers, you're certainly not going to find any. But the guys who have worked with the sports psychologists, both in Detroit, well, actually, here in Orlando, it was a private guy, a professor at Rollins College. But everywhere I've been where they've worked with those guys, it's been extremely helpful. I think with the performance people, it's interesting because I feel like in your league, in the NFL,

they've helped guys condition better so you guys can play more and healthier and in our league I hate to say it but I look at most of those guys what they've contributed to is our guys playing less and less and less all the time.

That's like it happened in the NFL. No, it's not. No, which is good because I just think I had a great strength coach when I was in Orlando, a guy by the name of Joe Rogowski. And he said to me, you know, that his philosophy always was, you know, the game has certain demands.

And as a coach, you decide what your demands are going to be practice-wise. And when I put those two together, my job as a strength coach, as a performance guy, is to help get the players ready to meet those demands. What's happened in our league now is the performance people are trying to control. the workload. They're trying to decide this is what the guy should do or shouldn't do. He shouldn't practice today. Your team shouldn't practice today. And I'm not sure that always relates to winning. Like we're in a business where Pat Riley always used to say all of us, coaches, players, strength coaches, we're hired by management by the owners to get a result. That's.

That's what this is all about. And I don't think our performance people are working toward that. And believe me, I am not saying that we should have injured guys go out and play, not at all. And I've never involved myself in those decisions. I'm saying healthy guys should play. And I'm saying they say it's science. I used to ask this all the time. Somebody would say, okay, he's limited.

He's got a minute's restriction, 25 minutes tonight. and I'd say, are you sure? Why not 24 and a half? How'd you come up with that? Yeah, exactly. And they'll always say, I read it the other day from one of the NBA coaches said, you know, we've got all this data. Really, I want to see it.

Because I'm not aware of studies on NBA players that tell you that they can't play in back-to-backs or that there's more threat of injury there. Of course, they can show you through a workload that guys are more. fatigued, okay? But I always thought, and this goes back to college coaching, hell it goes to growing up watching my dad's high school and college teams play. Like one of the things you do as a coach is, you know, you're sort of trained to recognize signs of fatigue. And I always thought the biggest coaching challenge was to manage that fine line between work and rest. Like you've got to do enough. It was great on hard knocks last year. Right. Dan Campbell at one point was talking to

his team and said, look, I don't want to be hitting every day, but I feel like we've got to hit some to have you ready for the demands of the game. And wherever you draw that line as a coach and everybody draws it different, that's a huge challenge as a coach because it's easy to say we're never going to hit great but then my question would be can you block and tackle yeah you know can you do that well at it maybe you can i'm not a football guy i don't know but in basketball it's the same thing okay if we never do anything live you know is our screening our cutting our timing is our execution going to be good enough and you've got to try to balance that and i felt like for probably 20 years or So we at least my experience 20 years in a league going back to the mid 90s everybody tried to balance those things and we all came down in different places

but nobody would have said I don't think we should ever practice you know and nobody thought we should practice four hours a day in season you know but you drew the line different places now the performance guys are drawing the line for you they've been given outsize power in order organizations and they just decide like we shouldn't be practicing like with no like there's no studies on my desk like I'd like to see one you know yeah it's I don't know so it's been your side yeah it'll tell you what it's a sore subject with me and the big problem with the load management is if this is working yeah okay minutes restrictions guys sitting out back to backs not practicing as much, then my only question is, why are injuries going up? Right. Why are injuries going up?

If this is the way, and it's crazy, 30 teams are buying into this. Nobody's questioning. Nobody's saying, you know what? Maybe we've got this wrong. Maybe the problem isn't fatigue. Maybe the problem is we're not conditioning our guys sufficiently to meet the demands of this sport. Stan, you're spitting, man. He's spitting.

Hey. I know what that means. Yeah, he does. Along these lines, I've heard you mention this a few times. So tell Chris, tell our listeners why they should be reading Mindset by Carol Dweck. Yeah, I mean, listen, first of all, you should read it if you're a parent, a teacher, a coach, a scout leader, anybody that deals. with young people. It actually applies pretty well to adults also. But it's just a really great thing. The gist of it is this, and I apologize to Dr. Dweck right now for simplifying her lifelong studies down to this.

But it's really about a mindset of you either have a fixed mindset, which is basically I got a D.I. that test I'm stupid or you have a growth mindset where you got a D on that test and said what did I do wrong in preparing for that test what do I need to do differently the next time and when I met with her I read the book three times and then my wife and I went out to Stanford and met with her also fit in a little trip to a wine country but you know we met with her at Stanford and I remember asking her I said like I know I can be hard on players.

What percentage of what I'm saying to them should be positive and what should be criticism? And she said to me, you're asking the wrong question. It's not how much you praise or criticize. It's what you praise and what you criticize. And this really stuck with me because she said if you tell somebody and she's done, she started this as an educational psychologist with little. kids and the study was this. You know, you would give them the real simple puzzles. You remember when you were a little kid, you'd have the puzzle with like only four pieces in it. You know,

they're big pieces and you would put it together. Well, if they get that right, here's what they found. If you tell that kid, wow, that was great. You're so smart. Okay. When the kid eventually hits a puzzle that they can't do, they will tend to quit on it early because What you have told them they're really smart doesn't add up to what's going on with the puzzle they're on. And so now they think, no, I'm not smart. But if another kid does that same four-piece puzzle and you said, wow, you really worked hard on that. That was great. I like that.

Now as they go on and you're praising their work. And when they get into tough times, what their self-esteem is, based on what their confidence is based on is their work ethic and she would tell me like if I told you know a shooter if I just said out man you're a great shooter sounds like I'm really building up this guy's confidence but now he goes through a seven-game stretch and he's like three for 31 from three and his self-esteem is based on his confidence is based on making shots he's like, oh, what I should be doing, she said is you, you know, you see a guy taking shots after practice. Hey, man, I see all your work. That work's going to pay off for you. You're a worker.

So now, three for 31 just means I got more work to do. She did a study. She was working for one of the baseball teams in the Bay Area. She wouldn't tell me which one. There's only two. The A's or the Giants. But she was doing some work trying to help them identify their minor league prospects who would have the best chance of moving up. And the question she thought was the most telling is she would ask guys why. Now, she's lurking with low A level players. So if you go through that, not many of those guys actually ever make it to the major leagues. And that's why they were trying to identify the ones who might. And so she would ask them, why will you make it to the major leagues. And to simplify, if the guy said,

I've been the best player at every level, I'll definitely make it. She said, now what's that guy do when he hits the inevitable slump in baseball and, you know, goes one for 29 over a week at the plate? Where does he do? His thought is, I've always been the best. The ones that had a chance, you know, in her studies were the ones that said, hey, look, I've been through problems before. I've been through slumps. You just keep working. You watch your film. You get, you know, you get your working in the cage and you get through it. Those people had a chance. And so that's the difference in, in mindsets between, I hit a slump and I say, oh my God, I'm one for 29. I suck. I'm not going to make it to

I'm one for 29. Hey, just got to keep plugging away, working at this. get it better, I've got a chance. That's the growth mindset. So that was a long answer. No, but it resonates. It was a long answer and a simplified answer to a very smart woman who if she heard this would say, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. But I did the best I could.

No, you did better than LeBron when they asked him what was in that book that one time with the press conference. So last question for you, Stan, let you go, man. You've been very gracious with your time. You were with Zion. He played 61 games for you. you've praised this guy pretty heavily. What's it going to take for him?

Right now he's talking about, I won't be back till I feel like me. If you were still with him, what is that about? And how's that process look for Zion Williamson as a young player? Yeah, I really don't know. I mean, we were really lucky that year, I think, you know, that he was able to,

and that was a short year, so he played 61 of the 72, and his injuries that year, tellingly too were he kept getting his hands hit. So all of his injuries were here on his, on his hands, his thumbs. Like he didn't have soft tissue injuries. He didn't have leg injuries, any of that stuff. And I don't, I mean, a lot of it's luck. I get that. But I do know when I got the job, Chris, I called Coach Sheshefsky at Duke because I had Zion and I had Brandon Ingram. And for that matter, I had Jalil Okafor at that time also.

We didn't end up bringing him into the season. And so I just called to talk about the guys. And I remember him saying to me about Zion, he said, Stan, the best way to get Zion in shape and get him ready is he needs to play. You need needs to scrimmage in practice. He needs to play in games. He needs to play. He said, I didn't think the minutes restrictions.

his rookie year were good for him. He said, there's just some guys. They love to play. They want to play. They don't want to be on the treadmill or, you know, running underwater or on an exercise bike. They want to play. And my experience with Zion is he absolutely loves to play basketball.

And I never remember a time where we were playing, where he was complaining about. playing in practice, competing in practice. I don't remember that time. So I know that's not the way to go now. But look, I think it's, you know, it's on Zion. I mean, look, he's got to figure it out. But it's also on the organization. Again, I said this before to all these performance guys, okay, you've got your approach with Zion. He's played, you know, 114 games in four years, 61 of a lot. them in one year. Whatever you're doing, it's not working. Like, that doesn't mean what you're doing is wrong.

Sometimes you can be doing everything right, and it still doesn't work out. I understand that. But what it should at least force you to do is say, well, this hasn't worked. We've got to give serious thought to, is there a better approach? Yeah. And I'm not sure that's taking place there. Well, I know Coach Kay's advice was probably music to your ears. No minutes restrictions.

Let's get this guy on the court. Coach Van Gundy, appreciate you. Thanks for coming on and spending time with us. We hope you come back again. Love listening to you on TNT, man. And watching you, coach was awesome. So thanks for stopping by. Yeah, thanks for having me on, guys.

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These shades have been rated five stars by over 200,000 people. Let's talk about football a little bit. That's right. There's a couple headlines. There are a number of headlines. there's one player who used to be a teammate of someone in here

requested a trade from a city in the NFL. Devin White. Devin White. Linebacker for the bucks. Yes, I did play with him. I'm not too surprised, no. And I think I was reading a little bit about this today. I'm curious to see how much of this is just posturing

because he just got his fifth year of his contract picked up. I think he's making around $12 million this year on his fifth year. You know, of his rookie deal. and I'll be honest with you, man. The bucks are not going to be good. No, no shit. Right.

They've got problems at quarterback. They were in Cap Hell, you know, earlier in this off season before they restructured a lot of different dudes. They let go some of their veteran players, created some cap space. What I think this is, I mean, I don't think the Bucks are going to trade him. I'll be very surprised if they do.

I think I saw some today that they kind of went out publicly and said they're not going to trade him. Right. But Devin White is a good young player. He's really athletic. very explosive. He got criticized a little bit last year by Warren Sapp down in Tampa for like his effort. Yeah, exactly. Monday game against the Ravens.

Yeah, good memory Chris. Nice. A lot of. But yeah, I don't think he's going to end up being traded. I think what he's trying to do is just, you know, posture for, you know, a bigger contract in the future, but it'll be interesting to see how it unfolds. I also think he could be looking at the Roquan Smith situation and be like, hey, I'm going to go the Roquan route. Yeah. guys aren't going to pay me right now, then trade me somewhere where they'll pay me and value me. And, you know, like, I don't know if he's looking at that blueprint and saying the same thing

could happen to me. Now, I'm not saying he's Roquan Smith, but he's a damn good player. Yeah, I mean, I think that's actually a pretty good contract comparison for him if he has another good year. He had a pretty good year last year, honestly. We'll see, man. I don't think anything will really come from it, but that could be some famous last words. I guess what I'm really saying is I think he'll play for the box next season but that doesn't sound real exciting playing for the bucks next season no they're going to be you have a poster of Caleb Williams in your locker eventually he's coming so like I look at Buffalo you know they just lost Tremaine Edmonds he's in Chicago now they need to fill that void they love

linebackers the Eagles need linebacker the Eagles and that's the thing like they haven't because they're whites on the move like you lost your guy you know jay Edwards. DJ Edwards, Wisconsin guy. You gain the Kobe Dean. Listen, like, they popped in my head thinking about this because, like, it looks like they've pivoted a little bit to

emphasize that level of defense a little bit more. And I don't know what Desai, you know, if he's like, listen, you need to go get me some dogs in the second level there of the defense. But I look at the commanders and even the Giants, man. You know, like, I don't know what their cap situations

like, especially with everything they have to juggle. I know there is a giant headline. There's a Giants headline. Sequan is not signing his franchise tender and so he is not reporting to camp when it starts here in a couple days. Making, are you nervous?

No. No. I don't think you would be. No. I just, I don't know what the, I think we just might have seen the ceiling for this group of New York Giants. I think you might need to allocate resources elsewhere. You don't pay running backs

in this NFL, yeah? Geez, that's a Betty Ford take. A-Chane. A-Chane, Texas A-N-M. Their backs in the draft. All right? There are a lot of backs in the draft. Good being with you, Sequan.

I really think this guy's special. I love you, like I know, like I know some people want to devalue the running back position. Some people want to, you know, some people have, I don't know what it is about Sequan. He's polarizing to people, but I'm in the camp that thinks he's special. He's totally special. He's also 26. I don't blame them. This is the,

you got paid me now. And this is it. And like if I'm Sequin, they, they handed me the ball 300 fucking times last year. Yeah. Okay, like,

that never happens. We're going to do that again. I need some long-term security. And he has the leverage because ownership last year, over the course of last year was like, hey, we have not set the table well for Daniel Jones.

Like that's guilty as charged. Well, what do you do? You give Jones the bag. And so, What are you going to do now? You're going to pull his best playmaker out from under him and expect to see the returns on this investment? Like, Sequin has leverage here, man.

And I do think he's going about the right way, including going to the player-led workouts as recently as last week. So I think he's a great guy. I think he's just being a businessman. This could drag out a little bit. He's just trying to extend his offseason a little bit. He's not ready for OTAs. Yeah. Yeah, right.

That guy's probably ready for OTA year-round. I don't think there's ever a time that he gets soft physically. Like, you know, like I used to get, in February, I used to be like, damn, I look like a fucking suburban dad. Actually, in July, still. But, you know, I don't think Sequin's ever out of shape. No. No. One year tag would be $10.09 million.

Yeah. And we've seen that hit to a color, other couple running backs this season. But I feel like there's a few running backs in the NFL that are worth a, taking a chance and given that kind of Todd Gurley money to and Seqwan would be franchise tag sucks right I mean this guy deserves the bag like he you know like he deserves a lot of money he's that good and you're talking about a guy who's given probably whatever's in the reserve tank of a running back I mean he's given north of 50 of it probably just in this and part of that is the reason why you don't want to pay running backs I understand that but if the tag

went away it just forced teams hands to do the right thing and pay these guys guys. The tag just sucks, man. Tony Pollard and Josh Jacobs are on the tag. And so those three would be the eighth highest paid running backs in the league. Yeah. Sequin, probably the best. Yeah, for sure.

Some NFL rumors now. Trey Lance was rumored that he might be on the Trey Block. Yeah, not interested. No offense to Trey Lance. He might end up being really good, but just like going off of what I know, it's not like he's

emerged from some like bombed post-Caldwell era Detroit situation where it's like who could succeed here. Like, you know, the fans that think they could throw for five yards in an NFL game, they might be able to do that in San Francisco. And so, you know, like if San Francisco is saying, you know, even the act of putting that out there decreases your leverage, because you're saying you barely have an answer this year. You have Sam Darnold and you have, by the way, Jordan Palmer said,

and this is spicy, that he thinks that Sam Darnal has as big a chance to win a Super Bowl as any quarterback in the NFL. I think that's hyperbole at best. But I see where he's coming from in that he plays in the NFC. He said this. There's a big delta between the teams. You can name seven great quarterbacks in the AFC.

Only one of them is going to come out there. So just being like on one of the best teams, great defense, great weapons. and playing in the NFC, if you can get something out of Sam Darnold that you haven't yet, and I hate doing this, because it just perpetuates

these first round quarterbacks getting chance after chance. But, you know, I do see, I do see something that interests me there if you don't have another choice, but the fact of the matter is you have given up, you've spilled the beans on Trey Lance already, like through what you've done and not done with him,

and now you're talking about trade. him. I don't know that anybody should send capital for Trey Lance. Does it work in his favor, though, that he only has 102 career passing attempts? And it also says something, dude. You know, it's like... I like my quarterbacks to throw.

Teams love, you know, talented players with skills that have upside, though. They always think that the grass is greener, you know, especially like if players have these physical traits and check those boxes, every front office, Because every GM is like, we can, we can make him our guy. I understand. You know what I'm saying? They love that.

They always, it's always a grass is greener thing. If we get him, we can make something out of him. The egos are out of control upstairs. Yeah. They think they can fix anybody. Exactly. That's why you see a lot of those first round talents with guys that have great physical tools, get chance after chance.

But it's not like a situation again where it's like, well, Matt Patricia couldn't fix this guy. I can fix him. Right. You know, it's Kyle Shanahan didn't think he was good enough to give us, meaningful snaps. That's such a quarterback-friendly scheme. You have such a good run game.

Very well coach. Great defense. You know what I mean? I think that goes back to the time. Tough sell. Take a little bit. Yeah. It's a tough sell.

I agree with you though, Chris. Yeah. Some more quarterback rumors. Aaron Rogers. We heard a ton about him, you know, early March when he was on Pat McAfee and talking about how the Green Bay Packers

weren't playing nice with the Jets. Now we haven't really heard anything the last month. It's been a little dark on Aaron Rogers. Holy shit. fucking like zero dark 30 here. We called zero dark 60 because he's owed $60 million September 1st by the Packers. It's, I forget what the term.

It's like a roster bonus or something like that. It's a giant fucking roster bonus or whatever it is. But usually that stuff is paid out in March or closer to March. I think this is really good by the Packers set this up. It does give them leverage if you think about it because if I'm the Jets, we've talked about the short-term rental of Aaron Rogers and how nerve-wracking that is.

Like, okay, I'm going to pay this guy. And we talked to Steve Kahn the other day. He's like, hey, if you're trying to win a Super Bowl, fuck it. Like, who cares? Bring the guy in for one year. Like, and you worry about it later. If you win a Super Bowl,

nobody's going to criticize you. But this is a short runway for him to get on the same page with him. You saw last year what it was like when there were reports that he wasn't working with his receiving core. Like those guys and him didn't get tight until August. So, you know, from the Jets standpoint, we can act, you know, like, hey, the Jets have some leverage because if the Packers don't trade Aaron Rogers to the Jets, who's it going to be? But on the other side of things, do the Jets really want to sit there until August?

And, you know, like they're going to make this big investment in a quarterback, possibly another one, and you're not going to see him until the last week of training camp? I mean, there's positions that you can have a certain amount of uncertainty. Because that $60 million is coming. They're not going to pay that. Right. So they will trade him. That FedEx is coming.

Yeah. No, I was just saying, like, obviously there's positions where you can have uncertainty in this point of the year. But there's only, like, that clock is ticking, man. Exactly what you just said. Like, I think the Jets are like, it's, they need to figure this shit out pretty soon.

Yeah. And that also begs the question, like, if this thing's going to last a while, is there anybody that wants to join the dance for Aaron Rogers. Like, you know, Trey Lance is going to be playing it for the Jets in a couple of months here. Or does it make, you know, that three,

does it make New York a team that could trade that up to that number three pick with Arizona? Would they be, you know, getting in the mix there? I suppose it's interesting because we've got 13 right now. A bunch of teams trying to move up to three, that sort of thing. I just, if you move up to three, you got to love Anthony Richardson. Okay, if I'm a GM, if I'm Joe Douglas, okay, here, let me put my GM hat on.

Will Levis eats mayo. Like, I'm good on that. He puts mayo in his coffee. He looks like Mr. Olympia. I don't know if I'm going to draft him. He's eating rotten bananas. Yeah. For TikTok likes.

Now, this whole thing gets flipped on his head if Stroud doesn't go to, like if Houston and there were reports that Houston's not going to go with a quarterback. Screen. Yeah, it could be a smoke screen. Probably is. I think he goes love, Stroud, and then at three, the question is, like, who are people trading up to get? I don't see somebody moving from 16 to 3 to grab Will Levis.

You move up to grab an alien at 3. Like somebody who thinks generationally talented. However, the Jets are in win now mode, you know? And, like, does Anthony Richardson or somebody like that fit the bill? I think it's Aaron Rogers or bus for them. I really do, unless Lamar Jackson falls out of the sky. I was going to ask, because you posited this a couple weeks ago, since it's been a month, you know, working with the Packers,

and Joe Douglas said it wouldn't be in good faith for them to go after Lamar Jackson. Since it seems like the Packers and the Jets are not talking, does that, you know, does that good faith kind of go out the window because it's been so long? Like, would 13 be okay to lose for Lamar? Would 13 be okay to lose? for Lamar. Like the pick, you know, they get up.

I don't know. If you don't make this trade, you're going to have to go do something. Maybe sit back, have a hooker fall on your lap. Five. Hendon Hooker, quarterback, Tennessee. You know, a little. Only 10 I see. I don't know.

I see a couple others. D.T.R. UCLA. Jake Hainer, Fresno State. Stanford Steve's guy. Yeah. You can get a great quarterback in later rounds. Yeah. I just don't know.

And like, Jets got to do some. They got to do some and it's got to be Rogers. Speaking of doing something, Detroit trades, former number three. Jeff Okuda to the lane of Falcons for number five. I feel for this. You would think number five. Yeah. It's a fifth round.

I feel for these guys for Okuda on a level. And I also feel happy for him too because number one, he's had to deal with a lot of injuries since he's been a league. He's playing in Detroit. Okay. So incomplete grade. As a guy who played on bad teams, early hydrant, like incomplete. Now, I will say this.

Last year when they switched defenses, they went from man to zone. Like they were playing a bunch of man, and then they switched to zone. And he was playing really well early in the season. He's more of a man guy. He started really hot. Yeah.

And sometimes people were like, what happened to him? I'm like, well, the scheme changed. And, you know, he's just trying to get his feet under him. So I think for Atlanta, this is a nice little pickup. And you know, you pair him with AJ Terrell. Same draft. You'd probably go grab another corner. But like this is a good pickup for them.

And for the lions, they had to do this. So you have to pay them next year. They're going to do that. So, you know, the only thing for me is if you go down and play in Atlanta, you better be ready to tackle. People are going to be running the fucking ball at those guys. And they added Jesse Bates in the secondaries. So they're along with Colais Campbell right in the middle.

Yeah. So they've been going after their defense because that's been an issue of the last couple of years anyway. Yeah. No, I think, hey, I hope Okuda plays great there. Oh, last thing, the cream sickles. Oh, yeah. Or not.

The Tampa Bay Bucks did one of these videos where it looks like they were going to reveal a uniform. And then you remembered like 15 seconds in as you were really hopeful that they were going to announce that they're going back to the cream sick. They're not doing that at all because two years ago they changed to like concrete colored uniforms and those are kind of mid super yeah they relevant they're kind of honey dick in the the cream sickles they honey dick in them.

They honey dick in them. Well that's everyone's like oh my god they're going back to the cream sickles. Nah, psych just going to be the old mascot which is cool. It's like a soft launch maybe for the cream schools. They're trying to they're trying to ease their way into it. This is a code break, in my opinion. You don't pump fake people like this. For sure.

Total tease. I hear there is a uniform change coming. There's a team. The Panthers, I hear it was rumored that they were going to take the silver out. I think it would be a mistake. But they do need some updating. There's a little itty-bitty shoulder numbers. Uh-huh.

They do need a refresh. All right, Bo. I know you had some... Oh, yeah, Chris. I'm here in the studio. We got a Miller Light draft segment for you. light draft segment. The NFL drafts coming up.

Have y'all been keeping up with the potential prospects? Did the results of the combine change your mind? Who are you pulling for to join your team? Where will our top picks go? It's anybody's guess. And we've seen some wild selections over the years. But there's one selection that every football fan can share. And that's an ice cold Miller light.

The game's definitely changed over the years. But Miller Light is still the perfect beer for draft time, game time, and any time in between. And don't forget, Miller Light is a proud sponsor of teams like the Packers, the Vikings, the Ravens. I'll be celebrating these draft picks as I watch them cross the stage and embark on this great journey. There's a lot to celebrate, but I'll continue celebrating being able to watch these guys play for years to come with an ice cold Miller light on my lap in my most comfortable chair. The work is just beginning, gentlemen, but not for me. Miller Light knows that beer lovers want their light beer to taste like beer. That's why they brew a light beer that's

light on calories, not taste. Because what's the point of having a beer if you can't taste it? So kickoff comes around again. Enjoy the beer that tastes like the season. Miller Light. Great taste, 96 calories. To get Miller Light delivered right to your door, visit millerlight.com slash greenlight. Or you can pick up some Miller light pretty much anywhere they sell beer. It's Miller time. Celebrate responsibly. Miller Brewing Company, Milwaukee, Wisconsin, 96 calories and 3.2 carbs per 12 ounces. You know, I want to talk about some of the interior defensive linemen, the detackles and the nose guards. Upcoming, coming up in the draft, want to start with some of the locks for day one.

You know, the big one that everyone's talking about this offseason because he's a great player, Jalen Carter, you know, a bit of a polarizing guy, Chris and Macon. he is incredibly talented. He's got all the physical abilities. Those kind of aren't in question. It's the off the field stuff. Detroit, that could be a fun place for Jalen Carter. Yeah, I got a couple good cons from here.

I think the Cardinals could be a good fit for him. I saw some news that he visited the Raiders today on one of those top 30 visits. The bears are in desperate need of some front seven help, and I think they're going to more of a four-three scheme. Those could be some good fits for him. And then he's also been linked to the Eagles who have D-line connection former teammate of his Jordan Davis. I think there's a little smoke and mirrors in play here.

Jalen Carter's agent said he's not even to take any top 30 visits with teams that are outside of a top 10 pick. So it'll be interesting to see how that unfolds. I think regardless it's kind of universally accepted that he'll be gone day one just because of how talented he is. He can play all over the, you know, all over the defensive line. He can win a lot of matchups. He's a freak athlete.

despite, you know, coming into his pro day, overweight and out of shape. I think also you have to chalk that up a little bit to, like, anybody who's going through something like that is not going to be at the top of their game. Right. And I don't mean to say going through something like that as if, like, you know, he inherited that mess and didn't actually, like, have something to do with it by just being there and doing that the drag racing or whatever they were doing, which, of course, resulted in a tragedy. But that's a lot to wear.

And then all the fucking chatter about what a bad guy he was and, like, you know, the McShay stuff, and then that news, like, I'll give him a pass on this pro day. Yeah, I mean, it's tough. I mean, you know I'm a hater, especially with guys that are highly touted coming out of college. You're not hating this guy. I'm not hating him. I mean, I think the talent is definitely there. Kind of goes back to what I was saying earlier about Trey Lance.

Like, teams are always willing to take a waiver on guys that are exceptional, and I think this is pretty much where that, you know, where he falls. So Brian Brazi, Brazi. Brzee. I'm not super hot on him, Frank. I think that if he wants to be successful in the NFL, he needs to develop as a pure pass rusher. I think he, you know, the NFL is all about winning one-on-ones, winning your matchups in college at Clemson. A lot of blitzes, a lot of stunts. A lot of his production is sacks came off of pick games and things of that nature.

Yeah, you see him as a looper kind of cleaning up sacks, a couple different coverage sacks. I think he is a great athlete. His testing numbers of the combine are really good. He's, you know, six, five, 300 pounds. He's a former top recruit in the 2020 class, huge hands. We ran a 48640, a 171, 10 yard, you know, like a 30-inch vertical. I just think that he really needs to develop, you know, his rush plan, his rushes, gets more moves in the bank, so he's not just, you know,

when you're kind of the big guy, you know, the big name on your team and your defensive coordinator has got your back set you up with these pitch stuff. You're scheming people up. You're beating inferior athletes. Right. That's not going to happen in the NFL. The guards in the ACC are not the guards. No, and I was watching a lot of his tape.

I know from experience. Some of the O-Line play was not great. So I'm not as hot on him as many others are. I think some, you know, I kind of wouldn't be surprised to see him fall, but a lot of people, a lot of pundits love him. I'm not sure. Yeah, not, I mean, not your boy B.A. But maybe the Falcons, he had a top 30 visit to the Eagles all,

So interesting to see where he lands. I could see him fall into the end of day one, maybe even, I don't know, day two. But a guy that I really like who is kind of getting hot at the right time. Actually, Megan, I wanted to loop you in here. You're not as hot on Brazi either, are you? No, no, no, no, I'm not. No, I'm not.

I don't like the cut of his jib. Got it. Doesn't really have a lot to do with any film study. I like it. What is cut of his jib mean? It's all, you know, you know what he looks like, I think. Yeah. Um, anyway, a guy that I really like is Colisia cancy.

Love him, dude. Love him as a lot. Hold on. Are y'all are gonna say Aaron Donald on some shit, but he's six foot two 80. How does that work? Who in a Ford? What do you mean? Aaron Donald are some shit, dude.

He went to pit. Here's the thing about pit guys. They always work out on some level. They got that dog in them. They had their dogs. He's field. They're used to the facility. Give me this guy.

Yeah. You know, he at least shows me something in the rush game. Super twitchy. He's active. Really active, really good at kind of, you know, splitting that slide when you're a three technique, you take an inside move on a guard maybe because the guard oversets you knowing that the center is going to slide over to you. He's so good at.

Well, you know who else is good at that? Ad. Adonnell. Exactly. And that's a very, very easy comp to make just from the, you know, the testing numbers. The fact they both went to Pitt. Pittsburgh's D-line coach is a guy that I'm very fond of by the name of Charlie

Partridge. He's my D-Line coach in Wisconsin. My first three years there. He's a really great coach, great guy. Anyway, I'm really, really high on Kansy. I think he'll go on the first half of the first round. Is he the best one? I like him the most. He's the most fun to watch. I also think there's something to be said for just making plays. Playmakers make plays, man. And it's a fucking simple statement, but it's true. Guys who are accustomed to getting sacks and TFLs, that usually translates, case in point, Aaron Donald, the best that ever done did it. So some landing spots I like for him I think he would really, really be successful

in like a wide nine Jim Schwartz type defense that we played. Yep, exactly. So Cleveland, I like Texans, Damico Ryan's, you know, new head coach, they run a, you know, a gap penetrating scheme that we saw in San Francisco, very, very productive for defensive linemen, you know, maybe the Seahawks. So he's one to follow.

Like the Michigan. Mazzie Smith. Now we're talking. Big body. Ozzie Smith. Like the Mazzie Smith. Yeah. great name some fun names in this crew yeah Michigan big body kind of inconsistent on tape at

times kind of reminds you of Dantari Poe coming out he didn't test running numbers at the at the combine his you know when you read a noseguard stats it says 48 tackles two and a half tFL's 0.5 sacks kind of tells you he's an early down guy yeah but he can be a little inconsistent on time on on tape just like Dantari poe coming out of Memphis but I like him big body he's actually pretty he moves really well for you know his size at 6 3 323 I'll like him I'm a noseguard I like this dude I think he's a noseguard he translates well as a zero tech you know kind of coming out of vogue a little bit in the NFL but yeah there's not a lot you know out there right I think they're going to hold their value Tomlinson uh Dexter Lawrence or some good comps for him you know I think

he will go on day two if I had to guess maybe even a little bit later just because he's a nose guard, but I thought some good fits for him scheme-wise. Maybe the Vikings who need a nose like that, the Cowboys, and then maybe the Chiefs of the Raiders. So we'll see how that one unfolds. And then I want to talk about a couple under the radar guys. I want to give a shout out to Keanu Benton,

who's another Wisconsin Badger. We all know I love Wisconsin Badgers here, but I actually trained with Keanu. We also went to Janesville Craig, home of Susie Allen, my mother. she might be the best athlete in Jamesville Craig history but Keanu was a wrestler really good wrestler and that often translates well to interior defensive line. This feels like a legacy segment. No, Keanu's actually coming on at the right time though. He had a really good

you know kind of senior senior bowl had some really nice one-on-one wins tested really well at the combine and and stuff like that. He's kind of getting hot at the right time. You know how like guys pick up steam you know before the day? draft and I think he's I think he'll be you know a day two pick he needs to work on his consistency kind of like you know Mazzi smith he'll disappear a little bit on tape get a little stuck I think he's probably a better two-eye guy or you know like a shade than a three tech I think he needs to continue to work on that a little bit but he has the ability to win one-on-ones he's fucking strong he's got long arms too so we'll see I think you know some of

these teams that run a lot of three four and four three like maybe I don't know the Steelers would value a guy like that or you know all these defensive that defenses defensive coroners that come from the Belichick you know New England scheme value a guy like that and then some other guys that be interesting to keep an eye on Gervon Dexter from Florida he's raw very talented uh interested to see him um Jacqueline roy from LSU jacqueline ah Shiv sister yeah uh he's got to big motor. He plays hard. He's pretty explosive. He was not

a starter at LSU, but I think he's got a lot of upside. I kind of want to watch where teams value him in the draft. Then Gerard Clark started as a tight end at Coastal Carolina. Another guy that's raw too, and seems like these raw, talented

physical defensive linemen that they feel like they can develop into whatever, you know, whatever need they might have. So those are a couple guys. I'm going to continue to fall as well. More excited about them than, you know, some of these first round picks who get, you know,

sucked off all the time. Yeah. Let's see how this unfold. There's no, what's the word there? Resetment. Yeah. In that statement. Deep-seated, buried issues.

Uh-huh. There, you know, for maybe like a highly-touted guy. The thing about first-round picks is they actually are expected to do things, which is a totally different game. It's nice to just be a seventh-round pick that no one expects anything from, you know? So you can just fly under the rider and that everyone's happy. and even make the roster. You know, like, it's great.

Holy shit. He's got to put his cleats on and he strapped his helmet up. If you're in Arizona, Colorado, Indiana, Louisiana, Michigan, New Jersey, New York, Tennessee, or right here in Virginia, and you haven't tried the WinBed app yet, I have great news for you. Sign up today to receive special offers and take advantage of great promos for the big game and the upcoming college basketball tournament. Don't miss out on the fun. Download the Winbet app today.

Terms and conditions apply. Must be 21 or older and present in a state where win bet is available. Gambling problem in Arizona, call 1-800 next step. In Colorado, Indiana, New Jersey, and Virginia, call 1-800 gambler. And at Michigan, 1-800-2707-1-17. Tennessee, y'all too, 1-800-9-9. Good news. The Thursday show we do with AMP will continue 430.

Every Thursday, the Greenlight Team, Cowboy Reeves. facts, Kingston, I'll pop through there sometimes. On AMP, you can interact with us really easily. There's a call-in button. We invite call-ins all the time. You can talk directly to us, ask us questions, ask us our favorite music. We might even play some. There's also a live chat during the show.

If you have a question about a topic we're talking about, fired off in the chat, we'll answer. We're going to be doing what we've been doing all fall every Thursday at 430 on amp. Check us out. So Makin, we were talking last night, and we were lamenting the fact that we don't have as much fun on this show. We're getting along great. Yeah. But I do that. I said, what did I ask you?

Do you remember? No. I said, did we grow up? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's why you got to bring me on here. Zigzag and three sixes of Zinn smooth in my upper lip talking about, here's what I have in my notes. A man breaks his dick, shortest living dog. Did we grow up?

Yeah. We used to do like trivia, you know? That's how we had, that's how we got living in a small town world. That's true. We used to do a lot of, uh, we'll finish with a round of trivia today, five, five questions. Okay. We used to bring snakes in and touch them or not touch them. We could still do that.

I touched a snake in the wild the other day. No big deal. How to feel? Out of the field doing MLS. Um, it was actually okay. I was really proud of myself. Nice. And I went back in for more.

You touch it on an accident? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, very much so. Okay. But I was in a drain. I was trying to clear a drain of magnolia leaves. They can really stop up a drain. And then a little black snake, like, didn't want any part of me either.

I went down the drain. But he went off my fingers. Then I went to another drain. There was a little tree frog there. Oh. Yeah. Which one felt better? Actually, I was more freaked out, creeped out by the frog than the snake.

I love frogs. I can hold a frog. Oh, really? Five, six frogs. Let him crawl all over me, hop all over me. Let me ask you this. You hold, you let, you let, you let nine or ten frogs be on you? Yeah.

Oh, yeah. Ask me an animal. I'll tell you if I'd hold it. Oh, okay. Horse. A baby horse? No, full grown. Couldn't pick it up.

Okay. Now, my level of concern around a horse is kind of high. I will not walk behind a horse. Yeah, it can. Or hers. By the way, I was thinking about this. I have a fantasy football punishment that actually will work. Okay.

The guy has to drive a hearse for like months. Ooh. Really? No, like I have like an actual like, I got a thing about horses. Yeah, me too. So you better win the league. It would be really bad.

You can get them for cheap. No, I have no doubt about that. I see a hearse, I look away. And it's not like a superstitious thing. Yeah. Yeah. What's too long? Memento Mori.

Huh? What happened to Memento Mori? Yeah, it used to be all this like, embrace death. Now you're all like... No, that's just remember. Remember everything must die. I think if you do that punishment,

you have to make sure that the driver whoever loses has to bring as much to do as much to bring as much attention to themselves as they're driving their hearse. Windows down, radio blasting. Disagree, cowboy. It's all in the hearse. You got to wear a tux every day, just like the hearse driver.

I like a solemn hearse driver. Hello, young family. You have three kids looking for a house. No problem. Pile into my hearse. You're not going to lose. You're not going to lose. Probably going to be Conrath again.

I got to punish it. What? Here's what you have to do if you lose your fantasy football league. You got to contact your local university. See if they have an agricultural department that will grow you a massive pumpkin. Float down your nearest river. No, dude. I'm not going to lose.

I'm going to do that anyways. And we're not getting the pumpkin from the university. We're getting the pumpkin from a pumpkin farmer who I've had to beat out Glenn Yonkin, various turns in the road here to get on the list. Shout out Luke the farmer. I just can't wrap my head over the pumpkin thing. Like, are you going to attack the world's largest jacklantern record after that? No, no, no, no.

Just floating. One record. He really likes rivers. That's a big part of it. So anyways, so we're going to have more fun. I don't want to do this at all, but we used to taste things. Yeah, we used to taste things. Bloc.

Now, wait a minute. I had a lot of fun scrolling back through. old shows last night to try to find out where our fun was. Yeah. We had one episode titled Coronavirus Day 17. We just need the next global pandemic to come back. Yeah. Like nowhere else to be, but here.

Yeah. You know? A global pandemic sounds fun. Remember we negotiated that that fiberglass screen between us? Yeah, we did. Yeah. Yeah, you would come in. You were like, are you being serious?

And I was like, yeah, I think so. We actually had a fiberglass screen. screen between us and we were podcasts. Yep. Yep. That was fucking certifiably in thing. I don't know about that. And then it was like a week or a couple weeks after using it and we saw the sign on it said not

medically used for coronavirus. Yeah, sure. I felt like an animal at the zoo. And speaking of animals, we've got the world's shortest dog, Pearl. It's a dollar-sized diva who loves dressing up. We've got some pictures of Pearl and some

cute, you know, cute sweaters and vests and stuff. What's Pearl's roster height listed at? Okay, three, I lost my notes this morning, but 3.59 inches, dude. I think they measure like, Chris is very familiar with 3.59 inches. That's good. We're a fun pod. So anyways, uh, the dog is tiny, obviously. Oh, wow. It's the shortest living dog. Okay, not the shortest dog ever. That was a dwarf terrier, uh, in the 19, It was like two and a half inches tall, which I don't even know how that's possible. I can't wrap my head around this shit.

This dog's aunt, Miracle Millie, was the former shortest dog. Passed away in 2020, I believe. And this dog was, you know, like four inches tall.

3.8. Yeah. So here's what I want to do. I want to meet this dog. Like, I want to meet this dog first. I want to meet this dog on Zoom. I want to get the dog on the show.

Here's what I want to do. It's more of a, YouTube thing because it wouldn't translate as well to audio, but I'd like the owner to hold up various items next to the dog because I really just want to get an idea of the scale. And then I want to go do like our version of the pivot with this dog. You know, like four of us go down there and we just chop it up with the dog. Get the dog and the pumpkin with you. No, I'd be so afraid to lose that dog.

You could actually lose that dog. You know how you lose a dog and the dog runs away? You could lose that dog like you lose a cell phone, dude. Put it on a little wallet chain, you know. Think about 3.59 inches. You know, Bo alluded to this a little earlier, but here's a good subway. A man was hospitalized after breaking his penis

during world's most dangerous sex position. Which is the reverse cowgirl. Really? Yeah. That's the most dangerous position? It counts for 50% of penile fractures. That makes sense. It does?

Mm-hmm. There's a lot of weight on it. The gyrating. Coach Van Gundy, if you happen to be listening to this, I would like to apologize on behalf of everyone here. Coach Van Gundy, what happens after a peanut fracture is something they call eggplant ballast. And you want to know why?

Yeah, I guess. Why they call it that? Probably because your dick blows up like a cauliflower ear. Turns purple. Oh, God. Yeah. So if you're listening at home and you have sex, maybe be careful in that position.

According to TikTok, and this was all reported on TikTok. Oh, sounds... Oh, very... Responsible for a whopping 50% of penis fractures. I'm reading... Yeah, that's what I said. And then I'm reading... I'm reading in the New York Post via TikTok.

Couldn't get a stronger source chain than that. Got it went straight to lab Bible. Look, they have an X-ray, an MRI. Things went south when the main... heard a loud cracking sound and then Hold on a minute play. Followed by pain and discomfort and immediate loss of erection. Enormous?

Oh. It's part of the phone is broke. A lot of the pieces in underneath. Your taint. I'm like, goddamn. Bro, he's got that eggplant. Bo is broken the chair. This chair is crumbling.

One chair, two breaks. What else you got read? We wanted to finish with trivia. Oh, yeah. Let's do it. All right. I got five questions. First one to shout out the.

correct answer. Actually, I'll go to one of you in sequence so that we're not all shouting over each other and if they don't get it, it'll go to the next person. Okay. Makin, you're up first. What was the name of the Red Hot Chili Peppers album? Oh, he's fun. On which under the bridge appeared. He's fucked. California Cation. Incorrect, Bo. I've literally just saw them in concert last week and they played the song. Blood sugar, sex magic. That's correct, Chris. Did I say a, you did. You got their very next album in fact. Oh, love it. Okay. Not an embarrassing. can answer at all. Nice. All right. So Chris has one. Bo. This one starts with you. As long as about heroin. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. What would you think it was about?

Californication? No, under the bridge. Oh. I guess that makes sense. Yeah. All right, Bo. Movie question. What movie did Martin Scorsese win Best Picture for? Oh my God. Three seconds to the part of it. The part of it is correct. Nice, Bo. Chris. That guy who does his fucking job. History. You must be the other guy.

Tough one. The Napoleonic Wars were between these two countries. Well, obviously, France. That is one of them. And I'm going to go with Spain. Incorrect. Macon, you can steal. What was the question?

Which two countries fought in the Napoleonic Wars? Well, surely you have France. I got there. And Germany. Nope, Bo, you can steal it Can't tell you, bad time Napoleonic Wars were France versus who If you've ever

I won't give you a hint They would get upset England Bo, Bo with the points Yeah Suh All right, Macon 30 ACT

I have a feeling you'll get this one She wrote Frankenstein Mary Shelley Macon on the board All right, Bo if you get this right You win Oh, fuck.

Oh, it's not two five, yeah. What is it called when a golfer shoots a two on a par five? Albatross. Fuck, man. Bo's the winner. He's the smartest. So stats and research went back and looked at it. Spain was a combatant in the Napoleonic Wars.

So Chris and Bo actually tied at the top. We'll have to continue this battle wits next week. Y'all have a great weekend. Thank you.