Habits and Hustle - Episode 190: DeVon Franklin – Producer, Author, Motivational Speaker, and CEO of Franklin Entertainment

Episode Date: October 25, 2022

Pre-order Jen’s New Book: Bigger, Better, Bolder today: https://amzn.to/3hvtqYp DeVon Franklin is a Producer, Author, Motivational Speaker, and CEO of Franklin Entertainment. From his speaking in his church at a young age to pursue his dreams in Hollywood, to his time as an intern working under Will Smith, moving on to produce films grossing hundreds of millions, and starting his own company to produce films with Oprah, Keegan Michael Key, and more, DeVon Franklin does it all and does it well. And talk about charisma! This conversation flies by as Jen and DeVon cover all that, relationship advice, writing, acting, and more! DeVon is a beacon of kindness and joy in a world that insists on hammering home that you have to be selfish to be successful. Don’t miss it! Youtube Link to This Episode DeVon’s Website – https://devonfranklin.com/ DeVon’s Instagram – https://www.instagram.com/devonfranklin/ ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ Did you learn something from tuning in today? Please pay it forward and write us a 5-star review on Apple Podcasts. 📧If you have feedback for the show, please email [e-mail]  📙Get yourself a copy of Jennifer Cohen’s newest book from Habit Nest, Badass Body Goals Journal. ℹ️Habits & Hustle Website 📚Habit Nest Website 📱Follow Jennifer – Instagram – Facebook – Twitter – Jennifer’s Website Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Vitamin Water Zero Sugar just dropped in all new taste with zero holding back on flavor. You can be your all-feeling. I'll play and all self-care you. Grab the all-new taste today. Vitamin Water Zero Sugar. Nourish every you. Vitamin Water is a registered trademark of glass O. Hi guys, it's Tony Robbins. You're listening to Habitson Hussle, Crescent. Today on Habitson Hussle, we have Devon Franklin. This guy does it all. He is a producer,

he is an author and is a motivational speaker. And lately, he's actually been a relationship expert. Yes, he is a man of many, many talents. He is best known for the film's miracle from heaven and heaven is for real. He is also a New York Times best-selling author of the book The Weight. We spoke about everything. His beginnings in Hollywood, how we navigated the system, and how he's had like an evolution in his career. He is a really nice guy, and I really enjoyed this conversation. And I'm sure you will too, enjoy. I have Devon Franklin here with me, and I got, we actually did a podcast. This is now, like, this is, we really did an hour pre-recording.

And now we're gonna start again. And I basically killed him on the hit axles. So I apologize. No, it was great. I love it. I mean, I've got to get one. I'm telling you, look, all pumped up. Because I am.

Well, it worked. And I'm not gonna be paid by them. I'm just saying, it's hit axles like a cardio slash strength machine that I'm just telling people if they're not aware of what it would be. It's like nothing anyone's ever tried. I mean, when I've tried a lot of equipment, a lot of things, this is on another level. I know, that's why I even showed it to you. So that's why I knew you'd like it.

I can't wait. I can't wait. Okay, so I was also saying before we started, like I don't even know what to describe you as. You're a New York Times bestseller, bestselling author, you're a producer, you're a spiritual, what would you call it? Influencer or I don't know what the word is. You're like a jack of all trades.

Do you have like any,, what is the one thing that you're kind of, in your opinion, that you kind of like lean really into right now? Is that more of the writing? Is it more the speaking? Like, what's your thing right now? You know, that's a great question and I don't have a good answer.

Oh, okay, well, thank you. Thank you. Because, you know, it hasn't been focusing on one, you know, for me, it's really about trying to utilize all the gifts that I have, you know, in a positive way. And so within a day, you know, sometimes I'm wearing the speaker hat, sometimes I'm wearing the producer hat, sometimes I'm wearing the talent hat, it just depends on what's going on. So I try not to choose one as a focus.

I try to say, okay, where am I the most useful? Where am I supposed to be? Oh, I need to produce this movie. Oh, I need to produce this show. Oh, I need to go here to speak. I need to do this. So I just try to, you know, state organic about it and really just allow my feeling of like,

oh, this is what I'm supposed to do right now. Because what I've tried to in the past like, pick a lane, so to speak, for me, it just doesn't work. You know what's so interesting about that? Well, because most people can't even figure out one thing to do. They don't know what one of their passions are, right? And I feel that you were, you were fortunate enough to have all these things that you're obviously good at and that you like to do.

And then also having these opportunities to kind of do them all. you're fortunate enough to have all these things that you're obviously good at and that you like to do. And then also having these opportunities to kind of do them all. So I guess the first thing I should ask you is like, how did it all, what was like your evolution, like your origin story, where did you start? And like, let's go from there and how you kind of evolved into being this like, jack of all trades and also successful in all of them, right?

Oh, also I should say, he's also known as a dating expert, which is another thing I forgot to put in his bio, which when I like Google Jew, that was all that came out. Oh my goodness, Lord have mercy. Yeah. Well, you know, I mean, going back, you know, I'm from Oakland, California, from Northern California, I'm the middle child of three boys,

and my mother, you know, raised us after my father passed away when I was nine years old. He died of a heart attack when he was only 36 years old. Yeah, so that's 36. 36, yes. That's one of the reasons why I'm very committed to fitness and trying to eat right so that whatever is in my genetics, I don't allow a bad diet or not oh, you know, not working out to, you know,

get the best of me. So, was he very unhealthy? He was alcoholic pretty much, you know, most of his adult life, which is not the reason why you have a heart attack at 36. There were some other issues going on. He smoked and all that. But I think there were some hereditary things,

you know, going on with his heart that he never really spoke about. Right. And by the time he was 36, he had had, I think the fatal heart attack was his third one. Yeah. Well, how old was he when he had his first heart attack? I want to say he may have been, he was in his early 30s, you know, like I think around 31, 32 around there.

Do you have any idea of the history before, like his father, his father, like the mother or? Not about their heart, only about that, you know, his parents were alcoholics as well. So did you ever, is there a way to check to see what kind of, well, when you see a cardiologist now, what did they say to you? Do you have that?

This everything looks good. You know what I mean? I just got recently, you know, that we did the whole EKG. We did the scan. I went through the two, got everything checked out. There was no blockages, nothing, you know, or heart monitor for three days. Everything looked good.

So, you know. But you're gonna be on top of that. Got to be on top of it. Wow. Sorry, it didn't mean to interrupt you. No, no, that's crazy. It's crazy. Yes, very, very young.

And so for me, growing up, that was always something that was top of mind. But coming out of that, you know, losing my father at nine years old, the two things that really made an impact were going to church and watching movies and TV shows. It was like entertainment and church became my therapy. In terms of, you know, how to really navigate what I was dealing with.

And so, as I got older, I started to have a passion for Hollywood. And at the same time, I was involved heavily in the ministry that I grew up in. And so, I was telling everybody, I'm gonna go to Hollywood to make movies, and people were like, you can't do that, you're from the church, and Hollywood is against the church.

And you can't be a person of faith, and hold onto your faith, and I said, well, I don't believe that. You know, I'm going to go and see what's meant for me. And so I went to USC, majored in business, minored in film. And I got rejected from the USC film school as a major, an undergrad major. So that's what led me to take on a business major. And as a result, I had a little more time on my hand.

So that freshman year, I got an internship working for the company that men is Will Smith and J. to Pinkett Smith and P. Diddy. Is that the overwork? What's his, what's his, his company's called, well, the company was called Overbrook. But before it was overbrook, it was a company called Handprint Entertainment and Benny Medina and James

Lasseter and Peter Golden and Jack Pollock were all the principles of that company. So I started as an intern when I was 18 years old and that was basically just learning the business and then as I got my feet wet, I really started working a lot with Benny Medina. When I was in the office, I was like the third assistant and just got a chance to learn entertainment

like front row and center. And that, I was like, this is it. This is what I'm supposed to do. You know, I was so passionate about it. And then Overbrook started my junior and senior year. And I when became their first intern. And then when I graduated, I became an assistant working for James Lasseter, who at the time was Will Smith's producing partner and manager.

And so that was kind of like my start in the business. And then I left there. It's a good start. It's a great start. Yeah. You know, to have those legends, you know, in my foundation from a professional standpoint, it's just amazing. And you know, just the mentorship and the help and guidance that Will has given me over, you know, the 25 years that I've known him is just unbelievable.

Wow. So basically, so people don't know, like gain these jobs, by the way, like as an assistant to these, in these, you know, these talent agencies or management companies, it's like a coveted job. Yeah. Like they're hard to get. Yeah. They pay you like terrible money, but like you kind of, you kind of practice and gain your whatever they say your chops or whatever. Definitely. That's how you get your opportunities. So did you, do you have a business degree from USC then? I do.

I have a business degree with an emphasis on entrepreneurship and a minor in film. That's amazing. And so, but for me, it wasn't just about getting the intellectual, it was about getting the practical. Of course. So that's why my whole four years, I combined the internship, the practical

with the educational experience. So I had the intellectual, My goal was to have both, because a lot of people may get the intellectual, but if you don't have the practical, you're not going to get the job. It's not going to work. It means nothing. Exactly.

For me, learning the business and starting to meet the right people and understand how it all works, I was incredibly fortunate to be able to do that starting at 18. And so the foundation, my career has always rested on that internship and then being the assistant for two years. And that lot of people look at how you wouldn't think, oh, it's glamorous, it wasn't glamorous at all.

I know, talk about what you did. I want people to understand what you did as an assistant, because I think this is, these are fascinating. I was that also for like five minutes. I didn't last very long, but I was at three arts. I didn't want to say. Oh, three arts, yes, yes.

Or like literally two minutes. Oh my goodness. Yes, like the rolling of the calls and all that kind of nonsense. Oh yeah, so yes, that's right. The assistant is, you know, rolling the calls, doing the schedule, you know, filing, running errands when need be, you know,

facilitating travel arrangements for, you know, for my boss. Anything that my boss needed, if there was someone going on at the house, have to make sure that that was being taken care of. If there was family coming in and they needed help, that was my job reading scripts, making sure that he had what he needed on a day-to-day basis.

Here's your to-do list. Do you have Jennifer Lopez at that point, Ben? Well, so when I started interning for Benny, my freshman in sophomore year, right when I was leaving to go to Overbrook, he took on Jennifer. Oh, okay. Because at that time, Puffy and Jennifer were dating.

Right. And so that's how, you know, from my recollection, that's how Jennifer got into Benny's life and Benny got into Jennifer's life, and then they've been together, you know, pretty much ever since. Right, they broke up, I think, for like a little minute, you know, but you know how to go. Of course, and then they've been together, you know, pretty much ever since. And so, I think for like a little minute, you know, but you know how to go.

Of course, then they're back together. They're incredible. Who was his big one? Was it Mariah? No, he didn't have Mariah Carey. No, his big one was Babyface. Babyface was his big one? Benny MacDee.

No, yes. Yes, before Puffy and before J.Lo. He had Babyface when Babyface did the day album. And that album got like 13 Grammy nominations. Yeah, I remember. I had this song every time I closed my eyes. It was just huge. It was massive.

Yeah, I thought there was a girl that he had also. He had Michelle and DeGiocello before he had Babyface. But Babyface was really, and there was a season like around what's the Mariah's songs? He had a baby face, but baby face was really, and there was a season like, you know, around what's the Mariah's song. It's a whole man. If you think you're lonely now, it'll come back to me. Are you a singer also?

No, I can't say. I can't say. I can't say. We belong together. Oh, we belong together. So around that album, Benny managed her, but that was, you know, just for a season. For a small period. Just for a small period.

So when the time when I was there, it was Michelle and Deo Chelo, babyface, will, on some level, he helped out with Will, he did P. Diddy and then Jennifer Lopez. And then there were a bunch of other talent at the time. Okay, so does he still have, is it just JLo now? You can't have time for anybody else. I think it's only, yeah. Yeah, I think they have a-

I think they're gonna be able to split your time between JLo and, you know, whoever. So then what happened to Babyface? Did he just like leave or what happened to him? You know what, at the time, you know, I can't remember. I'm just curious, this is not- I can't remember exactly what happened, you know, it's like, you know, I mean, he's less,

Babyface is still around and he and a LMA just did a new song. That's the number one added song at R&B radio. It is. Oh, yeah. So baby, they still live and doing the same. He's still alive and huge. Yeah. I mean, babyface is one of the biggest songwriters in the world.

In the world. I know. I mean, I was just curious what happened to that relationship between babyface and what like, I want the like, what, when you call it the T or the, oh, that I don't know. I want the, like, what would you call it, tea or the ice cream? Oh, that I don't know. I don't know. Okay, fine.

So you don't know that. We'll have to, you know, get Benny on the hook. Yeah, I was gonna say, I have to, exactly. I have to, like, I gotta make a note of that. Thank you. Yeah, he would be a great interview, by the way. I would love, I would love to get on. If he would do it, he would be incredible.

I think he would be, so if anyone, if, well, maybe you could hook me up Tim. I would, Benny. Yeah. If you still talk, you still talk to him? We text occasionally and I saw him. I saw him a couple times last year. And then I saw him like briefly earlier this year.

OK. And I'm, listen, he is just, I mean, to be able to learn from a legend like that who knows this business inside and out, you know, I can't tell you, you know, how great it was. I mean, because when I was an assistant, I was driving him around. Yeah. You know, I would drive him to meetings, drive him to the studio, drive him to award shows.

Were you able to go into the meeting and listen in on all the, oh my goodness, without a doubt. I mean, while he was on the phone, I was listening. Of course. And like, listening, picking up, understanding how it works, understanding what went into this business, how to be successful, how to navigate talent, how to deal with deals, all of that.

I learned while driving him around. And so when did you, so when you went to Overbrook, like why did you move? Is it just because the opportunity came up? Yes, because see, primarily when I first started interning, it was focused mostly on music because the music business portion of that company was so big and vibrant.

What I was really passionate about was music was great, but I really wanted to learn film. So at the time when Overbrook started, they got a film deal with universal pictures. And so James Lasseter and Will Smith broke off and started Overbrook Entertainment with that deal with Universal, and then I went over there as their first intern because I really wanted to understand

more about the film side of the business, the film development side of the business. So how did you get your first movie deal? Like again, there are people who move here all day, all night from everywhere in the world to have like an opportunity. So how did you even get that? Because after I was an assistant for two years,

I actually went to go work for Babyface and Tracy Evans in their film department as a development executive. I did that for two years, and then I in their film department as a development executive. I did that for two years, and then I went to MGM as a studio executive. I worked on B Cool and Beauty Shop, and then I left there because MGM got sold to Sony, along with a couple other equity investors, back in 2005.

And so I was able to transition to Sony, slash Columbia Pictures, and became an executive there. And so I worked on everything from the pursuit of happiness, seven pounds, pink Panther to 21, jumping the broom, a karate kid, re-make, you know, heaven is for real. I worked on a lot of films and so- As an executive- As an executive at the studio.

At the studio, right. Very different. Very different. So I'd always had a desire to run my own company. Right. And so after Heaven is For Real came out, this was a faith-based film that I oversaw and shepherded within the studio. We made it for $14 million, opening weekend, and made about $30 million.

And then it went on to make $100 million worldwide. Was it called? It was called Heaven is For Real. Oh, Heaven is For Real. That was a big one. Yeah, it was huge. It's massive. And so I ended up, you know, you say, okay, you know, the time the chairman of the studio wanted me to, you know,

they wanted to promote me and all that kind of stuff. I said, no, no, I want my own company. And that was Amy Pascal, who, you know, is like a legendary producer of Spider-Man now, you know. And so she was like, what, you want your own company? She says, yeah, I want my own company. I want to run my own company. I want you to give me a deal.

And she said, okay, all right, we'll do it. But you can't negotiate with anyone else. And I said, okay, that's cool. As long as the deal is with you. You asked for what you wanted. That's right, that's right. That's exactly what I wanted. Because I'm like, I'm at this point in time,

I'm making a lot of movies for the studio that's making them a lot of money. I'm like, hey, this is cool, but I got to invest in myself. You know, I got to see, you know, over time, if I have the ability to do what I've done for them for me. And so she was in her, I guess, savviness and understanding and catching my vision. She said, yeah, no problem. So that's how I got my deal. They gave me a deal.

And the first movie that I did for Sony was Miracles from Heaven, sorry, Jennifer Garner and Queen Latifa, and Johanio Derbeis, who's, you know, they're all amazing. And then I did a movie called The Star, which was an animated film that had Stephen Jung and Oprah Winfrey and Tyler Perry's voices among so many other great talent. And then I moved my deal from Sony to Fox. Why?

Because it was a better opportunity, you know, at the time, you know. What was the opportunity? I want to Fox. Why? And because it was a better opportunity, you know, at the time, you know. What was the opportunity? I want to know. The opportunity for me in running this business, you know, I'm, I'm obsessive. Okay. Right. I'm like, yo, I want to make, you know, let's make two a year. Good for you. Let's go. Like, yes, you know, like people need hope, people need inspiration, people need, and they're looked to entertainment. People look to entertainment. Whether whether we like it or not. Entertainment plays a very valuable cultural force,

cultural impact by people looking to entertainment for help, for guidance, to know what to wear, to know what to be, to know what to say. All of these things, getting whether it's good or bad, it's still as influential. You know, entertainment is one of those powerful mediums in the world. And so for me, I'm like, look, I want to go.

I want to make more. And so the opportunity to go to Fox was the promise of being able to do more. And that is what was happening. I was able to get a film made there with a Chrissy Metz called Breakthrough. That's, there was a song that Diane Warren wrote for the movie. It ended up getting an Oscar nomination.

And then right when all that was happening, Fox got sold to Disney. And so Disney, yeah, so Disney, you know, basically took over Fox. And so I had to go find a new deal. So he lost your deal. I did. And so I ended up in Paramount,

which is where I've been for the past couple of years. And how's that going? It's going good, you know. I got a lot of friends of Paramount and they're having a great moment with the success of Top Gun and getting ready to sit down with them. Oh, that movie is like every week, it's like unbelievable. I know, I know, it's just the timing of it.

The timing was, I mean, unbelievable. That movie is crushing, like I've never seen it. I know, and it's a great film and, you know, it is cool to like it. Everyone involved including Tom, you know, just was amazing. Keep coming back. You got plenty of space. Oof, not how you would have done that.

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Vitamin water is a registered trademark of glass O. So you still have your deal, so what's what I mean, what kind of deal is it? Do you have like a minimum do you? How does it work when you have like a development deal? Like I kind of understand, but most people work. So how does it? Yeah, so on that. So I have a film deal with Paramount Pictures and I have a television deal with CBS Studios. And so the way that that works is that Paramount Pictures basically funds the overhead of my company on the film side. In exchange, I give them a first look at any material that I want to develop. And do you have like certain, like, so did you have a certain budget,

you have to kind of stay with or is it whatever you have to have to get it? I mean, you mean in terms of budget for them films or budget in terms of overhead? Everything. Do they say you have X amount of dollars? Yes, they give you a finite amount of money for your overhead and you can kind of, you know, divvy it up how you see fit for the most part. Right, right, right. And then on the budgets for your films, it just depends on what that particular film is and what level appetite they have to make it. So with the first look, if they say no, I don't want to do it.

I can take it everywhere. You can take it everywhere else. Yes. And so, so your TV deal is, so would you have any TV things happening? Yeah, I just did a, I have a series on the air with BT and BT Plus called Kingdom Business, which is very much like Empire, the series that was on Foss. I love that, yeah, but this show, my show is set in the world of the gospel music industry. So it's really great and Kirk Franklin and Dr. Holly Carter are involved. Is it doing well?

It's doing great. We literally just opened up the writers room for season two, and now all that is moving forward. BET loves the show. BET plus loves the show. It's been a big hit for them. That's amazing. Yeah, that's great.

And then I produced a pilot for CBS this past season, which was a reboot of early edition, which was a show that was on about 20 years ago. Oh my god, you're doing so much stuff. Just on that stuff alone. Yeah, yeah. So you're busy. Oh, yeah. Yeah, you're like, what are you doing? So much stuff. Just on that stuff alone. Yeah, yeah. So you're busy. Oh, yeah.

Yeah, you're like, you're just like, I thought you were doing the hit axle with me and doing some work at a table. Showing the shoot about NAD. I didn't know what you're doing, okay. I get it. Okay, so you're still working actively in that world of Hollywood and producing.

Oh, yeah, I just did a film. I just produced a movie called Flamin'Hot, which is about Richard Montenez, who was the driving force behind Flamin' Hot Cheetos. He was a Mexican janitor who worked for Frito Le, came up with the idea to put Chili Powder on a Cheeto and market it to his community in Southern California. And next thing you know, it takes off and become what we know now is Flamin' Hot Cheetos, a billion dollar brand. Yeah. And so Evil and Gory just directed the film. We're doing it with Searchlight, Disney and Hulu. That'll be out sometime next year. So then, okay, so then, how much time do you have to like a lot to that and then also do

these other things? Like, what is- It's a blender, it's a smoothie, it's a professional smoothie. Yeah. Just put it all in, you mix it up, and you do it. And just, yeah, exactly. It's all you can do, right? That's it.

That's all you can do. So, like's it. That's all you can do. So, like, do you have a staff of people, like having producers, having creatives, like how big is the, like you're off the fair? You know, about six people. You know, I have a couple of folks in the film division, a couple of folks in TV, a couple of folks in digital, and then, you know, my own assistant.

So, you know, I have about six, and then I have a manager who really helps, you know, navigate all the talents out of my life. And- Oh, so you do acting too? I do. I do. and then I have a manager who really helps navigate all the talent side of my life. Oh, so you do acting too? I do. I do.

Sorry, Jay. Go. You asked me to question this answer. I'm so excited. I mean, this is like just do model too. Like I feel like you do. I have a model, Jay. I have a model, Jay.

You should get like a crest or a co-gate deal. Listen, you're the queen of branding. So you might be able to actually with that smile. I'm surprised, it was approached you yet, really? Not yet, not yet. With that smile, you've never been approached with all these like, you know, toothpaste companies. No?

No? No, no, maybe after this, it'll change all of that. I think so, I think we have to talk about that because that's a whole other revenue stream that you haven't tapped into yet. Yes, I have not at all. So I'm very old we have to talk about that because that's a whole other revenue stream that you have it tapped into. Yes, I have not at all. So I'm very old. We've got to talk about that. Okay. So, okay, you got TV, you got the Hollywood producing stuff. Wow, that's crazy. So, what else?

So, you're doing these movies, you start doing these movies, and you got this deal with this, with at the time it was Sony and then the other Fox. So, then how did you kind of morph into all these other things? Like how did you become a dating expert from being a Hollywood guy? Right. Or how did you become a spiritual guy or a speaker? Right, okay.

You're still only in that one area, right? Right, so we'll go back in the story and kind of articulate some parallel pads that were happening around the same time. Yes, because there's like so much with you. Who knew? Who knew, right? That's why we're here.

Tori, you should have told me this. You know? Go ahead. Okay. So when I was 15, the church I grew up in in Oakland, was run by my uncle, who was my pastor, Dr. DJ Williams. And so he started a church and he's

Oakland called Wings of Love, Maranatha Ministries. And that was our family church. And so at 15, they had me give my first sermon for this youth day. And so, 15. 15, yeah. Mm-hmm. Okay.

And so I was, you know, I was a huge follower of Les Brown. Yeah, I love Les Brown. He's amazing. He's just a legend and a guru and unbelievable. And his book, I think it was called, Live Your Dreams, was out around that time. And so for the first sermon,

I really probably relied more on that book than I did on the Bible to create my sermon. How old are you, by the way? I'm 44. Okay, could you please a life, lots of stuff. I know, like, a lot going on, a lot of time. Right, right, right, right, right, right, right, right. So much, okay.

So I started preaching at 15. Okay. And then people are like, oh my goodness, you need to go into ministry. You're like, you have the gift. I said, no, I'm being called to Hollywood. But even though I didn't think I was supposed to preach as my goodness, you need to go into ministry. You're like, you have the gift. I said, no, I'm being called to Hollywood, but even though I didn't think I was supposed to preach as my profession, I still started doing it.

So fast forward to when I took the assistant job working for James Lasseter, we'll submit for our producing partner manager. That same year, my uncle said, hey, Devon, I'm getting older. Can you come up to Oakland once a month to preach for me at Wings of Love? And so first I didn't want to do it, but I was like, you know, hey, Devon, I'm getting older. Can you come up to Oakland once a month to preach for me a wings of love?

And so at first I didn't want to do it, but I was like, you know, okay, because my uncle had been such a, and has been in still a very influential force in my life. Right. And so I started going up to Oakland once a month to preach. So lo and behold, I don't remember how it happened, but the folks at Overbrook started to find out,

like, oh, wait a minute, so you preach. And I'm like, yeah, and they're like, what? So we started like doing a time, at that time, we would do Bible studies during lunch. And people would come to me for advice, they would come to me for spiritual counsel, they would come to me for prayer. So that was just all organic.

And then when I got to MGM, the Hollywood reporter did an article on black Hollywood. And they featured me in their article talking about I was a young black executive, but what made me unique is not only was I an executive, but I also preached. And they talked about me going up to Oakland once a month. And they also talked about me observing the Sabbath because as even as a Christian, you know, I was raised observing the Sabbath. So fight a nice sundown. I said, yeah, I don't work because it's Sabbath. It's a day

of rest. That's what the word says. So you're like, do you wish like me? Who knew? It's Shabbat. Shabbat Shalom. Shabbat Shalom. You're gonna follow, you're gonna do the whole thing. I don't understand.

Yeah, I mean, Friday night growing up, we would bring in the Sabbath together as a family and then go to church Sabbath morning. And then after church we would have our dinner. Do you drive? Yeah, we would drive. We didn't practice like orthodox. We weren't practicing.

Anyway, no, no, no. It was just taking the principle of rest and not going to school dances and not watching movies and not watching regular TV. There was a lot of restrictions growing up. And so even now I've still observed this habit. All throughout my whole Hollywood career, I've observed this habit.

And so that was also something that people were like, what? Yeah. Because I told them when I took the Sabbath, throughout my whole Hollywood career, I've observed the Sabbath. And so that was also something that people were like, what, like, yeah, you know, because I told them when I took the internship, if it requires me to work on the Sabbath, I'm not gonna take it. And they were like, okay, wow. Were they confused? They were, but they just said,

all right, we're gonna leave them alone. And what are they gonna say? What are they gonna say? Right, right, so, and then when I got the job at Sony and did all that, you know, worked at MGM, I was always observing the Sabbath. And so what I didn't know is I was communicating that my spirituality was important to me. And it's verbally, I was just saying, hey, this is my, this is my boundary.

And if the job doesn't work for the boundary, cool, I'm not going to compromise the boundary for the job. And so when I go back to me preaching at Oakland, you know, as that started to get out there and as, you know, the information about Sabbath, all of that was put into the MGM article. And so then people started calling me and saying, oh, wow, you're doing this is that unique, how are you and Hollywood and still holding on to your faith

and all this kind of stuff. So it just started a lot of conversation. Did they think you were Jewish? You're like half Jewish? No, I knew I was Christian, but they just didn't know. It's like, wait, you're black, you're Christian, you're a Christian, you're a Sabbath.

What Jewish? How do those words, you know, they? That's what I feel right now with you. You're dating, wait, you're black, you're Christian, you're 17th. How do those words, you know what they say? That's how I feel right now with you. You're dating a girl, you're a whole different girl. You're also a writer, what are you? No, I know, I'm just me, I'm just me, you're literally just me. You're literally just me.

You're literally just me. It's moving, right, you know what I mean? So many grievous, it's just- It's graceful, it's moving, there you go. So true, even back then, so I'm not the only one who said this to you. No, you're not. You're not. I get it every day of my life.

Holy holy. So long story short, talking about that parallel. Yeah. So when I got to Sony, and I was there, I got there in 2005, so it would have been, I think around 2008, 2008, 2008, I believe. Okay. I got approached by a book agent and they said, hey, you know, you're your faith and you're you know, Roland Hollywood, you might want to consider writing a book and if you ever

did, I could help you out. So about a year later, I was in Beijing working on the karate kid remake and I just had this idea, oh wow, this is how my first book is going to be about you have to compromise your faith to be successful because I haven't compromised my faith and I'm here working at this studio and I'm in Beijing, China. Yeah, how are you doing that? Because weren't you like working on working at this studio and I'm in Beijing, China. Yeah, how are you doing that? Because weren't you like working on the weekend on Saturday and Friday at in Beijing?

Like you were just like, sorry, I'm not out. Yeah, literally. Literally, we were in my book, Produced by Faith, which is the first book. Yeah. The opening scene is me being in this Houtong, which was an old Chinese neighborhood.

And we were on the camera. Yeah, but that's what it's called. It's called a houton. And so we were there in Jackie Chan and Jayden and Will and Jayda and you know, I mean there were thousands of people in that particular village that came out for the shoot. And you know, I'm there as a studio executive, you know, working on the movie. And Sun started to go down and I said, I'll see you out tomorrow when Sun goes up. When Sun goes down on Saturday night. You know, and so I left.

And so I write about it and produced by faith and then what was so funny is the next day, I went out to go spend some time in the Olympic Village and one of the producers saw me and they were like, wait, wait, can you be out? I'm like, yes, I can be out. They're like, okay, because if you lose faith, there's no hope for any of us.

That's exactly right. Oh my God. I was like, no, no, I'm not losing faith. Just getting some fresh here. That's amazing. So you really are that restrictive about it, that, too. It's not just like when it's convenient, basically. No, no, I really try to really even now,

get to the essence of rest. And even now turn off my social media. I'll turn off my email for that Saturday day. So Friday night, sundown, a Saturday night, sundown. You know, I just really try to repress, renew, read, just plug that into me. So what are you doing? I'm reading, spending time with the family,

sometimes going to church, watching videos on YouTube. Also, right? And not yet. I'll write, you know, so I do all those things. But the point I'm getting at is all of that was what led me to write the first book. So when I got the idea, I called the book agent and my book agent at the time and said,

hey, I have this idea. She was like, great, let's go sell it. We went and sold it to Simon and Schuster. But then I had to go to my bosses because I was an executive, I was a vice president of production for Columbia Pictures at the time. And I said to them, hey, is it okay if I write this book?

And they were like, you wanna do what? I said, well, I wanna write a book about my faith and they were like, man, well usually people write books when they retire and get fired. Right, I can know myography. And Ryan and I was like, but I'm like, it's not like,

my dad's a bugger now, you know? Right, there you go. And so, but they were like, you know what, because this is who you've been since you got here, we're gonna give you the okay to do it. So they gave me the okay to write my first book and the book did very well and then that led to the second book and that led to the third book. So while I was being an executive and then transitioning into producing, the writing and becoming an author was just a part of it. So

once you're an author, as you know, you are an expert in whatever you just wrote about. Right, yeah, yeah. And then so that's when television started calling. So like the parallel path of like being the executive writing the book, you asked me, okay, well, how did I become a dating advisor or a relationship advisor? Then TV started calling. So I did open-wind for you Super Soul Sunday and I did Dr. Phil and I did Meredith Vieira and did entertainment tonight and co-hosted that and was on Dr. Oz for years. As what, what kind of...

I went on there as a, basically with Dr. Oz, we did a lot of different segments. So some segments, I was a spiritual advisor, other segments, I was a relationship advisor, other segments, I was just a life advisor. And then I'll just depend on, depending on what the segment was. I mean, we did all those different type of segments

over the course of a couple years. Really? Yeah, oh my goodness, yes. Yes. Normally they have a lane for you. Like, when I also did his show a bunch, but it was always in the fitness area. Right.

They didn't call me to do religious hour. Yeah, yeah. I did my lane. With you, they did all these other. Absolutely. We had all these different touch points that were authentic to me that worked for them for segments and stuff.

And so that's how I got into TV. And then that got me into doing more dating shows and going on and doing advice, everything from the Steve Harvey show that I've done advice on. Yeah. The dating advice on the real just did a season of married at first, I mean, not a season,

but an episode of married at first sight this season and the next season. So it was organic, is my point. Wow. So, are you going to get your own talk show? You know what? Listen, I would love that. And we're going to see what God has in plan.

But yeah, I would love to, you know, I mean, the talk space is so different and it has been, but, you know, I just know that given my experience in this business, given the things that I've written, given the access that I have and my point of view, it's something that I'm really excited about. And me and my team have talked about, we're just, you know, trying to get the right time in the right format. So have you explored it at all? Like, have you pitched yourself to them? Like to...

We have not gone out with the Devon Franklin show. Okay. You know, we have been really strategic about, you know, setting in place the right foundation and the right great because once you launch with the Devon Franklin show you can't relaunch it. Right and if you launch and it doesn't sell then the market's like, yeah, we're done. So we have been very very strategic and thoughtful and you know done a lot of meetings with different people around town and you know really just trying to

figure out like what's the best way to ultimately get there. But it's something that's close to my heart, it's something I'm very passionate about. Because it really would allow me to bring together all of these different things that I'm able to do. You know, I mean, not that long ago I sat for King Richard, I sat down with Will Smith and interviewed him. For rare, for, you know, we pushed out to the faith community.

You know, so we did- Where do you do the interview? Like what would you do? We did at the press junket. So right there on the tennis court. So I went there, you know, and got about, you know, 10, 15 minutes with him. And that was great. And then for my film Breakthrough, I brought Steph Curry on board as an executive producer. And he and I did a sit down that we did for Fox Sports. And, and then I did a sit down with Chrissy Metz. And so my point is like, I have all of these great relationships of people that are really like-minded that if I was doing my talk show, I'd be able to bring that knowledge and

that information to everyone because there's so much that people don't realize that goes into the people that they love. Absolutely. And so me being able to connect in that way I think could be great. Have you ever explored doing like a podcast, just like just starting as a podcast? Yes, I've thought about it. I've talked about it.

You know, we have a couple meetings come, I have a couple meetings coming up to discuss it. You know, you know, right? The podcast is a hustle. It's a hustle. It's a hustle. And so. But you have the relationship. So I do, I do, but the only thing that I wonder about with a podcast is, you know, with all the things that I'm doing,

you know, like, okay, is that just another thing to do or is it the thing that's going to help me bring all these things together? And that's where I go back and forth. We are in conversations, you know, about one, and I'm taking some meetings, but I haven't launched full steam ahead, because I've really been trying to be thoughtful about the right talent opportunity for what I have to offer. Yeah, but like someone like you, not to give you business advice, but I'll take you.

I'm gonna give it to you anyway. Anyway, yes. It's like such an easy, so I'm gonna tell you, this is just like a side thing. Funnily enough, this was not called habits and hustles. It was called game changers and I sold a TV show to a major network and then we're going to do a similar thing called game changers.

And I sold it to the network and we're trying to make a pilot and it was like, and you know this, it goes on forever and ever and ever and nothing ever happens and I'm waiting waiting and like we couldn't even agree on who to be the pilot. Like they didn't I wanted this thing. They wanted something else like a nightmare. Right. While this was happening, I'm like, fuck that. I'm not doing that. I'm just going to start it as a podcast and see kind of like, I'm not going to, I'm not gonna put my destiny in someone else's hands. And I'm just gonna like move, you know, and do have action and see what happens. Anyway, long story short, now I have this podcast,

but like not to your level, I'm not comparing it, but what I'm saying is that the amount of opportunities and leverage that I got from doing what I'm doing has just given me so much more Ability to kind of create with more opportunities. So like save now like people now Some of these networks are now coming back at a whole different level right because you did it on your own and you have something that's like Worth something. That's right. You know what I mean? I do so for you I think it would be like such a simple thing to do

to just start doing it on your own terms. And then you can like reverse engineer. That's a good idea. You know, like that's what I would do. And a couple of my friends have done that. And now they're like, they have a huge Spotify deals. You know, like making more money doing that than they were doing something else. Like doing the other entertainment stuff that they were doing, right?

Because the medium, this medium of podcasting, it's super saturated, yes. But if you're the right, if you are, if you're talent already and you are and you have it following and you do, and you have all these relationships, it's like a no brainer. Why would you not do that? And like, you know, you can catapult your all that into a whole different opportunity for yourself. Okay, no, this is good, this is good counsel. That's what I mean, I don't think you gave it for my business. No, I know, I came here for everything God has,

so thank you, I'll take it. No, I just think it's like a no-brainer for you. And you're so well-spoken. Like, what I noticed, like I was saying to you before, when I met with Atorri's birthday or whatever, like, your voice was made for this type of thing. Like, you have a beautiful voice, you're very eloquent, you're articulate,

and you have all the relationships. Like, I'm like, look, I'm like, where is he? Why do you not have a big deal? You know what I mean? I don't get it. Right, right. You know what? Listen, it's one of those things that, you know,

as I, here's what I'll say, everything happens at the right time. Yeah. You know, and for me, you know, as I've gone on just my own journey and personal development and really getting clear on the core essence of who I am and really living in that truth, I think that, you know, if I had to show a few years ago

within the business and back what is now, like me doing it now, like who I am now, what I know now, oh, forget about it. Well, 100%, but you can also figure that out while you're doing something. This is true. This is true. You know, not like you have so much time on your hands. I know you have like 97 projects. You're in another one. I love it. I love it. Let's go. Just keep on like adding to that pile. Yes. But I just think you'd be so good with it. You know, you're welcome. and then do also do motivational speaking.

You know, I do hear in there, you know what I mean, but it's not like a huge, you know. It's not like what you, you know, you don't like travel the whole time. No, no, no, no, no, not at all. It's more this like, you know, one-off, so there you go. So then how did this whole audible book come to be? Like why? And what and how? All the others like I mean, so audible had approached me

a couple years ago. I had done an article from a rea striver. She has a Sunday paper and the article was at the time called the Coalition of Black Women. Okay. And it was about my rea striver. No, no, no, I wrote the article for my rea striver. Okay, okay, got it.

Okay. So when my father died, my mother brought in the help of my grandmother and my grandmother's seven sisters. And so I wrote an article about how they surrounded me and my brothers and helped to really bridge the gap of losing our father. And so they gave us wisdom and knowledge and about everything, from religion to sex to money and all this.

So, Audible said, you know, this article is really good. Would you ever be interested in writing a book about it? And I said, oh, well, let me, yeah, I mean, I hadn't thought about it about it, but it would be open to it. And so, we did a deal to do an audio-only book. And so, the part of the process was me getting a chance to sit down with my mom and five of my living great aunts. So, my aunt Donna, my aunt Nuna, my aunt Sandra,

my aunt Ida, and my aunt Enis. Aunt Nuna is 95, aunt Sandra is 75. So it was a blessing to be able to sit down with them individually and then ask them questions about our history and our story and about the death of my father and their point of view on it. And then when I put the book together, when the listeners hear it, it almost listens

like a movie, because I really brought a storytelling aspect to it, so like my voice will come in, and then one of my aunts will come in, then my mother will come in, and we really just start to talk about how this tragedy of losing my father impacted everyone, and then how that led us to be the family

that we are today. Oh, wow, okay, so when did you release this? Released earlier this year, it was April of what, 22? Oh, okay, so it's very, it's very thin. It's very relatively new, right? Right, right, right. Yep.

And so I wanna ask you though about, because when I, like I said, did all this research and it's all the dating stuff, I have to ask, I did the research on this whole truth about, tell me the truth about man. Oh yeah. So can you tell me the research on this whole truth about, tell me the truth about man. So can you tell me the truth about man? Can you please tell me the truth? I'm a timely guy.

That's much of you want to give me. I mean, I've taken up God knows how much I'm ready, but I want you to give me the good. Yes, the truth about men, I'm actually in the process of developing that as a scripted show. I was going to, why didn't you, that was my next thing, or a movie. I feel like it would be a great movie.

Yeah, well we're gonna do the scripted show first. Yeah. And then we'll see why, why did you choose that? Because that's just what kind of came together, you know, with the writer and the right partners and you know, I can't speak about it yet, because our deals aren't closed, hopefully go close in the next few days.

You'll come back in the next couple of minutes. But I'll come back to, yes. But the truth about men, this idea was birthed out of, you know, all of what was going on with me too. And, you know, for me as a young man, I have always been fascinated with this idea of white and mencheek, you know, and I'll never forget I talk about this in the book

that in growing up, I found this picture of my father and my mother and another family member sitting on a bed. And my mother looked really unhappy. And that family member looked really happy. And so I remember looking at it saying, what is this? What's going on? And so years later, I asked another family member, I said, hey, what happened here? And they told me the truth.

And my father had in a fair with that family member. And that my mother found out about it. And that picture basically, basically captured that. And so I said, wow, so if my dad couldn't be faithful to my mother, what why? And so that question always kind of haunted me. Like, what is going on in us is men that keeps us from being able to keep our commitments and do what we say we're gonna do

and be who we say we're gonna be. And so all of that, and then the Me Too movement really was the catalyst for me to say, okay, as a man, I need to do something. And so that's what was the seed of the truth about men. And the truth about men, what men and women need to know, what that is, is that every man, every man struggles between two things, love and lust. And I call love the master, I call

lust the dog. So for us as men, to be the man we were called to be, we have to put love in control of lust. We have to master the dog within. And that lust can be a lust for money sex power fame women There's a lot of things that we can lust over and so for men if we become what our lust makes us if we become with that dog within makes us We become irresponsible We become Accountable we inflict countless damage not only to you know people that we say we care about, but for generations to come, we become callous, we become selfish. So that lust is selfishness.

That love is selflessness. And when we as men say, I'm going to put selflessness over selfishness, that's when we can become the man we were called to be. But the truth is, that's the struggle going on within every man. I don't care who they are. I don't care where they are. It's the struggle, but nobody wants to talk about it. I mean, also, why only men?

Don't you think women have that? I don't know. Not as, not as, for sure, right? And if I were to do the book, you know, if I were to do another edition, I probably would say the truth about men and women. But one of the women, you know, if I were to do another edition, I probably would say the truth about men and women. But one of the women or. But here's the thing, has a man, even in the dating space, I cannot be a man that writes

a book about what women need to do. No, 100%. That's not what's a good day. Yeah. So, so yes, you're right that women, you're job to do that. But not even on my job, I think that that's been done already. And I think that's the problem. A lot of times in the dating space,

it's so focused towards what women need to do. We as men get off with the free pass. And I'm saying, no, as men, let's do our work. And this is our work. If we as men start to do our work, things would change like that. But we don't sometimes. Okay.

So that's why I wanted to write it from the male point of view. But you're right. Women struggle between love and lust as well. Okay. How about this? Okay. So give me some practical things, right? So that makes, I like the way you describe that.

And I wholeheartedly agree with you, right? I also think it's a personality thing, right? Like, but I do think there's like, there is that conflict. How do, what's the first step though? Like wanting to do something like that wanting to do right doesn't mean that you do right, right? Like someone's, you know, the best intentions were, what's that? The road in hell is paid with it. It was good intentions. It was good intentions, right? So, okay, so I want to do well and I'm a good person,

but like sometimes I just like, I mess up or I I'm not you know, I veer this way, you know, like I can course correct, but does it mean that I'm not doing the mistake in the first place? What how do you, what's your advice or would you tell people step one would be? Acknowledgement. Okay. Acknowledgement. Anything we suppress we empower. So to your point, like if I want to change, not even change, if I want to be the best man I can be, I got to acknowledge that the worst man is in me. That's because I, because if I just say, oh, I want to be a good guy, I want to be a good man, but I don't acknowledge that darkness in me and say, hey, yeah, I want to be a good man, but yo, I got that dog

in me. I got that lust in me too. Yeah. So it starts with acknowledging, right? Okay, it's here. I'm not going to sit up here and act like it doesn't exist. Because if I do that, I'm going to do something that works against who I say I want to be. So the acknowledgement comes the first. The second part is to say, okay, what are my triggers? What have I done in the past where it has triggered me to feed the dog instead of feeding the master within?

Oh, got it, right? You know what triggered me was, okay, you know what? I got lonely. So I called up this girl, I had no intention for her, and then after that I ghosted her. Okay, all right, let's pause there. Does the ghosting align with what you say you're about? No.

Oh, okay, got it, but the key is you got lonely. Okay, let's talk about a better way to handle your loneliness instead of using women as an object of fulfillment in a moment and then discarding them. This is how we as men start to level up by addressing what's going on and taking a moment to identify like, oh, I can do better and I want to do better and here's how I do better by going back and saying, like, oh, I can do better. And I wanna do better. And here's how I do better. By going back and saying, oh, here's where I missed it. Yeah, I was wrong to do that. That wasn't cool.

Yeah, okay. That's how we do it. You acknowledge, you start to look for your triggers. And then you just have to really be, we as men, we need discipline. So we have to use discipline, right? So it's like, all right, just because you can, doesn't mean that you always should.

You know, as a man, just because, you know, I can be in a situation where maybe a woman is, you know, say, hey, let's go do this or do that. If I don't have an intent for her, I'm not, why would I do that? I'm not just gonna do that for sport, because for her, it's some serious for me. It's just, oh, let's, I'm like, no, I'm gonna just gonna do that for sport because for her it's some serious for me. It's just oh, let's I'm like no, I'm gonna use discipline

Because I want that master that loving me even if It's a situation that people say oh, well, it's fine. No If my heart is not there if I have no intent, I'm not gonna do it because it's the man I want to be right I want to master this dog within I want want this dog to not run, ruin, and wreck my life, which it will do if I just recklessly feed it. If I'm constantly giving in to my flesh, constantly giving in to the lust, constantly giving in to the excess,

I'm gonna become what it makes me, and that's less than a man to me. That's so beautiful. See, you're such a well-spoken person. First of all, have you ever heard the Chris Rock thing? You're only as faithful as your options? Yes, I've heard. So I was thinking about that one, you're such a well-spoken person. First of all, have you ever heard the Chris Rock thing? You're only as faithful as your options? Yes, ever. So I was thinking about that what you were saying this. Number one, number two, here you are. You're a guy in Hollywood, right? Good-looking guy, young guy. Are you single married? What you're doing? You're single.

Okay. How are you, how are you taking, are you hard? Are you able to like do that? Like, how are you able to harness a loss? Yes. How? How? What are you doing for do that? Like how are you able to harness a lust? And then how? How? When you're doing for a dip, are you just figuring, so again, acknowledgement triggers. Intention.

And intention. So you're not, so you're not, you don't have to be, well actually, I've bought you a ton of the truth. Like what are you, to be honest, I'm not enough. I need the true Devon, tell me the truth. So is that mean when you meet a girl and then you don't have any intent, if your intention is

maybe a little bit darker or a little bit like, not a little suspect to what her intention is, you will just... If we don't have the same intention, if it's not good for me, if it's not good for her, it's not good for me. You never slip up? No. Because it's about intent. It's like, no, I don't want, like if we do not have the same intent

for what this is going to be, then here's what happens in my experience. Yeah, give me, yeah. If in fact, let's say she, I'm just playing devil's advocate. That's great, but the devil doesn't need advocate. Got plenty of advocate. That's right.

But like in this situation, right? Like for me, it's like, okay, let's say, you know, I want something more casual. She wants something more committed. Okay, if that's where we are, engaging only is gonna lead to a problem. Yeah. But part of that requires just being honest too,

because a lot of times in those early stages, there isn't a lot of honesty. There's a little bit of like, oh, I wanna show you how great I am. And let me put on the character, put on the actor, sell the actor, all of that. But I wouldn't encourage anyone,

male or female, to not allow that period of time to go without asking real questions about who you're dealing with and finding out what their real intent is. And again, does it mean that their intent has to be marriage, right? It could just be like, my intent is to have a good time. Okay, great.

My intent is to have a good time. Great. Let's go have a good time. Wonderful. Right. My intent is to have a good time. Well, my intent is married. Huh.

Let's not do that. Yeah. Because one of us is probably going to get hurt. So to your point, it's just really about being honest. What are you looking for? Okay, cool. You know what? I'm in the same place.

Okay, great. Let's go hang out. Doesn't mean it's gonna work out, doesn't mean it's gonna lead to a relationship, doesn't even mean it's gonna lead to a marriage, but at least in those early stages, we can try to be on the same page. And that's what I say as men. Like, okay, you know what, my intent is to only deal with people as best I can.

That's share the same intent. Because then if I don't, as men, then we become manipulators. We manipulate women, we manipulate situations to get what we want, even if it causes them harm and pain. And I don't believe, listen, in relationships, there is pain associated with it because things don't work out and it's painful. But some of that pain can be avoided if we were just more intentional and we were just honest about our intent and Guess what give a woman The information for her to make the best decisions for her health and her wholeness

I agree with that 100% versus a mean not if I'm a man I don't want to quite be honest with you. Yeah. Yeah Because I'm trying to get you know know, like, no, give her, here's where I am. I'm in a casual moment. I'm in a not serious mood, you know, we may go out tonight, you may not hear from me for a week. That's where I am.

Give her the information. The problem is a lot of times because people, women, want to, they, they're much more, they want to act, we ask, they want to like, they want to, they're much more, they want to act, we ask, they want to be more like easygoing, they'll say, yeah, yeah, I want a casual relationship, but really in their intention is not to be casual, right? So when someone's like pretending, when you know that's not you,

I'm saying when someone knows that's happening, what is a person to do? They can always fall back on the fact that they said they wanted something casual, but knowing that that's not the case, what do you do in that situation? You know, I think it's a little bit of as a man going back to the whole master of the dog. Okay. If I'm choosing to be the master, right, if I'm choosing to let love lead, that requires

me to live on some level sacrificially. Okay, so in that situation, if you sense or I sense, I don't even doubt, you know, she's saying she's cool with it, but I don't feel that. So either we give it a moment and see, you know, if we, you know, give it some time to see what happens, but fundamentally, if we know we can feel, and if it doesn't feel right,

then I would encourage any man, hey, time out, press pause. Maybe this is not the right situation for you. Maybe this is not the right situation for her. Maybe she doesn't want to lose you, so she's going along with your program. But ultimately, as a man, if you really have no intent for her, long term, then maybe this is not the right situation for you. And that's where the sacrifice comes in. Were you always like this just more innately, or did you have to grow to do this yourself? And Laura comes.

I did grow. You were never a dog? No, well no, because... Never? Hold on, I've never been a dog. But it's a dog, kind of like,, I've never been a dog. Right? Was it the dog, kind of like, with a dog bigger than a master? The dog has not been bigger than the master, but the dog is here.

And the dog has always been here, you know, and just even growing up, part of the thing was like growing up in the church, you know, there was so much of a, sometimes a culture of suppression, right? When you have these lustful feelings and you don't know what to do with them, and you know, it's like, well, you know, God says, be holy, okay, but I'm horny, what do you do with that? And so, growing up, there was a lack of information on just how to navigate it.

And that's one of the reasons why I also wrote the truth about men was they say, hey, these feelings are gonna come. So, let's not, you know, act like they're not there. Let's figure out what we do with them. So for me, my journey was, it was like I was never a dog, but that doesn't mean I always had a good intent. You know, and I talk about this in the book

where there were women that I have been dating and again, didn't really have the intent. And what began to happen was I would see how much I would be hurting them because we weren't really aligned in our intent. Now again, it may not work out even when you have the right intent, but I knew in my heart of hearts that I wasn't really for this woman, but I was still dating her, still taking her out because I wanted just to spend out, spend time and have fun and all that

kind of stuff. And so I talk about this in the book that I had to have my own reckoning. And so that kind of came in the form of this dream, where I really felt like almost like a vision from God. And in that dream, I was at the altar and about to say I do to my wife in the dream. And then next thing you know, the minister says, turn around and I turn around and down the altar are all the women that I had dated,

but they were cut open. Slain. Really? Literally all down the aisle. And so basically it was like God was saying, is it worth all of that to get here? Don't play with my daughters. Like if you're not serious, just say I'm not serious.

Let them operate on with the full information about what they wanna do for their life. But don't manipulate. Don't try to just get and then go off to the next situation because these are truly my daughters. So that was a reckoning for me and that started to inform, you know, how I dated, and then also I was married for 10 years. And so being married for 10 years, you know, and being in the in in a marriage, which is great The the that dog was still there, right? But because I had practiced You know putting the master first and leading with love it didn't it didn't Disrupt my marriage, right? Because I was like, oh, got it. I know what this is

You know, I have some practice here, and that's the other thing as men Most of the time when we're dating, we're taught to just go and conquer, conquer the world, sew your oats, all that kind of stuff. And that all has its place, however, when we wanna transition into marriage, if we haven't been practicing some level of fidelity,

some level of monogamy, it's very difficult to just, in a moment, flip a switch and it's like, oh, all of the years I've been living one way now, I'm going to live differently. That's not so much. I think it's more when you're a mayor. It's more like falling out of lust with the person that you love, right? That's where I see the most stuff. Interesting.

Like, it's not so much like, yeah, you get married. It's not like, it's more when you're married and like you get into this routine. And then like, there's no lust anymore. So that dog, I would say you call it, kind of like rears its ugly head more, more and more. That's harder to tame than just like a little, you know, a little maltease. But when the German Shepherd comes out, it's much harder. It is. Or like the Doberman Pincher, like, having to do it. Right, communication.

This is where communication comes in. So why did you and your wife split them? Because of that. Yeah, you slugged in. Nah, that's the next habit's hustle and heartbreak. That's the next podcast. Okay, we'll do that one together. I slipped it in. That's okay. podcast. Okay, we'll do that one together.

I slipped it in. That's okay. You look at me like, what? But no, but we're gonna get to that baby. I don't know, but do you understand what I'm saying? No, there's a difference between the, I understand the messaging of the lust, but how do you tame a bigger dog

when you're having, you're in a situation where you're locked and loaded in a marriage and like that happens. Half is all the time. But if you know what, the key is a number of things acknowledgement. Well, communication, for sure, communication, communication. And this, it's, it sounds so simple, but it's the one of the hardest things to do. To your point, the art, the, the scenario you just laid out, oh, you know, that in marriage, you got the love, but that lust for your partner in that drive, that sexual drive for your partner

is not there. Okay. Yeah. So, no, no, no, of course, of course, but to you to the point of how to deal with it, here's a couple things. One, we have to reduce the stigma around that because people have come into marriage with these ideals of all the movies They've seen and oh it's gonna be this and it's just not this is not I haven't done a movie like that

Show the real life Show the real show like this is 40 version of it Show the real life. I do. Show the real. Show that this is 40 version of it. Every single movie. Right, right, right. Yes, I have.

Because it's not like that. No, it's not. Just not like Prince Charming and Center. Respectively have kids and everything else, you know? Totally, totally. Make a movie like that for you. You got it. And so when these ideas and ideals crash against reality, that's when it becomes challenging

and that's what we have to communicate. Like, okay, we have to have some difficult conversations and I need to express this lust is a problem for me or I need this. And then it's okay to bring in help. How about that? Work with a therapist, work with the sex therapist, read books, like really take it on. Like the same way that if you and your spouse have a home renovation, what are you gonna do? You're gonna sit with the blueprint, you know, sit with the contractor,

you're gonna sit down with the designer, you're gonna say, okay, how do we get this to where we want it to be? The same way you do that with your house, do that with your love life. Okay, you know what? Didn't expect this to feel like, I'm not having that same, um, let's figure out how we can how we rekindle this. Let's get tips. Let's get tools.

Let's get help. Let's not live in silence because in a lot of marriages, that's what happens. No, I think that's true. I think that's one of the big problems, right? Because people then end up in their own silo and they don't really like talk about it. No. And so therefore it just gets worse and worse. But I do think, and like, I'm just, I'm just calling a spade a spade. I think that people also just change and grow apart. I mean, that's also normal. I don't think we're on this earth necessarily to be binogamous to one person forever and ever and ever.

I think that's also not really. And that's just, I'm just being honest. I had this woman on my podcast. Her name is Jaya. She's a sex, she did that show group, the group Netflix show. Do you know what she is? No, I don't. Oh my gosh.

So it was very interesting because she was the sex all, she just, whatever. She's like a sex person. And we're going into this podcast and what's going on and on and on. And we're talking about all these other things. And then she drops like the best thing. And she's like,

yeah, so my partner's over there, blah, blah, blah, his name's Ian, 15 years. I'm like, oh, wonderful. We have a kid, blah, blah, blah. And I'm saying to her, how are you keeping it, you know, how do you keep it, you know, interesting and like fresh and everything else, she goes on and on, okay. And I'm like, oh, in my head, I'm like,

oh, this is great. Good for her, like this is amazing. And then she drops maybe five minutes into the thing. But she also has two boyfriends, 20 years each that she's been with, plus a new one that's four years. So she's got like three other men on the side. Like plus, the anchor, but she has all these other relationships. I'm like, oh, so that's how you keep your eyes on yourself. You're just bullshit. Like, oh, what we do this.

And I know what his sex type, like, she's giving me this whole blue print of like, his, you know, how like the personality test, like you're like, that thing, we're like, you're the kind of person who likes compliments. I'm the kind of person who likes gifts. So, love languages. Love languages.

Love languages, right. So she has the same type of idea with like, you know, sex languages. Like, you like this, like she has like, you know, sex languages, like you like this, like she has like one that says, kinky one is this one is that not to embarrass you, I don't want to hear you. No, no, that's part of it. Super interesting.

That is fascinating. Super fascinating. And she's great, she's so super knowledgeable. But then like, you know, the, the crescendo is like, but I also have 9,000 partners, you know what I mean? And this one, the other one's raising my kids. So like, it I also have 9,000 partners, you know what I mean? And the other one's raising my kid. So like, it's just so fascinating. Like, so like, I think that like in, I think in theory,

a lot of these things, like, they sound good, but reality is very different than theory. Yeah. In my experience. And I just call it a- I agree with that. I agree with that. You know? Yet, I think what happened- I agree with that. I agree with that. You know, yet I think what happens.

For people like Miss. Okay. No, no. One is enough. I'm just trying to embarrass you right now. Because you're so like straight, narrow, nice. It's cool, it's cool. You're just so like, where's your bow tie?

Hey, you know what? I left it at the words of Torre. Oh, then you go do it exactly. I did. I did. But you know, but honestly, like even in a, I left it at the end. We're at the tour race. Oh, then you're dead exactly. I did. I did. But you know, but honestly, like even in a, what you're talking about reality. Yeah.

But see, this is the thing that, you know, maybe even it also gets me passionate about relationships. Yeah. Because we don't always take the time to acknowledge whatever the reality is. And guess what, there's no, there's no right or wrong reality, right? And sometimes in, in marriage, there's that idea of like,

oh man, if this isn't what I thought it was supposed to be, am I gonna disappoint my partner, am I gonna let them, versus like, okay, this is having honest conversation for a moment. Doesn't mean, yes, we are growing differently, but that doesn't mean that that growing has to be, we're going apart. Two people can grow, everyone's growing from the moment

they say, I do, you're growing and changing and becoming different. And you can learn to love that person. You can learn to fall in love with who that person is becoming. There's no question about that. It just comes down to when you start to feel, uh oh, something's off. That's the moment to catch it.

Got it. Yes, I understand. Because if you let it go years, so true. And then you try to sort it out, it could be too late. So then, what would you say the biggest question is that you get, or the biggest problem that you hear, because now that you're the dating expert, right? I'm not calling myself a dating expert. I'm a relationship advisor.

I'm a relationship advisor. I like that. Yes. Yes. I'm a relationship advisor. I'm a real relationship advisor. I like that. I love that. What would you say when the biggest things that you actually get asked or hear that's the biggest problem? Is it the cheating? Besides the cheating. No, it's really about how, most of the time, women asking, how can I find a good man? And when do you tell them?

Go and Raya? I say pray. I just say pray because most women come to me and they tell me about their dating horror stories. And, and, you know. Especially if you're in LA, right? That's what people say. Yeah, you know, people, you know, just say that women,

you know, say that, you know, the men all they want is sex and they, you know, want, as you, just where they're articulating, they want polyamory and they don't want commitment and it's so hard to find someone on the same page. And so first and foremost, I really just try to encourage them. I say, I understand, and I know that's difficult.

And just trust. I say, you gotta just trust. You gotta trust it that your person is out there some way, somehow, and resist the temptation to allow the narrative and the culture to become your narrative. So all you need is the right one. It may take you a number of people to get there,

but I do believe that love is available and do your best to not allow the resentment and the frustration and the bitterness to work against that and try to stay in the energy of the love that you want. These are such great answers. I mean, it's hard though in the moment, right? Like, I'm not single, but I have friends who are and I know that it's social media also plays a really hard,

it's very difficult, right? Because there's so much more access to everything now and people and availability for men and women have much more of a difficult time. So, you're telling them to be like not to give up and all this other things. Are there other strategies besides that? They can kind of...

Don't be, don't have a stigma around any way that you can find love. So it may be, you mentioned Ryan, maybe dating app like that or a bit. No, I mean, there are dating apps out there. You're dating app, letting, you know, ask in friends, try and new things like that. a bit. No, I mean, there are dating apps out there. Dating app, you know, asking friends, trying new things like. How are you meeting girls now that you're single? Because I'm just me.

Right, exactly. I'm just saying, it's like easy for you. Right? I don't know. I mean, you're here showing them way with like a shoe. I didn't say all that. I didn't say that. I didn't say that.

With that smile, oh my God, it's like gonna be, it's like forget about it. You know, I think so. Cool, I'm good. I'm good. I'm doing with that smile. Oh my god. It's like gonna be it's like forget about it. You know I'm doing all right I don't think so. So what's your type? It's like just when you're looking for right now. Are you dating anybody? You know what? I am looking for it. And by the way, I'm not hitting on you. I'm just asking you by the way. I don't want to I didn't forget to try to get it all in a minute. I told you, Jan. Habits hustle and hard break. That's the next one. And we get into all that, okay? Right, but on this one, you know.

You're sweating now, you're like really sweating. I'm sweating because it's hot in here. I got to do it the questions. I know, I know, I know. Okay, take it. But in terms of your question about what am I looking for? Yeah. You know, I'm really looking for truth, you know what I mean?

Just, and that can take the shape of so many different ways, you know, and also it's like being newly. Well, how long have you been not together with them? It's been just this year. Oh, it's brand new. Yeah, so I'm not like out there like, oh, I'm looking this way. It's like, I'm open.

I'm open to what's true. You're living your life. Living my life, working on healing, and just being open. So it's the right person comes. I'm open to that, you know, and open to whatever experiences come along with that. So what are some of your habits and household,

you keep them bringing it up. So that's fine now. We know you like to exercise. So what's your, like, give me the day to date, like give me your day in the life of you with all your prognos and stuff. Yeah, exactly. We tend to wake up in the morning onward.

So usually I'll get up, you know, five, 30-ish. I'll use a go to rumble at six o'clock. Okay. And then I'm done at seven, come home. You do that early, huh? I do. I love it doing early. For some reason, like going at seven,

just feels like, oh man, I'm not done until eight. And just, you know, for me. It just means the day for you. Yeah, it's like, I get done. If I go to work out at six and I get done at seven, I'm like, oh man, I got the rest of the day. That's good. If I go at seven and I don't get done until eight something,

I'm like, oh man, I feel like I'm running late. Right, I get anxious. Yeah, I'm like, oh shoot, I'm running, I'm running behind schedule. But I'm, so I do that, I'll go to a rumble or another class, I will come home, do my protein shake, you know, usually listen to. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, back it up.

Would you put it in the protein shake? Oh, you don't want to know. Yeah, I do. Oh, my gosh. Oh, I do. Everything. This is what I want. This is the actually this that I care about.

So come on, tell me. Everything else. I want a smally hood. I want to know about this. The protein shake, that's it. That's it. That's it. I want to know.

OK, so I put this, I usually put coconut water. OK. Which brand do you like? put coconut water. Okay. Which brand do you like? The carbon one. No, it comes in a can. Oh. It comes, I don't know, but it's pretty good. Okay, you're sweating like a,

do you want to open a window a little bit because you're gonna die here? This has, I feel bad. Oh, you're like, die. You're gonna die. Okay, good, okay, maybe that will help you. Okay, cool, thank you. You're welcome.

Appreciate that. So, the so coconut water, protein powder, this vegan protein powder, then I cannot remember the name of it. I have to text you to the picture. So protein powder, psyllium, flax seed.

I put in these cocoa flavonoids, like a cocoa powder, this green powder. I also put in three raw egg yolks, not the white. You're not just in a row. I'm not playing. We need all the play, okay?

I love it. Yes. I do that. And. I'm not playing. We need all the play, okay? I love it, yes. I do that and then I do vitamin C in there, vitamin C powder and then vitamin B. You know, like the liposome. I've said over years, I just figured it out. You know, that works as good for me. And then that's usually it. And then I'll do my supplements.

What's the cake, what are the supplements? Oh, man? It's a lot you have Okay, you this apart you have to tell me like no like B12 ancestral supplements are you familiar with those actually? I am a little bit Yeah, I started using those and man it's great. Okay. I don't know much. I've heard of it So it's basically like you know, they're great. Okay, I don't know much, I've heard of that. So it's basically like, you know, they create the supplements from the cow. What?

Oh, I thought this was something else. No, no, no, no, ancestral supplements are like, they take all the different parts of the cow and they have a belief that, you know, like heals like. So if you're having liver problems, then if you consume liver, your liver's gonna improve. If you're needing a stronger, then if you consume liver, your liver is going to improve. You're needing a stronger heart. If you eat heart, it's going to improve.

Wow. You're doing this. Yeah. So these supplements, you know, maybe ancestral supplements, you know, there's a man, the male, a one from men, which I take. And then they also have this thing called beef tallow, which is pretty good. And I, you know, we'll do that occasionally. And they have, I mean, they have so many, you know, they have a prostate, they have them for, you know, they organs, fish eggs, all of it. So, yeah, it's, it's, wow. But it's just, they put them in a pill,

it's not like you're eating it wrong. No, I know you're taking the pills. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you're ordering like, which ones are you taking? I'm taking them, the male supplement. The male supplement. Okay, so what else are you taking? So doing that, zinc, what else you're doing that? Zinc

What else I'm just trying to go to my cabinet here I'll take it on mega three yes. Yes. Yes. Take it on made it three taking vitamin D for sure Taking 10,000 a day 10,000 a lot. Yes. I know I know how yes Yeah, well because sometimes you know, you don't know how much your body absorbs and not so. But you can overdo it. This is true, but that 10 to 15 range is not. Does someone give you this protocol

or you're just like, figure this part out too? Part of it is, I mean, I have worked with nutritionists, but most of the supplements are like me sorting out, like, okay, over the years of what I've tried, what really works for me. Okay. You know, and then there's the bunch of stuff, I just can't remember all of it.

Like, you know, I will. I will, I will. I told you about the NAD though, you should take that and the true Nijam and ascended that too. Okay, I can't wait. Okay, tell me what else you do. So then after the protein shake and the supplements, while I'm doing that, I'm using listening to,

you know, some sort of inspirational talk or podcasts while I'm getting ready My podcast obviously obviously, you know And then I get to work you know, so in that to have an office which is right on the street from my house and And so that consists of sometimes you know, I have you know staff meetings with my film department or TV department or digital department. I have meetings with my manager to get caught up on what's going on the talent side. What is your manager? Her name is DeNor Pena.

She runs a company called Bodega 7. She's fantastic. Okay. Yeah, we just started working together this year and she has a lot of great young up-and-coming clients and she's great. The best. Who are other clients that she has? She has great competing against.

No, no, no, no. She has a lot of social media influencers. She also has some actors She also has you know, Massy. I can never pronounce her. Oh, yeah, I'm sorry. I'm sorry I'm yes. Yes. Yes. She manages. Massy You know a whole host of folks and so I'll do means with her You know, I'll do interviews depending on what's going on, you know, for, I mean, if I'm meeting with Netflix on something or meeting with another studio, I will have pitches that I'll be taking, you know, and developing for different projects that I'm doing on the film or the TV side. So that'll mean me meeting with different writers and working on

the pitch or sometimes people want to pitch me projects. So I'll listen to those. I'll have a lunch usually at the Soho House with someone from the industry. Yesterday I sat down with an executive friend of mine. So it just depends. Do I know? No. No. And then in the afternoon, I have more meetings. And then in the evening, it just depends.

Sometimes I'll get in a second workout. Sometimes I'll have a dinner or sometimes I'll just go home and chill. That sounds like, that's actually a great breakdown. Who do you eat for dinner? Are you like, do we, where do we eat for dinner? My dinner is all over the place. It just, it depends.

Like I try to eat when I'm hungry. Okay. So sometimes if I'm not hungry at night, I might snack on some grapes and something like that, but I don't eat a big meal. If I am hungry, then I'll try to do something like, maybe I don't do a lot of meat. I'll do meat maybe once a week,

because it keeps my skin, when I eat a lot of meat, my skin is not clear. Really? You look at skin actually. Thank you. Do you drink a lot of water? I drink a lot of water and I have a whole, that's a whole other thing. Do you have a whole regimen for your skin? Yes. Of course you do. Why wouldn't you? It's like a dumb. Okay, so would you?

She knows for news podcast. That's today. She's got a nose for news. I tell you. Inquiring minds. You've no idea. I told you. Like. You've no idea, I told you. Like, I want to know. I don't want this bullshit surface. I love it, I love it. I wouldn't know what you're doing for your skin too. I love it, oh man. That's like, you know, some of that has to do with,

you know, one, just drinking water, reducing meat, and, you know, incorporating as much green stuff as possible. Yeah, this is true. And then I have this tea tree oil soap by carbon theory, incorporating as much green stuff. Yeah, it's possible. It's possible. Yeah. This is true. And then I have this tea tree oil soaked by carbon theory, which is just the best. It's the best. It just, I mean, I am religious about it.

Really? I've never heard of that one either. Oh my goodness. Is it a guy thing or is it like an everybody thing? No, it's everybody thing. Okay. They have it at, they sometimes sell them at some sephoras and they also sell them at Ulta Beauty,

and then you can get it online. But it's fantastic, and then belief has a brand that focuses a lot on hydration and moisturizing, and so I'll do the aquabomb at night, and then I'll do the moisturizers during the day. Wow, you have a whole thing. That whole thing, that whole thing. I love it.

You gotta do it. Do you drink at all? Never. Never, okay. Is it because for health reasons or for religious reasons or for both? It was family reasons because of my father, which is really the primary driver, not so much because of religion or not even so much because of health just because of my father. Yeah, you saw us.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And ultimately, you know, what, you know, I've come to learn about alcohol, you know, it really it's not healthy You know, we all I mean people do it, but just in you know, in terms of what it does to our brain and what it does to our body It's just not the the best thing to have a regular practice of from what you know, the research that I've done So can I chose I mean I I'm not a drinker at all either. I I feel like it ages you too It does it does like I think it's just even if you do it moderately like I think like I'm not a drinker at all either. I feel like it ages you too. Even if it does, I think it's just, even if you do it moderately, like I think, I've never been that person to like drink

two glasses of wine a night or a wine a night or whatever. I feel like there's like, that is like a, it's like a small, it's one of those things that make, it sounds so small, but it makes a big difference. Over time, I'm cumulative. Yeah, from what I've seen, so yeah, no smoking, no drinking, none of that. You're like super straight.

Trying to live my best life. You really are living your best life, but are you having any fun? Trying. What do you do for fun? Oh man, I go to the movies. I love going movies. I just started taking an improv class,

which was being great, so much fun, so much fun Just never done that before, so I loved doing that. I just went to Costa Rica with my close friend, my buddies, and went hiking in the jungles and jumping off a cliff. Oh, that's so cool. So really being adventurous and getting outdoors, I love doing that. I love doing that. I love spending time with my aunts and my mom. So I mean literally, my honest lives in LA and one of my favorite things to do is just go over

on Innocence House. She's 85. Then we'll just sit back and eat and talk and just catch up. You're such a sweet pea. Who do? I mean, I would never have thought this was you. Here I am. Oh my gosh.

Well, by the way, I don't know how long I've been talking to. I don't even have no idea. I think it's been like two hours poor guy. We've done two episodes. I think we've done, yeah, we have, but that's okay for me anyway. But I probably have kept you way too long. How do people like find more information about you and or where do they find you? Yeah, you can find me on my website,

devonfrankland.com. I'm also on Instagram, ad devonfrankland, on Twitter, ad devonfrankland, and then Facebook, ad devonfrankland. Not TikTok. You know, I think I have a TikTok that my team handles, but I just haven't, I just haven't got on it yet. You know, I'm just like, okay,

of all the things that I have going on. Right, that's one that you're just remiss. Unless there like, I'm less, there's a real purpose behind it. You know, I just haven't. You know, I haven't focused on it. Let me put it that way. Okay, how about YouTube? What are you doing? We have the presence on YouTube,

but it's not what it needs to be. Yeah, well, you're too busy. There's a lot going on, so. A lot going on. Wow. Oh my God, well, thank you. I'm so happy that Torrey like got, you know, it really prevented you and came here. Like really, this was so fun.

It was great. Thank you so much. No, but really, I really like talking to you. Me too, likewise. This was, you were much different than I thought you were gonna do. You know what's interesting? Most people say that.

And so, you know, I'm like, okay, what am I putting out? I don't know, but I'm trying to change it. So I love interviews like this. That give me a chance to, you know, it's great. I feel this is your very like Torrey like, I love that. Quite a common one. I love them. Me too. And like I feel like this was very similar where I didn't know him at all. Oh, wow. Right? Like Demetra who I work with was like with a big fan of his. Yeah, you have to have Torrey Roberts,

but I'm like, oh God, okay, fine. And I had him on and I like, oh no, I'm being totally serious. I don't like, mince words. Yeah. And I, I'm like, I loved. He's the best. He's like my favorite.

My brother. He is the best. And like, I feel same with you. I didn't really know who you were. And I was like, oh, I wonder who this guy is. You come on here. And like it was just you have such a beautiful spirit and a beautiful personality. And you seem so genuine. And nice. I don't know why I thought in my head that you would be kind of a dick. I don't know why. You're the opposite. I don't know either. So people the opposite. I don't know either.

So people, don't just look at it's cute smile and think, you know, he's actually very, this is very, very, and I mean that in the nicest way because you're so cute and I got that like, oh god, he's going to be a player. That's why I really thought. Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, you're just so, like, so nice and so good. So thank you for being on the podcast. Thank you, thank you.

I was like back very strange when it's okay. It's all good. I received that because I knew you're in 10. I felt the intent. My intention was good, right? That's right. It was great. Okay, good.

Well, thank you. Thank you for having me. time to get it rolling, stay up on the grind, don't stop, keep it going. Habits and hustle from nothing in the sun, all out, a host of biogen, a fuck going. Visionaries, tune in, you can get to know. Be inspired, this is your moment. Excuses, we in heaven at the Habits and hustle podcasts, power by happiness. Hope you enjoyed this episode. I'm Heather Monahan, host of Creating Confidence, a part of the YAP Media Network, the number one business and self-improvement podcast network.

Okay, so I want to tell you a little bit about my show. We are all about elevating your confidence to its highest level ever and taking your business right there with you. Don't believe me? I'm going to go ahead and share some of the reviews of the show so you can believe my listeners. I have been a longtime fan of Heather's no matter what phase of life I find myself in, Heather seems to always have the perfect gems of wisdom that not only inspire, but motivate me into action. Her experience and personality are unmatched and I love her go get her attitude. This show has become a staple in my life. I recommend it to anyone looking to elevate their confidence and reach that next level. Thank you! I recently got to hear Heather at a live podcast

taping with her and Tracy Hayes and I immediately subscribe to this podcast. It has not disappointed and I cannot wait to listen to as many as I can as quick as I can. Thank you Heather for helping us build confidence and bring so much value to the space. If you are looking to up your confidence level, click creating confidence now.