Habits and Hustle - Episode 20: Andy & Michael – Founders of Whole Life Challenge – Health, Wellness, & the Importance of Mobility

Episode Date: July 16, 2019

Andy Petranek and Michael Stanwyck are the founders of Whole Life Challenge. We talk in this episode about the difference between “being fit” and “being healthy”, and how Andy and Michael went from the fitness-focused world to creating a total wellness program. They talk in detail about the Seven Daily Habits that are the foundation of the Whole Life Challenge, and how everyone has the ability to improve their own health and wellness.  Youtube Link to Episode Whole Life Challenge ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ Did you learn something from tuning in today? Please pay it forward and write us a 5-star review on Apple Podcasts. 📧If you have feedback for the show, please email [e-mail]  📙Get yourself a copy of Jennifer Cohen’s newest book from Habit Nest, Badass Body Goals Journal. ℹ️Habits & Hustle Website 📚Habit Nest Website 📱Follow Jennifer – Instagram – Facebook – Twitter – Jennifer’s Website Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Vitamin Water Zero Sugar just dropped in all new taste with zero holding back on flavor. You can be your all feeling. I'll play and all self-care you. Grab the all new taste today. Vitamin Water Zero Sugar, nourish every you. Vitamin Water is a registered trademark of glass O. Andy and Michael from the Whole Life Challenge join us today on the Habits and Hustle podcast. Health and wellness is about more than just working out and getting a six pack. The Whole Life Challenge is a system built on seven daily habits that will help you create a healthier lifestyle, and you know I'm all about that.

Andy and Michael discuss their holistic approach, what those seven well-being habits are and how you can create a healthy balance life. Listen in, get motivated and start improving your life today. Alright you guys, this is Habits and Hustle episode. I don't know what number right now, but it's going to be in the first eight, let's say. I have the two founders of Whole Life Challenge with me, Michael and Andy, thank you guys so much for coming on and sharing with everybody, mostly me right now. What exactly is Whole Life Challenge

and kind of like the whole trajectory of what you why you did it. So I'm going to leave it to you Michael. Oh. What a softball. So okay, what are you saying? Okay, whole life challenge. Well, what we were talking about a minute ago is, you know, I think the whole life challenge can be a bunch of different things to different people depending on how they approach it. And what I was curious about you, because you're in day two of the whole life challenge, is when you heard about it, what made you think, like, I'm gonna do that. That sounds like a really good way to approach this. Well, yeah, I should have, like, that intro was kind of wonky, because I like the way we kind of discussed that a little bit. So, so far, what I know, the whole life challenge is a kind of a reset or a game-of-fying way

to kind of reset your wellness initiative. So, what I was saying to you is, I'm someone who's already fit. So for me, what your challenge, I hope does for me, is kind of keep me kind of more conscious or kind of conscientious of what my day-to-day habits are without the ones that are not on autopilot. So for me, so many things I put on autopilot to make it easy for me. So and I'm good and so many. I'm of your seven habits, which we'll get into in a couple minutes. There's about three or so that I do it very easily. But there are four others, which we'll talk about, that are much more challenging. So I thought doing

this whole life challenge would kind of get me to be more accountable for those and kind of help me do those things on a more regular basis. Because what is what is wellness or how to take your health to the next level is to have a holistic approach and have all these seven habits working together, correct? Yeah, I think a lot of people come at this thing you laid out perfectly because a lot of people come to this saying I need to lose weight. I want to get fit and And that's a really good reason to start because it's it's a it's a way into the world of your health and your well-being

But there are other people who are already fit But they might be fit but not super healthy and they might be unhealthy in other ways They might be too stressed out You know they might you know they might over train they might be they might be physically hurting themselves They might not be getting enough sleep You know there are a lot of ways that people can have a negative effect on their wellness. And what we found out because we have a background in training people, Andy and I ran CrossFit Los Angeles together and he founded CrossFit Los Angeles back in 2004.

And I Joe, I came on board in 2006 and it took a lot for our clients really to find their way into being healthy and not just being fit the way cross fit defined fitness because that part was fun. But there were like, I mean, if they were the gym for five hours, I don't know how many hours are in a week, it's 140 something. There was like 130 to 140 hours. They were outside of the gym doing all of these things that could have a negative impact on their overall health. So, one of the things that we discovered was if you start to pay attention to this

kind of constellation of habits and you know nutrition and your exercise and your mobility which is some of the things we talk about in the gym. Yeah, let's just do this. No, I'm just going to say because I think we can want to talk into what these habits. Yeah. And then we're not saying what the habits are. So number one, it's exercise. Well, nutrition. Oh, nutrition's one. Okay, exercise is two.

Yeah. Three would be sleep. Mobility. I didn't realize, sorry, hold on. I didn't know order order. There's no order. That's right. So there's any order you wanted to do.

Okay, so let's not use the order. So so far, I'm gonna start again. Okay. It's exercise, nutrition,. Yeah hydration, right? Mobility Mm-hmm. Different in exercise. Then there's Well-being and then the other one is reflection right right? Yep. So those are the seven So what I was saying earlier was that like for some people who are already at a place,

if there's three of the seven that are like no brainers, there's still four other things there that that that may be kind of weak for you and then therefore just because you're doing one habit or two habits you can still be kind of unhealthy because you're not really doing a holistic approach with all seven or really less well. I mean you could be less because you're not really doing a holistic approach with all seven. Or really less well. I mean, you could be physically healthy, but our approach really is about a sense of wellness, which includes your physical health, which includes your physical fitness, your ability to use your body effectively. But it also includes the way that you are in your life, your personal, your internal

sense of your life and your happiness and your wholeness. And Andy and I come from a, not just a sports background or a training background, but also a personal development background. And it was, it, we started to notice, I think, that that how you are in your life was really missing from how people were training themselves. They were just hammering away at these two elements of like diet and exercise, like it was all that mattered I mean, they couldn't figure out why they were so stressed or why they were so unhappy with their results or why they may not be getting the results that they wanted And so what was your background before then you said personal development? What was it?

Well, we've I think I've pursued an Andy's pursuit like you know, I don't talk too much for Andy But like personal personal development of our own. Oh, okay. I think you came from that space that you know, we're doing work with them that's a bit, but you're saying, okay, so recognize the importance of it in life. Oh, okay. I and I agree. I think that's, I and I, and I, by the way, agree that, that happens with a lot of people, right?

You focus on one or two things and you forget about the other things or you don't work on it because it's your challenge, right? Everyone always works on the, you know, focuses on the things that they're good at, right? And then when the things that they're bad at, they just try to like, kind of just forget about or just not deal with. And that's when you get into a lot of problems. So for me to answer it in a long way to answer your question, the reason why I wanted to do this was I wanted to challenge myself and see if I if I could focus on the things that I'm not As apt to do and see if I can kind of balance out my life better and I have to say that how I even got you know even Introduced to you was because my husband and his friends Try doing this whole life challenge. They did it with his group of friends and they had a competition.

So whoever lost the most weight or whoever did the best would get a prize or win money. And my husband lost 30 pounds on your challenge, which my husband, by the way, isn't even a big guy. He's not a big guy. I mean, he's a big guy. He wasn't overly obese. But what the program did, it gave him discipline and diligence

on an area he never really focused on. And it was extremely successful for him. So he was a big advocate. And then, of course, he comes to me and tells me. And I see what he's doing. And I'm like, oh my god, I gotta talk to these guys. Because these guys obviously are figuring out a great way to help people in a way that's, you know, fun and actually gets results. So, and you're very quiet over there.

Well, I'm just listening and, you know, it's hard to have a two-way conversation with three people. Yeah, right. That could be difficult, right? Um, the joy I made whenever you want. Yeah, no, I was just difficult, right? The joy, the name whenever you want. Yeah, no, I was just thinking, you know, I mean, one of the things that seems like it probably gave your husband is a reason, a purpose. Like, yeah, like, because- Absolutely, I agree with you. Because unless you have a system or a, like, an end game, right, it kind of like, you

can always be like, ah, procrastinate, I won't do it. I'll start tomorrow. But you're right. It was with other people. They had a, there was a goal, which was like a prize. So we had a reason to kind of go for it. And it doesn't have to be a prize like losing weight, right? That's the, that's the most obvious one. And that's the most obvious one for most people in the world.

That's the what, you know, that people are obsessed by. But, you know, like what we've tried to do in the challenge is, is equivalent, is that a word? Make all these things kind of equivalent so that there's no, like we're not only focused on food. The problem with our culture is food is in front of us, three to five times a day. So we see it all the time where meditation is not in front of us three to five times a day.

So what our intention is is to create this thing see it all the time where meditation is not in front of us three to five times a day. So what our intention is is to create this thing that you're going to have two or three areas probably that you're already okay in. Maybe hopefully to allow yourself to be challenged because the human nature is to expand. We want to expand. Like people just is to expand. We want to expand. Like people just want to expand. Like why do people want to grow? They want to get better at something or do something

and very often it's hard to expand in things that you already feel like you're good in. Like I don't need more abs. I got six or eight. You know, like I don't have to. I don't have to do, I don't have to do more sit ups. But I still want to expand. I want, there are other areas of my life

that are important for me. And what the whole challenge does is it gives me the opportunity to look at those other areas that affect my health and well-being that are not abs for me or that are not weight loss for somebody that doesn't need to lose weight. That are things like how you treat yourself on the inside. Like those are some of the well-being habits

that we, like the golden hour that you're doing this week. You know, those are different and they bring out different sides of areas that affect your health and well-being. Keep coming back, you got plenty of space! Oof, not how you would have done that. You like working with people you can rely on, like USAA, who has helped guide the military community for the past 100 years.

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Vitamin water is a registered trademark of glass O. Yeah, well said, I couldn't have said it better myself, that was perfect, because that's true. And I wanted to actually say to my husband, it wasn't even for him, it wasn't trying. It wasn't for him to lose weight He wasn't trying to lose 30 pounds. That actually was just the byproduct of what happened It was that because the journaling really helps because once you write things down you're accountable, right? And it keeps you more in the moment in present of what you did that day

But I think with anything and I actually agree. I don't think in all of this, at the end of the day, as we get older or whatever, it's not about getting a six pack so much. It's really about having a balanced healthy life and lots of areas. And I think that the byproduct, if you do all these seven habits diligently and build true habits and routines and rituals that are like that, that will be the byproduct, right?

You will physically look better. Well, and I think someone might say, well, so, okay, so these are the seven habits. Great, thanks for telling me knowledge. I'll just go do them on my own. And the reality is, people have come to us for years and say, why do I need you? I can do it on my own. I say, if you can do it on your own, you don't need me. That's absolutely true.

But what most people find is it's not that they can't, but it's difficult. The whole life challenge, like you said at the beginning, it's a game and being offered to do this in the framework of a game is, it's a service we offer. We facilitate this ability to play with it in your life and to have a game and to actually have a short-term reason,

like, I'm just gonna do this today because I can earn a series of points to do it. For no other reason than just to play a game and you'll find that by playing this game, you'll start to get the results that you've always wanted to get, that you've been trying to get because you don't like yourself or you don't like the way that you look and those tend to be less productive ways of going about it. And I know, you know, I know your husband is, he's a bit competitive. And that helped him. A little. And that helped him.

And that helped him. It did. And for people who are competitive, that's, I mean, that's a good reason to play a game. But, um, But it will, I would say that it would help him the first time he plays. And it might help him the second time he plays, but as you get further along in the path of, like, looking at your health and wellbeing, you get less, you get less influence by points. Like he's not going to care.

If he does every challenge, let's say for the next year. Yeah. He's not going to care so much by the fourth challenge, lose 30 pounds is not going to matter because he doesn't have more weight to really lose. Right. Right. And the points become like, well, that's fun and all, but I really am interested in my own internal shifts.

And the point, so then you become less interested in getting a perfect score or the points. And more interested in, am I doing the things that make me happy? Am I doing the things that make me give my life less stress? Am I doing the things that make me a well, more well balanced person? And so the points, as you move down this path of, you you know like we always say the best way to play the challenges And as an annual subscriber because you you get a chance to play it and you have whatever experience your first time is and Then you relax for six weeks and then you come back in and you play it again And you have a different experience because you're in a different place and you played it once and you have this

Experience and then you take a six-week break and then you come back and you do it in by the time You get to eat you're a different person and the way you're approaching this stuff is totally different than the first way you did it Absolutely, I think you also reset yourself different every time you do it You're like resetting for the next time because you have different goals of what you're what you're looking for right because you're right Like now he's not looking to lose 30 pounds, but it's probably something else Also, he said to me because he's doing the challenge with me is now because of that, I got some of my friends to do it as well, right? It's different. He says it's different this time than it was last time. So, are you guys tweaking the program every time?

I think it's more what Andy's saying. I don't think, I mean, so the well-being practices are always different. That's what I'm talking about. I guess it's the well-being practice. So the idea of well-being practices are interesting, because we don't tell people what exercise to do. We just say you need to exercise for at least 10 minutes every day. You do whatever feels right for you. If it's Pilates or Yoga or CrossFit or running, you can do anything.

I was surprised by that part that it's just 10 minutes a day. Well, I mean, so we can talk about that too. So the idea with the whole life challenge is that we're trying to build into your life, the ability to address these things every day. You're not going to be able to do a full-out effort on every single habit necessarily every day. But if you find yourself like losing, losing touch with a certain, you know, certain habit in your day, you say, look, I'm going to set aside 10 minutes, I'm going to do something. It really is just to keep it present and in front of you. It's like you don't say on any given day, it's fine. I'll just skip a day. You can, but the idea of 10 minutes is there's

a minimum amount just to say this still matters, no matter what's going on in my life. I also think that's really, that's what I talk on different things as well. I always give something small like that because More often than not the 10 minutes will turn into 20 minutes or 30 It's that initial motivation to start something. That's the hard thing right so if you start off I'm saying you know just give me 10 minutes five minutes people feel it's doable. It's not overwhelming Right, I used to start my crossfit workouts that way so back in the old days when nobody was really doing crossfit And I was I'd walk in the gym by myself

and nobody being there and I'm like, God, do I really feel like doing this? I knew what I was gonna encounter. Like it was gonna be hard. And I would say, you know what? Just take five minutes and warm up and do the first little bit of the workout as a warm up. And if you still feel like crap in five minutes,

then just bag it. You don't have to do it. But you've got your five minutes in, right? Right, right, right. Nine times at a time, I mean, I would have a fantastic work out. Best work out of the, 100% like it'd be phenomenal, but I would like mentally trick myself.

And I knew I was doing it, and it still works. It still works. It was crazy, yeah. I say that all the time, it's like mental tricks to get you to do something, but that fight is even though you're doing it. It doesn't matter, you still do it. It's amazing.

Because you've given yourself this out. Yeah, you're like, I can quit anytime I want, and that's okay. That's true. You don't feel that obligation. Everyone hates that feeling of obligation. Right. But it takes, it takes also, what, 21 days

to build a habit, right? So they say. So they say, like, I mean, I was gonna say, that's what they say. I don't think it takes 21 days. Personally, in my opinion, it takes way longer than that, right? So they say. So they say, like, I mean, I'm not gonna say, that's what they say. I don't think it takes 21 days. Personally, in my opinion, it takes way longer than that, right? I think to make it a real habit, maybe, you know, but that's why.

And you can miss a day and it still can be a habit. Absolutely. It's like if you're, if you plant a little seed, like, you know, short amount of time, it'll sprout. And that's like probably your 21 days. Yeah. But if you stop watering it and you stop feeding it, it's gonna die. So, you know, 21 days may be enough to like sprout

in your life, but you really need to keep tending to it if you want it to last. Yeah, I think that's a great way. That's a great analogy. It takes it just to have it sprout. But that's why six weeks I think is a great timeframe because you're doubling that time. And by hopefully that sprout will turn into

a little bit more of... Some more roots. Yeah, more roots. But then, okay, I didn't mean to interrupt you. So the wellbeing process. So the wellbeing process. So like I was saying, we don't tell people how to exercise because everybody is so unique

and so individual. My mother didn't do the whole life challenge for years because she thought I'm into it crossfit. And when she found out that like, and you know, if she didn't know what to do, she could just go out and take a walk. She was like, oh yeah, I would love it if I just even took a walk every day. So that's all you have to do. I mean, that's really the whole point. And she's now done it several times. I mean, I don't know if she's done it every time since then. It's been like two or three years, but she keeps coming back and doing it because

it just gets her back in that groove. But with the well-being practices, you know, what we found was a lot of people don't have any idea what to do for their well-being. And while we don't like to necessarily prescribe what you should do, we like to introduce things to people. So the idea behind our well-being practices, look, if you have something, if you have journaling, if you have meditation, or if you've got something like that, you can bring that, and you can use that in that category, just like you'd use yoga for your workout. But if you have meditation or if you've got something like that, you can bring that and you can use that in that category just like you'd use yoga for your workout. But if you don't, we provide a suggestion or an idea every week that you can try. If you find something you like, you can stick with that or you can try something new every week and see what works.

You can also go back into our archives and look at all the ones we've suggested in the past. So it really is, it's an exploration of well-being that hopefully you find something in that sticks for you and allows you to continue to develop outside of once the challenge is over. Wow. How have you guys been doing this for like how many years now? We were 11 with our first one, that was just at the gym. I mean, we created this, we can have some grandmaster plan that we were creating in Aparod, you know, like some software, some new business. It was literally for the clients in our gym. Like that is it. And we were gonna use an Excel spreadsheet, like not Excel.

Google spreadsheet and have people log in and we had two people who were software developers and they're like, don't do that. Let us make you something real basic. Yeah. And they did. And we had 150 people in that first one. And it just, everything that, and they did and we had 150 people in that first one and it just it

Everything that Michael and I went about to change because one of the I'd been fitness coaching since like 1995 and I was always I never liked the personal training model because it always felt to me like a personal trainer was For most most personal trainers was kind of like a dog walker, you know, like, or a babysitter, you know. Hopefully I totally agree with you. And it would make me crazy. And I had this concept in my head of graduating. Like, I don't wanna keep my clients forever.

Once they get it, they get it. I don't wanna keep seeing the same person for eight years. Like, I would see in a lot of gyms. And that seems like Tringer's goal is to keep their clients for as long as possible because you don't want to have to go out and get a new one. Is that a pain?

Oh, it is a pain. And also what happened is they checked out. They're on their phones. They're not really paying attention. They're phoning it in. They keep on not getting any stronger or any better. They're just like going through the motions and there's no real change.

And like I agree with you 100%. That's why I think there's like a, that's a whole other podcast we can do, right? But I do like- I mean, that was kind of the foundation of, like we wanted to really affect people's behavior on their own, with our- And tangible results. Without our help, they have enough information.

Right. If I was, I would say this, if I stuck you on a deserted island, now I know this is unrealistic and whatever. You had enough food to survive, you're not worried about your tribalmen, I said you had to lose 10 pounds. Could you do it? Could you figure out a way with no help, no internet, no research, no books, could you

figure out how to do it? I would bet that 98% of the people in the world could figure out how to do it. Like if you had to get off the island. Yeah, like you get off the island. I think I think I'm given any kind of situation. It's like that. People can figure out anything if they have to. So it's it's in you. I mean there's a lot's there. Right. Everyone has it within them. But it's about what their level of motivation is, although I think motivation is a wacky thing to say, because I think motivation wanes and you know, you know, we're Ed's and flows and you can't rely on willpower or motivation. A accountability is a much more sort of critical piece, because you're like,

it doesn't matter how I feel about this. I'm gonna punch that card because I said I'm gonna punch that card. And honestly, there's so much personal development in just doing that, showing up whether you want to or not. And that is a big part of the changes I think that people see when they go through the whole life challenges. They demonstrate to themselves, they're capable of something that they didn't know they were capable of. And that changes you.

Absolutely. I think that that's also can go into any area of your life, right? Like you, if you have that quality, it helps you in everything. Yeah. So like, I think being being accountable, being disciplined, having goals, all those are all the traits of a successful person, right? So why not use yourself as a guinea pig and get yourself the best version of you? And I kind of feel like this is what the program, this is what your program does, right? Like it gets you to the next level of your health, wellness, whatever you, what you want to call it before? You said to me else, you didn't like the name I used before. You said it was not, you don't remember? I said, was this before we were, no, like five minutes ago, you said, I didn't like some.

You said, you't like some you said Sound I called it something You said on his slack. It says devil's advocate. Yeah So that really are you a difficult are you kind of like? Difficult for was funny People will say you know Michael it always it's us it always seems it doesn't matter which side I take, you'll always take the opposite. And I'm not, I don't think I'm trying to be difficult, but I always think it's worth the conversation to question the assumptions that we have. So if you say, I think this is the answer, and I might even agree with you, I'm gonna be like, but did you think about this? Right. Because I think, well, both people must love you

in a real way. Really? It's me. I can imagine. So what's your relationship? Because you're just buddies and you guys are friends. Well, I saw it. So I could say it's,

and I started the job. I remember my first conversation with Andy, because I had been working out since I was 18 years old and just going to the gym and kind of pushing weight around. Yeah. I met Andy in 2006 or 33. And I was, I was, I had, a couple of years before and just going to the gym and kind of pushing weight around. Yeah. I met Andy in 2006 or 33 and I was, I was, I was, I, a couple of years before I just got sick, but I couldn't go to the gym anymore. So I was trying to figure out fun things to do to work out and, and then one day my mom,

she said, Hey, I read this article in the late times, but this, this gym in Santa Monica and they seem to be doing really interesting stuff. You might like it. So I read it and, and you had to come in and do an intro session. And so I made an appointment to come to Sandy and it was really informal. I walked into the courtyard of the gym, a small little area. We're talking. And Andy says like, so what was the work? Was the last workout you did? And I said, 500 pushups as fast as I could. He goes, I think you're going to like it here. Really? Yeah. And I did.

And I loved it. It was super fun. And within a few months, I mean, I came into the, to what was then, Petronic fitness at this pivotal time in, I think, in Andy's life, where Andy was about to become a father. And he was looking for a way to change how his business worked so that he was more free to be a father, not stuck at the gym as what someone told the highest paid slave in the business.

And so he came to me and it was about three or four months after I joined. And he said, we're making some changes and you really seem to be into this and we're looking for people to bring in and train his coaches. Are you interested? And I honestly wasn't doing anything that I thought was terribly interesting at the time. And I was like, yeah anything that I thought was terribly interesting at the time. Right. And I was like, yeah, sure, that sounds like fun. I mean, it sounded like fun. And so I came on board and did you have a job before? I didn't have a job at the top.

I wasn't working at the top. You're 33, but I just graduated from UCLA. I just finished my degree in philosophy. I hadn't graduated when I was 18. I decided when I was 30 to go back. But you would be in the culinary school. I had been the culinary school. I had been the culinary school. I had worked in the restaurant business. I had left the restaurant business. I did side jobs so 30 to go back. But you would be in the culinary school. I'd been the culinary school. I had been the culinary school. But working the restaurant business,

I had left the restaurant business. I did side jobs so that I could travel. And I was finally settling back into LA when this happened. And so I just started working with him and kicked my buddy, you know, trained me to be a coach. He had a really good coach, some coaches there, namely this one woman Becca, who also works for our company now. And they

both kick my butt into shape, like both physically and like as a coach. Yeah. Mentally or yeah. Well, just I mean, you know, there's a lot of things you got to get past in yourself if you're going to be an effective coach. You can't be so arrogant all the time. And you know, I had an arrogant street. Oh, you don't say. And so therapy appointment? So we work, we work, we have a couch over there everyone. So we work together for years.

And we moved, we moved Jim's, the Jim grew. You know, Becca left. I moved into the, the general manager position at the Jim. And Andy actually went through a medical emergency that if he wants to talk about it all the time. What happened? It was actually the year that we started the challenge. So my context of fitness prior to this thing occurring was really fitness is

wellness. There's this, there's an article that Greg lastman wrote, he's a founder of CrossFit, that talks about this time, this continuum of fitness and it goes from sickness over here. Fitness is at the top and then wellness, super, it's like super fitness is over here and that's equivalent to wellness. And I really bought into it. I bought into a hook line in sinker because it was fun. It was exciting. And I was totally into the workouts and like, and even though I had training in a lot

of wellness stuff that I wasn't as excited about, I trained with a guy named Paul Checkdown in San Diego. Of course it'll Paul Check. Yeah, yeah, of course it will. Yeah. So I trained with him. I became a level two coach of Paul Checkson, did the nutrition and lifestyle and the holistic coaching. But I kind of let that stuff go when I glummed on the CrossFit. And because I bought into this concept, and I don't know, I was a 30, I was 37, I think at the time, I had, that was my experience of life. But why don't I need to worry about all this other stuff? Because this obviously works.

My life works. I didn't even want to do the first this other stuff because this obviously works my life works I didn't even want to do the first whole life challenge because I didn't want to I Life I love die coke. I didn't want to go off my die coke I got me to yeah, and There were a couple like I was like, why do I I don't need this? I don't need to go pale like full on paleo back then It was some there was only one level. Oh, I don't want to go off all alcohol like I like my red wine and but I but this thing happened. I've been to the CrossFit Games as an athlete in 2009. Okay. Oh you were okay. I see. And then in 2011 our team qualified to go to the CrossFit Games and I was on the team.

And I had so we had to go through the rules. You must get a good cross fitter. I couldn't hold a flame to those guys today even in my best shape I the sport has just risen to this pinnacle like it's unbelievable still I thought like I isn't that kind of take it and it couldn't be the Thousandth loser in the world. There's this point. There's no Cross again. No, it's it's like ridiculous but I was good at the time and It's ridiculous. But I was good at the time. And we qualified third place in the regionals,

and we were in this like six week period between regionals and the games. And I started up my training. And I, on my bike, was, I started biking everywhere. And one day I was riding my bike, and I was riding into a go-to-do workout, actually. And I was like, my ass hurts. Am I allowed to say things?

You can say whatever you want. Okay. All right, so I'm like, and it wasn't normal ass hurt. Like, it's not my glutes. I think they're hurt. Like, and I'm like, what is going on? I had had some hemorrhoids years past, never painful, no big deal.

By like six hours later, I couldn't walk. I went into a doctor, the doctor said, well, the good news is this, you're physically fit, your body's capable. This could just reabsorb. Like, it could be no big deal. And this was on a Friday. And she said, well, I'm getting there. But she said, the other possibility is that it gets worse. And then it could get inflamed or infected or what, I don't know what the thing was. Why don't we schedule surgery just in case?

I'm like, I don't think I'll need it, but okay, okay, we can do that. And it was for Tuesday. And I don't, I remember thinking, I don't know how I'm going, it was Friday night at like two in the morning. I couldn't sleep, I couldn't do anything. And I thought I'm not gonna make it to Tuesday.

I called the doctor, like called the doctor like probably eight times over that weekend. Like we have to move the surgery up. We have to move the surgery up. I can't make it, I can't make crying. I was crying, like unbelievable. So I had the surgery. Yeah, I figured it was my... I was out for six weeks. I couldn't really, you know, I couldn't barely get myself from the bed to the bathroom.

I mean, it was horrible. And it had a big impact. I mean, I don't It had a big impact on my thinking about who I am and who what I'm capable of and whether my like suddenly I had a I've this impenetrable Man of steel like it's not so impenetrable right and what's going on here and I'm I'm getting older and what am I not seeing? What am I not looking at that I could be looking at?

And it was really a pivotal event. I mean, I don't know if I would say that I thought it was pivotal in the moment. But I look back and I mean, was the it was between the very first whole-life challenge and the very second whole-life challenge and it and it was just like he didn't go to the games. No, I didn't go. I think I did go but but I was you know, what was it the actual it was a hammer it was a hammer or an internal hemorrhoid and it had abscessed or whatever they call it and oh yeah and so all of a sudden Andy just stopped showing up at the gym

It was like done. He was gone. So I was like I guess I run the gym now And so for like the next next four to six weeks. I just took over and he came back he was like great. I like this That's amazing and so yeah, so Andy ended up taking a more of a, I would say, like a spiritual leadership at the gym, and he really let us and the staff, you know, the rest of the staff, run the gym. But Michael became really involved in the whole challenge. Like, he started running the whole challenge, and we decided quickly thereafter that this was going to be within two challenges.

We decided this was going to be a thing because we partnered with a friend of mine who was my business partner in coaching other CrossFit gyms to become better businesses. Okay. And we gave him rights to the first challenge, to the first global challenge. How many people don't so how many, is this your full time gig now? Oh yeah. 100%. Right? Like you're not your guys bought, I know. No, I left the G, I can't remember now. He was the first one to leave. I left the G 13, 2013 something like that. I left my management, I coached for another year.

Uh huh. And then I left full, you know, I did this full time. And this is when you think, I mean, it's like an online thing, so anyone could do it anywhere, right? But how many employees do you have? Because I feel like your website's really well done. Like the content's really good.

Yeah, we only have 12 of us. Okay, but it's 12's not a lot, but obviously it's. It's not a little either. It's not a little, it's good to say. That's not small. No, but it's a skeleton crew. I mean, like our content, you know, our Becca, who we're telling you about,

she is our editor in chief. She runs our content and she gets it together. And we have a chief marketing officer, and then we have, you know, Nikki, who runs our social media, and she actually does a lot of the... She does the... She produces the content for all the marketing. You know, we have three full-time website engineers who manage the game website. The actual... The actual game thing, right? Yeah. You know, we have somebody who manages the front-end website,

the marketing website. You know, we have a part-time CFO who advises us on things financial. And one of the best things we did last year was Michael and I tried to, we had this. It was very challenging to go from being a Michael's, for me, going from being Michael's boss to being his partner. And I think it was very challenging to go from being a Michael's, for me, going from Mike, being Michael's boss to being his partner. And I think it was challenging for him. I know

it was, to go from being my employee to being my partner. So we, we kind of melded this thing into this leadership by committee that I was a Marine. So I don't believe in leadership by committee. But I was, but I was, didn't know any other way to do it because Michael and I were, there was no, I was not his boss in any way and neither was he mine. So I had to make this work. And we got to a point. We hired one of my old CrossFit buddies who had run another company.

He could run it from founder up to a $10 million company, it was an equipment company. And we hired him to be our chief marketing officer. And he just over a couple years of working with us, he just gained our real trust and confidence and a lot of things. A lot of things that Michael and I had no interest in even really talking about. He was talking about numbers and spreadsheets and graphs and

Jesus. You guys were like checked out by that. We're coaches. I'm like, I don't do this. And we made him our CEO and it was phenomenal. Like because it just pulled us out of this I think now looking back like kind of this quagmire. Like, I'm not willing to really step up to cross Michael. Michael is going to cross me, and he's not willing to step up and cross. Like we had to agree on everything.

And what I think got for a long time. That was a strength, too. Like, it worked in most areas, like we had to agree, because we're both, we're very different. I mean, every time there's an issue, we will inevitably come at it differently. If Andy's person A, I'll be person B, not because I'm trying to be kind of, but we think differently.

I'm not gonna be kind of your conversation. So we see things differently. Is it kind of what your personality is? We're very, like if Andy's Yen, I'll be Yen, but if he switches and all of a sudden he's Yen, I find myself is very Yen. And that always helps us help us find the middle ground, which, which, which worked. I mean, and it ultimately made our business better.

I was going to say, it also knowing your strengths and weaknesses is very, very important for success, right? Because obviously you've got a guy who was much better at those spreadsheets and the minutiae stuff that, like the business financial things that you're not really that into. So you got someone who is better than you guys to focus on that, so you guys can focus on what you're really good at and what makes this relationship work. We're gone.

And if John listens to this, I don't want him to think that we only like him for his ability to manage spreadsheets. He actually came in and he produced like a workable business vision for the company. Sorry, John, I mean, I didn't mean to offend you. vision for the company. Sorry, John. I mean, I didn't mean to offend you. No, but I'm sorry, Michael.

No, I misspoke again. Yeah, I know. Maybe you need to. It'll happen again. Yeah, that's right. That's right. That's right. But we do have a sweet, I mean, our company

has one person departments. Like every department is basically a one person department. How many people do you guys have at a time? I know right now it's a six week challenge. You have it every six weeks, like you said, six weeks on, six weeks off. So how many people in a given six week challenge,

let's say now because it's a new year, and we're in, it definitely it fluctuates. It's like, it's ebb and flow. Yeah, our biggest challenge has been almost 30,000 people. Wow. You know, that's a lot of people. Yeah, and our smallest challenge, our first public challenge was 7,000 people. Wow. You know, that's a lot of people. Yeah. And our smallest challenge, our first public challenge

was 7,800 people. But usually it goes somewhere now between 12 or 13,000 at the low end and then I guess a 30,000. It also fluctuates weirdly with, I mean, maybe it's not weirdly, it's with seasons. So like January is pretty obvious. Like why January would be the number one? Of course, it would be exactly.

Yeah, but it also September. Like people are getting out of the summer and back into the regular flow of life and that tends to see an uptick and people wanting to do something like this. Whereas like summer, I thought too. Well, but the problem is, we don't really sell it as like, you know, get your beach body on. Yeah, it's in the summer. It starts in July.

Right. So it's not get ready for summer, it is summer. Yeah. And we just have found so far that that's just not been a real popular time But people still want to do it. They still do it. Yeah, well no, of course you don't sell it as the beach body But because we're talking it But I think it depends on what you're who you're talking to like my my like we're saying right? I don't want to misspeak but like right Michael, but I let you give it a shot

You can I'm sure you will You will correct me if I'm wrong. But everybody's doing it for different reasons, right? So some would be doing it to lose weight. Some would be doing it to be more mindful. Some would be doing it for, you know, to help with their exercise regimen. Right, for mobility.

You know it's even funny. I actually, when I started, I didn't realize I said, this is weird because exercise and mobility in your habits are different, like we said, this is weird because exercise and mobility in your habits are different, like we said, right? I thought it'd be in the same, they're interconnected, right? Mobility, right, but you separate them.

So I guess, well, yeah, the simplest level, it's like imagine there's the exercise and then there's the recovery, there's like say stretching. And mobility encompasses more than just stretching, but it is more of the recovery movement, whereas like exercise is more of the exercise, the growth movement.

And I think it came out of the knowledge that I had of I won't stretch unless you make me. That's why I said that's why I'm saying. So it's gotta be in there. That is what I'm saying. And it's so important. It's so valuable when I stretch. When I have full range of motions on my joints

and like Michael's got incredible flexibility of his shoulders and I'm dead as a doorknob if I don't work on my shoulder girl. No, you're absolutely correct. And it's funny because again, we're talking about people don't like to do this things are not good at or they don't like to do. So I'll exercise all day,

but get me to stretch for three minutes. I'm not interested. So when I saw that I was like, oh shit, does that mean I have to actually sit there and stretch for three minutes. I'm not interested. So when I saw that, I was like, oh, shit. Like, I mean, does that mean I have to actually sit there and stretch for like, God, that's like watching paint right? That's why I'm bad at yoga. I'm bad at all. I'm just like, slow.

That's why for me, I wanted to do it more for the mindful stuff, the stretching stuff. Though things are like at a slower pace. Because. Well, and people that are like over stretched have the same opposite problem. You know, like people, like they're a lot of yoga injuries that happen because people overdo it.

Right. And they're not tight enough. They're not strong enough. So the balance between those two things I think is really, really important. Yeah. Especially as you get older. Absolutely. I'm surprised that you don't have any, like I shouldn't say it like that, but being a

crossfit coach, I always, I would, oh, in my head, I think you're gonna have an injury. Don't you have, do you have any injuries from CrossFit? I was really in, that was a shoulder surgery. I mean, I tore my shoulder to pieces doing CrossFit. Yeah, I was gonna say it can be like, it could be a very difficult thing for people who aren't fit. I find like, people go in there thinking, I'm gonna do CrossFit, right? And they're not even physically fit. Well, they don't really hurt themselves. Most people don't have a lot of patience. And they think most people, and this goes into the whole life challenge, thinking most people think a long time is six weeks.

Like that's a long time. I should be able to lose everything I need to lose in six weeks, and then I'm done, right? Right. Like, uh, no. Maybe you get to one is step one in six weeks, but I remember one of my first conversations with Greg Lassman was about my squad. And this back when he used to teach all the seminars.

I mean, like, I would have a personal, I had a personal relationship with him. He's like, yeah, you, and he looked at my squad and I've been a fitness coach for, at that time for about 10 years. And he said, yeah, you got about five years before you have a mature squat. I'm like, what? Five years? Like, I thought he was crazy. Yeah, wow. I'm like, yeah, he's, I still don't really have what I would think is a really mature squat. 100% true. I agree with you. Like when I squat and I go someone who's like a, a, a crossfit person or power, whatever it is, I look like, I'm not squatting properly,

you gotta get really low. It's really hard to do a proper crossfit squat. That in itself is difficult. Well, just like think of like, we've lost that ability, like look at kids. Kids can just squat. Because of mobility, it's all about the mobility and lost it yet. Yeah Yeah, as soon as we start sitting in chairs and sitting on toilets. Yes, we don't have to do that anymore

Right our range of motion becomes half the 50% of what we thought between like kindergarten and fourth grade or third grade You'll start to see kids really lose that ability because they're not running around playing as much anymore Not sitting on the floor anymore than not sitting in desks at school. And everything just starts to tighten up and shorten. It's the beginning of a long road that as adults, you know, to try to reverse. Yeah, it's a long road back. It's amazing, it's true, it's a long road back, right?

Once you lose it, it's even harder to gain it back again. My mom is eating four years old. She lives in a retirement village. And she is the, well, she says, she's the only person in the village that does workouts that involves her getting down on the floor and getting back up. Like, she doesn't do Turkish get ups,

but she'll do squat. She can go down to the bottom of a squat and hold a squat for like a minute. Like, I, because I told her once, I'm, she's like, she's very proud of herself. She learned how to squat, right? I'm like, oh, mom, that's great. I'm like, okay, how long can you hold the bottom of a squat? She goes, well, how long should I? I said, well, let's just see what you can do. And she went

down and she held it for like five seconds. And I said, well, honestly, you really should be able to hold that for minutes, not seconds. And she thought I was in, she had thought I was gonna lost my mind. That's crazy. For sure. But I planted a little seed. I didn't tell her what to do. I don't tell her what to do for her work out. She had a goal now.

She had a goal. And so she does this stuff. She does lunges. She does squats. She gets down on the floor and then back up. She's like, people are paranoid about falling. Because they don't have a way to get back up. I have to tell you, of course.

Especially when you're that age, of course. You're very paranoid about that because they don't have a way to get back up. Especially when you're that age, of course. You're very paranoid about that. Wow, that's so true. Well, the mobility thing is actually, it's important. Again, you said I have a lot of flexibility in my shoulders, but because of that, I didn't take care of them because I thought I didn't have to. I thought, oh, they're flexible enough. I don't need to do anything.

I ended up arthritis of my shoulder I ended up having my burst of remove it to my labematch on my rotator cuff I mean I had a full job on it Wow and it doesn't it's not because then that's why I think it's really important to point out like mobility It's not just about flexibility. That's a that's a little piece of it Yeah, but your the range of motion is not solely dependent on how stretchy your muscles are right no I think it's I think the way you guys laid it out with the set, those seven habits and the way they're laid out is actually quite amazing and it's quite brilliant and it does cover the gamut

of everything. I think so. I mean, Andy said that to me a couple of years ago and of course, I was like, I don't think that's right. Right. Of course you did. You got them fixed. And then I sat with it and I thought, okay, well, what else is there? If you really think there's something more, what else is there? And I actually, after a while, I couldn't come up with something that I thought was significant. Like, other things that we've come up with would actually fall under some of the categories that we already have.

And we really think there's a synergy if you do all of these seven habits. It's like nutrition is obviously going to affect your exercise positively. And exercise and mobility are going to affect each other, and it's both going to affect your ability to sleep and be pain-free, and sleep is going to improve all that, and nutrition and sleep work together. And then you're well-being, and you're hydrating. I mean, all of this stuff actually does more together than any of them can do by themselves. I agree.

That's why I have two waters here, because I knew you were going to be here, and I didn't want to be shunned by you, Michael. So, you've barely touched me. I know. I'm trying. That's the I have two waters here, because I knew you were gonna be here, and I didn't wanna be shunned by you, Michael. So you barely touched me. I know, I'm trying, that's the other one I'm not good at. You see that? That's why I just told you I'm not good at this whole, I'm not good at the hydration, the mobility, and the...

But she's like a gimme. I hate water. You're gonna face myself. I actually, honestly, of all of the seven habits, hydration is the hardest one for me. Really? Very difficult Just remembering to remember yeah, because I think I can like bury my I can get into work

And then actually you know it's like three hours later. Yeah, and I've been sitting on a stool for three hours I just drink your coffee. No, I don't forget that I agree But I have to spend my day and before I have a cup of coffee with hot glass of water and I have like a click of me Me too. I have a green powder that I mix with water also. So I have 24 ounces of water before I have a cup of coffee, if it's hot, that's a water. And I have like a, like a, me, I have a green powder that I mix with water also. So I have 24 ounces of water before I have coffee. But if I'm not really conscious of it, that's like the last water I'll drink in the day.

That's why I trick myself. I don't let myself to leave my bedroom until I have 16 ounces of water. And then when I get back, when I get downstairs, I have to drink another eight before I'm allowed to have coffee. Yeah, so it's like, things like that, but it's like habitual now, right? So this is all about building good habits and I'm all about building good habits.

So I guess you're trying to get to a point where it's where you're unconsciously competent. Right. You don't want to have to. I say putting as many things on autopilot as you possibly can so that your brain has room to, you know, think and do things that otherwise need more attention. But then your job is to find where you want to keep it expanding, right? That's our nature is to want to expand. Right.

So like right now, Michael's been doing this for years, but I was a slow learner. Or actually, I was scared. Like, I just started a five day water only fast. Today is day one, and I walked into your house, into this place. I don't even know if this is your house, but I walked in my house and it was like chocolate chip cookies They're I mean I smell everything on Star cookies, but I don't know what it was, but I'm like I gotta eat something like First of all, you're selling turkey burgers and that's why you're so hungry because this water diet

I know you're thinking right but it's the next It's for me it's for me, it's appropriate. Like, because I've been doing a lot of stuff, and I need some good... This is the whole other conversation. That's a much longer thing. That's a whole other thing. There's a lot of health benefits to fasting.

There's a lot of... I want to separate my mind from the idea that I need food. And back, if you go back... If you go back... If you're intermittent fasting and all that stuff. I've done intermittent fasting, yeah. Do you think it works for you? It works for you. I mean, it fasting, yeah. Do you think it works for you? Did it work for you?

I mean, it, yeah, I mean, it works. I mean, like, I find that I don't really need breakfast. Like, that's an odd thing because I used to be tied to breakfast. I had to have breakfast. It's all people's psychology, right? We were told for so many years that breakfast is the most important meal of the day. Yeah.

And now they're saying it doesn't matter. It's like, it's all like, and then in five year, in a year from now, it's gonna be the most important because it's a help to spark your, or like fuel your metabolism. Well, one of the vatius, I mean, that, that we know, there's no such thing as that thing. I know, but it's like your metabolism's a machine.

It cranks if you like, put like fuel into it. Right, right, right. If you think back, and you know, like the example of Arcade Mentimes, or even a couple hundred years ago, if you were out and you were not in a city, and you were not in an industrialized, agriculturally based place, you, food wasn't just readily available, right?

It was a, oh, there's food today? Oh, cool, I can eat. So, like this whole modern idea that food is just available wherever we are, there's a, I was gonna say there's a laziness. There's just a given that it's just here. Like we just become, I wanna kind of see if I can detach from that.

Like for a short period of time. We were talking this morning. And then you started last night after dinner. They call me, he's like, so so did you like put vinegar in your water? I mean like he was already like he really hadn't even had misdemeleon yet. Oh my gosh. Because I had him in fast. So I'm used to making it at least a lunch.

Right. And I was that's where I was but my brain was thinking about the next four days. Right. How am I going to do this? Right. And so one of the things I told him I said look because I've gone as long as four days. Right. How am I going to do this? Right. And so one of the things I told them, I said, look, because I've gone as long as seven days. And one of the things, the boast I got out of that fast was,

holy cow, I was so wrong about how much food I need on a regular basis. I mean, look, I wouldn't, I'm not just, you know, saying anybody should just jump into a fast. I was also a very healthy person when I started it. Right. But I didn't lose any weight. I mean, it didn't affect me in that way. You didn't lose any weight? No.

I exercised throughout the entire time. I didn't do full-scale hardcore weight lifting. Wait, wait, what were you doing? You're having a cup of coffee in the morning and I would just water throughout the day. So you just had water for seven days? Yeah. You didn't lose a pound. No.

And you exercise. How did you have any energy? Because our, so it'd be funny if we had this mechanism that we have that stores fat and then didn't like rely on it when you needed it. I mean, fat, you know, we use our fat stores when we don't have food. Right.

It's the food that we carry. I've probably, even though I'm a relatively lean guy, I probably still have enough fat to last for 30 days without food. So going for seven days is like, you're really naughty. I'm not even breaking the surface of what I could survive. Right, but you have to crank that part of your metabolism up. Like, your body's not going to access your stored fat

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Age and other restrictions may apply. For coverage, consult your health insurance company. Visit the pharmacy or our site for details. No, absolutely. But I'm just saying on a debt to like how your brain function for seven days, any food, any calories, any energy, just water. Your brain functions on ketones. Yeah.

Well, that's what they say, right? Keep the whole diet diet. That's why that diet is. So your brain needs either glucose or ketones. If you don't give it glucose, you're not going to get ketones right away unless you've already been in on a ketogenic diet. So that's why people really struggle sometimes in the first couple days of a fast because their body is still expecting sugar and it's not kicking into that ketogenic. That's what they say. You're feeling gross for the first couple days of a fast because their body is still expecting sugar and it's not kicking into that key to get it.

Right, so when that starts happening, you'll come out of that sort of hangover feeling that fog that people get. And for some people, it's easier than others. I mean, some people are more wired for it, some people are more ready for it. But I mean, I think the point here is that you, this is a journey and it's a continuum and you're constantly evolving and learning and when things are appropriate to try, like I would never recommend somebody go out

and do a five day water fast. If they haven't gotten themselves to the point where somebody like me is. Well, they should first do the whole life challenge. Of course. And it's kind of like, I totally agree with you. I think that you can't just say, it's not a one, it's not a one-size-fits-all. You're obviously in a different place than other people are, to even take, to even get to that place. I mean, I'm like, this is the worst idea. Right,

but it's an evolution of other things. I haven't done a water fast probably in at least a year. Like I just, I did it a few times and I just, I just haven't been felt the need to do it again. I'm going to look more into this water fast. Would you guys come back actually and talk about these water fasts and all this other stuff later? I may be happy too. I think there, yeah, I sometimes feel like I'm going to get myself into trouble when I start talking about the science of, like, of our topology.

You guys have to come back. All right, yeah, that's fine. We'll say, all of the things that he was contradicting me. So with the point, I rather have a better half, the nicer half, but that's okay. Well, it doesn't make it interesting. It does. I like it. I could be a comb half, the nicer half, but that's okay. Well, it does make it interesting. It does. I like it.

I can be a combative person too sometimes, so I think it can work, you believe it. I might do it. I'm on my best behavior because I don't know you guys that well. Yes, sir. But you'll see. Okay, guys, tell everybody where they can find the whole life challenge, where to find you, whatever, it's the whole life. Go ahead.

Yeah, hold it challenge.com. Everywhere I, I'm anti-petronic everywhere, like Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, whatever. That's the easiest way to find me. Michael Stanwick everywhere, I try to keep it simple. Not anti-petronic, I'm not a... I'm not a... No, no, no, no, I am my name.

Yeah. The whole life challenge starts four times a year. So we just, you know, as we're recording this, we're just now two days into the New Year's challenge. We start again in May, April, and then in July and then again in September. One of our actual development projects for this year is to start to consider developing a product that people can engage with between challenges and use year round. So this doesn't only be something that you missed by a week. Yeah, that's a good idea. But then it also gives someone,

it gives people something to look forward to, right? Sure. And- There's been a bit of it to both, and so it's been a very sketchy conversation for us. Well, a lot of people don't want to wait to start the project of their health and well-being, and it's like- It's procrastinating. And people are always looking for something, oh, should I try the whole FJ? Oh, it doesn't start for eight more weeks. I'll just go do something else. That's true. You're missing maybe a certain amount of people.

Yeah. But, you know, we can talk about it or you can let me know what you side. And either which way, I think you're going to, I think you have a lot of people on the program. Yeah. I think I wanted to, I want to tell you how it worked for me. And then I know I'm curious myself. And like, why don't we try and do some kind of like thing

with people, like doing some kind of big challenge like on the podcast, you know, maybe do like a giveaway of some kind or something like that. Let's talk about it after. Yeah. That sounds like cool. Cool. Well, thank you so much.

Cool life challenge, guys. Check it out. Um, whole life challenge.com. These guys are great. Thank you so much for coming on. Even you Michael, you're a pleasure. I appreciate it. I love it.

I love it. I love it. I hope you enjoyed this episode. I'm Heather Monahan, host of Creating Confidence, a part of the YAP Media Network, the number one business and self-improvement podcast network. Okay, so I want to tell you a little bit about my show. We are all about elevating your confidence to its highest level ever and taking your business right there with you. Don't believe me. I'm going to go ahead and share some of the reviews of the show so you can believe my listeners. I have been a long time fan of Heather's, no matter

what phase of life I find myself in, Heather seems to always have the perfect gems of wisdom that not only inspire, but motivate me into action. Her experience and personality are unmatched and I love her go getter attitude. This show has become a staple in my life. I recommend it to anyone looking to elevate their confidence and reach that next level. Thank you! I recently got to hear Heather at a live podcast taping with her and Tracy Hayes and I immediately subscribed to this podcast. It has not disappointed and I cannot wait to listen to as many as I can as quick as I can. Thank you Heather for helping us build confidence and bring so much value to the space.

If you are looking to up your confidence level, click creating confidence now. now.