Habits and Hustle - Episode 390: Lee Trink: Are We Raising a Generation That Can’t Handle Real Life? Discover What’s Holding Them Back
Episode Date: October 18, 2024Are today’s kids being set up for success, or are we making them too "soft" to handle real challenges? In a world full of participation trophies, helicopter parenting, and an overprotective culture,... the question arises: are we failing to prepare the next generation to face adversity? In this episode, I sit down with Lee Trink to discuss whether today’s parenting methods are doing more harm than good. We dive into why resilience is critical for success and how kids might be missing out on crucial life skills. Are we over-sheltering them, and what can we do to fix it? You won’t want to miss this eye-opening conversation. Lee Trink, former CEO of FaZe Clan, is a Gen Z expert and leader who has worked extensively with young talent, helping them succeed in high-pressure environments. With his experience, he brings valuable insights on how we can teach kids to be resilient in a world that's becoming increasingly soft. We Also Discuss: (00:01) - Generation Z Softness Concerns (04:08) - The Softening of Future Generations (13:46) - The Importance of Likability (24:35) - Qualities of Likability in Individuals (36:33) - The Power of Likability and Comedy (41:16) - Missed Opportunities in Podcasting Thank you to our sponsors: Therasage: Head over to therasage.com and use code Be Bold for 15% off TruNiagen: Head over to truniagen.com and use code HUSTLE20 to get $20 off any purchase over $100. Magic Mind: Head over to www.magicmind.com/jen and use code Jen at checkout. BiOptimizers: Want to try Magnesium Breakthrough? Go to https://bioptimizers.com/jennifercohenand use promo code JC10 at checkout to save 10% off your purchase. Timeline Nutrition: Get 10% off your first order at timeline.com/cohen Air Doctor: Go to airdoctorpro.com and use promo code HUSTLE for up to $300 off and a 3-year warranty on air purifiers. Find more from Lee Trink: Website: fazeclan.com Instagram: @leetrink X: @leetrink Instagram: @fazeclan Find more from Jen: Website: https://www.jennifercohen.com/ Instagram: @therealjencohen Books: https://www.jennifercohen.com/books Speaking: https://www.jennifercohen.com/speaking-engagements Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
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Hi guys, it's Tony Robbins. You're listening to Habits and Hustle. Crush it!
Before we dive into today's episode, I first want to thank our sponsor, Therisage. Their
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Welcome to this solo duo episode that we're doing today with my friend, Lee Trink. Hi.
Hello, Lee.
How are you, Jen?
Thanks for having me.
You're welcome.
Lee teases me.
Thanks for inviting me to your solo.
You're welcome. He keeps on teasing me because he said it's not a solo.
I'm sitting here. What do I know?
I know. But like I said in an earlier episode that it's more to have someone to kind of
debate with and go back and forth than we used to call them solo. So you're right.
Just thank you for joining me on this shorter episode.
My pleasure.
Today's topic is gonna be on likability.
And this is why.
It's my belief that in order to achieve
your most ambitious goals, no matter what they are,
before you have the grit, before you have the tenacity,
before you have the grit, before you have the tenacity, before you have the boldness, the precursor
to any of that is likeability.
Because if you're not likable, you're unable to have the boldness, let's say, to get away
with certain things or to ask for certain things because people will be less likely to help you if they're not likeable. So,
my first question to you, that's my opinion. I think likeability is the precursor for
everything. Would you tend to agree or disagree? So I agree, but I think likeability takes on many
forms. And also, if you're too likeable, then it actually doesn't work in your favor
because people I think treat you like a doormat, right?
Like I think defining what likability is is important.
I think the other thing I would say about people is some people like assholes.
You've done well.
I mean, look, there are plenty of people that would call me an asshole.
I'm sure.
I was going to say, you know what, there's always an anomaly.
I mean, it's true.
No, it's true.
But I would also say that like-
Do you think you're an asshole?
No, I don't think I'm an asshole, but I bet there are people who think I'm an asshole.
Why?
Why do you think people think you're an asshole?
I don't know, because I think that I'm confident and sometimes people will confuse confidence
for arrogance.
And I don't think I'm arrogant, but I think that I'm confident and I think I own my own
shit and believe me, I'm very far from perfect, but I own my own shit.
And you know what it is about you?
You're aloof.
I am aloof.
That's the word aloof.
I think people mistake arrogance for aloofness.
Like you could be aloof and people think you're arrogant.
Yeah, it depends on the context too, right? Okay. But do you think your aloofness or quote unquote arrogance, let's just say,
has worked to your advantage?
I think it's probably a mixed bag. I don't think I've ever suffered from a likeability problem,
right? I think that whatever it is, the full composite is interesting enough. Like I think sometimes
being interesting and maybe magnetism is another quality. Maybe it's a component of likeability
or maybe it's a counterbalance, right? Because I think if there are people, and forget about me,
I don't want to sit here and talk about me, but just thinking about people that other people
gravitate towards, right? I think that there's sometimes magnetism in those people
that comes with some other stuff that maybe
if you talk about those traits are not that likable.
Like maybe part of the reason I say that is
where my background working with a lot of musicians
and rock stars, like that is magnetism.
Likability is kind of not,
their rules of likability are not the same for regular
people. And I think that that also is the same for people in general. Like likabilities can take
on different forms. Okay, I'll tell you something that's interesting. So I listened to Jared Leto
on Leto, sorry, on Smart List the other day. I think I told you. So just quickly, Lee used to manage like still. I helped break 30 seconds to Mars as an artist.
Right. And Kid Rock and a bunch of these people, Katy Perry, a bunch.
But I was going to say, I listened to Jared and he was very likeable on the Smartless podcast.
Why? And this is where I'm going to get into it. I found him to have a lot of humility.
He had a sweet, he sounded to have like a softness and a sweetness about him.
And he had this like aw shucks type of thing.
And he also portrayed a good work ethic.
So if that, to me, that's what made him feel likable.
Now I know just as well as you do
that perception is not always reality and optics are optics.
But if he's going for being likable,
I think those are really key touch points to have.
And so at least he knows, he has a wherewithal to know
that to be likable, he has to have these certain things.
Now, I guess my first question is, is he really those things?
Oh, I think so.
Look, he's, I would also say he's one of the toughest guys
I've ever worked with, right. But he's also one of the most hardworking. So, you know, there are
things that balance each other out, right? Like, again, really difficult, but has a point of view,
and is able to deliver and does the work himself. So like, you know, I say, Okay, I'll take, I'll
take the sum of those parts.
Okay. So that's interesting, right? So then let's break it down. Like what, in your opinion,
do you think makes somebody likable? I think different. I think that there's not a one size
fits all in likability. I think some people make that all shock. I don't think he's an all shocks
likable, likable guy. He was on that podcast. I will tell you, I should, I should listen to it.
I told you, listen to it. Because he came across, I mean, he's like a mega,. I mean look. He was on that podcast. I will tell you. I mean it's interesting. I should listen to it.
I told you to listen to it.
Yeah, I know, I know.
Because he came across.
But I mean, he's like a mega,
like the guy is like an Oscar winning,
you know, actor and rock star, like, you know.
And the most beautiful human being on the planet.
The guy's 52 years old.
You can't get further away from aw shucks than.
No, no, no.
But look, he's not, and I also think in a way
he's gotten nicer in some ways
because he's accomplished so much
and I think that also helps, right?
Like if you're talking about the ultra successful.
He came a long way from my so-called life, number one.
Okay, like that was definitely not like he,
like we all probably, like me as a girl,
like we all have the biggest crush on him
we thought would never see him again. Like he looked like he all probably, like me as a girl, like we all have the biggest crush on him. We thought we'd never see him again.
Like he looked like he was a one hit thing
that just with a pretty face.
Next thing, who knew he was like this amazing actor,
this amazing musician.
And by the way, on that podcast, he was talking
about how he climbed the Empire State Building.
Like, I mean, like it's like, but legit, like climbed it.
But the reason why I'm saying that is,
let's just take it back a second,
because I think that you think, you think, I should say,
you think that there's a whole different, like, soup of,
a variety of different qualities
that makes somebody likable, depending on the situation.
I still believe, you're right.
I believe-
Yeah, I think whatever the 100% of likability is,
there's a dozen different traits.
You can have one of them, three of them, six of them,
in whatever combination, and you make it work as a package.
Okay, so let's just say there's a menu, right?
I still think there's foundationally things
that make people likable.
And the reason why I'm bringing this up
is because I think that if someone is not that likable,
they can improve their likability The reason why I'm bringing this up is because I think that if someone is not that likable,
they can improve their likability by working on some core elements.
I agree with that.
Okay?
So one of the elements that I think that makes somebody exceptionally likable is enthusiasm.
If someone brings enthusiasm to a situation or positivity, automatically they're going
to be more likable than someone who's a negative Nellie.
That's the first thing.
Okay.
I think the second thing is humility.
That's why when Jared Leto showed humility to me,
I found it to be something that I like took note of.
I think, you know, the idea that you're not
braggadocious, that you have a humbleness about you,
I think it's very, very attractive.
And it doesn't matter if you're a guy or a girl.
The other thing I think is super likable is someone who's very generous,
generous with your time, generous with not just, not money,
but just like generous in like your thoughts and your time and always available
to be generous to help somebody. Those are some of them.
I mean, there's other ones as well.
So I want to, I want to push back on some of those, on the requirement of,
if you're saying those are like requirements
for like ability answers.
No, not requirements.
Those are, they're key.
The kind of foundational core, yeah.
And there's other ones too.
I think there are other ones too.
Like let me give you an example of one trait
that can make up for deficiency
and even like the wrong direction of some of those traits.
Sense of humor.
I think if you have a sense of humor,
you can, that makes up for a lot of things.
First of all, people, they can't help themselves.
If you can make somebody laugh,
you disarm them from a lot of things.
And so if you are somebody with no humility,
but you have a good sense of humor,
it's just disarming enough and people will like you
despite the fact that there are traits
that they dislike about you.
Totally true.
Name somebody that you think of.
Like think of somebody that you know
who has a really good sense of humor,
but like is kind of like an asshole.
Look, I'm gonna go back to just well-known.
You?
No, I mean, I think I use humor sometimes to do that.
I'm not as funny as I used to be.
That's a whole other podcast.
But I'm going to pick, you know, instead of picking a, you know, Joe Schmo that nobody knows, I'll pick somebody that people know, like Kid Rock.
Kid Rock is funny. Kid Rock can also be a huge asshole.
And now, look, if putting aside the rockstar factor
that nobody can just add on to themselves, right?
Which also kind of masks, people tolerate a lot of stuff,
but even forget about that.
Let's talk about like our friends
who that rockstar part doesn't really matter much to them.
But he can be an asshole,
but his antidote to that is he is funny. He's really funny. And that is a counterbalance. And
he's not always an asshole. And he happens to have some of those other traits that you talk about.
He is generous. He's generous with his friends. He's generous with his time. He's generous with
his money in being a philanthropist, although he doesn't talk, but I think if we're talking about humor,
he uses humor really well.
Frankly, even Jared, Jared is funnier
than most people would think he is,
because that's not what he portrays his life.
What he leads with is not humor.
Sometimes, and I would even say that about me,
like I don't necessarily lead all the time with humor.
Some people might find it surprising that I'm funny
or that I think I'm funny.
Yeah, I would never describe you as funny,
but you're humorous.
Like you could be, like very,
I know when you're in a good mood
because you're more levity to you,
but that's another one, levity.
I think when people have levity,
but I think the people have levity,
but I think the sense of humor to me is such a good one.
Yeah, you don't need it to be likable,
but boy is it great in your bag of drugs.
That's a really true, okay, name another one.
Another trait?
Yeah.
Maybe this is related to funny, but it's not.
If you're like, I have, there's a friend of mine now
that he's just fun.
He's a guy- Do I know him? When you're sitting, my buddy Joe. I a friend of mine now that is just fun. He's a guy.
And you're sitting.
Do I know him?
My buddy Joe.
I don't know if you've ever met him.
I know you talk about him all the time.
I don't know him.
So, like, he's a guy that you could sit at, you know,
sit at a table and he'll turn whatever these objects
into a game, right?
He does things like that all the time.
And it's silly and it's goofy.
And it's not like, he's just fun.
He's always looking for fun.
And he's somebody people gravitate to.
He's by the way, he's a huge pain in the ass, huge.
He's one of the biggest pains in the asses that I know.
And people tolerate it from, they tolerate things from him
that they don't tolerate from anybody.
I'm talking about, I'm really doxing, you know,
I'm doxing my friend, but all my friends would agree.
We tolerate things from Joe because he's fun to be around.
Even if he makes it excruciatingly difficult.
Even to coordinate time with.
Okay, I thought, you know what?
I didn't say one that I think is really important
is authenticity.
I think if someone has authenticity, they're a real person
that is automatically likable in a real way.
Cause like what I was gonna say earlier was that if you're funny and have a great sense of
humor, yeah, like you're super likeable to someone maybe on the surface, like, oh my god, I love them,
they're so funny. And so like, I would like to hang out with them or like they I get a kick out
of them. But like, would I take it a step further and actually want to be really close friends with
them? That's like a different level of likeability. So I think when someone is actually authentic and real,
that like makes somebody not just likable,
but someone that you really, really wanna invest time in
and build a friendship and relationship with.
I think part of it is consistency, right?
Like authenticity is kind of akin to consistency.
It means that like who they purport to be
is who they really are.
So you're not gonna get some random,
you're not gonna get some volatile personality
or some differing personality.
So you feel more confident investing time in them
because you're like, this is the genuine article.
This is this person.
And also it makes you,
I think it's part of magnetism, right?
People gravitate to authenticity and people reward it, right?
People reward authenticity in a world
that's kind of increasingly, you know,
Instagram versus reality.
Phony, exactly.
Okay, so what qualities would you say
make someone really unlikable, besides phoniness?
Yeah, I think phoniness is one of the worst, right?
Like if people think you're phony, most people are just out.
Unless they need you, unless they need you,
most people are out.
Do you know what I think is really a dislikable quality?
I think pretentiousness.
I think it's such an ugly quality.
And why there's such a disconnect for me
is that like so much of Instagram and social media
is based around this like pretense that you have a lot of
money that you have a plane that you have like this nice house,
when all of these things could be rented by the hour, and most
people know it. And yet they're being applauded for these
things. Like, I guess the disconnect for me is like, the
pre even though pretentious pretentious people are such an
unlikable trait,
it's been like glamorized with social media.
I don't get it.
So I'm gonna play a little devil's advocate
because there's not a one size fits all.
There are plenty of pretentious people
who hang out amongst themselves.
That that's the language they use.
It's like they're peacocking for each other, right?
And they're, you know, I would say there's probably
country clubs that are like filled with pretentious people
and not to paint with a broad brush.
That's so true though, you're right.
And they kind of like birds of a feather
flock together.
Yeah, they flock together, right?
So like then it becomes like, you know.
Are you pretentious?
I don't think so.
I think I'm not, I think I'm earnest.
But I-
Poor Lee, he's in a hot seat.
No, but look, I think that,
I think I'm misunderstood by a lot of people,
but it doesn't, it also, I'm not really,
it doesn't concern me because it's never slowed.
I think whatever the composite of what I am
is interesting enough for people. I have no shortage of friends, no
shortage of opportunities. And so if any of those things are a
problem, they're a problem for me and things in my own head,
rather than an obstacle to anything. But I don't think I'm
pretentious. I think that I think that I'm actually quite
earnest and and, you know, I think almost the what is a sign
of being not pretentious,
which I think is something that I do constantly is I'm self-deprecating. Back to Jared Leto,
he's extremely self-deprecating and that's disarming for people.
Yes. So that's, okay, so let's say that, let's like leave it with that.
So is Kid Rock to some extent self-deprecating.
So I think that, I think that's a really, that's a really great one too. Being self-deprecating. So I think that's a really great one too. Being self-deprecating disarms people.
So I guess at the end of the day, what makes somebody likable is their ability to be
self-deprecating enough to disarm, or not self-deprecating, sorry, is their ability to
be disarming enough. Like you could have, basically you could have any negative quality,
but if you are disarming enough, then you can get away with it.
I go back to what I said before. There are a dozen, maybe there's 20 traits. And as long as
your cocktail tastes good at the end, whatever ingredients you pull in and counterbalance your
flaw, look, we all have flaws. We all have things that we don't like about ourselves,
maybe other people don't like about us,
but if you can kind of mix that cocktail in a way
that tastes good for people, that's it.
And it means that you don't, you know,
you can have a glaring hole in that list,
even in some of the foundational ones,
if you've got this other trick up your sleeve
that you're great at, like again, the humor.
Humor like almost will cover, like, if you're like almost other trick up your sleeve that you're great at, like again, the humor. Humor like almost will cover it.
Like almost the funnier you are,
and I'm not talking about slapstick
or like slip on a banana peel funny,
like that's not what people value,
but if you're funny enough,
that genuinely can make up for so many shortcomings.
And look, frankly, if you think about comedians,
comedians tend to be,
put me again, painting with a broad brushstroke,
fairly damaged people.
Oh, totally, I agree.
Like if you talk to people that have personal relationships
with or romantic relationships with comedians,
they'll give you chapter and verse
about what a nightmare somebody is.
But being funny as hell covers up for a lot of it.
1000%. By the way, did you, I think, I don't know if you knew this or not, but I moved
to LA because I got a job to work with a comedy manager because my biggest obsession is like
standup comedy. I love comedy more than anything. I love to laugh. I love standup. And I moved
to LA. I was working with a really big agency, a very well-known one and a big
comedy manager. I literally lasted seven days and that was even too long because the actual business
of it and what you really, when you peel back the curtain or you peel back the whatever that is,
the onion, whatever, and you see what actually happens in these people's real lives.
It's so different than what you think.
You think because they're hilarious on stage,
they're gonna be hilarious.
Oh my God.
And sometimes they are and sometimes they're not.
Mostly they're depressed and difficult
and super neurotic that I literally was like,
okay, I'm out.
I wanna do this as a hobby, as a pastime,
but not as a job because of that.
It's funny, if I think back of like one of the things
I've missed in my career is that I would have loved
to participate in, and it's never too late,
but it's comedy.
Like I'm a student of comedy.
I like the math of comedy.
I think comedy is math to some extent.
I like the, I never thought of myself
as a standup comedian.
Like that's not the direction I don't think that,
but the business of comedy and comedy,
I'm infatuated with comedy and I've always thought back
and said, man.
You can still do it.
Of course, yeah.
Yeah, I almost joined Groundlings late in like a decade,
like less, maybe less than 10 years ago.
Why didn't you ever do it then?
I was busy, I was busy, but yeah.
You could do it now.
I suppose I'm busy now too.
Well, you'll always be busy.
I mean, this is a whole, we're gonna do a whole,
but you know what, our next podcast is gonna be about that.
About comedy?
Yeah, or about like-
Or about missed opportunities.
Missed opportunities.
Yeah, I don't even know if it's,
I don't wanna call it a missed opportunity.
I would just say a road not traveled, right?
Like, you know, I have another,
a good idea for a podcast for us, although I actually started thinking about writing a book about traveled, right? Like, you know, I have another, a good idea for a podcast for us,
although I actually started thinking about
writing a book about it, but.
Really?
Okay, well we should do it then.
Okay, well Lee, we gotta wrap this
cause they're supposed to be short solos slash duos.
So guys, if you are listening to this podcast,
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always give me a suggestion. Thank you for being on the podcast.
Absolutely. Thanks for having me.
And bye.