Habits and Hustle - Episode 48: Shaun Neff – Founder of Neff Headwears, Advisor, and Investor

Episode Date: January 28, 2020

Shaun Neff is an Entrepreneur, Advisor, Investor, and the founder of Neff Headwear. Shaun, known as a brand whisperer, is praised for specializing in placing his product in the right place at the right time. In this episode, we hear about the scrappiness Neff used to kickstart his headwear company and the clever methods he used to get brand visibility. He mentions that every entrepreneur needs three things to dream, believe, and hustle. This is a special episode for any entrepreneur at any stage in their journey.  Youtube Link to this Episode Shaun’s Instagram ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ Did you learn something from tuning in today? Please pay it forward and write us a 5-star review on Apple Podcasts. 📧If you have feedback for the show, please email [e-mail]  📙Get yourself a copy of Jennifer Cohen’s newest book from Habit Nest, Badass Body Goals Journal. ℹ️Habits & Hustle Website 📚Habit Nest Website 📱Follow Jennifer – Instagram – Facebook – Twitter – Jennifer’s Website Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Welcome to The Habits and Hustle Podcast. A podcast that uncovers the rituals, unspoken habits and mindsets of extraordinary people. A podcast powered by habit nest. Now here's your host, Jennifer Cohen. Welcome to Habits and Hustle. We have a really special guest today. We have Sean Neff. And for those of you who don't know who Sean is,

let me just tell you that he is known as the brand whisperer. He has, he's basically a huge investor. He's a big entrepreneur and obviously very good with building brands. Some of his companies have been Neff. We'll get into that, Sunbomb, and he does, like basically he has a company right now, an oral care company with Kendall Jenner.

So welcome, Sean. What's up? What's up? You're putting me to work here on this treadmill. I know, I put everybody to work. That's pass out in like two minutes. Or fall? Yeah, or fall.

Well, you can always hold on to the sides. Yeah, I'm doing that. If you get kind of, you know, unstable. But the whole idea back basically is to kill two birds of one stone, you know, burn some calories, get your blood flow going while we talk. I need that. I'm glad we can be of service here. Oh my God, my Cafe. Just don't forget to get that. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So okay, who gave you the name, Brand Whisperer? Actually Forbes did. So I did an article and just kind of told my story about my journey, how it started several different companies, I've invested in brands, and just was kind of

riffing with this editor. And then like a month later, the story came out. And it was just like, you know, Sean Neff, the brand whisperer, right? And I was kind of like, whoa, like, that's amazing. Because me, I like brand things and build businesses for a living. And I'm like, I don't even think I could have came up with a title that's rather than that. So I kind of just took it.

And I'm like, I love that. A, it's rad that Forbes gave it to me. And I just thought it was cool. So that's a great title. The nickname. Well, it's a great nickname, especially if you are somebody who builds brands. And I mean, there's no other big or compliment

than that, really. Yeah. No, I liked it. So then how did you like start your journey? Because your first company was called Def Neff, right? And it's in the, in the, in the surfing kind of active where we're okay. So how did that whole, how did you begin?

Yeah, so I grew up in Southern California was always, you know, into surfing, skating, snowboarding, kind of as an activity and something I love to do. And then at a young age, I was just always super intrigued with branding. Like for me, it was like, okay, I'm in high school. First day of school. I'm like, what logo am I gonna rock on my chest, right?

So it was like such a big deal because it meant like, what music I'm into, what I did on the weekend, what culture I'm buying into. So I was always like a brand geek on like what it meant for me to be a consumer and buy something and why was I buying it? So that intrigued me so much that I was always like,

I wanna start my own brand. I would love to create something that maybe someone would love as much as I love buying this teacher or going to this skate shop and how it made me feel. So with that, I just as a freshman in college, I put my last name, Neff, because I tried to trademark a couple of other names, and they weren't available.

So I got frustrated and it was funny. The thought went through my head. If you've heard the brand of Hurley, I was like, oh, Bob used his last name. I can use mine. It was just like a simple thought and it was four letters and could look good on a tag. So I put my last name on t-shirts,

was running around college. I'd find like kids walking to class. It had like dope sneakers and I was like, yo, if I wanted to buy a t-shirt, I was just literally selling t-shirts out of my backpack and put like, neck stickers on the stop sign. Had like the cool dudes getting at the skate park, rocking it, like the rad DJ,

kind of created this cool little buzz. And then I started hanging out with a bunch of different pro snowboarders and like snowboarding with them. And I was always trying to get them to wear my t-shirt. And they were like, I can't wear your t-shirt. I'm on like, Burton and Nike and Oakley

and they had all these deals. And I was like, okay, I've never t-shirt. I'm on like Burton and Nike and Oakley and they had all these deals. And I was like, okay, I've never seen a deal. I've never seen a contract. Can I see one? And I took it home and read through it. And it said nothing about head wear. So I was like, man, I was like, do you think I can put naff on like a hat or a beanie

and they can wear it? And it doesn't conflict with their endorsement deals. I said, that seems too obvious. Like, but that was kind of my window of opportunity where I was like, I'm gonna go with it because legally I think I can do this. And I didn't want to make a beanie or a hat. So the true story is I went to a 99 cent store,

like Mad Ghetto with like 40 bucks rolled into the store and Box some of the ugliest headbands and beanies you've ever seen in a Sharpie and I literally just wrote neff on these dollar headbands and I showed up to an Olympic televised event and Handed out a bunch of these ghetto beanies talking to agents saying hey, he can rock it This could be cool, right? And I like oh, maybe, maybe, but they're probably going to get in trouble. And that day, some of the top guys in the world wore my last name on their channel and got on TV. So you literally just saw that opportunity in the contract.

And then you basically had a lot of your very resourceful. So you always just resourceful as a kid, kind of being able to figure out stuff like that, because I mean, that's clever. You saw the contract and you just, you knew. Mm-hmm. Yeah. I think I was always a kid that kind of just drove and I was very competitive and like even if it's down to like playing ping pong with my brothers, it's like, I have to win. Like, I'm gonna win. Yeah, yeah. So for me, I think I've always had this like super heavy drive just to figure it out and to try to win in per se.

So I think for me, I'd already invested so much time and energy into Neff and selling t-shirts. And I hit this wall. So I think I was just figuring out so many different ways how I can break through and get relevant people that had big followings that can help blow up the brand rocking it. So I think it was just one of those moments where I read the contract and the brain was just spinning and I was just like, wow, that could be an avenue. But it helped, I guess that you had the relationships with these big time pro surfers or pro.

Because I mean, did anybody kind of give you pushback? Like, I don't know, man, I'm scared. Like, what if I wear it and they take away my Nike contract? Because it's such a fine line, especially in a company's pain, you so much money. Yeah, yeah, it was. I think I'd been hanging out with a handful of them. Yeah.

And they kind of knew me. I was young. I was like the same ages them or if not younger. So I think it felt very like non-competitive, right? Just kind of like whatever, it's like he's got these beanies. So for me, and we initially put on, I don't know, in the first six months

we probably had 30 of the biggest pro snowboarders in the world. Like kids from Europe and South America and all over the world, right? And what I did was try to get like the coolest dudes, right? Yes, they were big pro athletes, some of the best writers in the world, but it was all about image, right? Because for me, it wasn't about, oh, I'm gonna go off and win the Olympics or do well on X-Games. It was like, how's this dude rocking his pants? Right.

Cause he had good style. And headwear at the time was kind of underserved. It was, you know, Burton and all the big guys made beanies, but it was like, you know, they're focused on boards. They're focused on bindings, outerwear. So like, beanie would be like the last thing, the Herrian Design 20 of them. So I just honed in and made the Radis looking ones and kind of got the culture and a bunch of these athletes behind it to where it felt like a group of support. So it

wasn't about one dude getting in trouble. It was about like a combination of dudes. A bunch of dudes. Like a lot of the coolest dudes in snowboarding would have all gotten in trouble. So did you kind of just snuck in there? Did you get like, yeah, but that's how you have to do it sometimes. Did you get a huge, so people started seeing that, did you get some kind of massive order from like a department store? How did you start selling these things to people who saw these beanies? Yeah, it's like the game's so different now in building brands. I look at how we started Neff and then these brands

now were launching with some of the biggest talent in the world. It's like night and day strategy. But back to the Neff days, it was very like, there was no social media. There was no, it was like you had to resonate in small little spaces, which I kind of love in theory because it gives you time to figure out your brand.

You can like test a certain market. You can work with a couple retailers. What's working, what's not. Whereas nowadays you're on blast. Day one, the world knows. And you're just trying to figure it out. So at Neff, we started initially just with, like our first store was Milo.

It was like Milo and it was this little snowboard shop that was rad and they literally brought in, like even our first product was so ghetto. I was buying hats and beanies from another company that was already making hats and beanies. And I literally would take the beanies and I'd buy some where they just had woven labels on it. And rip it off.

And I would rip it off, right? And then my wife had an aunt that lived like 20 minutes down from where we lived. And we'd go down and she'd sew all these little neff labels on it because I didn't want to make a beanie. And so it started super small in like core shops and then it expanded. And the next thing that I kind of jumped on, which was another good step in blowing up the business, was it's all about sales reps back then. It was like, so I went to the guy in SoCal that did,

you know, he did Burton. So he was, you know, Burton at the time was the biggest snowboard brand in the world. So from LA to like Santa Barbara, he was in like a thousand stores. Aren't they still the who's the biggest brand right now? Yeah, I mean, they're still one of the biggest for sure. But, you know, once again, I found that niche to get athletes, right? And then I was like, okay, cool. If the athletes can do it, then I need to go find these big sales reps that are walking into these stores every day, already selling the best brand. And that's how I'm going to get in, right? So I locked in him as my first ever rep.

And he would walk in and you can imagine him walking in. It's the Burton guy shows up. So these big shops are going, whoa, when it comes November to March, 60% of my revenue is coming from that guy. Right. So he comes in. It's a big deal. He shows Burton. And then at the end, he brings out these little bag of beanies and is like, yo, here's this cool new brand neff. Here are all these crazy athletes rocking it. And every shop was like dope. Like there's not a beanie brand. And those are killer athletes. And we just got in distribution doing that.

And for the first two or three, well even like first four or five years, we were just in little mom and pop surfskates and shops keeping it super tight. Do you think like a lot of people, that it becomes very confusing when I think I see a lot of times, people put out so many skews and they try to do everything versus just focusing on one thing

and doing it really well and being known for that. Do you see that company? It's like that's how they fail a lot of times. Yeah, I think in the beginning, and for the life of your brand, you need to know who you are It's like pick your lane stay in your lane Right know what you're great at and go and even for me personally

I've been able to figure that out over these last several years like I now know my lane Like I know this on net lane, right? I went from Being a CEO and and like I remember reading Jack Welch books. Like, oh, great to see you. And I'm like, raw, I'm like so excited to be this big time CEO one day. Yeah. And I will never have that title ever in my life

because that's just not my skill set. That's not what I'm great at. Yeah. I was able to do it. And now I've built several companies that I can be a CEO, but I know my lane, right? To ideate brands to find, you know, unique opportunities in the market that are under serve that I can come in and disrupt real quick and then hire the right people to execute.

So for brands, yes, you got to stand your lane. And part of the genius of Neff was we just made beanies for like four or five years. It was just like, we're the beanie company. It wasn't another beanie company. So every story you walked into, the reps are like, hey, like there's 10, there's 15 snowboard companies to choose from, there's 15 sneaker companies, there's one beanie company. I'm surprised like nobody saw the success

and decided to duplicate it. Yeah, I mean, after we started, there was definitely dedicated beanie brands. And now, since that, there's been a ton. Right. But we were the first, like, especially for snowboarding. You're like, that's why I was shocked, because I was like, that's what's on their head.

They're like winning contests, and they're getting interviewed. It's like, neph on their head. That's what's gonna say. I'm so surprised that Nike or Burton, or all these people wouldn't like kind of tap into that, right? Because it's the first thing that you see, right? Visually. Yeah, I was shocked too. I mean, even when it first read that contract, I was like,

oh, here's the dice roll. It works. And it kind of worked. And over the time, you know, after, after we blew up and then, Neff, we started expanding and doing watches and socks and apparel and backpacks. And we kind of turned into a lifestyle brand and at that stage, the athletes got locked in. And then the other thing that actually was random, that came in pretty heavy on our business was the energy drink thing.

So like Red Bull Monster, Rockstar, everyone started coming into action sports and I had always owned everyone's head. So then all of a sudden these guys wanted to own the head. So if you look at all the big you know beverage deals it's all headwear deals. So for the first several years it was crazy like Neff it already kind of blow up blown up and for a lot of years we were making monsters, beanies and rock stars beanies so it would have a net flow go in a rock. So I was trying to get in there as much as I could, but you know, those guys were spending so much money.

Well, yeah, I was gonna say, did you then have to start paying your friend's slash after eventually? Yes. So start wearing yourself like a contract like anybody else would have to get. So how many beanies did you end up selling? Oh, God. Like millions and millions and millions and millions. And I don't even, I mean, yeah, we would sell three, four million a year, right?

Right, because we've probably sold, I don't know, 30, something million beanies. Because was it that your revenue was like almost half a billion dollars in beanies or what was that? Yeah, so we've, I mean, the company as of now, right? And I've, you know, I sold majority of the business about five years ago, and then we sold the whole thing about two and a half years ago.

So I'm like not involved in my little baby anymore, which is kind of interesting, but, yeah, the business is done, you know, over half a billion, you know, in retail sales, which is kind of interesting. But yeah, the business is done, you know, over half a billion, you know, in retail sales, which is pretty crazy. And then when you sold it, who did you sell it to? Yeah. So the first, the first gig, we sold it to private equity, to private equity company. And then the second, when we sold the whole thing, we sold it to a company called Matt Engine, which is just kind of like a licensing company. And then how much did you sell it for?

Not that. I mean, good amount. I'm good amount. Okay, I know you don't want to tell me, but. It's all private stuff. Was it less or more than 50 million? Just less or more. And I won't ask another question.

You won't ask another question. No, I won't ask. Yeah, I mean, the value of the company was yes, probably more than 50 million. Okay, okay, that's fair enough, okay fine. So I'll leave you at that, but normally I would, you know, keep on asking. I would drill, yeah, I would drill.

But for the, because this podcast only is a certain, we have a lot certain amount of time, kind of, but that's awesome. So then, did you, before you started, Nath, I want to ask you this, did you have any money? Did you come from a place where they gave you, you raised money or you had family money? Like how did you even start Nath in the first place?

Yeah, because now you're a huge investor, I get it. But yeah, so Neff was awesome. It was, you know, I had, still have an amazing dad. Okay. So, I was, you know, freshman and college had the idea. Right. And, you know, initially it was a minimal amount of cash, right? Right. Several thousand dollars. I've noticed what the initial startup cost was. And then started getting traction and then we started getting like distributors in Canada and people that wanted to buy a lot of beanies and I'm like, whoa, I don't have money to buy the beanies to be. So my dad from the beginning was always amazingly supportive and he kind of

saw my vision in my drive and my my dad ended up, you know, in the early stages of the business, putting in some capital. And, you know, he had some equity in the company. And it was just rad, right? I mean, now looking back as my first hurrah, and the first business I started to have someone like my dad, who I trust, who was always there giving me the insights and being a realist on a bunch of stuff

was kind of a great advocate. So we went and scaled that business just on our own forever. We never raised capital. We never had outside investors. And whenever we had to step up and we had a good relationship with the banks and with Wells Fargo help us, you know, really scale our business.

But, you know, my dad was always there if he needed to grow. And then, yeah, we ran a smart tight ship that grew every year, you know, and was a profitable business. And we ended up doing that until we exited. What is your dad, is he a business guy? Guess he... He's a kind of a tax lawyer. Oh, okay.

So he was where his real value was, is like setting up the company on the trademarks and all that stuff that's really important. Super valuable for sure. So then, then you started with all these other big brands, right? So Sunbung was the other one that you were a big investor in. Yeah, so Sunbum, it's a cool story. I was just, you know, chilling one day in my phone ring from just a buddy of mine that I went to college with and he said, hey, there's like this guy

that lives down the street that has and was a part of this brand called Sunbomb. And it's a small little sun care business and they need money. And they're very interested in you helping them out, maybe funding, putting in some cash and you've obviously built a brand enough. So.

They seem also like very like, there's like synergy there, right? From like surfing sun, you know, there's like synergy there right from like surfing sun Yeah, you know, there's a lot of like I think I think they saw in me that I Yeah, they're going in the path of all these surfskates. No shops, and I just built you know Neff through that whole channel very successfully, but yes, some of them was was incredible. I mean You know at the time they needed you know some money and I ended up funding The business and at the time they needed some money and I ended up funding the business.

And at that time, six or seven years ago, I became the second largest shareholder of Sunbum, which was awesome. And the team did an incredible job operating the business. So I didn't operate the business. I was just there kind of this investor and advised on targeting some of of the big retailers and that. But yeah, and we just sold that company

like seven or eight weeks ago to SC Johnson. So that was another kind of life changing moment. That's like a big win. Like do you have any losses or just win, win, win, win. Yeah, you know, I mean, there's always, there's always little losses here and there, right? I mean, fortunately, always there's always little losses here and there, right? I mean, fortunately, a lot of them have been wins, but there's been small little projects or investments that I put money in and I'm like, I leave them, you know, know if the company's

going anymore, right? I'm at a handful of those. And and then there's some ones I've been a part of those and and then there's some ones I've been a part of just start up stuff kind of outside my kind of specialty that I've maybe put money in and helped do a couple things but yeah anything that I've really put time energy into and had focus in my own capital in has turned out pretty well so far. So, but you're not going to put it. Yeah, it's close to no. Yeah, there you go. There you go. This episode is brought to you by Vonage. Is your business ready to integrate live video chats into your

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military community for the past 100 years USA a get a quote today. I think yeah, so just because you said you focus on the South that you're good at right yeah, and then you let the people or you balance it out by finding people are let the people who are good at what they do, do what they do. Like staying in your lane is super important to success overall. Yeah, I think now, you know, now it's different, right?

Because I've been fortunate enough to have a couple exits and I've advised for amazing companies over the year, like Sony and Target. And, you know, retail are five below and there's a handful of other big ones. But, so for me, I've always been, you know, very active and all that I'm doing and have a lot on my plate. And, for me, I've kind of got to this level now

where I just love ideating. I love, like, one of the things I do is I spend a lot of time at retail. I'm just like a weirdo all walk around stores and even one of our brands we launched called Moon. I used to chill and hang out in the aisles and for me the oral care aisle was just like the ugliest aisle in the store. I just sit there and be like okay you got these big blue and green big bottles and these big plastic things and then you've okay, you got these big blue and green big bottles and these big plastic things.

And then you've got this same big red, white, and blue sea that I've seen ever since I was a kid. And I'm kinda just going, compared to the beauty aisle. Right, right, I'm just going, wow, this doesn't look great. There's no good design here, there's no. So for me, I've been able to kind of know what I'm good at, which is kind of finding either A great products,

where I think there's room for something new, right? Because anytime you start a company, I always think like, okay, imagine you're gonna have to go sit with a buyer, and the buyer is gonna say, okay, I'm the buyer of oral care, you know, it target and they're gonna be like, my business is great, it's too late and just fine. I'm selling a lot of toothpaste and a lot of mouthwash

and a lot of toothbrushes. They really don't need anything more. So you gotta come in with a massive point of difference and convince them that they're gonna take a brand off the shelf that's probably performing and put yours on and take a risk. So I think I've been fortunate enough and it's just kind of how I'm wired that I can kind of see stuff that could be better and then turn that into product which, you know, oral care wasn't just that, you know, oral care was something that always just looked ugly on

your shelf. It's like if your friends are coming over, you're hiding it. So I'm kind of like, yo, make it look dope next to like the Chanel bottle, right? And make it look something that's clean. And it's like the soft touch on the packaging, it feels good. And there's a whole experience. But then what made the oral care thing really smart is no one ever had an oral beauty conversation. Because there's so many beauty regiments, that no one ever talks about your oral care and routine

in the beauty regiments. So that's kind of how my brain works. It's kind of like, whoa, the aisle, making it look better. Is that good enough? Probably not. Oral beauty. Oh, that's insane.

And then we created this skew, this whitening pen, and it's like, this could be disruptive and a massive skew. And I'm like, who's going to tell the story? Right.? And it's like who's the biggest superman in the world, Kendall Jenner. So like I went to Kendall's house and I was like, yo here's Moon, here's the concept. More from our guest, but first a few words from our sponsor. Did you know 24 million Americans? That's more than the population of Florida want to work for themselves by the year 2021. population of Florida want to work for themselves by the year 2021. But sadly 35% of them cite inconsistent income as one of the biggest things holding them back.

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And you can start your free trial today. I love what you say. I just like what the Kendall's house, right? Because most entrepreneurs can just wander into the, into Kendall Jenner's house easily and just say, hey, I got an idea for you. People get arrested being doing that, right? Exactly. So like, I'm glad that you said that. So then how did that, so there's two things. Number one, my first question is, do you need celebrity, quote unquote, to help push products now? That's my first part of my question.

And secondly, how did you just walk into, what was, what was the thing? Do you have a lot of relationship with celebrities that now you're have a lot of relationships with celebrities that now you're doing a lot of partnerships? Or... Yeah, so let's start on the relationship tip. So at NEP, we started with big, source gates, no athletes. And then I partnered with Snoop and Deadmouse

and Wiz Khalifa and Future and Scarlett Johansson, Kevin Durant, right? So it's a massive list. But not just massive lists. You're going after these people are all A-list. Yes. You're not dealing with a bunch of randoms that are on some reality show. Yeah, and no offense of anyone on the reality show. No, we love everybody.

We love everybody. I'm just saying. Yeah, so look at Neff, it was all about people of influence, right? So when it first started, I knew we were going after the Surskates No Market, which back then was just like the thriving youth culture market. Like today, it's a lot tougher. Because back then, it was like, Surskates No Shops were like the cool stores. Yeah.

And then it's not really that anymore. So where kids are getting trend and what have you. So I was able to stay focused with those athletes, but then I knew if I'm gonna blow up this brand and Neff was in like 72 countries and was a global business, I knew I had to have massive people, right? So Snoop was the first one I signed.

So I was very... How'd you get to Snoop? Yes, I got to Snoop randomly. One of our accounts, it was called like CCS. It was like a big male catalog order thing that you can do online of search gates, no products. I was sitting with the buyer and he said, hey, I went to college with this guy, Nick, who's now managing and working all of Snoop's deals.

So I was like, oh, like, hook me up. So I went and had lunch with Nick and we talked about Nef and everything. And at that time, there was already like little Wayne and a bunch of guys were already rocking Nefbeni. So it was all, it was like, this cool vibe already. So I said, hey, let's do a capsule collection. And the timing was insane. We had, it was like two weeks after I met Nick and we're having that lunch. He said, he said, it's crazy. Like, Snoop's doing all these big things over the next month, which Snoop always does big things. It's always been a million.

How does he have time? Do you know like 70s? I see him everywhere. Now, it's like Martha Stewart. Yeah, he's beast. He's a beast. He's a beast. Yeah, but it was cool because Snoop was doing the VMAs with Katie Perry on their California song or whatever

So he came out and I was like, oh perfect timing. I said, let's make him a neph shirt We'll put a big cartoon dog will create this thing like this one off neph kind of dog snoop collection And let's launch this right? So then this was like my game now is I do this for a living with big brands But that was like the first now is I do this for a living with big brands, but that was like the first one where I you know we made this like longest biggest shirt you've ever seen in your life. Homeless like it we've never had to make a shirt that they mean snoops was wearing them like to his knees and he was already like super tall. I think it's taller than you.

And you're tall. Yeah, he's like I don't know maybe six three. Okay, he's like six four", maybe, he's tall. So that's kind of how it started was collaborating with Snoop and we had all this success, which is, okay, he's gonna be on the VMAs and then this retailer just bought a half a million dollars of this t-shirt and then it just blew out. It was like this moment. At the time, was collaboration more like whatever we sell, you're gonna get a percentage of sales or did you have to pay them

like a some kind of advanced payment like a spokesperson payment plus equity house those deals structured back then. I know now it's different, we'll get to that. But yeah, and they're all, they're all a little bit different back in the day. I mean, like some talent, they were cool for just a rev share.

It's like, hey, I'll take you to Zoomey's. Like you're launching, like Wiz, you're launching your album. And I've got my brands, one of the hottest companies in Zoomey's, and they have 650 locations in the mall, and I have the front window. So, like, let's put your album cover there. Let's drop the collections. Now, Wiz's team's like, oh, cool, we're going to get 5 million kids a week looking at Wiz's album drop. That's free marketing. And then, you know, I'd give him a big royalty of what he made.

So it was kind of a win-win and some we had to pay it front, some kind of all different. I guess it's also easy or when you're like a brand that's selling so much stuff to get to these people. So then like, so then okay, like let's like fast. Back to Kendall. Yeah, fast forward, yeah, back to like oral. But the roots hair and Kendall. Yeah. So the roots of all that is, I guess the point is I worked with a

ton of talent. Yeah. So I kind of met a lot of the agents, a lot of the talent, people knew Neff, they knew me. So I kind of got in a little bit with some credibility. I'd made, made people money on the talent side. I was, I was trusted. Right. So in true story, about seven years ago, through PACSUN, I did a collaboration with Kendall and Kylie, might even like eight or nine years ago. Oh, wow. So that's when I first met Kendall and Kylie, and they were like, kids, these little 13, 14 year old girls.

And we did maybe 15, I don't even know how they were, but just young girls pre-blown up and we did some neppeens. So that's kind of how I first met them and then I've met, you know, became close with Chris over the years and a bunch spent some fun times with Kanye. So for me, I've kind of been able to know the family a little bit. So I was able to hit Chris and Kendall and went over to their house and show them the brand.

So she was the first one that came to your mind. You're like, you know, 100% for him. Yeah. And so what is the, so now with the partnership. So you went there, you pitched this idea of having, what are the products? You have toothpaste and. Toothpaste, toothpaste toothbrush mouthwash floss

Those are kind of our four main categories and then now we're launching we have something called like the moon dust It's like a white need enhancer. So we've got a lot of products and Yeah, we were already doing the business. What was cool about moon is we already started it We got it up and running we already talked to target. We already talked to Ulta They were already into the idea. It's core pre-kendal. So they love the idea of, wow, you're gonna disrupt oral care. It's gonna look like that. I've never seen oral care that's looked like that. How many years ago was this, you said? Just 18 months ago. That's not very long ago. No, we've only launched Moons bin and business for maybe seven months.

Right. Because I feel like lately, there's so many more toothpaste and rinse companies and there's ever been before. That's kind of like, yeah. There's been a couple. I mean, there's not so many. There's not thousands. But I mean, it's not just crest and coolgate. There's more of it.

Like there's natural or tall. Natural, tall. And it harms all the different. Right. So then what's your point of difference between them and? Yeah, I think ours is one packaging. Like there's not another brand I think that like

sits vertical on your shelf that just looks good. You don't wanna like knock it off if you're trying to clean your house. And then number two, it's good stuff. When we spent 18 months, we hired, I mean that's what I do now, right? It's, I can ideate and help create. The company is called Beach House.

And that's kind of our beauty incubator. And we hire great people. So like, our operator, you know, of all of our businesses have 10 plus years of experience, the marketing people. So each one of these has its own individual operating team. So we're good at ideating and kind of teeing up everything. Then we have higher, incredible people to go run these businesses. So for us, the packaging, right, our product development team, I mean, it's, you know, it's SLS free, it's paraben free, it's ADA approved. So it's actually

really good product and better for you. And then on top of that, I think organic or not organic. Yeah, I mean, organic is a funny word because it's like, what's organic to one person is not vegan, right? So, uh, it's buzzword and it's always buzzword but they change every day. So I think for us, it's the combination, right? It's like, it looks great, it's better for you. Kendall Jenner is talking about it every 10 days. So you kind of just put that. Is that the contract? Every 10 days, she has to mention it. No, I mean, she's an equity partner.

All of our Kendall Jenner, Tracy Ellis Ross, Millie Bobby Brown, Shea Mitchell, are four big partners that we've launched these brands out at Beach House. All are, they're in it to win it. Right? our four big partners that we've launched these brands out at Beach House, all are they're in it to win it, right? That's and I've met with a lot of talent and had a lot of pitches and a lot of meetings of who wants to build business, but it you know I try to choose people that want to work that fill authentic

incredible to that market, right? It's like the whole brand is not Kendall Jenner. It's not Kendall Jenner's toothpaste brand, right? She promotes the whitening pen, which is an on-the-go teeth whitening, right? So Moon is the brand and kind of the hero, right? And Kendall promotes and pushes those products, but you know, she's... She lives the brand and she's like a perfect fit for that. Perfect fit. She loved it.

She wants to push it. And yeah, that's kind of the gig, trying to find people like that. Vitamin water just dropped a new zero sugar flavor called with love. Get the taste of raspberry and dark chocolate for the all warm, all all fuzzy all self-care zero self-doubt you grab a with love today vitamin water zero sugar nourish every

you vitamin water is a registered trademark of glass oh so it's the only revshare in that pan or the entire moon probably in the whole yeah I mean now we're getting stuff, but she's the way I would say that is, is you're pretty, you know, fairly spot on, but for her, right, which with all the talent. It's like, we want to build businesses that can quickly get to, you know, 30 to 50 million in revenue, which we think we can achieve. And how fast is that? Over 12 to 24 months, right? Because we've got a unique formula. We've got a killer digital team. We've got these massive influencers that broadcast the world. And then we have incredible relationships with retailers. So we'll, like, moon. It's like day one, 900 stores in Ulta, and then six weeks later, 3500 stores in Target.

And then I think- How can you lose? Two days ago, we just shipped CVS, 4,000 stores. So we kind of have the trust, and my partner, you know, PJ Bryce, who's kind of our CEO that runs the day. He kind of handles directly with a lot of the retailers. And it's like, we just got a good little machine where,

look, business is not easy. You can always lose. But I think after having doing this a couple of times and being so selective, it's like everyone we light up, you're kind of going, okay, we got this. We got point of difference. We got a great product. We got an amazing, you know, person to tell the world it exists, we have the best retail in the world that's supporting it,

we've got, right, so- You have everything stacked in your heart to stack, yes. And we'll see. How do people like win or even, how do they compete against someone like you, or like, or or beach house right because you literally have every building block necessary and as someone's just starting out how do they get Kendall Jenner or how do they get like they don't have you know you have to have like it seems like it's you have to have so many variables like just right to kind of get it to go. Yeah, but that's what I love about being an entrepreneur, right?

It's like when I started Neth, I had nothing stacked on my side, right? Even down to like our first trade show booth was, I was like, oh man, we have a trade show in like five days and I was driving past a haunted house that just shut down. I was like, those are walls. So I like, man, I was like, can you walls. So I'm like, man, I'm driving. I was like, can you cut like a 10 by 10?

I gave them my little email and he just like cut these Halloween walls and I drove a truck down and that was my booth, right? So like, if I thought today of like, okay, we've got a trade show, I'm gonna go find a haunted house and have them cut a wall. That wouldn't even come to my mind, right? I would just be like, oh, we would lose

at the trade show. Right, right. But obviously I't even come to my mind, right? I would just be like, oh, we would lose at the trade show. Right, right. But obviously, I didn't lose, and it won, right? So that's why I love about starting businesses. It's like, to me, sure, there's some advantages with access to capital and relationships, to get talent, or get retail, and that's obviously the lucky position I'm in today that I've done this for a while

and had some success. But to anyone else that's doing it for their first time, like sure, I might have a couple of things over them, but their grittiness and hustle and whatever they're going to do might be an up on what we have. So that's what I love about on trip in their It's like, Gil, I don't know whether we win or someone else wins. Who knows? It's up to the consumer to tell us what they like, why they like it. So I wouldn't, you know, anyone that wants to start a business or has an idea. I mean, I like Just how I look at, you know, like we've had a lot of success, but I'm looking at the PNGs and Unilevers, the $50 to $100 billion companies, and I'm looking at them is like, okay, how do I attack them?

I feel like a lot of people are now because of the brick and mortar being so, it's very competitive, and it could also kill your business, right? If you don't sell and I'm paying for shelf space and all that. Like, I find, do you see a trend in people just selling now, just creating online, like through digital ads and internet marketing and obviously social media? Like, I feel like a lot of brands are doing that. Yeah, that's kind of, it's weird, right? Because if you look at CPG, I feel like eight or nine years ago was all this like retails dying and like raw. Like, yeah, you gotta, it's all about your website.

It's all about user acquisition and you've gotta create this formula and test it 17 times and double down on what works, which in theory is still valid. But like what I and and for me, I've loved it because I'm like, yo, I want everyone to think retail is dying. I don't want everyone to play there. And I'm just going to go here and then still like 80, 75% or whatever it is of all products are sold at stores. Right. So regardless of how big the online biggest is, it's tiny compared to what's sold at retail.

But I think you got to be in both, right? Because there's been brands that have been all, they raised a ton of money and they're like spending tens and millions of dollars a month to acquire customers. And to me, that just aggravates me because they're figuring out an algorithm, they're figuring out a way to do this promotion, to this free shipping, to this, to that, they're doing all they can to convince someone that maybe they should buy this product.

So they're getting a customer, but it's short-lived. Because sure, you'll sign up for something that seems crazy, but if you don't love it, if you don't love the brand, you're back to what you were on to before. So I've seen a lot of companies in this like user acquisition spend a lot of money to acquire customers. Most of those haven't panned out. I mean, a lot of them, they raise all this money, it's a billion dollar valuation, and then their revenue hits a ceiling. It's not that big online. And then it just goes. So there's basically a ceiling. I think there's a ceiling online for sure.

And there's a ceiling at retail, right? So for us, it's like, we launch brands online, we work with massive retailers, and it's like, let's go. Anyway, we can't. And now with social media, all these people are social media celebrities, right? Never heard of them before, day in my life.

And now they have these lines and brands. And they're like, but it seems like they're selling a lot of stuff. Yeah, they are. I mean, it's, we from the company, the bot, Neff, I spent some time with them several years and one of the failures. And okay, by the way, do I want more water?

Yeah, I'm good. I look like I'm dying. You're like, we're eating a little heavy now. Sorry. So, we started a merch company and same thing, it was like, Liza Koshie, Lily Seen, James Charles, like all these biggest YouTubers, and it's incredible. Like what, what they do, and when they literally send a post on Instagram to 20 million people, and all of a sudden,

900,000 people go to this website, and like 60,000 people buy a shirt, it's crazy. It's real power, but I think that's where we're trying to bridge the gap. It's kind of like, you've got influencers that have the power. In my opinion, whether it's influencer celebrity, whatever it is, there's only a handful that can really build businesses that can be worth a half a billion. Right.

Right. And we're in the business of trying to find the select few that want to work, that are authentic, that understand the hustle that we want to work, that are authentic, that understand the hustle, that we want to partner with, and try to build businesses worth three to $500 million, right? I mean, that's kind of our goal. Well, like, look, there's only a few of them. Well, like Kylie Jenner yesterday or to the ATB before,

she sold 51% of her brand for like $600 million. I mean, who would have thought? Like, I thought she was like the sleeping dog of the family, you know what I mean? Is she crushed everybody? Like, I thought she was like the sleeping dog of the family. You know what I mean? And she crushed everybody. Yeah, she's, it's just smart, right? Like Kylie knew her lane. She knew what she was pushing.

She was so incredibly smart that she only really pushed that. She's not doing 50 things. That's a critical thing. So she had, you know, Chris is, you know, I love Chris and I love just roughing with her and she's smart. She seems brilliant. She just gets it, she's nice, and she puts the right people around her.

So they've done an incredible job, right? Because it's like, they know what Kylie was and who she is. They had a very critical map of like, hey, here's our products. She's gonna talk about it 10 times a day and we're gonna go crush. Yeah, and that's what happened.

That's what they did. So like, I mean, it seems like from everything that you've said, what I've gleaned from all of this and not just from you from other people and just from experience that, you know, really just being very specific and targeted is like I think when you have too much and you're too scattered, you fail, you don't excel at anything, you basically will do, maybe you could do mediocre and okay, but it's the people and the companies

and the people when they just kind of focus in their land or one thing, they're the ones that really skyrocket and everything. I agree and I think not only is that a good principle in business and not only are you picking the right product category that you think is a need, but it's the right talent like Millie Bobby Brown. I mean, she's a unicorn. She's 15 now. I met her when she was 13. In my opinion, she has more power on everyone,

of the younger generation, right? Gen Z and below. They look at her as an icon, as someone they can relate to, as someone that they love. She's time one, youngest to ever be on time 100 list. She's a unicef ambassador. So for me, it was a no brainer to partner with Millie because not only was there a, yeah, there could be a Gen Z skin care, clean opportunity here, but when you pair it with someone so special as Millie Bobby Brown, it becomes exciting. Right. Right. And then it's Tracy Ellis Ross. I mean, her. Yeah. Why her? Why did you pick her? Yeah, that one was lucky. She, you know, it was kind of a mutual. She had already been on this journey for 10 plus years to create her own hair brand. And, you know, she's, in my opinion, you know, for that curly, coily hair, she not only is that person,

and she is a young kid used to pick up the phone, call a number that would tell her the humidity and that would be how she would leave her house based on that phone call, right? Like so she had been living this life and she hadn't found the products that were perfect for her. She'd been trying for so many years to do it and we luckily got introduced and all I did was sit back and hear her and And Tracy just talked for 30 minutes. And I was like, oh my gosh.

Yes, I believe you, I believe your story. I believe there's an opportunity here and you're incredible. And she's so involved down to the creative, the marketing, right? So that's kind of been the formula. It's not like, oh, find some celebrities and build brands. It's like, no, it's we're finding very unique people, genuine people, and going after unique genuine categories, and trying to build a business.

What's that, what's that, um, hair for Uncald? Pattern. Pattern. Where is it sold? Everywhere. Ulta. Okay. So we, we launched it with Ulta. I mean, Ulta's been a great partner with us. They've kind of the leader and beauty nowadays. And we partnered with them. How about Sephora? Wasn't Sephora? Yeah, Sephora is still great, right? But we've kind of, as of now, we're on the auditorium. Exactly. You're on the Ulta train. Okay. And I've been with a lot of people are, you know, like this. Kylie went there. A lot of people did. I mean, Kim. On this treadmill, on your wood way, there's been a, like, a many people in the beauty and in other products. And I feel like all of the company or the partner that really has been

stepping it up recently. Yeah, they, I mean, just for us, they've been so accommodating, Yeah, I mean, just for us, they've been so accommodating, nice to work with, appreciative of what we're trying to do in support of. So, you know, and they've got a good message, we've got a big door count. So. Yeah. How many do they have? How many?

Oh, I mean, what are they at? Close to 1,000 I think, ish might be off. That's okay. It's not an all-to-podcast. So it's okay I'm not gonna hold you to it And then is it like would you look for when you pick people then like are they just people are our celebrities? Constantly is it just celebrities now that you partner with or like if some if some girl or guy or whoever comes to like You know contacts beach house and they have a great idea Mm-hmm, you know do they even stand a shot

if they're not Kylie Jenner? Yeah, I think, look, what I- Or Tom Brady or whoever. Yeah, you know, yeah, I think there's not one way to build a business, right? I look at the success of Sunbomb, right? It never had a massive celebrity. It never had a big spoke person.

It was just great product, killer packaging, clean messaging, ran well company that worked with no big superhero or big celebrity pushing it. So there's not one way to do it. I think for me, it's like, if there's an opportunity to find a category with someone that is a massive spoke person, I just feel like you hit the market a lot quicker, right? Instead of, you know, naff or sunbomb these that have to build six, seven years, it's like within one week, your kind of awareness is just where these other brands

are in seven years. So what do you do? Just because it's called habits and how so, do you have a particular ritual? I don't go on treadmill. Am I sweaty? Well, you're wearing 90 pounds of gold on top of it, but maybe that's why it's weighing you down.

I should be slowly dying, I'm dreadnought. This is gonna be my last question. Do you have any specific habits or rituals that you do daily to keep you on point or that you just wanna share with us? Yeah, I mean, I don't know. For me, I mean, activities, I like surfing, right? That's kind of, I love being out in the water.

That's where I can really zen out. You know, something I try to do is not to work on Fridays. Oh, okay. That's good. I just, you know, about a little over a year ago, I was just, because it's such a grind, nothing turns off, right? And I look at, you know, I've got the wifey and now three kids, one of them right now is at home

and these, what, eight days old, we came like seven weeks early. It's just a little mini, four and a half pounds. Oh my, congratulations. Yeah, yeah. So, I guess you won't be a bachelor for my bachelor auction after all. Yeah, I guess not. The bachelor. bachelor for my bachelor auction after all. I guess not.

The bachelor. Okay. I'm taken. Okay. But I feel like a breast cancer or auction for, not for me, not a bachelor for me. Just making sure everyone's clear. Yes. Yes.

Both taken. Yes. But, you know, it was just kind of one of those where for so many years like building naff and like getting these first things up and running It was just I mean, you know, it's like all the business books. You gotta be all in It was it was heavy. It was like you know 15 hour days for years and it's like you're traveling and you're gone for 10 days and you come home You haven't seen like your wife and kids and they're literally like, I land and I'm like, get a text like, yo,

this party's popping and this artist is there. And like, I'm like, I have to go there. Like, I haven't seen my kids in 10 days, but I'm always the FOMO guy. If there's any like, oh my gosh, any opportunity ever, I'm like, I'll turn, I turn over every single rock. So my husband is exactly the same way with FOMO. Like he'll like go to the opening of a paper bag if there was such a thing

because he's always scared if he's going to miss something. Yeah. But I guess in your business that's super that's like it's important right because there can always be a contact or a networking opportunity. There's always something and that's why like about a year and a half ago I was like whoa I've just been on because my three things I was talking about are dream, believe, and hustle. That's like those are my things right? It's like you got to dream like you know something that doesn't exist or the best ideas right? So you got to like just dream like what do I want to create? And then the belief is like yo I'm a beast like you just have to what do I want to create. And then the belief is like, yo, I'm a beast. Like you just have to be like, I'm going to do this, right? And it doesn't come from like this

conceited like self-fulfilling like, oh, I'm so good. I'm going to win. It was even down in my first company, Neff. I was like, there was never a thought in my mind that like it might not work. Or like, oh, no, like stuff would hit the fan and it'd be disastrous. And I would just be like, all right, what do we got to do? Fix it, solve it. And then just the hustle, right?

It's just like, you just, like, if you ain't killing it, someone's gonna kill it a little bit harder in that person wins. Yeah. So for me, it's great. You have to be. You have to be. And I think, so for me, I was like, it never stops. Like I could go 24 hours a day, 365 days, and have something to work on.

And a new business to start and a new contact and a new riff and a new, so like for me, that's where I've been like very strict, like I don't want to work on Fridays. Like I'll take some phone calls. There's the rare occasion. I'll have to have an important meeting that I can't want to work on Fridays. Like I'll take some phone calls, but there's the rare occasion I'll have to have an important meeting that I can't change. But little things like that have been so important to me as a person, because it just gives me like everyone's still working on a Friday

and I'm chilling, and with the wife and with the kids. And I'm like, yo, those are my Fridays. I want to go that three day weekend. It is what it is. I've worked too hard not to try to enjoy things as well. You create boundaries You know you should just convert to Judaism because you get you know what Shabbat is? Mm-hmm You don't know what Shabbat is so I've heard Shabbat, but okay people don't work on they like

Yeah on Saturdays or you can't use your phone and whatever else, but usually it starts It's on Friday. It is on Friday. Like you have to buy dinner already there. I'm telling you, you should just basically get a rabbi in here and just convert you, right? And then you'll have, and then you'll even need an excuse, right? That's true. Okay, well that, listen, you've been a really great guest, because I think- And you got me really tired. I know. I know. You did great job. You're like, kind of heavy breathing for a few seconds there. And now I'm back. But overall, yeah, exactly. I know, you did a great job. But you're like, can I have happy breathing for a few seconds there? And now I'm back.

But overall, yeah, exactly. I feel like I should run down and finish strong. You want to do a sprint? No, you don't think so. How about you press that white button and tell me how many calories you burned? 6,000. Wow, 6,000?

At a pace of 1.1. I have had running a hundred and 177 miles an hour. 114. OK, good. So you burn 114 calories and you would have otherwise not have burned. So you kind of killed your, yeah, well, you killed you got some exercise.

Well, needed. Well, there you go. I'm glad we can help. You've been great. So how do people find you if they have a company or an idea they want to just pitch to your company, can they do it? How do they find you, if they have a company or an idea they want to just pitch to your company, can they do it? How do they find you? Yeah, I mean, you don't think I'm not taking anymore. Go play someone else. No, no, no,

yeah, I'm joking. I'm joking. You want me to answer a question or no? Yeah. Yeah, go ahead. Okay. No, I mean, I, I mean, my SMN, it's like website, whatever, then I've got Kirsten who's like runs my life and manages all my businesses. She's just like Kirsten at SMN-I-N-C.com. Like she gets the ton funnel through her or just DM me on the gram.

That's much easier. Slide into the DMs. Okay, good to have you. What's your good ideas? What's your Instagram? Just my name, Sean Neff. And I didn't post for like five years, but now I am.

Wow. Really like that I am again. Well, it gave a lot of people pitching you. Yeah, I think it's been a good vehicle just to like, just be accessible. Cause like for me, I don't think I'm that special. I don't whatever. I'm not better than anyone else or what. You know, so I'm kind of like like to have that as an easy way where it's just like, yo, I've got an idea. And I just kick them to

Kirsten and bet it out. Well, that sounds great. You've been a great guest and honestly, you've given us some really good tips and information about Fridays also. I don't know if you know, if you're Jewish, you probably know, know about that already. You got to know the gig. Yeah, exactly. Thank you so much. You really have been great. Thank you.

Thank you for walking on the treadmill with me. I appreciate it. That was fun. All right, you guys, and we're out. I'm out. This episode is brought to you by the YAP Media Podcast Network. I'm Holla Taha, CEO of the award-winning digital media empire YAP Media, and host of YAP Young & Profiting Podcast, a number one entrepreneurship and self-improvement podcast where you can listen, learn, and profit.

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