Heads In Beds Show - How to Leverage ChatGPT Into Your Vacation Rental Business

Episode Date: January 25, 2023

⭐️ Links & Show NotesPaul Manzey Conrad O'ConnellChatGPTContent At Scale🔗 Connect With BuildUp BookingsWebsiteFacebook PageInstagramTwitter🚀 About BuildUp BookingsBuildUp Bookings is a team of creative, problem solvers made to drive you more traffic, direct bookings and results for your accommodations brand. Reach out to us for help on search, social and email marketing for your vacation rental brand.

Welcome to the Heads and Beds show where we teach you how to get more properties, earn more revenue per property, and increase your occupancy. I'm your co-host Conrad. And I'm your co-host Paul. How are you doing today, Paul? I am doing fantastic. Just excited to be talking about today's topic. I think it's going to be a barn burner. I feel like you can't go anywhere without talking about seeing something about here, seeing

written, seeing something written by our next topic. We better just, I think we better just jump in, but how are you, how are things going for you? Oh, I'm doing great. I think we were able to put this at bay for what, three and a half weeks or something. Like we started using it maybe three and a half weeks ago whenever it came out. And now it's just, you're right. There's too much momentum. It's a sea change. Everything's over.

Everything's changed. I feel like Steve Jobs, we've revolutionized everything or have we revolutionized nothing? I don't know. It's up for debate, but no, I'm doing fantastic. I think this will be a fun one on a serious note because I think that I'm having fun playing with this stuff. It does feel like new technology.

It does feel like something that you haven't used in a while with how well it works. And I think we'll stop dancing around it. Anything for marketing minute, you want to hit on any particular headlines? Or is this the headline? Is this the marketing minute, which is a deep dive in the chat GPT? I think it is. I think this is it.

I think we danced. We even danced around it a little bit last week. This was all news last week, but now we're really going to dive in on chat GPT. So let's go. Yeah. Awesome. All right. So here's my takeaway on this stuff, right? Which is that if you haven't used it already, where have you been? Are you able to

access the internet? Are you okay? Can we check on you? No, but on a serious note, this obviously tool has blown up. If you go to ChatGPT or do a search for ChatGPT, I think it's currently at chat.openai.com, you'll get brought into an interface. So for those that haven't used it, and I'm sure there's some people maybe listening that haven't used it, or maybe just used it once or twice, is basically is a text generation interface where you can give it a prompt, or you give it some kind of message, right? And then it will respond to you almost like a virtual intelligent assistant with specific feedback to your prompt. So there's a billion things that you could do with it, probably actually,

we could argue an infinite number of things you can do with it, because of the fact that it has text generation model. Now it uses it's fascinating how I think this all all came together because this is not a new company. Maybe people are hearing about it for the first time, but like open AI has been around for, I think like maybe 10 or six, six, seven years at this point, like maybe not 10 years, but it's been around for a while. It was initially a nonprofit. And then I think that was changed at one point. And now it's like a for-profit model at the time of recording here in January, 2023, it's currently not a paid tool, but I suspect they'll change here relatively soon. Just a matter of like them figuring out how to package it and sell it. But yeah, it's a natural learning language model. So basically you give it prompts, it responds to those prompts and a

response to those prompts based on like a corpus of data. It works, my understanding is similar to Google where it goes and crawls and indexes and collects all this text data out there on the internet, similar to how Google does, crawls it, then it like synthesizes it. This is the part that I'm a little bit outside of my knowledge set. And then it gives you back that information in kind of a unique way. So the model is essentially learned who's the president or what year was the revolutionary war and stuff like that. And it can respond to those kind of prompts. Today, I think we're going to talk a little bit more about not necessarily what this tech generation platform is. I think you can go look that up and figure out some of the mechanics

if you want to. But more so why has it grown the way it has? Why has it become a tier point from a second ago, Paul? Why is everybody and their mom talking about this and how it relates to everything? And are people taking it too far and saying it's going to change everything? Or is there a more measured take in the middle? And I think you and I both have some perspective because we both use tools in our career and gone from having this kind of tool to this kind of tool over time. And I think we've learned, hey, some of these tools are awesome. And here's the benefit we get from them. Some of these tools are overhyped, and they don't really ever amount to anything. And this to me feels like something that has a little bit more solid use cases. And I

can happy to give some examples. So what's your take on it? You've been playing with it for a little bit. What's kind of your general approach on using it, the quality of responses, how things are coming back? What's your frame? Well, it is, I'll take it back a little further. The first time I heard about it, I was listening to the radio and listening to, I think it was the Daily, actually, the podcast. And they were actually conducting an interview that had been generated. The responses were all generated by ChatGPT. And it was very interesting to get that insight. And then it felt like the next day we were talking about it and we were talking about how we had just used it. And it's one of those things that it is. It has taken everything by storm. I think looking at how they're putting it all together, I think the last time it looked, the most recent update they had, they're generating this off of 175 million parameters.

You try to put into some type of formula of how Google does it on the search side of things. formula of how Google does it on the chat on the, excuse me, the search side of things. But that's a huge amount of parameters and ranking factors when we're thinking about unifying it back with the search side of things. But one of the things that I heard from a podcast earlier today even was that the next iteration is going to take that number up to 100 trillion parameters. And that's just like a mind boggling number to be able to think of what are we going to be able to generate with that? How are we going to be able to, to what level at that point can we have these conversations? So yeah, I think the use cases for overall with ChatGPT and any of the content, AI content writing tools, I think ChatGPT definitely has a leg up now, but it'll be a matter

of where anybody else can come in and see if they can supplement or complement there. But when it comes to social media posts, blog posts, email content, and it is, there's a lot of really practical uses for this that I've seen be very effective initially here. Again, I think because it is so early on that we're in this process of experiencing the GPT revolution, and I think we could pretty much call it that initially here. It's what are the long term effects? What are the long term impacts on the human side of things? I think that's certainly something that we can discuss here as well as what does this mean for content copywriters? What does this mean for different jobs? And Conrad, that's a basic part of your business there. So how are you leveraging this moving forward? But

it is, it's something that it's the hot topic. And I think we all have to learn to use it, play with it, and make sure that we're using it effectively. And I think to improve some of those efficiencies, because I think everybody would acknowledge unless you type about 140 words a minute, just the speed, kind of the mind brilliance there, it does take a while. It takes time to put together good content. And that's always been the case. So now we're coming to a point where it doesn't take as long. But where does that quality go? And what are the other aspects of that we still need to consider when thinking about

creating content like this? Yeah, you are right. And I feel like this does have a direct impact on what we're doing. And we're still sorting through that at the moment. I don't have any like major shifts that I'm making today to that process. But I'm testing some tools, I'll put a link to one of the tools that I'm testing right now, inside of the show notes called content at scale. And that's a beta test of a content writing tool. And it is pretty, it's pretty good. I'm not gonna lie, like I think the quality that you get already from a platform like chat dbt, which is free, or content at scale, which is a paid platform that goes through more in depth, I would say it's able to generate like 2000 more blog posts off prompts, whereas chat dbt will fall apart and won't be able to do it

that detailed. Anyways, these tools, I think already are better than hiring a very cheap writer who's maybe overseas, right. And I know sometimes there's folks overseas that can write great content. I'm not saying that's not the case. But there are many people on Upwork who will happily write content for you for two cents a word. And it's really no good at all. English is not their first language. And there's customers for that person today.

I don't really believe there will be customers for that person in the future because the AI tools are already better and cheaper than doing that type of service. Now, that being said, and this is the analogy that I said before we started recording, I do think these chat text generation tools are just that, they're tools.

So the analogy that I've been giving to clients and even to my team is that my uncle is a carpenter. So my uncle shows up to a job site, right, doing cabinetry, or he builds high-end finished carpentry work. He builds wine cabinets, right, things like that. When he goes to do that work today, and he were to show up to the job site with a hammer and a box of nails, he would be laughed at. People would be like, what are you doing? In order for him to be effective at his job, he has to bring in a pneumatic hammer, obviously an air hammer, right? And he's able to put together that wine rack, let's say, a high level of fit and finish and quality because he's very skilled and because he has a tool that helps him do that job a lot faster and easier. Now, could my uncle do that job with a hammer?

Just a manual hammer? Of course he could. He's very skilled. He's swung a hammer for 35 years of his life, but he's a heck of a lot faster by doing it with a pneumatic hammer where he goes, instead of going, dude, like people listening to the show are like, your sound effects are terrible. But anyways, that's how I see this going forward. So that's my overall take that this is the frame that I have today as we go through this process, which is that I saw a tweet yesterday or the day before, and it was like, you're not going to lose the chat GBT, right? It is not going to replace a person, or it's not going to replace your ability to do certain things. So you

can't go fire your reservationist and just have all your messages come in and be responded to through chat GPT. However, you're going to lose to someone who uses chat GPT. That's who you're going to lose your job to. So if you repel this kind of thing, and you say, no, I can do it faster on my own, you are the guy showing up to the job site with a hammer instead of a pneumatic hammer, maybe you can do it right now. But it's not going to be that long. I think we're already there in some cases, you could argue, where you're going to need to do these tools almost just to keep up with the pace of other people doing these types of jobs, right? If it's the case of a content writer, if a content writer doesn't embrace and use these automation tools like ChatGPT

to build their outlines, to build their intros, to build their outros, then at least get them started. I think they're going to fall behind by a good clip or a good margin compared to someone who is. And that's the way I see this working today is that you take this, you have to use it, and you have to still know what you're doing. You can't take something from JAT TPT, paste it on your website and be like, oh, yep, we figured out content. I think you're going to end up with very mediocre content in that scenario. But you can certainly use it as a tool to enhance the knowledge and the skill and the

capability of someone on your team, whether that be reservations, marketing for us, content creation, content writers, copywriters, and turn that into something of similar, if not in some cases, to your point from a second ago, better quality than some people can do. And it's something that is actually a lot faster and cheaper than sometimes what other people can do. So that's my frame on it, which is not as revolutionary as maybe some of the people online who get a lot of attention talking about this deal where they're like, this changes everything. I don't know if that's the case. Did the pneumatic hammer change everything for carpenters? I don't think so. It made them more efficient. They now have to get more done in a day

and maybe their arm doesn't hurt as much. So I think it helped the carpenter really that hurt them. So that's how I see it. I don't know how you see it. If you see more of that type of assist capability, but that's my general analogy that I'm drawing so far with that. I would agree with that. And I think even if we take that deeper dive at the vacation rental space specifically, it is, it's not like we have huge enterprise companies employing hundreds and hundreds of people. Maybe there are maybe a few companies out there in the vacation rental space that are doing that, that are that size of that complexity. But really it is for the most part, it's bare bones. On the operations

side of things, on the marketing side of things, maybe you have one person. Maybe if you're a big company, you have two in-house people doing marketing. A lot of times, you are. You're working with an agency. You're working with someone else. This is why, yes, there are experts out there. We can be considered maybe some experts out there that can help on the marketing side, but that's not the case. Not many people have that in-house. So to be able to put to a life chat GPT, to be able to bring some of this in-house, it's not crazy. I mean, it did. We did a quick lookup of chat GPT, tell me five ways that a vacation rental manager could use a chat GPT to be more effective. I mean, it is. I think most of these options here, I'm looking through automating customer service, using the chat functionality to be able to

answer simple questions, answer those FAQs that a lot of people have when they're visiting your site, enhancing property descriptions. Man, is that something that we've seen frequently to be something that just needs a little more information? I think we've all been to listing site that it's maybe have a half paragraph, two sentences, three sentences, and that's enough for them. It is being able to highlight the best features, provide guests with that sense of the local area and everything that's nearby and putting that all into the content without having someone go through 50, 100 listings and really do that more functionally. I think looking at emails, I think that's

something where another email, social media content, all of that type of thing, it's that quick content that right now, yeah, you may have an out of house or an agency doing that for you. Can you bring more of that content in? And it's not completely removing the need for an agency, because obviously there's still a lot of benefits to having that in place and having that expertise in place. But can you, again, can you just do more of it? I think that's something where those efficiencies that it's creating are really critical to these businesses that are these small businesses. There's a lot of mom and pop businesses out there that are looking for these quick tools that will be able to help

give them make and it is it's that one percent more it doesn't have to be you know is it going to increase your direct booking percentage by x amount is it going to increase your overall occupancy by x amount no but some of the operational items behind the scenes that contribute to those bottom line numbers are going to be affected if you're able to leverage chat GPT or these other AI content creation solutions appropriately and effectively. Yeah, I'll give you an example. And so recently, I've been working on the sort of the generation of some more detailed processes for certain steps that are like marketing approach, right? For sure.

And I've been using chat GPT to help me a lot with the outline. Now, if you give it an outline, and you say, for example, write me a cleaning process for a four bedroom vacation rental home in Florida, right, it would give you a process of clean, wipe down the counters, do this, do that, that all would be possible for someone to be able to do that manually, right? The cleaners know the process or someone in the vacational industry could be able to give you a list checklist of what those might look like. And again, the way that I see it is that you as a small manager of maybe 50 homes or something like that, you probably don't have someone who can make that document for you. So you got to make it yourself. And the way that I would use JetPT in that type of scenario, just like I've done for making some of our processes, is you prompt it to be like,

make a process, describe exactly what you're looking for. It gives you back text, you take that text, copy and paste it, put it into Google Docs, and then you start to work on it. And so actually, we don't do that first, we do this first, you don't do this, you do that. But man, it's like it's giving you all the Lego pieces, right? And then you have to work on it. And it's actually, we don't do that first. We do this first. You don't do this, you do that. But man, it's like, it's giving you all the Lego pieces, right? And then you have to go still assemble them, in my opinion, and put them into most logical order. And it'll suggest things that you don't do.

It might suggest that someone like take a step that you typically wouldn't take. Maybe you don't have the drain, the hot tub after every stay in your stay, other states do. So you still have to have like intellect and knowledge. That's my whole takeaway here is that this isn't gonna turn you from dumb to smart.

I hate to say it, make you look a little bit smart. Initially, when you start using it, you're like, wow, this is cool. But turn you from dumb to smart. I hate to say it, make you look a little bit smart. Initially, when you start using it, you're like, wow, this is cool. But if you know how to prompt it and know how to get back out of it, which you need to, it's just a huge time saver. And I think, yeah, to your point, you're still going to need the agency, I think, because ChatGPT isn't going to tell you what topics to write about. ChatGPT may give you some suggestions, but it doesn't really know which one is low competition

or high competition, right? You still have to figure that out for yourself. ChatGPT isn't going to format the content into WordPress for you. ChatGPT isn't going to generate images, not yet. I know there's some stuff on the horizon there as far as generating images, but it's when people are looking at the best restaurants in X, they want an image of the actual restaurant, right?

They don't want an AI image of a place that doesn't actually exist. In this case, we do on real. It's not going to push that out on social media for you. It may help you write the post that pushes it out on social media, but it's not actually doing the posting for you on social media.

So there's a lot of steps, obviously, that chat, these automated tools don't currently do. Now, that being said, I think that, again, you're foolish to push against it, because if you push against it, it's just going to crush you in the sense of someone having these tools and competing with you in the marketplace is going to be like, wow, they have they better and they answer faster and with more comprehensive responses to my questions about, hey, the remote's broken, like, what do I do? Like, you can have a little process built out for here's our process for like, when the remote doesn't work on the TV, you can ask chat, chat, dbt, right, give me give me a response to x, y,

z. And then you could build out an awesome knowledge base based on chat dbt prompting, and you going in there and massaging it for your specific use cases, or your specific ways that you do your operations, or your cleaning, or your guest issues, faqs, all that kind of stuff, and make something that that would take you maybe without ChatGPT 50 hours of work and compress that down into 10 hours. So that's the way that I see it going forward. So I think that's a good way to think about it.

It is. I think the one thing that's concerning to me right now on the social media side is you have people who are going through and starting to put prompts out there and get some beautifully written LinkedIn posts that maybe they have no idea what they're talking about. And that's where I'm is people like, I think we're going to see chat GPT created influencers where they are, they don't actually have this basic fundamental knowledge. And at some point, people who can identify and analyze

that content within the posts themselves are going to be able to say, this actually doesn't make sense here and there. They're going to be able to connect the dots. But that doesn't mean that there aren't going, you may have developed quite a following at that point by the time the AI starts to run down or slows down or you have a bad day or whatever it is. I don't know what that's going to end up looking like, but that is certainly something that are we creating false expertise? It's yeah. We're creating content, creating content, creating content. Awesome. I think there's something to be said for a lot of content isn't seen online. So if we're seeing, is this going to be better content that should rank more

as we look at the organic side of things, or is it just more content that people aren't going to see and ultimately is just further cluttering the internet and everything else out there? I don't know. That's, I think just proliferation of content is not that great. It's still, ultimately it still comes down to quality. And I think the other, what we haven't talked about yet is that we've got the bing integration coming out with chat gpt that should be interesting what's google going to do in response i mean there's electronic watermarks out there what's google going to do in response i think google is still this outline this big outlining question of what how are they going

to how is google which still controls 90 of searches that are done online going to, how is Google, which still controls 90% of searches that are done online, going to react when months, six months, 12 months, 18 months, two years worth of content is now out there? And yeah, cert pages are continuing to grow along with infinite scroll. And what does it all really lead to down the road? I do. I think there's going to be a chat GPT or some type of AI content solution for Google specifically. And I think at some point it might really cause that schism or that divide that, okay, search results for Bing, like Bing search results, because they are more chat GPT watermark or something like that are going to be different, fundamentally different than what Google is creating with their own AI content creation system there. So that is

that unknown right now of when does Google get into the fray? How do they get into the fray? And it is, I've seen Google Chrome extensions that are pretty cool where I do, I've got one on mine right now where I do a search, I get my organic results for Google, I get a chat GPT on the sidebar. And just seeing the similarities there, obviously, it's just that quick answer. But it was zero, it's a zero click search. How much more frequently does that happen moving forward? And what does that look like? And some I think we're all in the dark right now as to what that does look like. And Google has kind of already gone back and forth a little bit on this kind of stuff.

And I guess I have some larger SEO notes because I think some people think this is like brand new. I mean, chat GPT is brand new, but like the idea of like auto-generating text is not brand new. I mean, any SEO worth their salt who got in the game back in 2010 was using like article spinners. And that was basically a more rudimentary version of this type of logic, which is that you would actually pay a human writer to do an article. then you would article spin that 20 times and post it in 20 different places. And it was like, it would change words that were very similar, like amazing

into awesome or whatever. And it would keep the context the same. I'm reading an article right now in search engine journal, I'll put this in the show notes too, that back in 2014, the Associated Press had trained a model on writing articles and headlines and things like that, based on, for example, like sports outcomes. So we talked about this before we started recording, this team beat this team, this person had this many yards and this many touchdowns and all that kind of stuff. And that's been again, the Associated Press has had that since 2014, using it on the web. So this isn't brand new, I think it's a lot more accessible, that's fair to say, like, you don't need to like, download some sketchy program to do articles spinning, not that I ever did that for SEO

purposes. But in theory, you would have had to download a program on a PC and run an executable file. And like, you would have to load it in like a TXT file formatted perfectly. If you dropped one column incorrectly, the whole thing wouldn't work. Again, not that I've ever done that before. But not that I've ever done that before. But now it's like you prompt it

and it gives stuff back very quickly. To your point, Google is not going to lay over though on this stuff. And the article that I'll put in the show notes says, they initially said, don't do this. This is bad. And then they actually backtracked on that last week, which was surprising. John Mueller said something to the effect of it has to be useful for users.

And I think it was his admission, which is a fair admission and the right admission, I just surprised he made it to some degree, that using chat GPT and then publishing garbage content to your point from a second ago isn't really going to get you anywhere. If you post an article, three awesome restaurants in Destin, Florida, and then 50 other managers publish that article, that's pretty much the same. Maybe it's reworded slightly. No one's going to rank, right? That's not a better result than TripAdvisor as an example on the restaurant side of things. But if you'd like say that and say, no, I'm going to write a specific detailed description for every single restaurant, build out a whole directory, go and get local photos, go and do this, have this additional

information in there. Then you have the makings of something that's, again, useful, but you're using AI to help you make more useful, more helpful content. So if this AI content was the answer, and everyone could just do it, then there's no barrier to entry and your competition level goes from zero to an infinite number of people competing for those different keywords, or those different search concepts on the Google side of things, let's say for search traffic. And what you believe is a benefit is actually not a benefit at all. So I don't really think that's going to occur. I think that Google is smart enough to also understand the difference between good and bad content. And for people who are just using chat, dbt, hitting generate, clicking that, pasting it

in to a blog, hitting post and calling that strategy. I hate to say that's not a strategy, right? It's just not the case. Just going back to my analogy from earlier, just like having a bunch of boards and a nail and a hammer isn't the way to put together a cabinet, right? You have to still know what you're doing. You still have to know how to use the tools and assemble things. I actually had a note here. I was reading, I was rereading a traffic book the other day,

and it was just a simple breakdown. And I conflate these sometimes I need to get better at this of a strategy versus a tactic. And a strategy is just that, right? It's what are the overall goals and objectives that we have with the project? A tactic is just how you get there, right? Okay. We're trying to increase our direct bookings from 10% to 20%. That's a strategy, strategic decision or statement. The tactics could then be okay, how do we do that more email marketing, paid search targeting these long tail keywords, building landing pages, better photography, better descriptions, etc. Awesome. Use in this scenario, chat GPT or an agency or even better, maybe an agency that knows how to use chat GPT to do all these things to help you

achieve your goal, hire someone on your team that knows how to use it. That's all I think the right way to play it going forward. But this in and of itself is not a solution. This is just merely a tool or the same way that a hammer is a tool. And it's never going to get you where you want to go unless you know what it is you're trying to achieve. And what specific steps are in the way for you to get to that ultimate outcome. So that's the way that I think people should be thinking about this too, is that it's not going to be like a one click, one click, and then you're done type of model. Maybe these models will get smarter and better over time. That's plausible, or that could occur, but it's never going to be like a one click, one click, and then you're done type of model. Maybe these models will get smarter and better over time. That's plausible or that could occur, but it's never

going to replace everything when it needs to be done. And you should think, but think about Google, think about all these different platforms that are in the fray. And I agree with you. Google's not just going to lay down and do nothing, right? Google's going to have a specific, they're going to have some kind of comeback. They're not just going to let, you know, someone come up behind them and take their, the best, what I believe might be the, one of the best businesses of all time, Google ads to just be lost that night in the night that's not gonna happen no it's it is i think this will just as the the system is getting by i mean it is for moving on to 100 trillion parameters i again i can't comprehend what that actually means but i think

that one i yeah we've talked about over and over you're not leveraging it, find a way to leverage it. It's one of those things where maybe you don't, maybe you think your content is great. Maybe you don't need to need help writing social posts. Maybe you don't need any help with email. You're completely satisfied with that. Find another way. Are there regulations in your area? I bet at GBT would be a good way to start to find

about find out some of those ways. Look at your reviews online, look at the feedback you're getting on that regulations. Yeah, yes. Regulations one. No, I love this one. So someone I was talking to the other day at rent responsibly, actually, I think we were talking about this concept, where what if you took these regulation legalese documents, which are hard to understand, if you're not a lawyer, you copy and paste them and put them into a chat GPT. And you summarize this for me. And it actually does stuff like that pretty well too. So that's another use case, right? What if you could take chat GPT, feed it in legalese that you and I may not understand

and be like, summarize this for me. And it might help you understand. It's not, it may not be perfect. You still have to go through the parameters of it, but it might be able to be like this document appears to be talking about X, Y, Z, and it can help you understand things perhaps a little bit better. Or you can prompt it even more specifically to give this back to me in five or four, five or six bullet points, make it concise, right? And then shorten the bullet points and give you like just the facts of what it is. So yeah, I think it's,

it's going to help people understand things better as well. Exactly. You're fine. It is. I think that's it is. We just have to think about it is the straightforward way is just content content. But what are other ways to think about all those homeowner agreements that managers have with everybody. Those legal clauses, I have. I've heard another reference. It is. You can see people going in depth and making sure, hey, this legal clause is now accurate, and now I'm not going to get myself in some hot water if something bad happens. I think it is. Reviews are huge in Google for your organic placement. They play a huge ranking factor. Anybody who says otherwise, I'm sorry.

It's not the case. Keep pushing for reviews. That's just like we always do here. Do it for your business as well. But if you want to understand what people, what kind of feedback people are actually getting, feed it on the Jets GPT. You're going to get a general overview of how people feel and you're going to get some opportunities for how to improve yourself moving forward. That's something that if you have a thousand reviews, that's gold. I think it's not just,

ooh, everybody feels good about me. Ooh, it's helping my organic replacement. It's, ooh, I actually am getting insights to what guests love, what guests hated, what owners love, what owners hated. How can I improve my business? Hey, you don't want to go through and read a thousand reviews. Have ChatGPT do it. Take a scrape of some of your content and really see and understand, analyze this for me. And I think you will. I think you'll find some nuggets of gold that really will help you make those small operational, those small marketing, those small overall business improvements that might not take the form of, okay, I'm getting more traffic to my site. I'm getting more X, Y, Z. I'm getting these tangible

results through KPIs, through my marketing efforts. No, I'm just finding ways to improve my overall business based on feedback that I'm getting from users. So yeah. If this doesn't work out, why will that have been the case? So when we hear excited right now, all the possibilities, what's a steel mana for me? What's your best case for why this wouldn't work out in the next, let's say 24 months?

I think it is going to be just then, this isn't going to be the last tool. It's what's the best tool? And is chat GPT the best tool? Is what is the ultimate end tool here? Because I don't, I don't think this is even the last iteration of chat GPT, but what does that look like? Or I think the other side of it is that Google and Bing start to say, nope, this content doesn't work for me. This content works for over here. And like we do, we truly see some

heavily and segregated is a weird, weird way to put it, but I think we're going to see segregated search results pages. And that's the Bing content is good because it's all chat GPT related or friendly and whatever Google's is their own thing. And I think they will become so disparate. That's why they, it's that there's no unification. I think at some point, it does have to, everybody's got to play nice, everybody's got to play in the same sandbox there. But I think it's also so early on in this phase that it's hard to see how it could slow down with how fast it's risen. What do you think? I think if it fails, it will have been because all these tools will fingerprint the content

and there'll be platforms that reject the content, right? So if you are Twitter, and this has actually already happened on Twitter, is that they've allowed certain apps from not working in the way that they used to work before, where it was like auto generating tweet content and stuff like that. And they changed that model even a little bit today. And I think that if you're Google or something like that, what you may do is say, no, like we're fingerprinting all the content. We're getting that from an open AI, open AI API. Sorry, I didn't get that straight. And nope, this is AI content. We're not necessarily

sure. So that's also, I think somebody to consider is will this, I don't know if, I don't know if I see that where it's like segregated, but I think if it doesn't work, it will be that, or it will be that actually I've read online that they're losing ungodly sums of money every day training the model because it takes so much power. And so when chat GPT comes out and it's $99 a month or $199 a month and you have to pay to keep using it, how many people are going to continue to use it? I think people who can make a living off of that content creation would use it. But it might be similar to a lot of the tools that we use.

Like we pay for a lot of software within our agency that our clients don't want to pay for because they're like, why would I pay for? We pay Ahrefs like 400 bucks a month. like very few people are willing to do that for their one website so they're still going to rely on other people to have a chat gpt key and then you're going to use that key to access it so i think that's also feasible as well is that it doesn't maybe take off as much as it could because they're realizing when they need to like turn on the flip switch the flip flip the switch to start making money it may not be as economical as people want it to be to like use in their day-to-day operations they may just realize oh it's not that important i can

get over it i've also people are talking to you they also said it was so novel and interesting at first and they're like doesn't integrate with anything else right now so i think maybe that will be another case too will all these platforms want it integrated would gmail want to have an ai model they have it right now with the words if you start to type in gmail like you hit tab it'll write one word at a time but would they want to have a button in their email interface that's like write an email to a homeowner and telling them that I have their monthly report ready to go and it's attached. You could do that today by copy and pasting it. But would that be the model that we want to keep going with going forward? I'm not sure. And I'm now of the opinion, because of all

that we've lost with Facebook over the past few years, as far as data targeting, that I no longer believe that technology always just marches forward in like a linear fashion where things just get better every year. I used to believe that. I actually don't believe that anymore because think of the ability I used to have to target Facebook ads in 2018 and I can't target Facebook ads anywhere near the same level of accuracy today. I know there's privacy concerns and things like that, but I do think that there's a huge legal kind of question here as well. I've talked about this in the All In podcast that Kyle Kanis has. I think it's actually pretty interesting where he's all this data came from scraping the web and training it. What he was suggesting is that you would have, you have robots.txt for search engines. You would have

AI.txt for AI models where it's like all the data they get is basically taken from other people who have written that text content and then put it into there. So I can also see that being a stumbling block for them where they like have to get permission to train from a specific set of documents or webpages. And then people are like, no, you can't train up my webpages because then people are going to go make their 10 best restaurant lists based on my content. That's not fair. I know you're rewording it, but like you're using my content. So a lot of sites or even by default, if it's blocked, like for them to be able to crawl

content and get training data, then that could really slow down their progress or just make it where it can't be fresh. Like even I think when you log into chat GPT today, it says like this training model finished in like the middle of 2021. So it doesn't know about a lot of stuff that happened over the past what 18 months or something like that. So it's not even trained on the most recent data. Right. And I think that could also be a stumbling block. Because one thing about Google, right, you can't beat it for freshness, I can go today and say what's going on. And there'll be articles there from 10 minutes ago and whatever's happening in Orlando, Florida, or all the games last night, they'll have summaries there. And obviously

chat GPT does not work in that way. So I think that's, those are become some of my arguments against it. And I think that's a fair assessment of like where it could either go wrong or just not have the progress or the model going forward that we think it's going to have. I think the one last point, and maybe it's the last point we'll say, but the, I think the other thing to consider is right now, there really is no, there may be an electronic watermark for OpenAI and for any of the content that's being generated, but the end user still doesn't really know

what is and what isn't. You may think you'd be able to, you may think you'd be able to identify it, but what does that look like? When does the end user really start to understand this was generated by AI? And I think that's going to have to be something, whether it's part of the SERP over time or something where you are going to want to understand, was this manually created or was it

not? And maybe that's not, maybe that's something nobody really cares about. But as an end user, I think I would take heed of understanding this is generated by a human, this is generated by a computer. And over time, maybe tin hat type of thing, maybe conspiracy. But I think that's going to be important. I don't necessarily think it's a certification. I don't know badge. I don't know what it is. But I think we really are going to have to understand at some point what that breakdown looks like and what has been and what hasn't been. And whether that is, whether that's just the results that show up versus the results that don't, or whether it is some notification or

some information that is telling us, hey, this was created by AI. Proceed with the necessary caution that it needs to be. And I think it is. Some people won't give two thoughts about it, but it is that end user. And we've talked about with automation on advertising overall is that the end user is getting worse results. So if everybody's producing the same content, are we actually giving the user a better end result? And I don't know. I don't think that's the case. Yeah,

it's fun. There's efficiencies, but I do. I guess I'm trying to build that case for ways that it isn't going to work. I don't know. I'm trying to convince myself of it or what, but I can certainly see the downfalls. And as a bit of a natural skeptic, I think we're always going to look at it half full and half empty and then try to figure out what the best way to to present this and obviously the best way to use it we'll keep using it but is it going to be a fondue yeah think of all these things right like i was thinking about 3d tv the other day because i went and saw an avatar and i was like weren't we all supposed to have a 3d tv like in our living room it's a curve and everything remember google glass

remember google glass like google was going to be like, oh, everyone in the future is going to have like smart glasses, right? And NFT is like, I'm dead on that already. I'm already calling it dead. Go ahead. Put the dirt on the grave on that one, right? That was an eight month little hype cycle that died.

We have all these things that come into play and sometimes they have an impact in our lives and a lot of times they don't. But this does feel different to me. Like I think it's something that I also saw something the other day that fascinated me, which is think of the captivation

that we're having with a text tool right like a lot of the advancements over the past however many months or years or whatever have been like oh tiktok it's the new platform where you're going to spend your time i don't know if i would call it a social network in some respects but whatever call it a social network or a platform to some degree and it's all short form video there's really no text there at all other than like complementary to the video think of all the work that facebook's doing it's like the metaverse that's a fat ridiculous concept based on these things, think of all the work that Facebook's doing. It's like the metaverse. That's a fabulous concept based on these things. But think of how much attention has been captured by text.

And it really reminds me of like, that's actually one of the most powerful tools we have actually is text and copy and words. And we can change our lives and change the, improve our guest experience, improve our owner experience, do a lot with just words. If we put the right words together and we explain it in the right way, words still have a lot of power. So I think that was like a little philosophical like thing that I have when I was thinking of the popularity of this tool and the use cases for it is that the almighty

text still pretty important and like our overall communication, marketing and presentation to the world, everything that we do from a, from that perspective. Anything else you want to add or should we put a bow on it? I think this is more loose form, informal conversation to some degree, but I think hopefully I can take some of these things now, have a record of like when I said them and then later refer to it when it's like, why are you using or not using it? I'm going to be like, this is my thoughts on it. So that's how I plan to do it.

If not, we could put a bow on it. Thanks, Paul. As always, we will be back next week. I think we have a more solid, steady outline on back to our typical marketing topic. Maybe we'll dive into the world of SEO or paid search or email marketing, or it could be anything. I don't know, but you'll have to tune in next week to figure it out.

Thanks so much to Paul for coming in and recording with me as always. We will always ask for a view. Feel free to write a review using chat GPT, go to chat and say, write a five-star review for the heads and beds show podcast. I'd paste that into your podcast app of choice. We'd appreciate a either human of written or automated written review. That means the world to us.

And we will catch you on the next episode. Thanks so much.