High Performance Mindset | Learn from World-Class Leaders, Consultants, Athletes & Coaches about Mindset - 16: Cleveland Indians Performance Coach Talks Beating the Odds with Ceci Clark

Episode Date: November 9, 2015

Ceci Clark, the first woman to be hired full-time in Major League Baseball working in mental training, talks about beating the odds in this inspiring interview. That is exactly what high performers do, she says. They are among the 1-3% that beat the odds and dream big! Ceci discusses how life begins at the end of your comfort zone and how "fear keeps your sharp." Ceci also talks about her experiences as a female working in predominantly male populations including in Major League Baseball and in her previous role with Special Forces.

Welcome to High Performance Mindset with Dr. Sindra Kampoff. Do you want to reach your full potential, live a life of passion, go after your dreams? Each week we bring you strategies and interviews to help you ignite your mindset. Let's bring on Sindra. Today's episode is sponsored by Worldwide Access Solutions Incorporated, a 24-7 clear advantage, a call center providing inbound and outbound services, and a licensed life and health insurance agency. You can visit them at wasi.com. Welcome to the High Performance Mindset.

This is your host, Sindra Kampoff. And today, I am fired up to provide you an interview with CeCe Clark. CeCe is a performance coach or mental training coach for the Cleveland Indians. Now, CeCe not only works with the players, but also the coaches, coordinators, strength and conditioning personnel, athletic trainers, and front office staff to integrate mental skills training into their work with the players and the team. Before moving to the Cleveland Indians, she was with the Special Forces for six years and specifically loved the application of performance psychology techniques in the field. One of the ways that I've come to know Cece is through our work through the Association for Applied Sports Psychology. And I was able to have the blessing of presenting this year with Cece. Her work is incredibly respected in the field.

And after listening to this interview, you'll understand why. Some of my highlights from this interview was the really the importance that she discussed throughout the interview of embracing your discomfort and how fear keeps you sharp, how your life begins at the end of your comfort zone. She talks quite a bit about being self-aware and the importance of actually practicing gratitude every single day and being grateful for the small moments that happen. So high performers, I know that you're going to love this interview because you are out there beating the odds, dreaming big and going after your goals and your dreams. Let's bring on Cece. So Cece, I'm so excited that you're here. Thanks so much for joining us and

impacting the listeners who are listening today. Thank you so much for having me. I'm really honored to be on your podcast. Awesome, Cece. So tell us a little bit about your passion and what you do. Sure. I'm a performance coach for the Cleveland Indians. I get the pleasure of helping people go after their dreams. So I work with our players, our coaches, our staff, all throughout the organization on the mental side of baseball. You've experienced an incredible amount of success personally. Tell us what one or two things that you've done that you think has contributed to your success and made all the difference.

I think one thing that really helped me along the way was learning a lot about my personal style and how I like to work and being able to articulate that to people that I'm hopefully working with and really letting them make a decision if that's the right style for them, but really being sure about how I like to do my work. I think that's really been an impacting factor for me. Can you tell us about your journey and just understanding yourself? Is there, you know, anything in particular that stands out to you in terms of how you got there? Sure. I think one thing that really helped me was actually the six years I spent working with the U.S. Army and Special Forces. Special Forces is an all-male unit.

So you really have to know who you are and be clear about who you are. And you also explore who you are because there's definitely trials and tribulations and obstacles and setbacks and I think that really helped me learn a lot about how I work how I like to work how I respond to setbacks and failures and explore some different and unique ways to apply mental skills into different environments different populations so you know you have an incredible opportunity to work with some of the nation's best in terms of right now, Major League Baseball and in your previous position in Special Forces. So tell us what you think really separates the best from others or those who stay in the league from those who don't or the ones that really thrive in the league. What

do you see is kind of mentally the differences there? I think a separation point that might be a little bit subtle, but is really the difference between our very high performers and our guys that do fairly well is that they come back to a set of routines or beliefs, regardless of whether their performance is going well or not well, they know themselves well enough that they come back to kind of the building blocks, so the foundations of what they know works for them, and they leverage those building blocks. They don't end up chasing kind of what's going to make them good or what they need to do really differently because this year hasn't started out well.

They really have a consistency there, and I think that really adds to their confidence or peace of mind and what they have faith in. So they stay the course regardless of what the media says or what other people say. They stick with their beliefs and their routines. Cece, do you think those routines are in terms of how they pitch the ball or how they hit the ball or just like daily routines? Like tell us a little bit more about what you're seeing them do differently. I think they're both. I think they really explore themselves enough to know how they

want to set up a day and why they set up a day that way. And so, you know, one bad game doesn't change that for them or even a week or two weeks of bad games doesn't change that for them. And I think it's everything from their skill work to their interactions with teammates. You know, they've thought about how they think the best way to go about things is, and they're able to stick to that. They're able to come back to that. They're able to reinvest in that when they're struggling or even have that keep them consistent when they're doing well and not lose focus on what's important. And those are those foundational building blocks and the way that they move through their day.

So tell us why you do what you do, Cece. You know, we believe here at the High Performance Mindset that keeping your why really front and center makes all the difference in terms of, you know, staying motivated and staying excited about your work. So tell us why you do what you do. Yeah, I got this awesome chance to actually pursue math this past fall, and it made me reflect a little bit on my why and how I decided to do what I'm doing now. And I think one of the things for me, it really started actually in high school. I grew up in Berkeley, California.

Berkeley has one public school, and that's so that there is this wonderful cross-section of students. And so the high school has about 3,500 kids, and it's everything from UC Berkeley professors, frankly, to kids that are homeless. And it's this wonderful diversity. But part of what I realized, especially playing sports there, is that people, the students, the kids, we all had really different senses of what our lives could be and what we were capable of and what ceilings existed and what we just couldn't do. And that was a lot based off of what people in our family had done before us or hadn't done before us and what people told us.

And one of the things that I got to see a lot through teammates is if someone offered an opportunity for more, then people started to believe that there could be more. And you watched people with amazing potential start to achieve that potential and start to dream and start to really go after what they thought they could be. And I think that's an incredibly brave thing to do. And I realized one of the things that I love is being part of supporting someone's dream and part of opening a door that maybe didn't fully exist or helping with the skills to then achieve something that's going to be a really tough task and is going to be, you know, have setbacks along the way. But I think that's really where my passion comes from. Cool. So what you saw growing up in high school, you know, and you and I, we were talking before we recorded

this interview about just helping dreamers dream big and how so many times in our lives we get messages about that we shouldn't dream big or we have people say, oh, really? Is that something you could do, be an Olympian or make it to Major League Baseball? And I think one of the cool things that we get to do is really help people get there and then stay motivated while they're there. Yeah, I mean, if you think about working with high performers, we're talking about working with an abnormal population, right? There are people that are beating odds.

There are people that are 1% and 3%. And I think it's normal for their communities and society at large to say you're crazy for wanting that, especially when these guys are 9 and 10 and they're having a big dream. And I think it's really neat to get to step on the other side of that and say, all right, amazing, it's so cool that you have this dream that's really abnormal. Let's talk about how to really give that some legs and let's talk about what that would take and let's goal set and let's imagine how that would work. I really love just getting to step to the other side and support those dreams. So tell us, Cece, you know, about yourself as a high performer. So tell us about a time you failed and a story, you know, that we could relate to and what you learned from it. And the

way, the reason I want to ask you about that is because, you know, you, we all have these big dreams. Sometimes we forget about these big dreams. But as we go forward with these big dreams, we have to recognize that setbacks are really things that are going to happen, failure is going to happen. So what did you learn from a failure? And tell us about a story? Yeah, I'll actually go back to when I got to be an athlete and I was playing soccer in college. In my senior year, I got to captain our women's soccer team at Bates College. And prior to that, I had had really wonderfully strong relationships with my teammates. You know, I just got to be one of the team. I got to know my underclassmen incredibly well. I had one of those dorm rooms where everyone came to hang out. And it was really

phenomenal. And I enjoyed playing. And when they voted me captain, you know, somewhere in my mind, that role switched. And I started to pay a lot of attention to what the expectation of the team was and what my expectation was for how we should be working and practicing as a team. And I lost sight of my teammates. I lost sight of the people involved. And so I consider that, you know, a failure of mine is that when I captained that team, I don't think I was a very good captain. And it taught me a lot about what I think is important. And I think people are really important. It also went on to for my grad degree, where I focused on transformational leadership behaviors, probably because I thought that that was a point of weakness or failure for me.

So what motivated you was your failure and what you ended up doing was really about, you know, this defining moment for you. I loved what you said about like caring for others is really important. And it was when you're a leader or, you know, when you're in a role like we are serving people is really essential. Tell us about an aha moment that you had, you know, in your career and what you learned from it. I think an aha moment I had that's really changed a lot of my work was I was standing up and giving a presentation when I worked for the Army. And I was and I was giving a good presentation and someone asked a question at the end and said, you know, hey, this is great and I totally

believe in it and yeah, the mental game is important and these skills are absolutely essential. That's awesome. Okay, so if I give you my unit for the next two weeks, how would you train them every day to start to help them acquire these skills? And I think it was a really kind of shocking moment to me of how do I take this completely out of theory and into something very tangible, very doable, and break it down into really the day-to-day training. And I think that for me was kind of the aha moment of moving out of the classroom and into the field

of changing the way that I really thought about, considered, and taught mental skills. Yeah, and you know, I think when we go through school and master's and PhDs, we learn all about the theory, but it's difficult to teach it. And I think that's what the difference between the science of sports psychology and the art is. Yeah, I can't agree more. Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely.

So that sounded like a really important point for you just to learn how or the importance of like teaching how to do these skills. Yes, yes. And just changing even my skill set, I think, in some ways. You know, we can present the concept. We can get people to realize mental skills are important. But that moment where someone says, yes, they are important, now what? I think that was a big development step in just how, you know, myself professionally and how I train. And how about, you know, your best moment in your career?

So you told us about a failure, which I really appreciate, but tell us about the best moment and why it was so awesome for you. Yeah, you know, I've got maybe kind of an odd story on this one. I think my best moment, my career took many years to develop. So about two years into my work with the Army, I was doing a training for instructors on coaching methodology and high-performance coaching for special forces instructors training candidates that wanted to be special forces soldiers. And I had – these classes generally were small classes, groups of 10. They normally went pretty well. And I had one student in the class that clearly had no interest at all in mental skills or the mental game or anything mental. You know, it kind of got kind of believed if you if you ran 10 miles hard, you were mentally tougher for having survived it. And that's how you taught mental skills.

And so I think we were both pretty pleased when the training was over and we didn't have to interface with each other any longer. And sure enough, two years later, four years into my career, I show up to work in this course where he's an instructor. And this is a course that's six weeks long and you spend most of your time in the woods sleeping there overnight, moving 10 miles a day, carrying a heavy backpack, lots of time with your instructors. And he made his continued dislike of me and mental skills very clear, all the other instructors very quickly. And so the staff kind of decided that me keeping a distance for a while would be a good idea and I could work with the other instructors.

And so I did. And I ran professional development, got to know them really well. But he was a vocal naysayer of the work I was doing in me. And I was doing actually a workshop near the end of my time with the Army on growth mindset, mindset. And we were talking using a TED talk and talking about Carol Dweck's work and something clicked. And after that, he came up and asked questions and he asked if he could have the book. And, you know, I happily gave him my book. And, you know, we both laughed about the fact that my notes were all over it. But slowly and surely, he asked more and more questions. And we actually created this great professional working relationship that spurned an exchange of ideas. You know, him helping me understand more about his work, me being able to add to things that he was doing, you know, talking about family and kids and how this stuff affects so much more than just his work. And I think for me that was a really phenomenal moment of just leaving being seen as kind

of an intruder into his community and starting to be seen as someone that was a peer, a colleague, someone that could be helpful in his work. And I really prized and felt really honored to have that moment and see that development across kind of a four-year span with someone. And even today, we exchange ideas. I consider him a friend now that I've left that work, and it's neat to continue to watch his career unfold. Cece, I love that story because it really emphasizes that your best moment came after a struggle and also how you might have haters in the work that you do.

And kind of what I mean by that is people who say, ah, this really isn't meaningful, this isn't important. But you stayed the course, you didn't let that impact you, and he came around and you were able to positively impact him later and, you know, see the importance of what you do. So, you know, Cece, you and I were able to present together at the Association for Applied Sports Psychology Conference just about a month ago. And we were blessed to have an opportunity to kind of share our stories, especially about our experiences working as women, working with men's sports.

And so I work a lot with football teams. You work with baseball teams and we work with special forces. So tell us, you know, what, what seemed to really stand out to you about that opportunity to present at ASP? What are your takeaways from that experience? So I love the chance to get to present and work with you guys a little bit to understand more about your experiences working with all male populations and teams. I think one of the things that really stood out for me was that we were each working to find a way to be ourselves, working within a population that was obviously somewhat different

from us. And that was different for each of us. You know, as we're different people, we have different ways to do that work. But it came back to the point that we had to be ourselves to do great work. And I think that that's much easier said than done. And so that really stood out to me, I think, when each of us were presenting is that we all talked about our style. And there's not one style or one way to be a female working with a male team. There's many ways to do it. And while I think certain things kind of hold true

across all three of us, what really stood out to me was how important authenticity is. Yeah, that stood out to me too. You know, as I was just looking at the audience and reflecting on who was there, there's a lot of young women who are in sports psychology and trying to make a career in this field. And, you know, one of my messages that I really remember is just, you know, if women are only thinking that they can work with other women or girls and they're really eliminating half of the population of who they can work with. So it was really empowering to me just to look out in the audience and see that we made an impact. completely agree with you, Cece, that between you and I and Angie Pfeiffer, who's at West Point, we all talked about being yourself and how when you try to be somebody else, you can't make a

connection and you don't really let your true self be seen. And for me, when I've tried to be someone else, it hasn't fueled me. You know, I walk away from the presentation or the individual meeting with that person. It's like, gosh, that that really who was that? You know? Yeah. So authenticity is the key. Is there any other advice that you might have for females who are listening in terms of working with a male population? Yeah, I think, you know, really examining who you are within that population. And and if you're ready to be at a point where you can maintain yourself within that work. I don't think it's easy.

I think it can get glorified. I think, you know, all of us, you, Angie, and I all talked about kind of the trials and tribulations. We went to get to a point where we were comfortable doing that, whether that was, you know, getting help from outside coaches or fantastic mentors. And I guess I'd say, you know, it's not easy. I don't want to sugarcoat it because I don't think it's easy work, but I do think it's wonderfully rewarding. I think we also talked about the fact that we didn't have female mentors in the field that were doing it. So we kind of kept getting told, I don't know if this can happen. I don't know if this can happen. I guess part of what I'd say is it absolutely can happen. So there's now some people doing it and talking about it, which is great. Reach out, ask questions, and really do your due diligence of

checking with yourself if you're ready to do that kind of work, because it's not easy and it can take a toll and you really have to be at a spot where you're comfortable enough with yourself that you're not subject to the environment and letting that completely dictate how you are and how your life works and who you are. Absolutely. So you have to be comfortable with yourself and have the confidence that you have the skills and knowledge to do that. And it won't be easy. Nothing is. So that leads us to our next question, Cece.

Here at the High Performance Mindset, we believe that if your dreams are a little scary, then they aren't big enough. So what's a dream that you have that scares you a little bit, that gets you out of your comfort zone? You know, I think for me, that's a tough question because I, you know, in the last year and a half, I have achieved one of my very scary, big dreams. You know, I don't think anyone really knew about a female full-time hire in professional baseball. We have really small, tight quarters, especially in our minor league areas and clubhouses, and that can be interesting and difficult to navigate. And frankly, I'm still navigating it. You know, I'm finishing up my or finished up my second season and I'm still scared a lot by my

dream, um, cause I'm still working through it. Um, but I, I love that sense. I mean, I feel like that, that sometimes that fear kind of keeps you sharp and keeps you thinking and keeps you reflecting and keeps you wanting to do more and better. And so it's damn, say I'm still kind of chewing on that one. And I, and I haven't quite picked my head up to, to figure out what's next. And Cece, which trait of those top 10 traits of high performers do you think that you exhibit the most? So when I'm on my A game and I am completely aware, I'd say that I have high self-awareness.

But that is not always the case. I'd say what I probably default to is something that I carry with me pretty consistently is being gritty. And I think probably being really open to being uncomfortable. So those two I probably fall back on. And if I'm in a really good place, then I'm self-aware. Awesome. Tell us about, you know, getting uncomfortable and how you do that best or a time that you've done that. Again, looking back over kind of my past, I actually wrote my college essays on getting uncomfortable. Oh, cool.

Yeah, so I guess that's really been a trend for me throughout my life. I find that I oftentimes put myself in situations professionally where I'm not sure what the heck I'm thinking in terms of, you know, I get butterflies a lot. I get uncomfortable a lot. So I'd say, you'd say there's been steps along the way, leaving California to go to college in Maine, studying abroad in Wales for my graduate degree, going to Cuba when I was in college for a semester abroad, working

with all male units and special forces, deciding to go out into the field and stay overnight and do a lot of work where the soldiers were. I mean, that's definitely a trend for me. Looking at working in professional baseball and figuring out how this works, I've had so many amazing mentors throughout this process that have, I think, made it doable for me. But that's definitely probably a signature of my career is I'm often uncomfortable. And you wouldn't be where you are right now if you wouldn't have embraced that discomfort and pushed yourself. So I love what you said about how fear keeps you sharp, keeps you engaged and keeps you moving forward. So Cece, which of those top 10

traits of high performers do you see yourself still working on? Yeah, I think definitely having self-compassion. I ruminate on mistakes. I don't let them go easily. I'm always wondering what more I should be doing and feeling like it's not quite enough. So I definitely am actively working on that. And one of the reasons I wanted to ask you that question, Cece, is because, you know, we are trained in this field. We clearly know the skills and the strategies of high performance because we study it. But we, you know, are still human and aren't perfect. And so I appreciate you just being honest and open about that and helping us realize

that we're a work in progress, too. So what's one or two things, Cece, that really you do to stay at your best every day so you can really serve others? Right now, you know, it's professional baseball players. Yeah, I think connecting with family is really big for me, that support system. I've got a very close family. Well, geographically, sometimes we're far away.

We stay in touch in a lot of different ways. And, you know, they know me, they support me, they walk me through a lot of the harder stuff. And I think that that is really essential to my work. And at times when things are tough, or I don't know, or I'm low on energy, they really are fantastic. So that's been really big for me. I think the other thing I do is try to take a moment every day and look around and remember how lucky I am. Those times where I look around are having gratitude for strange things, you know, like being able to have a conversation with one of our players on a plane flight and them having the

strength to walk up and have that conversation with staff and teammates around. Or it's been, you know, 2 a.m. in the woods and having a strange conversation with one of our special forces instructors about how his life's going and really being grateful that he would share a very raw life moment with me or a sunset or a sunrise. Sometimes we're cranky when we see those sunrises, but really getting to appreciate that you're awake for it. Finding that moment every day I think's really big for me, too. I just got goosebumps as you were talking, Cece, because I just really appreciate what you're saying about practicing, really savoring it and intentionally being grateful for things that you experience or the opportunities that you have. And even if it's the small moments like the sunrise or this one conversation, just being really grateful for it, intentionally practicing that. So we're going to go on to this speed round.

And so, Cece, what I want you to do is just answer the question for the first thing that comes to your mind. So if you could recommend one book or a podcast or a person to follow, what would that be? And why did you choose that? I think Adam Grant, Give and Take. It's a book that he wrote. I really like it. Adam talks about givers, people that give without expectation of receiving, matchers, people that give but expect quid pro quo, and takers, people that are constantly looking to take. And he talks about how these people function in the world, business world

interactions, networking, all different forums of how this looks across a spectrum of experiences. And I really enjoyed reading the book. And I think it also really helped reinforce to me the importance of giving and being smart with giving, but also enjoying giving without worrying about what comes back your way and just how that impacts a business, a community, a society. And a lot of our front office has read it, and I think it really resonates with us.

I'm going to go buy that one right now, right when we get off the phone. Amazon.com, baby. What's the one word that people describe you as, Cece? I think passionate, for better or worse. Sometimes that might turn into pain in the ass, but that's four words, so passionate. And what's the best advice you've ever received? I think BU. You know, so simple, so hard to do at times. My work is at its best when I'm very much myself and finding out how that fits into different situations. And what's a success quote that you live by and how does that apply to us?

So no surprise here, my success quote would be, life begins at the end of your comfort zone. At that moment where we're pushing, reaching, striving, growing, just a little bit uncomfortable, you know, we learn so much more and we gain so much from those moments. Push beyond your comfort zone. That's how you reach greatness. And Cece, final question.

What advice do you have for high performers who are listening? All of us have a decision that we get to, many decisions that we make throughout the day. And those decisions are oftentimes small, but they're so important. And so making the decisions that make you smile, make you laugh, get you excited, give you butterflies, those are really important. And so making the decisions that, you know, make you smile, make you laugh, get you excited, give you butterflies, those are really important. But I also feel like the decisions we oftentimes don't talk about are the making the decision to still do the same thing you did yesterday and making the decision to work through a small drill that you really have to pay attention to detail. And it's not that fun, but it's an essential small skill. And the decisions that involve sweat and possibly blood and possibly tears and the decisions that are

uncomfortable and make your stomach turn, not just have butterflies. And I think those decisions are really important too. They're unnoticeable at times. And I think really high performers, when we hear their interviews, they're not necessarily talking about those decisions because they've made so many of them that that's part of who they are now. And those decisions don't feel so conscious, you know, but for those of us that are not there yet, I think continually looking for those moments to make those small decisions that are the right decisions for the goals that we have and who we want to be. You know, make sure you realize that it always is a choice. It always is the decision and decide things that help you reach your goals.

So small decisions matter in going after your big dreams. Cece, thank you so much for joining us today and impacting thousands of listeners. You inspired me in so many ways. There are three ways that really resonated with me, things that you talked about. You said that high performers really beat the odds. They are among the 3% or the 1%. And so as those people are listening, realizing that beating the odds takes grit. It takes dreaming big and going after those big dreams.

And it takes failure. But the importance of going after it is really how you become a high performer. You also talked about how your best moment was after a struggle, which I thought was really cool and that there's great things that can happen when you do struggle. And then I loved how you talked about getting beyond your comfort zone and how life begins at the end of your comfort zone and specifically how fear keeps you sharp and how you experience discomfort every single day. So Cece, I really, really appreciate from the bottom of my heart you showing up this morning

and impacting the listeners who are out there all over the world listening today. Thank you so much for having me, Sindra. It's been fun. Thank you for listening to High Performance Mindset. Are you signed up for Sindra's weekly email with free mental tools and strategies for high performance? Why the heck not? Text MENTALLYSTRONG, all one word, to 22828 or visit sindracampoff.com.