High Performance Mindset | Learn from World-Class Leaders, Consultants, Athletes & Coaches about Mindset - 198: How to Build and Sustain a Championship Culture with Jeff Janssen, Janssen Sport Leadership Center, Founder and Director

Episode Date: July 28, 2018

Widely considered the world's top expert on Sports Leadership, Jeff Janssen is the founder and president of the Janssen Sports Leadership Center. Jeff's pioneering work in launching and conducting college athletics' first Leadership Academies with student-athletes and coaches began over a decade ago. His groundbreaking work continues to be the gold standard today. Jeff and his team's work has led to the creation of cutting edge Leadership Academies at Michigan, Illinois, Arkansas, LSU, Pitt, NC State, Colorado, Yale, Georgetown, South Carolina, Stanford, among others. He has authored numerous books including The Team Captain's Leadership Manual, The Team Captain's Culture Manual, Championship Team Building, Jeff Janssen's Peak Performance Playbook, How to Develop Relentless Competitors, The Commitment Continuum™ System, and The Seven Secrets of Successful Coaches. In this interview, Jeff and Cindra talk about: 6 key components in a championship culture The characteristics of a high performance culture 7 secrets of successful coaches How and why he developed the leadership academies How to build and sustain a championship culture[CK1]  10 step blueprint You can find a full description of the Podcast at cindrakamphoff.com/jeffjanssen

Welcome to High Performance Mindset with Dr. Sindra Kampoff. Do you want to reach your full potential, live a life of passion, go after your dreams? Each week we bring you strategies and interviews to help you ignite your mindset. Let's bring on Sindra. Welcome to the High Performance Mindset Podcast. This is your host, Syndra Kampoff, and I'm grateful that you're here, ready to listen to episode 198 with Jeff Jansen. Now, the goal of these interviews is to learn from the world's best leaders, athletes, coaches, and consultants, all about the topic of mindset to help us reach our potential or be high performers in our field or our sport. Now with two episodes weekly, we explore everything

related to mindset. You can learn the secrets for a world-class consultant like in today's episode, or you can listen to me each and every week provide a short powerful message to inspire you to be at your best consistently. If you know that your mindset is essential to your success, this is the podcast for you. Now before I introduce Jeff, I'm going to go over and head over to iTunes and read a rating and review. This one is from the Food Healers podcast. So also another podcast and this person says 193 episodes of pure gold. He says, I always love listening to mindset and love Dr. Kampoff's approach.

She interviews a variety of people, athletes, doctors, speakers, and coaches, which makes her episodes very much relatable for you, the listeners. She truly has something for everyone. I really loved her episode on fear, courage, and stress with Dr. McLaughlin. Definitely an episode I would check out if you haven't already. I look forward to more episodes. So thank you so much, Food Healers Podcast. I super appreciate it. And two things. If you enjoy this episode, I'd love for you to head over to iTunes or wherever you're listening to this,

iHeartRadio, Stitcher Radio, and leave a rating and review for us. That just helps us reach more and more people each week, and more and more people get some great tools related to mindset. And I would also encourage you to listen to Dr. McLaughlin's podcast interview. It was an outstanding interview about three weeks ago. So today I interview Jeff Jansen, who's widely considered as one of the world's top experts on sports leadership. He's the founder and president of the Jansen Sport Leadership Center, and his pioneering work in launching and conducting college athletic programs, and specifically leadership academies for student athletes, began over a decade ago. His groundbreaking work continues to be the gold

standard today. So Jeff and his team have led the creation of cutting-edge leadership academies at schools such as Michigan, Illinois, Arkansas, LSU, Pitt, Colorado, Yale, Georgetown, South Carolina, Stanford. I could keep on listing more and more. So his resume is definitely impressive. He has also authored numerous book chapters, including the Team Captain's Leadership Manual, the Team Captain's Culture Manual, Championship Team Building, Jeff Jansen's Peak Performance Playbook, and the Seven

Secrets of Successful Coaches. One of the books that we're going to talk about today that he has written is this book about how to build and sustain a championship culture. And I bought the book about a year ago and I've really enjoyed reading the book and just better understanding his perspective on culture. So that's one of the reasons that I had Jeff on the podcast. So in this interview, we talk about several things, including the characteristics of a high performance culture. We also talk about the seven secrets of successful coaches, how and why he developed the Leadership Academies and what those are all about, and how we can help build and sustain a championship culture

in our sport or business or in our family. So I know you're gonna enjoy today's episode. You can also find the full show notes over at cindracampoff.com slash Jeff Jansen. Look forward to hearing from you. You can always shoot me an email at cindra at cindracampoff.com. And I am on Twitter at mentally underscore strong, as well as Jeff is at Jansen leader. Enjoy the interview. Jeff, welcome to the High Performance Mindset Podcast. Thanks so much for being on the podcast today. My pleasure. Thanks for having me.

I'm looking forward to talking to you about your work. You have so many amazing books and doing such great work in the field. So I'm looking forward to learning more about that and sharing it with the audience. So just kind of tell us to start a little bit about your passion and what you do right now. Yeah, I mean, my passion is really looking at what makes successful people, successful teams, successful coaches and captains so successful, basically. So I've really enjoyed, you know, looking at the teams and individuals that maybe on paper didn't always have the most talent, but always had those special intangibles working for them. So just spent the last 20, 25 years trying to really delve into that, learning from some pretty amazing coaches

and student athletes along the way and trying to put that into a really practical framework that anybody who's wanting to be better as an athlete or as a leader or develop a championship culture could hopefully do. So basically now what I'm doing is working with a lot of college and high school student athletes and coaches. We do leadership academies for several schools where we not only get to work with them one time, but really get to put in place a systematic leadership program so that they can develop over time from leaders by example to vocal leaders to developing the culture along with the coaching staff. So it's really a fun journey to see how things develop over time. And you started your business doing more peak performance, but then recently, or the last 15 years or so,

been doing the sport leadership. What made you kind of decide to shift it that way? Yeah, it was really partially what the needs of the coaches and student athletes were asking for. And certainly when I started in peak performance and sports psychology, that was kind of an interest at the time. But as time went on, the team chemistry aspect really came out. And how do you get people to get along given their different backgrounds and kind of personal agendas and things. And then as time went on, the coaches and how important their leadership is to creating that kind of chemistry. And then again, as time went on, you saw how important the captains were not only for on the field and on the court leadership, but in the locker room as well. And then culture came about and competitiveness came about and accountability came about. So a lot of this just kind of organically came up as different issues started impacting teams and maybe were barriers or challenges for them to get to where they wanted

to go. And as those things came up, then you, you spend a lot of time talking with coaches and athletes, finding out, okay, you know, what, what is your struggle here? And what is it that certain people aren't understanding? And then trying to put that into a simple framework that then people can apply and talk about and improve those really important and tangible areas. One of the things that I appreciate about your work is that it is so like framework oriented, but it's really easy to understand. So I appreciate that. I'm sure that the athletes and coaches that you work with appreciate that as well. Yeah, I mean, probably one of the best compliments I ever got from a coach was, you know what, all the things that

you talk about are things that I've experienced and done. And all you've kind of done is put it into a framework that makes it easy for me to teach to my student athletes. And I took that as a huge compliment. Yeah, I mean, most of these concepts are ones that you have coaches yelling at people to relax or to be confident or to be a better leader or we need to create a championship culture. You got to hold somebody accountable. And they're constantly yelling at people to do these things, but very few people have actually broken them down into

teachable concepts and relatable concepts. And I think that's hopefully the strength of what I bring to the table is I've really, you know, I've been immersed in these concepts. So I've heard them over and over again. I've delved into them both from the sports standpoint, and I've done a lot of reading in other areas like business and psychology and sociology and you name it. So, you know, these are human beings in a competitive setting. And hopefully what I've been able to do is put all this stuff into a very practical and proven framework that if coach really wants to work on confidence or really wants to work on leadership or really wants to upgrade their culture, I can now provide them

with a very practical step-by-step process that they can implement just as they try to work on physical skills or tactical skills with athletes. Outstanding. So before we kind of dive into your models and your framework, tell us about a story that didn't go so well for you, maybe something you would describe as a failure. And the reason I'm asking you that, Jeff, is for us to connect with you, but also that we can learn a lot from other people's, you know, frustrations or difficulties. And so tell us about a time that didn't go so great for you and what you learned from it. Yeah, I mean, probably one of the most pivotal ones for me was when I was with the University of Arizona. I've been working with them for about seven or

eight years or so, learning a lot from their student athletes, a lot of success with their men's basketball program and their softball program. But their football program was not doing very well. And they unfortunately, administration made some really poor hires and were in a huge economic bind. So they had to end up laying off 15 people from the athletic department. And unfortunately, because my job was one of the very few full-time jobs at the time, they're like, well, it's hard for us to justify paying a full-time salary for somebody doing this that very few other schools had. So I got laid off early in my career at Arizona, but it was probably, looking back at it now, one of the absolute best things that could

have happened to me because it gave me the opportunity to go out and really get my consulting business going, and really got us looking at leadership, where we're then, you know, working with multiple schools, we're probably working now over the years with 30 different schools, so rather than just having the one client at Arizona, you know, branched us into opportunities at Michigan, and Stanford, and Arkansas, and you us into opportunities at Michigan and Stanford and Arkansas and you name a bunch of other schools. So at the time, it looked like a horrible thing. But in hindsight, now looking back on it, it was probably one of the best opportunities for us to really branch out and get to learn from so many more coaches and athletes because of that

situation. There was somebody I just interviewed on the podcast a few weeks ago, Jeff, that said the same thing that they were laid off, but that turned out to be, you know, just an amazing opportunity to build something. So it's interesting how maybe one of the most difficult times in our life can actually be a blessing. Yeah, very much so. And I mean, I think we can relate to when athletes get cut from adversity that they're also experiencing. Absolutely. So let's kind of dive into your model and just this idea of championship culture and some of the biggest programs in the country you've worked with. Like you mentioned Arizona, but Michigan, Stanford, Notre Dame, LSU, Colorado,

right? So some of the best programs in the nation are implementing some of your practices and your leadership academy. So kind of start with telling us a little bit about like, what do you, how do you define championship culture and how would somebody know that they have one? Yeah. I mean, in looking at a lot of these really successful programs, they tended to have a lot of similarities in place. So, you know, whether it was a cross-country program or a football program or gymnastics, you name it, there were a lot of very similar elements that came into play. So what I tried to do, again, put them into a framework, those who maybe didn't have a championship culture.

And what we found is that I did a lot of surveying of people, and obviously over 90% of people would prefer to have a championship culture. But in the survey we did, only about 11% of them said they actually had one. So there's a huge gap, 80% of teams out there really don't have the kind of high level culture that they want to have. And the things that we saw that were very common in those, number one, credible leadership, obviously great credible leadership from the coaching staff, but also then different layers of leadership within the team itself. And that's where the captains really come in, but there was strong leadership, very clear about what it was that they wanted to achieve. They were the ones who were exemplifying that standard. They were encouraging those who were stepping up and showing that standard. And they were also then enforcing those who weren't living up to that standard. So credible leaders, really, really important. Second one, we talk about a clear and compelling vision. These teams know what all the blood and sweat and tears they're putting in. They know what that's going for. Most of the time, it's some kind of championship, whether it's a conference championship

or national championship or state championship at the high school level. There's a very clear and compelling vision about this is what we're going after and that gets people up and it gets people working in the off season and it gets people doing things without having others to have to watch over them because they're so invested and so bought into it. Third one are core values that these programs know what they stand for and these core values are so important that they're not going to sacrifice those values for short-term wins. They know that if they stick to those core values that they have, that long-term it's going to be their foundation and their bedrock to develop not just

one successful season, but an ongoing championship program. Standards of behavior. There are certain expectations that we have of you that if we operate at these standards, we know we're going to give ourselves the best chance of being successful. So they've got standards in practices that they need to meet certain times and do certain things there. They've got standards in the weight room and they've got standards in the classroom. They've got standards in how you're going to act and represent this team and be out in the community. So those standards are very clearly communicated to people and those standards are very clearly monitored and evaluated and then celebrated for those who are hitting them and exceeding them and then also communicated and forced when you're falling below those. Because of that, then, I think you've got a very committed

team and a unified team. Everybody rallies around this clear and compelling vision. They're bought into those standards, and they understand those core values as a group. And then last but not least, the sixth one that we see in championship cultures are what I call aligned systems. So the systems that every team has, every team has a system of who it attracts, who are the kind of people that would be attracted to that team, who are the kind of people who are recruited to that team, who others reach out for, whether it's a staff member or a student athlete, who are the people who are ultimately selected for that team, who others reach out for, whether it's a staff member or a student athlete, who are the people who are ultimately selected for that team? How are they oriented to what that

team is all about? How is communication in that team? How do they evaluate their success? How do they reward people who are doing the right things? How do they penalize and correct those who aren't doing the right things? Who do they name as leaders? So all these different systems that are operating within a program, all of them are in great alignment with that clear vision. They're in alignment with those values, and they're in alignment with those standards. And programs that don't have a great culture, they may say, oh, hard work is really, really important, but then they don't really reward that. Or they may say, oh, if you're going to really important, but then they don't really reward that. Or they may say, oh, if you're going to be a leader on your team, you need to do this.

But then the coach might pick their favorite person who doesn't do that at all. So there's a lot of misalignment between what is said and what is actually done. So when you look at those six things, those are the things that really are consistent among the programs that are able to develop a championship culture. systems. So let's kind of dive into the first one a little bit more, Jeff, and tell us, you know, like when you see a credible leader, how do you, how do you know that they're a credible leader and what do they maybe do differently from somebody who's not as credible? Yeah. And leadership obviously is taking place on a few different layers and levels there. The coach, the head coach is usually one of the most prominent one and their leadership is so critical. And what we did, you know, probably about 10 years ago now is look at what really is coaching credibility. And Greg Dale, I know you interviewed him as part of this as well. So we put together a

book called The Seven Secrets of Successful Coaches. And that looked at coaches who didn't just win, but they actually won their athletes' respect. And they were people that athletes wanted to run through a wall for them. So I'm guessing Greg probably talked about some of that stuff, but just a quick highlight there. Certainly character-based people, that these are people of strong character. They're highly committed. They care about their people, not just as, can you help me win? committed they care about their people not just as can you help me win but they care about them as individuals they're excellent communicators they do a great job building people's confidence in what they do and they then are very consistent people as well they have consistent philosophies they have consistent ways and how they approach things so those their leadership

is obviously really important. And what we learned there from those seven secrets, and then you have the athlete leadership that's going on when the coaches aren't there. What are the athletes saying to each other? And who are the leaders stepping up there? And same thing, we tried to look at what is it that the best leaders are doing there. And we found that number one, they're great leaders by example. They have great commitment. They have great confidence. They have great commitment, confidence, and composure and character. Those are the four things that we really emphasize there. And then they're great vocal leaders too. And they spend a lot of time encouraging and enforcing the rules of their team

and the standards of their team. So those are the things that we really try to teach to coaches and captains that if you want to be respected, you've got to earn credibility and trust with your teammates and with the coaching staff so that they will want to follow you versus feeling like they have to follow you by title alone. So Jeff, can you give us an example of somebody that you worked with or somebody that you worked with or somebody that you've watched or witnessed that you think is a great, credible leader, a really impactful, credible leader, maybe as a coach or, you know, a student athlete who's a leader? Yeah, I mean, probably the two best coaches that I've had the awesome privilege to learn from

early on. Number one, Mike Andrea, who's the softball coach at the University of Arizona, won eight national championships, was our Olympic coach for several years. And he just has a wonderful balance between being, you know, very competitive, very serious about what he's doing, very committed, having high standards, but then also cares about his kids and his student-athletes just tremendously. I mean, you ask any kid who's gone through that program, they still want to be connected with that program and with him because he does care about them so much. So he was a great mentor for me early on and a beautiful blend of this being able to require things of people but also being able to relate to people so he's one and then

Anson Dorrance the women's soccer coach at the University of North Carolina 22 national championships so he's been doing this for over three decades that programs won almost 60% of all of the championships there. And usually the best thing, example that I can give of how advanced Anson is with his program and what he does is he doesn't just do leadership training for his different levels of student athletes. He does different training for his seniors and different levels for his juniors, sophomores, and freshmen. He also does leadership training for his managers, which I have never heard of another coach going to that kind of level. But when you think about it, the managers on a lot of teams do have a big influence on the team. So he does actual

leadership training with them, but he is just somebody who I think has amazing insights into the psychology of elite performance, into what it takes to build and sustain a championship culture within a team. So the past 15 years or so that I've had the opportunity to learn from him and his program and his student athletes have been just remarkable for me to see that kind of focus on the intangibles and is certainly a key reason why they've been so successful, why they've attracted great athletes, but then have also been able to get them to work well with each other within a system and compete like well with each other within a system

and compete like heck against each other. That's one of his other really strong points is what he calls his competitive cauldron and how he's created a culture, certainly within practice, where they compete hard against each other, but then off the field, they still get along with each other. So one of the things I hear in both of those coaches, they really had strong relationships and they cared, you know, can you give us maybe like an example of what you've seen the best coaches and leaders do and like how,

how do their athletes know that they care about them? Like what might they do to show that? Yeah, I think making time to listen. As simple and easy as that sounds, I think most coaches get so caught up into all the craziness that they need to stay on top of, whether it's watching film or recruiting or different paperwork that they need to fill out. And it's so easy to get caught up into all the, what I would say, minutiae. Yeah, it's important. You got to do these things. But I think making the time to really listen and to connect with people and not always talk about your sport right away, but to ask about how things are going and with their friends and obviously not an intrusive way, but a really caring and connecting way.

How are things going with your family? How are things going with your classes? And just really getting to know them as a person and what makes them tick. And I was hearing, I was listening to something from Coach K the other day from Duke, and he just talked about how important it is to listen and to make the time to listen. Kevin Hambly, who's the volleyball coach now at Stanford, every two weeks, he's going to sit down with each of his kids and really just spend some one-on-one time individually with them. And he feels like that is so important for his success as a coach and his culture that he makes sure every two weeks or so that he has some quality time with each of his athletes. And you may not be able to do that, especially if you're a high school coach and you don't

have a lot of staff or other people. But even once a month or so, if you could just make some time, whether it's 10 minutes to check in or 15 minutes, it goes a long way to showing your kids that you care about them. And when they know that, then they're going to be much more likely to want to run through a wall for you. You know, and Jeff, most of what we're talking about right now is in athletics. But how do you think, you know, creating this championship culture and being an incredible leader, how do you think it relates to, like, let's say business or maybe even families, you know, and how parents have to be a good leader? Yeah, it's to me identical. I

got to spend several years with FedEx and their FedEx Leadership Institute in Memphis, and we taught these same exact principles. And these frontline managers and these managing directors, we're also saying that, yes, these same things that high-level coaches are doing are the same things that really help us connect with our staff and with our people. And yes, there are certain numbers and quarterly things that we've got ahead, but if we don't really know these people as people and what their goals are in terms of moving up the professional ladder, or the fact that one of my employees' father is going through cancer right now, and that's a really big thing that's weighing on their mind. If you're not aware of those things,

you're going to struggle to have that kind of connection and credibility as a leader. So the human beings are human beings, whether it's a sports setting or business setting or nonprofit setting. I think these leadership principles really cross all different sectors and are important for anybody really to understand and adapt. That's good. I'm glad that you mentioned that because as people are listening, even if they're not athletes or coaches, you know, that they can make sure that they're listening and thinking about themselves and the culture that they create as well. Yeah. Well, and let me add too, Sandra, I mean, when we go back to all the culture stuff,

when you talk about a business setting, incredible leaders and a clear and compelling vision and core values and standards of behavior and a committed and unified team and aligned systems, you know, I've spent much of my reading and practical time, some people might be familiar with Zingerman's Deli, which is in Ann Arbor, Michigan. They do an absolutely amazing job of creating a culture that attracts amazing people, that attracts people who want to eat their sandwiches. And they've spun off into nine or 10 different businesses because they've listened to their employees and because they've spun off into nine or 10 different businesses because they've listened to their employees and because they've followed their passion. It's not just a deli, but now it's also a

creamery and a coffee company and a training company and a cheese company and an ice cream company and several restaurants. So you can see how if you can create this kind of championship culture where people are thriving and looking forward to coming to and contributing to, it just is a win-win-win situation for everyone and just is something that people want to be a part of and really contribute to. Excellent. So a lot of application in what we're talking about into like various areas of work and, and performance. You know, Jeff, one of the things I'm thinking about, you know, if we go back to like our six key components of championship culture, like the first one is credible leaders, which we talked a little bit about a clear vision, core values, those two things. What if people like are unsure? What if they're like, well, I don't really know if I have a clear vision. And

you know, I don't know if I've really communicated that to the people that like, well, I don't really know if I have a clear vision and, you know, I don't know if I've really communicated that to the people that I lead, or I don't really know what our core values are. Where would you tell them to start? Yeah, I think, you know, that, that's a really important thing. And what I tried to do in our book, the how to build and sustain a championship culture is to give them a step-by-step process. So in the book, obviously, we talk about each of these six characteristics. We give very concrete and practical examples of different sports teams and business teams and how they've used them or created them and then also embedded them within their program. But then what I tried to do is put together a very practical 10-step blueprint so that people could really examine what their current culture is and try to build some of these in. So I'll just kind of go quickly through those.

And if you have any questions or anything about that, certainly shoot them at me. But number one is I think to start with, you've got to envision what kind of culture is it that you actually want to have? And the two things that tend to really impact culture are how much do you emphasize results and how much do you emphasize relationships? So if you look at the kind of culture that you want to have, one is, okay, what do we want to be as a team or as an organization? And how do we want to value results and relationships. So I think you

need to envision that first. I think Stephen Covey used to say in his seven habits of highly effective people, begin with the end in mind. So really look at what kind of culture do we want to have that is one that people would really thrive in and want to be a part of. So that's step one is look at, okay, what is it that we want? And then step two is, okay, where are we right now? And to examine your present culture. And what I often have teams do is rate on a one to 10 scale. How, what is our emphasis on results? Are we a high performance team?

Do we take our practices and our workouts and our lifts and our conditioning seriously? What does our off season look like? And obviously, if you're in the nine or 10 range, then you're really strong on results. And then I have people do the same one to 10 rating on relationships. Where are we in terms of our ability to relate with each other and to bond with each other? And not just do we, you know, hold hands and skip to practice singing Kumbaya, but are we willing to have those tough conversations with people, especially when they're falling below our standards. So I will have them rate where they are relationship wise on a one to 10 scale, and then compare that to what is their

preferred culture. And oftentimes there's going to be a gap either in the results side or the relationship side. And it helps you then focus a little bit more. You know what? We got to ratchet up our results. Things are a little bit too loose and lax. And we've got to start doing some things to make things more serious. And that's where your leaders come in. Or conversely, if the

relationships aren't there, you know what, we got to spend a little more team building time and a little more listening time and a little more connecting time with each other. And there too, the leaders can step in. So those are some very practical things you can do. And then step three is what I say, enroll team members, find people who are really bought in to that preferred culture that you want to have, that want to do something special, that want to create the kind of business or the kind of team that you look forward to being a part of. And then number four, empower your leaders. Identify who are the best examples of the culture that you want to have, and then really

groom them and hopefully put them into leadership positions, whether it's a captain or a manager for a business. Five, then establish that vision, the values, the standards, everything we were talking about before. What is that clear and compelling vision? What are maybe a small group of core values that we're really going to have undergird what we're doing, and then set the standards and expectations for people. Number six is embedding those into your program. There's different things that you can do in terms of putting up, I know Michigan men's basketball has their five core values very prominently displayed in their locker room, and other

teams will make bag tags with them. So those are some ways to embed them. Number seven is evaluate those regularly. So a lot of things that we've developed with our program is we have leadership evaluations and we have culture evaluations and chemistry evaluations. So you can really get a good gauge on where you think you are and then also have the team do that and compare team and coaches and how they see things. And then when you have people who are upholding your standards and meeting those and exceeding those, you definitely want to endorse those people. You want to call them out in a good way. Hey, the great job that John did in yesterday's workout of making sure that he had high energy, he was touching every single line, he was working through every rep and set,

that's the kind of culture that we want to have in our program. Great job, John. And then on the other side is you're going to have some people who are falling short of those, and that's where you got to step up and enforce that unacceptable behavior and say, you know what, Jim, what you were doing the other day isn't going to get us to where we want to go. Your attitude wasn't where it needed to be. You were stopping short of the line.

And that not only impacts you, Jim, but that impacts everybody else in this program because now they see you're not as invested. So you have to be able to call them out. And then last but not least is what I say, number 10, enculturating new team members. You're always typically bringing on new people. Certainly if you're in a sports setting in a school, you're typically losing your seniors and you're bringing on new freshmen. But even in a business setting, there's constantly a shuffle of people in and out or in

new roles. And it's important then to make sure they understand what this culture is all about. So it's those 10 steps that I think if coaches and managers would kind of sit down and work through step by step involving their people, involving their leaders, it gives them a really nice blueprint or framework to kind of work through how can we upgrade or change our culture. And it sounds to me really intentional, right? When you follow the blueprint, as you were talking, I was thinking about my family, you know, my kids, you know, our culture, but also the culture at work. So there's a lot of different applications. You know, Jeff, one of the questions I have for you is kind of going back to the vision and establishing the vision and the core values and standards, which is number five on your steps.

Do you think that vision should be outcome-based? Should it be more process-based or like how we want to show up? Or, you know, what have you seen in terms of kind of best practices on the vision? Yeah, I think it's probably a combination of both. What I've seen is if you have a program that's really been struggling, it's going to be hard to say we're going to win a championship in this next year. That's probably unrealistic and setting them up for frustration and failure. So I think what a lot of teams do that really just need to get a better foundation in place is they're less outcome focused and they are more process focused on how are we going to treat each other and how are we going to train. And they set their metrics more in terms of the process than the outcome. I think when you have a highly developed culture

and you have a highly developed program, then you can start saying, yes, we want to go to a Final Four. Yes, we want to win a national championship or we want to repeat as national champions. So I think the more developed your culture is and the more developed your program is, the more you can be outcome-based. And you'd still be doing the process things, but now I think the outcome is probably going to be your primary motivator. Whereas when you're just developing things, I think it's going to be much more important to put in the process.

And then if you can work the process, it will take care of itself. And one of the best books I could recommend to coaches or managers, if you're on that lower level and just trying to get the process in is Bill Walsh, the former coach of the San Francisco 49ers, wrote a fabulous book called The Score Takes Care of Itself. And what he did, I think he took over the 49ers when they were like two and 14. And he was all about putting in proper standards that if those standards took hold and people enforce them with each other, he knew that they were going to get to Super Bowls eventually. So hopefully that gives people an answer. It's kind of one of those depends answers, but hopefully the background and info that I gave people gives them a better clue as to whether they should focus more on process or more on outcome. I like the title, the score

takes care of itself. I mean, isn't that the case? When you focus on these other things, like then you don't have to worry about the score. You know, one of the things that you just mentioned that kind of Bill Walsh established was, you know, maybe have a hard time giving feedback like that or, you know, making sure that you do, let's say, enforce the unacceptable behavior? You know, what would you suggest in terms of how do you do that? You know, what's the, do you have a formula? Do you have some suggestions in terms of how do you give that really difficult feedback. Yeah, I mean, there's a couple things and it is looking at what those standards are and endorsing those who are living up to them and certainly exceeding them. And then also enforcing them when they aren't hitting those standards. So a lot of it simply goes with the verbal praise or the verbal correction that you're giving to people. I know there's different programs. I was just working on and I threw out some stuff to some of my list of people. I know there's different programs. I was just working on and I threw out some stuff to some of my list of people. And there's a guy, not remembering his name right now, but he does a sack of cookies so that when someone gets a sack for his high school football team, he and his wife will bake that kid a sack of cookies. So those are things, you know, a simple thing that just showing that this is what we really need as a team.

You've got others who will do, we used to do with Arizona men's basketball, the all props team, where the players would vote on a guy that they thought best demonstrated their standards and their core values. And sometimes that guy was the leading scorer. And sometimes that guy didn't even get to get off the bench, but because of the attitude that he had during the week, he was certainly worthy of that. So there's little simple things that you can do, just little reward kind of things. I think as you look at college football out there, Alabama had their ball out belt and Miami had their turnover chain. So these little kind of symbols of these are things that really contribute to our program are simple, fun ways of doing that. And then some other programs,

when somebody's not doing what they should be doing, they have a unity council. There's one team I'm working with right now that I won't name, but when somebody has been late for a tutor session or late for a workout or late for whatever it is they need to do, that person needs to appear before the 16-member leadership council as a group and explain why it was that they did it. And the leadership council will try to be understanding, but at the same time, they have to hold their standards. And usually then the penalty the first time for that guy is having to then for the next week, be in charge of cleaning up the locker room. So that's kind of a one strike thing. And then if it goes further than that, then the team actually will suspend the guy for a few days from practices, because obviously the message has not gotten

through. So you talk about some ownership and accountability within a program, the players themselves decided to put those things in place, have the coaches and the strength coaches blessing on these different things. And now they have set the standards and they are not only endorsing those standards, but enforcing those standards with their teammates. Excellent. So those are some really good suggestions of like tangible things people can use. And I think back to, you know, your continuum of, you know, this one to 10 scale of results

and relationships and how a championship culture, would you say, is high on both of those? Is that correct? Yeah, what I usually look at with both of those, I mean, if you can give your team an eight on results and an eight on relationships up to a 10 on results and 10 on relationships, I think you're definitely in that championship level. If you're only down maybe in the seven range or so, then you're probably in more of the constructive level. And there's different kinds of levels than the teams might have, depending upon how much they emphasize results or how much they might emphasize relationships. I like your eight kinds of culture in your book that kind of outlines this. So some

other names of these cultures are like country club culture, comfortable culture, cutthroat culture, right? Or competitive culture. What about those, those people that you've seen that maybe have this like cutthroat culture where they're really like high on results, but do not value relationships? What do you see is like the consequence and, and how do they turn it around? Yeah, I mean, it is one that I've seen. And fortunately, it's especially at the college level, it's there, but maybe not a majority one. At the professional level, it's definitely a big one there. And it is, it's so many people get focused just on the results, because that's how they're measured. That's how the media measures them. That's how the fans measure them as well. But I think that if you're an athlete in that system,

you become very jaded quickly because you see that you're just kind of a piece of meat that if you can either perform for that person, then you're valued. And if you're not able to perform, then they don't need you anymore. So I think it is a very short term kind of culture. And if these programs would see that if we would value our people as people, then they might even take it to another level, and they might want to stick around a little bit longer. I think the shelf life of a cutthroat culture is very short term. And I'll use an example,

at least from what I see, I haven't worked with them, but the Golden State Warriors are probably a great example that has a high focus on results, but then also a high focus on relationships. And I'm going to credit Steve Kerr with the kind of culture that he has created. He's a very selfie-facing person who understands that there are much more important things going on in our world today than being able to put a ball in a basketball hoop. And I think he leads that. I think Steph Curry and his ability to put his ego aside and bring in Kevin Durant and give him shots and have clay shots. And I think it's a team right now that has strong relationships and results that quite honestly, I'm wondering is I'm wondering how they're going to do because they've just added boogie cousins

who does not have a reputation for caring about teammates or being selfless. So I am concerned that their culture, even though on paper, there's nobody as talented as that team, I'm going to really be curious to see what their culture is. Are they able to absorb someone who from all external looks right now does not seem to be as a fit with that team? Yeah. And you know, when you just watch them, you can see that they have a championship culture, right? Because they're performing well together, but then you can see in their relationships, the way they're treating each other, the way they're respecting each other. So you can definitely see, you know, from the outside when you're watching a team or a business, you know, that you can see what their culture is like. Yeah, for sure. And that's, you know,

it'd be interesting to see if that they're able to sustain that kind of culture and chemistry, even though they're bringing in someone with a history who has not supported that kind of vision, values, and standards. Yeah, we'll wait and see, right? So Jeff, you know, you've implemented your leadership academies at so many different schools, like I already mentioned some of them, but you know, Wake Forest, Michigan, George Washington, Boston. What do you see in terms of like the result or, you know, Wake Forest, Michigan, George Washington, Boston. What do you see in terms of like the result or, you know, departments or teams like really thinking through and outlining, you know, your steps and your blueprint and being really intentional with that? What do you see,

you know, in terms of what happens to these locations who implement something like this? Yeah, I think rather than just randomly hoping you have good leaders develop, we do it systematically. So it starts, you know, early on with the sometimes freshmen, oftentimes sophomores, teaching them how to lead themselves effectively. So I think when that happens, you're getting a much more quality practice and workout. And then as they move up, you have vocal leaders stepping up and saying things. Certainly within competitions, when the momentum starts to swing the wrong way,

now you have a vocal leader who's stepping up, pulling the team together, refocusing them back on the task at hand. So hopefully these big momentum swings that usually doom teams are just a little blip and a team can get back on track. The culture has of most teams that I've worked with has definitely gotten better in terms of their focus on results and their focus on relationships. And I think over time, we've had a lot of teams. I mean, South Carolina is a recent one that a lot of their teams, as you look at it, certainly for a variety of reasons, because they've

got great coaches and great administration and facilities and student athletes who work their butts off to do well. But hopefully in some of the stuff that we've implemented with their teams, you know, these little intangibles are making a slight but significant difference in them having some really successful Final Four or National Championship or, you know, successful softball seasons and things like that. And then honestly, to me,

the thing that I really love about this are so many graduates who are coming back and saying, you know what? I'm experiencing these same things in the business world. And the things that we're going through in training, the things that we talked about in the Leadership Academy, like your commitment continuum or your culture stuff, has so much bearing on what we're talking about. Or I got a note from a former student athlete from almost 10 years ago

now at North Carolina with their volleyball program. She's a headmaster at a girls school in Memphis. And she's like, most of these girls did not have family who have gone to college, but we're using some of these same tools with them all the way to college and making their families proud and the future generations, because they're getting a higher level of education, it's going to make a big difference there. So it's those kinds of conversations that the people had or those notes that, that I get to know that this stuff is not just helping for four or five years while they're in school, but for 40 to 50 years after they leave school. Yeah. Long-term for sure. And so how could people connect with you if they're interested in

learning more about the academies that you, you've and you know how you might be able to help their department or their team? Yeah, probably the best way is certainly online. We're at JansenSportsLeadership.com. And then I know a lot of people are probably on Twitter as well. So I'm there. My Twitter handle is at Jansen Leader. And those are probably the best ones in terms of just finding out about what we do. We do a monthly blog with a lot of free articles and resources there. And then, yeah, as you said, I mean, what we really pride ourselves in are practical and proven resources. And we've got a six-level leadership, self-leadership, all the way up to culture and holding people accountable, we have different levels that are available to people. So it's almost like if you're at the high school or college level, if you have a freshman coming in, we'll help them with responsibility and accountability. If you have a senior, we're going to help them hopefully create that culture

and hold people accountable to it. So we've got a lot of resources, no matter where your kids might be in terms of where they are developing as a leader. And Jeff, one of the other things I really like about the work and what you've developed is you have a lot of different resources in terms of books. So we've been talking about, the book, How to Build and Sustain a Championship Culture. But I just looked on Amazon the other day and you have, you know, like so many of them up there, a team's captain leadership manual, the team captain's culture manual, championship team building, you have a peak performance playbook, the seven secrets of successful coaches with Greg Dale, like you mentioned. So where would you, you know, recommend that we check those out? Yeah, I mean, again, probably straight on our website is probably the best part there. And again, we often have with each of those kind of

a sample thing. So there'd be an overview article associated with each of those so that people can get a really good flavor of what it's about. I just got an email earlier today from someone saying, well, what's the best book I should use? It's like, well, it really depends upon what do you want to focus on for your team? And as we've talked about throughout this interview so far, I mean, there's leadership stuff, there's competitiveness, there's culture, there's coaching, there's just so many different areas. And I guess when I've been doing this for 25 years now, you get to really delve into and see all these different areas. So a lot depends upon what it is that either your team or your program is struggling

with, or what are the areas that you most want to jump into that you think are going to make the biggest difference for your team. And odds are, we probably have some kind of resource for it. Excellent. So the website, again, is Jensen Sport Leadership. You know, Jeff, here are some things that I got from the interview. So first of all, I'm grateful that you spent the time just helping us gain more wisdom in terms of leadership and championship culture. But here are a few things that I really took from the interview. So you said, you know, 90% of people want a championship culture, but yet 11%, only 11% have it. So over 80% of teams that don't. And so we can all use the resources that you provided. You know, also one of the things that I really

took from it is that, you know, a championship culture is really high on results and high on relationships. So about over an eight on both of those. And even the coaches that you provided as examples, they both had high, high emphasis on results, but then a high emphasis on relationships as well. And you could just tell that by the way that you described them. And so I'm just so grateful that you provided us with some insight in terms of your 10 steps of developing the championship culture and then the six key components of championship culture. What kind of final advice or comments do you have for those people who are listening? Yeah, I think the big thing is find your passion.

I mean, that's what I did early on in life, is I found out what made my heart sing and what I was passionately curious about. And I just continue to follow that. And I think when you do that, you're going to bring a tremendous amount of commitment and focus and great attitude to what you do. And other people will notice that as well. And they're going to want to hopefully have you in some way contribute to things. So once you find that passion, throw yourself into it., you know, amazing things can happen in your life. Nice. And you did a great job of like listening to what

your clients wanted, right? That you didn't just stick with the peak performance, but we're really paying attention to the needs and maybe the things that weren't available to coaches and athletes, you know, because maybe there's a lot of people doing peak performance, but less people doing kind of the sports leadership, which you're doing right now. Yeah, exactly. I mean, it just certain issues just kept coming up over and over and over again. And then I would look for a resource out there and there wasn't. I mean, there might've been something, as I said, that maybe was a little similar in the business world or maybe a little similar in psychology. So I just kind of followed where those pain points were for people, and then put together a really practical system to address those and educate

people about them and to fix them so that they weren't the problem or the drag on the program that was so frustrating to the coaches. and hopefully they could overcome those things then and get to the level that they wanted to be at. Outstanding. So we'd encourage you as you're listening to head over to Twitter and you can join the conversation with Jeff and I there at Jensen Leader. Is that correct, Jeff? Yeah, Jensen Leader. Okay. And mine is at Mentally Underscore Strong. So we'd encourage you to head over there. Thanks again so much for joining us, Jeff. My pleasure. Okay. And mine is at Mentally Underscore Strong. So we'd encourage you to head over there. Thanks again so much for joining us, Jeff. My pleasure.

Thank you for listening to High Performance Mindset. If you liked today's podcast, make a comment, share it with a friend and join the conversation on Twitter at Mentally Underscore Strong. For more inspiration and to receive Sindra's free weekly videos, check out DrSindra.com.