Hot Smart Rich with Maggie Sellers Reum - Aimee Smale on building Odd Muse into a $30M brand, why her wedding can wait, and the reality of out-earning your partner

Episode Date: August 5, 2026

Odd Muse founder, Aimee Smale, joins Maggie Sellers Reum to reveal how she built a $30M fashion brand with no investors, turning £12K into one of the UK's fastest-growing bootstrapped businesses through community, conviction and long-term thinking. Aimee shares the story behind Odd Muse, why vulnerability became her greatest advantage, the power of doing one scary thing every week, and how sensitivity helped her become a stronger founder.  She opens up about building a business without outside funding, taking bold risks, handling criticism online, balancing ambition with relationships, and why she believes her journey to a $100M brand is only just beginning. Get unselfish access to insights that will help you own the room. Sign up now https://linkly.link/2jPXJ  ---------- (00:00) Intro (02:28) Building a $30M Brand Without Investors  (07:33) Vulnerability Is Her Biggest Advantage (13:40) Do One Scary Thing Weekly (25:37) SoFi Ad (26:56) Pique Ad (27:53) The Story Behind Odd Muse (31:30) How £12K Became $30M (34:45) Building to $100M Bootstrapped (43:11) The Biggest Bet She Ever Made  (51:41) Friendship Looks Different For Founders (56:02) Fiverr Pro Ad (57:01) Lululemon Ad (58:02) Why Trolls Don't Matter (1:00:39) Why Sensitivity Is A Superpower (1:08:31) Success Doesn't Intimidate Her Partner (1:10:04) Why Marriage Can Wait (1:11:31) Her $100M Vision (1:12:23) Rapid Fire With Aimee ---------- SoFi - visit SoFi.com/HSRCrypto and get up to $1000 in cryptocurrency when you open and fund a Crypto account.  Pique - https://piquelife.com/hsr for 15% off  Fiverr - If you are scaling a business, then you need to visit https://pro.fiverr.com  Lululemon - http://lululemon.com  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This episode is brought to you by Accenture. When your advertising operations fall out of sync, everything else follows. Spotify and Accenture are working together to reinvent the rhythm of ad sales, using automation, analytics, and smarter workflows to simplify campaign delivery and access better data across the business. The result? Less time spent on operations, more time connecting brands with the moments and fandoms that matter most. Learn more at Accenture.com slash Spotify.

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They made so much time on crap friends and crap boys So I think in business Just teaching women to be unapologetic Is so important Basically, I was like pretty little thing And I started a brand called Oddmuse And now you've built a $30 million brand Bootstrapped

Yep, no investors I'm obsessed with you I was one of the first buyers Of our views I do like women especially We just need to scream a bit more About our success That's why I started my personal brand

because I genuinely didn't realize it was going to be this hard. Like, this is the craziest story. I had to pay my deposit, and one of the guys phoned me and say, can you send me $100,000 just to prove that you can pay the deposit next week? So, like, as a woman, I had to give a deposit to my deposit. But I love being underestimated. Like, I've paid my mum and dad's mortgage off. That's what excites me about money.

I'm like, what would this unlock? I would not have been able to do this if it wasn't for. A lot of people watching this will want to be founders. How do you think about being driven, successful, ambitious, especially in terms of being in a relationship? I'm a controversial. Hi, Angels. Did you know that subscribing to our channel is free?

It doesn't cost you anything. And it is the simplest way for you to support HotSmart Rich and help us grow so that we can bring you more of the conversations you love. Just hit the subscribe button below and thank you. In case you missed it, you're allowed to be hot, smart and rich. So let's get into it. Amy Smale, are you ready to get Hot Smart Rich? Yes, absolutely.

So excited that you're here. So excited that you're here. I feel like Hot Smart Rich is needed in London. Do you not think? You actually posted that and I really wanted to get into why you put that onto your latest vlog. Because I just feel like in the UK we're so like reserved. and women especially, we just need to like scream a bit more about our success. And I feel like I do on these podcasts because I know why people watch it.

But in real life, if someone was to be like, oh my God, odd muse or anything like that, I'd curl up into a ball. So I just feel like us British girls, us as a nation, we need some more hot, smart rich. I couldn't agree more. And that's why she's here. That's why you're here. And that's why I'm here. Yep.

We have a lot of US listeners that might not know who you are. So if someone's just clicked into this conversation, What would you tell them to get them to stay to listen to the episode in fall? Okay, so first of all, my name is Amy Smell. I started a brand called Oddmuse back in 2020 during a time where no one was going anywhere and I was essentially trying to sell you clothing then. Everyone told me not to start a business. I thought it was the perfect time to start a business because everyone was on their phones

and I knew I had a great product. Fast forward six years. We are now a $30 million company. We have stores in New York. We have a store in London on New Bond Street, which is like the most prestigious place in London to have a store. So I'd say that's my little thing to get you to stay. I started doing this because I think like you, you've built a community-driven brand. And so have I with Hot Smart Rich.

And so I like to give a promise because I've chosen you for a reason. So to my community, what I will promise you will get from this episode if you listen to it in full is this. And I want to see if you agree or disagree at the end. you will be able to build an exceptional personal brand, an exceptional bootstrapped business, and live life without permission. I love that. I do agree with that, especially like with the era I'm in now. Like the last like five to six years have been like really hard.

But that last point you said, I'm really like living that now. So there might be someone listening to this that are like in the crux, like in the pits of their business right now. But there is that kind of no permission coming your way. How would you describe your personal brand and your era that you're in right now? Exciting. And I think I really didn't know the opportunities that there are with a personal brand. Like for me, when I first started posting about odd news, it was by pure default. I was a 22 year old girl. I spent all my money on stock. I had no budget for models, photographers, marketing. I had no knowledge of marketing. So for me, building a personal brand and telling people what I'm doing and sitting on the floor of a storage unit packing your orders, that's the only thing I could really do to push my brand.

I think it's just super surprising, like how there is a business in yourself. I think the way that you think about even those two avenues is one is very short-term monetization and one is long-term equity. So, like, for you, you can actually get a lot of money from the personal brand right now this second. but you did something so smart, which is you have equity in what you've built with Audmuse. 100%. And on that point is, Oddmuse is always the priority. It always has been the priority. Six years in, I'm learning a little bit more about monetizing my personal brand, but my priority has been building Audmuse. And I think that's really important to say because sometimes the world of social media and maybe the attention can be super exciting and you want to focus on that.

But the long game really is in the business and the equity. A lot of people watching this will want to be founders or be building a personal brand. What would you say to the person about why it's beneficial to have something other than the personal brand as you're building both a personal brand and a business? Again, I think it's just something that I fell into, but I think people really connect with it. And I was talking about this the other day. So I have always, I've not gate kept anything. Like I've always told you how much money it costs to start a business, how much money it cost me to start my New York store. or launches that didn't go well, launches that did go well.

And I feel like I've just had no ego with it. And I think that's the key thing. I see a lot of founders that want to show this, like, glamorous day in the life. But I've always, the reason I started my personal brand and started posting was because I genuinely didn't realize it was going to be like this hard. I was like, like, I've posted videos of me like so upset on the floor because I'm like, no one is telling us that it is like this and that this is like the reality of a building something. It is so stressful.

And in those early years, everything is new. So everything just feels so heavy. Whereas like your five, six year point, you've like, you've seen it all. If you're going to do it, it's really important to be so authentic to a fault. And also, I would say I never actually really started telling people how to do things. until like year three. I see a lot of founders that are really early in their journey and kind of come into social media.

Like, this is how you should do this. This is how you should do that. I never felt qualified to tell anyone how to do things until like year three, year four. And that's when I kind of started doing podcasts and like feeling a bit more confident to share. Up until that point, it was like, this is how I done it. And, you know, I'm upset about this today and this has happened today.

but it's only in like year three, four, five that I've actually been like, no, I'm actually confident. This is how you should do it. So I think dropping the ego being really authentic and not trying to come across like you know more than what you know. I was so excited to have you on because I also have cried quite a few times on the internet. It's quite controversial, isn't it? It is. Is it controversial in the UK? Yeah, I think people just love to say, like, I would never cry on the internet.

but if I didn't cry, if I didn't post videos of me crying, there would be no content going out. Like I was building a bit, I was building this business. And if I didn't plop my phone up and just tell you how today's gone, there would be no content for making me smell. So it was kind of like, it's either like post that or post nothing. And, you know, I'm, I'm proud of it. It's real. It's like that is, I have set myself a goal to stop crying on the internet. Like there has to be a time when enough is enough.

But I have no regrets. I think it's like shocking that as women we didn't tell each other like how hard this is. And I'll always just advocate that it takes blood, sweat and literal tears to get to where you want to get to. I couldn't agree with you more. And you've also gotten amazing opportunities from crying on the internet. So we probably wouldn't know each other had you not posted videos of you crying. Take me back to that video. I actually have a fun story with Stephen about this.

So I posted that, I can't remember what was going on at the time. I think I was just running a team of like with no managers. So I had maybe like 40 people reporting into me. I wasn't like, I hadn't got the structure in Ombuds yet. And I just had this. Oh my God. I'm like the ugliest cry. I'm literally Kim Kay.

Oh my God. Someone commented on that the other day. Like I'm actually so glad to see this video and like know where you are now. But Stephen basically saw this video and reached out to me and was like, here's my number. Send me a 15-minute voice note of everything that's going on. And within like an hour, I got a 15-minute voice note back at like 2 a.m., which is insane. Because I know how busy I am.

I can't imagine how busy that guy is. So to send me back a 15-minute voice note was insane. But yeah, I just, I'm not that girl anymore. But that's crazy. I feel like that's where I have this thesis that the next era of these creator brands is actually leading through vulnerability. And women are so perfectly positioned to do that. But I also feel like one of women's superpowers is to be a chameleon and to know the room that you're in. And for me, I'm so curious for you because I think people see and have seen me cry on the internet.

And then I don't know if they assume that I would do that in every single work setting. So how did you think about your online persona building the business? branch of your community versus building it with your team. That's been a difficult one because obviously my team, I feel like at times my team have kind of like tiptoed around me a little bit because like there's been a few situations where I haven't actually known things that are going on internally with the business because the girls in my team are just first and foremost just too lovely to like want to bother me if I'm having that sort of moment. So it's definitely affected that.

But I would say that one of the reasons why I love how emotional I've been over the years is whenever I see someone in public, they do not hesitate to run over to me. And immediately they are not scared to say anything. They just feel like I'm their best friend. And that happened to us in Cannes, didn't it? That girl runs straight over to us and was like, oh my God, Amy and Magina. People are so excited because they have, they just feel so connected to you. Like they've seen you in your most vulnerable state.

They feel so, so connected to you. And I love that. Like, I love people running over to me like they've known me for like 10 years. So I actually think it's like my superpower, like just being able to share everything and have no. You know, I just click hit. I just click post. And I think not enough people have that nowadays. We all want to curate something perfect.

But I just, I just click post because this, I'm running a business. I can see if it like this or nothing. But yeah, no, I think they connect with you on another level. Like, because I see people that I maybe follow and I don't feel like I'm connected enough to them, so I'm a bit hesitant. Or should I say hello? Should I not? I know people don't feel like that with me and I love that.

You said something when I showed you that video that that's not you anymore. How would you describe the Amy that started the brand versus the Amy that you are sitting here today. The Amy that started the brand was so shy, so timid. And I love to say that because on paper, I am not the person or was not the personality type to run a business. I'm super, super sensitive. I feel everything and I can be super awkward in social situations. Like even at events now, I'm like, oh my God, why am I going here? Who am I going to know? Like I stress so much about all the little things. But six years later, I'm so confident in my success. I've always been super confident in Odd Muse product, but not myself. And I think the confidence that Odd Muse has given

me, but also it's just made me tougher. Like the last six years have been so hard. Like, it has not been easy at all. Like, a lot of people think Oddmuse is an overnight success. And Even overnight successes are, first of all, it's not an overnight success, but we've had moments where the business has skyrocketed overnight in certain situations. I don't think people understand how hard it is to have an overnight success, how hard it is to go from 100 people to 10,000 people on site and having to facilitate that and having to manage reviews when your face is front and center of this brand. So, yeah, I just think she is 10 times tougher, a lot more.

confident. There's still glimpses of her, but she's just been through it. A lot of people listening to this want to build confidence. They want to be a more confident version of themselves. That is probably other than like, how do you have a successful relationship or start investing? Confidence seems to be the thing that all of these women are trying to grow. What are steps that you can take or things that you do to actually build your confidence in addition to just putting in the reps? I think the main thing for me is, One thing I used to tell myself really early on in the business stages was every single week I have to be terrified.

Every single week you have to be scaring yourself because you're not going to build up that resilience without putting yourself in terrifying situations, without posting that video online, without opening that store, without signing that contract. You have to constantly be terrifying yourself and doing things that scare you. And that doesn't change. I still always put myself in. in situations that terrify me, that feel so, so nerve-wracking leading up to that moment. But it just, it does so much for yourself and it does so much for your business.

When you were at that creator, influencer, do people like to be called creators or influencers here? I think, I don't know, the creator terms kind of like coming in. It seems more like businessy. Okay. I think creator. Okay. So the creator event that you went to last night, were you nervous walking in? Absolutely.

And how did you overcome that to own the room? I went on my own. I could have had a plus one. I made sure I went on my own. And I just dived in. I just went. I had no strategy. I just went. And I met loads of people. I made sure to like go up to a few people and just say, hi, I'm Amy. How are you? And really introduce myself. That's one thing I never used to do, introduce myself. I would always just look for someone I knew or like and just attached to one person. But I really make sure that I introduce myself now. And I feel like, that's actually something that I learn from like American founders. Like they are so like, hi, this is my name. This is what I do. And that's one thing I found really refreshing in Canada. I was like, people really advocate for themselves. And as they should, there's not enough of that here.

We're all a bit like maybe like a bit awkward around introducing ourselves. And we can be quite clicky. And I think just walking into the room and introducing yourself. And if someone doesn't respond to that, the way you would respond to that, you don't need to talk to them. Like I know if someone walked over to me and said, hi, I'm Maggie and this is what I'd do. I'd be like, oh my God, that's amazing.

My name's Amy and stuff like that. So I think you should always kind of expect that people are going to be as welcoming as you. And if they're not, then you're not a match and you can talk to the next person. I'm so curious because I have a perception of what you would be as a child. Okay.

But how would you describe what Amy was like as a child? Amy as a child drove her self. mad. She would move furniture at 2am. She would rearrange her bed. I mean, to start odd news, I actually dissembled my single bed in my parents' room and threw out on the driveway. I was like, I don't need to sleep. I just need to shoot content in this room. And I need to like a little desk to work from. So like my dad had come home that day and was like, what is going on? Your bed is in like a million pieces on the driveway. But I just, I'm really obsessive and impulsive. And I feel like I really like if I have a good idea, I'd run with it.

But like throughout school, university, like, would stress myself out so much. Like, I remember being, like, eight years old and having, like, a test at school. And I'd covered my room with, like, all these, like, brainstorm mind maps so I could go to sleep reading all. Like, I would get so obsessive, I know. And, like, I would just spend so much time on my own. And I think I just really felt a lot of pressure to do really well. but it was so self-inflicted. Like that never come from anywhere, anyone in my family.

I just always wanted to do well. Why do you think that is? I don't know why. I just, I get a kick out of it. Like I love, I just, who doesn't want to do well? But I just was a bit obsessive. Like I would like stay, I would have like the security guy at university kick me out of the library at midnight.

Like I was so obsessed. But I think that's a credit to like my work ethic. Like I have always put myself. in situations where I'm doing things that I love. So at university, I studied fashion buying. I was so interested in the buying world of fashion. And even at school, all the subjects that I chose, like, I've always been really obsessed with, like, learning.

I think that's really important. I always say I need to be laughing or learning. And I always love to say that to people because I feel like people have such a thin patience nowadays with their expectation at work. Whereas if I'm having a crap day at work, I'll be like, at least. I'm learning something today. I can either be really enjoying myself having a great time laughing, or if I'm not enjoying myself, at least I'm learning something. If I'm not laughing or learning, I'm not doing it. That's like my rule of life. I think that's so important for founders to talk

about because so often it's like people look to you as the top of the business and you're almost democratizing your information. And like the best founders that I see actually do the opposite, they're learning so much from their team. But who would you credit the most that you've learned from in the journey of building our own years. I feel like I'm really just entering that era because I've really started hiring up. It took me so long to hire senior hires. So I've recently hired a managing director

and a brand director and I just love sitting in catch-ups with them and rooms with them. And I feel my time up with them as much as I can because I just feel like I'm absorbing so much from their knowledge and their experience but also just their experience in like leading the team.

Like I feel like one thing I really underestimated was that leadership quality that you need when you build a team. And I mean, I think just watching these two people give feedback to other people is so mind-blown to me. Because previously in the business, I would be like having to tell someone that I don't like something where I want to change something. I'm like hyperventilating going into this meeting and thinking that I'm breaking their heart. but these hires that have been in the business a lot longer than me, just do it in such an amazing way that's better for the team member. So I think I'm learning a lot about leadership from them. But up until that point, it was all my customers and all my community.

And I've had no, I've took criticism so good. But one thing about fashion buying will teach you if like a product's not working, do not personally attach, move on. So I've always constantly like been asking my community. Do we like this? Do we like that? Oh, you like that? Oh, you like that dress? Okay, we'll do this collection based on this. And I've learned a lot from my community. But now I'm like really leaning into like directors and kind of like moving into that C-suite level to just really absorb knowledge from them. I love that. You're talking so much about learning because you often think when you finish school, it's like you're done learning.

And you just have to know everything. I love people that know more than me. I want to be the dumbest person in the room at all times. All times. Do you like that or no? I say the exact same thing. Like I was actually, so there was a new woman, Elena, who just run my team and she's in training this week. And I was saying, like, I love when people have a point of view. Like, do not just agree with me. Because then I lose trust that, like, you actually don't have the skill set that I wanted you for. Like, the best way to work with me is actually to push me is actually to, like, give me a different thought.

If you are attached to that, that can become a problem. But if you introduce that thought and it's a conversation, I love that. I think that's such a conversation to have with anyone before you hire them. What is the best way to work with you? I read a quote the other day and I'm kind of like forgiving myself. Like I feel like hiring is a bit like dating and it's like it's so fine if it doesn't work out because it's not good for either party. And so I'm really like I feel like with people I hire I am kind of like playing the field a little bit and seeing if we like really click. I want to go to that a little bit because I think I'm so curious.

with founders of like why they start a brand. It sounded like that's why I asked about you as a child. Like you loved learning and you loved being obsessed with things. But what was it specifically about aspirational luxury fashion that you were like, I'm going to do this? Well, basically, I was working, well, I was at university, graduated, got my first job at ASOS. First paycheck hit. I was like, okay, fuck pretty little thing. I've got money now. Fuck boo-hoo. I'm not, get out of my way. I've only been buying you because I've literally had no money. I've been buying you on my student line. I'm ready.

So I want to spend like 150, 150 quid, 150 pounds on that we was laughing earlier when I said quid. I wanted to spend 150 pounds on something. I was like, I want to buy like, what is my first piece? I couldn't find anything. There was nothing out there that was speaking to a young working woman that wanted to just up her spend. and just like buy something cool. And it was literally like a YSEL blazer for 2,000 pounds or like a 20 quid dress and pretty little thing.

No one was like hitting that middle ground. And I just sat with that idea for a while, continue to just use my ASOS discount and just wear ASOS some pretty little thing and stuff. And then over COVID I was like, no, this really needs to happen. Like this is such a niche. I'd been like working on samples in the background. I'd been spending like 60 pounds here and there getting samples made in China because I was working at ASOS.

I understood where people were getting close from, how much they cost, how much it was to import them. Like I was really understanding like the BTS of fashion that no one sees, like how you actually get a product on site. And I think, well, over COVID I got moved departments at ASOS and I was on like the beauty brand. And a lot of people love beauty buying, but for me it was so systematic. It was like I was ordering like 30,000 pixieglotonics a week, just like a, I felt like I was just at a call center all of a sudden.

And I just, I wasn't in that creative realm, whereas when I was on the premium department, I was going to appointments. I was curating collections for ASOS. And I had an amazing manager that let me do things that were like way above what I was able to do. So I think it took job satisfaction to be like on the floor. and a bit of like lockdown, spending too much time of myself and just really gearing myself up to just go for it. And then one day I was like, I've got, I've got this sample made. This blazer's amazing.

I'm going to quit my job. And I think there's something in that that just clicks. And I think I'd spent so much time on odd news. Like it was a hobby before it was a business. So I was like commuting into London every day for two hours on my iPad, like sketching. What's the brand called? What's the brand called? The mission is investment fashion.

I'm listening to Slow Fashion. I need a good name. Like, I thought of every single detail. And I think when I come to market, although I look back now and I'm like, that is not how I would have odd news look, like if I look at the socials and stuff. But it looked pretty good for a 22-year-old

that was just quitting a job. And everyone was like stunned by the finishing product. So I think I'd just come to market with an idea that I'd spent so much time with. And I was so confident in, like when I speak about not, being confident in myself, I'd spent two years with Obniews and I thought it was the best thing ever and I had to share it with the world. So I think making it a hobby for like two years before launch was like the most game-changing thing I did because I fell in love with my business before the world did. I've always understood why people are interested in crypto, but always so real.

A lot of trading platforms make the whole thing feel more complicated than it needs to be. If I'm going to explore something financial, I don't want to feel like I've downloaded some random app that I barely understand. I want it to feel simple, and I want it to be through a company I actually trust. That's why today's sponsor, SoFi, is interesting to me. Sofi is the first nationally charted bank where you can buy, sell, and hold cryptocurrency all from one simple app. You can access over 25 cryptocurrencies on a federally regulated platform with the safeguards of a bank. And because it's all in the same SOFi app, you can manage your crypto alongside your SoFi checkings and savings and investments. If you're keen to get started, SoFi has in-app guidance

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When your advertising operations fall out of sync, everything else follows. Spotify and Accenture are working together to reinvent the rhythm of ad sales, using automation, analytics, and smarter workflows to simplify campaign delivery and access better data across the business. The result? Less time spent on operations, more time connecting brands with the moments and fandoms that matter most. Learn more at Accenture.com slash Spotify. Right now, for a limited time, everyone's part of the Buick team, even you.

Buick's employee pricing for you event is on now. Get a purchase credit of up to $3,168 on a 2026 Buick Envision. Surround yourself with signature Buick refinement from an available massaging driver's seat to an expansive panoramic moonroof and a stunning ultra-wide 30-inch diagonal screen. Don't miss Buick's employee pricing for you event. Visit buick.com for more details. Where did the name Odd Muse come from? Oh, I need to think of a chic way of saying this, but I'll tell you, and then I really need to work on this.

But I was obsessed with the idea of the word of muse, like something that was super inspiring. And I think I just really had a problem with the industry, like really pushing fast fashion onto these young women. Honestly, like spending, like you would watch brands like Boohoo spend way more money on getting someone in Love Island in these crap clothes than that. they would on the actual clothes and like people were just buying into it and I essentially was like, okay, what I'm doing is odd, odd muse. I don't think you need to change that. Okay. I'm doing something odd.

I think that for me, I think being different and being odd is actually such a superpower, especially in this world we live in now where even facial features are starting to look the same. But I don't know about you. Like when I see a woman with very distinctive features that doesn't have an. Instagram face, I am drawn to them. I am like, there is something so uniquely different about it. So I don't know, because I, you know this, but I was one of the first buyers of our views. When you showed me those pictures, I was like, I cannot believe this. Because this is like

the podcast that I've been manifested this year. And then you rocked up that picture. I was like, no, this is not real. This is not happening right now. And it's like, you in a car park with the blazer on. And that was the first VC dinner that I was hosting where I was actually trying to get LP, so very rich people, into a fund that I was working at at the time. And I remember being like, this is what is going to speak to who I am. I'm a creator meets being now at a VC fund, and I want to be fashionable and I want to be stylish, but I want to be taken seriously. And I'm actually hosting people that have real money. And I remember it was a UK brand. I was always looking to be different. Like whenever someone asked me about my outfit, I didn't want to say Zara. I didn't want to

say the same thing. And so, being having that word odd in it drew me to the brand yeah so i's a good name i actually think you need to like own that okay story yeah but i love what you just said there like that it odd me's really is a feeling like people we call it well we've there's a few people that's out on tictock and we're just owning it now but we call it like the odd muse effect and it really just met all the clothes make women feel so fabulous and so ready for whatever they're going into whether that is a board meeting, whether that's now like a wedding. Like it just, it really is like a coming of age when like a young woman

stop shopping fast fashion and moves into oddmuse. And I love that because every single year I've been in business, fast fashion is just declining. And I have so many young women that have said to me, you've changed the way I've shop. Like I used to spend the same amount on Boohoo and ASOS and stuff like that. But now I just like, I want to re-wear this one thing over and over again. We have people that still wear that blazer five years later. That was my mission to just buy something that you want to wear

that's not only going to last in terms of quality, but also style. Like we're not inspired by trends. We're completely inspired by what has worked before and what our customer will like. But it is a feeling. It is odd. People will, if it's a really important day, people are going to come to Obnuse. And I love that. I also love what Isabel, our mutual friend said,

about having things that you are known for aesthetically, on your personal brand page. So like she only really has a few pieces of colors in her wardrobe because it's actually now what people are drawn to where it's instantly recognizable. I think that slow fashion and what you have pioneered would be so intimidating sitting at where you were at a 22 year old woman.

How much money did you have saved to launch this brand to go up against these huge brands? So I saved like 12,000 pounds to try and move out. one day and then I thought I'm just going to risk it all. I've got, you know, I've got, I felt really steady. Like I hadn't moved out yet. I knew that my parents like pretty solid. They're probably still like me live in their bedroom now. So I'm so lucky to like have that support. Like they didn't have anything. They couldn't give me anything, but they gave me like a secure home and I feel like that's just been everything to me. And so I really just like

mitigated the risk. I was like, I can, I'll buy a house one day. It's fine. So it was 12,000 pounds, but that all went on stock. I had nothing for nothing else. Like I had no, I made my website myself. I learned myself, I taught myself Shopify. I made the logo myself. I didn't have anything but this stock that I'd purchased. I bought 12,000 pounds worth of stock.

And now you've built a $30 million brand? 30 million last year, yeah. Bootstrapped. Yeah, no investors. If you could do it all over again, would you do the same thing? Yeah. I feel like not having investors is like my biggest flex for fashion. It's so like when I walk down New Bond Street, I'm like, I'm the only store here that's like

female founded with no money from anyone. Like I'm on the same street as Ames. In New York, I'm next door to Totem. And I've done this all by myself with my own cash. Like I feel like that's something I'll be so proud of. And even if we do take investment one day or anything like that, I'll always be so proud of how far I took it without any help. And I did that with my community. I would not have been able to do this if it wasn't for the pre-order model. So for like the first three years of abuse, I was selling all my stock before I had to pay for it. And that was, people always asked me about the pre-order model. And I'm like, the product was that good. The first 100 units would sell out and people would pay and wait for five weeks. And it's like, it's a lot to ask people five weeks. Like I can't, this isn't fast fashion.

I can't get it back on site within a week. Like five weeks was even like a push. The manufacturer that I work with had just started her business at the time. So we was both just like working day and night to get it done because we wanted to build our businesses together. And like five weeks was the best we could do. But up until like last year like 60% of our site was on pre-order. And I couldn't have built that business.

It's like my pre-order, my community invested in me. And I think that's just the most niche story that I'm so proud of because I made them want that so much. And I made them trust me that much to want to wait for that product because we all have, especially now, like we all have such a thin patience. We scroll TikTok, we watch it for three seconds. We keep scrolling. Patience is so thin nowadays. But I created something that people were willing to pay for and wait five weeks for. And I think that's so powerful.

Now that you're sitting at $30 million of revenue, what is the goal? The goal is to take it to 100 with no investment. And then, because I feel like if you watch me in podcasts a few years ago, I'd be like, nope, never doing investors, blah, blah, blah. But I do feel like that would be such a new learning experience for me and definitely something that I want to do. I also feel like odd news and the team would deserve that because I recognize that there's only so far that I can take.

it on my own, it would get to a point where it'd be like quite risky to still be running a business solely on your own of that capacity. And but I really want to take it to 100 million with no investors. And I'm, I'm in no rush. I'm in no rush. Like that can be 2030. That could be 2035. Like that is just my goal.

So yeah, that's the goal. I love when you talk about that because I think so many people build a business to sell nowadays. Like you've seen the exits, right? Yeah. And it happens so quickly. Like Haley Buey Byrne Road three years. I know.

How do you think about that when you see something like that in the news where you're like, what do you feel when you hear that headline? I always feel like I always ask myself like, what if? What are people saying? What could that be for Odd Muse? What would Odd Muses' journey be like if I took an opportunity that come my way maybe two years ago? But I'm also like there's no rush. I'm building a brand with longevity.

Like everyone will tell you in business that you need to strike while the iron's hot. And this is an amazing opportunity when you're going like that. You should sell. But I just, I'm building a brand with longevity and we've got a long way to go. So I'm in no rush to take investment. And I feel like I'm only just really starting to enjoy myself and find myself in the business. So I'm just enjoying it at the moment. Like I'm not someone that went into business to make money.

And I feel like that's why I've got such a good relationship with my business. community. Obviously that's been amazing and I've wanted to like push the brand. But even one thing I'm being really transparent at the moment is we're kind of like lingering at this 30 million. Like I think we'll finish again the same this year with like no growth. And I'm like really transparent about that because I know that I need to restrategize this and this is a new challenge for me and I'm learning a lot. I also know that I could go to an investment board and be like, right, we're at 30 million. We want to take it to 100 million. And they could they could do that for me within like a year or two. I know that. But I want to challenge myself to do that myself. And I'm

not in a rush to see those numbers. And I think, yeah, some people might think I'm crazy for saying that. But I want to be transparent about it. I see, I see a lot of articles that go out when a business doesn't grow, keep growing like that. But I mean, I never set out to have a business with 30 million. So if I make 30 million for the next five years, I'm good. I'm happy. Like, that's for me, that's so, so cool. And I think the way I'm going to grow this business is because I'm not putting pressure on myself anymore. Like, I'm going to unlock that 100 million because I'm not that girl that's stressing anymore. And so, yeah, we're kind of stuck at the 30, but we're re-stratatizing. We're changing everything that we're doing. We're doing all new product. We're

sourcing so many new fabrics. We're just moving into like even more of a luxury era. And I'm just enjoying learning. You said that you didn't start the business. to make money. Do you like making money now? I do, but it's funny. Like, even since I, it's only since I've monetised my personal brand that I feel financial freedom, I've bootstrapped this business. So any money I've had, I've not been attached to. And I've just had, like, so many priorities with my money. Like, I wanted to buy my, my mom and dad a car before I even moved out. I wanted to pay their mortgage off before I even moved out and stuff like that. So the money has been amazing, but it's never really felt like mine until I monetise my personal brand. And anyone with the fashion brand will

know that, or anyone with a business will know, so many things crop up. Like, in them early stages, you could have like 30,000 pound in your bank account and then the next day and a big invoice hits and it's nothing. So I never got attached to that money. And I remember when we got a finance director in, he was like stunned at like how well I managed the cash flow. But it's because I never once got excited, made big purchases. I never really unlocked financial freedom until I monetised my personal brand. And I think that's really important because you can see those numbers come in. You can get super excited and you can make some silly purchases as you should.

But I just, I never did that. And I've had such a separate relationship with the money that is odd news. And I think any bootstrappers will know you just need to like save everything for a rainy day. Have you made more money from your personal brand than you have as the CEO of the company then? I guess so, yeah. I guess so because I've just like reinvested it all and like obviously there's more money sitting in Odd Mus's account than mine. So I don't know how you'd work it. But in terms of like how much Odd Muse has paid me into my account versus my personal brand, technically, yeah.

Well, I think that's why I wanted to ask it because, I think a lot of founders, especially women, are afraid to say how their business is doing with revenue, because people in their life feel like they've made $30 million. Yeah. Did you ever feel scared that, like, the people in your life, whether it was your family, your friends, whoever, would be like, now Amy's made it. And like, she can take us out for dinner or she can take us to the club. No. No.

Definitely not. I've had, I'm really lucky with the circle around me. Like growing, I've had like my two best friends for like 12 years. Like I'm not, I don't have like loads of friends and I like it that way. And I've just got such a solid family. And I think everything, even to this point, is like still such a nice surprise. If I do anything, there's no expectations. And I feel like I'm really lucky because I know some people wouldn't have the same experience.

But it just makes me want to give more. I'm obsessed with you. I feel like this is why you were asking me how it's going in the UK. And it has been so interesting that a lot of people, when, even the money conversation comes up and you know that's kind of like the whole point of the show is for the Bella, we call the Bella that's listening to this, to really feel like she doesn't have to follow the grain, she doesn't have to listen to the gatekeeper. She can find financial freedom and what I call fuck you money to be able to leave any room that she's no longer respected in.

But when it actually comes down to talking with the numbers, whether you're in the US or the UK, it's like, it's a very scary thing. It is and it really is. And it goes back to like when I come on these podcasts, I know as a listener what I would want to hear from me. But when I'm in real life, I would never talk like this at all. I would never sell myself. I would never, if someone comes over to me and says, what amuse is amazing? I'll be like, like, it really just, it's a British thing. We just want to curl up into a ball and we don't want to seem like we're boasting. I think that's the main thing. Like, we don't want to come across that we're showing off. But I think I'm kind of in this era where I'm like so proud of how I've used my success. And like,

even just like my life dream was to look after my parents the way I have. So the second I paid their mortgage off was like my I made it moment. Like how can I ever have a down day again? Like I've paid my mom and dad's mortgage off. I've unlocked the freedom that they've deserved their whole life after giving me everything. So I think I'm just really proud of how I've used my success. And I love to talk about it. How do you think about setting goals for money now if you've already achieve something for your parents like that. Now when I think about like when I speak about this hundred million, all I really think about is my team because with that 100, it's not about making 100 million pounds.

It's about building a brand with longevity. It's about giving the team all these opportunities. It's about bringing more people in that everyone can learn from. I think that's what excites me about. I always think about money and what it can do for like everyone around me. And so I think that's what I think about when I think about money. I'm like, what would this unlock? And I think that that's with the $100 million.

I'm like, this would unlock so much for the team and the brand. What are the investments that you've made both, let's do your personal brand and for Odd Muse, that were a lot of money but paid off in the end to grow both of those businesses? I think, I mean, for Odd News, there's been many, many times where I've just risked it all. And like that comes down to the stores. It's like even with my New York store, that was an insane amount of money. And I was in far too deep when I started realizing the deposits. And like, yeah, definitely the stores.

I remember when me opening Bond Street, this guy was like on his bike. And he stopped me like, what shop is opening here? Like, I live here. And I'm like, oh, it's my brand old music. And he was like, oh, who's like your investor? And I was like, no, I'm opening it. And he went to me, you're brave. That's what he said to me.

He was like, you're really brave. And I was like, yeah. I am. I am brave and this is going to work. And you should come back on Saturday and see the queue outside the door. So, yeah. And even when I opened the New York store, this is the craziest story. I had to pay my deposit and I had one of the guys phone me and say, can you send me $100,000 just to prove that you can pay the deposit next week.

So, like, as a woman, I had to give a deposit to my deposit. Yeah. Yeah. Did you pay that? Yeah, but I got it back. That is something that I feel like. like deserves even a different conversation where it's like about being a women in business. What do you think is our benefit of being women in business and where do you feel like situations

like that hurt us? I mean, it's never really hurt me. Like I love being underestimated. I don't. I get a lot of questions about this and I feel like people expect like more of an emotional response and like it's a disadvantage. But I think I think it's like, okay, I'm brave. I'm more than brave to be doing this.

And, yeah, I even get, like, there's people that really thought that New Bond Street store wasn't going to last through Christmas. And it's just like the New York store in January, we signed the permanent lease after a pop-up store. Like, just the fuel the odd muse gives me and how amazing it is and how much it has defied all my expectations, just kind of like fuel me whenever I'm in a room of people that underestimate me. When you distill that down to, like, what is it, is it viral product? Is it founder-led content? Is it like being in front of cultural trends that are happening? Like, what is it?

It's honestly the community that I've built and the die-hard odd muse girls that just support everything we do. And they've just given me so much confidence in this. And just the longevity of the brand, like being able to afford rent on Mercer Street in Soho and New Bond Street in London, just being able to pay that invoice every.

month is insane to me. So I think just the longevity of the brand, like every, every month that goes by, every year that goes by, every store that we open, it just builds more and more in me. And I feel like that's why you see such a change in me in this fifth year, because it's like, I've been running this business for five years. It's so hard to run a business for five years. Like it's one thing to scale a business. It's a whole other thing to maintain that. Maintaining is so hard. And that's what we're doing. And I'm sorry. so proud of us for doing that. Let's talk about the difference between building a brand in different markets because I feel like you actually done it in the US and in the UK and now you're doing it in

Dubai. Yeah. Why? The brand has always done really well out there through no market in, no like real push from us. And I think it's really important when you're in a market like that to recognize the business you have and learn more about it. So at the moment, I'm spending a lot of time learning about the market and the culture there. And I think that's really important because I don't want to get to a day where Odd Muse is huge in the Middle East and I haven't done anything to respect the Middle East and customer. So I'm learning so much about the Emeraldi woman.

Like I meet, I meet women that tell me that they buy our bridesmaid dresses for at home date nights with their husband. Like, how cool is that? They, obviously, they are modest when they go out. But when they're at home with their husband, they wear whatever they want. and Odd Muses is like such a part of that for them. So they'll buy like the bridesmaid dresses in every color and they get super dressed up.

And that is just learning about these women. They are so amazing. And I want to do more for them. Like that's great that you're wearing Odd Muses for your at home date nights. But you need to be able to wear Obmews when you're out of the house. What do you think the best market is to build a business in in the aspirational luxury fashion category you're in? I think the old-fashioned term, you crack America, you crack the world, is still very relevant. There's a lot of people in America, they are always looking for like the newest, coolest thing, the coolest London brand.

Like I love all the New York girls come in and think we're like the coolest thing ever just because we're from London. And I love that. So I still truly believe you crack America, you crack the world. And I knew that from the very beginning. Like one thing, one thing I really remembered when I started this business is, okay, I'm in the UK, we are on a tiny island. And as much as I want to convince young women to stop shopping fast fashion, they are a lot more powerful than me. So I'm going to tell them my mission and I'm going to slowly get them on board. But from day one, I'm putting all my ads to the US.

From day one, I'm speaking to the US. and we was really only sending orders out to the US for like the first two years. Like we was not a UK brand big in the UK. Like we had a lot of followers in the UK, but we weren't quite getting them to convert. It took a lot of time to build trust. It wasn't until 2023 when, or 2022, when I released our Pell dress and got into like the dress market that I really kind of convinced the UK girls to get on board with this. I had to prove myself.

But the US loved us from day one. I mean, I ordered the blazer from day one. Exactly. And a lot of people know that they assume that we kind of went into the US when we opened the New York store. But the US has always been like a large majority of the business. I think something that I found shocking about you personally then was that you ended up building it from the UK moving to the US when last year.

And now you've already left. Why? I think the main thing really was I wasn't actually ready to leave my team. It wasn't necessarily like a US thing, but I think what made it really stressful is I'd move to the US to really set this market on fire. Like they'd been ordering from us for a while from the UK warehouse. We needed to open a warehouse. We needed to do a big market in strategy. And then within a day of being there, Trump bought in a 145% tariff.

So all of a sudden someone ordering a $200 blazer would have to pay like $500 to get it. And that doesn't make sense. No one's doing that. So I kind of watched the business overnight half, and that's quite stressful because I'd just signed the lease in New York. We couldn't get any stock. It was like this time where I didn't know what to do. I kept stopping the shipment because my shipment was going to be like an extra like $100,000 just to get it into the port. I didn't know what to do.

So there was like two months when we first opened in the New York's all where there was nothing you could buy in there. And yeah, that was Trump. And I remember going to bed every single Sunday so nervous because every single. Monday he would announce something new with the China tariffs. And it was really hard because I built this brand with integrity and with this one woman in China, this family-run company. So the obvious thing people are saying to me is move from China, get a factory somewhere else.

And it's like, but these people are literally like my family. Like if I don't put an order in next month, like their business, they're like they only make for odd muse. Like this is insane. I can't leave them. So I was just stuck. And I think I could have been anywhere in the world, but I was in New York. And I feel like it just kind of ruined my experience in the US.

But I do keep saying to myself, I've got another New York chapter in me. Because I didn't get to do that how I wanted to do it. Like, I'm a fashion girl at a core. Like, I deserved my dream year in New York and I didn't get it. So, yeah. I get asked a lot about maintaining friendships when you're building a business, right? especially when you are transitional and you're like able to pick up and move. How do you think about friendships and being transitional and putting in the time to be able to have those relationships when you are focused on building your business right now?

Okay. This is such a fun thing for busy women to do. Me and my friends do this thing called a Wednesday waffle. So every single Wednesday we send each other a minute long video note and we only talk about ourselves in that minute. We don't ask. We just say, this is what I've been doing this. week, do-da-da-da, and we spend a whole minute telling us each other what's going on. And that is how I stay so connected to my best friends.

And I mean, that sounds really silly, but it's 2026 and that's how we like, I want to know what my friends are doing. And I love to say, all my friends and family I like take along with me. Like, if there's ever an event or there's ever something that I can share with my friends and family, like we're doing it. Like everyone gets to enjoy odd muse and the way it's changed my life. So, yeah, but a Wednesday waffle is a good one. Do you know what a waffle is? What, I eat like a pancake? No.

So Wednesday waffle is like when you waffle, you just like talk too much. That's so me, except I've had to train myself with the podcast to stop talking. If you're like talking too much, you're waffling. So that's, that unlocks what Wednesday waffle means. You'll probably really confuse them in here. But, yeah. If you're waffling, you're just talking too much. And you send it in a group chat?

Yeah. Just a Wednesday waffle. Do any of your industry friends or best friends sell a ton of odd muse? Yeah. Yeah. Isabel sells a lot of odd muse. It's very like her style, like super super capsule. And I mean, yeah, whenever I meet someone in the industry, the first thing I do is like,

kit them out with a new wardrobe, as you should. As you should. But I want to do that. And I think that's the reason it actually works really well because I have sat there and actually thought about the pieces that, not the pieces that I want to sell. Like there's a few things in there that are just not in stock and I went through the ends of the earth to try and get them for you. Like you can't even link it and sell it at the moment because I can't get them. But it is really just super intentional, like what I want them to wear.

So, yeah, it's never to like sell. It's because I want to share odd muse with the world and I know it's going to do great things for the wardrobe. Do you sell the most odd muse? Yeah, I do. And who's right after you? Who's right after me? You know what? the influencer side of things or the creator side of things is super new.

I've only just hired a head of influencer. It's all just been like organic random moments until now. But I'm like every week when we do trade, I'm the biggest like on the shop might. I'm the number one and I like it that way. Yeah. Because no one's going to sell your brand like you. And I think that should always be the way. But I mean, I mean there's so many US creators like, you know, like acquired style.

Whenever she posts it goes insane. Like there's so many like huge girls like that. But in terms of actually building that into a strategy, that's really new for Ombuds, which I love. Because when we're talking about that $100 million, how much am I going to unlock there if I've done 30 without an influencer strategy? All we've done is have like a shop my account and like make sure that earning commission when they sell ODMews. There's been no strategy there. So I'm really excited. I'm learning about that a lot more because up until now we've just like sent product out and just hope that you'd like it.

We need to talk about Bentley right now because Bentley has collabed with you. Joe and the Juice and Gestad Guy. And I'm like, who is running this at Bentley, this luxury car brand? That's one. I love the Bentley relationship because one thing I say about Oddmuse is for our younger consumer, it invites you into a world that really didn't really care before. And I had a very open conversation with Bentley and I said, I don't think I'm going to sell any bentley's for you, but I'm going to make it look really chic.

I don't know if my customer is buying Bentley's yet, but they're going to. And that's how Obniews makes them feel. Like, they're going to be in a Bentley one day. And, like, even the first Bentley collab we did was the Bentley booth. So everyone come to the New York store and had, like, a photo booth in the Bentley. And, like, all these girls are like, I've never sat in a Bentley before. And I'm like, neither. Like, everyone.

So I think I love how Bentley lets us invite our customers into this luxury world. I mean, who doesn't love a Bentley? I just asked all of you guys this one question. What is the one thing holding you and your team back from using AI properly? The answers were fascinating because everyone was basically circling the same problem, the same one that I had. They don't know where to start. People said things like, we don't know the right prompts. We don't know how to set up an AI agent.

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A lot of people that I would say are gatekeepers and like things being kept a certain way to be like, stop doing what you're doing. because I don't like that people get access to this. Have you ever been met with the same sort of? Absolutely. And I think as you grow, it's just, especially when you're posting online, it's just something that happens to everyone. And that's what I tell myself, like, this is just normal. This is just the reality, unfortunately.

Like, I really think that the way people are allowed to have these platforms and speak so crazy about people will be something that we look back on in like 10, 20 years' time. and we're like, how did we let that happen? Like, you know, when we look back on all the tabloids and how they used to scrutinize women, I think in 10, 20 years' time, we're going to have conversations.

Like, how the hell in this world of 2026 and AI, do we still let someone with a fake account hurl abuse on something that they know nothing about? Like, I had someone the other day, when I posted my, I had a Forbes article go out about how, like, I bootstrapped to 30 million and someone commented, like, fake account, obviously, and said, you should check company's house.

She only finished on three million profit. That's amazing, by the way. I'm happy with my three million profit. What's wrong with three million profit? I always call this person Martin from Sussex. I don't know why. So I'm like, Martin from Sussex, where's your three million? Like, how can you criticize a woman for only...

Who says the words just three million? That is shocking to me. And even if I, sometimes I have to go back because I'm like, no, this is just like stupid now. Like if you're really factually incorrect, I do every like once in a blue moon, I go back. And even if I turned over 30 million and made no profit, I still found 200,000 people in that year to buy my product. Whether I made no money or not, I did something right. I got 200,000 people to buy my product in one year. So I'm like, people just don't get it.

But they're given this confidence through these like empty platforms that have no real consequence. So I am, it's taking me a minute, but I've just learned that it is just a reality. And we're all doing something odd. How do you, because you said earlier in the conversation that you kind of feel the highs and the lows, which I deeply feel. Like I can be on cloud nine. And then one thing happens and I'm like, it's all going away. And it's all terrible.

And I find it hard. I think that level of passion is what fuels you to the high moment. So I've always like really like dogged myself down for being like a super sensitive person. But I'm like, no, this level of passion has this whole other side where it's like it has driven the business. So like I can be, I can feel everything, but I can also like take it to the next level. And you just can't have one without the other. I really feel like that you can't be so passionate about your business without being so sensitive and so susceptible to what happens. So that's taking me a long time because I've always thought it was a problem in me.

But I'm telling myself that like how sensitive I am and how much I actually care is my superpower in this business. Because there's been so many times where it would have been easier to quit. Like 2025 would have been easier to quit. It would have been way easier to just say to someone, I don't understand this whole thing that's happening. I don't understand what Trump could do and politics and all these things. I've just had my head in the sand building this business for the last five years. I can't deal with this. it would have been so easier to quit.

So I really pride myself on the fact that every single time, no matter how low I've got, I've just got back up again, I've got straight back up for work again the next day at 6 a.m. How do you stay on top of that type of, not to sound nerdy, but like geopolitical change now? Now that you've been in that space where you're like, I had no idea that this could affect my business. Like, how do you choose your information diet

or the things that you're doing to stay in touch with, like, the pop culture of the woman you're talking to you, but the lens of a CEO that's thinking about building a global brand. I think still to this day, like I don't really get too deep into what is going on in the world like I should. Like I still should, I feel like I should have learned more about what Trump can do and what the effects of this. But also, like, I recognize that all that stuff last year ruined my creativity. So my managing director, my operations director, they know everything and they're going to alert me if there's anything to expect. And there has to be with founders when you are running a

business of this size now, if you've got a good team, they know to kind of keep your head in the clouds a little bit. Because I'll have to show up for this brand every single day. Like if Trump's going to do something volatile tomorrow, they're not going to tell me before I come on this podcast. If it's going to really affect the business, we're going to have a chat about it at the end of the day or they're going to pick and choose their times because we have seen such a positive impact when when I'm feeling good, odd muses doing good. Like there's this weird other founders will feel the same. There's like this weird synergy between where you are in your life and how your business is doing.

So yeah, I think it's important to have a good team and have that covered in your business. But you have to allow yourself to be, especially if you're creatively fueling your business, you have to forgive yourself and have your head in the clouds a little bit. because otherwise there's not going to be good product or good marketing going out. Especially when you're the creative force behind it. Exactly. What do you think the role of a supportive partner is in that pursuit of keeping your heads a little in the clouds and just like having a solid family life? So important.

Like that to me is like my parents didn't have any money to give me. But like love and support and stability is like the best currency. And I never ever like take that for granted. Like, I know I wouldn't have the business I have today if I didn't have just solid friends, solid family. And even my partner, I've been my partner for like 10 years. He was like on the floor with me at 3 a.m. making this like shit little box that I made for my end of year project at university. Like it was a shoe wear brand and we like made the package it and like at like 3 a.m. The next morning I was presenting it.

So he's been there from the very beginning. And I think all girls in their 20s, like we waste so much time on like people. We made so much time on crap friends and crap boys. And I just, I was able to solely focus on my business because I just made really right decisions with good people. And I think my parents taught me what to look for in people and what to enjoy. And I think my parents have always really taught me

to just really be curious about others. And I think being interested in others and genuinely like not really bothered about talking about myself too much and really just like, what do you do? Tell me everything and wanting to learn from people has just really made building this business quite seamless for me at times. I just started a bit of controversy by saying that my age gap relationship actually sets me up for success because I can be very selfish right now and my partner is not focused on who's going to be the entrepreneur. Like he's done his thing. And so for me, it's like his attention,

his time is so focused on like literally like, how can I think about my business and like what can we do. And I think I'm so curious because you guys are a similar age. We're a similar age. Yeah. How do you think about being driven, masculine in work, successful, ambitious in terms of having someone in a similar age relationship? I think it's important to say like it hasn't been easy. Like there's been times where it's been like even when we moved to New York, like I had to say to him like the only way we can do this is if you come and work for odd news for a year. And the first thing was like, I'm not working for my girlfriend. I don't want to do that. What I'm going to tell my friends? I'm not doing that.

And I said to him, okay, but in 20 years time, are we going to say, oh, you worked for a music for a year? Or are we going to say, oh my God, we was young and we was out every night in Manhattan and we just lived our best life. Like, what are we going to do? And I always, I had to remind him so many times over the years, like, don't listen to the naysayers. And like, to our core, we know that we're like two normal kids from like a small town in Essex. Everything is so cool that we do. And that we never lose sight of that. Like we're so, we're so happy to be on this journey. And I think, again, it comes from like really wanting to share that success with him. We're now hitting a point where I'm like happy with where I am at. And I am really focusing on

like how we could like take him to the next level and he's, we're like renovating properties together and we're building up him a property portfolio. And I just think you can't do it without real love. Like, I want that for him. I'm not in competition with him and I'll share everything with him. He would do the exact same for me. If Odmuse was his, if Odmuse was his, we would live a very different life. Like, he probably wouldn't, like, have me working or anything like that. I know that I would obviously work.

But I think it just takes real love. And my sister always says that Josh is just, like, my person at the end of the day where I can just forget everything. Like in the last five years I've had such a crazy time building this business But as soon as I walk through the door Like everything is silly again And we're just together and there's nothing else going on And even that time in New York

Like it was so stressful Like half of my business is failing I've got an empty store in New York But he's like let's get on a city bike Where are we going tonight? Like just forget about it let's do it That support's been really valuable to me But it hasn't been easy

Like you get a lot of people that think it's super strange. At the moment, I'm in a relationship where I earn more money than the man, and that is really uncomfortable for people to get their head around. But we're on this there for a very long time. I believe in him as much as he's believed in me over the years, and he's going to be super successful. And it's turning. So 31% of women in the UK now out earn their partner.

In the US, it's 37%. Okay. And 26% in Canada. Interesting. in. I think that people are uncomfortable when things are new. Yeah. But if you actually understand women's potential, even if you look at like women public market CEOs, the way that they lead, the way that their business successes. It is not crazy that women are turning into these uber successful business leaders because we lead through what I believe even the next

generation wants, like vulnerability and emotion and the ability to relate to people. Yeah. You seem to not care about what people think about you. Is that a skill or is that something that you were born with? No, that's a skill that I've learned 100%. I, that's a skill, new 2026 skill. And not something I was born with. I've always cared way too much about what people think. But I love that. I love that I'm giving off that energy because I'm really trying. So thank you for saying that. You give off like the best energy. Oh, thank you. Yeah. I, for the minute I met you, I mean, I actually didn't buy the brand five years ago or whatever for you. I had no idea who you were. I love that, though. Yeah. And then I think it was like I had started hearing about you when I signed with Stephen. I had heard about you more. And then I, over the last few months, had been like following and following and like become obsessed with you. And then I got to meet you at Cann and we just bonded so hard. And we had a really interesting conversation, too, about weddings. and like the pressure of that, where are you out with that now?

Oh, I still haven't started planning it. I think, I just think for the first time in six years since starting this business, I know what it's like to wake up and not feel stressed. And I feel like I don't want to, I'm scared to invite the stress of planning a wedding in. So yeah, I'm unsure. But I've made a decision that at the end of this year, I'm going to do a big engagement party because I love a party. and I'm going to decide whether that makes me want to have a wedding or whether that scratches the itch and I'll just go down the registry office at the town hall.

So that's my decision. But I mean, I've been with Josh like 10 years, so we're in no rush. I kind of almost, I was talking about this last night. I'm like, no, I think I want to get married when like a designer's going to give me a custom dress and it's vogue weddings vibes. So I can wait. I want to keep elevating. And I want him to be super happy with where he is.

Like at the moment he's building himself and I feel like in the next year or two, he, I really believe he's going to be super, super successful. And I know for him that he's going to be really, he's really happy now, but I know I want him to be super happy in his career. So we're just kind of in no rush. So right now, what is on your big vision board? Just that 100 million figure. Like I really, and like I said earlier, it's so much more than 100 million in sales on Shopify. It is how much it unlocks, how many lessons I'm going to have to learn, how many new departments I'm going to build, how many senior hires I'm going to bring in and learn from that my team are going to learn from. This core office, like, is something like this is like so inspiring to me.

And even I've just started a podcast, like even seeing this set, I'm like, I'm just so excited for how much, how elevated. you can become through just having a bigger budget. So, do you know what I mean? I love you. So that's what I think about when I think about that 100 million figure. And that's why, yeah, that's why that's the main thing that I think about. But there's so much to that. I love it.

Okay. Amy, we're going to do some rapid fire. Okay. You ready? Amy's mail. Yeah. What is the last thing you put on your credit card? Oh, okay.

I bought the Chloe Jelly Sandals. You did. They're so cute. They kind of look like they're from the Disney. Disney shop, but I love them, the tortoise show-ons. And yeah, I wish I had a better answer for that, but I just got myself the Chloe Jellies. Love. What is the last most expensive thing?

Or I just went crazy in Paris with Isabelle for like the first time ever. We got a YSEL bag each and some denim jeans and I thought that was pretty cool. Iconic. Had loads of champagne in the store. Started telling the sales of bars of how much St. Laurent means to us. And we bought our first designer bag ourselves from St. Laurent. He probably felt get these crazy girls out of the store. But that was probably the most expensive transaction recently.

Love. Okay, you can only wear one for the rest of your life. Earrings, sunglasses, purses or rings. Probably sunglasses. I feel like you can just unlock a new personality with a good pair of shades. Can I mix a match or is it just one sunglass? What's your sunglasses brand? Oh, so many.

I'm loyal to none. I love so. I go like, I can have a pair of H&M sunnies. I can have a pair of Chanel's. Like, I love mixing. I love having a million sunglasses. Like, I'm packed for this trip. I have like a perspex case of just sunglasses.

I'm not loyal to one. We love that. Okay, you have to start a brand in your 20s. Are you moving to New York or L.A.? New York. What's the first thing you do every morning? Oh, I sit there for like 20 minutes and just silence. Like I need that 20 minutes completely on my own.

No phone. No phone, nothing. I just sit with a coffee. and like sometimes even close my eyes on the sofa. I just need that 20 minutes of silence in the morning. Love that. You can only visit one place for the rest of your life. Where is it?

Oh, that's a good one. Probably New York, you know. I had Trump ruined it for me last year, but I am just a different woman in New York. I dress better. I've worked harder. Like, I'd get it all done. Probably New York.

You can only work with one influencer for the rest of your life. Myself. Love you. Okay, who is your favorite comfort creator in the UK and in the US? I love this question. UK is Lorna. Previously, Lorna Lux, her Instagram name is now Lorna. Always been, she's been a huge part of the Obamese journey.

But she has always been such an inspiring comfort influence. I love her so much. And what about the US? I love the twins. I love, I love, I love, I love, I love, I love, I love, um, Danielle and Bridgette. I just love seeing what they do every day and how much they achieve in one day is insane. It's insane. They're just running on just craziness, like ice coffees.

They're just brilliant. You can do a collab with a high luxury fashion brand. Who is it? My main thing right now, this is probably a bit specific, but I really want to get in Harrods. And I really want to do more like Audmuse Lux range. Like we're releasing a 100% suede jacket that's going to retail for like 600 pounds. I really want to keep going with that. so I get inherits.

That's my main thing. I can't think of like an actual brand because I feel honestly Bentley's unlocked that for me. Like the Bentley thing is so cool to me. But I mean second to that, it's got to be St Laurent. Like the structure, everything is just super high fashion. And I love that. Okay, we do these on HSR.

HSS love notes. You know what they are? No. Okay. It's like an affirmation to retrain your brain. Okay. You can only tell yourself one HHSR love note for the rest of your life. What is it? I've got one thing, but I don't know if it's quite

superficial to say, but it's something that I used to always tell myself. I used to always tell myself, money is easy. I always, like, I always used to think about how money can so easily be spent, so why can't it easily be earned? And I always used to tell myself, I used to say to myself, I am in receiving mode, money is easy. I used to say that to submit myself every morning about odd news sales. And I think that's kind of just unlocked this really positive energy that I have with money and receiving it, saving it for this, like saving that rainy day fund cash flow. So I would always say money is easy, but I feel like I need to do something that's a bit more like girly.

No, I actually love that. I think girls are so afraid of talking about money. Yeah. Actually giving people tools of like how to even start talking about it is really helpful. Yeah. So a lot of people ostrich. Yeah. Like they just put their head in the sand.

They're like, I don't want to look at it. I'm going to go short-term gratification. Yeah. Not right now. And ultimately that only sets you back. Exactly. So money is easy. Just tell yourself that. Love it. Okay. You have to title this season of your life, Amy. What is it called? It's like a rebirth.

But what's the sheker word for rebirth? Amy 2.0 or something. Amy 2.0 is 100% the era. The chapter. Amy Small, where can people find you? So my brand is obviously Opemones London on all channels and it is at Amy Smell X on all social channels. And my substack. I love my substack. I have to shout out my substack, which is Amy Smell X again. And how can people help you? How can A.J. Zara help you? Just continuing to spread this hot, smart, rich message. Like, I loved when you stood up in Cannes and really spoke about your mission because it is something that we are, I just feel like more women need to hear it. We need to be more comfortable with our success. I love that T-shirt that you wear. future nepo baby parent like I love that because why do we slander nepo babies like their parents

have done cool shit so I think just teaching women to be unapologetic is just so important and it's so inspiring and I've just I've seen how much it can unlock for me when I just like step into that hot smart rich era so that's like what you were saying it's the odd muse effect but for me it's hot smart rich energy yes like whenever I sign emails I'm like sending you hot smart rich energy Yeah. And I think people for so long were like, this is so weird. And now you get it. You're like, okay.

It's embarrassing to it's not, right? It's embarrassing until it's not. Yeah. Amy, we love you. Thank you so much for coming on. I can't wait to wear all my stuff. Yay. You got to send you pictures.

I want to see you in the clothes. Yeah, I'll be linking Shopmai. Oh, yeah. You'll be like number two. I'd love that if it was me and you. I'd love that. Oh, let's do it. Love you.

Thank you so much.