Hot Smart Rich with Maggie Sellers Reum - Sima Sistani, Former WeightWatchers CEO, on Embracing GLP-1s, Leading Through Controversy, and Facing Uncertainty with Conviction

Episode Date: May 28, 2025

What happens when your salary becomes a headline, Oprah steps back, and your bet on the future of health divides the internet (and the markets)? In this episode of Hot Smart Rich, Maggie sits down with Sima Sistani, former CEO of WeightWatchers as she reflects on the boldest pivot in WW’s history—integrating GLP-1 medications like Ozempic—and what it was like to be at the center of a cultural storm. From media backlash to public salary scrutiny, she shares what the press missed, what she’d do differently, and how she found peace in stepping away. This is a masterclass in how modern CEOs manage perception and pressure. Sima and Maggie talk about ambition, identity, criticism, and the discomfort of no longer being the one everyone’s watching. This episode isn’t just about reinventing a brand—it’s about reinventing yourself. For founders and operators, it’s a blueprint for leading with conviction—even when the room isn’t ready. ⸻ Key Takeaways GLP-1s changed the game—if you were paying attention. Sima didn’t wait for consensus. She led a bet-the-company pivot based on science. She acted fast, with one eye on cultural shifts and one on long-term impact. Strategy requires stamina. Pivoting WW came with skepticism and scrutiny. Sima stayed the course, proving that real reinvention requires endurance—not just vision. The most powerful rebrands come from within. Sima joined WW to shift diet culture from the inside. Real change comes from systems, not slogans. Public perception doesn’t always match private reality. From Oprah’s exit to WW’s bankruptcy headlines, Sima shares what the media missed—and what she stands by. In public leadership, clarity is not spin. It’s survival. Visibility is vulnerability—especially for women. Sima reflects on being a public CEO, mother, and Iranian-American woman in a system built for polish. She proves you don’t have to sand yourself down to be taken seriously. Apology is not weakness—it’s real leadership. When called out by body positivity advocate Katie Sturino, Sima didn’t hide. She apologized, then turned it into a platform for change. Money and meaning aren’t always aligned. Sima shares how it felt to see her comp become a headline—and how she stayed centered through the noise. Leaving can be leadership, too. Stepping down was a full-circle decision. Sometimes your greatest impact is knowing when to walk away. What do you do when the noise dies down? Sima speaks honestly about no longer being in the spotlight—and how letting go helped her reconnect with purpose. ⸻ ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ If you like what you hear, rate, review, and subscribe to Hot Smart Rich, the podcast supporting women who own their worth — in business, wealth, and life. ⁠Subscribe on YouTube⁠ ⸻ 💌 Own your worth — and build the life you want. Subscribe to the Hot Smart Rich newsletter, the no-BS guide to startup life, consumer brands, and becoming your hottest, smartest, richest self, written by Maggie Sellers. Join 250,000+ women building wealth, confidence, and community on their own terms. ⁠Subscribe here⁠ ⸻ Follow Maggie here: Instagram: ⁠@maggiesellers ⁠⁠ TikTok: ⁠@maggiesellers_ ⁠⁠⁠ LinkedIn: Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In case you missed it, you're allowed to be hot, smart, and rich. So let's get into it. Seema Sistani. Are you ready to get hot, smart rich? Let's do it. I'm so happy you're here. Thank you for making the trip. This is the first interview you've done in jeans with no shoes on.

How does it feel? I feel comfortable. I think that's like kind of the whole goal with this because... And I didn't have PR prep. I didn't have glam. This is a whole new world for me. It's raw. It's raw, which is the best.

I'm so grateful that you decided to do this. I think I never get nervous anymore for interviews. I just get excited. But with you, I was a little nervous because you are the first formally, like publicly traded CEO that has come on the show, which is a world that is so different from mine. I want people to know how he connected first and foremost because it's so funny.

I remember when you followed me, I was like freaking out to my boyfriend, like losing it because I have actually like looked at Weight Watchers as a company that is so aspirational. and inspirational in terms of like the community that they've built and I'm a community builder. So I actually like a little fun story is I actually did a partnership with Weight Watchers when I had a company back in Canada when I worked for a company back in Canada and I would go to meetings in church basements.

And I was like, wow, this community is like crazy. It kind of reminds me of AA like this just insane power that it brings people together. So knowing you led that company through such a crazy time, which we'll get into, like I fan-girls. And my, and tons of celebrities had followed me in it. Like, to be honest, like, I always say this. I fan girl over CEOs, not celebrities. Very rare to find a female CEO to do what you've done. So when it happened, I turned to Courtney and he's like, I know her.

And at first, like, the wind got taken out of my sales because I was like, did you tell her to follow me and like, whatever? He's like, no, I have no idea how she found you. So when we started connecting, I was just. And I had no idea that you were with Courtney. And so how do you guys know each other? We know each other from New York days. It's crazy.

It's like 20 years ago. 20 years ago rolling around clubs in New York. But no, but also I worked at Goldman Sachs. He worked at Goldman Sachs. At the time he was in business school, though. And so we stayed connected while he had his various initiatives that he was doing. We were both in business. And so I've always, and when I worked at Goldman, I worked in Chicago.

has a connection obviously to Chicago and so yeah we just we like friends and it's nice when you meet people that you can stay connected with even when you go different ways totally and you've been so many different ways I think the interesting thing though is that you heard about the podcast through Diana Cohen right that's right so you this is the first thing I got from our conversation and I said this to you like I have not been lucky enough to have a ton of female people that are a bit older than me or have been through more things than me that look and are like, I want to help or I want to be in service or I see something and I want to like take her hand and lift her up. And so I felt really honored after like our two hour conversation that was

supposed to be like 30 minutes, thinking like, wow, I meet a lot of girls that are my peers that are girls, girls, and we are going up in the circle together. But I actually have not been fortunate enough to have a lot of females who are 10, 20, 15 years down the line from me that are taking my hand and being like, let me help you and being like, I'm willing to do your podcast or I'm willing to make this introduction. Has that been ingrained in you because you had that or is that just like who Seema is at your core? It's both. You said you have your girls, girls and your crew and I think that that's always been something that I've had too. But I actively try to cultivate it like multi-generational, like reach up for myself and also connect with people who are just

starting out. I always found some of my deepest connections in big companies to be with people who were like skip levels below me, to be honest. Because, and I hate that word below me. By the way, I hate it when people say like, I'm underneath her or report to her. It's like they were on my team. They just didn't, you know, report directly into me. And, but I also think that it has something to do with growing up first generation. I'm Persian. I grew up in Alabama. And so when you are someone who has felt other in their life, you tend to look for community.

You tend to look for connection. And I mean, that's just something that's always been at my heart. And many of the businesses that I've run have had community at their core, too. So it's both, both intentionally trying to seek that out, be in people's lives, and also it's just a little bit of who I am because of how I grew up. Yeah. Growing up, speaking of that, being first generation in Alabama, which shamelessly, like I haven't even been to Alabama.

I usually get, oh, I've been to Alabama on my way to New Orleans or on my way to Florida. Does your family still live there? So they recently moved and they have a house for our houses down. for me now. That's amazing. It's my dream to create this commune. My brother is in Memphis, Tennessee, but I have like a lot picked out for him to come to it too. That's amazing. We kind of had that with this new house, like Hallie and Carter, like in this night trifecta. It's amazing. Growing up with first generation immigrant parents and being in Alabama, like what was money and your perception of money when you were a little girl before you get into like going to

college and being at Goldman and like starting so many amazing companies and startups and then leading one of the biggest companies in the U.S. So I never felt like we didn't have, but for sure there were times where we didn't. My parents were living in married student housing when they had me and they worked their way up in this world. It is like the true American dream story. My mother earned her. PhD on the same day that I graduated from Duke University. And she had learned English watching Sesame

Street with me. And sometimes I get emotional thinking about it. And so they always wanted me to have whatever I could. I remember, like they sent me to a private high school when they thought I was mixed up with the wrong crowd in middle school. And like, it took everything in their savings to send me to that school. They gave, they, you know, when my dad was still driving a used car, he bought me a new car. But I also remember growing up and drawing a triangle on my jeans because we couldn't get guest jeans. And so I like kind of wanted to, you know, try to fit in.

And so I guess that's to say I had a complicated relationship with it. I was aware that we didn't have as much as others, but I also felt so much general. from my family and from our community that I never felt like I didn't have enough. Do you think that's what drove you? So backing up a little bit, you, where did you go to college, Duke? I went to Duke University. And then right after you went to Goldman. Yes. Do you feel like that sense of drive of like I want to go to one of the best university or colleges in the States? I want to go to Goldman, which is like such a recognized name. Do you feel like that was because of your upbringing or was there other forces in your world that made you just feel like

those are the best choices for you? I definitely have always felt a sense that my parents gave up so much that I really need to take every opportunity I have. And, you know, when they came to the U.S., it was before the Iranian Revolution. And they got stuck here. Like, they went to study abroad effectively, and they got, they, they were stuck. And so they had to make it without any access to capital to their family. They're both the youngest of six and seven kids, and they were separated from that family. And, you know, they never put this pressure on me, I will say.

I put it on myself. I wanted their sacrifice to be, have, to be worth it for me to take every opportunity. And so, yeah, I had an innate hustle. And but I was also learning along the way. Like I went to Duke University, which is interesting because it was the most prestigious thing that I had had any awareness of. It was in the South. But like it didn't even occur to me to apply to like a Harvard or Princeton or Stanford. Like those weren't even on my radar.

And Goldman also was something that was never on my radar. I was like, oh, I'll be a doctor or a lawyer. that's what good, you know, kids do. And they got the doctor for my brother. But I remember the night before the LSAT in just waking up and being like, I don't want to do this. I had worked at a law firm the summer before. I didn't enjoy it. And so I didn't take the LSAT.

And I was so nervous about what I was going to tell my parents. And I had seen like these flyers around campus about like come interview to be an investment banker. I mean, I didn't even know what that meant. Did you do business at Duke? I did sociology. I did sociology with a women's studies minor and an English minor. And I, you know, I called my dad and I was like, dad, I'm going to be an investment banker. What are you talking about? And so when I got that offer from Goldman and I showed it to him, he just was like unbelievable. And the thing about Goldman, and I'll give them a lot of credit for this, they don't hire people that from college, they're just looking for people who can scale a learning curve, who have motivation, who they feel have good analytical skills.

And that's, I think, how the opportunity unfolded for me. And I should clarify, I went and worked on the trading floor, not as an investment banker, but yeah, so I don't know if I answered your question, but that was a circular way. I think it's so interesting because a lot of people have like one life that, like, so I always say people are the best at, usually people are the best at one area of business. Like I always say I'm the best from zero to 50. Like zero to 50 million, zero to 50 employees. And it seems like you have succeeded and across all these different life cycles of business. So like Goldman, obviously you enter in as like a huge company. You're one of many. You've started and sold many startups that are like you're the co-finding. founder of, and then you've also been a part of large organizations like Epic and obviously leading Weight Watchers, which is one of the biggest companies. Do you feel like you're successful at one more than the other, or do you feel like you're just one of those people that has an innate inability to just learn and adapt to the environment that you're in? That's such a good question.

I've never actually heard it, you know, said back to me in that way. And the first thing that to mind as I was trying to find a through line in those experiences is I just love solving problems. And that's true in all of those businesses. And whether I was a, you know, cog in the system or whether I was leading the system, you're still solving problems. And that's the thing that I brings me joy that I enjoy, like that I think I'm good at is solving the problem. And so that's two parts, right, is what are we going to do? Yeah. How are we going to do it?

And how are we going to do it fast? Yeah. And I took and I learned really great things in each of those places that have helped me be better in every single one of those roles as well. My whole, like, philosophy to work, I saw recently this documentary called Giro Dreams of sushi. Oh, yeah. I've seen this. Yes. And I think that that encompasses is like you have to take the thing that you are just, you are doing, whatever it is, whether you're a barista or a CEO, and do it beautifully. Do it well. Be proud of it. Show respect to your craft, to the people around you. And then you're going to hopefully take a lot of energy from it and enjoy it. But my,

guess is you'll also be good at it. So I didn't get to answering your question about which one of those stages do I think I'm better at. I think I'm I am somebody who who can build followership and sometimes. People like listen to you and want to be following what you're doing. Well and I say that in a way that's like I think it takes building people, bringing people in. And, And that tends to happen at the early stages where you have to be able to convince people to hop in that ship with you. And so that comes from an authentic place because I don't do things that I don't believe in. And in some ways, even though Weight Watchers was this like, you know, billion dollar company, it was a startup in that moment for me because we were we were operating. a turnaround. And so I think the parts of that business where I really flourished in was when I was

like galvanizing something completely new. Yeah. It's so interesting because I don't know if I'm guilty of this or if this is something where women are, we're naturally like community builders and we want to like have buy in and we want to like create that. But what you've had to do so many times in your career and a lot of CEOs have to do this and founders is like go against with conviction, what people think or tell you that you should be doing. And I think that I don't know if this is a female versus a male thing, but I do think that it is harder for women to do that with conviction because we inherently are people builders.

We want to bring people along for the ride. Like, do you, how do you make such large decisions with conviction when you are such a community builder, when it might not be what the masses are saying that is the right thing to do? So it's interesting you brought up the like why is it harder for women. I just first of all I think everything is harder for women. And so put that in the bucket as well. But I actually think we have a superpower of a sixth sense.

And our intuition is so much stronger. And the more that as women, we can lean into that feminine knowing, that intuition, that gut instinct, the better off we will be. And that's not to say that you just like go, oh, yeah, that feels good to me. It's, I think I understand this consumer. I think I understand what this employee needs. I think I understand what this investor is really saying. And having a sixth sense around that and being able to respond to it.

And in some cases, pull, get the data to help. you make that case. And women, and I'm so excited about this like, um, influencer market that is, that is creeping up because it's, it's going to help women even more so where they're going to be able to build new businesses and new products and open up new markets with the intuition that there's something else out there. So, you know, I think, uh, it's, uh, it's, it's something that we, if we can tap into, yes, it's harder for us, but we're better at it. Yeah. It's interesting because when I was doing some research, you were really the first publicly traded CEO in the space that embraced these weight loss medications back in 2023. You made an acquisition, which it's called sequence. And you decided that you were like, okay, we are going to get involved in this and not just try to pretend like this isn't going to completely transform the entire consumer ecosystem in the same.

States. You were the first person to do that. And looking back, especially with where we are now in 2025, it was like the best decision that you could have made because inherently it is just disrupting the entire fabric of the U.S. economy, consumer businesses, healthcare. But at the time, it was very controversial. How did you come to making that decision? So, and that's when we announced the deal, we started working on it even earlier. How did you even know? And so the When I came into Weight Watchers, I knew that we were going to pursue massive disruption from a brand standpoint, but also from a digital standpoint. What I hadn't anticipated was that there were these pharmacos interventions that were totally game-changing and that they had really, there was this new science saying that obesity was a disease. And it was about three months in when I was there.

Because at the time, you have to remember, yes, OZempic existed, but people weren't talking about it in the same ways. We'll call them GLP-1s because now there's not just some of glutide, but also tri-septide. And there were others before that, they're glutide, et cetera. But it was for people living with diabetes. And so I sat in our scientific advisory board meeting. And this is another thing I love to do.

I'm very curious. I go and run into sit in all kinds of different meetings. I would like be in, you know, in all these different Slack threads. I think I gave people heart attacks all the time because there would be like some random, you know, slack about a bug in the app and then like I would chime in and they'd never experience it from CEO. But it's just my curiosity. And so I'm sitting in this meeting and I'm hearing all about these medications and I'm hearing about from from doctors and specialists who are the best in the world saying these are a game

changer we had it wrong and and and this is this is something that's going to be happening okay I go to discuss with our with our board with with others in the space and they're all like no no no no like don't worry about this they're so expensive this isn't going to be a thing for a while they're not going to get covered by insurance. Just don't worry about it. I just thought, no, this is important. Not only is this a massive innovation, but what I'm learning here is that Waywatchers

was giving people the wrong message for so many years, telling them that willpower could change their habits. and for so many people, they're living with a disease. And that is like the way we used to talk about alcoholism, the way we used to talk about heart disease even. You wouldn't go to somebody with diabetes and just say, you know, will your A1C into place? And I just thought, like, I can't like walk in these shoes another day knowing that

and not trying to do something about it. That was my intuition. And how long was that into when you, you joined Weight Watchers, like how long of a grace period did you have to even just be like consuming and learning before you had that realization? So I had that realization. Like I said, I was like probably three months in. And then I spent with the team another three months doing diligence into the space and understanding what all was out there, what was happening, learning about the science, learning about the medications, the insurance space.

You know, this was all new to me. This wasn't any, I mean, I'd come from building house party and then, you know, working on Fortnite. And it's funny, my mom, going back to the story about my mother, she's a registered dietitian, actually. She has her, the PhD that she earned was in food science. That's amazing. So it's a space I love and I'm very interested in.

So that process all took about, I would say, six months and then to get to a buy versus build analysis of like how we were going to enter the space, what we were going to do. And then producing all of the data to convince my board that this was what we needed to do because the company had a lot of leverage debt and making that kind of. of an acquisition was a bet the company sort of move. And, but how do you, like, I guess that is where I'm trying to get to because, like, so many people have asked me my career, like, you've jumped from music to being in startups, to, like, being in media and whatever. And it's like, it's never even really been a thought. It's just like, it's a new industry.

I learn. I'm very, like, you, very curious. But I've never had to make a decision where it's, like, bet the company. Like, how do you get to that place where is it, like, a mental thing? Like, what is that daily routine? where you're like, I have the conviction. I'm using the data. I'm using my team.

Like so many women, I think listening to this feel very strongly about things. And they get it in their gut, whether it's a relationship or it's work. And then they let that doubt, that little voice in their head be like, someone knows better. You don't know that's like, how do you get over that fear and just continue to put yourself into situations where you're like, whether it's accepting the job or betting the company on this being the future? Like, how do you get to that place? I have to imagine a world where I don't do that thing.

And that felt way worse. And I would say that I have the luxury of knowing that if I, you know, the job didn't work out for me, I would be okay. So that is, that is something that, you know, you earn the right, though, to do that. Makes it harder. But, you know, I will say I took risks earlier on in my career, too, leaving Goldman Sachs to work at a male. room at Creative Artist Agency or whatever it is. Like you, I do think that there are some people who just have more of like that, that willingness to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, but I also think it's a

practice. I also think it's just something that you can, you can build because fear holds us back. Fear of what if, what if. And let's just like, turn that fear upside down and say, what if I didn't? What if I don't? Mm-hmm. And. when we were talking about that acquisition, there were a lot of people against it for a lot of good

reasons, but I didn't want to lead a company that wasn't going to move in that direction. And that's what gave me the conviction to push it forward, was because this is the future. This was also a stigma that we had brought very mainstream that we needed to resurrect, that, excuse me, that we needed to resolve. and especially after having sat in that seat for a while and realizing, you know, I had, I had done Weight Watchers, by the way, the story of how I got there is kind of funny, but I had lost 60 pounds on Weight Watchers. Postpartum, I had a really hard time losing my weight. Turns out I had a thyroid issue.

So I also had a metabolic condition that was making it hard for me. And so it was a program I believed in. But once I was there, I got all of these. messages that, you know, people who really had felt a lot of trauma from the brand, or they had felt like, you know, I would read these things about how it was run by the patriarchy, who just wanted women to shrink themselves. And I was so upset because I was like, it couldn't be further from the truth. What I want is for people to have options and choices to live metabolically healthy, to do whatever is good for them. And so if that were true, then this is.

is important. This is an important move for us to make. And I thought it was going to be good for the brand. I thought also the ROI would be there. I thought being being first in this when we're a legacy brand that, you know, is, is, you know, part of this quote unquote diet culture. Then let's, let's change that. Let's let's let's be first out there with this. Let's let's talk about it. Let's not be afraid. And I'm so proud because Jenny Craig went bankrupt during the same time when we made this move. Why do you think, because like I said, when I started this, like, looking back, it seems so obvious what you made the right decision. Why do you think there was such big pushback on you when it was happening? I think it came from a good place. You know, we had people who, at the time, who had operated and led that company for a really long time, who were, who, who, you know, their feeling was, this is a playbook. that has worked, you know, let's do, let's do this motion. Let's go through this motion. And there were others, though, who could see this was a role, this was not just an opportunity, but this was like the right path forward. And this was where things were going. And the hardest part were our

members, because there were so many members who, like me, had had success on the program. And so when I would go out and talk about where we did things wrong, how we could do things better, they felt that I was saying that, you know, their success was as a, you know, not as important as a result. Or employees who would say, wait, have I been doing something wrong? And to try to hold two truths and to bring that to people and say, no, I can say, on one hand that we got it wrong. You know, building habits is not a moral failing.

And for so many people, they are living with a disease and they need an intervention, right? I can say that. And I can also hold on this hand that this was a program that did the best that it could during a time where we didn't know better. Totally. And so now that we know better, let's do better than Maya Angelou quote. and the other thing is it's important to have advocates. I don't want to say I just I did this all on my own.

Like I said, we had scientists at the company who also were very much like in this corner. I had some board members like Oprah who were very much in this corner and agreeing with the moves that I wanted to make. So there was there were there there were also in fact some some, members of my team who had started to utilize the GLP1 medications because you don't come to work at a company like Weight Watchers unless you are somebody who has struggled with their weight at one point or another. And so there were people who were in the company starting to see success and being like, oh my gosh, this is a game changer. Like I'm dealing with my food noise. I'm like, I'm in a better place now. So advocates are important. There's so many other benefits too of like what

I've heard for women with like PCOS having less intense periods or even like mood disorders. I've had friends that have had that like PPMS and they said that it like takes away all of their symptoms when they're going into their period. So I think it's just interesting to see how this will evolve. But helps with fatty liver disease, helps with sleep apnea, helps with heart disease, one in five, like you're 20% less likely to have a stroke, cardiac condition. You know, it's just, it is a truly amazing innovation and the reason we just don't talk about it as such is one it happens to be something that isn't covered by insurance and so we put it in this category of aesthetic along you know with ed medications but yet this is a life-saving medication for a lot of

people don't get me started I was actually just going to say like if I think about weight and society. Yeah. People are obsessed with it. Yeah. You, how does it feel to have, like, had the opportunity to lead something that is so pivotal and in so much of the news that we consume is like, wait, this star has lost this, this stars on Olympic, this stars like Oprah even, like just having her be like almost the face of

Weight Watchers, like, how does that feel as a woman to be the steward of such an important conversation in America? I felt a lot of responsibility. And I thought that if we wanted to change diet culture, our best way to do that was from the inside. And I really think that I, you know, I wish CEOs would take more responsibility when they realized that their company, their brand, went from, you know, doing good in the world to jumping the shark. you know and I've I've said this before like what you I believe that when Zuck started Facebook that he had all of the good intentions well I mean there's a little bit of the debatable choices but like let's say people at Facebook yeah and how powerful would it be for him to say you know what we're going to

change this social media culture from the inside we're going to do that or like food manufacturers where we have all of these additives and we know that the food system is working against us what if they would stand up and say, we're sorry, we got it wrong, we know better now, we're going to do things differently, or device makers where we have all of this problem with like our attention span and our, we're talking about the anxious generation and I think about my kids and, and their addiction to these devices. What if Tim Cook got up and was the first to say this is a problem? Let's do something about it. Schools. Let's ban phones. And here I was in that situation. And I was in that situation to be able to do that for weight, to be able to do that for diet culture, to be able to release

stigma, because there's stigma and there's shame. Shame is internalized stigma. Stigma is structural. It's a society. And who helps form that? Big institutions like the one I was leading. So I was going to be the first out there to say, this is what we got wrong. This is what we're doing about it. And, you know, people started calling it like the apology tour and I got a lot of flack for it. But I feel really, really proud. And I can like wake up and look at myself in the mirror. I have chills when you say that. I think like women already have so much responsibility on them.

And I think especially as we get into this phase of life where it's like our actual investment thesis at HsR Ventures when we invest is like women are now earning the same, if not more than like their male counterpart if they're in a heterosexual relationship. Yet they still are the person. primary caregiver, they are the primary house manager, even if they are not physically doing the work, they are managing that schedule. Even if you have the most supportive husband and partner, inherently, the roles that we have when we have a child and you decide to breastfeed, you are the one up in the middle of the night. So even if you have a supportive partner,

you still carry that burden. So we look for services and tools and technology and products that really alleviate some of that for women. What I hear you say is, like, you had so much responsibility on you. And it's interesting because when you become a publicly traded CEO, you're not only, like when you're in a startup, a privately held company, it's like, it's a different level of pressure. But not everyone knows everything about you. Not everyone feels the right to your personal life, which you made a decision when you decided to take this role that like, this was going to affect you. This is going to affect you. This is going to affect your family. It's going to affect when you wake up and you're checking your phone. Like, you're seeing your name in the headlines for

better or for worse. And it's interesting because you didn't disclose the acquisition number that you got when you sold house party to Epic Games. But when you become a publicly traded CEO, your salary, your comp package is out for the public. And especially for women with money, it is so interesting when you already have all of the responsibility of your day job. And then people are starting to scrutinize and know how much you're getting paid. Like you, in 2023, it was disclosed. you made like roughly 8.8 million in a comp package. Is it uncomfortable or was that an uncomfortable shift when you had people know kind of those ins and outs of your life that didn't really as much as it was. Yes, it's related to the job. But it's also like the way you're taking

care of your family, like the sacrifice that you're making. Like how did that feel to have people know that information about you? Well, I don't know how many people are actually reading public filings to know this, but your broader point of being so public and even like your comp comp package being public, I think that's, I think it's important, by the way, just in general, for public CEOs compensation to be public. It's good accountability. And I will say, yes, so that's what the comp package is, but it's so based on equity. So at any given moment, it actually could mean something totally different than in terms of like what you get as cash, what you've got as bonus, and then so much of that compensation is really equity.

I mean, people even talk about it being called CEO poor because you get all of this equity, but you also, you don't want to sell it because it would send a wrong signal to the market. That's what I mean. It's like everything is scrutinize that you're doing. And it was more pressure than I had bargained for. I don't think I had really thought about what it was going to be until I was sitting in it. that's the honest answer as I think about it now. And then once I was in it, the hardest thing for me,

which is something I think you're trying to do with your brand, is worrying about seeming unsurious in any situation. Because I'm like, oh, people know I'm getting paid this much or I have this much responsibility or I'm having to do this earnings call or I have to show up in this way for my team. and I'm a girlie at heart. Like, I love to have fun. I know that I know you in like the first five minutes we were talking.

And so, you know, I remember before, like, when it really felt real and I was about to take the role and, like, they had, they brought up like all my like, my social profiles and they were like, we need you to go delete all this and this. And that's hard. That's hard where you worry like, oh, I'm out with friends. And like, I'm the kind of person who would have gotten up on the table. Start dancing. I like no way I was so afraid in fact I remember I was on a vacation with a friend um Steph Simon

you know who you are and she posted this photo of me dancing or this video of me dancing at the pool and um it was just us girls too by the way it was like a a private retreat for women and I had to call her and be like stuff you've got to take that down like I have you know all this crazy like activism happening and people can't see me like, you know, dropping it like it's hot. Yeah. In Mexico, like, it's a bad vibe. Yeah. And I think that to me was the hardest is just having to put my personality away a bit and just

be this one thing. And I think, you know, some of the best CEOs out there, we're multidimensional. We have a lot of different parts to us. And so I love that you have this provocative brand and that you're saying these things. because I do think it's true. We want to be all kinds of things. And I think it's so interesting because what you said earlier of connecting the gut to the business decision is like women, and I say this all the time, and I'm sure people are so tired of me saying it, but we do control 85% of consumer spend. Like what makes us fundamentally good in business and as investors and leading companies is because we understand what people are buying, what we're consuming, what we're giving our kids, what we're taking away, where the trends are coming. And it's so interesting to me that it's like as soon as we're in the work world, it's like

take all of that away, put on your armor, pretend like you are masculine. And I don't know why it is that way because it may be if we embrace a little bit more of that femininity or like what makes us those community builders or like what we're doing in our personal life, if we bring that into the work world, like maybe there's a way in which like that number of 2% of venture capital goes to women. Like maybe that increases. Do you feel like looking back now that you're out of that role and you get to be this like girly girl version of yourself. Like do you feel like there's a part of you that would have made better decisions or be different in the role if you hadn't had to feel that sense of like I need to put away who I am at my core to be this leader here?

No, because I didn't put her away. Okay. She was still very much with me at all times. And I remember I would start meeting sometimes being like, okay, guys, like here's our eyes. I. I'm affirmation or, you know, so it was just, I had to be very aware of what was public in that way. So, but I was still showing up very much as who I am in, in all of those spaces, both at Weight Watchers and in my companies before. Like when I, at House Party, I was eight months pregnant when we raised our Series C. And I mean, I was like pushing payroll between contractions and which I, don't recommend. It was my second baby. But then I remember I was in this meeting and oh my gosh, this poor consultant who was there. And I just like had my baby on my boob and was like just doing all this stuff. And so I feel very much like I bring that that person is what is who I am and

is how I show up. And I do a better job bringing her with me. It's just a matter of how, much of her, like, was available to, to be out on display because of the public screen. Right. Was your husband, has your husband been extremely supportive of your career, especially as you grew bigger and more successful? And, like, you definitely have a name to you. Like, how did you find the right partner to take you through all the different iterations of Seema? Alex is an amazing partner. And I probably don't tell him enough. I'll make sure to clip. this and show it to him.

And he has been so supportive. So especially, let's go back to like the startup times. You know, he's been, I remember my maid of honor in our speech said that Alex is the harbor to weather, the storms of Seema's like ebbs and flows or something. She said it so beautifully. But like he had, he was such a harbor so that I could go and just run. run and try to do these like wild ideas and things. And so when we were building the startup, you know, we relied on his paycheck during that time.

And so I was able to do that. Or, you know, when we first thought about House Party, I actually, we published it in the app store under his name because he has like no social following or anything. We were trying to keep it down low. And so we published it under his name. and then it took off and he got in like growth capital and so he has all these like LPs which are you know investors and their funds and they were like wait what Alex what are you doing what is you incubating companies now because he's like he's in like healthcare investing and had nothing to do with that and he was like oh my god you got to get my name off of this

and so he's shown up for me in all of these different ways but most incredibly when I took this role I was like flying back and forth to New York and all of our offices, Weight Watchers is a global company. And I couldn't have done it. I have a 12-year-old and an 8-year-old. They were obviously younger at the time. I couldn't have done it unless he was like an all-in parent. And he actually takes so much offense to what I'm like,

don't forget this, don't forget. He's like, I got it, I got it. I got it. And so he's been like the biggest supporter and champion by just like, being there, being available, and being such a big part of my dreams. It's so interesting because I feel like when you're dealing with... I should say, though, I made it sound so rosy. Yeah.

And I, one, he didn't want me to take the job. He didn't. No. But when I did take it, he was like, all right, let's go. You've got this. But he didn't want me to take the job because when I, after I'd sold house party to Epic, I was like, this is it. And when we moved...

You were done with it. I was done. Yeah. I was like, I'm going to work at Epic and I'll stay here forever or until the company goes public or until I'm done. But like, I'm, we're going to move to North Carolina. And I thought, we're leaving Bay Area. Like, I'm out of that world.

I'm nobody anymore. And then you went back into, like, traveling on an airplane all the time. Yes. Having a, like, I'm sure you had a team around you that was just massive at all times. And there was like, again, to your point, no privacy in your personal life as well. So I did, so I do want to share that that that he, he, he, he, he, he was. was very cautionary about about that. But then once I wanted it, he could see I wanted it. He was really supportive of it. When you were in that role, did you ever have something that was such

like a public failure or apology that you had to like come to terms with and deal with head on and just be like accountable to it? So many because it is public. You know, especially like when I was there, there was a lot of activism, but I think the thing that really moved me the most, and that was, that still stays with me is when there's a woman named Katie Sterino, and she is a body advocate and just fabulous. She has a great, she's an entrepreneur, she has a company called Mega Babe. And she had done this, special on ABC with Oprah. And she had gone on Instagram and talked and did several stories about, you know,

how those CEO of Weight Watchers should have apologized. And she should have done this and she did that. And it was funny because when I was watching it, my first reaction was like, I did. I said we should have done better. I said we should have did this. And then I like rewatch it. And I was like, I did not say the words, I'm sorry.

And I. And she was, it was really hard for me to hear from her because I had her book. And she was somebody that I really respected, that I followed, and tried to incorporate a lot of what she had taught around body positivity to bring it into the work that we were doing. So her calling me out felt, and I, it felt, it felt personal. Yeah. And so once I got out of that mindset, I was like, she's right. She's so right. And I talked to the PR team about, I want to address this.

And I got a lot of like, no, no, no, don't do that. I got a lot of, you know, legal, you know, just this, that, whatever. And then I was on this flight at the time. I was going from New York to San Francisco. and I worked myself up the whole flight and it was like, I know what I want to say to her. I'm just going to do it. So I just got on my Instagram and did a story back and just was like,

Katie, like, I'm sorry. I am so, so sorry. From like the bottom of my heart, I'm sorry for anything that you, you know, felt any, you know, shame that you have carried in your life. And so we had this like very public exchange. and, you know, it turned into then a bigger conversation that we ended up really devoting a lot of time and attention to supporting it because once she did that, my DMs like blew up with people who had similar stories to hers.

So I was like, we've got to do something more with this. And I was just like chatting with Oprah, who already by then had actually stepped off of our board. but she continues to be a mentor in my life. And I was like, this happened. And it was funny because it was very fresh when I was talking to Oprah about it. And I had like tears in my eyes. And she was like, let's do something about this. And so we ended up doing this three hour live special about making the shift.

And we brought Katie on. And we had the conversation live. And we had all these other people join us. And I ended up funding a podcast for her and some other amazing women. we ended up getting Lemonada to produce it and just have this conversation about body positivity, about weight, about being good with ourselves because nothing, none of this other stuff matters if like on the inside you're not able to appreciate it. And I want to quote Katie, but she was always saying how at some point she just started giving

up because she would meet women who were like her ideal. and they weren't happy. And so if you're always striving for ideal, there's always something better, right? And so it was more about that. It was about self-esteem. It was about confidence. And anyway, so that was the time.

And it was Katie and I remained friends to this day. She's got a startup. She's working on. What's it called? It's called Click. Give it a shout out. Click. Yeah.

Yeah. So they're raising. I should introduce them to you. actually. But, but I, yeah, it was, it was public and, and then it was a time for, of amazing expansion for, for like so many people, I think, and like, kudos to her. Because she, she went on there and said some really hard things. And I was, I'm so glad she did. Everything that you've done has been so public when you've been at Weight Watchers, including when you decided to step off of the Weight Watchers grind. and I think you've been on this hamster wheel to your point,

like your husband didn't even want you to take it because you had been putting your blood, sweat, and tears into like whether it was Goldman, to like building at CAA, to building startups, to being in San Francisco, like going to Epic Games. Once you stepped off of the hamster wheel, how did that feel? Like, even just the active stepping off,

there's titles of like business insider, Weight Watcher's CEO embraced Ozempic. Now she's out of the company. having been on the hamster wheel for, let's say, 20 years stepping off with headlines like that, what did you feel? Oh, it feels terrible. Does it? It feels terrible.

Why? Because your ego gets wrapped into it. And even when you're able to separate your ego from your identity, which I worked very hard to do, Doing that job, my identity got wrapped up into it as well. And I think that is something that's very true for women. We have to give so much of ourselves when we pull from our relationships to feed into work. So to get on that plane and leave my kids and my husband and my family and my community every week, my mission, my mission became. my purpose.

So it wasn't just my ego, because then I was able to work through that. Right. All right. But was like trying to actually pull my identity back and say, okay, no, I'm not that. I still root for this brand. I still root for that team. I'm still so excited about the new leadership there. So that mission is still one that I believe in.

But the day to day, becomes like... But my identity is me is different and I had to remember that. And that took work. And until I got there, I would say it felt it, it felt not good until it felt great. It's so interesting because I went through a glimmer, not to the same extent at all. But when I met Courtney, my whole life changed. Like it was the first person that for me felt like I don't need to keep running. or keep building alone. And my whole thing has always been just to like protect myself and be independent. And I think when I met him, it was like the first time where I allowed myself to be something

other than like what I was doing in my career and to really like I say sacrifice things like for us and for our family that we're building and the relationship that we have. And it's interesting because as like my brand started building and it was like all amazing things were happening, it also was the time where it's like, wow, I'm traveling for the first time. And I'm like falling in love and we're buying a house and there's other things that are happening. And it was actually like a really interesting feeling of feeling like this season of my life is not just work for the first time. It's other things. And it was a really scary.

It still is a really scary thing to feel like I'm not giving myself 100% at work right now. And that's the first time in my life literally since I got into college that I've ever even wanted to be in that way. but even just that glimmer of like maybe a distraction or a difference of priorities or what I've actually said to myself that's made me come to terms with it is like there are seasons of your life and reading Amy Griffin's book where she was like I was out of the workforce for 10 years like I wasn't doing anything and then now to look at what she's done or to be with women like you I'm like there is it is okay Maggie or anyone that's listening that feels like they're in a season where work is not the number one priority for them and it doesn't mean that that's forever.

just means that that's maybe a season that will pass. What season of your life are you in right now? I'm going to answer that question, but I have to say something because you said something you were like, I'm not giving 100% at work, but that is like whose definition of 100%? Because if it's what you can give, it is 100%. Yeah. Wow, that's such a good way to think about it. Sometimes when we are type A people, our expectations, even of ourselves, are like so much. much more above and beyond what is actually we are actually capable of. So my guess is knowing you,

you are giving absolutely 100%. It's just, you know, the circle has shifted. Yeah. But the season of my life that I'm in right now, I'm in the season of freedom. And that was the thing that I had to come to and remember was all of this hustle and work, I had set up for myself an ambition of having a certain amount of financial security. And I achieved that. I achieved that before I took this role. And I told myself when I did get to that place that I would incorporate a life that is liberated. and that means being on my own schedule. And I can't do that if I'm the CEO of a thing. That is not my thing, a publicly traded company.

You know, I am at the behest of those shareholders, of our members, of, you know, the team. And what is this all for if I'm not getting to what my end game was, which was always freedom? And this part of my life right now is about stepping into things that bring me joy, that excite me, that are the things that I said I would always do if money was not an issue. So I just taught my first yoga class. I saw. It's amazing. I always wanted to deepen my practice.

So I did my 200-hour teacher training, actually signed up for it. literally two weeks after I left Weight Watchers. And so I've been working on it since that time. And that has been amazing. It's given me beyond just like the asanas and the practice of yoga, spiritual framework to move forward with. And it's been such a blessing. I continue to serve on boards.

I'm on the board of another publicly traded company and do private work as well. I'm a fellow of the Aspen Institute, and I really wanted to give back and have impact. And so I have developed a new curriculum for a course that I'm going to be teaching at Duke this fall called the Women's Leadership Lab. And I'm picking and choosing. I'm living what some people call a portfolio life. And this is the time for me right now. And I'm not saying that I won't ever step into the seat of CEO again.

But I don't see that happening in the next at least five years, to be honest. Because one, I don't want to be a CEO while this administration is in office. And two, I want my kids to be older because I know I'm not leaving North Carolina. And so unless I build in my backyard, I'm probably getting on a plane again. And I'm not willing to do that at this point. And I love traveling. and I'm still getting on plane. I'm in L.A. here for, you know, a week. But I do it on my terms. Yeah. You have recovering CEO in your Instagram bio. What does that mean?

I wonder if I should change that. I love it. I actually love it, but I want you to explain, like, because I've never actually seen somebody say that. Yeah. It meant to me, it was that work that we just talked about. It was that separation of my identity. as an executive, as well as living a life where it was all based on outcomes. My life right now is based on energy. And that is where that is what I am moving towards. And I talk about, we talk a lot as, I think, probably if you're listening to this podcast, I bet you're somebody who, who has heard about manifesting, who believes in manifesting. And I think that something that we need to think further about is reflection.

And to me, recovering CEO is reflection. This is a practice as much as manifestation is. It's like if manifesting is about your future and creating that alignment to your future, reflection is taking the data from your past and using it to figure out, which path am I going to be on. And so I think about it in terms of energy versus outcomes. I think about it in terms of alignment versus ambition. And I think about it in terms of shedding versus starting.

Do you think that it is possible? I love what you just said about outcomes versus energy. And it's actually funny. One of the pieces of advice that Courtney said he noticed about me was when he first met me, I was so focused on the outcome. I was like in everything, personal life, like even sexually, like even professionally. and now, like, I really feel like over the last year of, like, the work I've put in, it's really around the process, the energy, the feeling.

That's possible in the line of work that I'm doing. Do you think that is possible when the stakes get higher? Oh, absolutely, because energy is about what is depleting you and or what is, you know, lifting you, filling your cup. And so when the stakes are higher, it's even more important. It's more important, one, to, um, from a, from a business perspective, right? I'm talking about reflection as a personal endeavor.

But reflection, I mean, that's like post-mortem, right? That's the business term for it is what worked, what didn't? What are we going to repeat again? What aren't we going to do again? So I think, I think it's important, especially when the stakes are high. Yeah. Now that you're on this inertia. Like you can let, you can let the status quo move you.

and if we're being hot, smart, rich, we are not living in that world. I love you so much. I love you after our first phone call. And one of the things I wanted to say and ask you publicly, because we talked about this a little bit, I think there's so many people that listen to this. There's like the young girls that are in college that want to be the girl boss, but have this balance. And then there's like the 20-year-olds that are right in the thick of it, the 30-year-olds, the 4-year-olds, the 50-year-olds.

We had a conversation around hustle culture. And I think a lot of people listening to this will be like, okay, like, I want to embrace. energy versus outcomes. But we both had this alignment on like there are just seasons of your life where it's like you have to earn the right to be in the position that you're in right now. Right. And so I think the message I want you to share to those people that are in the thick of it or have these aspirations, like is it possible to find balance or what is your words of wisdom to like remain true to yourself while still putting it in the work? Yes. And that is, So, yes, now I'm remembering when we talked and I was like, I'm doing all this.

You're like, that's amazing. That's what I want. And I was like, okay, but hold your horses because maybe you are still in the season of like, get that shit done. Yeah. Because that's a season too. That still means you want your energy to be in the right place. Because if you're doing it all and it's depleting you, you're not doing, you're either,

you're either in the wrong like career or you're surrounded by the wrong people. because your work should bring you joy. I mean, this was great advice that my managing director at Goldman Sachs gave me. She said, you're going to spend, and I say she, I had a great unique opportunity of having an MD, one of the few at the time, female MDs. And she said, you know, you're going to spend more of your time at work than with your family, with your friends, sleeping, eating, doing anything, so you better fucking love it. And I have always taken that to heart.

So assuming you love your work. Love it. Then this is the time. Like you go after it. You go after it and you go after it with gusto. And you will know, and that's why the reflection is so important when you have come to a different season, where your goals are changing. And that's why I say the alignment versus ambition, because ambition is just,

unless I achieve this, I am nobody versus achieving this makes me feel so good. And then at some point you might reflect and say, you know what, actually, I want this. My stack rank of priorities has shifted. And so I'm going to realign. But I can tell right now that this is, you know, you're in it and it's feeling good. And so that's where you just have to calibrate. And the word balance is so dangerous. it's impossible.

Like ladies, stop. It's impossible. And I think that balance implies 50-50, and the rule should be 100. And what I mean by that is you give 100% of your presence to the thing that you're working on when you are working on it. But when you shift gears, then you are 100% in that other zone. So like when I was in, you know, New York or having to do a town hall or whatever, I'm 100% there. I am 100% there. And I joke about how multitasking is my superpower and it is.

But and I would have to train myself out of like not trying to do an Instacart list in my head while I was like doing something. But I was like, I'm 100% here. And then when I go home and I would tell people like I would have like my exercise blocks on the schedule. I would say like from here to here, you know, usually it's like from six to eight. I'm with my family. I can get back on later. So the idea that we are going to be doing it all and all at the same time I think is wrong. And so what I always strive for is 100% presence.

When I would take vacations, I would say Slack is gone. Gmail is gone. If you need anything, you call me. There will be 30 minutes or an hour in the day where I check. those things on a laptop. Yeah. But it's not on my phone. And that kind of calibration, I think, can get us through these times so that you make sure

that all of the different cups are moving along. And you'll get it wrong. And you just have to give yourself grace and just try to keep going back to it. Okay. You're like, I'm going to have you on again, but I have some more rapid fire because I feel like I could talk to you all day. You can only pick one, Seema, for the rest of your life. Coffee, cocktail, or matcha. It's cocktail. I love it. What's your cocktail order? I will get a Tito's martini with, and I get it dirty, but I always preface that I want it like PG-13,

not rated R dirty. Okay. So, because like if it's so salty, you wake up and your like your rings don't fit and everything. But I know this about me because I have tried to give up alcohol. Okay. And it's just, it's too fun. Yeah. So, you know, I try not to drink during the weekdays unless I'm traveling and I have business meetings. But like on the weekend, a cocktail just like makes me so happy. Although, you know, I came in so hot today being like, I need coffee.

Was it a good coffee? It was a great. I think it's almond milk or it's a different kind of milk. What type of milk is it? Almond milk. I knew it. It tastes good. It's almond creamer, actually.

Oh, that's why. Because I was like, almond milk usually separates, but this didn't separate. Okay, pick one for the rest of your life. Pilates are strength training. Strength training. Okay. How many days a week do you do that? I do, well, it depends on what you qualify.

Lifting heavy, I do twice a week. But then I do Tracy Anderson the other days. Okay. remotely. Or orange theory. Okay. You can only pick one for consuming calories. Would you rather drink them?

them or eat them? Eat. Yeah, same. I'm like, there's no question for me. Yeah. Is that your guilty pleasure nachos? Yes. Ever since college, I have a girlfriend, Alicia,

we used to always make late night nachos, and it's my go-to forever. I love that. Okay. Who was your favorite comfort creator? Oh, gosh, so many good ones. There's a new girl I just found. Oh, man, I really want to look it up and make sure I get her name right.

I think it's Alicia Lynn. Okay. I'm going to, I really, can I look at it? Okay, we'll look at it up. But she, she, um, she does the, like, food prep. Okay. And she, she's like, she's like this. For her kids or something?

No, she's like single girl food prep, which is also where I'm like, this is just my dream refrigerator and it's my dream. Like, just I'm not worried about like, you know, Adrian who doesn't want pasta, Ari who doesn't want beef. Like, everybody wants something different. Alex is like low sodium and I'm just like, oh, God. Can we all? So anyway, so I watch her content and I really enjoy it.

And then there's another one who I'm forgetting her name as well. I'm sure they would be the first to pop up on my TikTok if it came up. But she does, it's her eating her lunch every day. But she, like a muckbang? Yes, but it's like not really about the sound. It's more how beautifully she packages it. Like she brings like her little like yogurt with homemade granola. And then she has like a beautiful matcha that she has in these like to go containers and then her lunch and her snack.

And she's just like it's such a ritual for her you can tell. And I love that. I love when people take a normal everyday thing and make it beautiful for themselves. And this is why I will never like it. Like it makes me so upset when women my age make fun of the girlies doing the morning rituals and that whole thing. I love it. I think you have to do that every morning. Make it special.

Make it feel good. Make yourself feel like you're at a spa. Why not? I love it. It's so funny you say that because I think it's all about romanticizing your life. And when I'm actually having a really down day, like I do have ups and downs of my mental health. And I always feel better when I'm like, okay, let me just film this for TikTok and I have to make it beautiful. And I think that is something

that is such a misconception about social media because it's like we often say it's so toxic and so negative, which yes, it can be for sure. But I think to your point, the ritual, the making of beautiful things is something that I love and appreciate. So I actually love when people romanticize their life and sometimes people are like, it's so much effort to do that. But it's like, people enjoy watching it. It's just like using boundaries to actually make sure you're not consuming too much of it and comparing. But if it's just for pure enjoyment, I actually love when people are mintized their life.

There's somebody you should follow. Her name's Coffee Bay. She's so good. She does it with drinks. And she, like, uses her straw and, like, goes with the ice. It just sounds amazing. I'm obsessed with it. I love that.

What is the first app you open in the morning? Oh, gosh. It's changed. Well, it was Slack. Yeah. But now it's my ORA app. Oh, really? Every morning you just look at your sleep.

I do, but I also don't look at my phone first thing in the morning. Okay. But the first time I open it, I will, I will, if there are no text messages, because like if there are text messages, then I probably just opened that and I looked at the texts. But I have a lot of my notifications off. So that would be the only thing that would prompt me. Otherwise, I'll go to ORA and I'll just check in on how I slept and what it says my recovery is for the day. Okay.

Okay, you can only pick one for the rest of your life. Podcast, book, or movie? Book. Really? What book are you reading right now? A million. You start so many at the same time. I start so many books, and I have, actually I was thinking I should post about this,

because I put books all over my house. I have, like, poetry and affirmation books by my bedside table. I have a little reading nook, so that's where, like, all the fiction books are. in my office it'll be like you know 48 laws of power and like whatever like business type books I'm reading and in my Kindle it's not safe for work to say that's where the stuff goes that like nobody should know what I'm reading nobody needs to know but let's just say it's chili peppers okay but book interesting do you listen to podcasts oh yeah okay I listen to podcasts um on my on I do my like podcast walks. Okay. And then also the nice thing about North Carolina, you are in your car a lot.

Yeah. So that's driving. Always, always, unless my kids are in the car and then they steal my phone and they play music. Their choice of music, which I look, that's the one thing about podcasts is I do feel like I've gotten out of the habit of just having music on. So when I'm home, there's always music playing on our speakers. Yeah. I actually felt that this morning. I was listening to your episode on the Skinny Confidential. And I was like, I usually listen to podcasts when I'm cleaning. Like, like cooking dinner, walking. I never listen when I'm driving. And I was listening to you this morning for the second time. And I was like, huh, I miss listening to music in the car, but I like would never listen to music while I'm like cleaning or cooking or something like that. It's very interesting,

the habits that people adapt. Are you a nighttime or a morning girly? I'm a, I'm now a morning girly. Okay. It just happened suddenly. I used to be nighttime. And now I honestly, I'm blaming my LASIC surgery. My eyes get tired. Yeah. And I'm just like, okay, it's time for me to go to bed. And then you just read a book in Balsley. Mm-hmm.

Okay. Last one, solo founder or co-founder? Oh, buddy. You know, I want to say co-founder because it is so nice to have a partner, but I just say that with so many asterix. You have to find somebody who compliments you and you have to go to therapy together. Like, you know, there are, you can get coaches that work with you because it is, it is like it is a marriage. It's a marriage. And so it's so important to have great communication and to make sure ahead of getting married that you have talked

through all of the different outcomes that you might each want, the different ways you want to lead, the different things that bring you excitement to work on. And so if you can get those things right, co-founder is amazing. But when you get those things wrong, and I've heard so many stories around this, it's not a good situation. Seema, I am seriously so honored that you came on. I feel hotter, smarter, and richer. And I just feel like, like I said to you in our first phone call,

there's like certain people that come into your life at certain times. And you were like the exact person I needed in my life. And I hope that everyone that's listening to this feels that too. for this interview. I genuinely like can't wait to see what our personal and professional lives look like and just I know they're going to be so intertwined. And honestly, like Courtney has met a lot of people in his life and the pure joy and like brightness that got brought to his face when he heard that we were doing this. He actually wanted you to come at like 8 a.m. So he could just like see you this morning before he left. I just can't thank you enough. And I

know people are going to have a ton of more questions for you. One of the things that people have ask me to ask gas that they're really impressed with is what are you working on that people can get involved in or get behind or get excited about like what are ways that the ages our community can support can be a part of like anything that comes to mind oh that's great i so i just started a substack which um i'm excited about i'm trying to take some of these experiences and musings and um you know all the things that inspire me and hopefully inspire others and so to the extent that they want to join. It's called, well, I'm still figuring out substack. It's my name, but I call the publication default settings. Okay. Love that. Because, you know, the whole idea is, you know, we kind of

go through life with all of these playbooks and everything kind of written out for us. And especially for people who want to be entrepreneurs or live intentional lives, we have to question the default settings. and look for opportunities to put in our own widgets. Love that. But I'm on Instagram. I'm on TikTok, and I look forward to staying involved in your community. We're so lucky to have you.

Thank you so much. We'll put everything in the show notes, you guys. Please follow Sima. She is incredible. And if you have any other questions, of course you can email us, and we will definitely be having her back on. So thank you so much, Seema.

Thank you. Mua.