Instant Genius - How to maximise your motivation, according to a neuroscientist

Episode Date: March 1, 2021

As the UK enters its 13th month of lockdown restrictions and home-working, many surveys cite a slump in mental wellbeing and general productivity. But are there any scientific ways we can maximise our motivation and prevent procrastination? In this episode of the Science Focus Podcast, neuroscientist Dr Gabija Toleikyte, author of Why the F*ck Can't I Change, tells us all about it. Let us know what you think of the episode with a review or a comment wherever you listen to your podcasts. Subscribe to the Science Focus Podcast on these services: Acast, iTunes, Stitcher, RSS, Overcast Read the full transcription of this episode [this will open in a new window] Listen to more episodes of the Science Focus Podcast: Why you can’t multitask (and why that’s a good thing) Dean Burnett: The neuroscience of happiness Daniel Freeman: How virtual reality is helping patients with phobias, anxiety disorders and more Anthony David: Why is there still such stigma around mental health? Pete Etchells: Are video games good for us? Sandro Galea: What is the difference between health and medicine? Helen Russell: What does it mean to be happy? Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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available in print and in several digital formats throughout the world. Find out more at sciencefocus.com or look out for us in your app store. Hello and welcome to the Science Focus podcast. I'm Thomas Ling, staff writer at BBC Science Focus magazine. As the UK enters its 13th month of lockdown restrictions and homeworking, many surveys cite a slump in mental well-being and general productivity. But are there any scientifically-batt ways we can maximise our motivation and prevent procrastination? Neuroscientist Dr Gabby Atulakita, author of the new book, Why the F-Cant-I-Change, is here to tell us all about it. Thank you very much for coming on the podcast today. So firstly, could you?

Do you give us an overview of what motivation actually is from a neurological perspective? Hi, great to be here. Well, it's not necessarily a very straightforward question. As when we talk about the brain perspective, we usually discuss brain regions, brain networks and brain chemistry. Now, for motivation, there is multiple brain regions involved, but one in particular is called reward center of the brain, which consists of two key areas, one called VTA, ventral tegmental area, and the other called nucleus accumbens or NACC. So both areas, they register, if something is kind of pleasant to us when we do certain activities, and VTA secretes the chemical called dopamine. Dopamine is called the molecule of pleasure,

reward and anything that feels enjoyable to us, it feels that way because of dopamine. Now, people who have low levels of dopamine, no matter, which happens actually in depression, and some people are prone to have lower levels in general, no matter how pleasant things they're doing, they could be eating like the most delicious meal ever, they wouldn't feel any joy. They wouldn't feel any pleasure doing it. Now, different activities secrete different levels of dopamine. So the things, you know, which kind of are objectively enjoyable, such as our favorite food, time with our loved ones,

or hobbies we enjoy, they secrete high levels of dopamine. So for motivation, what we need to know is dopamine, ventraltic mental area and nucleus accumbens. Okay. Are some people more prone to getting these high levels of dopamine, high levels of motivation? And if someone suffers from low motivation, are there some genetic factors at play? Yes. So there is probably both the genetic and environmental factors. So some people in general might have higher levels of dopamine secreted in the brain.

But also those levels change based on what we do. So if we are constantly sort of stimulating that dopamine system, actually there is a phenomenon called dopamine oversensitization, which basically reduces. So dopamine is a neurotransmitter, which needs the other kind of molecule called the receptor on the neurons to join, to be active. So when we kind of stimulate the system too much,

there is less and less receptors left, they kind of get taken away. So the same amount of dopamine will cause less pleasure. But imagine you're eating a bar of chocolate every day. And first time, if you discover some really, really amazing chocolate, and you eat that chocolate, it feels like, wow, this is amazing. Now, if you start eating it every day, it suddenly becomes less and less pleasant when you get used to it.

So then suddenly you need actually either more of that chocolate, or different kind of chocolate to elicit the same amount of pleasure. And that's kind of tricky thing with dopamine, when we kind of do the same thing, especially if it becomes predictable, it gives less pleasure. Interestingly, well, there is some research showing that actually, in order to secrete more dopamine, we need unpredictable rewards. So how could you use this unexpected rewards to boost your motivation? So I guess if you want to self-motivate, it's hard to come up with an unexpected surprise.

You know, you know you're going to buy yourself that chocolate bar. Yeah. Well, first of all, some things naturally create a level of surprise. So when we work with other people, social situation naturally bring level of uncertainty, right? So when you have a meeting with somebody, they might praise you or they might tell you off or they might be neutral. you don't know. So those social situations and having contact with colleagues if possible, which you know, during these times of lockdown, we probably all crave desperately, but trying to find the way to have the social collaboration or even with friends if you're like working from home

and really fed up, you know, having a Zoom call with your friends and working together, kind of still staying online could increase levels of dopamine. Also creating sort of a bit finding good balance between routine and variety. If everything is really predictable, you know exactly what you're doing at what time, you will inevitably secret less dopamine. But if you create an element of variety in that, so each day you do something differently, then it would actually secrete more dopamine, that activity. Also, when you work, if you take the breaks and during the breaks, you do the activities,

which naturally secrete loads of dopamine for you, right? So you could be browsing the pictures of cats for some people. It could be doing, you know, some push-ups for other people. You could be listening to really kind of loud music and kind of dancing for other people. So having those breaks when you get that dopamine hit will actually spill over into your working time later on. So you'll be actually in a better state to do the work later on. So how often should you have a break, you know, looking at cat videos, exercising, or maybe at the same time? It varies depending on what time of the day it is and how your brain is feeling.

But probably a good rule of thumb is to start with having at least one break an hour and a half. Every 90 minutes taking 15 minute break. Now for some people, an hour and a half is too long to do focused work. So they might work 45 minutes and take 5 to 10 minutes break. So depending on your own individual preference and style, also, if we're going through challenging times emotionally, as a lot of people, unfortunately, are these days, then we need more frequent breaks. Then not more than 45 minutes of actually focus time, a break, 15 minutes, if you're feeling,

you know, if you need some downtime and get a bit of a dopamine and motivation, another 45 minutes, another break, and so on. As the day goes by, the brain actually gets more tired. And there is quite a few things that happen. We deplete neurotransmitters, which are necessary for us to focus, have willpower, and do productive work. So then it's actually we need to reduce the working times and increase the frequency of the breaks as well. So it kind of depends. And also it kind of depends on what we're doing those breaks. So some things like physical exercise or social time with, you know, even just talking to people on the phone online, help the brain to replenish quicker than if you are watching news in your breaks or if you're just kind of, you know, browsing, browsing social media. So again, it's quite circumstantial.

Okay. Just to give you a scenario then. So, What would you say to somebody who needs to write a huge report for work? And it's really, really boring, it's really boring. And they just don't want to do it. How would you sort of help them motivate themselves there? Okay, well, firstly, I would suggest not even get started until you see a point in doing it. Because it's going to be really unpleasant, you will accumulate resentment towards your work. So firstly, sit down, take a piece of paper and write,

all the benefits of you getting this report done. For you personally, based on your individual value hierarchy, you could be, okay, once I get this done, I can go and play with my kids in the snow. Once I get this done, I can cook myself a nice meal. Once I get this done, I could finally send it to my boss and he would be happy. Once I get this done, I could call my mom, you know, right?

Whatever is important to you at that given moment, look through that prism of those values, because we need to change perception first. Because if you stimulate pain centers related to that task, A, your performance will be worse, B, you would be not enjoying that. And C, it would take much, much longer for you to get it up. So once you kind of write down as many things as you could think of, I like to, you know, suggest people writing down 50 benefits.

Now, a lot of people say, Gabby, you're crazy, it's too many. So start with 20, right? but the more you write down, the better. We'll see the point in doing it. Now, second thing is breaking the task down. What exactly do you need to do? And kind of break it down. So first, maybe write introduction.

Second, read this article relevant for the other part. Third, doing this. So each part should be maximum 30 to 40 minutes long to complete. If you break it down in those steps, Then there is a technique called Pomodoro technique, which could help to complete the task, where you actually set the timer. And during that time, you can only work on that task. You can't check the emails.

You can't, you know, like do anything else. And after you complete it, let's say you work in 25 minutes chunks. So for 25 minutes, you set the timer, just work on that task on that specific aspect of the task. once you complete it, take five to 10 minutes break and do whatever you like in that break. And then do another chunk and so on. So then what actually coming back to dopamine, just completing that time focusing on the task, secretes dopamine, it creates sense of accomplishment, right? And he is quite important that we focus on the time we spend working on the task by really focusing on and working on the task as opposed to how much we got done.

because different times, different days, we kind of can produce different amounts of work. So we shouldn't really stress about it. We should, you know, it's kind of, it really helps to just focus on something what's in our control, which is focusing on the task. In your book, you talk about aligning task overall to your intrinsic sort of values. Is it okay if you can explain a bit about that? and how it works neurologically? Yeah, so that can be a big game changer for people.

So in order to do that, you first need to understand what your true values are. So look at what things keep on sort of distracting you, what things naturally draw you to spend time doing, what things you always find money, time, energy for. So for me, I know my daughter, Amelia, my relationship with my husband Matthew and my work. So my seminars, my book, my coaching, and my lecturing at university,

these are top three values for me. And I always find time, energy, money, and everything for those three things. Now, some other things like understanding politics probably are quite low. Now, some people say, you should, you should understand that. But intrinsically for me, it's not very. important. However, if somebody asked me, Gabia, could you write a report, let's say, on how Brexit is going to affect mental well-being of people? So that's quite a political topic. But given that my work, and actually my daughter and my husband and my work, they kind of score very similar amounts.

So they're equally almost like shared first three places. So my work comes really, really high. And what in my work is important to me is actually truly helping people to understand themselves. So in that politically sort of flavored article, it's there, you know, I could see how that would help me with my work to help people to understand themselves. And then I might actually, given that it links to my one of top three values, I might write down how it would benefit, you know, my daughter, my husband, my clients, my book sales, my, my, I kind of write down all the things which are high on my list, how this article would benefit me.

And once I stack up those benefits linked to my true values, then I would be much more motivated to do the research needed on Brexit in order, right, to actually write a good article on that. So it's kind of changing the perspective, but from actually much kind of a deeper sense, it requires personally understanding what things truly. meaningful to you, then what this task, you know, involves and how to bridge those two things together. What happens in the brain when you do link a task you don't want to do and a value that

you do agree with? Well, it just changes, you know, whether you stimulate reward centers or pain centers in the brain. When we resent something, we naturally stimulate pain centers, which when we do that, not only it kind of changes our emotional state, but also it changes the blood flow to different regions of the brain. So when we stimulate pain centers, it naturally triggers so-called sympathetic nervous system in our brain and body. And sympathetic nervous system being designed evolutionary for us to escape the predators, really. So your kind of really primitive centers of the brain, grouped on the mammal and reptilian brain areas, according to the trune brain model. They don't know the difference if you're actually running away from a bear or if you're writing,

you know, the report on Brexit. So, so what we need to do, we need to kind of sort of educate those primitive centers. Now, when we stimulate the, when we actually stimulate that those pain centers and sympathetic nervous system is released, blood flow, is changed, then blood and energy is prioritized for your muscles, for your kind of limbs, so you could either run away or fight the predator. And the blood vessels in the smartest centers of the brain called prefrontal cortex are contracted. So actually, the smartest cognitive centers don't get as much glucose and oxygen. So they can't function optimally. Now, in contrast, when we stimulate the reward system of the brain,

it naturally triggers rest and digest or parasympathetic nervous system, which is crucial for us to learn to be creative, to be empathic, to understand other people's way of being, and for brain plasticity to be taking place. So in that state, we actually can, our performance is greatly enhanced, and we can get much more done,

but also in those performance, prefrontal cortex is a crucial center also for personality. So when we do those tasks, which are linked to our highest values, we feel like it's part of who we are. So we kind of link to our identity almost, which then, you know, needless to say, we tend to go an extra mile when that happens. I could do that, yeah. Okay. Of course, if you have low motivation, that can lead to procrastination. From a neurological point of view, what actually is procrastination? Well, procrastination is quite a lot of different things altogether. It doesn't necessarily require low motivation to procrastinate.

So different things could trigger procrastination. One could be, of course, if you don't see a point in the task, you're more likely to procrastinate. But also, for some people, the task is so important that they feel overwhelmed. They feel okay, if I, like I talk to many people after I published my book. People say, oh, wow, you're so brave to publish the book. And when we got to talk to them, it seems to them writing and publishing book is so important that they're never going to do it because it overwhelms them. The idea of actually getting the work done and getting yourself in such a vulnerable position

of sharing you information is almost like opening your heart to the world, right? seems just too exposing. So it triggers certain emotional state that they want to avoid. And a lot of times in procrastination is emotional component to it. But it could be different triggers for different people. For some people, it could be being overwhelmed by the task. The task seems just so big. And it would take so long to complete it that they put the delay even starting it because it's just just overwhelmingly large task. For other people, they fear rejection, they fear criticism, they fear some other kind of judgment on their work so they can procrastinate with the task. For other people, it might not be the task that they are interested in or enjoying.

So there's multiple triggers. So whenever we procrastinate, what I suggest asking, what happened right before you started procrastinating? In other words, what's the trigger? Is it certain emotion? And if so, what's the emotion? Is it... And then based on that, when you identify the trigger, solution would be different depending on what's the trigger.

Okay. So if you are procrastinating, I take it, you're not really activating these reward centers in the brain. Well, you might be actually. So it's kind of, it's a bit tricky with those complex behaviors. We can't quite put the, you know, specific brain regions and brain chemistry to it. It just would be oversimplification. But sometimes people trigger loads of really, actually, reward in procrastination.

So imagine instead of doing, let's say, accounting, you might be watching some sort of funny movies on YouTube. your trigger reward centers might be even more, right? So a lot of times we choose to procrastinate with tasks that are quite efficient at triggering reward. So those things like TikTok, YouTube videos, games on the phone, they're so clever in the way they're done that they trigger huge amounts of dopamine. And therefore, we do them.

You know, like if you look at TikTok, there's no point of doing it. But because it triggers dopamine, it feels pleasant. It feels addictive. And we keep on doing it. But doing accounting won't give the same amount of immediate reward, immediate amount of dopamine. Therefore, it requires well power and long-term vision to do it. So there kind of, there is different things can secrete dopamine. So it doesn't necessarily mean that when we procrastinate,

we don't get dopamine, we just might get dopamine from different things, than the task, it's we procrastinating over. Okay, so if you are in like a YouTube hole and you've been watching funny cat videos for like 15 minutes, how do you get the motivation to go back to do your work? I would suggest to sort of a little bit train yourself. So using Pomodora technique, I meant, and I discuss more in my book.

Work for, let's say, 25 minutes, set the timer, and only if you focused on the task for 25 minutes, give yourself five to 10 minutes break to watch YouTube videos. Set the timer. Once it's over, you have to stop. Then another 25 minutes of work, only if you focused on that task for that period of time, you can allow yourself to watch those videos.

So it's a little bit using it as a reward rather than as a kind of the overall activity. What would you say to somebody who's feeling like they have a lot of low motivation at the moment and they're listening to this podcast instead of working? That's a good way to procrastinate. That's what I would say. It's called meta-procrastination and procrastinating, listening about procrastination. Okay, well, that's fine. You listen to this podcast. Now take a piece of paper. I'm like a strict issue. Take a piece of paper and write down what is one thing that would be really meaningful for me to get done today. It has to be a small thing. It could be like, oh, I need to send this email to somebody or I'll do my work for five minutes. It's still better than no, right? And write on what that one thing that comes to your mind.

Once the podcast is over, close the laptop, set your timer for 25 minutes and work on that task. It could be a different time, by the way, if your goal was to, you know, do push-ups for five minutes, then set for five minutes. It doesn't matter. But set the timer. Once the task is up, do something pleasant again. And look into the Pomodore technique. It's for a lot of people, it really helps to take the emotional component of the performance, and that generally helps to unstuck.

But asking yourself, what is the most important task for me to get done today? Can help us to be in that proactive mode where we feel like, you know, we aren't victims of what the tasks were given. We actually, you chose the job, you are at. You can live any time. I mean, of course, we all need money. So you're still getting something out of it. So kind of getting into that proactive mindset would help you, A, to get more done, but B, to enjoy your work a bit more. And just kind of tweaking your working day in a way that actually it is more like who you are would help you as well to enjoy it more and get more done.

So bringing yourself into your work, into your relationships, into your homeschooling your kids, into your time you spend with your loved ones, into the meals you cook will help you to, A, have healthier activation of your reward system. And ultimately, would not only increase your motivation, but would increase your inspiration, which is the kind of ultimately longer term, much, much kind of more well suited to you, who you are type of motivation. Thank you for listening to this episode of the Science Focus podcast. The February issue of BBC Science Focus magazine is out now. In this issue, we explore the baffling science of dark boats and stars.

Dr Michael Mosley shares a top tip to boost your sleep, and as always, our panel of experts answer your questions. There's much more inside and on sciencefocus.com. Thank you for listening to the Science Focus podcast from the BBC Science Focus magazine team. We're the UK's best-selling sites and technology monthly, available in print and in several digital formats throughout the world. Find out more at sciencefocus.com or look out for us in your app store. This podcast is sponsored by Name, Audio and Focal.

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