Just As Well, The Women's Health Podcast - Candice Brathwaite: Activating 'Miss Trunchbull' Mode to Get Runs Done is a Form of Self Love

Episode Date: October 11, 2022

This is our final episode in a very special series - powered by Nike - where we’re exploring all the many wonderful things that running can do for you, via chats with inspiring women. Today’s seriously energising guest - bestselling author, content creator and erstwhile marathon runner Candice Brathwaite - recently picked up running again, albeit shorter distances on her home treadmill. She runs to access what she calls 'tension'. By that she means a type of controllable struggle that encourages personal growth in all areas of life, which - in her words - she just can't get from any other form of fitness. Candice also discusses learnings from writing her latest book, YA fiction debut, Cuts Both Ways and why, when it comes to helping her daughter and stepdaughter enjoy a healthy relationship with fitness, she's leading by example - rather than telling them what to do. Oh, and if you're looking for the pep talk you need to stop standing in your own way and actually action those healthy habits, Candice shares *exactly* what she tells herself to get the thing done. Candice is joined in the coaching clinic by Nike Run Coach and youth mentor Dora Atim (who we met in episode four) to get advice on how she can reach her number one running goal right now: to run a 5k in 25 minutes. Join host Roisín Dervish-O'Kane on Instagram: @roisin.dervishokane Join Candice Brathwaite on Instagram: @candicebrathwaite Join Dora Atim on Instagram: @doradontexplore Join Women's Health on Instagram @womenshealthuk Like what you’re hearing? We'd love it if you could rate and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts. Also, remember to subscribe if you haven't already, to be the first to know when we'll be coming back. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Whether that's unpacking your suitcase the evening you get home, rather than the following weekend, actually taking time to do that weekend beauty ritual you know will help make you feel better in the week ahead. Or simply parking your feelings of lethargy to grab your headphones and your trainers and run your way towards a clear ahead in Dorphin Buzz or the simple pleasure of just having ticked another thing off your list. It's hard. We're busy. We're tired. We might have the beginnings of a seasonal cold, as you might be able to hear is certainly true for me right now. But if you've been struggling to overrule your urge to suck off the things you know will make you happier and healthier, I'd urge you to listening closely to today's conversation.

Hello and welcome back to Going for Goal, the Women's Health podcast. I'm your host, Roshin Derbyshire Kane. This is our final episode in a very special series, Powered by Nike, where we're exploring all of the powerful things that running can do for you. Nike run coaches share all the tips. and tactics you need to create your own running practice or elevate an existing one. Whether you're around the park plodder or inspired by the epic energy and buzz around the recent London Marathon, are keen to tackle a longer distance. But running is about so much more than

putting one foot in front of the other. And if you've not been alerted to just how transformative it can be, it's time to strap in and prepare to be inspired as I speak to some truly impressive women about life, goals and the role that running plays. in their happiness. My final guest in this series is the writer, mother and possibly the most reliably joyful person on my Instagram feed, Candice Brathwaite. She's a best-selling author of three books, including the hot off the press cuts both ways, her fiction debut for young adults.

What you might not know about her is that pre-kids, Candice would run marathons, half-marathons, even an ultra-marathon. After an invite to a Tuesday session with London Run Club, Rundem crew, which she initially scoffed at, properly ignited her passion for running. Then, the juggle necessitated by trying to raise a young family while building her career as a blogger and author, press pause on her race career. And she pivoted from running to gym workouts and home yoga.

But, recently, Candice has been renegotiating a way to fit running back into her life. Why? Because, put simply, putting one foot in front of the other helps this busy brain multi-hyphenate working mum, put the blinkers on, find perspective, and in her own words, encourages personal growth in a more potent fashion than any other form of fitness. And this is coming from a self-described lazy person who, if given the choice, would spend the day in PJs, unshowered and watching box sets of sex in the city. So, for anyone struggling to do those things that they really should right now, the ones we were talking about earlier,

This episode is for you. Candice also talks about the importance of modelling a healthy relationship with exercise to her daughter and stepdaughter. Plus, why it's important to go for your own authentic goals, rather than being pulled every which way trying to chase status symbols. This was a fun and seriously thought-provoking chat. Let's go. Candice Brathaway, hello, and welcome to the Women's Health podcast. How are you?

Hi, thank you for having me. I'm very well. I'm actually very well, thank you. Yeah? Yeah. Big week, this week, fiction debut. I know, I know. And that has just, it's kind of crept up on me

because it's like book number three in three years, which is a bit insane. I think I'm long overdue for a break, to be fair. Well, I love the sound of that. And was it a bit of a shift? Because your previous books have been more reflective and memoir and first person. So what was it like going into writing fiction?

and fiction for a different audience. So much more fun. The issue with my kind of nonfiction is it is very memoir-based. So it pulls up a lot of past traumas and stuff. Really, I'm not too keen to remember. Whereas fiction, I was pushed into this whole new world and a world that I had to ask my daughter about because she's eight, my stepdaughter who's 14 going on 15.

This was a YA love story or it is a YA love story. So I needed, I was like, what are the cool words? Because I'm not cool, apparently. And you know, you can trick yourself into believing that if you know certain tech and read certain things that you're cool, no, no, no, that like there are new words, there's new slang, there's a new way of thinking and understanding the world.

And so to do it through their eyes, so brilliant. And also it kind of gave me a heads up about how they think about and see the world. In a way, I think I never would have been privy to if I didn't write this kind of material. Interesting. What's some of your dispatches from youth culture of things that you found out? Are there any words that you're going to be dropping now to try and look forward to your 14 year old? The words are so terrible.

I can't even remember some. I think what I found most surprising is how mature my eight-year-old is. And just how, especially if not entirely because of the internet, you're not dealing with a child in the same way you were 20 years ago. They are just privy to so much more, even if they don't say. and watching my eight-year-old engaged with her 14-year-old sister over this book where the starting age is like 12. I'm like, my gosh, I feel like, not that I do with my children, but I feel like if anyone's parenting from a place of secrecy right now or, you know, thinking there are certain things they shouldn't say around their children, your mind will be blown at their knowledge, not just of the world, but also their own world views. Yeah, I'm a bit, I'm just stunned, to be fair.

Yeah, very, very, very different childhood experience. Yes, yes. So I want to talk to you a little bit about the juggle. Mm-hmm. Because you're a very busy woman. Am I? Three books in three years. Yeah.

Tons of other projects. How do you find a way to fit it all in? And how have you found a way to kind of negotiate your healthy habits around that? How have I found a way to fit it all in? I'm never shy to say I have a husband who was willing to become a stay-at-home dad for a little bit. And that is, I get really annoyed because I'm about to say, and that's such a privilege. And it's like, is it, from what landscape is it a privilege? I think there's just a lot of deconstructing of masculinity, the patriarchy,

the way we think things should be set up for those in relationships with us. other people. And him stepping back from work has allowed me to, has allowed our entire household to flourish in ways that were seemingly impossible when we were both at work. And so him stepping back from work in that capacity is absolutely central to what people would see as this juggle. Healthy habits for me though, I have to be a bit trunch bullish about it. And I was speaking to my husband about this this morning because I'm about to go from three PT sessions a week down to two. And I said what's so interesting is outside of body image, weight and all those societal functions, I'm now understanding I actually have to work out just to keep my joints in order,

just to keep, I hate to be gross, but to use the toilet every day. Just like your body changes so much over time. I'm like, my word, if I don't work out for a week, I've got an ache in a new place or mentally I feel really bogged down, I truly didn't realize, and I know this is going to sound so silly, I didn't realize how imperative exercise was just to living day-to-day life. Because I come from the era of 80s workout videos and everyone on a diet plan and just have some carrot and lettuce.

So I've always, for better or worse, aligned exercise with body image. And I don't know. I think social media has a lot to do with it. I think over the last two, three years specifically, I've been able to untangle the two and really start to key into exercise as me time as a way to, I call it the flush. So to sweat out, bad feelings and to literally get sweat out of my body. and I couldn't imagine now not factoring exercise into my life. So to go back to the question, I'm very trunch bullish about it.

I'm like, if I don't get on the treadmill, get on this bike, go to this PT session at least twice a week, something's going to come crashing down. Maybe it's the attitude towards my kids. Maybe I'm going to shout at someone on my management team. Maybe my husband's going to get in the neck. But doing all of that is never worth it if the only thing I had to do was jog for 30 minutes, you know?

Yeah. So rather than almost doing it to strive for a goal, it's to facilitate. It's maintenance. Yeah. You put better than me. Yeah, it's the maintenance of these dreams and goals also. And I say this on social media a lot,

and I understand why people don't believe me. I am innately a very lazy person. This was my next question saying, I don't believe you. So, by that I mean, If there was a choice with no, like, ramifications to do nothing, I would always pick it. If I could not work, not work out, even not shower, I would always choose that. Me too.

Just to be this sloth-like slob is like, oh, I just think about it all the time. That's annoying. What? You're a muffler. You don't hear it? Oh, I don't even notice it. I usually drown it out with the radio. How's this?

Oh, yeah, way better. Save on insurance by switching to Bel Air Direct and use the money to fix your car. Bell Air Direct, insurance, simplified. Conditions apply. The exercise ties into the idea that discipline has to happen somewhere, especially in the kind of career I have.

If I sat around waiting to feel inspired to write, there'd be no books, let alone three. If I sat around feeling inspired to live my best, it just wouldn't happen. And so now exercise to me is that reminder that, you know, it's not necessarily motivation I'm waiting for. Consistency is just the name of the game. It's like you show up, you do this thing, you might like it some days, you might not like it other days. It has to happen regardless.

Yeah. And how do you get yourself from that place? So maybe if there's the inner instinct to be the sloth, what is the thing that gets you from, feeling that and wanting that to being like, well, this just has to happen. The thing is, and I hate, because I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to feel as if I'm promoting this, but I'm very good. And this is the only place it, it's a positive thing. I'm very good at really cracking the whip self-talk. So I know if I don't do that 30-minute jog I scheduled in the morning, by evening in my head, I'm going to be like, oh, you're so terrible.

You really should have just done that. look now the day's wasted away. I'm very good at being like that, that old grandma or that strict head mistress in my head to myself. And so that for me is the switch also. I just take it step by step. So even this morning, I'm in the space in my cycle where,

and by cycle, I mean, you know, girly things. Where I was like, I just don't want to do anything. And I was like, no, okay, focus on the teeth brushing, focus on the lacing of the shoe,

focus on turning the treadmill on or the bike in this instance. Just focus on those little things. Lo and behold, by the end of the workout on my bike, I had cycled my fastest ever in that time frame. And that's what I've noticed on the days when I truly feel like I don't have this. As long as I commit to arriving at the space, something's going to happen and I always remember something is better than nothing. That is very wise.

And also cycling your fastest time whilst in the Luteal phase. My God, Candice. I know. And this is the thing. You know, and sometimes I'm pumped and ready to go. And then I just don't hit the number I would like to see or whatever. But I always just think, again, it's just another tick in that consistency box, you know? Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, my God. And consistency is, consistency really is the goal. Yeah. Now, I had to get you on this series when I, I saw some pictures or some videos of you absolutely giving it some on the treadmill recently. So could you tell me a bit about your running journey?

Because you've had a long history with running, kind of where you've been and why you've decided recently and why now has been the time to really try and renegotiate a role for it amidst the juggle. So my running career started, I would say, 2010. 2011, I was working as a receptionist in an agency in South London and a guy came in to meet one of the people working at the agency and he was like, I run this running club, you should come down and I audibly scoffed. I was like, mate, you've got better chance of me stripping naked right now and doing like some river dance. I ain't never coming to your running club.

Like I was very like, stop asking me stupid questions. And like for six weeks he'd show up and pick this guy up And he'd be like come to my club I was like do you know what just to A shut you up And to B show you that I can't run Like I'm just not here's the language again Here's the thing I'm not built for running I'm going to show up just to show you

And I showed up I ran to the lamp post I promptly cried I walked back to where we were meeting And then I kept going every week after that Because in my opinion On a true data level Running for me is the only exercise That is going to give me back

Exactly what I put in No more, no less If you haven't done this training right There is no like scooting around this You're not just going to get some extra strength that day like you could in a weightlifting session or something, you know, whatever you put in, you're going to get out. And so this specific crew would meet up with crews in New York, in Japan, in Berlin.

And there was something very community-based about the activity. And when I look back, that's what did it for me. It certainly wasn't looking and feeling embarrassed and not being able to breathe. It was like, I know on Tuesday evenings, I'm going to see my running family, literally. I'm going to see my, and we're going to talk about all. all the things that aren't working and they're going to inspire me and vice versa. And somewhere in the midst of just falling in love with this running family, I ticked off London Marathon, Amsterdam Half,

I even just about made it round an ultra course once upon a blooming. Like it really became so central to my life. And then I had kids. You know, I follow lots of people on social media who have had kids and they're running with the buggy and la la la. really wasn't my thing. Also, I had a really janky, secondhand buggy that wouldn't fold properly,

so I'm not going to jog with that. I just think it's going to end in catastrophe. And it just became quite hard to do that juggle with a young baby in tow and trying to get back into work. So I was just like, I'll go to the gym, I'll do yoga, I'll work out at home, but running is really going to take a back seat.

Fast forward to now, I have a little again with my husband stepping back from work and helping me work and us running a business together I have more flexibility in my day to day life and I wanted to be tested I know that sounds silly I've now arrived at a place in my life where everything just feels nice

everything ticks over and I'm so grateful for that the universe if you're listening that is not me say in Forest Banner in the works. I'm not interested. But I did see looking at my day-to-day life, I wanted there to be a space where I could create tension because what life has taught me is tension is where growth happens. Unfortunately, if I could grow emotionally and mentally being that lazy sloth, again, we would choose that. But growth and being able to reach for goals and remain consistent, it requires tension. And I was like, I love cycling and some days are hard and some days are easy.

I wouldn't call it tension. I love weight training, some days are hard, some days. It's not tension. Running is tension because whilst I now understand language like I'm not built for running is wrong, I'm also not like this super gifted long distance, super long-limbed, you know, marathon runner. That's also not who I am. And so I have to fight really hard to be good, or even decent, but good in my mind. I have to fight really hard to be good. And I thought, I would like some tension that I could control back in my life. And I think running is how I do it.

That's fascinating. And because it's in a safe space as well, isn't it really? And as you say, you are the, you're the string puller. Yes. Yes. And what does like what does that, I love the way you put it, tension, how does that feel in your body and mind? What is it about, what is it about it that makes it so addictive? My addiction to tension I can control is, and I learnt this early on the first time in my running career, is that within that tension, other things are going to feel easier. So of course, if you're running, I don't know, eight miles per hour, 10 incline on the treadmill, you're struggling, you're panning, you're out of breath.

The minute you drop that incline and drop that speed, that feels easy. And that jog wouldn't have felt easy three days ago when you were just jogging. You had to introduce more tension. And so I'm able to have a really hard run that just beats me black and blue. And I can get off that treadmill

and maybe my publisher can call and go, I don't really like that book idea. And the candies before that, who would have been like, Ah, Raj! What do you mean? Are you saying I'm not talented? But I'm an artist. I feel like you're not respecting me.

I've had tension early on in the day now. And this tension compared to what I would have perceived as tension, they don't relate. And so I can step back and go, understandable, let's talk later, you know? And so inviting that tension into my life, I think that's why I do it and that's why it's so addictive. Because then when I align other things up against that,

I'm like, this isn't so bad. Yeah, it's perspective, isn't it? Yeah. And feeling that in a very embodied, yes. Probably animalistic sense that probably then taps into rather than all the kind of made up stuff and all the ego and thoughts that can be going on up here. Yeah. That's fascinating.

And speaking of, I know you were taking the piss out of yourself when you were saying, I'm an artist, what are you doing? Is running for you? Do you come up with, because you have to. to have a lot of creative ideas in lots of different areas. Is running a time when you are able to, do you come up with things?

Do you come up with characters for your books? Do you come up with ideas for new ventures? Or is it just a time when you go to another place entirely? It's just a time to go to another place entirely. But what I love about that is this is another thing running teaches me is how to lock off and put blinders on. In this hyper-digital world, you know, I'm trying to have a call, I'm scrolling at the same time,

but I'm watching TV, but I'm feeding a kid. And running is like, hey, if you don't just focus on me, you're going to bust your face open. So get it together. You know, it's like one thing at a time. That's literally how running talks to me.

I'm like, okay, I can't be on social. You know that there's nothing else. And so what that does in my creative space, it allows me to ring fence and understand when the blinders need to go on. And so now, I can actually sit down and just meditate on creative ideas. I'm not necessarily having to wait for magic to fall out of the sky.

I can go, right, I'm going to sit here for 20 minutes and just doodle and try and think my way through the next book or something. And running absolutely has taught me how to do that. It's like you can only be here now. Think about the other stuff later on. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And like wiping the whiteboard clean. of all the days.

Yeah. Nonsense. Exactly. Fascinate. And with a treadmill as well, you're very aware that if you don't have... Probably even more so

than when you're outside. If you're outside running, you just stop. But yeah, you're so right with the treadmill. It's like, yeah, you will literally face. You will literally just hit your face. So you've got to be very, very focused.

Also, especially with incline on treadmill, I just almost fell right off the other day because I wasn't expecting that. So you do have to literally put one foot in front of the other. I've just found it very, very helpful in other areas of my life. Yeah. And speaking of your daughter and your stepdaughter early and being mindful about, you know, their influences as they grew up in this, you know, very different world to the world that you and I would have grown up in. Is it important for you to kind of set those examples or to kind of portray a positive relationship with fitness?

Absolutely. and to never have a conversation about it being tied to the way I look. So I'm not one of these parents that stand in front of a mirror and berate themselves in front of their child. I just, I think we need to think about the conditioning and the signals we are sending in that way. I'm always, I always speak really positively about my body. Also, I really enjoy clothes and I enjoy getting dressed up

from the perspective of someone who isn't like a size one influencer who's cavorting around Paris like i'm more quote unquote normal i know people hate that word like i'm just this down to earth girl that enjoys clothes and to watch my daughters like well they don't even sneak into my wardrobe because they know within limits they can touch anything but to watch them try things on and to not be um aware of a size label or i think all of that is so important and so when it comes to fitness i also what's so funny is i don't really mention it I just know they'll come in when I'm on the treadmill. I know my youngest is desperate to get on my bike.

And I'm like, oh, you're still a bit young. And I think because they just see me living it, it becomes part of their world. And like my youngest is on the hockey team and she swims and she likes to play football with the boys. And none of this is ever, you know, from like it's not too competitive. It's not about her body. She's just like, oh, yeah, I had a hockey fixture today. and we won and I just keep it light because like I said, I've arrived at a place where I now understand

the sooner they find exercise they enjoy, the better for us all because actually for the best version of their life, this has to happen forever. So I never want them to do something or engage with something where they're like, this is the ultimate worst chore because then they're more likely to just not do it and then they're back at square one. Yeah, absolutely. And as you say, there will always be, I know you spoke about there, being in the 80s, Celebrity Diet videos. And I always think I was a teenager in the naughties and it was all the kind of size zero and all that awful toxicity that you grew up with. But even now, like you'll go on TikTok and just on the for you page, just some of the, it all manifests, doesn't it? In every generation, there's always a new one.

way of these kind of very harmful ideals getting through. So yeah, the ability to kind of really put exercise and movement within this space of this is what you do for fun. And all that other crap is over there and kind of separating the two. Because obviously they're going to be yoked together in stuff they consume, what they hear in the playground. But that's such a powerful example that you're setting just quietly. Yeah, as you say. Yeah, I just, I found, you know, when I was growing up, what was the saying, do as I say and not as I do, which I just found so corny.

I was like, most of the time as a preteen and a teen, I'm certainly not listening to what you say. But now I think so deeply about the things my family around me did, their actions and how they showed up in the world. I'm just not a very vocal parent, unless they are steaming. rolling towards danger. I'm like, I think my daily practices and how I live my life are going to imprint themselves on your mind way more than me being like, you must get up and run five miles and no.

And also, when we start doing that, it then ties their self-worth to their capability to run this way or swim that way. And those metrics are always changing. And I don't want them to think if they don't get an A-star. or if they're not captain of the swim team, that their value is now depleted in my eyes. It's a very dangerous game, to be honest. I mean, it sounds, it sounds tricky.

Berry. Motherhood, man. Barry! Do you see what I mean about being the slough? I could just lie down. So I want to know about this. So talk me through your perfect sloth day. Let's indulge ourselves here.

If you had the whole day to be like, I'm going to lock trunchable in the choky. And I'm going to indulge what would it be? So we're doing, we're not showering, that's for sure. What's so funny? I can't believe I'm going to put this in here. There's definitely some meditation. I cannot ignore how positively meditation has impacted me.

What kind do you do? I use an app. So I use guided and I use guided based. on what I'm feeling like I pick a theme or you know. Nice. And it's just and you know I always tell people who are quote unquote new to meditating. I think even if you've been meditating for 20 years, you're new to meditating. But that's another discussion.

People are like, well, I don't know if I'm doing it right because my mind is, I think I've been meditating my son's four for at least four and a half years now, on and off, but more consistently the last two years. And I can count on one hand the times I've had that bow. clarity that you know certain enlightened people will speak of it's so rare it's so I'm so used to showing up and just then I'm thinking about an ex-boyfriend from like primary school and I'm like now really mind we're trying to be still but and yet it's still so important because that's that I would say in meditation that's when ideas are sparked that's when I can start to

work through something that has maybe left me disgruntled. So in the sloth day, we're meditating. There's a particular childhood treat Rice Krispy Squares. Oh, we're going to go for about four of them that day. Lots of sex in the city. I'm trying to re-watch with a new mind, with a new open eye. It's just, yeah, sometimes watching it back, you'll go, ooh. I'm cringing so hot.

I'm in cringe zone right now. And I just have these moments where I was like, Carrie, I was rooting for you, but this, this, I can't enable this. You know, I'm just like, girl, get it together. So I'm rewatching that. I'm doing some reading. And I'm physically reading magazines. I appreciate the ease. I appreciate the ease of the apps, but there's nothing like.

Again, for me, it's my attention being on one thing. I think if I'm reading a magazine on an app, notification comes in, boot, boot, boot, boot. 20 million things. And then what happens with magazines in apps are links are clickable and that just gets so dangerous. I'm like, now I'm spending 100 quid. I didn't ask for this experience. You're in a maze. You know, like, whereas sit down with a good mag. A couple of coffees. Yeah, that's a sloff day. That sounds heavenly. And speaking of your, well, I mean the opposite of speaking of sloth day, back in the real world where unfortunately you're a highly, you're a highly ambitious and capable person so I'm going to ask you about goals.

So you have achieved a hell of a lot. As you said, three books and three years, all your many other projects. When looking forwards then in terms of goals, personal, professional, kind of fitness, health-wise, what are some of the things that are percolating? Where do you want to be? What does success look like? I think across all of those personal, professional, even health, I'm having to retrain my mind to thinking about my goals on a personal level. Because I'm online so much or TV or whatever and I have a quote unquote public profile, the past 12 months I've really been working on what Candice wants and what her ego wants.

And they are such different things. Talk to me. And I've been led, I would say up until the last two years, I've been completely led by ego. must have that because that means that and if I'm seen in that space I'll be regarded that way and then you start to peel that onion layer back and you're like and you know that that's a trend and maybe 90% of those people won't even engage with you the person you'll just be the symbol of this success like it goes really deep and so now and that means my goals get a lot tidier and as sacrin and as corny as it sounds um

it's tension, it's tension I can control, it's happiness. So like one of my goals is to own a brown stone in New York. It's always been a goal since I've been going there since I was a kid, I've got family there. And I've dithered about how I'm going to make this work and, you know, will the kids come with the family concede?

I'm like, no, that is an absolute goal for myself. And now I deeply think about 90, year old Candice who has the privilege of looking back on her life and I write my goals from that perspective. That's smart. I'm like, right. If 90 year old Candice knew that she didn't even try to get that brownstone, what's that moment going to feel like?

Hate, hate, hate. Trunchful moment. So we must try, you know. And so I go straight to, hopefully, after having lived a long life of thinking, from my goal about my goals from there. And all of a sudden, success as it pertains to right now when people's thoughts and charting and numbers and selling this and being on the cover of that

just gets cut away. Because 90-year-old Candice is like, that don't really matter here. It's cute. I mean, if you're going to frame a Vogue cover, if Ed was listening, go for it. But it's not, it's just not the mean. on these bones.

So be really careful about how you spend your time because sweetheart, and this is 90-year-old candies. 9-year-old Candice is like, I can now tell you there's not enough of it. Even though you're 90 pushing 95, we're still here like, damn, I wish I had another 10, which is unlikely.

And so doing it that way, oh, it's just the sweetest gift, that perspective, to be honest. Like not sacrificing what you truly want. and your authentic desires for status. And little shiny status wins. Little shiny things. Little shiny things.

Where, if that was the case right now, I'm surrounded by lots of shiny things. And it does feel warm and bubbly for a time. But again, nine-year-old Candice is like, and it's just not in the... There used to be a show I used to watch as a kid called This Is Your Life. And this guy used to have this massive red...

book and invite celebrities and you'd look back on their life. And nine-year-old Candice has got that red book and she's like, yeah, and that shiny thing's not here. So could we please pay more attention to the building blocks that are going to get you to this version of old lady Candice? To those literal, beautiful brownstone building blocks, which is one part of Sex and City, which is aged flawlessly. Oh, gosh.

Do you know what? I just wish they weren't so expensive because for every year that I've not achieved that, I'm like, wow, I've got to find another 50 million. Great. We're backing you. We're backing you 100%. 100%. And what about so that's the, and so that follows then with health as well, but just being, so with health then, what would or with your, with, with training, with running? What would, what would 90, 90 year old Candice be thinking? What would she want you to do? 90 year old Candice would still be, in, in all ways that she could, would still be able to. be mobile and utilize her body and just pop down to the local bodega and get a ham sandwich and not feel as though her age was now caging her in her body because she hadn't kept things in motion. So it's that. It's being able to and this is why one of the things I'm learning to do right now

is learn to swim. 90 year old Candice is a really good swimmer. Thirty-four-year-old Candice today, not so much. But there is something about 90-year-old Candice that's like, I love being in water. Also, right now with me learning to swim, it's a tension because I'm having to give my entire body over to water. And I've noticed with swimming, again, so many of us can do it. But fear enters the chat and that's where the fight comes in.

And that's where water's like, oh, you want to fight me? I'll fight you back then. Whereas it's like you have to get into this body of water and just trust it with everything in you because even if your toe is like, I can't do this. It's like the water senses that and then just wants to pull you down. So 90-year-old Candice,

she can power walk around Central Park really well. She's a really strong swimmer. She definitely goes to dance class, you know. And again, all of those things though, they're tied to fun. At 90, it's not going to be tied to like some P.B. where I'm outrunning a 21-year-old. No, it's just tied to fun

and the enjoyment of life and knowing that those exercises also allow her to enjoy other parts of her life. Like when the great grandkids come around, I'm not like huffing and puffing or I can get out of the chair and play with them, you know? Yeah.

Doing those, finding time to do that stuff that even if you don't want to do it, you know it's going to keep things moving. Yeah. And not being afraid of the fight, Not being afraid of the tension. I love it. Before you go, could you sum up if you had to?

In a few words, why you run? I run to know that running is not the hardest thing. There are bigger, harder things. And even though this run right now may be hurting and burning, it's going to give me what I need to get through true hard times. Beautifully put. Thank you so much, Candice. Such a pleasure.

Thank you for having me. After my chat with Candice, I put her in touch with Nike run coach Dora Atim, so she could get some expert advice on how to achieve her personal running goal. Hi, Dora. I'm Candice and my goal is to run 5K in sub 25 minutes. Can you give me some advice on how to do that? Oh, absolutely. First of all, hello, hello. Okay, faster 5K, amazing goal. I think what we would try and focus on is increasing our speed

or just get closer to becoming comfortable with being uncomfortable, basically. When we think about 5K and 10Ks, these are predominantly aerobic exercises and requires a lot of VO2 max, which is very sciencey. VO2 max is basically the amount that our body can use oxygen whilst exercising. But I'd say Sammadge your training. So we get some long runs in there. We get some slower runs in there, but also get some interval sessions. So basically just like working closer to your pace.

So if we think about running fast, we've got to run fast for short periods of time to be able to build the endurance. It's not that fun all the time. I'm going to be honest with you. It's not fun. But obviously the goal is the goal and it's great when we achieve it. So, for example, we can go out and run nice warm up, 15, 20 minutes. And then you can go into sort of like, you know, run one minute harder pace, one minute easy, and then increase the time as you get more experience.

So you can do two minutes hard, one minute easy. Hard as relative, you know, it can be your seven, can be your eight out of ten. But it's just, yeah, working towards getting strong. You know, how do you feel about that? I'm a bit nervous. I'm a treadmill girlie now. I'm not going to like. And as someone who has a very long history of running,

but years ago, I'm very aware of how different, I learned this the hard way, of how different treadmill running is to road running. Road running just feels a lot more strenuous, in my opinion. But the reality now, having two kids and working from home, and also living in a secluded area, I'm not going to be running outside as much. So it is on the treadmill.

Do you think that advice still works for that? It's just making sure we differentiate the runs. So making sure that the slower runs are definitely much slower. You're able to have a conversation. You know what? You're able to tell the kids what to be doing while she's still running, you know? And then making sure the faster runs, the speed, the intervals are definitely at that.

I think treadmill's absolutely fine. You can get the goal. You know, I believe in you. Yeah. And I guess it's just working it around your lifestyle, you know. I find if I can do the hardest thing on the to-do list early on, and then like, okay, sitting down and writing 10,000 words today isn't so bad. No, I definitely feel like, yeah, I'm also a morning runner,

and sometimes I feel like once it's done, I don't have to think about it for the rest of the day, and I don't have to think about, oh, you know what, when I finish work, it's just watching over me. And, you know, this is someone as a coach as well. Yeah, this is what I do for a living. I literally coach people to run, but sometimes I definitely feel like, oh gosh, I still have to.

run at the end of the day. So when it's done in the morning, you know, the rest of the day I'm feeling like untouchable and, you know, I feel like I've got my stuff together. Yeah. But, you know, if I do have to put it off and run in the evening, I try to like manage those thoughts and be like, you know, regardless, you ain't going home until this run is done or you're not, you're getting this run done today. Unless obviously I really cannot because, you know, health-wise or anything like that.

But, yeah, that's all, that's discipline, you know. So when do you see yourself, you know, completing this? How much time do you think you want to complete this in? Realistically, end of the year, I think, you know, a good three months left. Yeah, I think end of the year would be feasible. The treadmill may have other ideas. But I don't, again, I'm also coming from a place of having a past running career, so I know how much I can push myself.

And I know how so much of this, in my opinion, is like 80% mental. It's so rare that it's, oh, my bones are too heavy, or whatever excuse we feed ourselves, it's having the mental strength to endure a certain pace for a certain amount of time. So I definitely think, yeah, end of the year would be great. Yeah, I think that's a fantastic time frame. And, you know, with these goals that we set ourselves, I feel like it's so important to be realistic,

especially like we all live busy lives. Six weeks might be feasible for some. Six weeks can be, you know, totally impossible. I feel like three months is a very good time frame to work around and I'm definitely invested so, you know, I'll be helping you along the way. I'll be helping you a long way. So yeah, and it's just like easy enough to, you know, break off the weeks and manageable chunks. And you know what?

Yes, we have a big goal in three months' time, but it's ticking off the smaller goals in the process. So it's like, okay, you know, we've had a good week of training. Yes. Or we've managed to get, you know, a good interval session in and, you know, a nice recovery run in. That's an achievement. We tick that off.

Yeah. it's just like celebrating the small moments and, you know, it'll make the big celebration even better. or feeling like I smashed it, but I'm ruined at the other side. I think there's something to be said for arriving at a running goal, feeling like not only did you do that well, but you could do it again, so to speak. Oh, that's so important. And I can relate hard with that, you know, if I train for 5K, 10K, K marathon, whatever it is, sometimes I've found myself in the past getting to that goal and I'm wrecked.

I don't want to hear about running. I don't want to talk about running. I don't want to run no more. I was, to now have the way I look at it, when I finished, I was always going to feel like, oh, yeah, I can definitely do some more. And then just give, you know, allow yourself to be eager. Allow yourself to be like, oh, yeah, I really want to do that again type thing. And then it will just help carry the motivation over to, you know, the next goal that we see.

And I'm looking at you, I'm like, the next goal. So I feel like it's super important to acknowledge that in your training cycles. Like, it's not all give it a million percent and then be completely burnt out. And again, these go into many aspects. of our lives is just making sure we're taking time because we want to run we want to run we want to do healthy habits for for as long as we live yes what's the rush oh I love that dora thank you so much for that I'm feeling so inspired and like I can do it is I think it's hard to just be on a treadmill and being your house by yourself I think it's really hard to

feel impassioned and invigorated so thank you for this oh you're so welcome I'm so excited let me know how it goes and we'll be cheering from afar. Thank you so much for listening to this whole series. I really hope you found it useful, motivating, or even just fun, to learn that running is about so much more than putting one foot in front of the other. A huge thanks to all my guests and super knowledgeable Nike Run coaches. If you've enjoyed this series of the Women's Health podcast Going for Goal, please rate and review and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.

We'll be taking another break, but we'll let you know when we'll be popping up again. soon.