Just As Well, The Women's Health Podcast - Chessie King on Self Kindness and Her Body Confidence Journey

Episode Date: June 17, 2020

If sunshine’s energy could be distilled and infused into a British millennial woman, the prime candidate would probably be 26-year-old Chessie King. The presenter, blogger and author of new book How To Be Your Own Best Friend is a champion of body confidence and self-kindness. She’s earned an army of loyal fans thanks, in part, to her willingness to show her ‘imperfections’ (think: cellulite, rolls of skin on her midsection), but Chessie’s not always enjoyed such a free, confident and self-loving relationship with herself and her body. In fact, her disordered pursuit of becoming her smallest, leanest self saw her overtrain her body to the extent that she experienced a mini stroke, which left her with a heart condition and hearing loss that still affect her today. Here, she tells Roisín about the life lessons she’s learned along the way and why she's so determined that other women won't need such a dramatic event to make them realise how important it is to listen to their bodies. Plus, she shares her top tips for practising self-kindness and why everyone listening can improve their body confidence - no matter where yours it at right now. Join Chessie on Instagram: @chessiekingg Join Roisín on Instagram: @roisin.dervishokane Join Women's Health on Instagram: @womenshealthuk Topics: Why teenage insecurities can be so damaging What it's like to be told you're 'too big' while at 8% body fat The health scare that transformed Chessie's outlook Two simple strategies for bad body image days How to ride the lockdown emotional rollercoaster Be Your Own Best Friend: The Glorious Truths of Being Female by Chessie King is published by Harper Collins and out now Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Eligibility restrictions apply. See Golden Nuggett Casino.com for details. responsibly. When you support Movember, you're not just fundraising, you're showing up for the men you love. Your dad, your brother, your partner, your friends. It isn't just a men's issue. It's a human one. That's why Movember exists to change the face of men's health, from mental health and suicide prevention to prostate and testicular cancer research and early detection. Movember is tackling the biggest health issues facing men today. Join the movement and donate now at Movember.com. Hello and welcome everyone. You are listening to Going for Goal, the weekly Women's Health podcast. My name is Rochene. I'm senior editor on women's health and this is your weekly chance

to plug in, be inspired and get expert advice on how to achieve the health and wellness goals that matter most to you. I hope you're all having a good week, whatever you're up to. And if you're not, then, well, you have definitely tuned into the right show because today's conversation is with a woman who I think it's fair to say is like a ray of sunshine personified. She is Chessie King, a presenter, blogger and now author who spreads heaps of positivity through her channels, whether it's an ode to body acceptance in the form of a rolls and all body shot on Instagram or just a video, the 27-year-old, shaking her bum in the sunshine,

or dancing in a duck costume. Make no mistake, Chessie is a brilliant laugh, but you better believe that she is dead serious when it comes to improve. proving the confident and self-esteem of women and girls, just like we are at women's health. She goes into schools and speaks about body image and self-love. She's got a book out all about self-kindness and becoming her own best mate. And now she has come on going for gold to share how she got to this place of self-love and respect and kind of comfortableness with herself and her advice for how all of you listening can to.

Her own journey, which she'll tell you all about in the chat, is such a stark reminder of just how important it is to learn, to love, accept and listen to your body. I really hope you enjoyed this conversation. It took place in May. It was a real joy to record. And as I said, really made me think. So enough for me. Let's get into it. Chessie King. Yes. Big sister of the internet, bringer of much, much joy and positivity. Welcome to going for goal. How are you doing? I am fantastic. How are you? I'm good. So we are here because we are here. We are here. was you have a book out. And it is called Be Your Own Best Friend. And it's published by HarperCollins. And by the time this episode drops, it will be out. Congratulations.

It will be out. Thank you so much. It was like, it's so different to how my Instagram is in the fact that it's the same things I speak about, but just with so much more substance. Because I felt like it was such a safe space just to like just say everything. Like things that I wish I was taught at school. from periods and body hair to contraception to all the things that I just wish that I not necessarily was taught at school because I feel like teachers have enough responsibility as it is, but things that I wish we spoke more about in our friendship groups. And yeah, it's, it's, I'm really looking forward to people actually holding it. When I held it the first time, like a few weeks ago, I was like, wow, it's chunky. And I wrote all those words. Like it was a really nice feeling. Lots of people listening will probably be quite familiar with you and your journey,

but for those that aren't, you've lived a lot of life for someone in their mid-20s. I think it's fair to say you've had a lot of experiences, like you've done a lot, you've been through a lot. For anyone listening who is not so familiar with your journey from, well, I'll let you tell it yourself, but with anyone who is not so familiar, can you catch them up a little bit on how you got to where you are, how you became your own best friend? Of course, yeah. I I say it wasn't an A to B kind of thing. It was literally the whole entire alphabet. I think I'm still going through the letters.

I was so free and confident and just kind of nonchalant when I was younger that I was just, I just loved life. And I literally loved making people smile and I felt so comfortable in my own body because I was just, I wasn't really aware of what my body was. I just thought of it as like something that carried carried me to dance and singing and all these activities that I used to do. And now I'm just at that place. I went through that chunk of my life that I speak about a lot in the book from about 16 years old when I realized I was the tallest girl in my year. It was the tallest girl in my group of friends. I was a bit bigger than everyone and little comments were made like, oh, when I hug you, it feels like I'm hugging like my boyfriend or when we were out. shopping. It was like, oh, I feel really embarrassed because it looks like I'm out shopping with my

mom. And I was like 14, 15. And all these little comments that obviously back there and are so, like, harmless and they don't, they don't mean, no one meant it maliciously or with any intent to her. But I think that all these little comments that you're bigger, you won't fit into that. Oh, yeah, I'm half the size for you. All of these little comments, I think, built up and they kind of ate away at my self-confidence. And from 16 to 22, so only about four years ago, I just tried to change my body in every single way. And I feel like that, for me, that eight years of really disliking myself and really trying to look like other people, that was time that I thought back then, I was like, oh my God, I'm losing all this time because I'm not looking how I want to. But I feel like

I gained so much and I can now speak about those stories to try and help other people and other girls that are feeling like they need to change the way that they look to become a better person in a world that is so heavily image obsessed. And I don't ever regret going to the extremes that I went to because all of that has developed my relationship with my body and I feel so, I don't just celebrate every single day what my body has been through and what it does for me, like on the day, on the, like every minute, I'm like, oh my God, my heart is beating without me telling it to. My ears are listening. Yeah, there's so much to it. But I'm finally here at a place where I can just say I'm so proud. I love that. And just to take you back to a time where

I think a subject of fascination at the moment is kind of the bikini athlete world and the bikini competition world. And obviously you talked there about not regretting some of the extremes that you went to. What was your relationship with your body and yourself like at that time when you were competing? Tell me about Chessie at that time. I, it was the most extreme. I could have pushed my body too. But back then I thought it was healthy and I love an experiment, I love a challenge. And for me, I was like, oh, well, I'm going to follow this 18 week program leading up to bikini competition. Just to see how I can change my body. I was listening to like a coach who told me that I need to look a certain size and

going to the gym every single day, twice a day sometimes, 5.30 in the morning before work and then going at lunchtime or after work. And then following this strict, crow like it was just wild i can't believe that i even did it and the bikini competition was fascinating and i am so glad i experienced it but i would just never ever do another one like it was a one time one time kind of thing it's so it's such an interesting world and i think for a long time people kind of didn't talk about what happened afterwards um there's a piece in there's a piece in the july issue of women's health which again will be out by the time this comes out and it is all about the like psychological journey afterwards and people having to almost find a sense

of balance and what a normal relationship with health and fitness but even just their body was like. The aftermath of a bikini competition, you're right. That's something that was not spoken about. The 18 weeks leading up was the thing that was the main priority for everyone. And that's what you honed in on that 18 weeks. But actually it took me two years. after bikini competition because I was told I was too big when I stepped on stage, even though I was 9% body fat, I was told that I was too big for my category, I was holding too much weight, all of these things that I thought after 18 weeks of, I mean, now I see it as beating up my body. Back then I was like, oh, but I'm just training

really hard and all of this. So I think it took two years to really come to a place of accepting that that was covering up disordered eating and also it was like camouflaging a relationship with my body that previous to the bikini competition was just unhealthy and I was just never satisfied. I always wanted to be smaller and smaller and smaller because I was told I was too big to dance,

too big to model, too big at bikini competition. I was, yeah, I was just so focused on proving to people that I could be smaller. So after that two years, and I mean, there was so much in that two years of rebelling and going against everything that I'd learnt in the 18 weeks, like eating whatever I wanted to do, never go into the gym, not even moving.

I was so unhappy in my post-Bikini competition body that it was that perpetual cycle again. It was like, yeah, it was a daily thing. It was kind of when I started posting about body confidence and body celebration and body acceptance on Instagram. And that was three and a half years ago, my first post. It was from that moment that I was like, every day I will speak to myself with kindness.

I will speak to myself with the way that I do speak to my best friends and my mom and my sister. And I just, it was, it wasn't like a break. through, oh my God, I woke up one day and I was like, oh, I don't love my body. It's amazing. It was literally like an everyday, it's like an everyday practice. It's like, it's with anything. It's like with anything. You have to do it daily. And every time I caught myself or still catch myself speaking to myself and self-sabotaging myself and these self-destructive thoughts, I think, why would I, why would I speak to myself like that? I don't speak to anyone else like

that and I genuinely don't. Why would I say that to myself when I'm literally, me and my body are a team, like we're going, and my brain, we're going to be spending the rest of our lives together. And we spend more time with ourselves than anyone else in the world. So why would we, why would we speak to ourselves so nastily, like bullying ourselves? So it, yeah, it's definitely a daily practice. And I think with sharing, the more I share on social media, the more, the more more, it actually helps me just accept my body. And the fact that I am so lucky, like, after my bikini competition, when I started training again, kind of going back into that, like, what else can I do to cover up the fact that I still

wasn't happy with my body? I then had a mini stroke and lost my hearing in my right ear. And it was from boxing, I think, so in that week, I'd done. two, three classes a day. And I was on, like, my, I think I was on my, like, tenth class of the week. And it was only Thursday. And I was boxing away and I fell to the floor. I was gyrating.

My whole body was just gyrating from my heart rate being 260. And I crawled out and I came to and all these bodies and faces were like over the top of me. And I couldn't hear what they were saying. All I could hear was just a high-pitched ringing. And my, they were like, she's having a heart. hashtag and I could just see their lips moving. And I was like, oh my God, that doesn't, that doesn't help. But at that time, I was like, I'm fine, I'm fine. I just can't hear you. And they, they rolled me onto my side. And anyway, after that, and I was only diagnosed with a heart

condition after three years of tests before lockdown. And I think that was my, that was my body telling me to stop. That was like, this is your limit. You have pushed me to the limit for eight years and you've tested me in every single way. And that was the moment that I think the connection between my ear and my heart and all of it just snapped. And it was like, right, you need to, you just need to calm down. And it's funny because you hear all these things, like listen to your body and tune in with your body. And actually, when that happened, I realized I hadn't been listening to my body at all. And that was the moment. I was like, wow, I've really got to look after myself here. It was such a shift.

of losing my hearing and I still haven't got it back. I wear a hearing aid when I have to. And I think it's sad that it took something so extreme like that to happen. And I'm still affected by it. I still can't work out as well, I only do low intensity. I've got a heart operation coming up that's been pushed back because of lockdown. I'm having a, like it's like a pacemaker, but it's a device that is fitted under my skin. And that's going to be there for three years.

and all these things that actually, I would never, if you told me when I was doing bikini competition, I was in my head, I was at my fittest, and I was being told, oh my God, you look so amazing, you're so small and you're so this. All these compliments that actually just increased that voice in my head that you're better when you look like this. And people were saying how proud they were of me and all of this.

And it just kind of fed my, well, back then my ego. and I can admit that now. I look back at some of the posts that I did and I'm like, what? You were just adding to that problem. But I wasn't, I wasn't at the place that I'm at now and I'm so glad that I went through all of that to be where I am right now.

Even though I'm really scared of my, I'm not scared, but I've kind of like, I psyched myself up for my heart operation because they have to go in when I'm awake. So yeah, I don't want to go into it. But yeah, so yeah, that's going to be fun. They're going to rummage around and fill the whole.

So I've got a whole. hole in my heart and then I'm I've got SVT which is super ventricular tachycardia which means my heart rate spikes to 260 in like five seconds and and that's happened so I've had 14 episodes in the last three years and it's yeah so I just I just think that the listen to your body that message did not actually ring true to me until something so extreme happened now streaming on Paramount Plus. It's the epic return of Mayor of Kingstown. Warden? You know who I am. Starring Academy Award nominee Jeremy Runner.

I swear in these walls. Emmy Award winner Edie Falco. You're an ex-con who ran this place for years. And now, now you can't do that. And Bafto Award winner Lenny James. You're about to have a plague of outsiders descend on your town. Let me tell you this. It's got me consequences.

Mayor of Kingstown, new season now streaming on Paramount Plus. And then it hit you in a dramatic way into the sense that you're still feeling those repercussions. So the condition that you've got, I can't pronounce it now. I can't remember it now. The condition that you've had now, is it a SVT? There we go. Is it a direct result of the over-exercise

and the pressure you put your body through? Yeah, so it was that mini-stroke that I had, which was the build-up. Yeah, so that was from it. And then I lost my hearing from the mini-stroke. and then the SVT has that that's what was triggered by it and then the whole in my heart was either made or created from the episode that I had when I had my mini stroke.

I read all that and I kind of heard you say it but when you're hearing that live in a conversation and someone basically saying how they had such a profound reminder of that their health was so much more than what their body looked like and so much more than their size. It's really powerful and I'm so sorry you had to that you had to go through all that and more power to you for being so positive despite it. Maybe even because of it, I don't know, like these things teach us, don't they? Absolutely. I think, because lots of people say like how do you deal with the loss of your hearing? How do you deal with the loss of your control over your heart and exercising? But

I genuinely think I gain so much compassion and so much understanding for those with invisible conditions. Because I always say, like, obviously we never know what anyone else is going through. And just because someone seems maybe, like I always use the example, someone pushing you on the tube, obviously that pre-lockdown, we don't know what a tube's like anymore, but is someone like pushing against you on the tube? What's that? I don't know, huh. Who's true? And someone like, someone, yeah, pushing past you, right?

And, like, walking off and then you, you feel frustrated. I would have felt frustrated before I lost my hearing. But then, honestly, it's like this thing that, like, the mind, the gap second. I always think it's like this millisecond of, like, before you react, I go, they might have visual impairments, they might have spatial awareness problems, they might have a condition that, and it honestly, even if they don't have, that thing. I feel so much better because it doesn't annoy me as much. And it gives me that time and that understanding that everyone, everyone has something, everyone has a story. And you don't

know what chapter they're on. You don't know what pages they've written. Like all of these things that I just don't think I understood and fully appreciated before I lost my hearing. Because I've had people, especially at the beginning, when my brain was not used to it at all and a hand adapted. When I was like crossing the road and I had to look an extra like 10 seconds before I cross the road and even these simple tasks that you think, oh, you'll be fine because you've just lost your hearing. Like just these, yeah, it definitely has given me so much more compassion for others and the fact that these invisible things are not just, you're on crutches because you've broken your leg. Like you can't, you can't see my hearing loss.

It's invisible. So yeah, that gave me a huge understanding and awareness of things that people go through. Well, thank you so much for sharing all that and giving us a potted history into how you've got where you are now, which is a position where you are, you're an advocate for body confidence, body acceptance. For me, it's body confidence, body acceptance, body appreciation, body celebration, body respect. all of these things that three years ago, I had no idea. I didn't even, I just said, I'd never seen it before and I just said, I want to feel confident in my body and I just said body confidence. That was like before I'd seen anything about it. So these phrases, I think once you find one that really

rings true to you, then that can work for you. Because I did a post the other day about like how sometimes it may feel like I'm speaking a foreign language to people that don't feel confident in their body. So therefore, they may find that body acceptance is better for them or body celebration. Because we all, I think there's so much pressure on loving ourselves and loving our bodies and feeling at home with our bodies and all of this. But actually, some people are not ready to do that. I wasn't ready to feel like that seven, six years ago. So it's just finding. what works for you and you can make up your own phrase. I heard body respect a few weeks ago and I love that. It's like actually just respecting my body and not being like, oh my God, look how amazing my arms. I love my arm so much. It's just I respect what they do for me. So yeah, it's finding what works for you. I love that. So find a terminology that works for you. And then, so I would love to go in here to getting your tips as basically for someone who has managed to befriend themselves, make themselves the other half of that little best friend necklace.

And make this self-respect and self-celebration a lasting habit. So what comes first? I know you've got you quite handily break this down in your book. But what's the first thing that you think people need to work on? Do people need to have a level of awareness about where they're starting? someone who does want to start on this, I don't know, you could call it self-love journey, this process of becoming your best friend, whatever. Where should they start? I think first things first, just stripping it down to the basics. You can strip yourself down for

this. So I would just do, I call it a mini bodyology session. So like a biology session or lesson. Obviously you don't have to be like a scientist to do this. We all kind of know the functions of our body. So literally starting from the top of our head down to the bottom. And like you do in say yoga and shavasna, all of our favorite bits of yoga, like my mom's a yoga teacher. So she's like, relax the face. She goes down like bit by bit, inch by inch down the body and relax the different body parts. I feel like for me, when I'm feeling like a little bit like, oh, God, that dress doesn't fit me or I wish those shorts fit me. Like I have those days still. I'm like, right, let's just check in, what's my brain doing for me right now? And I put my hands like where I'm feeling it,

where I'm talking about, because I feel like then you can make that connection. I'm like, okay, what's my brain doing for me right now? It's thinking, it's processing information, it's doing all these things. I put my hands on my ears and I'm like, even though one of them isn't working, it's like, what is it doing for me? It's listening. What can I hear? I can hear the sounds of the birds. I can hear the cars, all of this. And it's just stripping it down. So going from the top to the bottom and being like, what is my body doing for me right now. And that really takes me into my body and just, I think like, they are fascinating our bodies. Like, imagine what, if we could see every single day what everyone's bodies are doing

beneath like the exterior layer, that first layer of what we look like. Imagine if we could see it, like the mechanics of a clock or the mechanics of a car. Imagine if we could see it. We would celebrate our bodies. so much more. So that's my number one. Sorry. And so like when I get really passionate, I get really like, yeah, lose my voice. No, no need to apologize. It's something that I just want to shout about because I spent so long just being stuck in this negative self-talk cycle that I'm just like, oh, that's why I go into schools and speak about this to younger people and teachers and parents. But so the first one is your bodyology lesson.

And second one is any time that you compliment your best friend or compliment your family or your work colleagues or anything, commenting on something that isn't body image related. So something like I'll always, even with Matt, like he's studying a master's in neuroscience psychology in mental health. And for me, that is incredible. And I am just in awe of his brain and what he's learning. And I'm like, that is fascinating, that and incredible that you're working hard towards that. And it's not, oh, my God, you look amazing in that shirt. I think he's hot every day, but I don't comment necessarily on his body all the time. Just because it just feeds that whole, like, I think the more we talk about bodies,

the more we think about them. Sometimes it's just taking away from the exterior layer and talking about what I like to call the juicy bits, the bits that you find in a human, the bits that you love about your friends when you peel back all those exterior layers. People have a perception that body confidence is to do with how we look and the size that we are,

whereas I actually don't believe it's anything to do with the size I am because it's all in my head. It's all in our brains. Like I look back at photos of when I thought I was big, because I was told I was big, in bikini competition. Back then, I thought I was big. That was in my head.

now I see that actually I was half the size I am now. And so it has nothing to do with how we look because it is all how we believe, we believe our thoughts and we believe everyone else and all these other things that are telling us that we need to change ourselves and we're not good enough. Yeah, on that point, for someone that enjoys progression in fitness, how do you continue that whilst being kind to yourself?

I feel like with fitness and nutrition, I think the more you experiment with what makes you feel good, the better understanding you have of what works for you. Like, there are obviously, we're saturated with recipes and workout videos and all of this. And actually, sometimes it's like a bombardment. You're like, it's like going to a restaurant and having like a million different pasta dishes and like choosing one out of a hundred and being like, I don't know what I want. I'm so bad at choosing on the menu.

Like I will take half an hour. because I want to get like the yummiest thing. So I think, I love how I've just turned it back into food. I think, yeah, just so experimenting. Obviously at the moment we have the time to work out whenever we want to without any like, oh, you've got a 10 o'clock fitness class

and you have to get to it at 10 o'clock, otherwise you lose all your money and you won't be able to work out. So I feel like just having, if goals work for you, then incredible. whether they're fitness goals, strength goals or just happiness goals. For me, I don't go off of a goal. I just keep like a really nice, steady. Like, obviously my workouts are different in the past two, three years because of my heart.

So I've had to do low intensity stuff. But the whole conversation when I'm working out now is, wow, like my body is doing this. Like, my legs are literally like fired up. I can feel it here. My heart rate's a little bit higher, but I'm checking in with my heart rate. I obviously don't want to push it. I don't want to have an episode. So it's like that conversation.

But if that conversation where it used to be in the gym was at 5.30 in the morning on a cross-trainer or on the treadmill for so long, like literally wasted so many, not wasted, but spent a lot on my time on that. And the whole conversation was how many calories have I been doing this for? So yes, I think now. and honestly for me it depends so much like with working out and eating it it fully depends on my cycle like if I'm um I'm really trying to get in tune with my my cycle because I came off the pill two and a half years ago and I just want to learn more about like my hormones and I'm just

fascinated with that kind of aspect so I think the less that you focus on got to push myself and I've got to lift heavier and I've got to do this and just going, okay, yeah, you know what, I'm going to try and do that today. Or I fancy, fancy experimenting with that or just coming at it with a playful aspect. Yeah, so we had a couple of questions sent in from some followers on Instagram. And one of them, which I want to know the answer to as well, is from Alia Price. And what is your favourite workout move? Workout move. Oh my goodness. I, love dancing any kind of dancing i literally like the amount of wild dance moves that i didn't even know existed i've done in lockdown because i've just like pumped some music on so loud that my

neighbors have no choice other than just to join in um so yeah i like does that count because honestly any kind of move i'm like doing some 90s like some um sprinklers i've got stacking the shelves i've got just feeling the music like closing my eyes and just like wiggling a booty shake is by far my favorite just literally wiggling everything it's my favorite i mean i was going to say that is the trademark the joyful the joyful booty shake is the chessie king trademark and if you're not quite getting that then do go check out her instagram and you can know what i mean and so we had another one here from jenny which is what do you do to get you up on your down days. I know you mentioned before that you do still have some days when

you feel a bit rubbish about yourself, you feel a bit rubbish about your body. What do you do? At the moment, I am painting. I'm like just splattering my brain and everything I'm thinking on a canvas, but obviously some people that won't be, yeah, like accessible. So just for me, like writing it down. So like I will literally write down everything I'm feeling onto even just with like a pen and a piece of paper how you normally write things down and just writing down how I'm feeling. And then, you know, like in science, I used to just doodle all over my page. I just do that. And I carry on like, just scribbling out how I'm feeling. And I just, it's so cathartic. It's like, I'm actually doing this right now, like, as you can see the actions.

And just like writing down how I feel, getting it all onto a piece of paper. And sometimes I just leave it. And I'm like, okay, brilliant. I'm ready to start the day. or sometimes I like just rip it up and put it in the bin and I'm like okay right let's go and sometimes I just sit in it and I feel as in like I sit in the thoughts and the feelings and I just indulge in that feeling instead of like shoving it away and being like I'm fine like I can I can get on with the day it's just like feeling it and being like okay why do I feel like this and the other side like flipping it round like why do I feel really happy today like why do I feel so full of energy and noticing what these things, like what things around you make you feel certain things.

Like you notice when you're feeling your best, when you're with the people that maybe encourage you and enlighten you and inspire you and empower you. Whereas sometimes I feel like quite heavy and drained and almost deflated when I've left maybe an event with like a certain, yeah. So it's noticing your environment and what makes you feel good and what makes you feel bad.

And on the days where I am feeling a bit rubbish, I'm like, right, I'm going to turn to the things that I know make me feel good. And it's not necessarily like, oh, I've got to run through my to-do list and I have to get that done still. It's actually going to go, the world is not going to end if I don't do these things right now. So I'm actually going to just give myself this extra hour to either indulge in what I'm feeling or to do something I know makes me feel good. And sometimes that is just putting on.

a playlist and just dancing around my kitchen naked. Naven's love it. Yeah. I love that. So something that is coming across throughout all of this, it's like you are on a constant one-woman mission to really understand yourself and really know what makes you feel happy. And that comes across why you have these,

it's amazing positive energy. And I just think that's a really, really, that's really, really good advice. Don't ignore it. Don't push it to one side because otherwise it will bubble up like that. What's that game? Like whack a mole and you knock it down and then it pops up somewhere else. That is so true.

I said like that, but with Jenga, because I'm like you are literally those stacks of blocks, those building blocks and you, those like the feelings that you keep on saying, oh, I'm fine, I'm fine, I'm fine, I'm fine. And like you stack those blocks up higher and higher. and that block that you pull out that finally fooled over, you know, the little like, yeah, what's it?

Yeah. That wooden block and that is the same as whackamol. I feel like all of the games that we used to play, we can use as analogies. But yeah, it's like, I always said it was a buildup of like, it was like an emotional extravaganza and it almost felt way too overwhelming to deal with my thoughts because I'd left them for so long.

So when I feel them now, I'm literally like, God, yeah, I feel really sad and I'm actually just going to feel it. And then a few days later, I'm like, okay, I'm glad I dealt with that sadness because I'm ready to go again. Yeah, so allowing those feelings and just indulging in them and then getting up and starting again, getting on the phone to your friends that makes you laugh. I could talk to you all day. Before you go, we ask everyone this, if there is one piece of advice or one thing that you want people listening to take away from this conversation about how they can learn. to be their best friend and love themselves and cherish themselves, what would it be?

So every time you're feeling upset or slightly angry with maybe yourself or the world or anything, just giving yourself a big hug, do it with me because it feels so good. Rapping your arms. I'm going to have a go now. Oh yeah, you're under your duvet. Rapping your arms around yourself. And even that touch of like just holding yourself. and kind of just checking in and being like, we've got this.

Like having a little self-talk. And you can do it on the tube. I mean, people might look at you, a bit silly, but do it on, do it any way you want to. And it's like, just that squeezing yourself and being like, thank you so much for like making it to where we are right now. Like you've been through so many days and so many things that you never thought that you'd get out of.

And actually, it reminds you that you've made it to this point right now. And I honestly, I just love giving myself a big hug. and like just reminding myself that we're still here. So yeah, I just love giving myself a little hug. Wonderful, wonderful advice and excellent for all those low moments, Chessie. Thank you so much for coming on, going for goal. It's been an absolute pleasure. You're a dream.

Thank you. Oh, I so hope you enjoyed that conversation. And thank you to all of you for listening. If you enjoyed it, please remember to leave a review on Apple Podcasts. And remember to subscribe wherever you get your podcast. to make sure you never miss an episode. And if you've got a health goal in mind, absolutely get in touch.

We did this episode because we've had a number of people reach out. We had Ludders who wanted to build self-esteem and Tammy who wanted to grow mental resilience and I really hope Chessie will have helped both of them with those goals. So yeah, if you have a goal in mind, we will know someone who'll be able to help you get there. So get in touch on Instagram and put Going for Goal at the start of your message so we can't miss it.

Right. That is enough of me whittering on. Take care, guys. I will be back next week. See you then.