Just As Well, The Women's Health Podcast - Trinny Woodall: The Style Icon's Mission to Outsmart Alzheimer's and Age Brilliantly

Episode Date: November 18, 2025

Thriving at 60 and beyond, Trinny Woodall gives us her blueprint for longevity. With Claire Sanderson and Gemma Atkinson, she discusses her fascinating long and varied career, how she dealt with drug addiction, her plan to live well until 110, what she’s doing to her all-round wellbeing to not be stricken with Alzheimer’s like her late mother. Plus she gives easy tips that every woman could adopt to dress well, takes Gemma and Claire through her mood boosting laughing therapy practise and shares the exact workout  she does to get her incredible arms. It’s a must listen.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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We have just had a chat with the icon that is Trinny Woodall, or Trinny London. Or just Trinney. Just Trinney. However you know or as, it was... It took a turn, let's just say. By the end, we were all doing a one-minute laughter, a meditation with an invisible ball, and talking about Buddhists. And guardian angels.

Guardian angels. And all the woo-woo stuff that you do, although she says, I'm not allowed to call it woo-woo, because that's insulting. So I'm no longer going to refer to you as woo-woo. She was very, when she, when she, yeah, she's just weird, not woo-woo, just say that about me. When she first arrived, we were all a bit like, because she came in the office, didn't she?

She was a little bit under the weather because there's this horrible lurgue going around. And then when we came in this room, she, like, relaxed, opened up. Yeah. She spoke about the biggest failures have led her to grow and evolve because that's when she learns when things aren't going too well. Told us how she keeps herself mentally fit, physically fit. She's obviously the cover this month as well. She is on the December cover of Woman's Health.

Yeah. Yeah. My biggest joy was that within 30 seconds of her arriving, She started critiquing my outfit and telling me what color I should pair I should pair with my trousers and telling me my skin tone and what colours would work well with my eyes. So I had the whole Trinney and Susanna experience. He was brilliant. So how many people get to say they got that?

I followed her on social media now for a long time and she very much from meeting her just now lives that life. She is that person. It's not an act on social as it is in real life, which is brilliant. She's authentic through and through. Yeah, it is what you get. So enjoy this chart. I'm sure everyone's a fan of Trinney.

Who isn't? And if you do like it, please do like it. Subscribe. Send it to your family. Send it to your friends. And enjoy just as well with Trinney. So today's guest is our current women's health cover star of which the pictures are insane.

She's also the brains behind one of the biggest, most successful beauty brands with a simple philosophy of wanting women to look in the mirror and think, I'm alive, I'm well, I'm Bible. She's also one of the busiest women in the world. We've just been, literally, she's been all over the globe. So the fact that you're even here finding the time is incredible.

Welcome Trinny Woodhall. Thank you so much for coming here. So nice to chat to both of you too. How was the shoot? How was your... The shoot was, I am the worst C-U-N-T on a shoot. Let's just make this totally clear. Because the problem is when you've been a columnist or a journalist or an editor of some kind,

it's very difficult to then just have the role of being in front of the camera. So in my career, I've been, you know, columnist editing, looking at photo, photo, you know, final approval. And so I kind of have to think, I mustn't put that on that hat. I mustn't put on that hat. But then I'm like, can I please see the screen and can I please check the shot? And I just don't think this is good for the skin tone lighting. I'm just really, really tricky. People know where they stand.

Your picture was so nice because I said at the end, shoot. I'm really sorry I was so tricky and he said it's kind of you were clear and that's better than somebody who pretends it's fine. You clearly have an amazing eye for detail and just by how spectacularly dressed you are today and your fabulous accessories and we saw examples of those accessories on the shoot as well and the fact that the minute you saw me today he said hello darling and started giving me style advice. I know you didn't ask for it and then I thought should I really tell the editor of a lovely women's magazine. the idea I just can't stop myself.

But I think I'm quite obsessed with colour and with colours that people are drawn to in colours, they feel it's a trend, let's wear it, and then how do you wear a trend and make it suit use? Because I think colours mean so much, and black is easy. We had this conversation a little bit before we came on. It's a very easy default.

And, you know, when we did the shoot even, a part of me was like, where's my bright yellow? Where's my, you know, because colour brings me alive. And so if I'm in sort of, Or else colour or creola dressing brings me alive. You know, the idea of wearing head to toe, like, Gemma, you're doing in a way because you're in a jumpsuit. But, you know, it's like you're all in one colour and I love that too.

And then in your trainer, I don't know, it's that black or darkest navy, indigo perhaps. But, you know, there's a continuation. So I think that's beautiful as well. Or else just totally crazy contrasts. But that's what I mean, I follow you on Instagram. And one of the things I love is how you do the, you do your shopping. And then you will show people, not only what you've bought, but multiple ways of how they can wear it

because I'm terrible at shopping I'm all comfort over fashion and I shouldn't be I should take more pride I've got two young kids so I'm just like whatever's comfy it don't matter if I get spilled food on it whatever but I would never think of wearing items in different ways it's something you've always been into though isn't it

fashion and also I believe things should stay in your wardrobe for a long time and I believe there are investments and their friends because whatever budget you're on I think, like the idea of Sheen to me is abhorrent because I think it's like, let's get a dress for a party tonight and then let's never wear it again. And I'm not an amazing, sustainable activist.

But, you know, like in skincare, I wanted it to be replenishable and sustainable because I think we throw away a lot of bottles. But in clothing, like I wear sequins, they're plastic. But I would never buy something sequined just for now. And when I did a sale last week for the King's Trust to raise money, for something called Change Girls' Life campaign so I got people donate their wardroats

but I actually donated a lot of my clothes and we raised really good we raised nearly 400 grand for the sale which is amazing and there was quite a few sequins but all of the ones there I'd had 20 years in my wardrobe or nine years of my wardrobe and I think that is so that's what I'll do

is I'll buy something and then I'll think okay I've got to see all the like these are trousers that I don't know what you can see you can see a bit so these trousers that are really long. Okay. And I thought I can wear them with a heel like this. I can wear them with a high stack tree. I thought it was elasticated at the bottom. But then what do I do if I want to wear them short? So in the summer, how do I wear them? I need to wear them summer and winter because they were expensive. So then I thought that doesn't work with this heavy shoes. So then I'd seen

somebody a weird, a stylist the other day doing, you know, I'd always wanted to do little socks these are from costs. But I thought actually the blue from this could come into there and break the burgundy and then also I won't if it's raining today I won't get my trousers wet so I'll think of all those things you know as I'm dressing and I enjoy that sort of intellectual challenge of you know how does it flow does it work does it does it have old friends in my wardrobe it can make friends with you know or does it always need continuously to have new friends for it to work so I just and then once I then so I used to buy more impulsively but now what I'll do is I'll do that and then I'll hang it on a rail

and I won't ever wear it fully but I'll take it out and try it with other things and then if within a week I'm feeling it's got so many friends then I'll keep it so for those listening who are not watching what Trinney has just done she has these beautiful long silk are they silk silk pattern trousers and you've created a sort of I've taken a hair band yeah I've taken a hair band and also it depends entirely on the hairband so this side was just it was Lila as I went into her covered but it's one that doesn't strangulate your ankle and then I tuck it in and I create a fashion which actually first spring summer is a strong fashion which is a balloon trouser but this is like a

smallified balloon trouser and then I got a little sock poking up but it just it's practical and then it I like changing silhouette like anyone watching and yourself you've got young kids it's the priority of I've just got to get ready I've literally have to just put clothes on my body all right but I always feel how can we take a bit of time at some stage during the whole week that you could maybe like I did this on a Sunday morning when Lila was little I'd get up early I liked my Sunday sleeper but I'll get up early and I would just do six outfits that I felt good in and this is another thing about our relationship with our body so if we do this when we're feeling in a good relationship with our body we try things on and you take a picture and you think

that looks good you like it and so you think I've got six options maybe two for the evening and four for the day that I can wear this week instead of having a tornado in your bedroom. Okay. And then what we then have to get over is when we put it on, we think it doesn't feel right, it doesn't feel right. That is Negi Nelly, who's not a part of us but lives inside our head, who's going to judge our body differently today, even though there is no way our body has changed.

Something inside our head has shifted where we just don't feel it sits well. And so it's how much you listen to Negi Neri who might say, oh, you can't get away with that or you can't wait that. Whereas on Sunday morning, when you felt good, about yourself everything worked well so it's how do we go against the tide of putting something on and feeling oh i don't know and just going with it just waiting for the reaction like you said you went out when you wear um you'd worn red and everyone said god you look fantastic you know people notice us more sometimes in certain colors and it's remembering that too the feedback

people give you you might go out feeling and then somebody goes you look so well and it's It really changes your day. Because that Negi-Nelly voice, although my daughter is Nelly, so... Oh, sorry, so... Negi noddy. It can be really loud. Yes. And it's very hard to override it sometimes.

That's a great tip. If you're having a day when you feel great, get it all set up then. And then Negi, negative noddy. I hope nobody in this room is now called Noddy. No, no one's got a child called Noddy. There's other things that I sometimes think are good to do because we can do physical things with our body. that will help us break a train of thought

and we can either do the five senses meditation which I really love which is just how do you break this continual training thought in your head so that's you know think of five things I can see and then you close your eyes and think of four things you can smell and then you think of all four things you can touch that are different textures and then three things you can smell

two things you can and it just makes your brain shift and then it sort of forgets what it's been negative about Or you can hold an ice cube in your hand like that because the real coldness will make your body behave in a different way and send different messages to your neural pathways and break that train of thought. You know, if it's just such a bloody party in your head, different things you can break it, which are actually physical things you do.

You've reinvented yourself so many times. You've done TV presenting, a beauty entrepreneur, a wellness advocate. What is it that keeps you wanting to break boundaries and try new things? What keeps you going? The art of reinvention and evolution. And to me, I prefer that how do I evolve as a woman? Because I think if I say I reinvent, I'm negating the past of what was good in the past. And I think you bring everything from your past to help you.

Which summer can be incredibly painful and some can be great highs. You know, when you're having a really bad time, it's like, remember when last week all these customers came in the store and they were so transformed by Trinity London, they want to just tell me their story. So if I wake up to a day of not very good sales, you know, I'll think, okay, I need to remember. I remember we're a really big growing brand. And just because we have one day where the sales are not where I want them, that's don't hone in. So I do, I feel in the flow of my life. Like I've started so many things that have been, you've never heard about it because they were terrible.

You know, like I had a sock company that I started when I was 19 and I wanted to sell men's socks. I'd been trying to trade commodities. It hadn't gone very well. And I turned to getting really cute girls. This is like very early days. Wouldn't be politically throughout right now. I chose them all because they had great legs. And we all went into trading floors, sold socks.

They had baskets of socks. The guys were bored. Their socks were eaten by washing machines, and they only have had one. So they did it. And they were, it did incredible. Like we literally earned five grand a month, which was a fortune then. And then I thought this is amazing. And then suddenly I got the socks from Barta,

which was this East European company. The glue went. They started going in the wash. All their wash was turned to different colours, you know, disaster. So this kind of great high and then failed. And then for the next 10 years, in my mum's attic or in my attic or in a garage, I found another bloody box of those socks to remind me of my failure. But that, what did I learn from that?

I learned quality control. I learned I've got to check. everything. I learned don't assume or presume, check it yourself. You know, although I took a lot from that. And I've done many little businesses where, you know, I had one where I worked with a friend of mine, but I didn't check how long she wanted to be in the business for and she suddenly wanted to go off to art school. And it was sort of, I was like, I can't do it by myself. You know, so if you're going to work with somebody, really both know what you both want from something, you know. So I then went to partnership, Susanna. And we, I really, I remember this, we sat to

down the first day when friends introduced us. And I said, what do you want from this? Because she actually called me afterwards and said, can I nick your idea for the column? I went, no, you can't, but we can sit down together and think what would we like to do together and make it clear. So I learnt sort of clarity of messaging, communication. So I think they're all brought into the next decade. Trini and Susanna was a cultural moment.

There's not many people who are known singly for their first name, and you're one of them. There's Rihanna. Antendek and Trinney and Susanna. Yeah, there's not many celebrities, talent, who are known widely for their first name. And it really is thanks to that show that it allowed you to use your name to grow on and build your brand.

How long ago was it? It was the early noughties. It was, I started working on the telegraphs and a column called What Not to Wear in 97. And in 2009, we did an online business, 2001, we closed it. I think it was 2002 or three. We started and we started on BBC 2.

And, you know, I was sort of thinking, I have to close this internet company. It's 2001, actually. And I was really sad. And I was thinking, God, failure, where am I going to go now? And I went on a retreat in Arizona, went on cacti walks every day. It was where I learned to understand that the, the employer, of cactus was cacti. I never knew that before. And I sort of had this, I think when you just are so flawed about where you want to go next, and I also thought, I've never had a formal

education. You know, I was appalling at my 11, so I hardly got GCSEs. Who will hire me? We can very quickly go in that spiral. And so I just said, you know, whatever's coming next is coming next. We had happened to have done this column, which was doing well, came back, and then the BBC had done a pilot with us like a year and a half four, and they suddenly caught said, can we do the show? And I was like, yeah. And then we started doing it then. So it must have been 2001.

And how did the show evolve? So it became a very warm, wonderful place for women towards the end. It did, but it did evolve. I think at the time, you won't remember this. I don't know if you might remember. We had the close show with Jeff Banks, and it was a really good show. And it was sort of just fashion, kind of fashion, beauty, health. It was everything.

and then it stopped. And then there was nothing. So BBC 2 did what not to wear with us. And then there was a certain limit of viewing figures on BBC 2, and then you went to BBC 1. So we went past that limit because it was popular, so we moved to BBC 1. So when they moved to BBC 1, they wanted to make it bigger or better.

So then it had to be more shocking. So there was this quite, nobody knew they were being filmed. And the production team would say, do you mind if we put a camera in your wife's, bedroom as she changes. Yeah, why not? There were things that we'd never do today. And then they never knew we were going to help them because somebody else had requested it. So there was a big shock for them at the beginning that somebody thought they needed help or else that they thought they were past help. You know, you had a whole contradiction, whole different types of women.

We went all over England. It was really interesting because it gave me the very foundation of how women feel about themselves, their body, body dysmorphia, our relationship with our hair, makeup. It taught me so much that I used today. And then after about four years we went to ITV and they wanted to do a show called Undress which was about two, you know,

they wanted still that shock factor. So we found couples who were in a state of not getting on and it was about bringing them back together and there was this moment always where they were behind a white sheet and they each had a mini camera and they would talk to each other about each other's bodies

and how they felt. And there was some moments in there where I still remember very clearly some people, but a woman who'd had breast cancer and she hadn't let her husband for seven years see her undress because she'd had a mastectomy and never had reconstruct the surgery. And so her relationship with her body was really tenuous and she felt he couldn't bad to see her naked. So we had this moment and he the first thing he showed was her scars and he said, this shows me how brave you are and everything I fell in love with you is shown in these scars. You know, the real. reason I love you as a woman is shown in these scars. And it was really great because to me we did

create intimacy of people reconnecting with each other in the oddest way. So I did love all the shows we did. I really did. And then we stopped doing it. We were stopping Flavent Month. There was Gok One. There was Nicky, you know, 10 years younger. All these other shows then came in. But then we took a variation abroad because we went to this as a TV conference called Mickcom. We went there. didn't even go though. We'd done a tiny show. We had a company like Spanx called the Miracle Pants Company, Magic Pants Company, for Spanx. And it was owned with us and a Belgian. This is like random things in life, a Belgium tights manufacturer called Set. And they said, can you do a show in Belgium to help support the knickers? So we're like, we need to pay the

mortgage. We will do that. So we did it. And they took that show to MIPCOM. 16 countries bought it. So we thought, okay, make it. we'll get some residue from selling a show. And they went, no, we want you to come to these countries. So some are like, okay, so we went to Poland, Israel, India, Australia, Norway, Scandinavia. I mean, we went everywhere, America went everywhere doing the show. And it was then, for me, so emotive because we had unbelievably challenging moments of people's lives. And it was really for me the most interesting because I'm quite intellectual in trying to

quickly understand what makes somebody tick and you as journalist you know how you have to get this intimacy really quickly when you're interviewing somebody and you want to understand the heart of them so it taught me so much how to quickly understand what was going on inside somebody that they weren't telling you you know and I use that a lot today so do you think you still have that skill now you feel the empathy with people when you meet them yeah I have it um more than that sometimes I mean, I am quite empathic with women sometimes. Yeah, I get that sense. So I'll know, you know, we launched a product last week

and I did this thing called The Honesty Chair in Liberty. And it's very weird. And it's so hard to talk about because I never actually talked about an interview so I don't sound like I'm a weirdo. I get it when my place is at its purest. And what I mean by that is like, I haven't been compulsively shopping or being very superficial. I'll get it where I'm in a sort of,

lane where I'm very there's a lot of women around me and they are carrying stuff and I'll just feel it so this woman comes and with the honesty chair you had booked for 15 minutes and you've got chance to meet me and you could ask me anything it could be about it's called naked ambition the product but it could be about your ambition in life or where you're lost or you know those kind of things so this woman had come and she brought her friend and the friend sat down in front to me John was doing the other woman's makeup and she said I don't know why I'm here and I looked her. And I said, how old you? And she said, I'm

44. And I said, you are here because you're married. I don't think you have kids. I think you're going to perimenopause, menopause, and you don't know you are. I think you wake up every day without joy. You're dressing profoundly invisible. You want to be invisible to the world. And she just

started crying. And it was every single thing. She was not. She was married. She did not have children. She had felt she was depressed and she should see a doctor, she was scared to do it. It was all this stuff. And there's a lot of women I meet probably who have a not brilliant GP maybe who then puts them on antidepressants. In fact, it's perimenopausal or early menopause and it's not diagnosed or they don't even choose to go and see a doctor. They just feel this shift in themselves as women and then they end up just not dealing with it and then they get to a place

of totally retreating from the potential of who they can be. But that was that moment, and we had this amazing moment. I mean, literally, I know that day shifted her so much. Because you made it feel seen. Yeah, but it was more than that. It was such, I felt this shift in her. I felt there was a reason why. There was a reason why she came that day,

and there was a reason she sat down that chair because she just needed to totally change something. And so I love that about my work. What are your, obviously this lady came to you for help from you in some way, obviously. What are your non-negotiables? Because obviously you run a business, your parent, you're so busy. Is there anything to start your day, like your non-negotiable daily routine, something that regardless of how busy you are, to keep yourself, give yourself clarity and level out?

It's probably five days out of seven. My non-negotiables are that I do a 22-minute meditation. I do an hour's workout. 22 minutes meditation and I do an hours workout and that is a non-negotiable why 22 minutes is it a specific meditation so there's one of 22 and 25 and there are there two meditation so I did learn Vedic meditation where you have your own mantra and sometimes when my brain is really full not necessarily with negative noddy but just full I can't sit with myself and get into that zone on holiday I will because I'm sort of

chilled and then I'll because when you do Vedic meditation it's like Transcendental meditation and you need to let the mantra like bubble up from the silt in the bottom of lake and come up into your conscious and what I find I'm doing when I'm very midstweek very busy is I say the mantra in my head and you want to get to place where you're not saying it's literally just coming up you know what I there's difference and I sometimes can't get there I'm like too full so I listen to David G on Insight Timer and he does a deep thought meditation then it does a morning meditation that sets you up you set an intention you send out some energy to somebody who's having a bad time you show some gratitude um and it it really sets you up to

kind of get that balance that you need a lot of people in today's world do a manifestation or they do all these different things but i kind of think there's basic principles in life of if you put out to help other somebody it's really important and how do you do that And sometimes there's some mornings, I think, who can I do it to? Other mornings somebody's just told me a friend of mine has cancer. It's really easy, okay. But sometimes you think, okay, is it my friend's daughter who's having a tough time who's 16 who I don't know very well?

Why not? Why not? Let's send out some good energy to her. And then it will be, you know, what's your intention for the day? So my default one is to bring my best self to the day. Things like when I did the shoot with you, I didn't do the medicine. that morning because I wanted to beautify myself before the shoot so I didn't have it and I didn't have time to work out and it was interesting how those two things and then that day you know

it's amazing for me how I've noticed if I do or don't do it I feel like that we were saying if we don't work out you feel how often do you work out I try to do something every day you do that's really yeah in terms of I love strength training and you know functional training And, you know, every day is not the same, but even if I can just do a longer dog walk than usual, that for me is a tick. You know, it doesn't have to be killing yourself every day. Because it's about, I think women are becoming more aware now of training for longevity and quality of life, not just for an aesthetic. Yeah. It used to be, let's train because we've got a wedding or we've got a holiday.

Now it's like, let's train so I can continue to put my own luggage on the plane. I can continue to walk up and down the stairs. Nobody's going to help you with that luggage. No. And I think the shift is happening, isn't it? I think with strength training, for sure. I don't know if it's also, for me, I know it's because of the age I'm at, because I remember my mother at this age. I think when you get to a stage that you remember your parent,

and if your parent wasn't that healthy, you think, I want to be the total. So my mother had osteoporosis, Alzheimer's, Aska, dementia. So there was brain and body, and she was never that mobile. You know, for her doing lots outside, I was playing game tennis. once a week. That was it. So she did not have movement. She never really liked a really long, she'd grown up in Scotland, so she'd love long walks, but she didn't. And I love walking like you. But also, I, when I think of all the things I do now, I think that will help with omniparosis, or this will help with my brain function. Or, you know, I like you, I love

strength training. And I feel, I want, if I physically feel strong, mentally, my strength is so much better. And I love taking my way too heavy suitcase that they haven't really weighed at check-in because I whisked through all my thing and just putting it up. And, you know, I'm so nervous somebody said that looks a bit big or whatever that I have to make it look like it's the weight of a balloon. You know, it's like, get it up. It's really heavy. Shub it in. You know, and the guy goes, can I help me? It's so light, if ever somebody asks to help. And then sometimes, occasionally somebody will go and help and they go, my God, that's so happy. I'm sorry to hear your mother passed away with Alzheimer's. My mother passed away with Alzheimer's too. And I interviewed somebody

for this podcast yesterday, a very well known, I mean physiology expert. Yeah. And she was talking about the link of strength training and warding off Alzheimer's. So it's not just osteoporosis and we all know muscle mass is the sort of panseer of health. But there are there are brain benefits and dementia and Alzheimer's benefits to lifting weights as well. So we absolutely should be. You mentioned that you do 60 minutes of exercise. So what does your typical workout week look like? So Monday is strength training. Tuesday is rocket yoga, which I do with Victoria Woodall from Get the Glass.

And she has been training to do it. And it's a kind of very dynamic yoga. It's a lot of strength in it. And quite, it's not hathot. But occasionally on a Sunday we'll do a spiritual version. So we did the chakras this Sunday. So there was just very simple yoga and then a lot of mindfulness. And then Wednesday I'll do really hardcore strength training.

I mean, for me, hardcore. I used to lift two kilo weights. So now I do sort of 15. I'll have 30 on my stomach. And I carry a mixture of weights. And it's building up those weights and challenging yourself on that. But not, I never want to damage my body as well. Because I think some of you sometimes rush in or they,

so I do get up and I try and move my body path now before I start strength training. So I will do take creatine. So I want to bring some water to the muscle. I'll take some dire light. I'll take some lion's mane. I might do 30 grams of protein in a shake, and then I'm ready to work out. And if I don't do those things before I work out, then I might not have, you know, I haven't eaten anything.

I think that's a bad idea. I think you need to eat a little something before you strength train. And also the creatine has really helped. And also now there's some evidence of brain function with creatin. So I'm throwing that one in too. We're talking about creatine with almost every guest, aren't we? Yeah, the cognitive benefits now are apparently really, really good. I mean, I think people used to link it to it, or you look like a...

I think that's one that people would take, like, you know, five tablespoons. But also micronised creatine I take. The doctor that we mentioned yesterday, I won't say her name, but I think her episode will come out after yours. I said to her, I said, I've been taking creatine, and recently, even though I've not really changed my training much, I've done 10 full press-ups, and I've always struggled with full press-ups. And I said, could that be down to the fact that I've been... taking, creating, and she said it absolutely could. How much you're taking?

I take a teaspoonful, a generous teaspoonful, which I understand is about five grams a day, and I mix it with my protein shake. Oh, you put it in your protein shake, okay. And I have it every morning, or at least six mornings out of seven. I've tried to mix it with, like, a vitamin, you know, a vitamin blend thing, but it's quite chalky, isn't it? I have it in just water. And because it's micronized, it's so fine. and so I have it like that

I didn't I haven't done I think as I sort of think I'm throwing so much into the protein shake I don't want to dilute the benefit of the creatine but I don't know if that's just in my head

I go straight in my mouth in my literally the powder five grams straight in my mouth and then I water do you really my god that's hardcore yeah because you can't taste it because I'm the same as you

where probably might not happen but I think the same as you I don't want to dilute so I just scoot straight in and down I mentioned to the doctor, was it okay, to put it in a protein shake? And she said, yes, what you can't do is put it in a shake and then leave it for longer than five hours. So once you've blended it into something, you have to.

You have to take it. So unlike if you were taking a shake to work, you couldn't put in that kind of shake. Yeah. And she said, you can't put it back in the, you can't write in the fridge or anything. You have to just. But it seems, it seems to be the wonder drug. Yeah. I think it's, you know, whenever there is a one drug, then there'll be some, you know, know downer saying this is not to be used because of X and there was something I read last

week about I was like I you know it's working for me so I'm going there yeah yeah like you I shared with you on our shoot that the women's health audience love your arms remember me telling you I know I just found it a bit weird with your arms what's your secret well I did do I did reformer Pilates for 30 years before I started strength training so I started at 23 and I did it till 53 and then at 53 I started strength training or 50 when was COVID COVID was so 55 I started strength training and I'm now 61 so I think that Pilates does really first of all it really gives you an incredible core but also you're doing reformer and I never did Matt Pilates I always did reformer and you said as well that you want women to look in the mirror and say that I'm

vibrant, I'm alive, I'm here, and I think you're such an incredible role model, and we're all about, like, well, I'm personally pro-aging. I turned 40 recently and everyone was saying to me, oh, what? And I'm like, 40, what you're on about? Like, to me, old age is like maybe 86, 87. Yeah. I genuinely think it's not a big deal for me whatsoever. How do you personally maintain that relationship with yourself that you encourage other women to do? I think that I, I said this thing a couple of years ago, but I just said age is irrelevant. It's about the energy you bring,

and I've always felt it, because I meet lots of women in their 30s who are exhausted. So it's like, okay, how can you get energy back into yourself? I met meet women 38 to 40, who suddenly they've got kids in a different priority in life, and they're exhausted. So it's about getting that sense of energy. And I think energy comes from physically,

all the things we've discussed. I think it comes from how you project yourself in terms of are you in black every day and do you hide from the world or in beige, you know, unless beige happens to be a vest colour or black happens to be a colour, but that sort of, how do you make yourself present in a room because that also is engagement?

And then, you know, what am I putting in my body? I want to look after myself. And how do I stimulate myself to learn things new all the time? Like at the moment I'm quite obsessed with AI, probably more than the rest of 300 people who work in my business, and I am the oldest by 10 years of anyone in my business. and 70% of the people in my business are 25 to 35. So, you know, for me, the way of never feeling away from the epicenter of life

is a really important element to feel how much you are in life. So there is this thing of you, you know, with our phone, we can even, any of us could say, oh, you know, you're doing something slowly, and your kid tests takes out your hand and finishes it. So if ever that happens, look with Laila, give me the phone back, show me how to do it. I want to do it. You know, I don't want to feel that I lose this connection with the beating heart of life. Now, for everyone, the beating heart of life could be very different. It could be your Oxford Don, you know, and you love reading and being caught up in the past, and you don't like the connection. But I love the connection to the most current things that are. So I will take

time to listen to Hoopman podcast, learn about, you know, what he's yacking on about in terms of of new innovation in longevity or in, you know, anything. Mel Robbins, not totally, but more sort of David St. Clair, I listened to a bit, who wrote a book about longevity as well. And there's a weird Russian guy or Eastern European called Dr. Alex, who does a lot of stuff around AI and longevity. So I love learning. And I think that's important.

But there's, going that thing of you saying, I'll live on I-7, I, Zara, this is a really weird one, But Zara did this 50-year anniversary a few weeks ago. And they had these, I think the daughter of the man who owns Zara is very into furniture and architecture, but she did some 50 things. But they were all really interesting things by very, like Norman Foster did a beautiful leather set for an architect. You know, really beautiful leather. Not cheap these things.

But there was a book. And this book is a big, beautiful book. It wasn't Charlotte Rampling. It was somebody else got to sign it. And it went the next 50 years. and I thought I'm 61, I'll buy it because I'll die at 110. And I had that thought, I have that thought, that's how I see in my life. You know, so if I want to die at 110, I've got another 50 years.

So how well do I have to look after myself to do that? So, you know, there's little things like HRT. HRT is, I'm still always staggered by the lack of great education amongst the broader medical community to understand overall benefits of HRT because years ago in early 2000 there was a report of the negative aspects of it and there were still women who think that report is true.

You know, if we were living in the 50s or 30s or 1510s but the role of a woman would have been get to an age you can breed, breed then when you can't breed anymore decline to death. I've just been really severe here

but that was like that sense is you know the fact that we have a cycle it starts at 1314 and it stops at sort of 45 to 58 then your body doesn't have hormones and you have hormone receptors for each gen progester and testosterone in every part of our body and then a doctor says well you know let's see you have a hysterectomy no you don't need it because you're you're you're not reducing anymore but it's like sorry we have hormone receptors all over our body you know so I find hormones are so profoundly important for my longevity and I look at it that way too so when I look at HRT which I'm fortunate enough that I can take it properly and not alternative I will take that till I'm nailed in a coffin you know because these are things that help me with every aspect of my body we just spoke to Dr Zoe Williams didn't we and she said with AI the medic she said with AI now over the next 30 years medicine

is going to rapidly increase in a positive way And she actually said, in generations, they'll be living to what? Did you say 120? She said 150. When? In how many years? People being born now. We'll live to 150.

She said, she said, due to AI and medicine, she said the changes that are coming because of it are profound. And, I mean, my little boys, too. I don't think I'd want him to live to 150 without me. But the thing is, yeah, but your perspective of, oh, to live to 150 without you. That's interesting because there will be this generation. where it will be out of kilter. It's like at the moment my daughter and myself, we are in this apex of pre-AI and post-A-I,

your little boy will grow up in an AI world fully. And it's so interesting the difference in then how he will view life and act in life compared to you. Or my daughter is 21 or me. You've mentioned that you're obsessed with AI, so am I, and I use it a lot in everyday life. Is there any health tech or treatments that you've engaged in that you've been very impressed with

that you think truly make a difference? Health prevention as opposed to treating existing conditions is something that's accelerated by technology in general. So the neuroscans and all these different kind of things where they will look at what are the markers for preventative medicine and they created a scan that you have. It's outside the National Health Service. but if you're thinking, oh, I wouldn't mind just an intro into where my body's at?

You know, are all these weird marks on my body? Should I check if they are skin cell? I have a friend of mine right now who will die in the next month from skin cancer. You know, there are things that we don't notice and we don't notice too late. So inflammation in our body is early indicators. I'm not a doctor, but this is just from, I'm obsessed about it. But I think the advancement in technology, which includes AI, to enable to bring to a broader set of people

the opportunity to take control of their health is really important. Instead of waiting on a list to see a GP or using our NHS to wait months and months for something where we then might be sent in a totally different direction. And it's really challenging because we have all a set amount per month we can spend and there is a belief that the NHS

to work for every single person in the UK. UK and it's unbelievably stretched so obviously you've got to put at the top of the game things that are life-threatening but it does mean that the idea of where we could get to like I love the idea of sugar tax I love the idea of sugar tax and it's the one thing that when we look at what's happening in America and there's a mit some you know it's like a you're kind of really every single day but the idea that the two inches a sugar tax and I heard it and I don't even know if it happened but I thought Wow, how great, because inflammation is such a bad thing in our body and sugar in that kind of process sugar way that we're talking is the beginning of inflammation. Imagine if you could eradicate that element of the cause of information, how much it would help the NHS as well, because they would not be dealing with lots of things that that turns into as illnesses later. You know, there's certain things you look at and you think that singular thing could transform so much on so many levels. the more that we can use AI and use it to get data, to get stats, to really present, look, I can go through every record of everything and present you this information and you can make more, you know, informed decisions. It's like when these, how they sell cigarettes, they sometimes have a, well, they all have a picture on the cigarette packet, don't they? Of someone with tubes or the teeth or the gums rot in. Even they did that with sugar products.

Even that might make people think, you know, you'd sell in all these chocolate bars if you looked at them what they're actually doing. But also, do you think the price of cigarettes has made people buy less? Yes, and I think a sugar tax is a similar concept. It's saying make it expensive so that it's harder to buy. And then what's the alternative somebody might then buy? And maybe it's going to be less harmful for them. It's difficult. I just, you know, it's very difficult because smoking is something where that, I think, has worked to an extent, but then everyone started vaping.

And we don't know yet the damage of vaping. I don't want to be like a depressing conversation here, but I look at, you know, I occasionally have had a cigarette. You know, on and off. I smoked a lot in my 20s. I stopped in all of my 30s. I started a bit in 540s. I stopped in my 50s.

It's challenging when I look at my daughter and I see, you know, her vaping a lot. And I think I don't know what that's doing to her. Like if I had two cigarettes a day, I kind of know it wouldn't kill me. You know, but the amount she vapes, I think, I don't know those chemicals going in your body and what they're doing to you. And then I read things. This is when we can go down a rabbit hole. But recently a man in America, who's a professor, came out and said, I've done a really big research on vaping. And it was a really uncomfortable reading report because it was about the profound damage on the lungs of adolescents. And that he had actually saw one or two deaths that he felt were directs out of vaping.

And this is only one man's you, who is a professor, and it was the first time I read it, but it made me worry. You know, I just thought, you know, that's... And it's hard when they're 21, because... Impossible, because my daughter would turn to me and go, Mommy, at least I wasn't doing lines of cocaine, aren't you relieved? Yeah. You know, and that's... When she asked that comeback, I'm like, I haven't got a comeback from that. You know, I have not got a comeback.

Oh, yeah, but you don't know how much damage, as you say, the vaping is doing to her. Yeah. Cocaine might be doing to someone. You don't know. Because you were in recovery in your 20s. You're now in your early 60s. What would young Trinney think of where Trinney has gotten to? I think that young Trinney didn't think further than the week ahead.

And I just do feel that if I look at Lila and, you know, if I look at in that time and if we remember we were in that time, did we really think beyond six months? No. No. Never. Did I think beyond three months or even the next Saturday? not particularly. It's not like we don't live in the now, now, and I think it's really good. Like, I made a decision after I had some stuff happen when I was 60, 50, that I wouldn't live in the past ever.

So I'd live in now and the future. So I don't choose, it was a very conscious decision to live in the past. And it was a decision I did at the time to protect myself because I had painful things. I didn't want to have affecting my day. So it was kind of a protective mechanism. And then 10 years after that, I left a relationship and I was in my new home. First night alone, my daughter was away. First night in 30 years, I'd been on my own in a home, okay, at night. Because I was always either leaving with Susanna to work in a relationship with my husband where I worked more than him or with Lila.

And if I went away to work, somebody was looking off Lila in the home. So I had, actually, and also in my relationship of 10 years, I traveled a lot more than him. So he never was not at home. So there I was, first time, on my own at home, not feeling like I'm scared to be on my own, but giving my space, my brain space to think. And I thought for the first time the things I missed about my husband who had died, who I had just to protect myself, I didn't think of that much about my past with him for years. And it allowed me, but it took years to heal.

Anyone who's lost somebody in difficult circumstance, it takes years to heal that. but I do then now look back just at things that are fond of memories you know and then and otherwise it's really the now and the future because I find that the most exciting I read a quote my my dad passed away when I was young so I was how old are you I was 17 when you did it was I kind of felt I didn't think how would I how will I go on now without my dad you assume they're always going to be there and then I went through stages of being really angry at him, even though it wasn't his fault he had a hard stack, but I was thinking, how dare you leave was like this, you know? And then it definitely

shaped my relationship with my future partners, for sure. Of what, just that wanting to have him back in your life in some part of that? Wanting his, like he met one of my boyfriends in school, my high school boyfriend. And I always used to think with any guy who I dated, I wonder if my dad had approved. I wonder if he'd like him, because I always wanted that. seal of approval type thing but i read a quote that said those who live in the past often live with a lot of sadness because it's gone it can't be changed it's happened those who live in the future live with a lot of anxiety because they're wondering will it happen those who live in the now live in peace because it is just now and that's what i kind of approach with my dad and my mom was

brilliant and she just said we can't change it so rather than it cloud your thoughts 24-7 that's just going to make you sad. Occasionally, when he pops in your head, it'll be for something good, and it'll be something that you'll laugh about, and that's what it is now. But it's the same thing as you is it takes time, and you have to ride the waves of grief, but not let it consume you. Yeah, exactly. But it definitely takes time to get there.

Yeah. 100%. Before we close, Trinney, and it's been absolutely wonderful having here today, and I'm so thrilled that you are on the December cover of Women's Health, which has gone on sale today, the same day that this podcast. Christmas cover. I've got to say I felt like when it was suggested

and I was like, wow, that's cool. Yeah, I did feel that. It's amazing. It's a Christmas cover. It was a cool. And I love the shoot. I love the styling. It looked super cool.

But before we finish, we have some quick fire questions that we ask all our guests, just a bit of fun. So Gemma and I have invited ourselves to your house for dinner, if you don't mind. Lovely. So we'd love to know what you're cooking us.

I'm not cooking because I am a shit cook. So there will be no food on the table or there will be a nice delivery. Or if it's a very special evening, I will get somebody in to do some cooking. But I cannot cook at all. I can do a phenomenal omelet if you happen to be in my little cozy house in France and salad.

I can bring ingredients together and make them friends. but my daughter is a really good cook and my stepson is a really good cook and my lodger right now is a really good cook chosen on purpose we've got someone cooking for us but it's not going to be you no it's not but what would you ask them to cook for us oh that's another question because I love food

so my classic easy dinner party menu is a really good mozzarella barata okay really like falling apart tomatoes that smell of tomato with some lovely fresh band and a dressing. Actually, I make a very good dressing, and I always put horseradish sauce in the dressing with lemon, with lemon, olive oil, honey, agave, it's just kind of mixture of things. So drizzling on top. So that's like the most delicious bread, but it will be a relatively healthy bread, but delicious

bread. And then it could be chicken Marbea, which is chicken with olives and prunes in the oven, which is really yummy. It could be a delicious lasagna, which will have a very, a lot of Bishmal sauce and then a really nice rocket salad, but pudding is my favourite. Actually, I have made this in the past and I've shown somebody how to make it and unfortunately they made it in the other day. I had Susanna Rover for dinner and I forgot it was in the oven and I brought out this burnt thing about two and a half hours later because they refused to leave. But it's pear and banana crumble and my sort of trick of it is I take got to be, cannot be fresh pairs, it has to be tinned pears and then banana and then the crumble is digestive. It mixed with a flour.

Oh, that sounds nice. And then sort of brown sugar, muscovard sugar on the top. And it gets really crispy on the top. And then underneath you have this pear and banana just making the nicest taste together. And then I do it with custard. So you talk like someone who should be able to cook. You should be able to cook. I like to eat. I like how you pair, you make your food's friends like you do your clothes. Yeah. I like that. There's got to be friends. Yeah. So we're sending you to a Desert Island for a year and you can only take one item, what would it be? That's all wrong. I mean, I'll take SBF, but I mean, am I clothed when you're sending me there?

We haven't given it that much thought. Okay, fine. All right. If I'm closed, I will take SPF 50, and that's all our work. Because I just want to, you know, if women only ever did that, they would have to buy hardly any skincare products as they aged. But if a woman from, and I'm saying, a girl from 13, wore an SBF 50 every day, by the time she's 50, she's hardly having to put things on her face. I mean, it's like, it's the best thing.

Otherwise, it's wrong. It took me, a skirt, a dress, it can be a, it can be everything. What's the last thing that made you belly laugh? My steps on sending me this morning, because I have a mouse infestation in my house. They're so braytent now that they come out and they look at us. It's not like they scuttle, they look at us. So it is an infestation. And then my, Zach, send me this picture. It's like, of a, of a guy at night, who had a cat, and he'd obviously put a, you know when you have the S-A-S and they'd photograph you at night, you know when they use the goggles that you can see. So it's that kind of imagery.

And he's sleeping, snoring with his mouse open. And the cat comes and puts a dead mouse in his mouth. Oh, wow. I mean, it was that mixture of, ugh. But I was a belly laugh because we're all obsessed with mice at the moment. So you're going to go to bed tonight with a dark mouse on your mouth. Coffee or wine? Coffee.

Coffee. And I'm obsessed with really good coffee. We're coffee girls. Yeah. What's one thing people listening or watching today can do to make themselves feel a little bit better? There's a weird one that Katie Brindle taught me during lockdown when we were all feeling a bit blue. So you can either jump up and down for a minute and do bunny hops, which is like when you let your body go and you're just like, you'll jump me up and down without any tension.

I make audiences do this. If I'm speaking and the person who was speaking before me has been after lunch and then they're tired, I make them all stand up and do bunny hops and I ask people if you need to go to Lou, please sit down. But it's a really good one because energize your body. So I love that. But otherwise, being by yourself and making yourself laugh continuously for a minute, which is something Katie Brendel taught me from,

who's a Chinese acupunctrists and does some things. And it's really weird. And you laugh, laughs. And then I did it during COVID with people live. You know, there was a thousand of us compulsively laughing in our homes where the people around, the foresting, what is going on? And you, after a minute, you change your whole energy

and you just think because you've been smiling when you laugh for a full minute which we don't always do and you change everything you change totally how you feel let's just do it now for a minute we just do it now for a minute

because it's like when you do it it feels very self-conscious but we're going to somebody time us everyone else who's watching just like just tell anyone around you if you're in an office go in the loo but if you're like wherever you are we're going to do it and

we're going to do it but we're going to we might have to move around because after a while it's weird But are you ready? Yeah. Come on. You can't. You can't.

You can't. What are you? You're so funny. You stop, you're so good. Oh, you're still going. Oh, my. Ha! Ha!

Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! I don't know what I'm going to be quite a lot of breath. I actually feel quite out of breath. It's so exhorting. I feel quite...

But it leaves this tingle in your body, okay. And now we can't stop laughing. I think it does something... It's like your hum... It's like that. It's the type of... It's the vagus nerve, I think, isn't it? It's that vibration.

Them in the office, we're all shitting themselves. What is going on with that one, isn't it? I kind of... I love that one. And that's something that I do do. And then I do another... I do a meditation, which gives me energy. This is the audience participation.

part of the show. Okay. So if anyone's feeling like really tired, all right, and they're just like they got no energy. So you're going to have in front of you, your hands are going to be as if they're holding a little ball. It's like the size of a very big tennis ball, all right? And it starts off small so your hands can cup it and then you go round with your hands all the way around this ball. All right. So you're kind of feeling this ball and this ball is golden and you feel it. Imagine it's in your hands, so how your hands would go round it is they couldn't go through it. You're turning this ball upside down. Close your eyes now.

Close your eyes when you do this. And feel this ball. And this ball is like a throbbing piece of the sun. It's so, it's vibrating. It's like raw energy. But it's a ball. And you've got it in palm of your hands. And that ball is getting a little bit bigger because it's so vibrating now that you can begin to feel

as you turn, keep turning that ball, keep to feel the light from that ball, and you will begin to feel in your fingers some energy. A little tingling sensation is in your fingers, and you keep going round with that ball, and then you get that ball, and that ball is like an optimum peak of energy, and you push it in your heart, push it in your heart now, and feel your body has taken all that energy, and now feel your fingers, and just feel that little tingle, because it's there because we have inside us energy and sometimes it's low and sometimes it's high

and that is we need to remind it and we need to kind of get it and I think always I can get it through my fingers so if I get it to my fingers and I make that ball grow shove it back inside me I reset so I do that too so I do that too yeah because you love all the crystals

and all I'm into grounding mats grounding mats I'm not there yet I have one in a box at home but do you put it on your bed? Yeah, so I just put it under my fitted sheet. You do, and you really feel it's made difference. The first few nights, I was like pins and needles, and I was first on it. Really?

I was like, oh, okay. And then I had some plant sophaciitis in my heel, so obviously inflammation. I just stood on it, stood on my bed. Yeah. And I felt, again, in that area alone. My God. And, I mean, your body does get used to it, but I love mine. Okay.

Could be a placebo thing, but I'll have that. I don't know if there's something, because it is, energy you're bringing to your beds with the electricity side, I don't know. But you're sceptical or not? I wouldn't say sceptical, but crystals

I can't get on board with. I believe I have a garden angel. I think I've admitted that. This is interesting, you know, you've gone from, I was thinking, very strict, very open, and now you're saying you have a guardian angel. That's really, like, that's believing

in a power that you cannot see. So you tell us about your guardian angel. I believe it's my grandmother. Yeah. and I fervently believe she is with me all the time and I believe she has helped me through life and has gotten me out of scrapes that should have destroyed me where I've actually made me stronger

and I believe I am as successful as I am in spite of my upbringing, where I'm from, you know, it's not usual for someone with my background to have achieved what I have and I truly believe that's because my guardian angel grandmother is with me helping me guide my way and I am not very woo-woo at all

but that is one thing that I do believe in. That's nice. It's really nice. You're much more into the alternative and the woo-woo side than I am but the more time we spend together though my motto in life to do what Jemma does so actually

people are getting these tips of things and the grounding mat I am going to try now. The sage is good. I've had sometimes There's people who've come into my space and I felt the badness of their energy. And when they leave, I light sage and I clean the space. You know, there's people that we meet, we gravitate towards and they have a sort of open energy. And then there's people who are not what they seem. And those people, I'm always skeptical.

And I'm thinking, what is it? Why are you hiding something? Well, I call them dementers. You know, demented in Harry Potter where they sack the life out. Yes. I believe in life you meet people. all them deventors that they suck the life out of a room. So you're right, that's bad energy.

You can sense that in a person. Oh, there can be a radiator in the energy, yeah. We should wrap things out. Yeah, we should wrap. Otherwise we'll be actually having to call it a different name. Yes. It'll be meditation with Trinion just as well. Thank you so much for joining us, though.

It's been really lovely. Yeah, I've so enjoyed it. And you're going to go back to bed. Yeah. For anyone listening who joined the meditation, so I hope you feel better. Thank you. Thank you.