KGCI: Real Estate on Air - Creating Financial Freedom One Rental at a Time

Episode Date: May 2, 2024

Welcome, everyone. This is the abundant investor podcast, and we are Beth and Christine, your host. We are here to show you how you can live your rich life right now with the power of an abundance mindset and tools the wealthy have used for years that are accessible to the rest of us, things like real estate investing and using the powerful benefits of life insurance. We're so glad you're here. Now let's dive in. Welcome back to the abundant investor podcast, everybody. I'm your host, Beth Rooney. and I am so thrilled with our guests today. Today we have Rachel Swanson.

She's a best-selling Christian author turned real estate investor beginning in 2021 and acquiring 20 doors in her first year. She traded her stressful 80-plus hours per week, author and online coaching business for a more flexible part-time real estate investing business gaining time and financial freedom, tripling her income in less than 12 months in all well balancing her marriage and motherhood with wannabe triplets.

Her goal is to help others see the value of real estate investing as a solid foundation for future wealth building and true time freedom for bigger impact. We are so thrilled to have Rachel here today with us. She is also a colleague of ours here at EXP in part of the amazing powerhouse group of agents. So without further ado, please join me in welcoming. Rachel Swanson to the abundant investor podcast. Hello, everyone. Welcome back to today's podcast. This is Christine Fisk. I'm here with my co-host,

Beth Rooney, and today we have a special guest, Rachel Swanson. Rachel, it is so great to have you on the podcast. We've connected. We've been in touch. And you've got a really fascinating story, especially for the investors, but also the agents out there. And I'm super excited to dive in and talk to you more about it. Absolutely. Excited to be here. Terrific. So we met, we didn't, we met online through Instagram. We found you on Instagram many months ago. We loved what you were doing. And I personally could relate to a lot of it because we've been on a short term, mostly short term rental investment journey as well. So I saw what you were doing. I loved it. Love your energy. You have quite a following on Instagram. And we thought it was just really so fascinating to what.

watch you really dive into your real estate investing work full time. And it's great because you really show people behind the scenes, but you talk about your story and why you're doing it and what your mission is. And I've been to where you live coincidentally. So I happen to know the area that you invest in now. So that's fun too, because I can really put myself there. And I always thought that market was really interesting. So can you just tell us a little bit about your journey in real estate investing and how you came to where you are today. Yeah. So, I mean, it really kind of starts from being accidentally brought into real estate investing. Really at the time, we were, we were in Idaho at the time, actually, and we were trying to sell our house, and it wouldn't sell. And so, and it was super weird

because it was a good market. This was like 2019, I want to say. And there was like no reason why it shouldn't have sold, everybody loved it. And so then at that point, we thought, okay, well, you know, we had all this equity in it and we thought, well, maybe there's a way we can hold on to it, pull the money out and put it down on this next house that we're trying to buy and rent it. And so we did just that. And then the new house that we bought, we actually bought it with the intention. It had a finished walkout basement. And there was a family that we just kind of knew. They needed a place to land for a little bit. They were in a art. RV really nice, sweet family. And this was Idaho where, you know, it was November and winter's

like approached and it's freezing and it's cold. And it's not very much fun to be in a trailer in November in Idaho. And so, you know, we gave them, you know, a pretty decent little rate to rent out the bottom part of our basement. And at the same time, he was a contractor. So he helped kind of renovate some of the things in our house as well. So it was really like a nice little relationship there. And for the next year, between the two of those, even after, you know, the little bit of extra with the additional mortgage and things like that, we were making, you know, an extra $1,500 a month. And I thought, wow, this is really pretty nice, you know, and not a lot of work. And that's when I started to dig into what is real estate investing really about? And so I started reading tons and tons of books and I just got obsessed, like,

ultimately obsessed with it to the point of it was just like, oh my gosh. But then I started to really open my eyes to the world of, oh, my gosh, this could really change our life. And so my husband, you know, he had always been the kind of the main breadwinner of the family. And, you know, he was working on trying to figure himself out. He was having some burnout and just not feeling us fulfilled in his work and his role, but he really had a knack for taking real estate projects or things. He's very handy and bringing them to life.

So, you know, I could see the combination where I could help manage, you know, the back-end stuff or do marketing. I'm a lot better at marketing and those sorts of things. And he would be really great at, you know, lightly fixing up properties. He can do paint. He can, you know, do repairs and we could even manage some locally. And so that kind of started our journey of, okay, let's see if we can acquire a couple. And yeah, so we started to do just that.

I would say the big strategy that we used was, and I guess we can get into this later, but was, you know, capitalizing on some of existing equity, as well as we actually have used our 401K, which a lot of people think is a no-no, but we've used that to invest in real estate. And it's really been life-changing. And then from there, we continue to move forward into various projects. So initially it was long-term rentals because that's what we were familiar with. And then we took on a pretty unique project where it was a nine-bedroom assisted living home, which we turned into like a co-living community, which is basically where people rent by the room.

And it was a really great win because in this market, you know, you could really lower the cost of what it actually would cost somebody to rent like a one-bedger apartment because it was harder for some people to do that. But for us, it was even better because renting them all each by the room. whom increased the gross rents significantly more than if we just rented it out as like a house or divided it up. So we we did that and it increased the value of that property so much. And as we continue to move forward, we started diving into midterm rentals and having nurses come and furnishing them and then even into short term rentals, which is when we moved also to Texas and kind of capitalized on the market here as well as in an existing market elsewhere. It kind of just blew up from there to where now, you know, my husband, he retired from his job last March.

And it's just been awesome. Like it's been a journey. It's been a little bit like, whoa, this is crazy. But it's also been such a huge blessing and one that, you know, I wouldn't trade for anything. Oh, that's so great. What a great story. Now, I have a question. Yeah.

You know, so that's a big leap, right? You're taking that leap. like you're trusting yourself, your husband's trusting himself. Tell us a little bit about your mindset in making that big shift. Like what propelled you to make that? What gave you the strength to have that trust in yourself to do this? Yeah. Are you talking about the initial leap into real estate investing more from my husband quitting his job? A little bit of both. It's not been that much time for either one. So it's this long period of time. For sure. I would say like the initial leap was really out of necessity to find something that I could do as a mom to three young children.

I wanted something that was flexible, something that wasn't going to take all of my time and energy. And, you know, being, so my background was actually, well, I've had several backgrounds, but my background previous to real estate investing, I was doing online coaching as well as I was author and writer and I wrote books and and launched those and some even came you know one became a national bestseller and so with all that said even though there was a lot of titles to that there was not as much income as you would normally think that comes from those types of things and it was exhausting I had to be on line all the time I was working like 80 plus hours and it really wasn't

as flexible nor as profitable as I thought it would be and so when 2020 hit it just kind of tanked our business. It completely shut things down. Publishers were not publishing any more books. All my speak engagements that I had packed in for that year. All got canceled. And so it really was this, this pivot. And it was kind of an unexpected blessing where just before that, like a few months before that that's when we first got our, our first, you know, rentals. And that really just kind of carried us. That extra like 1500. It was really tight at that time, but it carried us through. And then I thought, wow, like there's there is something to this. And I did start to, I was still figuring out my risk factors, right? And so I was, I still had a few different other side businesses that I was pursuing

at the time. And I continued to cultivate each one of them until it was very clear that real estate investing was the best, had the most potential and just the most likelihood of achieving what I want to have. And so then I went all in on that. And I think it was that decision of just, you know, once you kind of start to experience it and see it and you see how it starts to grow and how steady it can be, yeah, then I realized, okay, this is the thing that that is truly better than any of the other things that I've, I've been dabbling into and I really do need to give it my focus. So there was that. And then once I did that, I really felt like it was nice because I wasn't dividing my attention into so many different things.

I could really hone in on the aspects of real estate investing, especially the things that I was really good at. And even though my husband was still working at the time, it was a joint effort. Like he did have to put in some energy and such for some things and maintenance and all that. But still, even then, I was very, very mindful of I do not want to be pushing myself to where I'm going to get burnt out. I worked within my hours.

I literally worked like 25 hours a week and that was it because it was between the times that I dropped my kids off for school and I had to go pick them up and I was like, okay, this is it. And so, you know, a couple times, sometimes I'd have to run out in the evening to, you know, get a tenant from, you know, being locked out or whatever and we'd have a few of those things. But overall, that's when I worked it. And yeah, it just was amazing to see just how really God blessed that. And then with my husband, it was actually, you know, we were making enough at that time where we thought, okay, we can probably do this. We did have savings. So we weren't being totally naive. And I do think that's really important. I don't think you should just quit cold turkey

and not have any savings or I definitely don't think you should do cold turkey if you have absolutely no rental income coming in. You know, that's a, that's a way to have to run back to your W2 job sooner than you probably like. So at that time, there was, was, you know, this cost-benefit analysis, actually, too, because we knew when we came here and we were looking at the projects that we were going to be acquiring. When you say here, just for a second, do you mean Texas? Montgomery, Texas, yeah, in Texas. So when we came here, because we moved here about a little over a year ago, we saw some of

these potential projects and rental properties that needed some fixing up, but would be great properties. And while we could hire out everything with a contractor, the area of my husband really adds value as well as just comes alive is through working with contractors himself and doing that work. And you found one that's just been fabulous to work with here where he can work alongside him. He has his kind of role and then we give the contractor his jobs and it's worked out really well. And so it got to that point where we thought, you know, also my husband's mental health was more important than him just staying in that job. And yeah, we felt like,

you know what, at this point, I think we can just step off. and launch into this. And I'm so glad we did. While it has has its ups and downs over the last, you know, 12 months, I would have to say easily like it's been the best decision that we made. And he really added all that value. And yeah, and again, you know, you're going to have those unexpecteds that pop up, trust me. But that's what that emergency fund, that cushion is for. And it's been helpful. Right, right. That's awesome. And I can hear from just your voice and your energy that this is something that is fulfilling to you both. And I know from watching you online that you enjoy working together and that it's been really fulfilling for you to be able to kind of craft your work

and the rest of your life all together in the way that feels good to everyone in your family, I'm sure. Yeah, we do. And just looking from, you know, from your Instagram, it looks like you have about $4 million in assets and real estate assets. And how many properties is that in How many properties do you own? I know you have long term, eight term and short term. Right. And I don't know why I always forget.

I think because we've sold a few and bought a few and we keep like changing things around. I believe that is eight. Yep. Total. Yep. Yeah. I think it's eight. And I know for a lot of people listening,

there either some people are already investing in real estate and a lot of people are thinking about it and are unsure about where the money comes from. And you talked a little bit about. how you funded your first few properties. Could we just dig into that a little bit? Would you mind sharing? Yeah. Would you be open to sharing with us? 100%. Yeah. A bit more about how you made these financing decisions once you purchased that when you were still in Idaho, when you really got into investing once you made that purchase of that. Was it the nine-bedroom facility? Yes. Yes. So I think you have to kind of go back because everybody's always like, how in the world do you start investing like hundreds

and thousands of dollars into real estate investing. And truly, I almost have to feel, I feel like it's kind of cheating to say I did this in, you know, three, four years because there was a significant choice we made back in 2012 when we invested in our personal primary house. We did a 3.5% FHA loan, scrounged up $17,500 somewhere around there, felt like so much money at the time. And we had this huge payment it felt like at the time, but, you know, something that we were like, okay, I think, you know, we can, we could, we should be able to afford this, but it just felt like a lot. And we did that. And in six years, that property, now I know 2012 is a little different because that was definitely at a lower part of the market too. But in six years, you know,

that increased in equity by about $225,000. And so that money was really what gave us, you know, the ability to take that money over Idaho into our another primary, and then we can continue to split that out and use that to build, you know, our portfolio. We have also just, you know, we have like 45,000 in savings at one point, and we're like, okay, let's just put this in a property. Like, I feel like this is more, you know, this is what we should do while still having a little bit of emergency fund, but we thought, you know what, let's do this. And sure enough, we did that. It was with a property that was barely cash-flowing, you guys.

Like, this is not like a home run property. It was like a falling apart 1920s, craftsman-style house. You know, like just whatever. But we rented it. It worked out. Thankfully, like no major things happened during that time. And in two years, we doubled that where we made like $89,000 at the sale of that one. You know, so it doubled our equity in just a few years. And so we also have taken, you know, the money. from a little bit recently more. So in the last year, year and a half, from our 401K. And while we've taken, you know, there is a 10% penalty, but I don't think people realize that, you know,

they think there's more penalties than that. And really, no matter what, even when you get, and again, let me just state this, I'm not a financial advisor. I'm not saying legal advice and please go talk to your CPA. Don't come back at me. But from my personal understanding, in my opinion, is that, you know, when you get to whatever 65, 69 and you pull it out, it's still taxed as regular income. And so it's not like you'll never be taxed on that. It still would be taxed if you

pull that out. So the only real like downside is that 10%, but when we've calculated and analyzed deals that we are going to be investing this money into, we're talking like getting 30 to 300% returns and that well overtakes, you know, the 10% that it takes out. And so for us, it's been worth taking that money out so that not only do we receive better returns and growth on our money based off of the real estate investing we're doing, we also get the cash flow income now that we can live off of, as well as depreciation, which is a whole other category with like owning real estate, reduces your taxable income. There's just so many more better. benefits that we've experienced with that, as well as just life-changing things where we can live

right now in our 40s, just our 40 this past, or last year. And we can already be in this place of like being semi-retired, so to speak, where we can have that flexibility. We have the income. You know, things have just really changed for the better. So those are all the ways that we've scaled. And again, a lot of it has been just being really smart with our purchases in appreciating markets and using that equity and making sure we're putting it on properties where, you know, it's not only going to cover itself plus that extra payment, you know, those extra payments that might make it go up. Because we did do that with that one nine unit property. We pulled out a significant portion of equity out of our home and our payments went up by $800 a month.

And everybody's like, oh my gosh, you know, why would you do that? Like an extra $800. Well, we were making on the other side, $3,000 a month extra. Like that's after all expenses. So if you do the math, you're still ahead. And so that's the whole beauty of it is looking and seeing, okay, what is the math day? You know, what are also my exit strategies in case this doesn't work out?

And we always ruled and factored those things in. And to us, we're like, okay, this is, you know, it lines up. It's worth it. Let's do this. So, and that's what got us to where we are now today. I love it. I love it. Makes so much sense, yeah. And so another thing we noticed is that you recently got your real estate license and got

into working for E XP and take us a little bit through that decision-making process and how that's gone for you. Yeah. You know, it's so funny because initially the reason I got my real estate license is actually not why I'm exactly using it now. But it's been good. I feel like it was a process and it's still like it's actually there's things that are even better about it. But, you know, again, real estate investing, you do not have to have your real estate license to invest. And I think that's a lot, a lot of people still continue to think that, that you have to have your real estate license.

No, for the last 20 transactions that I've had before, you know, before having my license, I used it out of the realtors, you know, and I was fine paying their fees because they were great. Like, they helped me through the process. They helped me learn. They made sure that I didn't make major mistakes. They helped me factor in some negotiations, which I didn't really understand. at the time. But now, you know, after going through that so many times and now being a realtor myself, I understand those contractual obligations or differences or things that you can ask for. And I felt like, you know, it would be useful to now have my real estate license because I really want to capitalize on the market I'm in and be buying some myself as well as helping others. And the initial,

the reason was I wanted to, in Texas, you know, start and kind of launch a short-term rental management company business. And while it's still not off the table, I realized there was a lot more complexities than that, as well as even within EXP itself. And I've talked to my mentor about that, who's in EXP. And so it's definitely not off the table, but it was one of those, you know, maybe I don't need to do this. And maybe this is like a little bit more of a liability than I anticipated. And so now it's kind of become my shift of like, okay, you know, where can I help others then through this? And it's just been through, I mean, so many now people, when I'm sharing, about some of the properties that I've even acquired just in the last year and just sharing the

numbers and how great they've been. So many people are like, hey, can you find me, can you find me one too? Can I use you? So it's been great. And I've already have like at least eight or nine investors I'm working with right now, two or three out of state, people just looking for their primary home. And so now just working on helping others with my experience has been really good. Because I think one thing that's that's harder to find out there, I think, is investor-friendly agents. And so they're not the theme of like a primary home agent. And I can share this because, and again, it's not like, it's not a downside or anything as far as if you're, you know, like agent has its own niche. But for example, I was working on connecting with this. There's this one property that has

great investing potential. And I'm talking to the agent. And it's very clear. that she has no experience with, like, investors, like, as far as an investor, she doesn't have that mindset. And again, that's fine, but, like, it's hard to talk to her through this investment side of things and looking at this as investment property because even the things that I'm explaining to her to share to the, her client, and she's sharing that, but then the client's responses back, you can tell the client doesn't really understand what we're talking about. And the agent isn't really, she doesn't understand it either. So she's just, you know, she's just, you know, just kind of there like passing messages back and forth. And it would be so much more helpful.

I think even to that client, if she had somebody who was more investor savvy and they could help explain things to her and help her understand what we're also trying to share and negotiate with. So with that said, I mean, I do think it's been interesting and fun to see where God's leading in this. But, you know, definitely the investor relationship side of my real estate license, that's where I feel like it's coming into play now. It's so apparent, Rachel, how you're able to support. other investors, not just through knowing the lingo and walking them through properties and looking for things that an investor would look for, but also you're an inspiration because you're here you are doing it yourself. And especially for women, right? Like, let's talk about

that for a second. I think, you know, women, someone made a comment about this. Maybe it was, I think it might have been Go-Go, we were talking to, like, we are the ones making so many decisions about the homes. We are buying homes. We're helping people buy homes as real estate agents. We have so much insider information. It only makes sense that we as women are investing in property. 100%. Yeah. I think I just feel like, I mean, and I feel like there's definitely some men that can do that as well, you know, well, but that's just not something as well that my husband has as much of a strength in. And you're right. Like we just, as women can see certain things differently than men do when it comes to properties. And so being able to have to,

on that can be really helpful. We're generalizing, of course, but I think... Yeah. Not everyone, of course. But I think for a lot of us, and I do think it's really women's time to rise and shine in this industry. So it's super exciting, and I'm excited for you and that you get to inspire so many women. And I just want to go back to something you talked about before, because I think this is a question that comes up with people that we are coaching and we're talking to about investing,

is you really leveraged equity that you already had. So we have, you know, so many of us, not everyone, but so many of us have this asset that we're literally sitting in that we don't realize is leverageable to create a wealthier foundation, to create more wealth for ourselves. And, you know, there's, I think there's a couple things at play. I think there's a general, some messages around debt that aren't so, favorable, right? That there are some schools of thought around that that you can or cannot

subscribe to. And I think for women, we're always trying to do the right thing and follow the rules a lot of the time. And I think that there's so many opportunities to learn about creative financing and different ways to use money. And like you said, you have $2,000, $25,000 in equity that you were sitting on. And you just said, hey, like, what do we do with this? Like, we could go invest and you'd read all the books. That's exactly how I got started in real estate. I took out a HELOC on my primary residence. I had a bunch of equity in it. And I didn't know it at the time. I took out the HELOC because the rates were great. And I said, who knows what I meant I need this for? And then I realized I wanted a house at the beach. And one thing leads to another. And then you

realize you can leverage equity in the first investment property to go buy the second investment property. Right. And so I think if you're sitting on the outside and you don't have a lot of experience, you could say, oh my gosh, like Rachel built this real estate empire. And I knew her when she didn't have any real estate. And all of a sudden she's got all this real estate. She's really been like what happened, right? Yeah. Yeah.

And yeah, sitting here, we're actually in a time where there are a huge percentage. I feel like I remember reading statistic. It was somewhere like over 75% of homeowners right now are sitting on. hundreds of thousands of dollars of equity. And, you know, it's never been a better time, actually, in some ways, because you have so much of this equity, you can go and use and deploy to make even more, you know, money, make, make more wealth, make wise decisions to help reduce your taxable income or things like that. And yes, while, you know, the other thing that people keep talking about is interest rates are high

at the time or higher, it's still, you can still find properties that are cash-level, like, Like last year, I just bought, I bought a property. It was 8.6% interest rate, okay, 8.6. Yeah. And it was turnkey. This is not a fixer upper. Okay. I just put in feature walls and furnished it.

And my monthly PITI, which is, you know, taxes, insurance, all that kind of stuff, came out to be just under $1,600 a month. Okay. Okay. For this one. Yeah. My all in, it was like 80. you know, $1,000 to put, you know, to put the money down and all the different things and stuff like that for this one. Now, it rents for over $3,000 a month. Like, it's a monthly midterm rental.

So I'm making around $800 to $1,000 because sometimes, I mean, I've had like, I've had it be $3,600 or $3,800 on some months. And I'm making an extra $800 to $1,000 a month on a property that again was at an 8.6% interest rate, you know, and used again, I used money that was actually from another property on that one that was just, it was all based off of equity. And so, yeah, and now I get the additional tax benefits. So it's just like there's, there's ways that you can do this and don't be afraid of the interest rate. If it works, if the number still makes sense, then you'll do it. You're still making more. And someday you'll refinance and you won't be an 8.6% forever.

Yes, exactly. That's my thought too. You know, it's like, okay, bye now. And then, you know, in a few years, it'll go down and then I'll still even have even more equity and more, you know, it's like, then you take the equity out again and you do it again and again and you just keep doing that. So it's actually not, I don't think a benefit to hang off your house early, to be honest. I'm not one of those in that camp. I actually think that some people don't realize. So when you, let's just say you owned your house for a long time or maybe even 10 years. but it has gone up over $500,000 worth, right?

Maybe it's $700,000 you have equity in there. You guys, if you sell that, if you're married, you only have up to what I can't, correct me if I'm wrong, but up to $500,000 is not taxed. The other $200 is going to be taxed. And that's no fun. That means they're taking your money that you had, you know, and you could have used to do something else.

So it's actually in your benefit to either pull some of that money out or refinance. or do something to leverage it more rather than, you know, being taxed on that in the future if you ever were to sell. And it's even lower for if you're single. It's like $250,000. Exactly. Exactly. So it's actually in your benefit, again, to do something like a refinance, because even when refinances, you know, it's tax free. You can take it out tax free, go reinvest it and make more on your money than if it's just sitting there, you know, you're tied up in the equity of the home. So true. Yeah, that's a really great point. I think people don't, a lot of people don't realize the enormous tax benefits. And we have a lot of people

in our audience that are doing quite well. They're making good money in their job. So their taxes are relatively high. And there aren't a lot of things to offset them. So you mentioned, Rachel, you have long term, midterm, and short term rentals. I don't know if this is like asking you to pick a favorite child, but. Which one? I know. I actually don't have a favorite child, but I do have a favorite when it comes to real estate investing. So, um, you know, I think it's funny because initially I was all about like long term rentals. That's where I'm at. Blah, blah, blah. And I wanted multifamily. You know, that was also the thing. And while I still love my, I have a four unit property that is a long term and it does great. Like it's a wonderful property. It's pretty low maintenance because it was

brand new when I bought it. And yet the numbers looked great. I got it back. Yes, back when it was like a 3.75% interest rate. So that's why it's awesome. But regardless, it's still like, I don't know. If I were to continue to try to grow in that way, it wasn't going to be quick enough for what we were wanting at the time. I had this position. I had this issue, I should say, my husband was burnt out. Like, truly fighting depression was not fulfilled in his job. And he would not mind me sharing all this. So by the way, so he's totally fine with it. But he was in a place where he needed a change. And it was like, I needed to save him from that. And so there was an extra motivation of like, how can I do this as quickly as possible without also burdening myself too much,

but in a way that would be fulfilling and lifegiving. And I saw more opportunity in the midterm and short term rental space. And also when I started to go into that space, I realized how much I enjoyed that space as well. I realized I really enjoy hospitality. Not everybody is like that. I enjoy making these really cool and amazing, you know, properties and having just these experiences that people get to have on like vacation. And even dealing with those types of people, to me, are way more fun. Like you get the occasional ones, which are, you know, frustrating, but like they're only there for a couple days and then that's it. So it's not like you have to deal with them for months and months and months and months.

Like I have, I do have a property, a duplex. And I am like so tired of this one tenant, you know, he's been late a lot of times. He's kind of annoying. Like, no offense, but like, he's just a lot. And I'm like, man, I have to do with this guy for another six months until I have to get renew his contract. You know what I mean? Right. Whereas it's like, you know, these short term people, they're in and out. It's like, man, if somebody bothered me or it's like, good, they're gone and I can block them from ever having to go to my property. You know what I mean? Exactly. No, I totally agree. And I have to say like when we go to our vacation house rentals, the short term rentals that are vacation houses for people, I just love knowing that other people are coming to that house and making memories and having amazing times. And it just feels so good to be able to be the facilitator of like what people will go and remember for years and years. Yeah. And I mean, I've even had little notes like shared like written, handwritten notes from people telling me how much they loved their stay, loved their property. Can't wait. to come back next year, going to make it a family tradition. It's just so much fun. And so just being able to be a part of that has really brought me alive as well as, again, we love, we love the ownership of properties that we feel like we can be proud of. And not that, you know, no slow lord. Yeah. Yeah. But it was like, okay, even at this place in our, our, um, granted, we did, we did have one property, One of our first ones, right, was like probably slumlord almost material.

You know, we had plans to fix it up and we never did. We just ended up selling it a couple years later. And it was at that point, too, we're like, you know, we really want, we're not that type of landlord. Like we want to have like properties that we actually really love and we actually really feel proud to own. And it's not just something like, okay, you know, we just have it because, you know, it provides, you know, a basic need. from people. Like, we really want to be able to have that ownership and enjoy it. So, and where we found that is the short-term rental space as well as it was just the cash flows can be significantly higher. If you run your numbers, right, they really should cash flow so much higher and you can own less.

And really, the management side of it is easier, in my opinion, since I've done both. Personally, I think scaling a short-term rental business and having things hired out is easier than if than doing like long-term rentals, to be honest. Now, I know long-term rentals, you don't don't tend to have as much of the back and forth. But I don't know what it is, but something about dealing with long-term tenants, it's just, it's, it robs me more the wrong way. Like, I don't know. I guess it's because on the other side, you're wanting to create this perfect experience or amazing experience. So you're willing to go the extra mile. Whereas on the long terms, it just seems like, oh, man, what's this? And also, you just don't have as much cash flow. So it's like, dang,

here we go again. Like, you know, I have to go get a maintenance guy that's going to cost. $250 just to show up and tell me what's right. You know, I don't know. It just eats into some of the earning potential. And I know it shouldn't be about that. But to me, those are just not as much fun for me. Yeah, I hear earning and joy. Like I hear it eats into the joy for you because you love creating the experience.

And I think for a lot of women, it could be such a beautiful creative outlet because you get to set up a house and then you actually get to design an experience. And we all know experiences are more valuable than things, right? So you're really like setting the stage for the experience. It's a really cool concept. Yeah. Again, long-term rentals are great. It's definitely nice to have that consistent knowing that there's just typically, again, unless they're not paying, but a typically consistent income for those. And, you know, that's really wonderful. So I do think a mix can be good too because over time, it, you know, what if the short term, you know, what if we have another COVID 2020, you know, where a lot of people that had short term. rentals, they lost like six months of income typically or some had to return things. And so it is a good idea to still not put your eggs all in one basket, right? But I think there is going to be,

as you continue to walk this path forward, you'll start to notice and almost kind of feel it out of like what real estate asset and investment type like feels good to me. Like what do I enjoy? What is something that I really like I really come alive in as well as I feel like I can give my skill sets into and they really shine. And for us, again, it continued to be like, the short-term rental space is definitely ours. We feel 100% that that's like, that's where we want to be moving forward

is more on that side of things and what we just enjoy and love. So yeah, all that to say, I think, you know, you don't know until you start to step in it, and it's okay to pivot as well. And we've done that several times. And it's good. It's all been part of the learning process.

And once you do it a few times or even like you're in it a couple of, years now, then you can really be like, okay, this is the thing I really want to focus on. And that is like, that's truly my thing is like, and we're going to be focusing this on this now, which I think is important to eventually have that focus because if you try to do too many things, then yeah, it's going to be spread out and you're not going to be as well. You're not going to execute things as well. And so, yeah, moving forward now, it feels really good.

Like we feel really aligned and it's really good place to be. Oh, that's great. We talk a lot in this podcast about living your rich life now and you're just such a great example of that. Like, you know, this, I love the idea. You know, I'm, I'm in financial services and I understand the penalty of the 401k, but those are monies you're going to sit at and look at for 20 years before you can really, you know, impact your life and what you did with your husband saying, you know, he's not happy today. But who knows if you're going to be here in 20 years? I hate to be like that, but it's like, what if you're not here in 20 years? Yeah. What if you miss out? Yeah. And so I just thought, man,

I'd rather live this out now as much as we can. And let's do this. And we are. Like now it's like, man, I would not ever go back to what we were trying to do before. And it's, well, again,

it's fine for those if you really just want to have that, you know, I guess, you know, do the traditional way that that's, there's nothing necessarily wrong with that. But that just, I was like,

this isn't, that's not me. That's not where I want to be. And I want to live my life now. Like with, with the ability. and the opportunities that I can have to make an impact now as well as just have the financial freedom now.

And I really 100%, like, it's such a cool place to be where I'm like, I 100% know I will never have to worry again. Like my financial abilities and stability with real estate investing has truly, like, it's not going to fall apart. Like, again, we've been very careful. We're not like more than 50% over leveraged. And so I think you get to that point too where you're like, okay, now I want to make sure I'm preserving as well as growing.

And so we're at that point. But yeah, it's just been so much fun to just be able to have that flexibility. At my husband home, we get to go take walks at like eight in the morning after we drop the kids, you know, off to the bus stop. You know, we can take an afternoon, go play pickleball if we really wanted to. Like, we have that opportunity and the flexibility to do those things while still making over $10,000 a month, you know, not everybody has that. That's great.

That's great. I have a follow up question for you. You talked about jumping into books and reading a lot of books. Could you name a couple that were sort of the most influential for you? Yeah. Well, obviously, this is like shared by everybody, but rich dad, poor dad is definitely one. Brandon Turner has his how to invest in real estate, I believe it is. I also really liked, oh my gosh, why am I blanking on his name?

Zuber. Zuber? It's one rental at a time. Now, that one was interesting because it's actually very much the traditional way to buy real estate. It's just like saving up, do the 20% debt like all that. But I just loved his story. And I don't think, I think so much of the time you read books and it's so much more on the analytical side, which is great. You definitely need that.

But it was fun to just actually dig into somebody's story and hear them walk this out as well as just like literally it took him about 10, like maybe 10 years until he got. to that point where he could really, you know, afford and have enough to retire off in a sense, retire in a sense off of real estate. And he did the traditional method. And I'm like, but here's the thing. If it took even 10 years, wouldn't it be worth it? Right. Like, would it be worth it? I mean, some of you maybe you're like 70, you're like, I don't got 10 years, you know, but okay, well, then you might need to speed that up and find a different path and avenue. But if you're like 20, 30, even 40, like 10 years, that's still sooner with retirement in real estate. then it would be at like 65 or 70, you know.

So those are ones. And then I'm trying to think there was one other one. I think it was called multifamily, multifamily real estate investing. That one was interesting just because it helped me really understand all the terminology and dig into a little bit more on the commercial side of real estate investing. But honestly, I got one of those,

you know, like go to Amazon and get a Kindle Unlimited account. And I just started looking up all the free like investing books, even ones that were not the greatest, right? But I just started reading them or they give you discounts off of other ones. And I just started reading them all. And at first, it felt like I was reading like a science book on astrology and all these things I didn't understand. Like, you know, like, what is?

But by like the third or fourth one, I was like, okay, I think I know what R.O.I is now. Okay, I think I know what this gross, you know, rental calculator. Like, it was just, you start to become familiar. and you just have to just keep going. And I knew if I just kept reading and trying to keep reading, like those numbers of the terminology would start to make sense. And so it did. And then I just couldn't start going from there.

But yeah. Oh, that's great. That's great. We'll definitely have those books in the show notes for the listeners. You know, I think this is such a great story. And I think it helps a lot of people frame how they could get started and then what the potential is. And even though, do you have three kids, Rachel?

I do. Yeah. My twin boys are 11 now and my daughter's 10. So okay. Yeah. I mean like I think you're living the dream. You're living what so many people want. That's that flexibility and financial freedom and living now. I just love that. I echo what Beth said that you're living right now and you're not saying when I retire when I'm 60 or when I'm 70. Yeah. So it's so great. Can you tell people where they can find you? Oh yeah. Instagram is my, best spot. Rachel C. Swanson is my handle. And yeah, that's really, I will, if you message me, I will most likely respond back as long as it doesn't go in my junk or whatever. But I will eventually message you back for sure. So if you have questions, just shoot me in a message there. Gosh, I was just even talking to some guy just the other night who was feeling, he's feeling stuck. You know, he's living in a high expensive area. He has. this job. He doesn't feel like he can remove himself from. He actually wants to move states, but he just doesn't feel like he can. He's invested already a little bit. He has a few rentals.

And he's like, man, I just don't know how to make this happen. He has three kids and a wife and all that. And, you know, and after just talking, I was like, look, you have options. You actually do. You may not see them right now, but like, I promise you have options. And so I started even going through like here's a couple things. And he's like, what? Really? Like, you could do this? Yes, these are some of the options. Like just even off the top of my head, you could figure this out. And of course there's some. He's like, well, no, I can't. I'm like, no, what if you could? I get it. Some of these might be a sacrifice. Like there's going to be sacrifices involved in all of these. But look at the benefits on the other side and isn't worth it to you. And just don't ever feel like you

never have an option to move forward because we all do. We have multiple options. Even if you feel stuck, you have more than you think. And when you open your mind to that, it helps you actually start to see them. Okay, because even back when we were in a very expensive area of Southern California and my husband was burnt out with his job and we realized, okay, if he quit his job, we literally could not afford to live here. And it's like, we're all our friends and family, whatever. And it's like, oh my gosh, like we couldn't move, could we?

But then we started to realize we're like, what if we did? What if we did? What would that look like? And we tried it on a little bit. Like we dreamed a little bit. We're like, what would this look like to not feel the financial burdens anymore of life? And what would this feel like if we did do a lower cost of limit? Like even if we had to downsize our life in our house, like, what if we did that though?

Like would that feel better? Like would it resolve some of the issues we're having? And it got to the point we're like, oh, yeah, this is more important. This is worth jumping into and. trying this out over what we're like the path that we're on right now. So there's there are options. It's going to be challenging at times. It might be hard to overcome them or maybe you're just like not willing to jump on certain options, but you do have them. It's just a matter of choosing which one. Oh, I love it. I love it. It's so aligned. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. It's just so fun. It's just been so

fun. I mean, we were following you and all of a sudden we're like, I think Rachel's at EXP and yeah. We're all in the same group. We're all under. It's so fun. You know what I mean? We're all part of Go-Go's team and Amy Gray. It's just so. It's, yeah, it's in the powerhouse group.

It's just so aligned. And the way that you, I don't know, the way that you come across in your, in your mindset, and your vision, it's just so in line with us. So it's been such a pleasure to talk to you and get to know you more and share your story with our listeners, just like you were saying about that one book. I mean, it's so great to hear people's stories and to have that. that inspiration and hope to say, you know what, there's a better path. So thank you. You're welcome. No, it's so fun. We hope you've enjoyed this episode of the Abundant Investor podcast and

learn something new. We would love to hear from you. And if you did get something from this episode, please subscribe and rate this podcast so more people can find it and live their rich lives too. And remember, an abundant mindset means there's always plenty to go around and through giving we receive.