KGCI: Real Estate on Air - Leadership in Motion

Episode Date: September 17, 2024

Welcome to the Reveal Podcast. I'm your host, Jessica Nieto. We're going to go beyond the success story, the surface level chit-chat about entrepreneurial journeys. We're going to uncover the layers and reveal the kind of secrets that top entrepreneurs rarely share. I want you to experience real impact to these conversations and stories and inspire you to commit to the action required to achieve your dreams. I'm joined today by our amazing guest and my friend Trenel Doyle. Trenel's a founder of Go Girl Ride, a ride share company. She's a visionary. She's reshaping the transportation industry with her commitment to safety, inclusivity, and empowering her community.

She's the recipient of women who move the nation and 100 founders of change by American Express in 2020. So jump right in where we reveal stories of breaking through barriers and purpose-driven entrepreneurship at its finest through Trinnell's inspiring story. So welcome, Trinnell. So glad to have you here today. See your smiling face. I haven't seen you in person for a while. Welcome to the Reveal podcast.

Thanks for being my guest today. Thank you, Jessica. I know it's been a minute. Not too long. But as soon as I met, I felt like we were like, okay, we're going to be ready. Yeah. We share a lot of similar passions, but one of them is food,

and we broke bread together after the first time we met. Oh, my gosh. It was so good. So, Trinnell, I'm excited to have you in the studio. I reached out, I think even be a text and it was just a yes. So thank you for saying yes. Thanks for being here. And I told you a little bit before we kicked off here this morning that you're actually the first guest on this podcast. And what was funny is that my mission with this podcast is to amplify voices of real estate entrepreneurs that are not only entrepreneurs are behind the scenes. Like you finally get paid for all those hard things you do behind clothes. doors, I believe there is transformative power in having deeper conversations and cultivating real lasting connections. We're going to go beyond the success story, the surface level chit-chat about entrepreneurial journeys over many iterations of yourself. And you popped into my mind immediately as an entrepreneur that I wanted to share a conversation and share more with you

about to my network because you are a woman of so many hats. And so I wanted to kick off with that with your name as Trinnell. So I'd love for you to share a little bit about that and just you as a brand what you're working on right now. Absolutely. Jessica, first of all, I'm so proud of you. I am so honored to be the first guest on the Reveal podcast. I used to have a podcast way before people knew what a podcast was back. So I'm so excited to be here and I'm so excited to be here with you. I am Trinnell and hey y'all. It's so nice to meet you.

Oh gosh, where do I start? Trinnell as like a whole as a brand. Oh gosh. I am. I'm an entrepreneur. I feel like the way that I grew up with my dad being in the military, we would drive. He's retired now, retired chief. But we drove across country.

Literally I moved every seven months to two years. in my like childhood. So we got to experience a ton of cultures. I got to experience a ton of just, I just got introduced to a lot of various things. And so I've always just been all over the place. What is Trunell up to? What is Trinnell doing?

So whether that be I've been a professional photographer, I'm now retired, but from a photography, I've been a photographer and just the creative as a whole for at least, I don't know, 15 years. I've grown up singing. I still sing professionally, which is really cool. and then I also do a lot of things locally. That is my first love.

It's just like my, it's just my getaway. It's my way to communicate in just others. And so I love music with a passion. I am an HR professional as well. I'm actually an HR director for one of the big agencies at the state of Oregon. And I've been in HR, oh gosh, for at least 10 years. And I am Trinnell, founder, CEO of Go Girl. Ride, which we are working on.

I've been working on now for about five years. And then, oh gosh, and I'm so excited. Govo Ride is a ride share, but it's centered on trauma-informed and centered on the safety of women and femmes and non-binary folks. So we're currently transitioning it into a

nonprofit, which I'm so excited about. I do a lot of things. I'm a daughter. I'm a friend. I'm a godmother. That was understite. It's always funny when people are like, first, the two questions. they're like, where are you from? And I'm like, okay, how do I explain this?

I'm from Long Beach. I'm so proud to be from Long Beach, California. But there's a huge part of me that's also at this point in life from Portland, Oregon. We moved here for the first time when I was nine. We got stationed here. And my parents bought a house because they wanted my siblings and I, unlike both military kids, I'm so grateful because they wanted us to always have somewhere that we can come back to. So even if we were stationed somewhere else or we live somewhere else,

we always had our house in Portland. So we would spend chunks, like big chunks, sometimes small chunks of time here. And I'm so grateful for that. But it's so funny when people are like, where are you from? Because I'm also from where just being a military kid, you pick up on culture easily. Like, they're like, are you from New Orleans or are you from the East Coast or California? I'm like, my parents, my dad's from New Orleans. Mom's from Virginia.

I'm from Long Beach, but also heavily influenced by like culture. So I do a lot. I love Matt when people ask the questions like the small talk type questions and you just have much depth. We're going to have to get some coffee or something for you to talk about. Let's talk about. Yeah. Let's go back to the photography. It was so funny is that how we met was that you were referred to me by a realtor for, I think,

you had done her head shop and Nia. And so I said, who did your photography? And she said, oh, you've got to meet my friend, Renold Doyle. And she connected us. And when we first connected, I didn't realize until, I can't remember what it was that came up. You had said. And I thought, oh, I know who you are. I had actually met you very briefly.

There was so much going on that night at one of our friend Gregory Gorda's events at the restaurant. And so we're up in Portland and they had the full, the car inside the restaurant. And you were giving out those amazing safety kits. The visual ride safety kits. Yeah, with like the kitty. Nussle. Brass knuckles and like all the goods for safety. And I picked up one of those kits for a friend of mine for Christmas.

My wife and I picked up a few. So I immediately connected this. But my first experience with you in person was in a studio with you with your camera. Yeah. And to say you're just a, what I love is when entrepreneurs, like creatives are entrepreneurs. And because of your vast experience, I love the saying, the more, the more you can create. Yes. And you just have so much experience.

And the fact that it's coupled with also wanting to serve people, I heard you say, once something in a podcast or something I listened to something along the lines of how you wanted Bill Girl ride, how to elevate the experience for people, right? You have that in mind. That's your why is like how you can make this experience. and you have all this experience with HR and actually helping people have better experiences. So how does that HR side of you come into play?

Almost like a technical side comes into play with the creative side when you're coming up with your entrepreneurial visions and missions for your business. I got into HR. I feel like I would always just end up in an advocacy position. Well, another thing about me, I actually wanted to be a lawyer growing up and I still, I work with a ton of lawyers at my day job.

And I just, I love the law. I wanted to be a defect attorney and I used to do lock trial and all these things in high school. The reason why I say that is because I've always wanted to advocate for people. And when I got into whatever job I would have, it could be at like a call center or even when I was like a server, I've done a million job. I would always end up in some type of supervisory or leadership role. just like an advocacy role where it was like telling people, no, like, this is what you're entitled to. They can't talk to you like this.

They can't treat you like this. Also, though, just observing organizations and structures. And I think just being a maybe brat, I see people. So I always just ended up in like an advocacy type of position. And when I, I didn't go to college until I was like older, quote, unquote. I didn't go to college until I was 27. and I ended up graduating at 33. And I was pre-law for a little bit of time.

But I was like, you know what? No, because I'm going to have to go to law school, work my butt off for 10 years. I'm not going to be able to have a life until I'm like in my 50s. So I was like, what can I do that's similar that's for the people but also marries what I love, which is like the law compliant, but figuring out how to make it work for the people. Because I'm very people first. Well, that's how that's when I got into HR. Are you going to say?

I want to dig into that a little bit because so quickly we can say, oh, I was going to do this, but then I thought about it and thought, no, this. And then we just keep moving. One of the things I notice about a lot of people that get stuck is they literally don't take that time to reflect on what it is, what is it that I want? And being able to clearly articulate to yourself, what is it that I want? And you thought, how can I have a great? live not live in debt the law school and start

serving people and elevating their experience and be an advocate now. That's that entrepreneur spirit. Yeah, that's exactly it. And I think a part of that is the brilliance which is my therapist who I'm so grateful for you. It's helping me realize like the beauty of ADHD

is able to do a bunch of different things, but also to make it work for my good and really good. And yeah, it's just kind of, it fell into my lap. I feel like a lot of folks have a hard time getting into HR. Sometimes it can be who you know or folks have to go the epidemic route. That just wasn't my story. I was still in community college and I got my first HR gig at the University of Portland. I was hired by has now

become a great friend of mine. But she is just the most brilliant mind, Sandy Chung. She's what in Portland. She went to Harvard undergrad Harvard Law. She was the HR director. the University of Portland. And again, I didn't even have a degree at the time. And I don't know, 101 people applied for that job. And two of us got it. And I remember I was talking to her. And I was like, yeah, I'm thinking about going back to school or just like doing all these things because I feel like I need these credentials. And she looked at me and she was like, Trinnell, unless you're going to be like a rocket scientist or something, she was like, it doesn't matter. A credential, like, it does not matter. It is, do you have the capacity

you grow, do you have the capacity to learn? That's why I hired you because that's what I saw. And that really has just been like, I take that mindset through everything that I do. And if I'm able to just, can I learn from this? What can I learn always observing?

And how can I apply what I know and what I don't know? How can I use my resources to figure it out? And it's always, yeah, I feel like I'm always in some type of role where it's working with folks. And even the way that I approach HR, it's so funny when I tell people I'm an HR person and they go, oh, and I'm like, I'm a nice. I'm a kind one. It tells you how many people have bad experiences.

And I work with a ton of HR people. I'm always talking to HR folks and I'm always reminded of why people have the preconceived notions because they're often true that they do. if you support people first, happy people, happy structure. That's always, if folks needs are met, their base needs are met. And if they can trust you and they know that, then whatever you're doing, if it's a corporate office or nonprofit, whatever, I feel like I strongly feel like it will be successful and I haven't been proven wrong yet. So that's just the approach to me.

And so the other part that I love to highlight in the, this podcast and just like with the people that I interact with, the common threat is that authentic leadership. That leadership that you have in everywhere that you're showing up is that same thing that she had hired you for, right? Your ability to learn and your ability to grow. But the other part of that growing, it's not always learning, right? It's the self reflecting and learning about yourself. So can you share something that maybe in the beginning days of that entrepreneur mindset where you first thought, what else can I do? Yeah. What was. something that maybe you can think of that you saw was a weakness that you found has become a

straight as an entrepreneur. That's a good one. Not to stump you, but I'm curious. I know. I am the personality hire. I feel like that's been a net folks that talked about. I used to feel like I wasn't as I'm surrounded by really intelligent people a lot. And me, I don't fit that mold. at all. I just don't. And so I would often, imposter syndrome, it's so real. I would often feel inadequate, like even some of the just recognition that I've gotten, even for Go Girl Ride, where I'm like, we're not even long. So I'm still trying to figure out the basis of this. How am I here? How am I at these tables? How am at these wounds in these rooms? and something that I have realized now that I didn't back then when I got started,

it's because I'm good with people because I see people. I see power. Yeah, it's a mega power. And yeah, I see people, honestly. And I feel like I didn't realize that at the beginning. Okay, so I would be like, why am I here? It's because the work I'm doing. And I think the intention behind it and the,

heart that's behind it and I think the heart for people. And I think where that comes from, the more that I dig in, I see people because that's just how I grew up. I'm used to being by myself. I'm used to being a loner, but you don't have a choice as a military kid. And it's like, you got to make your lane because nobody's going to make it for you. But I know what it's like to, I'm comfortable in my skin. I'm very comfortable alone. So I don't want to make it seem like I wasn't like I was picked on or bullied and stuff. No, it wasn't that. But I think always having an outsider perspective and always being a new girl, I'm able to just observe. And in that, I'm able to see what people are experiencing. I can see how people engage with people, the impact that has on people. And me,

I'm always wanting to make room for people. And yeah, I always want to make room for people. Be able to be their genuine, authentic self. And so I feel. I feel. I think I have gotten as far as I have, even connecting with you, Jessica, I think it's because, I don't know, I feel like people can sense that and people are drawn to that and people want to support that. So I love mega power. You hear super power, but you're right. You have a mega power.

And I know you're humble. I have a similar, that really resonates with me. I have a similar experience with imposter syndrome where I almost feel like for many years, I knew what it was. I was aware of it. and I hid in plain sight of it. Oh, I, because I am confident, like you said, I'm comfortable in my skin that resonates with me.

It's not that I ever dislike myself, but what helped me get past it further, it's always a challenge, is feeling worthy and separating whether or not, why am I here? You're still striving to put yourself into those rooms and being in uncomfortable places as an entrepreneur, so it never really stops, right?

Because you keep going even further and faster. But the women who moved the nation, you're a recipient of the women who moved the nation award. And went to D.C. Right? And since you're research. Girl, remember you telling me about it? And so the MX 100 for 100 founders of change.

So when you were nominated for this award and you went to D.C. Tell me about that experience, being around other female entrepreneurs making real change. Did you feel worthy there? What was that experience like shoulder to shoulder with so many other women like you making such an impact? I will tell you. So which one? Do you want to start with Amex or Com?

Let's go with women who move the nation. Women who move the nation. It's Comptu. It's the Conference of Minority Transportation Officials. And I was a recipient of that in 20. Yeah, it was last year. So it was a very prestigious award in recognition. Some of the other recipients, it was the mayor of D.C., the executive director of Massa, like,

the mayor of D.C. is awesome, too. Yeah. And Massa rocket ships and stuff. I was looking at. Remember, your professor asked you if you were going to be a rocket scientist, so you actually didn't have to get the degree to be with rocket scientists either. That's need to be recognized with it. Wow.

I think, wow, that's amazing. So I was looking at this list of recipients, and I was like, I don't understand my sardac that I'm getting recognized for. We haven't even launched. Like, I am internally, I am struggling. I'm even, like, struggling with this and trying to get funding and all of these, all of the things. I don't understand why I'm here. And even how they found me, they had been trying to reach me. Apparently, they heard an interview that I had did on a podcast.

Yeah, they were trying to get in touch with me. They ended up, I was checking my Facebook messenger. And one of the folks in the organization, she had messaged me on there. And she's like, we've been trying to contact you. This is not spam. Oh, okay. I'm not sure it's clearinghouse. So anyway, I get to D.C., long story short, and I fly out.

We get there. I walk into the space. And as soon as I walk in, I'm just greeted with like warm hug. people knew exactly who I was and I'll never forget and it sticks with me even to this day the lady who had she's the one who had recommended me had nominated me to be a recipient she hugged me she said you're here and you deserve to be here embrace it embrace it how did you know all I needed you to say that to me right now well just to be in that space it was really inspiring it was motivating and it was also encouraging and

It was intimidating at the time, too, just because, again, I'm like, I haven't even gotten where I'm going, where I know I'm headed to, but you are, like, y'all saw me here. And what I'm grateful for now in someone, they really changed my, they got me to see it differently, which is, I was like, I just feel like, sometimes I feel like a fraud. Like, I do? Because I'm like, I don't get it. Do I deserve this space? And no, it was my dad, I think. And he was like, sweetheart. I think. I think it was my dad. He was like, sometimes, yeah, you may feel like you're not ready right now, but the fact that you have already have those things behind your name, that's going to open doors for you. And when you get into those spaces, that's going to help you out already.

So it's a setup. You may feel like you're not worthy. You may feel like you're not ready right now. But when you get where you're going to see, nope, these things are actually going to benefit you and they're going to help you and they're going to make room for you. Like me, I like to make room for people. And you're even popping this through. I'm realizing me making room for people is actually helping make room for myself.

So it was amazing. And I got to make some fantastic connections. I did some fantastic networking. And I'm just really grateful. I'm so grateful to even, if you could just see the lids of women get recognized. It was fancy. It was real fancy. Then bye, fancy on the hill.

I love it. That is so neat. I love what your dad shared with you. You really, everything you share, I love that you share stories. I love storytellers. Yeah, and the audience's podcast. And when I listen to podcast, when you hear a story, it really resonates it and it really helps you have a transformative experience and it resonates with you. You shared a little bit about the gal at the university, but I want to go into networking and relationships a little bit because I feel like myself included, I didn't have a big education or have a lot of degrees, but the things that I've learned through people and experiences

is something that is just absolutely helped me get to where I am. Can you think of another story experience or a person that literally, in a hard thought in your journey, that really helped you pivot and catapulted you in another direction, just that one relationship or conversation? Yeah. I think of a few. I would like to say, like, sometimes only one conversation away from your life changing.

No, literally. And honestly, I'll talk about how we were able to talk. You touched on it. But a really good friend of mine, her name is Patricia Williams, the friend, mentor, advisor, big sister, she's everything. Her and her husband are, they're like two of my closest relationships. And so she, at the time, I think she was working and I think she still works with Hala, which is a nonprofit in Portland.

And they had gotten connected with Khan for the at the time. Kahn was doing the yurts and the pop-up and all of that stuff. She had recommended Go-Girl Ride to Gregory and his team. And so from there, like they reached out. They were like, you're not a nonprofit because they were only working with nonprofits. But Go-Girl-Ride was so mission-based and they just connected, like we connected. And so we went to our initial meeting. just to talk about what that would look like.

And so for those of you, most of you probably don't know, Jessica and I know. But restaurant is a, it's one of the top restaurants in the country. It was the number one restaurant. It's amazing. If you can get a reservation, you should go. You should fly. Oh, my gosh. Gregory is his chef and his business partner, who is phenomenal.

She likes to stay under the table. so I won't mention her name, but she knows who exactly what she is. Yes, she knows. But I met with her and she just, we just connected. She really, I guess she said she appreciated our authenticity and all of the things. And I'm just the team and just how our experience. And I appreciate it theirs as well. And so we would love to sponsor you a night.

Essentially, like they gave a certain amount of what they earned that night. They donated to these non-proneys. like they sponsored them and highlighted what they were doing. And so we brought in a Tesla, which was really cool, our night, and we filled it with the safety kits. And Jessica talked about the safety kits a little bit, but they were casers, pepper spray, brass knuckles, just things that keep you safe. And really, I wanted to make sure that women, them, had things to keep them safe.

And so it was a way for us to raise money to work on go over a ride, the ride chair. So we feel the Tesla with a bunch of safety kids and yeah, the team was just there greeting people talking about. It was awesome. Yeah, that's amazing. And we had the music playing and so big food. And you all in Ireland, too. I remember that. You were.

I believe when you show up, you need to show up. I'm not. What I'm hearing of that, we did. And from that, though, they had just always. been super supportive and I wasn't even aware of the opportunities that would come from that and the doors that even that would open. And I'm talking to Jessica, who is phenomenal and I actually met you, Trinnell, before we met in a different capacity, which was through Kahn. So I think that's a great and that really was a game changer for me. There have been a few things

like you talked about American Express being nominated for that, or not nominated, but I was one of their for 100 women founders of change. It was like this grant that they did and it was a whole national theme. But I feel like having these genuine connection like like this and just being genuine and showing up has opened a door for these amazing opportunities. And what I'm grateful for now is that things are circling back. I took the year off because like my mental health was absolutely in the gutter. It was terrible like the lowest of the low. And I really needed to work on that. And also I just felt overwhelmed by investors and highs and lows of all of that and all of the things. And I was like, I just need to take a second. And it really did take a year and of just

me working on me. And now it's okay, no, I'm going to do this the way that I know I'm supposed to do it that I wanted two years ago. And there was a lot of just thoughts of, okay, I've been off for a We've been working on these things for a very long time, four or five years now. Is there still space? Is there still opportunity? Do people still want to support? And those same folks who I network with and establish those relationships and connections with finding is, nope, there's absolutely still room.

There's still a need. There is still a desire. People are like waiting on you to. And so it's really important to make sure that you cultivate genuine connection, and cultivate genuine relationships. And yeah, it's okay. It's not for okay to take a break and pivot, too. I can't even believe everything you're saying is just like music to my soul.

I was reflecting on it this morning, actually. This year was a whole vibe, right? For the seventh past year was the whole vibe. And one of the mindset shifts and reframes that I've had to personally do is similar to what you just shared, which is to say everything that I did, this year while I was laying a little bit lower while maybe my activity did not match the performance that was required to achieve what I want to do achieve or what I want to achieve.

But reframing it and just acknowledging that everything that I experienced this year and that time and all of the thinking and learning and discovery that I did that year with myself, it is now it's like it's on the table and I can execute better this year with. with all time than I had. And so really trying to nurture that little empty piece where I feel like you, like I miss or and not being full of regret, but honoring myself in that way and being excited for what I can execute, having made that space for myself.

I honor you for that for now. And I'm grateful that you shared because that's a big part of an entrepreneurial journey, right? It's not always going to be the year of winning. That is not the equation. about that. There's so much about the real deal of being an entrepreneur that I feel like people they don't talk about or yeah. I would just like, no, all that glitters is not gold and it's wonderful. There are so many amazing parts to it, but it's real out here. Like, it's really real. But getting back up. You just got to, you just, you do. You have to, and there have been so many

times and just on this journey where I've been like, okay, I can just settle into this nice nine to five and be good. Do I want it? Is it worth it? Is it worth all this? The literal tears and just like resources, all of this money, my life. Is it, do I want this? And I have had to ask myself that question quite a few times. And immediately, it's like, yeah, absolutely. Yes, I do. I'm crazy. I'm crazy. Absolutely, because I also, I think I'm so grateful for my purpose. Like, and at this point, I know what I'm supposed to be doing. And I find that when I do it, like when I'm working on it, it just happened. I work best when I just operate.

I don't overthink, but I'm able to just just go. I feel like things just fall into place. They just kind of align. And even things that are not okay, okay, but it'll be fine. in the end. And so I'm just like at that space now where it's, we could have been launched a long time ago if I wasn't listening to the opinions of other people. Like you got to know how to seek what's get though. Like you, it's getting seek guidance and stuff like that. But you also got to trust your gut. And so much of this entrepreneurial walk, it's your baby. And nobody

knows your baby like you do. So it's like you got to also trust yourself. And if you're, you're holding yourself accountable and you're making sure that you're doing all those things, it, I don't know, I feel like it should work out. And so I'm grateful that I know my purpose. And that's just all I'm interested in doing at this point. I read this thing this morning. It was a visual, actually. It was two small balls. And it said if you are learning, this is learning, right, reading and learning from others and then learning about yourself, right? And so if you're doing both, then it moves forward. But if you're only doing one,

then you keep going in a circle. And I've been in a circle. I wasn't. And even if, that's the thing, though, even if you feel like you've been in a circle, I feel like, yeah,

but I'm also, I've learned quite a bit of skills. And that's agreed. Agreed. Even when you fail, even when you feel like you're felling, it's not really, I call it failing up.

Yes. Selling right? You're selling up because you're, you're learning a lesson, you should be learning a lesson as you feel. And then eventually you get tired of going around that same circle and you're like, no, we can stop right here and turn like a line. So I'm going quite a bit in the failure, in the circle. And now I'm excited to just apply what I know and hopefully no longer go in a circle.

I love it. Yeah. All those circles are necessary, right, to get where we are today. So you're on the reveal podcast, so I hope you came ready. You've got to reveal to the audience and to meet you're, what's one thing that you're working on right now that you're looking to solve or plan on solving this year where you might need a new connection or a resource? Absolutely. Be working on. I am, we've talked about it a little bit, but I am working on a go-girl ride.

And I'm working on it now as a nonprofit. fit. The reason being that we are so community focused and we're so community-centric. And it's really important to me that folks have safe transportation, that they're able to get to wherever it is that they're going in a way where they feel safe, where they have confidence in knowing that they're safe here. The slogan is, we meet you where you are. And what is you don't have to change. Like you can show up as who you are. And because we've set up this organization in a way that is mindful, we've done mindful hiring and with our drivers and just with you and mind, that's what I'm trying to solve because there's a lot of folks, there's so many communities that are

completely ignored or underserved, the nor diverse community, by the way. Like, folks just want to sometimes just get out there, play wherever they sleep. and go outside and see nice things, but because the person may not look like you or because they may not, you may not understand them, you, I think sometimes we get so into ourselves that if it doesn't look exactly like this, we feel like there's something wrong with that person or that whatever that thing is. And so we ignore it. And that thing, that person goes completely underserved and they don't get seen. And so what I'm wanting to do and what I am doing now, it's helping get people from point A to point B, whether that be a sex worker who deserves, who's getting off of their ship and they deserve to get home safely without a person seeing what they do and making men feel uncomfortable, right?

They deserve safety or whether it's having to transport child protective services. Like so many hospitals and organizations, they've reached out to us too because a lot of times, these taxis or these ubers or these lifts, it's so easy to become a driver to where you don't know who's picking you up. And if you're having to go and pick up a child in the middle of the night, to bring them somewhere. If you're transporting a loved one, there's so many times where I think I'm picking up an adult and I'm actually picking up their kid. It's like, then I become Auntie. But what I realize is everyone doesn't have that switch and everyone doesn't have that training. There's so many things. I could talk about this answer all day, but that's what I'm

wanting to solve is safe transportation. Thank you. That's that. Thank you for addressing it. And I've learned so much about you today. I love interacting with you anytime. Thank you, Trenel, and I will see you soon. Thank you for sharing your heart and your vision and your mission with our audience today and look forward to seeing you again. Yes, my pleasure. Thank you so much, Jessica. And I'm so excited to be the first guest on the Reville podcast. Thanks, stay now. We'll see you. Much love.

Bye-bye.