KGCI: Real Estate on Air - Probate Bonds

Episode Date: September 5, 2024

Hey, welcome to Probate Weekly. I'm Bill Gross, on social media at Bill Gross Probate. And we do an interview format, generally speaking, and the idea is to have most commonly attorneys, but also vendors. And from around the country, and I would say to those of us who are in California, you know, there's different vendors and our business is a little different than other places. And same with the agents who are on the country. But there's three things that we want to try to focus on.

One is we want to learn about the business, and today we're going to learn about probate bonds, surety bonds. Second, we want to obviously make connections, and here's a vendor here who would be, who would love to talk to you about your business nationally. And I think the third thing always, though, is how are they attacking the business and are the lessons you can learn to apply to your business, whether you're an attorney or a real estate agent or an investor, how can you help build your brand? Because to some degree, we're looking for some of the same customers or getting to some

the same people. And so those are the three angles I think about when I do these interviews. We're excited to have today here, Bryce DeSai, who is with Jet Surety, which is a probate bond company, which if you don't know what that is, you should be on this call. And if you do know what it is, you should learn about them. Bryce, thank you so much for joining us today. Yeah, certainly. Thank you so much for having me, Bill. It's really a pleasure.

I love the show, and, you know, it's great to have the opportunity to be on. Love the audio, by the way. Man, I just have to say that again. We pre-call. I mentioned that to you. It's one thing to have a good microphone. Another thing to have it set up. You guys really have that nailed down.

And you have a voice for radio. You look like you're in a voice for radio. So how did you end up in the probate bond area or with Jet Shurdy? I mean, growing up as a kid, you play with like dolls and say someday, I'm going to be the probate bond guy or how'd that work out? Yeah, yeah. You know, it's not exactly a kid's dream to be in Shreddy Bonds, but I couldn't be happier that I am where I am now.

So, you know, coming out of college, I graduated with a marketing degree. and I ended up interning and the marketing department for a surety bond brokerage. And in that time, I was doing research, writing bond pages about guardianship and estate administration bonds, which we'll get into today. And really, I've just gained a full understanding of it. And ultimately, it led me to Jet. And I'm coming on just a year. I'm at 10 months now with Jet being a senior probate underwriter here.

You know, I'm going to tell you an interesting story. For those who are listening in on this, why I was so anxious to get you on our call. in in LA there's one company that just dominates the bond market I used to go to court every day and I would see them in the courtroom and there were four or five different guys and you know I feel like I'm a pretty good salesperson I'm pretty good at making relationships meeting people I follow the guys I learned about what they did I could never crack the code and I think it's because because they're getting business they didn't want to share what they're doing or who they were they wouldn't be off the radar I know the banker they bank with I know all kinds of people

them, couldn't get in with it. But on my own, I've met other bond companies and called them. I've interviewed him my YouTube channel. And Bryce's company is one of the few that does it nationally, markets their business nationally. And at the end of the day, the bond itself, I think, and you can explain this if I'm right or wrong, is really unwritten by an insurance company. You're more like a broker or a provider of the insurance, but it's being underwritten by some the same companies, regardless of who the bond company is, you're more acting as some sort of an intermediary. Is that how you would describe your relationship? Well, that would be most shirty companies, but the special thing about us is that we are direct to principal. And principal is the

fiduciary and the person going through probate. So a lot of companies, yes, exactly. They will, an insurance agent will talk to a surety company and, you know, just broker the bond on their behalf, but we, we actually talk to the administrators, we talk to the attorneys, we talk to the fiduciaries, and we give them the bond directly. And in doing that, and in doing that, you know, we're cutting out the middleman fees, we're cutting out the time it takes to underwrite, and ultimately just making it a better process. I had no idea. I knew you guys were national, which is one thing that was interesting. And oftentimes in other markets, the insurance broker really is no different than any other insurance in that they have an insurance license and they

pick different lines they want to represent and sign up and represent those lines. They may or may not know the product. They may or may not specialize in it, but you really have a division that just really does probate bonds. That's like your product, right? Precisely. And just about a year ago with what Jet Insurance Company decided to do was specialize in specific bond types. So, you know, we've got other departments, but my main forte is probate. And really, I, you know, I couldn't think that it's a better idea because probate is so nuanced and every single state, every single county has a specific way that they like things to be done. And having a dedicated team that really understands those requirements, ultimately just

makes the process better for us as the company and the customers and the consumers. So in California, and I'm not attorney, but I know the business of probate and bonds and such, There are occasions when the will will write in at bond not required, then they don't need a bond. You might still want a bond to protect yourself or protect the state. That's a different question. But there are cases where they can be waived. The judges can decide to waive a bond or require a bond, and it really is the judge's discretion. But when you say a bond is required, somebody has to qualify to be named the person being bonded,

the administrator or the executor or the fiduciary, right? And so you have you have to kind of underwrite that person as well as the situation to make a decision. Exactly. It's a very special type of surety bond because there are surety bonds in any type of industry really. But with probate in particular, it's almost qualitative underwriting where you're looking at the person and seeing, okay, will this person be able to uphold their fiduciary duties? Because that's what the bond is protecting exactly. It's making sure that someone who's appointed administrative, or executor, they will follow the probate code and, you know, give notice to creditors, deliver assets timely, pay off any creditors, and ultimately file a final accounting.

And so when you look at and underwrite somebody to make them a bond or not, you're looking at what, their credit score? Is that part of it? Criminal history? Is that part of it? What other types of things you're looking at when you underwrite a bond? Exactly. Both those two points are important. And traditionally in probate surety, a lot of times it will just be a credit check, basic details about the estate, and then go on, here's your bond. But we've taken more of a holistic approach where we look at the entire situation, okay, who are the heirs to this estate? What are they entitled to? Are there any estate debts? Are there any conflicts and disputes, which can happen all the time? And ultimately, we look at where is the risk factor in terms of who the heirs are and who the creditors are? and will they get their just due?

So credit and criminal history are two really important factors. Attorney involvement is something that we really highly prioritize because a lot of people will try to do probate pro se. And even if they can do it, it will be very timely, very costly, and ultimately it's just more risk that opens up. So somebody who's otherwise not bondable on their own pro per pro se would be perhaps approved if they were using a suitable attorney. Yes, yes.

That can be the situation. And a lot of times we have ways of going around that situation. You know, if we have the heirs, if they're in agreeance and can sign off on the bond, that makes us feel more comfortable. There's a lot of different ways because as you and everybody else in this call knows, probate is so nuanced. It's such a case-by-case basis. And each person's situation is unique. You know, it's not a one, one. one box fits anybody or, you know, it's just one specific type of customer we're looking for.

We're just looking at the situation as a whole. So when to go to your website, adjutshirte.com is the website. And then for probates, you want to go probate hyphen bonds. And there you'll see the specifics as far as where the bond is. Now, I'm not a vendor. I don't get affiliate income. I'm just interested in learning about this for my customers, for the attorneys I work with, for my team members, and for those you watch the call.

So just know I have nothing to do with this financially, but I just find this fascinating. Here I go to your page. And the first thing, well, I guess attorney purport would be the top right. Top left is get a quote. So talk about what's it take to get a quote for how much a bond is to compare your price to somebody else's. Yeah.

So the application process, we try to keep it as straightforward as possible. And you've got our stepper application that's opened up right there. That's kind of our bread and butter and what we really pride ourselves in because we designed it to mimic a conversation with an underwriter. So when someone goes online, they can complete this on their phone, on their computer, any 24 hours a day, and it'll feel like you're talking with an underwriter. And really what we need is basic information about the estate, the administrator, what assets are there, and a few qualifying questions as well. And so once they fill that out online, which imagine sounds like a couple minutes, how long before someone will get back a quote as to how much the actual bond will be? So that's something that we, and me personally, I absolutely pride myself in. I have a background in customer service and we really make sure that we respond to our customers quickly. An hour is our turnaround time that we try to guarantee and, you know, during normal business hours. So when someone submits an application, usually, honestly, I'm on it in five minutes and taking a look at it. But we like to give ourselves at least an hour.

And so once they get the quote and they might like what they see, then there's some additional information you need to underwrite. them and actually approve the actual bond, if they have all the information available, i.e. the filing information, the attorney information, the state questions you have, how long is the process to get confirmed on the price and or approved for the bond? The larger the bond amount, the longer it might take, but we usually try to do, you know, two to three days, 24-hour turnaround, because at this point, you know, we've really got a good understanding of what's a riskier estate and what's a not risky estate. And so when we see an application come in, you know, we know that things will happen straightforward. And so we can feel

comfortable approving it. And a lot of times we will need to review the court documents as well, which can be a little timely. But thankfully, California's got great portals where you can pull it up online right away. And so those are you listening, I think one of the things that we offer as a vendor to make it easier, can a attorney do this on his own? Yes. Can the attorney point the customer here to do it as well. Yes. But if we do that for them, that's part of the value we're creating. And so if we have information, we have the documents that they're going to ask for the letters. We're not going to have the letters. We're going to have the order or we're going to have the filing, the petition. We'll have the attorney's information, sometimes just going into

calbar.org and pulling up the information, sending that along with the application. Those are little things that can speed the process up on behalf of our attorney clients and or on our, on our clients. And I think that's where knowing these processes, we get involved and try to move things forward. Do many real estate agents ever call you about these? I know you're an attorney portal. And I know that most probates come to

attorneys from a real estate agent, but I think most of the realtors don't know this is part of the process and lead us to attorneys to handle on the run. Is that how you rather keep it or do you have some realtors that interface with you directly? Well, you know, we're a small team, so we're flexible and we're open to everything. We do have a dedicated attorney partnership program that, you know, I can definitely get into later on. But I do work with realtors all the time. A lot of times they've got a listing. They need some assistance. Then they need to make sure that their

client is bondable. And so they might need to call me and get a pre-approval before that order for probate. It finally gets issued. So, you know, yes, we work with attorneys or realtors all the time. So when somebody says to find it a bondable, at that point, they, what you just rent credit, do a credit application and a general history? Or they do the full application at that point? Well, we prefer the full application just to get a full picture and we can, you know, give them an honest answer, especially because the application takes about five minutes. But then, yeah, we'll review the court documents, look at, you know, what debts are on the home, what debts are on the estate otherwise, are all heirs and agreements to sell the home or does one

person want the house and the other one doesn't. But, you know, we'll just take a look at the situation and then we can give a pretty good assurance to the realtor or any other customer we have. What states do you Isha Bonds in? What states do you not issue bonds in? So we are active and we can do business in all 50 states. We're working on jet insurance's approval in a couple of states, but we also work with a couple other sureties that allow us to do business in states like New York where it's a little bit, it's a little bit tougher to get approved, but we're working on it. Okay. But they could call you and start working with you through that relationship, really you're saying you're operating today in 50 states as far as being

able to offer a solution to the customers. Exactly. From Alaska to Florida and everywhere in between, we can help out with the bond. Great. So the first part of this call, I really wanted to talk about like we did, kind of the bread and butter of what you do. For those of you watching, if you're an attorney or realtor, you know, reach out to them, feel free to use them as a vendor.

You know, I feel like everybody should be on my team, and I want to help everybody on my team as well. And so when I wasn't able to get the bond company in L.A., I started looking for the companies and, frankly, look forward to my next bond to work with Jet Shurdy. And I spoke to him last week and said, hey, I have a podcast. Let's get together and get you booked on there because I just think this is great opportunity for all of us to add more value to our attorneys. So that was really the main interest I had behind that. Matthew Price is happy Passover.

Thank you, Matthew Price. I appreciate that. For those you're wondering, that's why I haven't shaved because it's our tradition not to shave between this holiday period. Let's explain the gray hair. That's a whole different story. That's why I haven't shaved actually the last three days through the holiday. Okay, so we talked a bit about why a realtor should learn about the bond process, how we can bring value to our pro se customers as well as our attorneys.

One of the reasons why people use attorneys is the ability to go to a bond company. If we can help that process, we can save our customers some money or direction, possibly, though somebody who's marginable probably needs an attorney to get bonded. Let's talk about the second piece, which is most people on our call, be real estate agents looking to do more business with among other people attorneys. Talk a bit about your marketing. How do you market to attorneys? What do you, what's the value proposition that you present? And what are some of the activities you do that have been successful in building your business with attorneys? Yeah, excellent question. So we, when, from a, from a surety's perspective,

if there's an attorney's on the case, it's much lower risk. And so we wanted to prioritize them heavily. So what we did is we created. Well, hold on a second now. We make sure. but here's that, right? So for those of you, we're talking to customers, the thing I'm doing the around, what do you just say? He just said that if they have an attorney, they're the more likely to get bondable. And so you have to ask, is your customer bondable? They have a criminal background. They have made people inherit property. You have no net worth at all. A lot of debt. Their whole life has been with two bucks in their pocket and now they're inheriting a million-dollar house. They're going to need a bond. And Bryce has just said they might struggle to get the petition approved,

but won't be bonded. And here's a way they can perhaps get bonded, which is getting an attorney as well. So I'm sorry to interrupt you, exactly. That was the first thing I'm going to say. Exactly. And that's a really important caveat,

especially in California, because as I'm sure everybody on this call knows, the difference between full authority and limited authority and how that can really impact a listing. Right. You know, with us personally, we won't do credit checks under $25,000 bond amounts.

So there might be a case where you have a client who can get a bond for $20,000, dollars with limited authority. But then you have to wait for the probate referee to appraise the house, do a public bidding, and it's just a public invasive process. Whereas if a client can qualify for a full bond amount and get full authority under the IAEA, then it just makes the process go so much faster for realtors and the fiduciary as well. Right. So if you're not bondable, you're going to end up having to get court approval, particularly

Los Angeles, can be a much per cumbersome and expensive process. people say, oh, if we go with limit authority, you know, you save money in the bond. Well, that's true. You save a couple hundred dollars in the bond. You can spend thousands of dollars in months of delay, trying to get your household, I think. So, okay, so I interrupted you. My question was, how do you market to attorneys? What's the value proposition? And you mentioned one is, but by the fact that make the bond's popular people, attorney to attorneys is one way. What else do you do to get attention from attorneys and what kind of activities you use to do that. Yeah. So we, you know, when in terms of marketing, you know, we'll reach out to attorneys by

email, mailers, you know, Google ads as well. And that's just, you know, some basic marketing. But the value proposition is that we set them up with their full account where they have an entire backend dashboard that they can quote bonds with a customized application. They have access to all of their previous bond records with, you know, invoices, receipts, any records or documents you need. few clicks of the button and just access to a dedicated probate team. You know, we're on the East Coast, but we're available anytime from, I guess, 6 a.m. to 3 p.m. Pacific. And if an attorney needs something, they can call us and we will answer in, you know, the first

ring and we'll be able to speak to them and help their client. I think is where realtors can step in, again, because some of the forms need to be signed, maybe notarized. We as realtors are used to taking documents to customers, getting notaries, maybe me and the customer at a FedEx to get the notary done, but being involved, that process. And so this is where we end up combining our tools with a tool like Bryce as a judge surety and give our attorney that authority, that of power, but they don't want to do on their own. We're just going to do it for them and help them get that done. Okay, Matt has a

question. Would you say a broker who has been given authority to handle the items inside the estate property also needs to be bonded would be something that we need to be considered? So, Matthew, we're talking specifically today about bonds that are required to get the court to approve you to be the administrator or the executor. We're not talking about a bond that you might get for your business separately to protect yourself for liability or for errors and emissions. This is a bond in your capacity as an executive, administrator, administrative, of an estate that really protects the estate in case, let's say you sell the house, you take the money and go to the Bahamas and leave the creditors or the errors without any money,

right? That's what we're talking about. So whether it's in that bond, would apply to the property inside the house too in the sense that if the executor and they have a multi-million dollar baseball card collection you can't just sell it and put your pocket and run the bond would would protect the estate for that so the state might say hey before you have the three and take the baseball cards we want to have the bond the problem is baseball cards get stolen before anybody follows the bond so that's another story and and if they got a good card you know it might be tempting exactly i have to say When you go to a house, there's a bunch of stuff that when you find the few things are viable, it always is tempting.

I mean, I'm a human being too, and you see something. This guy went to my song, he had the world's best GI Joe collection. I mean, when I was a kid, beyond a dream. And they were all in boxes. They were all like in perfect condition from like the 60s. I was like, oh, my gosh. When I was six years old, I would have killed for this. I wonder if you missed that one.

You know, the Navy one looks so sharp. Maybe, yeah, you can't do that. That's a big problem. Yeah. Okay, so you market to attorneys and your value proposition is the service. Tell me about, do you also market directly to families? Do families come into you through, I guess, Google searches or ads or social media? What's your value proposition to them?

Because you obviously rather work with attorneys, but you must have consumers that come directly to you. They do. And exactly, Google Search is one of the main ways that will find families that are going through probate. And me in particular, one of my main roles is to write dedicated bond pages. That kind of just describes each state's requirement and what are the steps to get appointed and the terms and conditions of the bond in that specific state. So, you know, let's say someone in California, you know, great example, we'll look up California administrator bond. They'll see us come up first, give us a call, and then we can kind of explain the full process to them. because one major thing that I've noticed in my role with families that I'm talking to that are pro se, pro per, is that nobody's given them any type of advice whatsoever out of fear of giving legal advice.

And a lot of the information is publicly available online. So, you know, someone will come and apply to us for a bond and they haven't even filed their petition yet. And so, you know, I'll tell them like, hey, you need to go to this specific website. You need form DE11 and you need to file this first. then once you have your hearing, you'll take the order back to me, and then we can get started. And, you know, it's publicly available information. And so, you know, we try not to give any legal advice, but at the same time, you know, we want to help people at the end of the day. Right.

And I tell people I do the same thing. It's such a great answer because people, particularly realtors, we're so drilled into being scared about. And we should not. It's illegal. Just to be clear, it's illegal for us to give legal advice. It's not illegal for us to give business advice. It's not legal for us to read the information is posted on the state California probate court website or the LA County Probate Court website. So just like you said, I won't give people legal advice what to do, but I'll say, hey, I'm reading here on the LA County Probate site.

And it says the form you need is a DE11. I'm just reading it in plain English. And it's not legal advice, but you can read it. Let me send you the link to the page. It has all those details that gives you the step by step of what to do. And so as realtors, and that's part of why I do this podcast is we have information. that we should be giving to our customers so they're not lost. So they call us first.

So then we're in charge of the transaction and bring the case to the attorney rather than begging somebody for a referral, we should have those customers coming to us. I think that's a very powerful opportunity for us. Exactly. Because, you know, probate is so scary. It really is. You know, I've been dealing with it every day for the past 10, 11 months now. And people have just lost their mother, their brother, their child, even sometimes.

and they really don't know what to do. And it's really difficult to see. So, you know, to the extent that I can and I'm legally able to, I will point people in the right direction. Now, I'm thinking, let's not talk about California, but you've written these state-specific instructions for other states as well? Yes, yes. I might be at 15 now. Well, if we were to name them, we might get somebody on this call and reaches out to you for a copy of that page, and they might post it in their social media to promote your business for them.

I don't know. Don't do that. You might get some business. But to me, I was telling people when I have vendors on the call, the reason I'm promoting them is because my customers see me as an expert. I'm telling you what you should be doing as well, which is you should be on just surety, finding the good content that you want your customers to see and educate your customers that will make you the expert when you deal with their customers.

I'm constantly reminded of the movie, Catch Me If You Can with Leonardo DiCaprio. And in that story, he became a high school substitute teacher while he was still in high school. And they interviewed him and said, how in the world did you pass off being a teacher when you were in high school as well? You're the same age as them. He said, well, if you just read one chapter ahead of the students, they look at you as an expert. And so for us realtors, I mean, on one hand, it's funny. And the other hand, it's a clue that all we need to know is something our customers don't, and it can be attorneys as well. They may not know there's a bond company.

They may think they have to work without one company, and they may not like that guy or gal at that one company or that guy or gal on vacation this week, and they might need help. By posting's information, we become the experts to our attorneys and to our customers. And so, Bryce, should I get, if I have real estate agents, should they reach out to you in different states and get your state-specific dollar? documents to post? I think that would be a good thing, no? Yes, yes, certainly. I could definitely get you a list to share, but off the top of my head, you know, we've done a lot since we're in North Carolina,

that's where we're based. We've done a few pages on the southeast in particular and then a few up north as well, New Jersey, New York, Ohio. Yeah, chances are, no matter what state you're in, if you type in Jet Surety, that state probate, you'll probably find one of our pages.

And if you don't, I'll make a Bryce, send me the list, and then anybody who's, I'll only give it to one person per state. So the rest of you have to Google search it. That's your penalty. And those you who text, email me and say that you want to get the document from Jet Security on your state, but the state name and the subject line, I'll send you back the information I get from Bryce.

How's that sound? We'll try to get some people helping promote your content. That'll be perfect. And, you know, always if all, you know, if you can't find something online or if you're just not sure, you can always call us at any time. Chances are it'll be me who answers. And, you know, if you're just looking for information, happy to help. I can point you in the right direction.

All of our pages will have cited statutes, cited probate codes that specifically cite the law that requires the bond and the terms that'll specify it. And again, I think anything we do, and you can take and repost his material, you can summarize as material. You can basically use the script for your own video to post on your own social media. You can use the same piece, five different ways, post it. once a day for five days, and I'm telling you, customers are going to think your experts as well as attorneys. I think many, it's the thing we assume they know everything, the truth is many know a lot of law, but they don't go that deep.

They may know there's an idea of a probate bond. They may not know anybody of how to get it, and you're saving them that step by putting out their head of time. Exactly. And the bonding itself is very, very nuanced and specific. Like in North Carolina, for example, the bond amount has to be. 110% of the value of personal property if the estate's worth more than $100,000. If it's less, it has to be, the bond amount has to be 125% of the personal property.

And then in Ohio, it's double in Illinois. It's one and a half times. So it really just depends state by state. And so it really is tricky to just have it all mapped out. So that's why we like to be a resource and an expert on it. And there are some attorneys who are licensed in multiple states, some only in one state. but you want to be the resource to help them and make that connection. I imagine also you guys must have a pretty good network of attorneys in different states.

Yes, yes. I think last time I checked, I think we're just reached 350 attorneys nationwide. Yeah. So again, this is a case where I'm sure if you're bringing business to Bryce in your state, that's where from time of time they'll need more help. You're the one posting their content, and that's how the relationship gets built. So I'd say rather call them and ask them for an introduction, get the service material,

posting yourself, generate some business, bringing an attorney to into him, and then naturally he's going to help you with your business because he wants to keep you growing and things like that. Question, in North Carolina,

specific question, is a bond considered a corporate and commercial bond? Yes, so it would be a corporate surety bond, and then there are specific types of corporate surety bonds that are commercial.

So not to nerd out, out too hard. Go ahead. Nured out. Let's what we do. There's a there's court and pro. So there's court bonds that'll deal with, you know, probate. That's the biggest type. But then, you know, if there's an appeal or a civil judgment that you're trying to get reversed, you, that will be a bond that would apply under the court bond category. And then commercial bonds will apply mostly for businesses who need licenses. So contractors, motor vehicle dealers, you know, really a lot of businesses would need a licensed commercial bond. And then there's contract bonds where, you know, if there's a contractor that's building a project

or some type of construction, they might need a contract bond. Right. There's a very common thing for contractors because they are getting financing on the work. And if they were to disappear, somebody has to step in and finish the work and the materials may be replenished or whatever. So that's a whole other area of bonding. and we know that it's important that they have that. So you've been doing this for a while.

Is the bond business getting more competitive? Is it the same and you're just working at every day and getting better at it? How do you see the market for bonds changing or is it changing at all? I think in probate in particular, it's a very soft market where a lot of shirty companies want to be involved in it. there are a lot of other bond types that have more risk factors to it because, you know, essentially the risk factor for a bond would be a claim. And if you file a claim on the bond, you would have to pay out up to the penal sum of the bond

to whoever was financially damaged. So to put it in the context of probate, if an heir misses out on a $50,000 inheritance, the bond would reimburse them. And so and lots of other bond types, oh, excuse me, there's a little bit more risk there. And so the market gets harder. Some surety companies pull out. But in probate in particular, it's a pretty soft market that every surety company wants to be involved in. So it's kind of just making sure you have the lowest rates.

And, you know, you're the biggest expert and have the best service. Right. I think there's as much money as ever, but there's no more bond. the private business isn't exploding. It rises a little bit every year. And so I do think is an opportunity there for people who can deliver this. I think, you know, I'm not looking to change careers, but I can see being in probate bonds, there's a great career choice in that.

It's a growing area. There's a need for it. And yet, like, everything else is competitive for that reason, nobody's going to give you guys business anymore than anybody else. When the probate is completed and the court orders, the disbursements, Is the coverage at that point ended, meaning if an error felt they were cheated by the administrator-executor, does that bond cover them? Because now the bonds no longer being paid for or is it extinguished with the end of the probate process? So the bond will need to be renewed for as long as the estate is open and an administrator is appointed.

Usually that'll get done within a year. And once the disbursement happens, that's, oh, goodness, excuse me. that's not technically the end of the bonding process. Once all assets are dispersed, you would still need to file that annual accounting and that final accounting. And only at that time when it's approved, and this is, you know, this is generally the case in all states, but California in particular, the final accounting has to be approved by the court. And then the bond can be released. And you have to show proof to that to the surety company. But in lots of states, you know, each one has their own specific tail period.

California, it's four years. Any time after the estate is closed, up to four years, if someone is damaged and realize that they are, they can't file a claim on that bond. So the claim would be against the bond, not against the administrator or executive, unless there's criminal involvement, right? If it's just, I didn't know there was such an error. We didn't know they had a kid. We didn't know that that creditor existed and they have some claim that the court deems valid.

Is that bond then paid out? That's what was covered that was paid in the premiums, or do you also go after the administrative executor for maybe just making the air and missing it? Yeah. So in a hypothetical situation, an administrator gets appointed and has a $50,000 bond amount. One of the errors gets damaged by $15,000 or so. And so the surety company will pay them out if the claim is valid, you know, right away because they need to be rectified for their damages. Any time a bond principle obtains

a bond, they have to sign an indemnity agreement, which basically states that if any claims were to be paid out, they're ultimately responsible for reimbursing the surety. So that helps us cover our losses, and that's, you know, a standard practice industry-wide. So one shouldn't look at the bond as a get out of jail free card that somehow we can ignore a creditor. I'm going to get away with it because the truth is, yes, you'll have to pay them the bond, but then you guys are to come after the executive administrator as opposed to the error who got cheated. And my guess is you guys are a little stronger with that than the error might be. Exactly. And, you know, sometimes an administrator, you know, someone involved in the state will call me and they'll just say, hey, I just want to get bonded

just because I think it's good. And I'm like, hey, no, hang on a minute. We can't give you a bond, but that's $50,000, $100,000, $200,000 of liability that you're putting on. on yourself. So is it required? That's that's important though. Now I do believe there's another type of insurance for an administrator or executor against those kinds of risks. Like an errors admissions types of policy. So there perhaps be that's not specifically my forte. So not entirely sure, but there probably is. Yeah. So attorneys have that kind of insurance, errors emissions, and professional fiduciaries. And this is why when a family member steps in to be an administrator, they understand they're taking that liability.

And as long as they don't make any mistakes, they're not going to get sued. But if it turns out, Dad had another child and they were legitimately due the money, you know, that that would be a challenge who pays them, the Shirti company, and they're going to turn and say, hey, thanks, and we have this credit application on you. It says you own a house. We're just going to put a lien in your house until we get paid. So again, if you're going to step in and be an administrator, executor, if you have any kind of assets, you want to protect them in one way is separate from

the bond is an errors of emissions policy that professional fiduciaries have, attorneys have, realtors have on their real estate wouldn't apply to this in that capacity. Okay, well, look, I watch you either joking. I feel sorry before you. I was battling the cough myself the last couple of weeks, and your audio was so good. That's the shame of this. Yeah, exactly. Exactly.

I'm finding a little bit of a cold right now, but still I had to be on. Okay, well, I appreciate that. And like I said, I had just met you guys. I wanted to say a week or two ago, and I thought, I've been looking for you guys my whole career because, like I said, there's a great buying company in LA. I'd love to do business with them as well, but I just can't crack that nut. And here, you're nice to come on to help promote our business. I think nice stuff to help teach the realtors on this call, the attorneys on this call, what

you do. In addition to, you're going to send me the list of state-specific material, going on your jet sure. I know you have some other resources. Where should an interested real estate agent or attorney learn more about your company? You guys have some video material, you guys doing kind of podcast or any kind of regular programs that they can tie into? You have a blog? Yeah.

So we've got, so we've got blogs on, you know, all different types of probate as well as specific claims and just specific details of it. On that link in that URL that's going across the bottom of the screen right there. We do have a YouTube video that I'm in as well. That kind of just explains probate, what we do, the services that we offer. And it's a nice just four minute snapshot of how we're able to help with probate bonds. But once again, I always think phone is the best way to reach us because you can call me directly. And I can explain exactly how we can help you in your specific situation. Yeah, I think a phone call is great.

You have a call. And then also, like I said, on the website, they have some of the state-specific stuff. They have the bond material. And I tell real estate all the time that you should be educating your customers about this, both to get them through probate and then how to avoid probate with estate planning. Both those are relevant. And even their administrator might consider getting a bond to protect themselves from errors and emissions as opposed to this type of bond that we're talking about here.

So definitely you want to think about those questions as you go forward. Fantastic. And I will, Bryce, thanks so much for being on the call. I really appreciate your time today. I love your product. Look forward to my next bond requirement to being on the call as well as introducing the attorneys I work with and urge the rest of you to at least find the right answer. If they're not, let me know if you get some feedback that's negative.

If they're good, let me know as well. We want to hear some positive feedback. But I want to say that we want to do more to help our customers, the consumers as well as our attorneys, give better service to our customers. And how do we do that? One way is to learn about the bond process. The other is to be more active involved. So, Bryce, thank you for helping us achieve that cold.

I appreciate you. Certainly. Thank you so much for having me on the show, Bill. I absolutely love what you're doing, and I think it's absolutely fantastic in an industry that can be really frightening. So, goodos to you, and thank you for having me. Well, thanks so much. It's so sweet.

You say that. And for the rest of you, this is Probate Weekly. We do this every Thursday, 4 p.m. Pacific time, 7 p.m. Eastern Time. So look forward to seeing you guys again. I'm at Bill Gross Probate on social media. Again, thanks to Bryce and everybody at Jet Sure to you for your help today. and as always made today your best day ever.

Thanks so much, everybody. Thank you.