KGCI: Real Estate on Air - Think Circular Practical Tips to Design Sustainably with Kathryn Soter

Episode Date: December 9, 2024

Here we go, Catherine. Thank you so much. And so you can briefly tell us a little bit of a background about the Good Future Design Alliance. We are calling GFDA. And I know you have prepared a deck for us. So you can start sharing your slides and tell me about GFDA. Great. Well, I really appreciate being here today. We have been around for about three. We're going into our fourth year now. And very excited. We had started out just before COVID. So that was always a little bit hard to get a new organization off the ground. But we are off and running. We are an movement of design and build professionals that are committed to adopting low waste practices in the design and build industry. And the goal really is to reduce construction waste for future generations. people don't really know just how big the problem is, but we now have grown from when you probably talk to Katie a couple of years ago to a couple of chapters, but we now have four chapters and members all over the United States and a few from other countries. And they're all what I would call the leaders of this movement. These are the design and build professionals that your audience might want to hire,

that know about how to adapt low-waste practices and make a difference in our health of our climate and our planet and the inhabitants that live on it. And so I know you have some really great statistics. Let's hear about the facts. Yeah, absolutely. So Katie and I were in the design industry. I was on the sales side, and Katie was on the design side and I used to work with her. And both of us were kind of appalled at the amount of waste that we would see not only in sometimes excessive transportation, but also in packaging waste and just the amount of debris that got thrown away. So we as an organization started to really look into that to make some sense of it and like, how big is this problem? Is it just us or

you know, is this is this more widespread? And the sad facts are that we toss enough furniture away each year to furnish one-bedroom apartments for almost nine million people. Wow. And the other fact is that in landfills, most of the furniture is less than 15 years old. So it's really quite sad that we are throwing away perfectly good furniture when we could use those resources for a much better cause. The other thing is, just textiles that we discard just from furnisher manufacturing could provide pillows for about half the people on the planet. Wow. The waste in textiles, you probably heard about the fashion industry coming from a lot of fruit, maybe,

because it's even more of an issue with textile manufacturing, but for fabrics and clothing. but what people don't realize is that construction waste is second only to food waste. So we throw away 500 million tons of construction debris. 90% of that is from demolition alone. And if we just start there by not deconstructing and not throwing away so much, we could make a serious dent in the problem. But people have a hard time relating to five. million tons. Like, I don't know what that is.

It is about a trillion pounds. So what I try to do is I ask people, I don't know if you have ever been to Egypt and seen the great pyramids. But the largest one, the pyramid of Giza, is about the equivalent of a 45-story building. It's two, it's a couple of football fields wide or length and each length of it. And I would like to say that, you know, throwing away one of those would be the equivalent of 500 million tons, but it's not. Wow. Wow. It's much more than, oh my God. 100 of those. Wow. And this is just in the U.S. and it's just once a year. Just in the U.S. Yes, and every year.

Oh, my God. This is where we sort of want to take a pause and say, you know, the amount of waste created is an extraordinary and staggering amount. And we have to think about it very carefully. I think the other, you know, thing to understand is I mentioned textile waste for clothing. That's behind construction waste. So it's third in line. And we know how much it gets discarded from. from fabric for making our clothes.

So it's a big problem. We're not here to try to scare people, but we're here to say, hey, we have to pay attention. We should care because there are ways to mitigate this. Right. Before I go to the next question, Catherine, I'm just curious if you know this.

You said that 5 million tons within U.S., And so that's astounding. That's like not including the other part of the world. But do you know if U.S. is one of the worst or do you think that the rest of the world, you know, more developed countries, Europe and, you know, some parts of Asia? And are they producing just as much waste as U.S.? Do you know? We produce the most. Now, China and India are right there with us.

But we, just as a society, Americans consume twice as much of what Europe does. So that means we're throwing out likely about twice. It's just a mindset in America of consumption. Yeah. This is where we have to pay attention to it. and it doesn't mean that you can't have new things, but if you buy things that last longer, then you're not replacing it every three to five.

It's making things last longer. It's being more careful in your selections and also just asking yourself the hard questions. The hard fact to know is that we can't recycle our way out of this problem. We will run out of landfill waste in the U.S. fills will be full and we will not have enough space in about 60 years. So we have to pay attention to it now. Yeah, 60 years is not that long, you know.

It's just around the corner. Now, so we are talking about waste and how waste is harmful to our environment as well. But how about our health? Like, you know, I'm sure it has some effect on human being and other beings, you know, in health area. Yes, I'm really glad you asked that question because it's a common refrain that we get from interior designers who are working with their clients. And they often say, well, you know, if I ask my clients what their priorities are,

like they'd like to reduce waste, but honestly, it's not a top priority. One of the top priorities, however, is the health of my family. And so we, you know, so the question basically is, is there a connection between construction, waste, climate change, and the health of the people on the planet? Client, excuse me. And their answer is a resounding yes. And I'll tell you why. First of all, we'll start back with landfill pollution.

I already mentioned that we're going to fill up the landfills within. 60 years. But right now, we are polluting our soil, our water, and our air. And you don't have to live near a landfill to be affected by it. Then there's the whole issue of emissions. So it's come from a couple of places. They are the carbon emissions when you produce something, the manufacturing, all the energy that goes into manufacturing that new product that you're buying. Then there's carbon emissions from when you're shipping a product across the country. When I was a little girl, I grew up in Los Angeles, where you're from. And I remembered walking home from school because they let us out early because we had

smog days. Smog days. Smog days. Not snow days, smog days. The sad truth was the air was pretty polluted back then. And my lungs would ache when I'd get home. My mother would let, you know, make me lie down for a while until it passed. We couldn't have recess.

So they sent us home. It was that bad back in the 60s. And then we started to get smart and we cleaned up. We got rid of leaded gas. We got catalytic converters. We've done a lot of things to reduce air. pollution from automobiles since then and some manufacturing. But we have a new problem with emissions. We have something of trapping heat. So now we've gotten rid of most of the dirty air,

but now we're trapping the heat because of excess carbon emissions. But the real problem is that methane, now you've probably been hearing about it, is even a worse problem because it's 84 times more effective in absorbing the sun's heat than carbon dioxide. Wow. So methane comes from decaying landfills. It comes from cow pastures. So that's why there's this movement to try to reduce the amount of dairy or meat that we consume. So all of those things go into it, which is why we should pay attention to it.

But the one that I think that we can all almost have an immediate effect on is the amount of plastic that we're discarded. So we dump 10 million tons of plastics into our oceans each year. Now, not all of that is from packaging waste that we generate as a building industry. A lot of it is just our own consumer waste from plastic bottles and packaging. And someday, I hope, it's one of our visions that more and more plastic packaging material will be replaced by recyclable, returnable, or decomposal. compostable materials. And they're out there and more manufacturers are starting to pay attention to that. It can ship a product, not necessarily bathed in plastic. One of our members actually uses a decompostable plastic bag to wrap her things in. And she brands it very clearly. This is a compost. This is not

plastic. It's decomposable. People realize that there are products out there. But it took her a long time to find it. But here's the other thing about plastics and why it ties back to health again. Did you know that 50% of the oxygen that we breathe comes from the ocean? So if we're polluting the ocean, we're warming the waters, we're killing off the plant life in the oceans that create the oxygen. That is a big alarm bell. as well. Between landfills, polluting the soil and the water and plastics polluting our oceans that are generating oxygen and the methane gas and the CO2 kind of creating this heat bubble, we are really doing a repairable damage to the planet if we don't start to shift course. And that's what the

whole climate change movement is about, is about the man-made contributions to climate warming. warming or planet warming. And so yes, there is a connection between health and our climate. Very much so, isn't it? Like, we don't think about it or we don't take it for granted, you know, we take it for granted, like the air we breathe. Like, who would think that, you know, when you're living in, and I am living in the mountain and I'm a little bit far from the ocean today. And I wouldn't think about the plastic pollution that might be affecting the oxygen I breathe. Yeah, that is, you know, that's something that we all have to become more aware of. I agree.

And so all the waste that we are talking about that comes from the building industry and designing industry. And I understand like, you know, a lot of the packages contain plastic. and things like that. But what are the other ways that we are talking about and where do they come from other than, you know, manufacturing process and construction process? Yeah, here's where it could be really valuable for anybody that's watching this webinar.

Because we, either if you're a consumer or you're a designer, if you're the homeowner or a designer, or a developer or an architect or a contractor. One third of the waste that we generate as an industry comes from decisions that are made before the project starts. Here's where homeowners can take responsibility by being more mindful of this. And we'll get into that in the second. Here's where designers and architects can properly select materials and think about things

that could be salvaged at the beginning of a project. But a lot of it is not making mistakes. So it's the result of flaws. If we've made a mistake, we've overordered, we didn't communicate properly with the installer, there's too much excess that now is going to get thrown away. All of these types of things go into, you know, what constitutes a decision made before it even starts.

So it's a really complex design that requires excess materials just for a small piece of it. We mitigate some of that. But a lot of it is coordination and communications. So things get done on time. There's many manufacturers that will do just in time manufacturing, which definitely saves waste. There's a movement about 3D printing in materials. both from from a concrete to furniture manufacturing that reduces a lot of waste. And then a lot, one third, or actually 30% of all construction, not just the waste, is actually

rework. So that means you've changed your mind. You didn't like the way that turned out. Oh, wow. You got to rip it up, start over. Well, the guy ripped it out. it's on a time schedule. You're now in a hurry.

And he has to discard that stuff. He's not going to take the time to deconstruct it, see what boards can be salvaged, whatever. Right. Windows, et cetera, that you just pulled out. Now, granted, if you don't make mistakes, if you can minimize them as much as possible, some of that will, you know,

that's a way to reduce those kinds of rework mistakes. But a lot of rework comes from just not planning carefully. Right. If people would take more time in the planning process and carefully lay out their steps and work very closely with their designers and communicate and spend more time thinking about how a room or a home is going to be remodeled, you can reduce the amount of rework. And then sometimes rework is just because you just didn't like the finish. Okay, maybe that, you know, maybe you could live with it, maybe not.

maybe it doesn't require a whole ripping out. Try to think really carefully about. But that's a real easy way. So between a third of all ways coming from things starting at the beginning and, you know, again, careful planning and communication is a huge part of it, making sure all your documents are accurate, making sure all the communications are accurate. But then rethinking the rework and try not to make mistakes to avoid that. That's a big part of it. And as an organization, what the GFDA is about is really connecting the dots. So I'm big on communication.

And so the whole genesis of our organization was to connect interior designers and architects and contractors and manufacturers. Because a lot of what I just pointed to, these mistakes that are happening are often those gaps where those little orange arrows are, those gaps in between. the communication, you know, sphere. So if we get interior designers, architects, contractors on board early on on a project and they're all on the same page with the same goals in mind, then the communications will go more smoothly. And so what we're trying to do is educate all of these people with courses that we're developing and consulting practices and partnerships with us.

other organizations that either provide services or great products or a place to buy or donate your things. And then just a full amount of resource sharing within our market. And for homeowners or developers, you know, we we want to encourage you to work with trained professionals in this area because it makes your life so much easier if you know of a designer or an architect that adopt these practices and do it every day, and that's just the way they approach their project. It will go as fast.

Things may not cost as much as you think, and there are often tax benefits from resource donations, especially on higher end projects, which people don't realize, is that the more that you salvage and you can get a tax write-off that could offset the extra cost of a potential deconstruction of an entire building. Right. The other things that the design team can do, and again, this all flows up to the clients making the decisions, right? Exactly.

I know some designers that work with two contractors. They have deconstruction experts and they have the builder. And because sometimes they're not the same people. Often, we're trying to educate more builders to embrace deconstruction and know how to do it right. But some designers say, look, I need to do this now. So they have their deconstruction team that can assess, get a price, and then identify the products that come out and actually will do it. And then the salvaged. And then the builder will come in and build the new item. That's how that work as a partnership. So it's super important that we do this. You know, so I have to

to stop you for a minute. All of these people like you had listed, designers, architects, contractors, and manufacturers. And like you said, it comes down to the client's decision, right? So whether it's a homeowner or building owner, they are the ones that are ultimately making the decisions. So how can we, as lay people living in the home or, you know, walking in the building or whatever, how, I mean, it's our job. You and I have been doing this, you know, effort to educate the world about, you know, reducing waste and whatnot. So, I mean, it just feels like such a huge task, or it's almost daunting, overwhelming. And what do we, how do you suggest in terms of how can we as people who are not designer, architect, contractor, manufacturer, what can we do to be part of this movement?

Again, great question. And one that, again, we get asked a lot by interior designers in particular and architects, is that they feel like their clients don't, like. as we talked about, may not care enough. But we know there's people out there that do care, but they don't want the project to be more expensive or take more time. But I always say that if you're planning from the beginning to do it the right way, that it won't take more time because time is a matter of expectation.

So it's already building in the time to do the deconstruction. Mentally, you're prepared for that, right? Okay, maybe three weeks to your project. So you just have to start early. I also want to remind people that little steps do add up. When you're working with a team, they can find small areas that can make a difference. We talked about this before we started, which is like maybe, excuse me, you can find a few pieces of furniture that you can use in another room or be a pollster or reconstruct. or re-apulster it or rebuild it.

And a good professional can guide you through that process. Then their selection of materials can also be something that you won't have to sacrifice necessarily quality or design because they have their resources about really good materials. There are tile manufacturers that are B-Corps, which means they've got the extra mile to, manufacture sustainably. And that's a huge, there are many companies like that in all aspects. There are furniture companies that package in low waste methods or design to disassemble. So these are the types of things that are steps that homeowners can embrace from the beginning of a project and realize that all those little steps add up. And that's why we want you to think also about donations at the beginning. So there's many things you're going to want to

throw out. Instead of just discarding them and having your contractor haul it away, he's likely going to take it to the dump. Right. To pay for a dumping fee, what they call tipping fees in construction. So you might as well donate the usable pieces and get a tax benefit from that than paying the contractor to dump it. So those are just a few examples of ways that homeowners can make a difference. The selection of materials,

low fees, things that are manufactured locally save on carbon emissions and you can get them faster and with less packaging waste, right? If it's coming from a few miles away versus a few thousand miles

away, just imagine the amount of less packaging waste and savings of time too. So those are just a few examples. Thank you so much. I mean, as I was sharing with you that I recently had to replace a sofa and I am, although I did my research to find the sustainably built product, I am now regretting that I didn't get the older one. Even though I did give away that old sofa to someone who needed new sofa, but I wish that I had talked to you before I did that. Yeah, before I get into my whole thing on re-apholstering, because I think there are a lot

of misconceptions about that. I want to take you through just a few other things that I think I'll sort of bring this all to circle. So what the one is a stark truth, we have to consume. less. So perfect place to start is what can you live with? What do you still love? And let's give it life. If you do want to get rid of it, let's find a new home for it. There are, there's our people and they're aging out of foster care homes that are getting their own homes, but have no furniture. There's wonderful organizations in every market that are providing furniture for people. One thing that homeowners can do that I would hope they do or pay attention to is why do we need to put in the temporary kitchen when we're just going to remodel it in about five more years.

If you could just tell your viewers to do one thing, don't put in temporary anything. Just save the money a little bit longer and live with it. Give it a coat of pay. or something, repair something that you don't like. But when you're ready to remodel, put in the absolute best products that you can, but they will last a long time. As I said in the beginning of my presentation, furniture that's in landfills, appliances that are in landfills are less than 15 years old. So if we could stop doing the, if we could be more mindful, if we will.

You know, most of us care about this stuff, but we have. have to really start to walk the talk, right? Right, right. So this comes, this goes to really shifting our thinking. And what makes this point? This is the way we do things now. It's called linear thinking. We take some material, we make it into something, and then when we're done with it,

we throw it away. So it's a linear approach. Take, make waste. The new thinking is around circularity. The idea of circularity is the circulation. of materials at their highest value for the longest period of time. And when you design with circular systems in mind, you are thinking about the end at the beginning, meaning what's going to happen to this product that we're making?

What's going to happen to this house that we're designing at the end of life? Can any of these things be reused again? Can they be made into something else? Can you take and you send the furniture. back to the manufacturer and they'll repair it or even keep it and resell it to somebody else. There are companies that do that. Circular thinking is starting with the end in mind. You plan, you design and you construct very carefully using the absolute highest quality materials

possible. You are always maintaining and restoring things along the way through the life cycle of the the whole major portion of the time you're living in it or using that product. Keep it just because part breaks, I had a microwave where the handle actually broke off. And I'm sure there was a lot of people thought, oh, there's a part broken. Let's just rip it out and get a new one. I was called and looked online and believe it or not, I could buy a new door. Oh, wow.

A new door with a handle on it and we just put it on ourselves. I've restored lots of failing appliances just for budget reasons. And sometimes people just don't go there. They think, oh, I'll buy a new one. Like, you know, just keep repairing things that's possible. And manufacturers should take responsibility. Then when it is time to remodel or buy a new place that is really beyond a habitable. with a deconstruction.

So think of destruction, not, you know, destruction or demolition. And we've talked a lot about that already. And then the salvaging of materials. So there really are, that's the idea of a circular approach. So the other things I tell people are to really educate yourself. All these things that we're talking about today, there are many, many resources on all of them. So start early and find that team. you want to work with all those professionals that are part of the GFDA and get one that you like a lot

and have them build their team of resources and other professionals around that. So educate yourself. Get agreement early about waste reduction priorities. What we said at the beginning of our talk, which is go through each room and identify what you can salvage, what could be given away, where your priorities are. And then, plan to keep track of your waste minimization. This is really important because it'll serve as reinforcement. It's like, oh my gosh, we got that locally. So we saved on carbon emissions. There was little to no packaging because it was blanket wrapped. Or we didn't throw away all of this whole room of furniture. We actually rehomed it. So that's great. Look at there's 15 pieces of furniture that

found a new home, that's the type of thing you keep on track of. It serves as a reinforcement for what you're doing and motivation to try a little bit harder every time. And if you're a design professional, it's really important to share those kinds of things with your new clients too, about how you can get there in case they're somewhat resistant. It's like, no, it's not hard. It all adds up and every little bit matters. It's a force multiplier. If everybody listening to this and all their designer and their designer friends in just Los Angeles started to adopt even small steps. And then we got every designer in every major city. And then we got everybody in the United States to do it.

Just imagine small steps add up. Sure. And then we talked a lot about planning early. I can't. And carefully, I can't stress that enough. If you slow the process down and realize that this is a priority at the beginning of the process, you will save problems at the end. You can't be in the middle of a project

and say, oh, I want to reduce waste now. You really kind of have to start early on. So now we're going to get to your sofa question because I have been wrapped up here. There are organizations like Cherish and First dibs that have saved literally and other online marketplaces that have saved literally millions of pounds of furniture from going into landfills.

It's a huge, we are big proponents of shopping for vintage or just gently used pieces first. And you can add vintage treasures to your home because it adds a more colorful and rich story to it. And every piece of furniture not only has its own unusual shape or period that it represents, but there were craftsmen behind it. So you're supporting and honoring that legacy of the craftsmen that built that piece. Let's restore some pieces. So you have a sofa. You thought it was just beyond repair.

You thought I don't want to, but it fits in my room, but the saggy material and the cushions. Well, here's how to think about restoring sofas. If it works in your scheme, if it is a good fit and you've always really enjoyed it. but it's just worn, right? Mm-hmm. You should consider that finding a really good refurbishment, refurbishment source and a re-apholster, because re-apolsters can literally rebuild the whole thing except the frame. And sometimes they'll repair frames if there are some things missing,

or maybe the feet need to be resanded and restained, but they'll redo the cushions and any springs or anything like that. So you can have entirely new cushions or add padding to it and you get a new fabric that you pick that goes with the new scheme. This is similar to buying a custom made piece. So don't have re-opulstering necessarily as a cheap way out. It's not. It is like building a new custom piece for your home. The beauty of it is you already loved it.

And now you get to enjoy it in a new. with a facelift, if you will. Right. And it already fits in your room. So scale is super important. And more importantly, you didn't buy a new piece that has all the embodied carbon in manufacturing and shipping, right? Not to mention the off gassing and things like that that come in with a new piece.

There'll be a little of that with fabrics, but not small. If you source natural fabrics, they last longer like wool and hemp and linen. These are all wonderful materials that can be, that don't, that last longer with the right maintenance and don't, and decompose naturally a hundred years from now when we're all gone and it ends up. So anyway, does that answer your question about? Yes, yes. So, so I have a couple more questions for you. Yes, second-hand furniture for kids and use appliances for the second home or ADU. And they all make sense. So you mentioned that you have four chapters now. And so GFDA is an organization serving those professionals, designers, architects.

and contractors and manufacturers. But can homeowners or anybody like myself can come to your organization and look for designers, architects, and whatnot who are within your organization that is really embracing this practice of reducing waste? Yes. So I would say right now we are, We're for a member-only organization because we do some education and provide resources for design professionals to work together. But we get asked this a lot, and we are working on some educational modules that will be

available to consumers. But if you're looking for a design professional, just contact us directly and tell us where you live, and we'll give you a few names of people to contact. I see. We'll start there. Someday we'll probably have a. the ability to share the directory with consumers too. If you're not a design professional,

but you want to pay the membership fee to get access to all of it, knock yourself out. And most consumers, you know, would only use it once, but I would say, you know, you could join, but you might want to just find it faster if you just contact me, which is why I have my contact information up there. Yes, and I will put that in the show note.

well. But here's my last question, Catherine. For those of those people who are not able to, who have, who don't have the means to hire professionals in the design field or building field, or they just want to, you know, do it on their own. Do you have any resources that you can share for people to look for, you know, we know about cherish, you know, salvation armies or habitat for humanities, may have some of the upcycled material or recycled material. Do you have any other resources that you can share with people? Yeah, there are other organizations like Renovation Angel that will take basically everything in your house.

Okay. Really, what they focus on is kitchens. And they literally come in and take your entire kitchen out. Oh, wow. including the cabinets, providing there in decent, you know, somewhat decent shape, can't find a new home for them. The thing with the other point I'll make, and so what you do have to do is look for your local resources.

Right. There are many. They're popping up all the time. The problem we have is to keep these people in business and doing the right thing, we also have to buy from them. Yeah. So that's the way I say, consider going to renovation angel. if you don't want to spend a lot of money on appliances,

you would be surprised at the quality of appliances they're being pulled out of really high-end homes. That's because the homeowners are tired of them or the size doesn't fit, and they're putting in five or 10-year-old appliances that are really high-end. If you go to some of these places, you might find them there,

and then you just saved probably 50% at least on a very expensive refrigerator or range. So renovation is another one other one. There's another company called Revital East that, you know, you can, no matter where you live, it's a place to get your old furniture restored. But you just have to, I always say, ask your neighbors. Right. What donation places there are.

Google it in your area. That's a big way to do it. Go on if you just, you know, look for your local resources. The thing with salvage is it generally is local. There are some online marketplaces too where you buy and sell. One of them is a member of ours, which is called Recapture It. And then there's a large company, mostly on the architectural material side that is also called Reapley, R-H-E-A-P-L-Y.com. And they are, again, they espouse, you know, buying from, you know, sinks and faucets and lighting fixtures.

Like, why spend top dollar on things that are perfectly good? Right. People with, you know, high-end things. If you're working with a vintage home, like recapitals, a lot of vintage homes and the doors are, you know, they have a certain style to them too, in the windows sometimes. So there are resources out there. Yeah. And keep track of them. And if you're still stuck, pop us a note.

There's another email. We have a general mailbox, which is hello at the GFDA. Pop us to tell us what you're looking for and we'll do our best to help you find it if you're still struggling. But that's another reason for, you know, keeping your little notebook and tracking or your document on your laptop, tracking your waste. We are, one of our initiatives is to try to work through and develop a tool that, you know, builders and designers and homeowners can use to track waste, but we're still a year or so away from that, but we'll get there. Well, I really appreciate all the work that what Katie started and then you're, you know, carrying on. It's and the organization is growing quickly and I'm

really glad to hear that. Great. Thank you so much, Catherine. This was so informative and very educational. I hope people get a lot of great ideas and inspiration from you. Thank you so much. It was great to be here. All I can say in closing is just try a little bit better every time. And it will add up. And it's like exercising a muscle. We have to develop new habits. And that's all we have to do is keep practicing. Yeah. Thank you so much, Catherine. This was Izumi Tanaka with Home Greenhomes podcast.

Thank you so much. And until my next episode.