KGCI: Real Estate on Air - Why Boring Wins and How to Win Without Being Bored

Episode Date: March 28, 2025

Welcome to Real Estate Real World, where we talk to the mover, shakers, and leaders that are getting it done right now in the real estate industry and beyond. Your host, Marguerite Chris Bello, started this podcast simply dedicated to call people about what's really happening in this crazy roller coaster ride of real estate. Be sure to subscribe on iTunes and stay up to date on the newest stuff by adding yourself to the list at D. www. realestate realworld.com. Now your host, Marguerite Chris Bellow. Hello, everybody. I hope you all are doing well. I've been traveling the last few weeks,

so I haven't had a whole lot of time to step in, but we've been airing some historic episodes, some of my favorite episodes over the week, and I'm thrilled to have seen those pop back up into our social media. But today, as a matter of fact, part of my traveling the last couple weeks, weeks. I ran into a longtime good friend of mine, James Becker, and I'm like, you got to be on the podcast. And he's super excited to be here. And I am thrilled to have him here. So let me read a little

bit about his bio and then we'll jump into the conversation. So James Becker has been in real estate mortgage and business development for over 25 years. I got a few years on him, I think. Currently, he is the founder and CEO of Fusion Growth Partners, a business incubator and microventure capital firm that invests in small service-based businesses, including real estate agent businesses and lots of other small businesses out there. His entrepreneurial spirit ignited him to bootstrap a new business concept from zero revenue and employees to a profitable 300-plus employee business with revenues of $20 million a year and still rapidly growing without any formal funding. James specializes in teaching the fundamentals required for small business owners

who labor in their business to help them earn profits from their business by working on it, one simple step at a time. His vision along with scaling fusion growth partners nationwide is to share his wealth of knowledge along with his insights and perspectives regarding the practical utilization of the lessons gleaned from history and the lives of great people whose contributions impacted the world of which he is won. So thank you, thank you, and please join us, Mr. James Becker. Hello, my friend, how are you? I'm doing great. Good to see you again three weeks.

This has been a crazy travel season for all of us. I got home and I was like, oh, I'm going to sleep for about three days and I think I did. So I feel a lot better. Feel refreshed. I haven't taught up yet. You are much busier than I am in a lot of ways. But I'm thrilled your hair. We've talked many times over the years and I've had some in-depth conversations about the real estate industry as a whole. having you have been in the industry for a long time. I'm going to be 30 years in November. And you have, you ran a brokerage for a while and a lot of other stuff. But it's interesting the direction you've gone because I know as a full-time real estate agent and the owner of a team,

how crazy things can get. And this roller coaster ride that real estate agents are forever on. So tell me like what you've seen in that. Can you tell us a little bit about your background and what led you to what you're currently doing now? Sure. I started selling real estate at Cook Realty in Southland Park area. I was there for a year. Then went to Lions and a few other brokers. And I had some success pretty quickly. I had some needs. I was married. I had a woman. I had a wife who was pregnant and the market took a serious downturn. I think the most serious downturn that I've ever experienced worse than the previous or 2008 in what we're going through now. I don't know if you remember, but in Sacramento in 2000, excuse me, 1992, there were how, there were streets that had a sign on every single house on that street. It was just insane. There was zero urgency to buy. Prices were dropping on a consistent basis. And I had to put food on the table.

And so I worked really hard. And I started to create some success around that level of work. But I didn't want to continue to work that hard. And so it began a long odyssey of trying to figure out how to grow a business without having to do all of the work myself. And it's been a process of iterating ideas, one step at a time having an idea, implementing it, improving on that idea, and then improving on it again. And it's been a couple of decades of doing that. And in In 2015, I had a brokerage of about 240 real estate agents, and I was providing a lot of services for them, and yet it didn't have the impact because they weren't taking advantage of a lot of the things that I had on the platform. And I had this idea that I just thought to myself,

what if I just did everything for them except meet the clients face-to-face? And I shared that idea with a few people. They thought it was crazy. And I started to come up with this program that I called the Diamond program. I did kind of a dog and pony show with all of the agents that we had. We had about 30 people sign up for this new Diamond program. And it was an absolute cluster. It was a complete mess. It was much more ambitious in the idea that I had the ability to actually execute. But I had a handful of those first 30 that believed in me, trusted in me, and stayed the course, and are still with me today, where they allowed me to make a lot of mistakes and a lot of errors. And so two, three years into being a broker and then offering this diamond program,

I also had the idea, 2000, where we were recruiting people in and they loved it. They wanted to come on board, but they didn't want to leave their broker. And I woke up one morning and thought, why do they have to, why do I have to be their broker? Why can't they just stay at their broker? So I ran that idea by a lot of people. They all thought it was nuts and crazy. And so we became the first version of this broker agnostic support services. I know that there's another company that says that, but we started that in 2018.

And I sold my brokerage to remax and started doing this 100%. And we had when we made this switch, 50 or 60 clients. And we now have almost 800 clients. right now that are probably selling north of $6 billion worth of real estate on the annual basis, about 1,400 transactions. 14,000. That's pretty amazing. And so what did you see as the biggest challenge and the biggest problem?

Do you think it's simply the agent not having the time, the desire, or even really understanding structure? It seems to me, and correct me if I'm wrong, that the industry as a whole does not attract business-oriented or business-minded people. And there's that funny saying that says, God does not put a salesperson and a good manager in the same body. It's one or the other. And that seems to be the biggest challenge. What do you think is the biggest challenge with real estate agents as a whole? I don't think people end up in real estate when they're on a winning streak typically. So there's a lot of people that come into the business. They're searching for

something that they can do, that they can make some good money, that they can have some freedom, that they don't have to have a boss, or whatever the case can be. And there is a group of people at the top that are very professional and they just take off and they do very well. But the vast majority, one of the issues is that we throw so much at them. There's so much information. There's so much that we have to learn. We have to learn contracts. That's a lot. You have to learn NLS. You have to learn sales. It's just over the top and it's overwhelming. And most people that come into real estate don't really have a business background. When I came in, I had a sales background and that is what allowed me to be good in the beginning. I understood sales and I was

trained in sales, but I did not have a business background. And that's what created some challenges once I got to a certain level. And there's a lot of paradoxes in business that's really tough to get over. I was explaining that this morning to someone who was looking at trying to get team members had a reasonable split on their team. And I said, there's a couple of things that you can say. First of all, who owns Tesla? It's Elon Musk, right? Not really. He owns 12%. So richest man in the world owns 12%. And then you could do that Jeff Bezos. You could do that Glenn Sanford with the XP. They're all about 10% of the companies that they have. Other people own 90%. And the moral of that story and the paradox is that less is more. If you are going to build a business, you have to have

people. And if you're going to have good people, they have to have a piece of the pie. And yet as real estate agents, we feel if we give up the piece of the pie, it is a detriment. And that's the opposite. Really, if you look at everybody who's successful, they have less. But in the beginning, but eventually they have more because they have more leverage and they're growing that pie. But those things are really hard for some people to comprehend on an emotional level that allows them. Logically, they can understand that, but on an emotional level to make that change and say, okay, I'm going to accept less of my commissions so that I can grow bigger. And that's really tough for people who don't have a longer term vision and understand some of these businesses.

It's interesting that you're saying that right now because we've been re-evaluating some things on my personal production team. And there is like this whole psychological process that you go through. And I'm sure you've analyzed this quite a bit about how you determine. You like you start to think, if I give all that up, does it make sense? Or could I just simplify things and sell more houses? Like, it's hard to give up those small pieces of the pie. But then there's that great saying that says, it's better to make a little money off of a lot of people than a lot of money off one or two.

And so giving up that piece of the pie, is it a control thing? Is it a budget thing? What is it that goes through? Because I'm trying to analyze this for myself. So it's a great timing for this conversation. Okay. One of the things that I say to are partnership executives who are providing business consultation. I don't like coaching because coaching is like you're telling.

I see a coach as someone that you have to follow their instructions. I see our role with our partners more as a board of directors. Our job is to argue with the CEO about what they think is best for the company and what's best for the CEO. And then the CEO, though, has to then make decisions on their own. And so I say we do business consultation, but really we do business therapy. Because in small businesses, there's so much emotion wrapped up in the decisions that we make that are in our subconscious. So we can understand things at a logical level, but being able to move past some of the emotional things. that creates fear or anxiety because we've done things a certain way for so long is very difficult.

And for us, I sometimes tell our employees that we have to do an intervention with our clients because that's what it's like. People are addicted to doing things the way that they're doing, even though that the consequences are negative. And I don't know your specific circumstances, but there are some business fundamentals that we teach. There's about 15 fundamentals. One is that as the CEO of your business, if you're the CEO of General Motors, you have assets that you need to allocate

to get a return on those assets. So that could be the people that work for your company, that could be the cash in the bank, that could be the facilities and the factories that you have. And you have to make decisions on how you are going to utilize these resources and assets to get a return on them. That's your job as the CEO is to allocate your resources. In real estate and the small business,

your number one asset is your time. And we're not really measuring where we're spending our time, number one, so we don't know what we're doing. And we're not conscious of where that time is going. And so the first step, I think, is saying, okay, my time as an asset, where do I get the highest return on the investment of my time? And once you can start to identify what those things are, short term and long term, and I'll talk about that in a minute, then you can say, okay, how do I figure out how to get rid of those

other things so that I can now take my time and put it into the areas that are going to provide the highest return. Now, there's two things on return, I think is very important. And this is a concept that I've just been thinking about most recently. My time is probably right now, if I was to go sell it, maybe worth $200, $500 an hour. Okay. But when I'm working on my company, for something that I could scale a year from now or two years from now, my time might be worth $5,000 or $10,000 an hour. And so when you're looking at that return, you also have to look at that.

So you have to be able to live, you have to have enough money coming into the bank. But when you're looking at your time, that return, for example, building a business may lose money for you for two years, but three or four years, from now could all of a sudden take off and then you have a sellable asset. And so those are some of the things that you have to look at. So if you're looking at that, I would just ask myself,

okay, where am I going to get the best return on my time? And then you start with that. So what goes through my head a little bit is that it is maybe the control freak aspect of it, right? Like you feel like if you're not in the middle of, if you don't have your, your hands in the middle of all of these pies that things are going to fall apart. And so it's a matter of number one. And I guess this is a lot where you guys come in. As an agent, we're trying to control all this and bring it all in, where if we let some of the stuff go and what I hear from agents, and you correct me if I'm wrong, they can't find

good help. They can't get people to do what they want to do. There's not enough hours in the day. They're overwhelmed. They're trying to do all of these things. But then they try to hire somebody and they use the good old fashioned Segal approach, right? So they just grab the first person who's breathing, throw them in a desk. They fly over, dump a bunch of crap on their desk and fly out.

They don't train. They don't teach. They don't have a system. They don't have a structure in place. And so where does that even start? Like, how do you begin? What's the first step? Maybe we need a 12-step program for real estate agents.

But what is the first step of figuring out how to determine what is the... I feel like my highest and best use of time is in front of people when I'm face to face. No question. That is your highest in best use. Right. And you've known me a long time, so you know that to be true. But anything else, it seems like, is always restricting me or keeping me from getting in front of people because I feel like if I don't take care of this stuff and I can't take care of people,

Is that, I know I threw a lot. There's a couple of elements. You talked about it in, gosh, there's so much here. Just bear with me. I'm going to try and remember. So one of the things that is if you're a control freak and you have to do everything yourself, if you don't change that, you're just going to be by yourself forever. And that is the choice.

either you accept the fact that someone else is going to do work that's not as good as your work. Otherwise, you are by yourself all the time. You never build a business. You are trading your time for a certain amount of dollars. That never scales. So that's the first thing. You have to accept that fact. The other thing is things are going to screw up.

You're going to hire people and they are going to. going to screw up. We screw up. We make mistakes. We accidentally put the wrong phone number on a flyer or whatever the case may be. We send out a mailer that's got the wrong signature on it. It's happened. It's embarrassing when it does. But we have agents that have experienced that and they've lost their minds. Oh my God, it's the end of the world. People don't care. They know mistakes happen. And it's happening all the time. And so, I love Theodore Roosevelt's speech about the man in the arena. And one of the key lines is there is no effort without air.

There is no effort without air. I love that. When you listen to some of these great business people talk, and particularly in the Silicon Valley, they want failure because you love it. learn from failure all the time. The faster you fail forward. And you have to understand that if you make a mistake and someone points it out, which they will, you made a mistake because that's the critics. But you're the one in the arena, right? You're not playing it safe. You're the brave one. You are the one with courage. And you have to feed yourself that so that you can get better. And when you start and you

first hire people, it's going to be a mess just the way that it goes. And so that's an emotional piece that you have to be willing to do. And some people can't do it. When you are building a business as a small business owner, you go out and you have to, if there's something that you are doing, you build a checklist. And there's a book out called the checklist. manifesto and anything that has value that's important like flying a plane, anything like this, everything has a checklist to make sure stuff is done. So you build a checklist, what's done, how it's done, you create that list and then you hire somebody and you train them to do that thing that is specified in an SOP, which is a standard operating procedure. Once you do,

that you have that checklist, the next thing is you have to inspect that work and correct them as they're going and be willing to let them make mistakes. So that's one process. Once you have someone hired to do that process, now you build an SOP for the next process. And then you add that person doing that or bring somebody else in and then another process and then another process. So if you look at businesses, any business, particularly a service-based business, it's all systems and processes. And I'm giving an example. Starbucks.

When you go in the Starbucks, you go to the line, the customers are part of this process. You order the drink using their vocabulary. They call it out. You then pay. Then you go down to where you wait. They call your name. That's a process. They're cleaning. They have people who are doing certain things. At the end of that day, they clean up. They have a truck that comes in the middle of the night that brings and replenishes all the food. And so all of those standard operating procedures are done the same way every single time in every single store. So when you're in New York City, you can get a mocha with two extra pumps of chocolate, extra hot at 185 degrees.

agrees when he asked for it. And then you fly to San Francisco get off, go to the next Starbucks, and get the exact same drink. And it's that consistency of procedures and processes that allows them at one point, they had all these processes and they just took it and opened another store. They were opening at one particular time a store every nine hours, okay? Only through procedures and processes. And so everything is a problem. And what we do in real estate is we want to do it all. And we don't, we're not even consistent with the way we are doing it. Well, it does a hundred percent. It definitely answers a question. And it reminds me, I know you've talked about this. I was watching some videos about your business program that you have going on this morning. And you were talking about the E-myth, the book, the E-Mith, which is one of my all-time favorite books. It's one of the first books I read when I got into real estate and I've read it probably 50 times. And the irony is that. We think about a lot of these things, but the biggest thing that probably holds many of us back is the action step, right?

Because you start hustling, you get some deals in escrow, and then you focus all of your energy on helping those clients, and you don't take any time to work on your business, right? Yep. You'll work in. Yeah. And you addressed that this morning, too, in your videos. So it was interesting. I was like, oh, yeah, like, I know all this, but it's a matter of the action step. Can you stop on that for one quick second, this idea of the value of your time now,

versus the value of your time into the future? So if you're working on taking care of a client, that's going to give you money now. But if you're working on your business, there's no money right now. There's no money for a long period of time. But the actual return could be five times what you're getting right now. And that's that difference of thinking about the value of my time now or in the future. So I don't interrupt. I actually love that you interrupted that because, again, it takes you back to, I know part of what we were talking about today is that why boring wins, right?

And boring, to me, how I know that where my greatest strengths is in front of people is because that gives me energy and that drives me. And I get excited about that. What I don't get excited about is creating systems, right? I don't get excited about that. That's not true. I love to create systems, but I don't want to follow them. I don't want to be the one who's doing every step to make sure that happens. I like the idea of creating that system and there being a system.

So to me, that's where when you talk about why boring wins, that's a part of it. That's the boring part. I don't want to do that stuff. I want to do the fun stuff, which is in front of people. But the boring stuff is what wins and what gets you further down the road. Does it not? It's the routine. It's the repetitive routines.

That's all a business is. I just watched a video on Tiger Woods talking about putting. He has a routine for putting. He does the same thing every single putt. He walks it around it. He comes up. He takes two practice swings. He does the same thing with his head every single time.

That's not exciting. But that's why boring wins. And that's another one of those paradoxes, right? Less is more. And what's exciting is not what generates significant scaling profits over the one. And so how are you helping with what you're doing to divide that arena, so to speak, right? Like, how are you helping with, because it sounds to me in your business that the main focus is to really take a lot of that boring stuff off your place. and be able to take that boring stuff and make sure that it actually happens, right?

If I walked into Starbucks, it was your story, and it was different every time, I can guarantee you Starbucks wouldn't be where they are today. Because if I walked into the New York Starbucks and my oat milk latte, it would be an issue. And I probably wouldn't go to Starbucks. I'd be looking for something different. So how do you divide your time even with that? Because obviously, you have to put some time into developing and creating these systems. How do you determine how to divide your time up? Because you still have to go make money. So you still have to get out there and bring that business in and find a way to manage those two different arenas. I think it's a decision of making less money for a period of time. That's really hard for people to do.

And that's why so many people, we've seen it a bazillion times where people come in, they do amazing for five years and then you never see them again. Because they go on a sprint, they burn themselves out. And then, you know, I did that. My first run in real estate, I didn't have an assistant this before there were teams. And I think I sold close to 70 houses myself. And at the beginning of the year, I didn't want to pick up the phone. I couldn't even imagine talking to somebody.

And it's because I was doing everything. I completely burnt myself out. And I think people don't realize that there's a shelf life. That's the other thing is that people get complacent. And they, I can tell you when someone's going to fail at real estate. One of the key things is they start flipping homes. Why? Because it's a different business.

Right. And you and I know Afton and her husband, they've become very successful. successful at flipping homes, but very few people do. But most people that start flipping homes, they buy a house and that becomes a complete distraction. It's now again exciting, sometimes terrifying, but they're not working on their business. And I really believe Chase Two Rabbits catch none. You got to have one main business and you need to focus on it until the business is a separate entity from yourself. That means you've hired people, you're paying people. And that thing can run without you. And for me, in my business, that's where I'm at. I can travel and

people hire and sometimes let go, paychecks. Payroll goes. The company can run without me. Now, it still needs my leadership for us to get to that next particular level, but the operations day to day. So if I wanted to buy another business, I could do that now and not have it really be detrimental to the current business that I have, but I could tell you it would be detrimental to the future growth of my business because now I'm trying to solve two different sets of problems. And that's one of the things that I really struggled with a lot of our clients is they need to have multiple streams of income. I think that's that idea is an idea when you're trying to get a business to a point of being self-sustainable.

You got to get one business going and then go out and create another. Well, don't you see like right now the industry is changing quite a bit, right? We're seeing a lot of changes in the industry with interest rates rising and with inventory. Is it changing or is it more of the same? Well, I've been around a long time as have you. So I've seen this rodeo a time or two, right? This is nothing surprising to me. Yeah, but you still get all.

all your business through referrals. So for me, it's not changing. You still protect your clients. You still take care of them when they're upset. You're talking to them. You're still trying to find the best deal for them. You're still putting pressure on the lenders to get stuff done for them. What's changed? Okay. So let me rephrase it. I don't necessarily think the industry as a whole is changing, meaning the process of buying and selling real estate and taking care of your business. I think that we have a perception problem a little bit. it in that we have an entire generation of consumers and real estate agents who've not seen a shifting market.

They've only seen intro home prices since 2010, the bottom of the market, continue to rise. They've only seen interest rates low up until six, eight months ago. And so. Three. Money for free. So the things they, for the last 13 years. so to speak. For 13 years, we've only seen prices do this and interest rates do that. And so even somebody who got into the business, I've been around 10 years. In 10 years,

you still, you haven't even seen anything different. Right. And so this whole kind of picture of seeing through rose-colored glasses is changing. And people are actually having to do the stuff that you teach and do in your business. They have to, I'm going to use your line because it's my favorite, it, they have to, what is it, make friends serve people, right? And a lot of people haven't been doing that. They've been just doing business and making a ton of money. They're not really making friends. If they are, they're not continuing those relationships. And they're absolutely not serving people. Servicing people. Yeah. And so that's the perception. And that's what's happening is we're just seeing that shift. Yeah. To me, I'm a steak and potatoes blocking and tackling kind of.

I'm basics. Yes, we had dinner and you wanted steak and potatoes. That's right. So the realities are is I think principled based businesses win, boring wins in business. And we were having a coaching session. Bill Pipes comes in and talks to our clients every other week or so. He was talking about Deon Sanders. why they were doing so well and why he was doing so well. And he runs, even though he's flashing from the TV screens, he is very principled. He is old school. He doesn't allow his players to be disrespectful. They show up early to every single meeting. Like he is a disciplinary. And he is totally old school. He is back to the basics. And that's why he's taking a program that wasn't

winning at all and is now the talk of the country. And because he is making a difference and it's only going to get better because it's principled. And I think that if you're running a business that's just trying to find the next trend or the next hot thing that it's not sustainable. And I think it's really important to only do things that are sustainable. It's like going on a diet, right? if you're going to do the Atkins diet, you'll lose weight. But everyone I know is done that is gained more back within a short period of time. And so it's doing the basics of chloroic deficit over a long period of time that gets to those results that we want, which requires discipline. And a lot of people don't have discipline or don't want to employ discipline.

I think as an industry, we're hearing it a lot, especially from some of us old timers, right, the OGs. who say, get back to basics, do the basics. I've done some of the very simple things my entire career, sending out my little letter. You've had an amazing business. Your business has been amazing day one, and it's been sustainable and consistent for decades. You're making me old now, but I know.

You're a little bit younger than me. But the world. You don't know. Thank you. The truth is that, as we've said, couple times through here is that it's the consistency, the simple stuff. And what I love about what you have built and what you're continuing to build and grow is that those are the key components. It's the basics. It's not flashy. It's not flash in the pan or doing something different every

day. It's doing the same thing over and over again. And it's proven. Also improving on that same thing, interrating for improvement and efficiency. So it's not being complacent that this is the way we've done it. But you have a system and then you iterate and improve on those systems, slightly little by little. And that's what improves efficiency and gives you a compounding return. So I think that's an part. So yes, you have a system you do it, but you have to look for efficiencies in those systems. I love that. And as we wrap up today, I'll address that. Is it, for example, example, when I first started in real estate, I used to send out recipe cards, right? Little good old 10 remember sensations was a car. I don't know if they're still around. They might be,

but I'd send out little recipe cards. And then I was like, oh, I need to improve that. What I didn't stop doing was I did not stop. What I didn't stop doing is I didn't stop mailing. I continued mailing something to my database every single month. However, I did change that up. I improved it. I got a little bit better. I'm like, oh, maybe I'll do a newsletter or maybe I'll do a little letter of the heart. But I kept the consistency. And I think that's what you're saying as well, is that as long as you don't, complacent doesn't work, but consistency does work. And you can consistently and constantly be tweaking it and changing it and improving it and making it better. There's no way it doesn't work. Like there, it's impossible to me for it not to work.

If you don't keep doing the same stuff over and over again. The same stuff doesn't necessarily mean being complacent. What it does mean is that you're doing something consistent and you're learning from it, right? Like you used sports analogies. And if you look at some of the world famous, I'm terrible at sports, but basketball players. And they practice the free throw 10,000 times. But they're learning that if they move this finger to the right or something, I don't even know what it is. But if they move that one little thing, they can improve it.

Time differences. Yeah. Yeah. It has a compounding effect over a period of time. I'll share something interesting with you if you're interested. This is just something that I've recognized. So we've gone from zero to tracking about $20 million in revenue as a company. That's not commissions.

If we were looking at our commissions, it'd be over $150 million from our group. But as a company, our portion is about $20 million. And one of the things I'm realizing is each step that we grow, I'm like, okay, I was running a company of 10 people and then it was 20 people and then it was 100 people. And then each step, it's more difficult and more complex to manage. And recently, we've slowed down a little bit in our growth because I'm in virgin territory. I'm like, I've never run a company this big. What the heck am I doing?

And so I'm going to get back to this less is more. So I started looking for someone who I could bring in as a president of the company. I'm still in control, but basically is a professional manager. And I got really fortunate. And I found somebody who was running a company that was doing over $100 million. They're a service-based company. It was a private equity owned company. And he became interested in what we're doing.

and he wanted a lot of money, far more than I'm paying myself. And he wants an equity play. And I took a big swallow and I hired this person. And he has the ability to vest into a chunk. But I know that what's keeping us growing a little bit slower than where we were is me. And I had to get out of the way and get somebody else that's smarter than I, am in these things. And I think that's the other ego play to a certain extent. We want to be the one that everyone gives credit to, but that's not going to help something grow significantly.

And so I think it is, and he's been with me just a couple of months. And oh my gosh, it's such a relief to have some of this stuff go to someone who's competent in it. And I think that as businesses grow, you just have to keep giving a little bit more and more away. but it grows that much more. And so I'm practicing that myself right now. And so I'm investing, taking less of what I could take myself to potentially have something that's bigger in the future. And that delay of gratification is also a really important element for business.

James, we've spent many hours talking over the years. I could spend many more hours talking to you. You're fascinating always and quite an inspiration. I'm really proud of what you are creating and have created, and I'm honored to be your friends. Thank you so much for taking some time to be with us today. I feel the same way about you. And if anybody is interested in talking to James about what he is doing and growing,

I can promise you it will be well worth the conversation. So we'll be sure to have his contact information in our podcast notes today. And I encourage you to take what we've said, because trust me, this is valuable information. And while it's worth listening to a few times to figure out how you can implement some of these things in your business and potentially hire Fusion Growth Partners to help you take your business to the next level. So thanks again for joining us today, James. I hope I said something that is of interest to somebody.

You always. Thank you, everybody, for joining us today again on Real Estate, Real World, where we get to talk to all the cool people. and I'm thrilled to have had James Becker as a guest today, so be sure and listen to us on all your podcast options. Go out and make it a great day, everybody. Thank you. Thank you for joining us today on Real Estate, Real World, where we talk with masters and leaders in real estate and beyond on how we can race the bar in our industry. Please subscribe over on iTunes. And while you're there, be sure to give us a review.

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