Know Thyself - E52 - RY X: How to Unleash Your Creativity, Heal Your Pain & Find Your Voice (LIVE)

Episode Date: June 27, 2023

Musical Artist Ry X joins the podcast today to uncover what it means to be a great artist and master your craft. He shares how he finds inspiration in the spaciousness of nature and why the ocean is his greatest teacher. He explains the process of alchemizing pain into beauty - that the most powerful art, comes from the deepest feeling. Explaining that in order to make great art, we must first be vulnerable and authentic with our experience, and excavate the beauty that is there.  Ry X shares the lessons he has learned from fatherhood, what his definition of success is, and why our voice is the most powerful thing we can offer. He also performs 2 of his songs live, and gives an insight into the meanings behind them. ___________ Timecodes: 0:00 Intro 2:37 Spaciousness & Inspiration from Nature 7:14 What it Means to Be a Great Artist  10:06 Artistic Mastery: Discipline Creates Freedom 14:02 The Creative Process and Spiritual Practices 18:32 Musical Performance: Howling 23:03 Sharing Music Vulnerably - From Performance to Prayer  26:38 Transcending the Opinions of Others to Find Your Own Voice 29:45 Transformation through Death Moments 36:25 Rising From Rock Bottom & Finding Solid Ground after Falling Apart 42:46 Practices for Emotional Wellbeing 50:20 How Fatherhood Changed Me 55:12 Success, Responsibility, and Meaningful Impact in the World 59:23 Artistry as a Commitment to Excellence 1:03:07 Ry’s Song “Howling” Explained  1:06:27 Musical Performance: Berlin 1:10:05 The Power of the Voice 1:12:27 You are an Artist 1:15:23 Conclusion ___________ Ry Cuming, better known by his stage name RY X, is an Australian singer, musician, songwriter, and record producer. He is drawn to the loneliness of nature: to the sea, to the forest, to the mountains - finding inspiration for his songs. His music has reached millions, with some of his top songs being "Berlin", "Only", and "Howling". He also pours his creativity into his compelling music videos and grand performances - inviting his audience into a deeper sense of feeling and connection within themselves. Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ryx/ Website: https://www.ry-x.com Listen to his Music: https://ryx.komi.io/#c3f39ab8-b943-4340-9e19-4105c4052c38 ___________ Know Thyself Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/knowthyself/ Website: https://www.knowthyself.one Clips Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJ4wglCWTJeWQC0exBalgKg Listen to all episodes on Audio:  Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4FSiemtvZrWesGtO2MqTZ4?si=d389c8dee8fa4026 Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/know-thyself/id1633725927 André Duqum Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/andreduqum/ Meraki Media https://merakimedia.com https://www.instagram.com/merakimedia/

I don't know that there's a more personal thing in the whole world than the voice. As people, we have the same unifying things. We all have fear. We all have love. We have passion. A lot of the role of an artist is to dig deep inside of ourselves to find a connection to our emotion, our experience, that then becomes universal. To go to that place where the veil is thin. To go to that place where death and rebirth and spirit live, that's all that really matters in that.

Is your need to create is the essence point. There is something deeply majestic about taking away everything else that you are to be in those moments. Go and do it. Pick up the guitar, pick up the piano. Your art is meaningful. Process itself of making it is one of the most beautiful, powerful practices I've had in my life. Hello, beautiful beings. Welcome back to the Know Thyself podcast for every single week.

We get the honor and privilege to sit down with a brilliant mind. in heart, sometimes a dear friend to learn more about ourselves and the world around us at deeper and deeper levels. My guest today is a Grammy-nominated artist and producer. He's toured all around the world and collaborated with incredible establishments and orchestras like the LA and London Philharmonic. He's written and produced for many big names like Drake and Diplow and John Legend. But as a friend, he's somebody that is just so connected to his heart, such a grounded spirit. And I I feel like he really does pour his heart into his art. And he uses his connection to nature and spirit to inform and inspire his artistry and his music.

And we might be even lucky enough foreshadowing to get some beautiful live music here today in the studio, which I'm so excited for. Rye has been such a pleasure to get to know him more and more. And he's an individual. Like I said, that it's a very grounded spirit and it's super inspiring. He's somebody that I feel like is not art isn't something he does. it's something he is and it fuses into everything that he does so rye thank you for coming on today bro wow thank you i mean i want that intro everywhere i got i'll do i'll just follow you around thank you it's beautiful to be here man yeah yeah yeah so good man so i want to start because you're

somebody that like i said i've been getting to know more and more and as a friend but then like also i'm just that you make such soul expanding music that i'm also a huge fan of so it's a pleasure to have both inspiration on both fronts. I feel like there's a saying that the creative adult is a child who survived. Yes, absolutely. And so I would love for you just to share a little bit more about your own personal background and story and what would we have to know about you and your upbringing to help get a bigger understanding into how you are and who would inform you to become who you are today. Yeah, I mean, the first thing that comes to mind with that quote or that idea is, you know, watching, growing up next to the ocean on this little island in Australia

and having such a deep, reverent connection to the ocean. I was born on, you know, a property that was essentially a permaculture farm. My dad was one of the guys that was early in the permaculture movement in Australia. My mom's a midwife hermopath, naturopath yoga teacher. So I really kind of grew up in it, you know, eating from the garden, waking up to my parents doing pranayama in the morning. And in some ways, it was easy to continue to follow that thread. And I think one of the main threads that I followed or continued to follow was the one of youth and play and making that a part of practice.

And this beautiful quote in a surf film I used to watch growing up, which was, you know, there was these travels all over the world to find the holy grail or to find this eternal life. to find the cup of life, this idea, this identity of people, searching for a way to belong forever. And a way to be young. And meanwhile, all they had to do the whole time is jump off the side of the boat to just play in the ocean.

Every surfer, every person that's connected to the sea in that way, knows youth and knows play and knows reverence with nature and knows kind of the belonging in the place within nature. So I think I grew up with that balance. You know, nature as a friend and nature has a place to go revel in and to remind me of who I am as a part of nature and also to be in play as we go along. Yeah, I've known you as somebody that really does use

your connection to nature and the ocean and the waters to just find your own source of connectedness and well-being vitality, but then also that goes hand in hand into your art. And so how do you, because it's very obvious, you watch your music videos, you listen to your music, you see your imagery and the visuals, it's all kind of connected with nature.

And so how does your connection through nature really inspire you as an individual in your being, but then also through your music? I think one of the major things is like the spaciousness within nature and the nonlinear time understanding, right? Like we're here in such a kind of short, brief connection in this physical experience. And nature has a much longer understanding of its role. And so going up, there was always spaciousness. There was always this idea of like negative.

space and I think for me in my art and in my music it's a lot about that if I'm editing directing or editing video it's like how long can we keep this shot how long can we keep breath here or in music how much space there's a there's a quote that I use with some of my collaborators it's like now that we have it can we reduce it to its maximum so can we take away what doesn't need to be there for its essence to be even stronger right so and nature does that in this beautiful way, you know, with fire, with rebirth, with, it's just this constant kind of beautiful dance of chaos and perfect planning at the same time. And, you know, for me, making art with an understanding of that, I think, is more inherent and intuitive. I'm not

too cerebral in that process, but I find myself constantly wanting to strip things away, constantly wanting to find what makes it most powerful and most spacious. And I think that's a lot to do with not growing up around a lot of people and growing up, you know, immersed in a connection with nature. Yeah, it's unfortunately, most people aren't able to have that experience growing up. There's a lot of noise. There's a lot of opinions, conclusions, dog must kind of put and shoved into youth. And it makes perfect sense that you allowed your creativity and your own connection to nature and that spaciousness to really blossom within you. And then you get to listen your, there's less noise within you and around you. And so you can actually listen to that intuitive process or

or what the inner voice wants to guide you through in life and what direction to move in and explore. And so your artistry and the development over the past many, many years, it's so hand in hand and I see how directly correlated it is with your youth. How do you view your own artistry and what it means to be an artist? I mean, what a vast question. A lot of the role of an artist is to dig deep inside of ourselves to find a connection to our, our emotion, our experience that then becomes universal.

You know, as people, we have the same unifying things. There's this egalitarian nature of like we're human. We all have fear. We all have love. We have passion. We have our grief. A lot of us have trauma. I think we all have trauma.

But, you know, we all have these things that we carry. And a lot of the time, if you know grief, if you've experienced grief, all the way down embodied it, learned from it, go into that place and make art from it. Of course that's going to resonate for a lot of people. But I can't make art based on the idea of grief or the idea of connection to spirit. I have to make art based on my connection to those experiences. And the deeper I go into the finite minutia of my own truth and communicating that truth with authenticity and rawness,

what I found is the more that resonates, the wider that resonates, which is a bit of an ironic pathway because you think you're going to talk about something that nobody understands, lyrically for me a lot. I speak about these tiny experiences, which are like photographic moments in my mind, you know, these tiny moments of a cheek, of an eye, of a feeling, of the way that the light was in that moment. And what's really interesting is they're the things that seem to resonate the most because people understand the feeling that's conveyed within that. So I think a lot of the role as an artist to zoom out is to go to that place where the veil is thin, to go to that place where death and rebirth and spirit live, and to be excavating

and pushing away the scar tissue that a lot of us build around that and to keep that place open so we can reach in, we can make art, reach in, but also reach in, make art from that place and share it, and then it becomes a universal theme. And it becomes a powerful tool for healing and connection. And more than anything, I think a reminder. I think good art is a reminder for people to feel in themselves. And planting that seed is much more powerful than telling somebody how to feel. It's powerful.

I think a lot of people probably get cut up and just trying to make something good or impactful. But the more you can make something honest and just true to your own spirit, the more that it actually will be translated and those who resonate as good and impactful. And so I'm curious for your alchemization process, your own life experience through difficult relationships, through difficult, challenging experiences, but then also really beautiful, ecstatic ones,

how you use that to then alchemize it and transmute it into something that can be shared with the world in your art form, right? It could be various different things for other people. For you, it tends to be music. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I think when you become, When you learn prowess as an artist that transcends genre, you know, if I'm directing, if I'm producing, if I'm writing, if I'm, you know, you get behind something and you feel like you start to have an understanding.

But music obviously is my first medium of expression outside of just being a human. And there's something really powerful about deciding to go deep, as we've talked about, deep into these understandings. But behind it, there has to be an element of also being good at what you do. and being dedicated to that craft. And I think it was Yogananda or Satchananda, beautiful quote, with complete discipline comes complete freedom. And for me, that really landed in my 20s when I kind of left the music industry at one point

and went into more spiritual study and yogic study. And I really learned. And in my mind, I almost changed the word discipline to devotion. Because discipline has a lot of negative connotation. So if we reframe that with complete devotion comes complete freedom. What that means is like waking up for me moving my body, being in nature, connecting to myself, and then diving into my art and diving into the practice and the devotion to the art. That means sitting through that itch to not be there.

It means writing 12 verses instead of 3 for the song. It means referencing all of the books and the people that inspire you around you from the different lineages and reading their work and going deeper into a way that they understand so that you become a bit of a vessel for this. If you're waiting for some divination moment in your art, it will come, but very infrequently. And if you want to be an artist making work, I think even in the sense,

prolific just means to create a lot. It doesn't mean it's all good. But to be prolific, you have to open that channel that we talked about, that creative channel, you know, to that kind of other world, and leave it open. And then with the discipline and with the devotion and with the work, it can come through.

And it doesn't mean it's all good. A big part of the process as an artist is to learn how to edit and refine your work. And sometimes that just means letting go of whole ideas and remembering that when your ego goes like, yeah, but that's really good. You're like, yeah, but it doesn't feel right. And for me, so much when I'm working, it's how does this feel rather than how does this sound? how does this feel rather than how does this look and so within that for me i think there's a framework then i can use my my kind of lineage of studying work and becoming a vessel for it and being the meeting place of these two things and within that you're then like the center point you know there's

this notion that i love that that as far as the universe goes outside of us it also goes inside of us whether it's a center point kind of and i think in some ways and i'm you live as that center point between the emotional, the spiritual, and how to communicate that to the world. But you have to have tools and you have to do it well. Yeah, I think we both have found our own individual tools in life that kind of allowed that vessel to open, but I think you're so right. Discipline does kind of have that negative connotation of using willpower and force to really like, you know, make what you want happen. A lot of people think that freedom comes from just like being able to do whatever you want. And if you follow that path for very long, not very

long, you'll experience a lot of lethargy and build up in the system and not feel very free, where you're speaking to devotion, finding those spiritual practices that you can stay committed to and devote yourself to something bigger than just your own compulsive pleasure seeking, then you can actually discover a different kind of freedom. It tastes like true, liberated freedom and expression. And so I know that you've had spiritual practices and yoga and meditation has been a big part of your life and practice. And that goes hand in hand to shaping you as a spirit and you as a being and that of course infuses into your art. So before we can maybe get a little taste of your music, I would love you to share a little bit more about your spiritual practices and

how that's informed. Sure. Yeah. I mean, as I said, I grew up in it. And there was a maybe naive presumption that because I grew up in it, I was the thing, you know, because I grew up in permaculture and yoga, therefore I just knew those things. But again, that moment really in my 20s in a deeper way when I chose to lean away from kind of the external need for validation creatively or in what I was doing and more into who I was being that for me is a big part of a spiritual journey I'm not what I do I am who I am my actions I'm who I wake up and what I'm doing you know and within that what do I need to refine and what do I need to work on so that I'm kind, compassionate, loving, witnessing and observing my shadow, doing some work on it, not putting

it back, you know, and letting the ego kind of run. And I've been through some beautiful ego deaths, you know, and for me personally, I really needed to go through those things. There was a lot of kind of gravity in those moments where looking back, they're the most grateful. And they tore apart my spiritual practices. Here I was thinking I was a great meditator that I was devoted, that I'd taken, you refuge with Zong-Sakensur-Rimbache and Sogi Rimbichet and these Tibetan kind of Buddhist lineage teachers. And I was studying Ashtanga and I was doing, you know, living in Bali and doing this whole work. And then I get completely destroyed, you know, a few years later. And it's like the constant reminder that there's a million pathways to get there. But on the way are we being kind? On the way

is our heart open. On the way are we being honest. That's a huge spiritual practice. Just honesty. just being really honest knowing your own inner landscape and choosing to speak your landscape to other people so that those around you know who you are and how you're moving otherwise again I think what can happen is we get this duality between the idea of the spiritual self and who we are in our shadow and who we are how can we combine that turn it over

there's only shadow when it's when it's in the dark as soon as you turn your hand to it is in the light So a lot of my spiritual practices now have come through the different modalities. Obviously, still yoga, connection to the ocean, connection to nature, breath, prana, moving your body and getting chi to flow out of your body, somatic release, the spiritual kind of lineage of the Mahamudra meditation that I studied for many years and my commitment to specifically sobri-Rubche or Zongsa-Khancer-Rimbhi. And a lot of that was based on the meditation of death and impermanence.

And, you know, we sit in this room and we have this moment where we imagine each other dying. We imagine that could not be just in 40 years, but tomorrow. And then what do we want to be doing here today? And how do we want to speak here today? And how do I want to live and how do I want to act to the people that I love in my life? And what do I want to put in my art if that art is going to be? go out to millions of people. If at some point I'm not going to be here to receive the adulation, what do I really want to belong in that as I move through this life? So that's the cornerstone,

I would say. But underneath and on top of that and around that is this very human experience that we have of fucking up and continually wanting to grow and develop and be more raw and be more authentic as I continue my practices and stay in devotion to those things too. Yeah. So beautiful, man. So well said. So articulate. There's many doors that were just open that I'm excited to explore and dive into. But will you play a little something for us? I will. I mean, like, yes, absolutely. It's always vulnerable for me to play music because I enter that space. And I would love to do that here. Yeah. Beautiful. Beautiful. Get all these little little. things to happen.

Yeah. Swallow my palin' Gold a spell of God we fell you were pushing and I laid bed. You have me

howling cold your skin on the night you let me under your sin you have me howling You help me, howling.

So good, I'm just the biggest fan. This is like the best job ever. I just get to sit down and have conversations with rad humans and get serenaded. You just share that. Man, your art is just so, so beautiful. I'm just such a lover of it. I think it can really feel like for me it just gets me in a place of calmness, but like lifts spirits and and I know so many millions of people around the world feel the same way you know so

just thank you for what you do bro thank you you so such a gift thank you man I mean it's a weird thing because you just enter this for me I like enter a little portal enter a little space when I play music and when I come out of it even just here in the room with you it's like I feel somatically that I've been in that place and then it's like I have to not that I have to I just gently put myself back together I put my like clothing my emotional clothes back on. Because you're really like on dressings with a very naked place. Yeah. Yeah, imagine anyone's, just imagine if you're here, I'm just like, hey, can you sing for me? Yeah, exactly. It is a very vulnerable thing. Exactly. Yeah. But there is this distinction with, I think, you know, a lot of what

people would say is performers versus sometimes artists that can show up vulnerably and it's an offering. It's a gift. I know you've shared that before. I would love for you to riff on that and how energetically it's different for you when you share your music than maybe some people are familiar with. Yeah, I mean, for me, I think there was this really defining point where I realized I didn't want to perform. And what I wanted to do was like have kinship in relation to my music and my art and in a way sing to higher place, sing to spirit, you know, and be witnessed in that communion. There's something a lot more powerful about that that is engaging on a much deeper level. it doesn't belong in all environments though so you have to be very conscious and aware you know where

and how you share because you are going into that undressing and that kind of communion and people are witnessing that communion so obviously at a huge music festival um which i play a lot of too it can be challenging it can be like how do i how do i go this deep into this connection of vulnerability and rawness while there's also all of this happening and all this range and i think the idea of mass appeal, at least in my world, has died, where for me it's about if I'm going to connect deeply to some people through my art, that's what I want to do. And I want that to be meaningful to those people, to double down on that rather than how do I make this song more appealing to a wide scope of people? And so within that fold, it's a very easy, easy veil to see through.

It's like, am I making this to appeal to a lot of people? Or I'm making this and singing this and communing here and then are people going to witness me in that communion and have their own inspiration of like that's all i want you know at a show um all i really want is and and all that i've worked for including set and setting the energy around it working with the orchestras bringing in these beautiful bands lighting projections video art is like how can i create a space that is a catalyst for people here tonight where i'm playing but people are having their own individual experiences with in the hole. And then when they leave, what are they taking from it? That's up to them. But the seed is planted. And, you know, there have been some great teachers for me. I mean,

watching like koali music and Indian music, Ravi Shankar and like Harri Prasad Drazi and, you know, Nostva Ali Khan, these people, like, when I witnessed them singing to, singing to God, sitting on a stage, not standing, you know, putting their hands in the air, I was like, that's it. that's what I want. And I found obviously an amalgamation of coming from this lineage of like playing a more traditional Western instrument and singing. But in many ways I see and feel my music as a very devotional practice. So beautiful.

And I just love the way that you shared that because it's funny, I was just having a conversation a couple weeks ago with another friend who's a pop artist and he's in this transition. There's this old version of him using his voice in a certain way. And his newfound self-discovery process and realizing that he really enjoys and feels his spirit lifts when he sings devotional music. And it feels good to hear you say that you can actually bring the same energy, of course, you know, that you would in typical devotional music or spiritual music into whatever your style is. Yeah. So I'm curious, how has there ever been points where the perception of how others will receive your music has changed your own creation process? You got to rule that out.

Yeah. You've got to just throw that out the window straight away. If you're thinking about other people when you're making your art, then it's not your art anymore. It's not from a pure, authentic place of your need to create. That's all that really matters in there, is your need to create is the essence point. And so stay in your creation, stay in what you want to be doing. Once you finish, once you come out of that, you can observe it maybe as a, you know,

as a person that's stepped back and looking at your own work, hopefully in healthy, vain without self-judgment. But the act of creation and going into the depth of that creation is really what matters, being in the process of creation and sitting, as we mentioned earlier, just sitting there and letting that happen and creating the time and space, the discipline to just be there and make that work. And then you refine and you refine and you refine. If you're thinking constantly, how will this be received by other, then your message is already diluted. And you're already taking in tens, hundreds, thousands, millions of people's opinions into your thought process. And there's nothing wrong with that, but what you're going to end up with is very different.

So for me, it's like when I close the door to write, when I close the door, figuratively speaking, into that creative process, am I in tune enough? Have I taken care of myself enough? Or at times, am I living in the beautiful, like, swirl of chaos enough to touch this other place? Am I in darkness? Am I deep in my shadow? Okay, let's go. Let's write from that place.

It doesn't always have to be from love and light. Actually, the best art isn't from that place. The best art carries the shadow with it at all times. And it honors the shadow, you know. But the choice is to be over here. And I think that's something that I just try to implore and bring into my work is to always carry this. And always carry the depth of the sadness and the beauty and the melancholy

of the human existence. while also honoring that in context they're much larger you know oh this doesn't really mean anything but let's honor it let's bring it in let's have a conversation with it I think it's super important

to make space for that part of ourselves that wants to be like that of course wants people to perceive us in a good light but then as we were speaking to earlier and as you were sharing it's more important for you to create something that is just honest for you

and where you're truly at and that will actually connect with people the most because it's real So I would love for you to share a little bit more about some moments where you have to let these parts of you die in order for more of who you truly are to come online to truly be activated. And so you spoke to briefly a couple of those moments where you got completely destroyed by whatever was happening through your life. And those death moments when you're really in the shit, you're in the shadow. Of course, they can be incredible inspiration for what gets transmuted into art. in a lot of your music, I'm sure, has come from that place.

It is important. I would just love for you to reflect on a few of those moments and how it's been transformational for you. Yeah, let's go deep. Let's go. You know, I'm somebody that I'm strong. I have like a strength in me and a will and like a power that I carry in myself.

We all do. I'm conscious of mine. I'm aware of mine. And these situations broke that in just the right way. Spirit had just the right dance. for me, you know. And spirit being me, you know, in my calling to want to do that work and work through some of this. And I'm constantly there. It's just, there's less excavation because you've already done a bunch of it. But the refinement process is continual. I would say one of the

most formative moments, you know, for me was probably five, six years ago in the separation of family, this idea. You know, not a lot of people know that I'm a father, because I'm a father. I haven't put that in a social spotlight and a cultural spotlight because I really wanted my son River to have his own life growing up just being him and what he saw around him was his world and then he can engage with the outside world when he feels ready. But I'm deeply devoted in my fatherhood and my single fatherhood and my co-parenting. And the process of becoming a father is or becoming a parent, as all parents will know, it's the first time where the self-centric view has to dissipate

because finally you're in true devotion and service to another being. And people that are in devotional work in their lives know this feeling too. The parenting one just comes with a big push all at once. And to go through the narrative of becoming a father and a stepfather at the same time, River's older brother, Tejave, who's my second boy? and to be deeply diving into that while I also had the birth of my art and I was away and in devotion and service to the world in creation I felt split and ultimately a relationship couldn't survive that duality within me

my shoulders weren't broad enough yet to hold it all you know and that's been such the beautiful practice to learn the things won't stop coming it's just how strong how able How much can I hold with ease and grace? It's a beautiful word, grace. And in that time, there wasn't grace, and I wasn't graceful, and the fumbling and the falling apart, and then going into the shadow self

and those things that come up, those trigger points. Through all of that, though, underneath the letting go of this identity of the traditional nucleus family and letting go of the identity that to be an artist, you need to be in your pain and struggle, and to be a father you need to let go of your art or to be a good artist you need to like run from responsibility there's all these narratives and for me i just looked at it all and i was like through this deep grief through this deep pain moments how do i find what is beautiful in my life

and in this life as a human person spiritual person and double down on those things how do i build pillars now of my existence where the temple of who i am can sit upon these pillars and what are those pillars and how do I shape them and how do I show up for them every day and that became the compass for me and that became the compass that I still live by that I'm still refining but there's such clarity now in the pillars and there's such beautiful co-parenting my devotion into fatherhood my devotion into my devotion into my art my devotion into community my devotion into spiritual practice would be four pillars that I could name and with that compass everything else can exist. Prior to that, I had no compass, which I think a lot of us still struggle with.

So a lot of it is how do you find what those pillars are in your life? And if you want to be a person touching art, touching the depths, touching where the human, emotional, spiritual world connects, your work's going to be a little more fiery, a little more watery, a little more to deal with in that space. So how can you get even stronger? How can your shoulders get even broader? How can your heart get even bigger? I mean the limitation, the idea of the limitation of love is the biggest one, right? I'm fearful because there's not enough love or I'm fearful because I need to be loved in this way. And there's something incredible that happened, especially in becoming a spiritual father to Tejave, my older boy,

and staying in his life post-separation, was learning how to become a father to all children because I learned how to become a father to one that wasn't my blood, this concept. And then how to broaden that understanding with my son River and the love and double down on that and double down on the love from river back to Tiavi and back out to the world and realize, wait, there's no limitation here in love. If I am opening my heart wider, there's just more love that comes out and I'm being fed by the universe behind my back. People may not see it or feel it.

some people say like how do you have so much energy to do all this stuff and tour the world and I'm just like oh this is like the lifeblood this is what I live on and when I come back I pour into my fatherhood devotional and and when I go it's the hardest thing to leave them but I know that also in being service in service in what I do I'm also teaching them to follow their hearts I'm teaching them what it looks like to walk a path devoted to the self to spirit to your heart and you wouldn't get there unless you had these deep moments of falling apart because you can't recreate a structure if it's pieced together with glue and sticky tape sometimes you have to pull the whole thing apart and then find the way that it can fit solidly together and for me that's one of

the most beautiful processes and then you write you include that in your art you include that in your conversations yeah when all that's falling apart you know it's it's a beautiful process especially once you feel like you're on the other side of it. But I know in those moments when you feel like you're not going to make it out, you know, you feel like you're in the pits of hell, your own experience, and it's really tough. Is there one moment or period of time, I suppose, that sticks out when, like, can you take us into that?

Okay. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. The way that I would describe it, my mind works a lot in analogy. And I've worked hard over the years in this kind of poetic brain of mine at times to, like, be more logistical and be more. more clear in my communication. But I think in this case, there's a beautiful analogy that makes a lot of sense. And if we look at emotionality and grief as a body of water, which is often seen as in, you know, the likening and analogy space, for me, you're swimming on top of the surface and you're

always afraid a little bit of what's underneath because you don't know what's there, but you kind of block it out. And then all of a sudden when these things start happening is you get pulled down and you get pulled down where color starts to leave. The first thing that you do is you're panicking for your breath. In life, in this life, you're panicking for breath. Because you're afraid of letting go. And at some point, even though you're out of breath, you're still alive. You're still looking at the world and you feel like you can't make it out of that space.

But you're still functioning and people are still doing things and the grocery store is still open and you're still driving your car. and then all of a sudden the color from the world starts to dissipate you know and the reds go first the warmth goes first and then eventually the blues start to go you get down and then light itself starts to disappear and the water's getting cold you're going all the way down and at this point you've kind of forgotten that you needed to breathe at some point and this place in grief is like such a scary place because you don't know if there's a bottom and you don't know if you're ever going to hit it. And I think what can happen in this basic grief is you get weirdly comfortable,

not comfortable, but you weirdly accept that things may never change and you just think you're going to fall forever. And eventually your feet hit this soggy bottom of the ocean, right? And there's no light, and you still haven't taken that breath, but you're still okay, you're still there. and it's cold, and then it's about making peace with that.

And there's some part of you, if you're going to fight that, this is the place, this is as deep as it goes. I've been there. I've been on that edge point where you go, I don't know if I want to live this life anymore. I don't know if I want to be in this body anymore. My choice is to not be in this body or not be in this space or to come to grips with maybe this is the reality now. And from that place, this is what's so beautiful, from that place where you come to be in a place where

you come to peace with the mud around your feet and the cold and the lack of light. It's one day the silt and everything just shifts a little bit. It's just a baby earthquake somewhere in your heart, somewhere in the world, and the ground loosens up and you just start floating up. And you're not desperate to swim to the surface because you know how far it is. And you don't know where you're going to stop, where the buoyancy will be. But you just start coming up. Suddenly the water gets a little warmer and there's suddenly some light coming

back through again and you're like wow light this is so beautiful oh this place is so beautiful right oh the warmth on my skin and you come up and suddenly you see blue for the first time you're like oh blue wow this is fucking amazing right and you come through the color range and suddenly you're coming up to the coral reef of your life and you're looking around meanwhile you've learned to breathe underwater but you're looking around and you're seeing turtles and coral and you're just like what is this place this life is such a beautiful gift. Holy shit. I didn't know that when I was on top of not the world, but on top of the surface of the water. And you come up eventually and your head comes up over the surface. And what was really interesting for me from this place is I didn't gasp for air. You just suck it in real

slow and deep. And you look around and you go, okay, now I start living. Now I know. And that place, once you've been there and touched it, becomes a cornerstone of air. every breath that you take. Because you're not afraid of the depth of life, and you're not afraid of the death of things anymore. You have an understanding of what it means to be in that place. At the same time, the revelry, the beauty, the gratitude that you have is a million X.

And yet, when you meet somebody else in grief, you see them and you're like, I get it. And you don't even say I get it. You just show up and your presence is like, yeah, I know this place. I'm safe for this person. And it's probably one of the greatest gifts that I ever received was knowing that from this place I could then understand grief as a universal theme, real grief, and how to show up for other people in life with that, and how to be compassionate and how to hold space without going into their world, without getting into their well and their water. But just knowing, hey, it's a beautiful day up here. I'm not going anywhere.

You know, when you come up to the surface for breath, we're going to be right here and we can't wait to see you again, you know. So poetic, man. That was so beautiful. That was like a song, a little journey that you just took us on. You asked deep questions. You're going to get a deep answer. No, I love it. And it was just so beautiful in the analogy of your own experience, you know, with the things that were happening in your life, getting to this point where there was no light, you know, and it was so heavy in depression and grief. And I think for people that have been going or either in that right now that are listening to this or have been gone through it, you have. energetically being willing to continue to release the parts of you that are no longer you and die

to the version of yourself that you thought you were over and over and over again then like you spoke to you you become a safe space an energetic permission slip and safe space for people to be around you and to know that they're accepted that their process won't be judged and that's like that that's the best thing to feel you know like you're with family in that space and so for you I know part of it is just like allowing life, time, the cycles to kind of do its thing and you started to slowly rise up from the pits of the bottom of that ocean. But there's also things that you can do to, you know, support you coming up and getting, getting that air. And so for you in this process of really honing in more on your own mental health therapy, you know, the different modalities, spiritual practices,

nature, if there's anything else you want to touch on and what really supported you in coming, getting that air again and coming back and seeing those colors, I would love for you to touch on some more. Yeah, absolutely, especially anybody that's going through it. I think will really resonate with some of this stuff. I'd say the biggest thing is looking into your life, really examining a lot. This is universal for anybody, anybody listening. Examine your life and see where joy exists and arises. Not happiness.

Happiness is very conditional. Happiness is a thing that comes. music is a place that makes me happy but it's conditional i also have a duality it also takes me into other spaces so what's the place in my life where i have a natural arising of joy and the definition of joy for me is really where is love coming through without the condition of what it is itself you know where am i feeling love in my life without it based on being a certain way for me especially in a place of grief but generally and for me that relationship

when I really looked and examined my life in the core parts it was pretty simple it was the ocean and the ocean growing up on an island growing up going through family stuff going through a whole bunch of things going like in my movement through adolescence into young adulthood

and realizing the ocean was the place I always went to so I brought it back to that place because when I go to the sea, I don't wait for the waves to be good to surf. I don't need it to be a certain way for me to find love and peace there. I just go and my whole being goes like, yes. It's a full yes. It's a melt into that. And for me, it was like my practice and discipline in this place is to just go to the sea every day,

regardless of the conditions to go and make that my practice. and to start finding and looking for what is beautiful in those tiny moments, the way the water comes off the surface, the way the wind does something, and start to magnify those moments in your life. Concentrate on the way the wind is through the trees. Look at that and stop there and stay there just for long enough where it expands. And you start becoming an expander in your own self of what is beautiful in your life. And then your energy starts going to that place.

And it can be tiny. there's this beautiful quote where it's like if you can't get out of bed it's fine if a week later you get one leg out of bed it's fine if another week goes past and your other legs out you know whatever it takes for you to get to that place and i'm not just speaking about grief but in general if you want to go into your spiritual practice if you want to go into your artistic practice devotional just start doing and start walking and start showing up for that path and look for where where joy arises and double down on that place and start to take the energy away from conditional realities and put it into that place of unconditionally. Because that is the place where you really

then have a foundational understanding of not being separate from things but belonging within it and belonging to it. And that I think is one of the major things that starts to pull away from the idea of loneliness and pain is realizing like, oh, I do belong. I do belong here. I do belong as part of this existence. Yeah. I could talk about this foul. It's great. It's so beautiful. I think we all fundamentally crave feeling connected to life around us. When we fall into the illusion of separation, you know, and we live into the mental person that we've created for ourselves and the perceptions that we have of the world, it's very lonely, like, non-enjoyable experience, but having those practices, and for me, for sure, being in nature is like,

the got to be one of the best ways to be able to just feel connected because nature is connected to everything else. We are nature as opposed to the definition. It kind of separates us from nature actually. And so that's, that's, I can think about, now that you're even speaking, it's like kicks my mind in. And it can be a lot more analytical too. Move your body. Yeah. Every day. Move your body. You know, go to nature, you know, be around the people that you love, regardless of how you are in that room. Just be around the people that love you being you. Those three things.

And then commit to something higher, you know, devotionally in spirit. With that, if that's the cornerstone of your life at any point, but especially when you're going through a hard time, move your body, get breath, release it through your body. Absolutely. That's a practice of mine every single day. I wouldn't go to the ocean and just sit there.

I'd go to the ocean and run and surf and swim and play and move. my body that became a part of my dance with her. So I'd say there's more foundational, analytical things that you can place on it. But whatever is right for you. Yeah. You know, but I think breath moving your body every single day, being in nature, every day if you can, being around people that love you and that you love. You know, I mean, we could bring this back, but like in death, right, in the conversation of impermanence, it was this beautiful talk recently. And we did this meditation on death.

And it was like, at the end of life, there's really only a handful of things. And it's like, do you forgive me? I forgive you. Thank you. I love you. That's pretty much it. You know? And so what are we doing in our lives to live by that code every day?

If that's all that really matters at the end. And we have to have some understanding of this realization of impoteminence in our life to give us the block to move towards, to give us the goalposts to move towards. It's just you also have to include that while you're waking up and moving your body, while you're being in your spiritual, artistic, devotional practices.

You have to have something that's larger than all of that to frame because then you always have a balancing force in whatever you do. It's such a powerful framework and understanding to not just have the intellectualized, idea of, you know, what it's going to be like when I die, you know, Yolo, you only live ones, but to somatically feel what it's like to be in touch with your own mortality.

Like, I'm here, I'm experiencing, I'm in this vessel, and one day I really won't be here in this way, in this form. It's wild, you know? Our energy may take different forms, different shapes, maybe outside of our own field of awareness at this moment. And to the degree that we're aware of our own mortality is the degree we're going to actually have access to more life. source of intelligence within us.

Yes. And so I think that practice for you with Mahamudra and reflection on your own death, like that's kind of just be so fundamental in your own prosperous and your own growth. Before we continue, I do want to touch on one more thing with fatherhood because I know that by being a parent, by stepping into fatherhood, I'm just curious what has, what do you feel like genuinely within you has transformed the most in that process from them coming, you know, from River First, you know, being born and then becoming, you know, stepdad also and that whole process.

What is really transformed within you the most and how that impacts how you show up in the world? I mean, you know, if you were to meet me and you were to say like, who are you? The first thing I would say is like I'm a father. You know, and I'm a man of the ocean, of nature of spirit, and I'm a friend, and I'm a member of my world and my community.

I also play music, you know. So for me, it's a cornerstone, fatherhood. and letting go of the narratives of success in certain ways and other framework to devote that time and energy into fatherhood was a very conscious decision. Fatherhood like my whole life, my whole week, my whole existence is cornered around, not cornered, it's directed, it's compassed around that. and so when I'm doing anything, when I'm on tour and I'm in Europe,

and I know that I'm going home in a week, my orientation is already grounding, it's already shifting, it's already changing so that when I show up, I'm not somewhere else energetically, I'm fully there and I'm fully present. And to my management, to my agents, to my teams around me that help me accomplish and move into these kind of, of bodies of work in the world, I made a call to them, you know, and I said, like, I realized I was sitting at a laptop and I was answering these very important emails, which are really not

that important at all compared to fatherhood. And I watched River look at me playing Legos, and he just came over and he's like, Daddy, could you get off the computer? And I was like, yeah, yeah, in a minute, you know, classic daddy thing. And then I remembered this moment where my father, who I love, who I have a beautiful relationship with back in Australia. the way that he worked, the way that he poured into his work. And I remembered this moment of wanting his attention and presence and his energy towards this work in the world, which was sustainability and permaculture and deep ecology,

meaningful things. But as a son, I just wanted him. And I remembered in this flash, and all of a sudden in that very moment, which is incredible in our human experience that we have this power, I closed the laptop, I pushed it aside, and I went, I'm done with that idea. Not just in this moment, but for the rest of my life.

And I got on the floor and I played Lego. And I started shifting my whole being into real presence, doubling down. And then I called my management, my agents, everybody next day. And I was like, hey, guys, when I'm dad, I'm not going to be available in that traditional sense. I'll get back to you when he's asleep. I'll get back to you later. But my devotion is here now. And from that point on, I started building a,

I mean, he's very young anyway, but it still took time to understand this fully. I started becoming his best friend and him, my best friend, and Tayavi too. And I started becoming a father that led through respect and trust rather than any idea of punitive authoritarian, you know, parenthood. I never raised my voice at the boys. We're a team, we do everything together. I stay by my word entirely in my fatherhood. And anything that I'm doing is in relation to that.

So, I mean, again, we could just do a whole podcast on parenting. But the idea that everything that we do in our lives is somehow self-centric, not in a negative way, but we pick a partner because we kind of like who they are and how they make us fear and how we respond. We pick our spiritual practices because we like how they fit in our world. We pick our workouts or our way of moving because it feels good. friends because it feels good. When you become a parent and when you have that responsibility with a being, you're not in ownership of them. You're a guide and you're there, you're there to

move through the world with them and teach them and protect them and support them. And in that, you really are selfless for the very first time, at least in my experience. And that became, you know, the chapter of the book pre-fatherhood was closed. And the next book, was opened and here I stand in how I sit as a father that also plays music. Yeah. So beautiful. Yeah. Love it, man.

The process of your own individual artistry, you know, I mean, I know parenting and fatherhood has been such a transformational time in your life and how you show up in the world. I'm curious how you view what success is or what that means to you because a lot

of times it's mostly kind of fetishized in the West, you know, that it's like, your numbers, like how much money is in your bank, the number of followers you have, the number of plays you have on Spotify is like, that's how well you're doing, you know, in the world. What does success mean to you? What does it mean to feel successful for you? Yeah, I mean, those things feel good too. Let's honor aspects of those things, but also put that aside in this conversation in a way because success, I had a beautiful conversation with a group of people that have a lot of gravity in the world recently. And there was a conversation about

legacy. What are we leaving? What are we leaving behind when we go? And I was like, raise my hand. I was like, can we change the word to responsibility? Like, can we talk about what our responsibility is with gravity in the world if we start to have a place of, you know, people coin the word power, but just we have more gravity in the world. What do we want to do with it? And success to me really looks like am I doing things with my gravity in the world that are meaningful? When I go out on tour, am I in service to the people in that room that night? Is there change and catalystism happening in these rooms? And if not, should I really be there? If I'm going to make music, the people that listen to that, that choose to listen to that, whether that be thousands or millions, is irrelevant.

what matters to me in terms of success is how deeply that lands and impacts the people that do connect to that work. The accolades recently, you know, there's been all these things that have happened in my life in the last year of, you know, being on the cover of Rolling Stone and the Grammy win with black coffee,

the nomination, you know, just like the Drake record and all these different things where people suddenly started going like, whoa, you're blowing up. And I'm like, nothing has changed, you know, for me. This is just the constant path. There's just more eyes on it.

It's just more awareness on it. It's just the consequence of you staying devoted for a while. Yeah. And also growing, not just devotion to the singular thing, but the devotion of growth. And the devotion to say, when Drake's team calls or when Rihanna's teams called me and these people, and they're like, hey, could you do this for us? Me going, I love these people as artists. I love what they're doing. They're frontrunners.

They're paving their people. path. They're not following people. They're creating. That's who I want to connect and work with. But also, when I go in there, can I bring myself and can I bring who I am and add that to their story? Because if they've reached out, that's what they want anyway. So how can I go to that raw place and vulnerable plays and bring some of that to this collaboration? And success is not working with these artists. Success is doing some dope shit with these artists and doing things that is meaningful that is catalyzing growth artistically that is catalyzing other people to like oh we want to go create oh this is dope we haven't thought about making music like this

or bringing that super emotional like deep vulnerable self into hip hop or into you know club music like let's go that for me is success absolutely staying true to yourself not sacrificing your own internal truth no matter what heights are people you connect with yeah remember we were just talking about pillars, one of the pillars for me is making art of worth to the world not based on success, on the cultural definition of success. Making art that's of worth, that to me is successful. It's totally apparent for anybody that hasn't, I mean, listen to Rise Music, but then also seeing the beautiful orchestras that have been put together through Philharmonic and the beautiful capturing is like so, so gorgeous. Where, where, where,

Where does your own personal commitment to excellence and high quality beauty? Like, where does that come from? Has it been cultivated? I know it's like you really take your artistry and how you show up in the world in that way. It's like a very sturdy pillar, you know. Yeah, I think like most people would meet me, you know, barefoot at my house, some surfboards string around, old truck. And be like, oh, this dude's going to show up and just be so relaxed on set or whatever. And I show up and I'm like, let's make the most powerful piece of art we can today.

And everyone's like, oh shit, this is a little different from what I thought. I thought we're going to have a flowy day. And I'm like, no, let's flow completely. But let's make sure that everything that we do is at the highest level. For me, if I'm going to show up in a practice, that's what I want to be doing. And art, I love all forms of art, personally. Music, but film, photography, creative direction, concepts, ideas. So if I'm going to lean in, that's how I want to give myself and how I want things to be

received. Talk about medicine journeys or something. You talk about set and setting. You talk about these ideas where people are opened. You know, if you're going to go on a meditation retreat, hopefully the conditions allow you to drop in deeper. It's the same with art. If the video becomes a piece of art in itself that allows the music to sink more deeply in, it's doing its job. If the music video is trying to capture something to get people to listen to the music because the music isn't strong enough, let it go. You know, that's kind of how I operate. add more beauty, add more gravity, add more weight to what you're doing through each step.

And that's been weird for me because it's meant that I've had to learn how to be a lot of things, editor, a producer, a creative director, and how to change those hats and say, I was on a conference call recently and about to do this beautiful project in the Sahara. And I said, on the call, everyone's like,

oh, we're so honored to have you, Ryan, we love your music and everything. I said, guys, today I'm a creative director and I'm a director. I have to put the artistic cap of the singer aside so that we can just rap and relate to each other in that way and then we can talk about this idea and get that to be powerful and then when I step in front of the camera

I can trust that and I can be myself entirely then I don't have to play a character to try to get some energy into the camera I know it's all there I can trust it so a lot of it is just trying to imprint myself as honestly and deeply as I can and everything I do. Wonderful. It's translated. It's very much so felt. This is a deep conversation under it. We're going deep. That's what we do here at Node ourselves. We dive deep into the deep waters.

But there's so many beautiful golden threads and themes that have been coming up throughout this whole conversation. And I'm excited that, I mean, you haven't, this is like one of your longer formal kind of formatted podcast that you've come on. Yeah, this is the first one. That's sick. I'm so stoked that you're. here for that. Yeah, yeah. I haven't, I guess I haven't felt cold in some ways to be in this intimate of conversation, knowing you as a friend and knowing you as a person and your work and the choice to dive in with intent is a beautiful thing. So I'm here for it. Thank you. Thank you for trusting me and us to come on here. It's so rewarding for me to kind of dive deeper into the

heart and energy of you as a person and, you know, show that side of things because there's always going to be, you know, it's going to be translated in your music and people can decode the lyrics of your songs and feel the essence of your work, but to actually hear the stories firsthand of what's really gotten you to this point, I think, is really important. Was there anything I just wanted to bring up with the first song, Howling, that you played here, was there any context you wanted to provide for that song, the period of your life, and then also potentially the next one that you'll do. Just like, give me some love.

You know, I think, again, we spoke about, like, the writing lyrics from a deeply personal place. My lyrics are tattooed on people's bodies around the world or my, you know, my songs are in people's weddings and when their children are getting birthed and these different things. What a deep honor. You know, what an absolute honor. And sometimes there are songs that are played which are completely wrong contextually

in terms of what the lyrics actually mean compared to the moment but their beauty is the transmission of the energy in that space, right? So in some ways I don't like to decode lyrics too specifically because what I'm singing about is deeply personal to me and what matters is how people resonate with it.

The song Howling is really a lot of the time I'm really writing about my relationship to the feminine as a man in lust, in passion, in love, in enamoring, in the muse energy, in all these places. And in a Sufi kind of way, I also place beloved, the same way that Rumi would say, beloved, he's talking about God and spirit, you know, at the same time as he's talking about a love. And so for me, I tend to do the same thing a lot. There's a metaphysical element to the way that I write where I'm singing devotional and I'm singing specifically about women that I've had deep, beautiful relationships with or connections

with. And at the same time, there's an element behind that woman of the universal. So Howling definitely brings in, brings in that theme. And I think I'll play Berlin for you as well. And that is a very specific, very, very, very honest song where I'm literally saying, you know, come down love, Berlin and the cold, all that fighting, all that snow. I've flown from Byron Bay where I grew up, it's summer, and I've flown into the middle of Berlin winter, and I flew there for the idea of love, and I get there and I realize it's completely different. And so here I am minus 15 degrees, is snow piled up, darkness, and my choice to be there, my choice to fly there for an idea that wasn't real. And the song and all the lyrics, sorry love, I'm running home, I'm a child of sun

and the stars I love. I can't do this. This is not me. I need to go back to the place that I am and the person that I am. So every lyric in this song, if you listen to it, is just very, very, like a diary, like writing in a diary. And the irony is you then go out and you play it to hundreds of millions of people through online and in the world, and yet you're seeing about something so, so personal. Beautiful.

Well, let's, would you bless us again with our little makeshift studio here? Let's do it. I'm just so honored to have you here and jamming. To be able to have this. the effortless ease of going back and forth between singing and talking. It's not easy. So thank you, yeah. It's all really vulnerable, to be honest. But, you know, that's the, that's the choice in this life to walk that path and to make sure that when I'm doing it, I'm doing it with my heart

as best as I can. Yeah. Do you see the voice as something that's just an extension of your soul, like how it transmutes and how it shares with the world? How do you view your own tonality and the voice and the way you sing. I don't know that there's a more personal thing in the whole world than the voice. You know, if you think about like, if I asked you right now to sing a song for me or to just sing, everything changes.

Your whole being is like, oh shit, somebody's going to see me. It's like saying, hey, could you just take off all your clothes and just like stand there for a while and let me examine you, you know? And it really does touch that place. I think between that and dance, I think those things are like two of the most informative. When you watch somebody move their body and you see their connection to their self or the way that they have rhythm and you listen to somebody sing, you understand them on such a fundamentally different level.

So for me with my own voice, obviously for me, I just see it as it's a part of me and it's an extension. And also in some ways I see it as the undressing. Like there I really am. in a way played out to the world from a very, very tender place. And I think one of the most interesting things is within that context, you have people that you've never met that feel deeply connected to you or deeply responsive to you. And you've played a role in their life because you've been a part of their world.

And at the same time, behind that you're a human being and you're a father and you're a man of the ocean, and other simple things. So my voice has become, I think, something meaningful to people. And for that, I'm really honored by that journey. And don't take it lightly. You know, the commitment into continuing to make sure that when I sing and how I sing is with my full being

and with my heart is really, really important to me, sacred to me. Beautiful, beautiful. There is, like I said, we could talk for hours and hours and hours. And luckily you're my friends. you can just continue talking. But it's been such an honor to be able to share you with the audience today and get a little bit more into the crack into the crevices of who you are as a being

and your soul and how it expresses itself. Is there anything else that is on your heart that you want to share, you want to riff on? I think something has been coming up for me a lot lately is witnessing. You start changing roles as we grow. and I devoted deeply into the idea of not the idea of the practice of continuing to be an artist making work that feels resonant and has an impact or mean something to myself and therefore other. And we've talked a lot about spirit and other things. And I think one thing is like a lot of people that I think respond to me want to be artists themselves.

They want to dive deeper into that part of themselves. And so I was just taking a moment to say, go and do it, you know, and put down what needs to be put down and move things around to give yourself enough space to devote into that practice. It's almost full circle from when we started into that idea. But even if it's just a little bit, be in your practice and maybe make some gentle commitments in your life. If you're wanting to be in your art, pick up the guitar, pick up the piano, you don't have to be good. you don't have to know the things about everything paint go shoot photography um whatever it is whatever modality put your hands on clay just go do and be and be in that because there is something deeply um majestic about taking away everything else that you are to be in those moments and um so if

anybody you know is connecting and and really feels called do it now lean in you know and lean in and remember that your art is meaningful, not because it goes into the world and does anything other than the process itself of making it is one of the most beautiful, powerful practices I've had in my life and continue to have and something I'd love everybody to know and feel in their world if they feel cold. Such a beautiful message. I think that commitment to truth and honesty and exploration of your own creative urges and desires and how that expresses as an artist is one of the most freeing things because that literally is your soul in motion. Yes. And we get so stagnant, we get so calcified, so stuck in our persona, in our personality, in our ways of being, that we feel

trapped. We're like these little prisoners inside of these bodies. And full circle moment, the creative adult is the child who survived. So for those that don't feel artists like artists, or they don't have their creative connection to themselves, it's rediscovering that inner child. Yeah. And being in play with that inner child every day, start seeing the world that way. You know, then and then followed in and pass along to other and and um i can't you know i can't wait to hear all of your art and see it like like i'm here i love i love knowing that there's so much more going into the world we need it and we're here for it in every form and yeah it's been beautiful journey today thanks for having yeah of course brother uh anywhere else you want to point people towards i know

everything that we mentioned today with different videos um performances that you've done will be linked in the description but where people can find you just anywhere you want to point people towards. I mean, if you want to find me, you'll find me. You know, I think that's the beautiful thing. And, you know, I think what's, what feels really beautiful is, is to just remind each other have these kind of conversations. And it's beautiful that you're doing that here and using a platform for that. And, you know, I'm going to dive deeply into the other things that you're doing and the other things that you're working on and anyone that feels called, you know, I'll be out touring and sharing my art around the world for the next however long. Yeah. So come and find that and let's be

in that beautiful dance together in communion. Yeah. So good. Yeah, we didn't even talk about like you just came back from tour, you're going on tour. It's a whole process. Yeah, my life is complex and perform big and I'm doing some of the craziest things that I've ever done in my life. The shows keep getting bigger. The way that I'm asked to show up keeps getting bigger. in my life as an artist and then in my life personally. And let's get stronger, broaden the shoulders and keep handling it. And I'm doubling down on my devotion to art. You know, there's many times I've thought about leaving and just being like,

well, you know, there's a lot to give to the world and to belong as an individual outside of that world of art. And recently I just went, no, this is it. This is, let's go. So I'm here to keep making art and keep pouring in. and I'm so happy for anybody joining that journey with me. Thank you so much for sharing yourself with us today and for everybody that's been tuning into this episode of the Know Thyself podcast.

Thanks for coming on this journey and me doing my favorite thing ever and getting to be serenaded and drop in with friends. It's so good. And if there was something in particular that resonated with you on your own individual path and journey, let us know in the comments down below. We share clips on social media and everywhere you can find right will be linked in the description as well.

Thanks for coming on this journey with us. Until next time, be well.