Knowledge Fight - 1100 Tucker The Man And His Straight Friend

Episode Date: January 11, 2026

In this installment, Dan and Jordan make the classic mistake of listening to Tucker's interview with Milo Yiannopoulos about why people are gay.  [Content warning: this episode contains a fair amount of slurs and disgusting conversation]

I know, no, no, knowledge fight. And Jordan, I am sweating. Knowledgefight.com. It's time to pray. I have great respect for knowledge fight. Knowledge fight. I'm sick of them posing as if they're the good guys, saying we are the bad guys. Knowledge fight.

Dan and Jordan. Knowledge fight. Need money. I'm not. Amos, you're on the air. Thanks for holding. I'm a huge fan. I love your word.

Knowledge fight. Knowledge fight. KnowledgeFight.com. I love you. Hey, everybody. Welcome back to Knowledge Fight. I'm Dan. I'm Jordan.

We're a couple dudes like to sit around, worship with the altar of Celine, and talk a little bit about Alex Jones. Oh, indeed we are, Dan. Jordan. Quick question for you. What's up? What's your bright spot today, buddy?

When do you go first? My bright spot is that my dispensary and I don't normally, I don't normally advertise, but dispensary 33, huge fan. It's Petition 33 of weed. Of weed. Right. They had a 10-year anniversary huge sale, right?

Everything must go. Oh, my God. We've got to move this weed. Include, include the medical, include some other stuff. I got so much for so little. Crazy. And it was nice. But what it made me think of was whenever I used to try and buy weed in high school.

You know, and it was like you would spend maybe 20 bucks on a couple of butts. and they were trash. Sure. Absolute trash. And I thought about it and I was like, if I had a time machine, I could go back and just fucking liquidate this shit for thousands of... This would kill people in the early thousands. Yeah, probably.

It's too potent. They would be... There's too much of it. Oh, it would explode their brains. Yeah. Back in those days, you would, like, embark on trying to get weed and you might not. Yeah. Like, you could hit up a guy and, like, I'll get back to you.

I'll let you know. Absolutely. I'm out. My guy is out. It's like that was a thing you would hear. You would hear it. Yeah. And just imagining back then a sale.

Yeah. Yeah, the idea of a 33% off sale. It's a 10th anniversary sale. Crazy. Oh, my God. Yeah, those days were more fun, I think. There was fun to it that doesn't exist anymore. But at the same time, it is, it was incredibly stupid.

The certainty of it is nice now. Yeah. I guess that's the trade-off. Yeah, yeah. You do lose a little magic whenever you don't have to go schlep for it. Yeah. You know? Mm-hmm.

And when it doesn't feel a little bit seedy. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There should be somebody you kind of don't want to talk to involved in the transaction. Mm-hmm. And that's just, that's just an important part of overcoming wheat. But I still think those, some of those people you probably don't want to hang out with. Those people with the weed shop?

I'm sure. I bet some of you just don't get a chance to find. out why you don't want to hang out with them. They're too professional. Yeah, exactly. They're professional. They don't have to be bad people. They're not allowed to be the bad people they deeply are.

Yeah. And you're not enthralled to them. Maybe that's the problem. Yeah. Maybe they should be free to... The power imbalance is the problem. No, maybe the employees should act more freely. Yeah.

Maybe scare you a little. Maybe sometimes ask if you want to up your game a little bit this time. And you're like, I don't know what you mean. And they're like, you know what I mean. I got a gun. That'd be great. That's a dispensary right there. It's customer service.

Absolutely. What's your bright spot? So, Jordan, it is the 8th today, December 8th. So it's time for more cheese. Okay. Cheese. Thank you to Alexandra for that sting. It is time to have more cheese.

All right. What kind of cheese are we talking about this December 8th? Today we got Red Leicester. Red Leicester. Yeah. Red Leicester means... Red. Well, I mean, I do you mean...

I would assume it's a British thing because it's Lacer, Leicester. So it's the L-E-I-C-E-S-T-E-R, and then they say that it's pronounced Leicester. Yeah, something like that. As opposed to Leacherister, which is what we all actually believe. I also need to fill people in because we've missed a few days just because of like when we record. That is how we... I had a bruchetta that was really good. Sure.

I had a goat cheese that was fine. It was a fine goat cheese. I had an adam that was a little too much. Never heard of an adam. What is that? It was a little too much. All right, fair enough. It was a little tart.

Tart cheese. Yeah, I didn't care for it as much as some of these others. But yeah, I forgot what the other ones were, but we'll fill you in next time. But now it's time for Jordan to vamp. Yes. What we are talking about, whenever you bring up an adams. cheese. The first thing I think of is the Adam from Adam and Eve story.

And I wonder to myself, if you're in the Garden of Eden, right? And there is a talking snake. Why bother talking to it? You know, at what point do you think, ah, this snake, ugh, not interested. Not interested, snake. Sure. Yep, what's going on?

Never talk to a snake, number one. Yep. Number two, you could have told me that was a cheddar and I would have believed you. Yeah. I think that's going to be a theme. That could all be cheddar? Yeah. Did you know that cheese all tastes exactly the same and everybody's just been lying to us the whole time?

You could trick me into thinking this is cheddar. Might be the name of the segment from now on. Cheese is all snake based. That's good though. I like that. You like it? Yeah. It looks a lot like a cheddar.

Yeah, it has a little bit more of a bite to it perhaps. But I could not really. describe it any more than that. Anytime they show the like, oh, on the amazing race, you know, they'll have the eight cheeses and you have to put them in, fuck that. Nope, I'll never win. I'll never do it. That olive won on this season?

What are you talking about? Yeah, that was crazy. Four of them looked exactly the same and they knew it. Yeah. Those, look, I love Greece. Sure. That was dirty. Yeah.

Or was that in Italy? I can't remember. I don't know. It was dirty no matter what. Yeah. Anyway, today, Jordan, we have an episode. that is dirty as hell. All right.

To go over. This sucks. I don't want to do it, and I'm sorry in advance. Fair enough. But we're doing it. Okay. And let's say hi to some wonks first before we get into this. Okay.

So first, shout out to the goons of sea spam, who keep me laughing through the nihilism. We're all going to die, but at least Lolax did it first. Love Norris. Thank you so much. I'm a policy won. I'm a policy won. Thank you very much. Thank you.

Next, who is Kyle Serafin married to? Thank you so much. You're now a policy wonk. I'm a policy wonk. Thank you very much. Thank you. And to John Musser, have a happy birthday. Thank you so much.

I'm a policy wonk. I'm a policy won't. Thank you very much. Thank you. And we've got a technocrat in the mixed, Jordan. So thank you so much too. Every time my band covers Mr. Jones by the Counting Crows, I fight the urge to sing Alex Jones instead of Mr. Jones.

Thank you so much. You're now a technocrat. I'm a policy wonk. Four stars. Go home to your mother and tell her you're brilliant. Someone, someone, Sodomite sent me a bucket of poop. Daddy shark. Bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb.

Jar JAR Binks has a Caribbean black accent. He's a loser little little titty baby. I don't want to hate black people. I renounce Jesus Christ. We all want to be Bob Dylan. Yeah. Alex Jones wishes he was someone a little bit more funky. Alex Jones and me tell each other fairy tales.

Yep. But they're slightly off. They're very different. They're different fairy tales, that's for sure. So Jordan today, we're not going to talk about Alex today. Nope. We're going off the Beating. path a little bit. And so I want to, like I've already said this, but I want to repeat it.

Yep. I don't want to do this episode. Fair enough. I didn't want to do this. Public demand reached out and insisted that we do this. Just public demand reached out? The world demanded it. The world as a whole. And as it turns out, the timing was just right. And I could have used a little break from Alex after that last episode. So here we are. We're talking about Tucker interviewing Milo Yanopolis today about why people are gay. and it's a complete disaster. Yeah. Okay.

All right. It is such a mess. Great. The extreme right wing that Tucker represents has decided that they've done enough demonization around trans people. And now it's time to fully commit to attacking homosexuality as a valid part of society. They want to undo that progress and are setting their sights on that. Yeah, that's about how poems work. For anyone who hasn't followed his history, Milo Yonopoulos was a blogger working for Brightbart who rose to

huge levels of popularity in the era around the 2016 election. He positioned himself as a gay man who supported the extreme right, which is his entire brand. He was a troll and he talked all kinds of shit on LGBTQ folks in the same way that pretty much everyone in his world did at the time. But he was a gay man, which gave him access to a different kind of trolling. And it created a very lucrative place for him to exist in that market. He was different than the other guys around his political space because he was fun. He was a sassy dude.

a ton of cocaine and he had a sense of humor. He really wasn't all that funny, but he had the speech patterns that sound like someone who's saying something funny, and every now and then he landed a pithy line. Because he was different from the stuffy right-wingers you'd find in his media, he was afforded a lot of opportunities that his peers didn't get, like being a regular guest on Joe Rogan's podcast and other shows that presented themselves as non-political at the time. Milo was one of the first large accounts who were kicked off Twitter, and it led to him finding an important role in the pretend free speech activism that was popular around that time.

He would plan speeches at college campuses and then monetize the outrage that was created by the student body, not wanting him to be there. Right. And it was a cycle. That was a whole thing. Among his contemporaries, I find Milo a bit more fascinating because beyond his need to incite outrage, there's not really much to him. There isn't much to him past this troll shit.

And everyone just, if they just ignored him, his act wouldn't work. and there would be no money for him. Yeah. And I do suspect that Milo's always known that, which is why he had to be more sensational than his peers. He had to do things that would guarantee backlash, because as people started to catch on that he was just trying to elicit a response from them to get paid,

it would become harder to create that response. By being even more extreme than the people around him, Milo was trying to make sure that what he did caused outrage, even among the people who might ignore some of the other guys in that media space. and being a gay man helped him out considerably in that. He was able to say flagrantly homophobic things that his heterosexual peers would probably have a tough time pulling off, and because he was gay, he never really needed sources. He could say something sensational about gay people,

and if he needed to back up where he was getting this from, he could always just appeal to his own authority as someone who was gay. I'm gay, I know this stuff. Exactly. He was doing really well in late 2016 when he was poised to release his auto biolute. Dangerous, along with a bus tour of public incitement events to promote it, called the Dangerous F Tour. What a huge mistake that was.

In the lead up to the book's publishing, some videos of Milo's podcast appearances went around social media and kind of destroyed his career. They featured him discussing gay relationships and include him arguing that relationships between older men and 13-year-old boys were totally fine if the 13-year-old is emotionally mature, which many people interpreted as him condoning pedophilia. Yeah, well, that's... That's what it would be. Later, Milo would go on to explain that a lot of this stuff was based on him trying to rationalize his own past as a survivor of child abuse and that he was raped by a priest at age 13.

At the time he did these podcast interviews, he didn't view that interaction as abuse and thought of himself as the instigator of the sexual relationship. And that perspective informed what he was saying in those interviews. Sure. I think it's important to let people who have experienced trauma understand that trauma how they feel as appropriate. It's not for me to demand that you take on my definitions of the things that you experienced in your life. So I think that if Milo had just said in these interviews that he had sex with an adult man as a 13-year-old and didn't consider it to be abuse, there wouldn't have been a problem. It would have been one person discussing their perspective, which you're welcome to agree or disagree with. But if he expressed himself like that, then it wouldn't have been heard as something that, you know, he felt it should be universalized.

Yeah. He wasn't just speaking about his own experience, though. Instead, he was making prescriptive statements that minimized the impact of adults having sex with children, and that basically destroyed his career forever. Yep. Almost immediately, his publisher dropped him in his autobiography, and he had to resign from Breitbart and stop getting money from the Mercer's. He became a wholly toxic presence, and most of the right-wing fans who liked his provocative antics in the past, they just couldn't justify this.

It was a bridge too far. His career fell apart, and by 2021, he was trying to rebrand as a formerly gay man, which probably sucked for Milo's husband. Ultimately, he probably made the right choice for his career because there was nothing left for him as a gay man in the media space that he helped create. It is too overtly... Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Now we hate gay people too much for you. Yeah. Before we moved past you... We needed you to help us get rid of people caring about you. Yeah. It makes sense. Coming out as straight was probably meant to be a big provocative spectacle for Milo to get back on top in the attention economy,

but I think that most people just laughed at him. Beyond anything having to do with a person's sincere or private sexual orientations, it just seemed like a cry for attention. He would then go on to intern for Marjorie Taylor Green before teaming up with Nick Fuentes on Yey's 2024 presidential campaign. And then that all got ugly. Yep. Along the way, one thing has become very clear about Milo, though. He holds grudges and he fights dirty. He released a bunch of secret recordings and private texts from figures in the right wing media like Paul Joseph Watson and Dave Rubin. So most figures in this space, they probably don't want to associate with him all that much.

He's dangerous now, but kind of only to them. He knows a lot of their dirty laundry for personal lives and financial models. So no one in the right wing media can really crush him, but no one wants to hang out with him either. Milo sucks. And I think he's one of the saddest figures in the modern attention economy. but I want to make sure that I say one thing clearly at the start of this episode. I don't care if he's gay or straight now. Sure.

A lot of people like to dunk on him about how he's still gay and just pretending to be straight to create a new space for himself in the media. And I think that's a fruitless attack. If he wants to say he's straight now, I don't think it matters. There are so many other things to criticize and make fun of him for, and in and of itself, there's nothing inherently wrong with having shifting sexual attraction. If anyone else wants to make fun of him for that stuff, I'm not judging them. but I'm going to try to leave that out of my critique as much as possible. Sure. Because I just, I don't think it's, I don't think it's necessary.

Yeah. Well, I mean, and it's not even about, okay, in that kind of situation, if it were to matter, it would be because it's a genuine expression from a person to another person trying to communicate with them. In Milo's case, whatever it is he's saying he is at any given point in time is only to exploit you. because without you, he doesn't give a shit. You know, it doesn't matter to him.

He exists as the thing that creates a response that you are doing, you are making. So whatever he is saying to you is part of the creation of that response and therefore isn't real. Yeah. You know? Well, I think that's probably true a lot of the time. But I don't want to fall into the trap of like losing sight of he is a human to. Right, right. Like not everything everybody does has to be insincere.

Sure. And there's stuff that he, you know, he's talking. talking about in terms of his life that are like, yeah, you probably are pretty fucked up dude. Sure. You probably have some real struggles. So like, it's not all, you know, what can I do to provoke a response. No, I'm with you. There's a battle going on too.

I agree. I think part of the reason that I'm far less likely to give him the benefit of the doubt on that just simply is because he came on with that kind of agreement that if you, you don't look at me, I don't exist. You know, so his even initial burst onto the scene is purely like, I don't have anything. I don't make anything. I don't do anything that exists outside of you paying attention to me, you know? And that's like, fuck you.

That's our whole lives ruined. Yeah. And I want to be clear, I don't have anything against that perspective that you have. Yeah. I don't have anything against that. Yep. I'm just the sap and the type who. You're a better person than me.

Keep a humanity in my view. Right, right, right. I'm a psychopathic murderer. Yeah. So one of the things that's interesting about this episode is that Milo doesn't come on for the first half hour. Okay. Tucker is given a little bit of a lecture at the beginning. Great. He wants to set the table for his guest.

Okay. And I'm going to just say this also in advance. There are a number of slurs that are going to be thrown around in this episode. Sure. and it is, I don't even know how to warn anyone in advance when things are going to get real messy. Yeah. This whole thing is going to be messy.

I presume we're going to be getting a lot of that F slur. There's quite a bit of it. You better believe it. But not from Tucker, at least not the first half hour. Of all the great memes and clips on the internet, Fat Kid Falls Off Bike being, of course, the top of the list, really in the last 13 years, 13 years this week, almost nothing created on this planet has surpassed in popularity or sheer hilarity an interview that took place on Ugandan television in December of 2012 on a show called Morning Breeze, the morning show of Kampala, Uganda, in which a trans activist, a woman who

now identifies as a man, came on and was asked a series of questions by the host. And if you don't know what we're talking about. Here is a two-second clip that reveals the essence of the conversation. Why are you gay? Why are you gay? Let's play that again. Why are you gay? It's still the funniest thing that's ever been on the internet. I think there have been some funnier memes, but whatever. So Tucker's starting the show on this note because Uganda is a country with a government that's very hostile towards homosexuality, which is what Tucker wants for the United States. And so his opening volley in this is to be like,

they're not so bad. This government isn't so bad. Yeesh. Oh, boy. You know, I was, whenever he started talking, I heard him say about the culture that we have created, you know, top of the list, fat kid falls off bike. So good.

You know, and I was just thinking about that. And I was like, maybe I was born in the wrong time. Like, wouldn't it be nice if he was like, like, you know what? My favorite book is of human bondage. Like, you know, it would be nice if there was something more than just fat kid falls off like, that's who we are now, man. At least when I was younger, someone would be like, funniest thing, dirty work. At least, you know, at least there's an effort in it. Absolutely. You had to go find it. Yeah. So why, why is this funny? This guy saying, why are you gay? Why is this funny? Why? Why? But why is it funny? But why is it funny?

And why does almost everyone find it funny? Left, right, straight, gay? Well, because it's kind of the key question, and it's kind of the question that no one in the United States is allowed to ask, why are you gay? And of course, it's being asked by an East African with kind of a quaint, semi-colonial accent, and, you know, conservatives can laugh at it,

liberals can laugh at it. Really, this is kind of the only way a white liberal in the United States could ever laugh at a black person. If it's an African expressing non-PC views on homosexuality, why are you gay? And of course, people in the West laugh because the guy's an idiot. Why are you gay? We all know why you're gay. Why are you gay?

Actually, we're laughing in part because we're not allowed to ask that question. Damn. What? Who banned asking the question about why people are gay? I don't think that's a forbidden subject. And I think a lot of queer art has to do with exploring that. kind of theme in that area. Yeah.

Countless studies have been done trying to isolate genes or possible variables in nature versus nurture debates. Why does Tucker think that people in this country aren't allowed to ask that kind of question? If you're asking it and you're actually interested in hearing other people's answers, no one gives a shit if you're curious, like, about how people engage with their own sexuality. Like, it's not a forbidden topic. Yeah, no.

Whenever you hear someone like Tucker say that asking a certain question is for It's important to understand that this is a signifier, that what he's talking about isn't a question. He doesn't care about the question of where does homosexuality spring from. He's already got an answer, and he doesn't like that most people in our country don't like that answer. He thinks that homosexuality is illegitimate in a sin, so when he asks, why are people gay, he's not really interested in exploring possible answers. He just wants to make the way he's calling gay people sinners come off like a question that society he won't let him ask because it's such a dangerous mind expanding question.

And it's just a game. Yeah, I mean, in a different kind of context, what he's really saying is, why do we allow you to exist? You know, like, and I mean, if you want to describe it sin-wise, you know, why does God allow you to exist? Are you just a test of faith for me? Because really, you should be dead. Is ultimately the underwiring of that, like a fox, myel. at chickens.

Yeah, no, it's almost like Tucker's doing an HR meeting. And he's like, what do you bring to the company? Absolutely, yeah, yeah, yeah. Why are you still employed with White America LLC? We need to downsize all gay people. Well, unless they can justify it. Oh, boy, that's no good. So, uh, it's settled.

It's settled. Everyone understands why people are gay, or is it? Actually, we're laughing in part because we're not allowed to ask that question. It's settled, though no one's really explained. what about it is settled. If you were to ask the average American, why are people gay? They would probably say, well, they're born that way. And then if you followed up with, well, how exactly does that work?

They would have no idea and tell you to shut up. Because, again, like so many myths or things that we think we know, we don't really know. We can't really explain it. But we do know for dead certain we're not allowed to talk about it. So when some African morning show host in Uganda, wherever the hell that is, asks it out loud, we can't help but laugh. nervously. Why are you gay? Tucker has created an imaginary arguing partner here where he asks why people are gay. They say they were born that way. Then Tucker asks a follow-up and the person

gets mad and tells him to shut up. What if that person is just Tucker's fantasy of what someone he disagrees with is like? What if it were possible that someone in that conversation wouldn't crumble after a basic rebuttal and you'd be like, well, here's what some people believe here, some thoughts around the subject. Do you want to do this? Do you really want to do this? Are you just We can do it. We can do it. We can do it. It's almost as if Tucker has created a fantasy of a person to argue with solely to justify

his insane position that no one is allowed to ask questions about homosexuality. This seems like insane behavior. Yeah. Yeah. It is like this. Based upon the amount of content we consume in our little bubble, right, we think that people outside of our bubble will get mad at us. if we say these things.

Yep. But we will never speak to people outside of this bubble. Why would we? So, don't just get mad at us. So we have created a situation where the people we are most afraid of are inside of our own heads. And the people who reinforce those people are the people that we talk to all the time, leaving the people who we are actually afraid of completely out of the equation entirely. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, you know, like it's cartoon shit. It is cartoon. It's so dumb. Yep. So Tucker, he's excited about this Ugandan TV show.

Sure. So he talks a little bit about it. And by talk, I mean, lie. If you watch the whole interview, and actually it's worth watching because it's really revealing both about Uganda and about the West. The first thing you notice is how polite everybody is. That tone, why are you gay, continued throughout the entire interview, which lasted over an hour, just watched it.

And the morning show host, whether you like him or dislike him, was just unfailingly polite to the guest, who was him or herself also unfailingly polite, and they were just sort of talking past each other. The trans activist couldn't really explain why he or she was gay or whether gay was different from trans or what was good about being gay. That was another question.

The host asked, why would you want to be gay? And the trans activist just didn't really have an answer. Tucker is representing himself as a person who's watched this whole interview. on the Ugandan Morning Show, and if that's true, then he's lying about its contents. He's either lying about having watched the whole thing, or he's lying about what happens in it. It's true enough that the interviewer and the trans man human rights activist on the show have a mostly polite exchange throughout, though they aren't on the same page, and he's right.

They kind of talk past each other a little bit. Sure. What Tucker seems to have missed is that there was another guest on the show who was an aggressively anti-gay pastor who makes horrible accusations about gay people and won't shut up, even when the host is asking him nicely to show his guest some respect. About halfway through the interview, this pastor shows up at the studio and has brought a bunch of vegetables that he uses as props, yelling about how gay people use them for sex. All right. The pastor comes off like an asshole, and the activist comes off as a person who has to put up with a lot of assholes who doesn't want to engage in schoolyard bullying.

Sure. Also, the activist guest doesn't fail to answer these basic questions. He does a fine job of explaining the difference between trans and gay. it actually explains that he's not gay as he's attracted to women. I get that Tucker doesn't like these answers or refuses to understand them, but he's just lying if he says that they weren't articulated in the interview. It's a big piece of shit. Yeah.

Yeah, you know, sometimes I stop and I think, you know, I pull back and I go, what is it with these weirdos obsessed with other people's flesh tubes that fill with blood when they see stuff sometimes? Isn't that weird? Well, there's a real morality to it, to the flesh tubes. Is there? It's just a flesh tube that fills with blood, and we're all fucking monkeys. So what are we doing here?

Yeah, well, I think that's an interesting perspective, and you're not allowed to ask that kind of question. I don't think I have allowed to ask that kind of question in America. So Tucker, like, this, this meme of the, Why Are You Gay? Yeah. This is a launching pad for him to talk about the morning show thing, but it's really to get to a law that was passed in Uganda. Right. That he wants people to, you know, be a little bit softer on.

But the host was coming from a position of total certainty that this is just weird and wrong. And that is the consensus in a lot of the world. And it's certainly famously the consensus in Uganda. And the consensus in the United States across both parties and pretty much the whole educated population is they're horrible because they think homosexuality is wrong. And we know this because about 10 years. years later in Uganda, the legislature passed almost unanimously with only, I think, one dissenting vote, a law against something called aggravated homosexuality. Aggravated homosexuality as of 2023

is a death penalty offense in Uganda. What? Aggravated homosexuality? A death penalty offense? That's medieval. But how is it defined in Uganda? Well, if you read it and you can because it's online, The Ugandan government defines aggregated homosexuality as gay rape of children, gay rape of the elderly who can't consent people over 75, gay rape of people who are mentally deficient, and the intentional transmission of deadly diseases to another person. So it's rape and murder effectively are against the law. in fact, capital crimes in Uganda. Hmm. It's a little different than advertised. So the thing that Tucker is failing to point out here is that the law he's trying to

sell his audience on is called the Anti-Homosexuality Act of 2023. It's a broad attack on the rights of LGBTQ Ugandans, and Tucker fully understands that. He's trying to put a good face on it because he wants the U.S. to pass a similar act. Tucker is trying to present the image that this law is just making a raping, children illegal, but that was already illegal. Yeah. All of the things that he's saying that this law accomplishes were already illegal. The category of aggravated homosexuality in this act, it does include things like abusing

children or the elderly. Sure. And those things should be crimes, but legally categorizing them as kinds of homosexuality is already a dicey thing to do. And this bill is pretty unnecessary. Yeah. But what Tucker is conveniently ignoring is that according to the act, which you can read, because it is online, as he put it.

points out. Yeah. The definition of aggravated homosexuality also includes, quote, serial offenders. This is because the act makes all homosexual activity a crime. But if you're only caught being gay once, you can get sentenced to life in jail. Just attempting to commit a homosexual act can get you up to 10 years in jail. Sure. Aggravated homosexuality gets a person the death sentence, and Tucker's trying to present the picture that it's just for things like people who abuse children. Sure. In reality, if you're just consistently gay, you will be considered a serial offender, which

counts as aggravated homosexuality and you could get executed. Cool. Consenting adults engaging in homosexual acts or attempting to. Yep. The act does a number of other things, too. For instance, if you attend someone else's gay wedding, even if it's an informal commitment ceremony, you could go to jail for 10 years. That's not just for getting gay married.

That's for going to the wedding. You can go to jail for taking any actions that are considered to be promoting homosexuality, which would include engaging in human rights activism, like the person on the morning show interview Tucker didn't watch was doing. You can go to jail for leasing or sub-leasing your house or apartment to a gay person. This is what Tucker is trying to sell his audience on, by pretending that it's all just about making abusing children illegal. He's doing this because he's a liar and a bigot,

and he knows that it would be too hard for him to just argue in favor of sending gay people to jail for life. He knows that most normal everyday people don't want to live in that kind of world, so if he wants to sell this to the audience, he's got to lie. And this is the way that you lie. Yeah. Yeah. Can you believe people are so upset about this bill?

I don't know. It's so common sense. I don't know how many times you can get into a situation where you go, well, these people, who I nominally trust, are telling us. me that it's only the bad ones. And then five years later you go, but it's everybody. And then they go,

ah, well, it's only the bad ones again. Like, you got to learn after one. You got to learn after one. You can't do a three. You can't wait for a pattern. It would be wise to start understanding these cyclical natures of this behavior. You got to get this one. This one's right on the nose.

Yeah. So the whole thing of creating the fake version of this bill is meant to, first of all, sanitize it, make it more appealing to the audience. Naturally. But also to use as an attack against people who oppose that bill. Of course. And so that becomes most of what he talks about. But it wasn't just Biden.

Here's Senator Ted Cruz, the self-described conservative from Texas. Here's what he said. He tweeted this. He put this in writing, as he so often does. And we're quoting, any law criminalizing homosexuals, or imposing the death penalty for, quote, aggravated homosexuality is grotesque and an abomination. All civilized nations should join together in condemning this human rights abuse. So it's uncivilized to penalize gay rape or the intentional transmission of a deadly disease.

That's uncivilized. Seems kind of civilized. but at the time nobody agreed this was grotesque, the kind of thing that only Africans would do. It's one step up from cannibalism. Can you believe it? Penalizing gay rape? And the intentional transmission

of AIDS, what do I think of next? It'll throw you in a stew pot, savages. Tucker constructed the fake version of this law, partially because it's the easiest way for him to support it without doing the really hard, bigot work, and because he can then use it to attack people who are against the law.

If this really is just about making abusing children and spreading disease illegal, then how could Ted Cruz be against that? The only explanation is that Ted Cruz must be in favor of child abuse and spreading diseases. Yep. Come on, it's clear as day. Yep. This is a very simple rhetorical trick, and Tucker knows that he can get away with it because he knows his audience are either bigots who get what he's saying,

or they're too stupid to consider that he might be a liar and is lying to their fucking faces. Yeah. There's no other real explanation for who could be in his audience at this point. Yeah, you know, it's fucking crazy because while it's, okay, all right, so you can see the pipeline, right? And it keeps going back in America. It's the like, oh, this is a reasonable bill. It's just, it's just for escaped slaves. It's not just for, it's not for all black people.

It's just escaped slaves that can be grabbed from their homes, ripped towards there, and then be forced to back into a life of slavery because their property. No big deal. It's just this. And that takes you to the next guy and the next guy's like, well, we got to get them all into slavery because they're all not people. And then you got the next guy who's like, well, let's just kill. Right.

The pipeline has been the exact same. This is the gay pipeline. This is that, no, it's just the ones who are doing this. To the, well, I mean, it's all of them. To the, well, we got to kill them. Right. But all of that, these people create this pipeline. But who the fuck is getting

caught in it and not being, you know, not capable. As an audience. You know, you're a, you're a fucking person, right? Like, grow the fuck up and look at where you're at. If you're in a murder pipeline, it's 2026, man. Or 2025 still. Well, I think that, unfortunately, a lot of people have probably got caught in a confidence game of Tucker and believe him to be a straight up actor.

Yeah. In the space. And so that's bad. I think that people are a lot of times busy or don't have the wherewithal to actually look stuff up themselves. Yeah. So they could take his word for it. And if you believe what he's saying, then Uganda just outlawed a bunch of horrible crimes. Of course.

And everybody's saying that it's so bigoted of them. Right? So like you would have every reason to think that everyone is overreacting and this is a bunch of bullshit. If you believe him. crazy. If they just took that affirmative step of like going to check and read this stuff for themselves, I think that it would poke some holes in his sincerity disguise. Yeah, I mean that just, but anytime somebody's like,

this is just the reaffirming of the 10th Amendment all over again. It's like, hey, you're making a lot of crimes against the law. Like we already, those are already against the law. So if you're making a new law, then you're doing something else with this. There's a piece of this that there's something you're trying to snobes. in here. Exactly. Come on now. And it's making being gay illegal. It's, yeah.

So, um, the, the international community also was very opposed to this. Unsurprising. Because they apparently are super into things like gay rape and spreading disease. Sounds true. Uh, the World Bank said they weren't going to loan. Of course. And then the foreign aid got pulled. And then finally, Joe Biden in October of 2023 spun fully into a frenzy at this point,

watching taking the lead to the World Bank, announced that Uganda would be expelled from the group of sub-Saharan African countries that benefit from tax breaks under the U.S. African Growth and Opportunity Act, AGOA, because of the country's, quote, gross violations of internationally recognized human rights, which violate the AGOA eligibility criteria. So that was 2023, so bottom line, no more money for you. What happened next?

Well, Uganda and starved. The next year, there was a famine. Not to laugh at famine, but it's almost unbelievable. So you ban gay rape of children and the elderly and the mentally disabled, and we're going to starve you out. And boy, did they. The United States shut it down. International aid institutions followed suit.

And the next year of Uganda had a famine that is still ongoing. 50% of children in Uganda today suffer of the symptoms of malnutrition, stunted growth, anemia, 50%. Half of all Ugandan kids are starving. And of course, Uganda's never been a rich country. It's had a lot of turmoil. Idi Amin was from there. Uganda has some problems for sure.

But the year after the West collectively withdrew aid from Uganda, billions in aid, they have a famine, and it's all because they banned gay rape of children. children. Okay. So I guess the point here is our values are pretty clear. We're for this and we're totally against questioning it. To be totally clear about this, Tucker doesn't want to send any aid to the

people of Uganda. Yeah. He was perfectly happy with the doge bullshit so he can come off that soapbox trying to pretend that he wishes Biden would have kept sending money to this other country because kids are hungry. Jesus Christ. Fuck right off. Yeah. You don't care about that. Yeah. He doesn't give a shit about any of this stuff and he knows that he's lying about the anti-gay act. Like this is just a charade. It's parodic. Yeah. I don't even

know how else to describe it than to be a, this is not sincere. This is what somebody on SNL would think is an extreme thing. This would be them being like, look at how hilarious. Well, yeah, obviously they would be funnier. But I mean, that laugh like, ha ha! Not to laugh at famine.

That's the type of thing people joking about you would Yeah. You know? And I was, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I'm, I, I, I, I, I'm, I, you know, I, you know, this isn't just extemporaneous. Sure, sure, sure, sure, sure. And so I think that what's going on is he realizes he's about to say that. Yep. That he's about to say that there was a famine that was caused by the U.S. Because they made this bill outlawing, uh, that. gay rape. Yep. And I think he's laughing because he knows that his audience is that dumb, but they'll buy that. It's an anti-stinker laugh. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, that's how it felt to me. Yep. I'm reading into it things that, you know, are just vibe-based. It feels very much like this is a, I can't believe I'm getting away with this bullshit. Yeah. That's the overall sense I got. Yep. So we're told that ever, that people are, they're born gay, you know, and all that.

Yeah. But is that true? We have been told for the course of my life that you're born gay. It's like handedness or eye color or height. It's just something that you're born with. God created you that way. You are unique. Your iris, your fingerprints, your sexuality, they're all unique to you.

And that's something not to be embarrassed of unless you're a white man, in which case, of course, slink away in shame. Be denied admission to college or a job. but for everyone else, your immutable characteristics are something that you celebrate that you should be proud of. Not something that you chose.

They're not something you can change. And this is the story that all of us have been told and most of us, me included, sort of, kind of believe that. Okay. And if that's true,

of course, you could never, ever show bias against someone on the basis of his immutable characteristics because that's wrong. It's also un-Christian. I think Tucker could make it a lot less obvious how white supremacist he was

if he just cut out the asides he makes like that one. All civil rights legislation protects him as well as all the groups he hates. You can't deny someone a job because they're white or because they're straight. In the same way, you can't do that if someone is black or gay. Tucker wants to pretend that white people aren't a protected class as it relates to civil rights because to him, the protection of other group's rights comes at the expense of his group's monopoly on power. Tucker doesn't feel like all groups deserve the same protections under the law. He feels like his group is entitled to everything, and any move away from that is an undermining of his rights.

It's fine that he feels that way. I mean, most bigots do, but we as a society need to move past the point where we take that kind of shit seriously. This isn't a political perspective. It's something Tucker should be working on in therapy. Also, I'm pretty certain that if scientists were ever able to find a gay gene and definitively show that sexuality is something you're born with, Tucker wouldn't all of a sudden start liking gay people because it's the Christian thing to do? The fuck is he talking about? Yeah.

It's ridiculous. It's, it's, it's, like, the, the conversation itself is such an illusion that keeps you from dealing with the central problem. You know, like, in, in Japan, there's a serious issue with blood types. There's a lot of prejudice around blood type, and that's absurd. You know, where you put your flesh tube, absurd. All of these things are absurd. And yet somehow they capture the minds of millions of people. It's crazy.

People are insane. Yeah. Yep. And I think that there is a, you know, there's a tendency towards like making it better and making it worse. And it's those kinds of weird things that human brains do. Yeah. Where you separate people based on these arbitrary things and, you know, you get hung up on it. I understand that people do that.

And it's a part of culture and we need to work to get past. We got a lot of shit to deal with. It's fascinating to me the people like Tucker who's like, your primary function is to make that worse. You are trying to make everyone more caught in those arbitrary distinctions between each other. Yeah, it is the feeling of like these people are absolute predators. This is a person who is literally tricking people. to hate other people so they can exploit those people for money.

Like, I don't know how obvious it could get. Yeah. You know? Yeah. It's crazy. So speaking to obvious. Yeah. 2028 is going to be another election, right?

Fuck. I mean, is it? Maybe. Is it? And it's obvious that Pete Buttigieg is going to be the Democrat candidate. Is it? I don't know. Apparently.

Early polls have shown that he is a front runner. And then even higher than him is, I don't know. Is anybody? Anybody. No, there's a bunch of candidates who have a certain amount of, you know, and then way ahead of all of them is, I don't know. You guys are disappointed is the number one vote getter.

Yeah. He's a leading candidate, but also he's gay. Or is he? He dated women. Is he gay? No one has put this in clearer terms than the former mayor of South Bend, Indiana. the former transportation secretary, and as of today, the leading candidate

for the Democratic nomination in 2008, Mr. Pete Buttigieg, here he is. I can tell you that if me being gay was a choice, it was a choice that was made far, far above my pay grade. And that's the thing I wish the Mike Pence's of the world would understand. That if you've got a problem with who I am, your problem is not with me. Your quarrel, sir, is with my creator.

Take it up with God! He made me this way. Notice the self-seriousness. The sort of JFK-esque gaze into the distance. Your quarrel, sir, is with my creator. A little drama queen. Yeah, maybe, okay. But that doesn't really answer the question.

Why was Pete Buttigieg's dating chicks for the first part of his adult life? Yeah. He's not in admission. He's dating women. Yeah. Like a bunch of women. He was. openly heterosexual, including in the U.S. military after the repeal of Don't Ask, Don't Tell.

Oh. What? It's illegal to be gay in the military, but Pete was still heterosexual. Huh. So the answer, I think most people come to, is, well, he was just ashamed of being gay. Like, he couldn't be his true self. He couldn't kind of let it out. Maybe that's true.

Though those of us who were living in the United States 10 years ago remember that there was no sanction against being gay. tons of gay. Television's filled with gay people. Those of us who worked in television around gay people, great gay people, actually. Just being clear, really nice, good people

all day long. Wasn't anything weird about being gay 10 years ago? 15 years ago? Don't go any further back. Only 10 years ago! Do not go further back. No, they were actually

lifestyle liberals. They're big left-wingers, his parents. So probably unlikely that his parents were like, don't be gay, son. It wasn't. They were!

I love pure talk. It is amazing wireless service with absolutely the best prices. Cool, cool. So, yeah, Pete's probably not gay. He's probably faking this whole thing. Because 10 years ago, it wasn't weird to be gay. There you go.

Sold me. What fuck is this? What kind of insane person? Because 10 years ago, you were still a prick. Yeah. Of course it was uncomfortable to be gay 10 years ago. Because even if the society at large was slut. rightly better with it than they are now.

Assholes like you still existed. Yeah. And got a bunch of other assholes to hate. Yeah. I mean, when gay marriage was passed in the Supreme Court, you know, that was fairly modern history. And people were furious about that. Absolutely. So there's a lot of backlash.

Yeah. Towards that. There's a lot of reasons. There's still hate crimes that happen quite regularly. Everybody has their own constellation of personal things to various family members. various friends. Ten years ago is such a great number. Ten years ago is such a great number

because it's like 15 years ago motherfucking Obama was against gay people getting married. Like that's how fucking crazy people are. Well like ten years ago was like the Unite the Right rally. Exactly. I don't know if it was a great time. That's fair. That's fair. I'm just saying from the perspective

of a person who's like, hey, the people who don't want to hate gay people were slightly cooler with it back then. And that was a fucking Obama, you know, like fucking hey, buddy, Jesus Christ. So look, Pete, I think he might not be gay. Maybe he's not, maybe he is. I don't know. Who knows?

Fine, fine, fine, fine, fine, fine, fine, fine. But even if he's not, that is all who he is. You know, that's just all he is. That's a great way to talk about somebody. The day isn't just this thing about Pete Buttigieg. It's the whole point of Pete Buttigieg. It is the reason that he has the plurality of support from Democratic primary voters who are not black. His support among black voters?

They're more in the, why are you gay, Cam? They're not impressed at all. In fact, I'm trying to do the math here. I think his support, people to judge's current support among African-American Democratic primary voters is, let's see, around zero. So zero percent in that range, meaning nobody. like no black people. They're not going for it. What are you gay?

You can almost hear them saying that. Yeah, you almost can't. Or you can't. You can't. You can't. You can't hear them say that. For someone like Tucker, the fact that Pete put a judge is a gay man

is the totality of his identity. Tucker sees Pete and he just sees a gay guy. That's his whole thing. What else is there to you? I already know what you're all about. You got it. And that's kind of weird. I mean, it's, it is the person

And not, believe me, these are not similar in terms of like how they work, but they are in an idea, right? Like when Jackie Robinson is playing baseball, people are going, oh, he's still just the black guy who plays baseball, right? He was fucking amazing at baseball. He's playing baseball. Exactly. But because he's there and everybody else is why, they just want a black guy. They tokenize somebody who is proving excellence as another way of taking. away like any quality of individuality you have.

Yeah. Any competence. Yeah. Any excellence. Yep. They just remove it because if it's not and detriment to you, then it's going to remove anything that you can do. Yeah.

And while I was listening to this and going through it, I started to realize like, you know what? I mean, obviously this is a really deeply anti-gay pivot that Tucker's engaged in here. Yep. And it's interesting that a bit of it is about Pete Buttigieg. And it made me realize, like, this might be preemptive ground laying in case Pete is the candidate. Sure, sure, sure, sure. Like, let's get everyone really mad at gay people.

Before we even begin, let's make sure half the country hates him and thinks that Harvey Milkwood should be relitigated. Yeah, yeah, I think that's kind of part of the strategy. Gotcha. But among white liberals, Pete Buttigieg's gayness, the fact he's married to a dude called Chason and has, somehow acquired babies somehow. How do you get babies? Just sort of buy them somewhere. Whatever.

He has these babies. And he is the model of whatever, a modern gay man. That's the whole point. He is a civil rights hero because of who he sleeps with. Pretty.