Life Kit - Your Boss Wants You Back. But Is It Safe?

Episode Date: July 7, 2020

Returning to work during the COVID-19 pandemic? This episode helps workers understand their rights, including current rules about unemployment, safety concerns and underlying conditions.Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

Hi, this is Ryan Mulhern. One of the things I miss most during quarantine is going to the movies. If you want to support your local independent theater, check online and see if they might be offering movies to stream or other content like Q&As with filmmakers. And maybe consider donating or buying a gift card. This is NPR's Life Kit. I'm Yuki Noguchi. And I'm Chris Arnold. And we've both been doing stories about the impact of reopening as business all over the country are trying to resume some kind of normalcy here amidst the pandemic. Right. And depending on where you live and when you're listening to this, it varies, right? Because phase two is different than phase three. But of course, that means different things in different states. Cases were down and now they're up again. Everyone is living with different realities. And while all these things are changing, some people are thinking, should I go back to work? Some people are already back at work and some people are like, wait a minute, you know, this is way not safe. How come nobody's wearing a mask here? People are running into all kinds of

problems. Right. So in this episode, we're going to talk about workers' rights in the age of coronavirus and what those rules are, what can workers expect, and what to do if your employer isn't following those recommendations. Admittedly, there's a lot of obstacles to that, but we are going to give you a few solid, actionable things that you can do as you decide whether to go back to work and how to go back to work and try to stay safe. You know, I've been really busy myself with extra work, although not paid. I'm now a short order chef, as it turns out, a homeschool teacher, and a camp administrator. In addition to that, I've also been my entire family's barber. Not half bad, if I can say so myself.

But I've heard you ventured outside for a haircut recently, so your barber's back at work. What's that transition been like for him? Yeah, I was a little embarrassed about it because I'm like a man of a certain age and just gets like all wispy on the top. And when I heard that my salon was reopening and my guy, Vincent, his name is Vincent Cox, he cuts my hair. So I called him and he's like, yeah, you know, we're reopening, come in next week. And I just was like, what am I going to put vanity ahead of my safety? But I was like, yeah, yeah, I am. He's like, look, the salon's opening. Come on down. We got face masks. It'll be OK.

He's done all kinds of innovations in haircutting before. He was telling me he's cut rock stars hair on airplanes. The Rolling Stones. That was dangerous duty, too, you know, in the 70s. A different kind of dangerous. A different kind of danger. Because there's no social distancing when you're cutting hair. Yeah.

And he's scared. He's 65 years old. 80 percent of COVID-19 deaths are people his age or older. And he's touching people's heads all day. I mean, like he's breathing next to people. I mean, it's just impossible to not have any social contact. I cut my dentist's hair. He was like just warning me and telling me, Vincent, don't take off your N95s. You know, my doctor, they're worried sick about me. It's been one of the hardest things I've ever done in my life. I was almost in tears the first day. I was almost in tears. But Vincent is lucky in many ways because, you know, his workplace is at least taking safety precautions very seriously. Yeah, they are. And, you know, this actually brings us to takeaway number one,

which is talk to your employer and express your concerns and try to work together. If you're in a job where you have that kind of relationship with your employer, and Vincent did, he went to the owner of the salon. He's like, look, we got a patio. We should be cutting hair out back on the patio. And he brought in mirrors and set up three workstations outside, you know, which meant they could do even better social distancing inside. And it was a really good example of them working together to make this as safe as they possibly could. So what are the rules here? What rights do workers have to a safe environment? I mean, look, at the federal level, the rules are there are no rules. In terms of mandatory federal safety requirements, everything's voluntary.

And there's tons of criticism about that. Former officials from the Labor Department and the CDC and OSHA are all tearing out their hair because, for example, restaurants, the guidance from the Centers for Disease Control recommends employers, quote, actively encourage workers to stay home if they were in close contact with a coworker who got COVID-19. But actively encourage is like totally voluntary. But at the state level, that's different, right?

Because states are putting in enforceable requirements. Right. Since the federal government's arguably not doing much, all of this is falling to the states. And we're seeing big differences from state to state, but some of them are, I mean, just look at the phased openings and stuff, right? I mean, right there, those are actual rules. You can't open the bar if the state of Massachusetts says you can't open the bar or the state of California or whatever. And then there's a million other rules, too. And that's evolving. So, you know,

there's a little bit of hope there that, OK, some more rules are coming into play, at least in some states. You know, Chris, I know you've been talking to workers in some of these states where cases have been spiking recently. And, you know, what are their concerns or what are you hearing? Well, you know, it's all over the map. Let's talk about one worker, Alexandra, who works at a restaurant in Austin, Texas. And she only wants to use her first name because she's being kind of critical of the restaurant. And a number of things haven't seemed safe. For one, there's a checklist every hour. She's supposed to sanitize doorknobs and handrails and clean high touch surfaces, kind of like, you know, the hair salon.

But she admits when it gets busy and a lot of customers are there, they just can't do the cleaning. One time a newer manager asked all of us, actually, just make sure the paper gets filled out, whether you do it or not. And I didn't really think that was cool. But, you know, I mean, I try to keep up with it as much as I can. So basically, they're like forging the paperwork to make it look like they're doing something. Yeah. And she just feels like there's nothing she can do. And actually, recently, somebody in the restaurant got sick with COVID symptoms and they sent him home. And she says before the test results even came back, they had put her back on the schedule

to keep working. They did not tell us to stay home. And that felt really confusing and almost like the sense like I'm the crazy one, because I feel like I am taking it more seriously than the restaurant is. You know, it's interesting because I've heard that, too, from a number of workers in Arkansas or North Carolina. They're not wearing masks at work. So, you know, what can workers do if they feel unsafe? One good option, actually, because you can do it confidentially, is you can file a complaint with OSHA. That's the Occupational Safety and Health Administration. And if a workplace isn't even following those suggested voluntary guidelines, you can file

a complaint at OSHA.gov. You can do it confidentially. And what that will trigger is that OSHA will contact the employer and basically say, hey, we got a complaint that you've got an unsafe workplace. Which puts them on notice and they might actually react to that, even if there is no actual enforcement capacity. Exactly right. I mean, OSHA is probably not going to do anything, but the business doesn't know that. And businesses tend to be afraid of OSHA. And I mean, look, November's coming. It could very well be that there's another administration that will take this much more seriously. And now this employer has on their books, there is a complaint at the federal level about safety. It can be enough of a nudge to make a change. And what about the state? Since the states are enforcing some of these rules, what can you do there to file a complaint with the state? Well, workers can call their state

health department, the governor's office, and the AG's office and look on their websites. And there, you can find out what the rules are in your state. You can often find out subcategories. What are the rules for restaurants? What are the rules for hair salons? And find out, okay, what's my employer supposed to be doing? And then call the state health department or the AG's office and say, hey, look, you know, I don't want to use my name. I don't get in trouble, but they're not following the rules. What can I do? That's a pretty heavy lift for somebody. You know, it might feel scary to do that, to report your boss to the state, especially in an environment like this one, where, you know, jobs are more scarce these days. Of course. Yes. But it's like, this is where we

are. You know, it's like if it's your health and, you know, you're living with a parent who's 85 or something and you're really concerned. Yeah, that's a terrible choice. You know, your health or your or your livelihood or your livelihood. And I think if people can do it in a way where they're not sort of outing themselves to their employer, they're calling saying, hey, what are the options? You know, you could at least try to push for change. And again, file that complaint with OSHA. That could be confidential. Mm hmm.

So can you give us a flavor of what different states are doing, what they're requiring to try to keep employers abiding by public health standards? Yeah, I mean, you know, there's a lot of different things happening. But for example, in Minnesota, the governor ordered that employers cannot fire workers for what we were just talking about, for refusing to work in a workplace that they believe is unsafe. If you say, look, no, no one's wearing a mask. I'm uncomfortable. They can't fire you. In Michigan, the governor has ordered employers to supply workers with masks and also to require workers to wear the masks if they can't be six feet apart. Not like the federal guidelines or federal recommendations. Right. And some states

are putting together what are starting to be held up as models like Virginia is one that this kind of comprehensive lots and lots of rules that are enforced by state inspectors and there's $100,000 fines and they might close businesses. I mean, so as we go forward, there is some hope here that some states at least are getting more aggressive and like, all right, you know, we got to enforce some stuff here. You know, one of the more complicated aspects of this in terms of thinking about going back to work is the people who have underlying health conditions, right? Those are the people who are more vulnerable to COVID. Are there special protections for workers with those kinds of issues? Yeah, there are. And they're not coming from the CDC and OSHA, but Congress, when it passed the CARES Act, one of the things they did was they said, look, if you're immunosuppressed, you've got a serious health problem, even if your employer says, OK, we're opening back up, you can come back to the office, you can stay on unemployment. Because normally, if you have a job to go to, you can't keep collecting.

The CARES Act says, yes, you can. You get a note from a doctor. It's a little touch and go because you've got to go through the state unemployment office and they may say, nah, you can. You get a note from a doctor. It's, you know, a little touch and go because you got to go through the state unemployment office and they may say, nah, it's not serious enough. But there are a lot of people who are getting this benefit and it's really, really important. And they're getting their expanded benefit of $600 a week on top of whatever state benefit they might get. Right. And just like with everybody else on unemployment, that is giving people a living wage. That's going to expire along with everybody else at the end of July. And there's a lot of pressure on Congress to either extend it or come up with something else, because otherwise you're going to have all these sick people.

Who are going back to work even if they are vulnerable and sick. Because they can't afford to not do that. Yeah. And did you talk to anybody like that? Well, I talked to one person, Brianna Finnell, who is in Orange County, California. She is a singer. She does opera. She does voice lessons. She's just graduating from graduate school. And so she teaches at a music school and the music school is opening. So she thought when the music school reopens, she can't get unemployment. She's like, OK, I have a job. I can't get it.

And then I was like, well, no, there's this whole pandemic unemployment thing. You could apply for that and see. And she has a note from a doctor. She's got really serious asthma. She gets hospitalized. She's really worried, but she's really too scared to go back to work. Very frustrating, very scary during this time when having asthma could put you in the hospital or kill you. And I don't think that just because I'm young means I'm disposable. You know, I've been reading about choirs trying to mask. And I don't know. I've tried singing with a mask.

It's just not possible. And I can't even really do my job. You know, it occurs to me, Chris, that the risk is not the same everywhere, right? It's very different depending on where you live. Right. People should look at what's going on at sort of the county level if they can do it, the state level. In Boston, cases are way down. So I feel less scared about my friend Vince cutting hair. For him to go back to work is a different decision maybe or a lower risk decision than somebody in Arizona. Right. Because it's different whether you have two cases or 200 cases in your county.

And, you know, actually there is a new tool at globalepidemics.org. It's a Harvard tool that, you know, allows you to assess that risk county by county. Because you're right. I mean, depending on which county you're in, your state may be doing well, but your county may not. And it's important to know what that distinction is. And, you know, that might help people decide whether, you know, whether it's too risky for them to go back to work. Yeah. And again, there's no perfect answer and everybody's trying to be an epidemiologist, but I think it can give you some, you know, handle on what the risk is in your area. Yeah. I mean, I think,

look, if there's anything that we've learned from this whole pandemic, it's that everything is a moving target. And so as things spike, you know, it's important to know what's going on in your local area, not just in your state, but in your local area. All right. So we covered a lot of ground. Chris, let's do the takeaways. Okay. Tip number one, talk to your employer. If you can be like Vince and set stuff up outside and make it work, that can be a great option. And tip number two, call OSHA anyway. That's the Occupational Safety and Health Administration. We say anyway, because they're probably not going to do much. The rules aren't that enforceable at the federal level, but they will call your employer.

That can be a really strong nudge to get them to feel like, uh-oh, government's calling. Maybe I should do this in a safer way. And tip three, find out your state level protections. So call the health department in your state, the attorney general's office, or the governor's office because states are the only ones who are enforcing rules. And tip number four,

if you do have an underlying serious health condition, you may be able to stay on unemployment, like heart condition, diabetes, you're immunocompromised, you need a note from your doctor, call your state unemployment office and see if you can remain on unemployment. Tip number five, gauge your risk, especially in your local area. Find out how many cases there are and try to gauge what risk you're taking by going to work.

That's it for this episode. Chris, thanks so much for joining us. Absolutely. For more NPR Life Kit, check out our other episodes. If you're lucky enough to be still working from home, I hosted an episode with tips all about how to do that. You can find those at npr.org slash life kit. And if you love Life Kit and want more, subscribe to our newsletter at npr.org slash LifeKit newsletter. If you've got a good tip, leave us a voicemail at 202-216-9823 or email us at LifeKit at NPR dot org. This episode was produced by Sylvie Douglas. Megan

Kane is the managing producer. Beth Donovan is the senior editor. Our digital editor is Beck Harlan and our editorial assistant is Claire Schneider. I'm Yuki Noguchi. Thanks for listening. These days, Chelsea Handler tries to keep her and her friend's white privilege in check. She starts really getting weepy and I was like, well, what are you doing right now? You just said you read

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