Locked On Mariners - Daily Podcast On the Seattle Mariners - Mariners Arbitration Projections Released + Morosi Says They Should Trade For J-Ram?!

Episode Date: October 6, 2023

MLBTradeRumors.com has released their annual arbitration projections, so Colby and Ty look through the list and discuss which Mariners players should be tendered a contract this offseason, as well as which non-tender candidates outside of the organization could be of interest to Seattle this winter. Later on, the duo react to an interesting quote from MLB Network's Jon Morosi during his recent appearance on 710 Seattle Sports, with Morosi saying Seattle should target a superstar this offseason, but not Shohei Ohtani nor Juan Soto.Follow the show on Twitter: @LO_Mariners | @danegnzlz | @CPat11Support Us By Supporting Our Sponsors!Jase MedicalSave more than $360 by getting these lifesaving antibiotics with Jase Medical plus an additional $20 off by using code LOCKEDON at checkout on jasemedical.com.  eBay MotorsKeep your ride-or-die alive at ebay.com/motors. eBay Guaranteed Fit only available to US customers. Eligible items only. Exclusions apply.GametimeDownload the Gametime app, create an account, and use code LOCKEDONMLB for $20 off your first purchase.FanDuelMake Every Moment More.Make Every Moment More. Right now, NEW customers can bet FIVE DOLLARS and get TWO HUNDRED in BONUS BETS - GUARANTEED. Visit FanDuel.com/LOCKEDON to get started.SleeperDownload the Sleeper app and use promo code LOCKEDON and you'll get up to a $100 match on your first deposit. Terms and conditions apply. See Sleeper’s Terms of Use for details. Currently operational in over 30 states. Check out Sleeper today!FANDUEL DISCLAIMER: 21+ in select states. First online real money wager only. Bonus issued as nonwithdrawable free bets that expires in 14 days. Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit FanDuel.com/RG (CO, IA, MD, MI, NJ, PA, IL, VA, WV), 1-800-NEXT-STEP or text NEXTSTEP to 53342 (AZ), 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org/chat (CT), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (WY, KS) or visit ksgamblinghelp.com (KS), 1-877-770-STOP (LA), 1-877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY), TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN) Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

MLB Trade Rumors.com has released their annual arbitration projections. We're going to go through the list and tackle it from every angle. Also, John Marosi of MLB Network says the mayor should set their sights on a superstar this offseason, but it's not Otani or Juan Soto. All that coming up here on the Lockdown Marries podcast. Colby, hit it. You are Locked on Mariners. Your daily Seattle Mariners podcast.

Part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day. Ahoi, sailors. It is Friday, October 6, 2023. This is Tadang Azales and Colby Patnaud for the Locked-on Marries podcast. Thank you so much for making us your first listen. Subscribe, like, and turn on alerts if you're watching on YouTube, or subscribe and leave a five-star review on your preferred podcast platform if you like what you hear. And if you're part of the crew and rock with us every single day, let us know in the comments below. And if you want to hear from us even more, please consider signing up for our Patreon. You can now get a free seven-day trial to check out the show.

The link as well as our social accounts. It's in the description of this episode. episode. So today's show will be mostly about arbitration. MLB trade rumors.com has released their annual arbitration projections. I'm going to go through the list talking about what they have down for the Mariners' arb eligible players and we'll also look around the league for some non-tender candidates. Could be of interest to Seattle and more. Later on in the show, we'll also talk about a superstar John Marosi thinks the Mariners should target this offseason. But first, Colby, for those that have no idea what the hell we're talking about with arbitration.

Can you give us a quick breakdown of what arbitration is and what some of these terms like tending and non-tenory mean? No, don't be lazy. Do your own research. All right. Moving on. So every winter, right, players are, well, some players are subject to what's called arbitration. And essentially, arbitration is simply. the team and the player agree on a one-year contract for a certain amount of money.

It's not set in stone. You can kind of pick what you want. Teams pick what they want. Players want what they want. Pick what they want. And essentially, they try and find common ground. And it's a series of one-year deals. If you're to be eligible for arbitration, you have to have three years of big league service time.

or there are special cases called super twos. Super twos are players who have just under three years of service time and the top 20% of those players get an extra year of arbitration. So instead of making the minimum for the first six years of your career, you make the minimum for the first three years of your career. And then you have three shots at arbitration after which you are a unrestricted free agent. So arbitration eligible players, they're not free agents. They are still, you know, their rights are still exclusively owned by their team. But this is kind of a lot of players first chance at a pay raise from the previous year. Teams cannot offer less than 80% of what the player made the previous year.

And essentially what typically happens is that player exchanges a number, team exchanges a number. They find somewhere in the middle where both sides are happy and they agree to a deal. they tender them a contract. If you don't get tendered a contract, you are a free agent immediately. So you can tender somebody a contract. And if they don't accept, they're not a free agent, you go to actual arbitration, which is typically a judge looks at, you know, he looks at the numbers, the offers. He listens to both sides, say why they're worth this and why they're not worth this.

And then the judge picks a number. He does not get to, say, split the difference. He has to pick one or the other. And that's what the player gets for a year. They do that three times, sometimes four, if you're super two. But they do that three times and after that year, free agent. So it's pretty rare that players actually go to arbitration. Typically, it behooves both the team, well, mostly the team, but the team and the player to just kind of find somewhere in the middle between the two numbers and just get a deal done that way.

because if you go to the arbitration process, you know, that can get a little nasty because you're basically telling a player to his face why he's not worth what he thinks he is. And there can be some, you know, long-term hurt feelings and stuff like that.

Of course, last year, kind of the most famous case of Corbyn Burns, uh, going to arbitration. The Brewers took him to arbitration over, what was it, $600,000.

I think it was $7.50, something like that, somewhere in that range. Chump change for major league teams. And that's usually what it is. We're talking about sometimes the difference in offers is like $50,000. But in this case, it was $750. And essentially the brewers had to go on record and say that we're not willing to pay Corbyn

Burns this amount because he cost us the playoffs last year, which obviously got back to Corbyn because his agent told him that and things went sideways fast. So arbitration, very simply put, is a way to get players who are not yet free agent eligible is a way to get them pay raises in a kind of incremental step. You make more as an R2 than you do as an R1 and then R3, blah, blah, blah. So yeah, very simply put, it's you still have control over these players. They're just kind of arguing for a raise the last three years of their contract. Right.

And in some instances, you'll see, especially towards the end of a player's arbitration eligibility, there's not necessarily extensions handed out, but contract. agreed upon where maybe you just settle on a number for the final two years of arbitration. Jesse Winker is a great example of this. A couple of years back with Mariners, they agreed to a contract to just buy out his last couple years of arbitration. That didn't give the Mariners an extra year or anything like that, but it helped them and Jesse avoid the whole process of arbitration to begin with,

just so they don't have to deal with it. So sometimes you'll see that and you'll see, I think sometimes it is worded as an extension, but it's not actually an extension. For it to be an extension, you have to buy free agent years. Yeah. So if you're Arb one and you sign a guy to a four-year contract, that is an extension. If you sign a guy to a two-year contract, that's not an extension.

That is just buying out a year of Arb and then he still has one more arbitration year after that extension. So, yeah, it's pretty simple. Like, it's a little complicated. But at the end of the day, like, as long as you tender these guys a contract, they're going to be on your roster next year, unless you trade them. Right. Yeah. So the Mariners have eight arbitration eligible players this off season.

And MLB trade rumors, of course, has projections on where they might land this off season. And usually MLB trade rumors is really, really accurate with this stuff. There really hasn't ever been a time where it's been too far off the mark with their projections and what it ends up being and what guys end up making. So we're just going to go through this list. and talk about a couple of these guys here. Logan Gilbert is one of those guys. He's projected to make $4.9 million.

Obviously, yes, he's going to be tendered. Mike Ford, $1.5 million, Justin Topa, $1.5 million. Sam Harriety, $800,000. Josh Rojas, $3.5 million. Trent Thornton, $1.4 million. Luis Renz, $1.3 million. Ty France, $7.2 million.

So, Colby, of any of those guys that I listed, Did any of them that you think should not be tendered a contract? Loose Terenz should not be. Not at that price. If you really want Trens back in the org, there's a decent chance you get him for the minimum. So you're not tender him. He goes into free agency.

He has a shot to make more than you're willing to offer. But yeah, he's probably not going to. I think that we've talked a little bit about Thai France as being a guy. who you could non-tender at less than eight it's kind of hard to see them doing that uh agreed but i i do think that i i think it's a discussion but i also think that at that price it probably just makes more sense to tender him that contract bring him back and and see what happens protect yourself still but uh you know i i think that makes sense uh thornton i'm probably not given uh one point what was it 1.1, 1.2? 1.4.

Yeah, I'm not giving Thornton that. I'm not giving Ford that. I don't think either. Yeah, maybe, I don't know. Here's the deal with ARBK is you have to make a decision pretty early on. The arbitration hearings aren't until usually late January or February, but the arbitration deadline is pretty early on in the offseason. So you have to make these decisions pretty fast.

But yeah, for one and a half, like, I wouldn't be upset if they did that. But I probably wouldn't. Topa is an absolute yes. Haggerti. Sure. I mean, I guess. You have 40 minutes.

But yeah, I would say no to Turenz Thornton. And I'm really on the fence about Ford. But everybody else, I think I'm a yes. And obviously you would say no to Logan Gilbert. I mean, I would honestly,

my solution to Gilbert would be to, hey, Logan, you want four years and $36 million right now? Sure. Just buy out all. all four years of arbitration. Just so you don't have to do it. Yeah. Because, I mean, if he's going to make four and a half this year, next year he's

going to make eight. The year after that, he's going to make, I don't know, 12 to 13. And the year after that, he's probably going to make 20. So you might be able to save a little bit there. But, yeah, I think Terence, Haggerty, sorry, Terenz, Thornton, and Ford are probably knows. But none of those are an egregious amount of money. Right.

Not to get too hung up on this, but really no, no to Mike Ford after a 123 WRC plus. I know he, he's a first base. He's first base only. But it's one and a half million dollars. I mean, if they do it, fine. But like if they non-tender Mike Ford, am I going to get on the show and and question John Stanton's commitment to ownership? Probably.

But that's not going to be related to Mike Ford. Right. But no, I would get if they didn't. But again, this is a projection. Maybe it's Mike Ford is hey Mike do you want one point one million dollars for this upcoming year? Sure. Okay. Yeah.

So yeah, Topa to me is a no brainer. Obviously Logan is a no brainer. Rojas to me is a no brainer. I know that Joe Doyle disagrees, but I honestly think that's stupid to suggest that you would, uh, you would non tender Josh Rojas. Uh, right now he's your starting second baseman and he's pretty solid player. So three million, if you, if you, if you non tender Rojas at three point. 5, that's cheap. That's being cheap.

And then France, like I said, I mean, significantly under $8 million, yeah, I'm probably going to go ahead and roll with them next year, but also protect myself. So, yeah, no big surprises from the Mariner's side of things.

I don't think. All right. So we're going to look at some key projections around the league, see if there's any non-tender candidates that could be of interest to Seattle or maybe some guys where their number is so high. that their teams might be more likely to trade them than we initially thought heading into the off season. We'll talk about all of that.

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I mean, last winter, the big one, of course, Cody Bellinger. Yeah, I don't really see a Bellinger type. I don't see anybody who's like definitely getting non-tendered at their, you know, anybody of like real significance who's getting non-tendered at their projection. So I think, you know, I think more than likely we're going to see most of these guys get traded before they get non-tendered. So I don't think there's going to be any massive shakeups to the current free agent class, which, you know, isn't ideal because it's not a great free agent class. But also, you know, it's a normal group. Like I think last year was kind of an exception.

But, you know, there's some useful players here. There's some useful lottery tickets here. But overall, I don't see too many guys that are like no brainer that guy's getting on Tinder or. or that guy has to be traded because of his contract. Yeah, you know, there are some teams that have a lot of, you know, they have a lot of ARB guys, but they don't have a lot of like the Yankees. I think they have like 16 ARB guys. And I only found one guy that I felt like is most definitely not getting that number.

So, yeah, I think it's a pretty, you know, basic list, pretty common list. There are some guys who might get non-tendered. But I think most of these guys that I kind of ID'd here are probably. probably getting traded with a few exceptions. So a couple of guys that were probably going to talk about quite a bit just in terms of, you know, what fans are going to be asking for here. Juan Soto is projected to make $33 million. Glaber Torres is projected to make, where is it, $15.3 million.

So I'll have to keep that of mind if we're talking about trades for those guys for sure. so yeah so who are some guys here that you think could get non-tendered or you know their number might make their team more willing to trade them from the mariners perspective i got about i don't know 15 names here you just want me to run through all of them we can run through all of them you can highlight a couple up to you whatever you want to do well since we're really good at brevity i'll just name all of them sure uh sure and i'm sure i miss some so if you don't hear the guy's name on this list that you want to talk about. Just let us know. I'm sure we'll address him at some point this offseason. But these are just guys quick skimming the list that I think really stand out here. Jared Walsh of the Angels due to make $2.7 million. He's not getting that. He hasn't performed the last two years. He's

been hurt. I think he's also had some. Actually, I'm not sure. I want to double check on that. But yeah, he's probably not getting that. That's a lottery ticket move, though. You're not paying Jared Walsh 2.7 million. But if he's, you know, a million bucks in a 40-man spot to see what you get in spring training, fine. Seth Brown is a guy that you know I like. And, and he's only scheduled to make 2.4. That's definitely something Oakland could swallow and might, but it's also Oakland. So, who knows? Adam Simber, Northwest guy, kind of a funky delivery out of the bullpen. he's set to make 3.2 million for the Blue Jays this year. Toronto certainly can afford that,

but they have a lot of other pieces they need to take care of. So Simber wasn't incredible this year either. He was actually sent down to the miners for a little bit. So there's a guy, Willie Adamas, probably the first name that people would perk up at. 12.4 million is the projection. Brewers, I don't want to say notoriously cheap, but very, very, very mid-market team.

who has other guys they need to pay. And Adomas, didn't have a great year. Did not have a great year. So I can see him. He was still, he was still a three and a half win player, but all of that was defense.

He was a low, 20-some-hour hitter. Yeah, 20-plus home runs. Obviously the year before, he was really good. The reason that a lot of these guys would be, you know,

non-tendered or trade is because they're coming off of the down year. So, yeah, but yeah, Domas plays short, play third. If you need them to, you can probably play second. Like,

there's, there's some stuff. there. Mike Ustrimski. the Giants set to make 7.3 million. You know, lefty bat can play kind of all three outfield spots.

Good fit for T-Mobile Park. But again, the Giants can, the Giants can afford anything they want. But just a guy to keep an eye on. That could be a guy that, you know, in theory, like I don't think this would happen. But in theory, you could like swap Thai France for Yostrinsky and the salaries are about the same.

and the players, you know, about the same in terms of value. J.D. Davis also of the Giants, 6.8 million. That's pretty steep for a guy who's kind of, who was pretty much Thai France last year. Can play some third though. Also play some first. There's some Thai France insurance for you. Josh Naylor is the guy that I really like on this list. Now he's probably the least likely guy to get traded or not tender, but $7.2 million is not nothing for Cleveland.

and Naylor is a guy who, you know, chases but doesn't strike out. He's a good fit for Seattle, left-handed pull power for days, play first base, DH, that type of stuff. Ramon Lariano, you guys know who he is, 4.7 million, fourth-fifth outfield type. Drew Smith, right-handed reliever for the Mets. It's got some interesting fastball data.

Joey Lucasey, $2 million. He's kind of a fifth-six swing starter with some pretty good stuff, and stuff that I think could play out of the bullpen if you need them to. Kyle Finnegan is, you know, from the Nationals, $5.1 million, hard throwing, ready. I think that that's probably a step too high for the Nats. But, you know, the Nats are probably thinking that they can make a run at the wild card next year. So maybe.

Anthony Sontan Dair is another one, 12.7 million. That's definitely going to be a trade if Sontadere is not playing for the Orioles. But Orioles are notoriously cheap. That's obvious. So Santander one year of that, probably getting traded. Plus they have the young bats to replace him. Former Mariner, Osce Nola, is kind of an interesting one. 2.35 million.

He's been terrible. The Padres are more. No, the Padres are more than willing to move on. He's going to be a free agent. Could you get him on a minor league deal? Maybe. He likes Seattle. We know that.

And we know that the Mariners like having him. So if they think they can fix them, why not? Maybe give them a million bucks in a 40-man spot. Who knows? Trent Grisham, also the Padres, probably not a guy who's getting on Tinder. He's projected to make less than $5 million. But, you know, really good centerfielder. The bat just kind of disappeared on him.

So we have to wait and see there. Scott Barlow, pitcher for the Padres reliever for the Padres. Good stuff. 7.1 million. Luis Urias, definitely getting on tendered. 4.7 million for a utility guy and who might not be better than Dillamore. We'll see. threw him on the list anyways.

Kyle Farmer of the twins, kind of a platoon infielder can play first, can play second, can play third, can play short. Like, it's pretty much Dillemore. But,

you know, a little bit higher floor, uh, floor than Dillan Moore. Uh, so that's an interesting guy. Lou Trevino, uh,

former A's reliever. He missed all this year. I'm not sure if the health is there, but he's definitely not getting 4.1 million, uh, from the Nies this year. And that's kind of one of those reclamation projects. You can take a shot on.

And I saved him for last because I know people would be interested in this one. Paul Seawald, yes, that Paul Seawald, $7.3 million for the Arizona Diamondbacks. Not a guy who's most definitely getting non-tendered, but I wouldn't say he's a guarantee to get non-tendered either. And if the Mariners have a shot to reacquire Paul Seawald for, you know, less than what we think they could, then they'd be fools not to. Yeah, agreed. We'd love to have Paul C.Wald back. So, yeah, hoping that the,

the Diamondbacks will not intend to room on that front. So we can, we can bring him home. Or, you know, just trade for him. That would be cool, too. I'll trade down the band zone for him. One of those guys is a good major leaker. I, for one, would pay Paul C. Wald $7.3 million. But that's just me.

Absolutely. I love Paul C. Weld. All right. So, John, Marosi popped on 710 Seattle Sports this morning and said the Mariners should target a superstar, but not Shohei Otani, not Juan Soto. I'll tell you who that is coming up here on the Lockdown Mariners podcast. But first, a reminder of this episode is brought to you by Fandual. Celebrate the start of the NFL season with great offers from Fandul, America's number one

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That's LOC, KD-O-N, kick off the NFL season with an offer you won't want to miss. Fandual, official partner of the NFL. And you're listening to the Lockdown Mariners podcast. Thank you again for making us your first listen. so John Morosi of MLB Network hopped on with I believe Wyman and Bob to talk some Mariners

and made a very interesting statement. Now, the thing about John Morosi is he is fairly plugged into what the Mariners are doing and last off-season he did kind of hint at a Teoska Hernandez deal about three or four days before it actually happened. So that's why we're bringing this up, ultimately. because sometimes when Marosi has something to say about the Mariners, you have to pay attention.

So he talked about the Mariners potentially acquiring a superstar. But it's not Otani. It's not Juan Soto. He said, quote, my first choice, even ahead of Otani, is if you could find a way to talk with the Guardians about Jose Ramirez. Continue to say with them, manager Terry Francona is leaving. I realize Ramirez is on a long-term deal with a full no trade clause, all those things, but maybe just file that one away. Because if I was a Mariners fan and could wave the magic one,

I would honestly say give me a trade for J-RAM as opposed to waiting for the Otani possibility, which is probably like 15%. Take the sure thing if you can do it. You've got the pitching. You've got a lot of pieces. Make the phone call to Cleveland, in my opinion. So Colby, Jose Ramirez is arguably the most underrated start. in today's game and has been for quite some time.

He is a legitimate perennial MVP candidate. This year, 282, 356, 475, that's a 123 WRC plus, 5-1 player. He walked literally as many times as he struck out this year. 73 walks, 73 strikeouts. Jose Ramirez is elite and obviously has a great right hook on him too. Like Morosi mentioned, he did just sign a long-term, deal that has him locked up through his age 36 season. That's through 2028.

It is with a full no trade clause. But the guardians are weird. They operate very, very weird. So, and they've displayed signs of cheapness, even though they have given out deals, long-term deals, like the one to Ramirez, but also the one to Ramirez is nowhere near what Jose Ramirez should probably be making. on the market right now. I think at most on a yearly, like on a year basis, like an AAV basis,

I think the most he's making is like $26 million. Yeah, it's the last year of his deal. He's five years 105 remaining. Jose Ramirez, when he signed that contract, probably left $150 million plus on the table. Yeah. Not his smartest decision, but whatever. His decision to make nonetheless. Yeah, let's also remember that Morosi's the same guy who said Logan Gilbert for Lars Neupar made a lot of sense for both teams. There's also that. Yeah. There's a lot of give and take here with John Lursey.

We do know, hey, you know what? We have a month before any moves can be made. So yeah, we're going to talk about this as ridiculous as it is. So yeah, I don't think the guardians are trading Jose Ramirez. I don't know if it would even make that much sense. for the Mariners to acquire him, not because you don't want Jose Ramirez. Of course you do.

But what is that cost? Because I have a hard time putting together Jose Ramirez trade package that doesn't include Kirby or Gilbert. Plus probably Kelnick, plus probably Harry Ford or Colt Emerson, plus probably. Tai Pete, Johnny Farmello,

etc. Yeah. You know, Gabby Gonzalez. Like pick like three top prospects. or two top prospects and Kellnick and Gilbert and you probably get the Guardian's attention. But even then they're like, okay, now what else? So, yeah, I don't see this as the possibility, a real one.

I'd love it to be. And if you told me I could get Jose Ramirez for just four prospects, I would tell Cleveland to pick any four prospects they want. I don't care at that point. But that's not how this works. So I also don't think the idea that like, oh, they have pitching. Yeah, Cleveland is really good at developing their own pitching. So it's not that they wouldn't value Logan Gilbert.

Of course they would, but they can kind of make their own Logan Gilbert. They kind of do it every year. So wouldn't they prioritize bats? Well, also, what is their plan if they're trading Jose Ramirez? Right. I mean, like,

they were, look, they kind of overachieved last year. This year, I would say they've underachieved a little bit. but that's a organization that's got some good pitching. They've got, you know, good players, Naler and obviously Ramirez and Kwan, like Jimenez, like they've got good players.

The right one? Yeah, it is. They've got good players. They got, you know, an offense that is functional. They've got, you know, a pretty good farm system. They've got young pitching. Like, I don't just, I, I, that's why part of it is like, if you're rebuilding, you're trading Bieber, you're trading.

Ramirez, you're probably trading Kwan. They're not going to rebuild. They're going to kind of reset. Ramirez is locked in for an incredible bargain for the next five years. It's not like Shane Bieber, who is R3, I think, this year. And so they're probably open to trading him. Although, did he end up having Tommy John? I can't remember.

But yeah, I don't see why Cleveland would do it. And again, to make Cleveland consider it, if I have to give up Logan Gilbert, I'm not saying no, but that's also not like a gimmy like you're not just like yep all day with that so because now you have to go out and you have to get the pitcher to replace gilbert so yeah you know i i'd love i'd love for morosi to not be you know talking out of as you know what but uh and again like you said he did you know he was at least briefly in you know the teosker

stuff but that was kind of common sense i think we all looked at that and we're like yeah that makes a lot of sense and uh the cardinal stuff we knew do that know the Mariners talked about, you know, about some of the young hitters the Cardinals have. We do know the Cardinals really like Logan Gilbert. So, you know, you can draw some connections there that Morosi knows something. But this is pure speculation. And I don't even think it makes sense because I don't think it makes a ton of sense for Cleveland to do this. I don't think it really makes a ton of sense for Seattle to do this.

Again, unless you can tell me that like, oh, yeah, they want Harry Ford and Colt Emerson and Ty Pete. And, you know, Jared Kelnick, then it's like, oh, well, yeah, okay, sure. But that's not what it's going to take. It's going to take Kirby. It's going to take Gilbert plus. Yeah. And I don't know if that's the best decision the Mariners can make. I don't know if that's the best they can do with, you know, Gilbert, Gilbert, like, I'm just making this up, total speculation.

Gilbert Ford, Emerson, Pete. Like, is Jayram the best they could do? Maybe. but also is that worth it then? Yeah. Let me preface this by saying that this is very, very, very low. But I would put the chances of Shohei Otani signing with the Mariners higher than the Mariners trading for Jose Ramirez, contrary to John Marossi's belief. I just-Marosi said they have a 15% chance at Otani.

Like, no. Yeah. I appreciate the optimism, John. No. I just, I don't see a, I don't see a clear path here for the Marys to, to make a trade for Jose Ramirez for all the reasons that you just laid out. Right. You know, I do think they should go to Cleveland and ask about a bad. I just happen to think that bat probably should be Josh Naylor. A guy who has two years left and also doesn't strike out and also has power. And, you know, yeah, he's first base DH only. But, you know, he stole 10 bags last year. Go figure, right. So yeah, I think Cleveland and Seattle could make some sense. on a few trades, you know,

pending health, you know, could Seattle kind of throw their weight around and go get Shane Bieber and just build this like super rotation? Maybe. Josh Naylor's guy, could they maybe, again,

I'm not saying, would they, could they do like woo for like Stephen Kwan or something like that? Maybe I don't know. But I do that Cleveland, you know, has some pieces that make sense for Seattle. I think in a vacuum,

you're definitely interested in Jose Ramirez, but just realistically looking at what it probably, cost to acquire a guy like that to in essence kind of force Cleveland to be interested in trading him. I just don't think that it's going to, I don't, I just don't think it's going to work. I don't think that that's a very realistic possibility. And I would say it's probably about on par with with signing Otani in terms of realism, which I think I've put at like half a percent. Yeah, I'd also, I'd also put it. I'd also put a one soda trade as a higher likelihood. of happening than a Jose Ramirez trade.

And again, that's very, very low. We're talking like tenths of a tenth of a tenth of a tenth of a percent here. Yeah, maybe. That one comes down to cost. And, you know, obviously, Jerry always is going to value club control even when he maybe shouldn't. But, yeah, like, again, like, if you, just to be clear, if you're telling me I could get Ramirez with Miller or Wu as the headliner. Oh, yeah. then yeah absolutely i just don't see that no i don't either because i think again you're going to have to

force cleveland to be like oh yeah no we actually will move ramirez and i think in order to force them into that decision we're talking about you got to offer them cow logan uh kirby jp like i i think you're just offering i just think you're kind of rob and peter to pay paul at that point but never say never i guess yeah i'm not i'm not going to completely shut any of this stuff down because you never know. But from my perspective, I can't envision a way that the Mariners get any of these guys,

really, Soto, Ramirez, O'Tonnie, etc. I just, I have a very hard time convincing myself that that's a real possibility. But again, for you know, for your guys' sake, we're going to be fair about it. We're going to talk about it. We're going to cover all these things. We're going to leave ourselves open to the possibility. Just right now, I can't see it.

Sometimes Robinson Canoe signs with the Mariners. You know, it can't happen. I would say this, and then we'll wrap because I know we got to go. If we get firm reports from multiple sources that Cleveland is interested, they are open to trading Jose Ramirez. This conversation goes, you know, a completely different way because right now I am operating under the assumption that like Cleveland isn't interested in trading Jose Ramirez. And your offer kind of has to be in that like blow us away and we'll think about it mold. Yeah, like if they're actually shopping, yeah, if they're actually shopping Ramirez and they're listening to. on offers? Yes. The answer is yes. Again, not Gilbert, not current. Not in any

Concord, but like any prospect package, yes, you're interested. So yeah, you know, things are subject to change. But until we hear that Cleveland is, is shopping Ramirez or they're open to the idea and we hear it from not just like, oh, well, maybe like firm like passing is like, hey, Cleveland is shopping Jose Ramirez. Or Cleveland beat reporters are talking about. Right, right, right. Like, watch out for Jose Ramirez trade. Cleveland's very interested in it, blah, blah, blah. Once we start seeing stuff like that, the conversation changes completely because honestly, trading for Ramirez makes more sense to me than giving Otani $600 million. So, but until that day, this is just kind of, it's just kind of October 6th and there's no baseball on today. So, you know, the Mariners

didn't make the playoffs, so we can't talk about that. So we'll just throw this out there. Sure, Sure. All right. That's going to do it for our show. Thank you so much for joining us here on the Lockdown Mariners podcast for Colby Patnode. I'm Taday Gonzalez. Be sure to give us a follow on Twitter at LO underscore Mariners. You can follow me at Dan Gonzalez. It's D-A-N-Z-L-Z. Colby at C-Pat 11. That's C-P-A-T-1-1. You can also find all that stuff in the description of this episode. Thank you again for making us your first. Listen, have yourself a beautiful baseball day and we'll see you next time. Peace.