Locked On Patriots - Daily Podcast On The New England Patriots - AFC-Style East versus West IV: Patriots/Chargers Crossover - 5/14/2020

Episode Date: May 14, 2020

It’s AFC East/AFC West Divisional Crossover Week across the Locked On Podcast Network.  Joining host Mike D’Abate is David Droegemeier of Locked On Chargers to discuss both the New England Patriots and the Los Angeles Chargers’ 2020 NFL Draft report cards, their potential rosters and life beyond Philip Rivers and Tom Brady.   Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Patriots fans, you are now locked in to the Locked On Patriots Podcast. I'm going to show you how to make a beautiful and beautiful flower. I'm going to use a small flower pot. I'm going to use a small pot Hello to all of you Foxborough faithful, and welcome to the fourth and final day of AFC East, AFC West cross-divisional crossover week here on the Lockdown Podcast Network. It is Thursday, May 14th, 2020, and you are listening to the Locked On Patriots Podcast. And today's episode is brought to you by Built Bar.

Built Bar is a protein bar that tastes like a candy bar. Go to BuiltBar.com and use promo code LOCKEDON to get $10 off your first order. What's up, Patriots Nation? My name is Mike DeBate, your host of the Locked On Patriots Podcast, which is a proud part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day. And folks, because it's your team every day, that means your questions, your comments, and your feedback are always welcomed and greatly appreciated. And you can share that feedback anytime by reaching out to me and following me on Twitter

at M-D-A-B-A-T-E-F-P-C. And while you're out there roaming around through that Twitterverse, please be sure to follow the Locked On Patriots account as well at L-O underscore Patriots. And then there was one, Patriots fans. One more team left in our AFC East, AFC West cross-divisional crossover week here on the Locked On Podcast Network. And on Monday, we chatted about the Kansas City Chiefs. We delved into the Denver Broncos on Tuesday. And yesterday here on the pod, we crossed blades with the Las Vegas Raiders.

But today, it's time to charge complete. Like what I did there, folks? Yeah, a little play on words. You know I love to mix those in. But that particular play on words is one that's near and dear to my heart because it was the title of a weekly column that I used to write when I covered the team that will be the subject of today's podcast. And of course, charge complete could only mean one thing.

The Los Angeles Chargers. And I can't be too shy about this, folks. This is a crossover that I've been looking forward to for a while. And don't get me wrong, I've enjoyed doing each and every crossover I've ever done on the Locked On Podcast Network. Whether it be game previews, interdivisional crossovers, or the ultimate divisional crossovers that I do with my colleagues in the AFC East. It's always an honor and a privilege to share the microphone with my great colleagues across the Locked On Podcast Network.

But as you may or may not know, and some of you have probably heard me say a few times here on the pod, I cut my sports media journalistic teeth covering those Los Angeles Chargers from the tail end of their time in San Diego at the end of 2016, right up to the 2018 season where I was pulling double duty, covering both the Chargers and your New England Patriots for FullPressCoverage.com. When I first started off writing for a company called Cover32.com, I used the phrase charge complete as my weekly column.

And covering a team from across the country does have its challenges, but the Chargers organization was always great to me, and I enjoyed getting a chance to cover some great players like Phillip Rivers, Antonio Gates, Keenan Allen, Austin Eckler, and Hunter Henry, just to name a couple. In fact, one of the players that I covered in Los Angeles is now a player I'll be covering this year in New England, and that is safety Adrian Phillips. So again folks, today's crossover has a lot of significance for me, and to help me break down all things Bolt Blue, David DeGrogemeyer, one of the hosts of the Locked On Chargers podcast, will join me here in just a moment, and we'll talk about the Chargers 2020 draft class, the impressive haul of free agents that they've brought in to help the Chargers

return to contention in the AFC West. And last but certainly not least, we will be talking about how both franchises will be moving on from legendary quarterbacks and likely handing the ball to a couple of highly talented but largely untested quarterbacks to begin the 2020 season. So as always, folks, an action-packed crossover episode here for you today on Locked On Patriots. David, along with Daniel Wade and John Kegley, put on a great show for Chargers fans. It's my honor to talk Patriots Chargers with him, and we will do so, folks, for you in just a moment.

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for $10 off your first box. Eat healthy while indulging in a delicious treat. Don't delay. Make Built Bar your go-to protein bar today. Patriots fans Make Bilt Bar your go-to protein bar today. of these teams rests on the arms of two talented but largely unproven quarterbacks. Football fans, of course, we're talking about the Los Angeles Chargers and the New England Patriots.

And on Sunday, December 6th, 125 p.m. Pacific, 425 p.m. on the East Coast, the Chargers and the Patriots will do battle in the City of Angels, both of them wearing some snazzy new threads. But if I'm being honest, I think the Bolts got the better of that deal. I'm Mike DeBate of Locked On Patriots, and joining me today is Dave Droegemeier, host of Locked On Chargers. Dave, thanks so much for joining me today. And this is a crossover that I've been looking forward to for a while.

Yeah, we had talked a little bit before we started recording, and you said that you had actually covered the Chargers for a couple of years for a former publication called cover 32, you know, a site I know very well. I've read quite a bit of articles off that website. So I probably have seen some of your work in the past, but yeah, after being so close to a team, it's obviously going to be one that you circle and be really excited for. And I'm excited to learn more about the Patriots,

even though they are the evil empire. Welcome to the dark side. I assure you it will be a fun trip down Foxborough Lane. I do assure you of that. But the time that I did spend covering the Chargers, both when they were the San Diego Chargers and morphing into the Los Angeles Chargers, was a great experience. It's a great organization, and they were very, very good to me.

And again, that's why I did circle this one on my calendar for quite a while, and I've been looking forward to it. A big fan of what you and the guys do on Locked On Chargers, and it's an honor to share the microphone with you today. But David, we'll start right off with your Los Angeles Chargers. And best uniforms in pro sports got even better, in my opinion. We saw your crosstown counterparts, new unis today, and you know, I'll be nice. Let's keep that clean. You know, we want to keep that clean rating that

we so richly covet, my friend. But seriously, for the first time since 2006, Phillip Rivers will not be the starting quarterback in Bolt Blue. The veteran, of course, parting ways with the team, signing as a free agent at the Indianapolis Colts. Now, here in New England, we know a thing or two about losing a franchise player. We've experienced it ourselves. But by all accounts, rookie Justin Herbert seems to be poised to take the reins. But Tyrod Taylor still is very much a possibility as well. We both know of his history with the Chargers and with head coach Anthony Lynn from their days together in Buffalo. David, what is the mood in Chargers nation when it comes

to the quarterback position and how are the Bolts preparing for life after Phillip Rivers? Yeah, so I think going into this year, they fully expect Tyrod Taylor to be the starting quarterback of the Chargers going into this season. The coaches in the front office have all said that there's going to be an open competition, but I think in the back of their minds, they all believe, they're in a prime position to where they have Tyrod Taylor under contract for a very measly amount of money, five and a half million dollars. And I'm sure they're going to ride that till the wheels fall off. And this gives him an opportunity to get into the NFL playbook, get into a strength and conditioning program, although he's already a very large kid. I mean, he's got a lot of athleticism. And I think it's just a perfect situation because Tyrod Taylor is a mobile quarterback. That's what kind of offense Anthony Lynn wants to run.

He's said it multiple times. So I think there's no better person for Justin Herbert to learn under than Tyrod Taylor, get his feet wet in the NFL, get a year of seasoning under his belt, and then be ready to take the reins next year. Obviously, that's barring an injury, but I think everybody is pretty excited to see what a new offense is going to look like under Tyra Taylor. Obviously, they're very sad that Phillip Rivers and the Chargers decided to part ways. That was a beautiful marriage for over 15 years,

and he's the type of quarterback you absolutely love to watch. And I'm sure most of us are going to be watching him, hoping that he has some success in Indianapolis. I'm so glad that you said that because there's so much acrimony that seems to want to exist in some sects of fan social media about legendary quarterbacks parting ways with the team that they are always going to be remembered with. And I'm seeing that a lot in New England. And again, we'll get to that in just a little bit, folks. But I'm glad you mentioned about Tyrod Taylor and kind of setting

the record straight on a lot of what we're hearing from Chargers Nation. Tyrod Taylor is a name that Patriots fans do know well, especially from his days with the Buffalo Bills and seeing what he can do. That marriage between he and Anthony Lynn has a real chance, I think, of being a pretty good matchup this year. And again, you have Justin Herbert waiting in the wings. There's a lot to love about that kid. And I really do know that in some sects that the Patriots were definitely looking at him as an option.

I'm not saying they ever seriously consider trying to trade up for him or draft him, but I do know from what they saw at the Senior Bowl, from what they saw at the Combine, and from what they saw just in his days at Oregon, he seemed to be the type of football player and the type of quarterback that they really admired and wouldn't mind employing. That being said, there is a lot to love about Justin Herbert. Exciting young players in the draft are something that I think the Chargers really nailed this year. I really was impressed by their draft as a whole, particularly guys like Kenneth Murray, who was selected with pick number 23. That's a pick they acquired from the Patriots. And a couple of late round gems that I kept a sharp eye on throughout this draft season. Aloy Gilman, safety out of Notre Dame, and K.J. Hill, the wide receiver out of Ohio State. I think he has the

potential to be a great option in the slot for the Bolts. You know we love our slot receivers up here in New England, so K.J. Hill was a guy that I watched pretty closely. David, your overall impression of this draft haul, and who besides Justin Herbert has the potential to turn heads this year in Los Angeles yeah I mean I love how you brought up KJ Hill I mean obviously in getting him in the seventh round is just an absolutely incredible value before the draft you had plenty of pundits out there that had him going as early as the fourth round to see him slip so far to the seventh even Tom Telesco had mentioned that he wasn't even planning on taking another wide receiver but when KJ Hill was still on the board in the seventh

round it was something he absolutely could not pass up so I think you could see some exciting things out of KJ Hill and the Chargers have had a void at their wide receiver three position the last couple of years since Tyrod excuse excuse me, since Tyra Williams left in free agency to the Raiders, the Chargers have had absolutely no production from that position. But I think another wide receiver that they picked could have an even bigger impact. And that is their fifth round pick Joe Reed out of Virginia. Joe Reed is a guy when we first went into the draft after the draft had no idea what this kid was all about had never seen any video on him. We were kind of like who is this

guy but then you put on the tape and you see right away this guy is the was the best kick returner in college football last year won the award for that the jet award for the best kick returner in the country. He is electric with the football in his hands and open an open field. He always makes the first guy miss. And, you know, I think if you look at the draft picks that the Chargers made, they really got guys that kind of emulate what Justin Herbert did well at at Oregon when he got the ball out of his hands quickly into a playmaker's hand to allow him to create and get yards after the catch, and that's something Joe Reed is going to excel in a lot.

He's going to be an immediate impact player as a kick returner, and I think he's going to be given many opportunities to get the ball in his hands and show everybody what this guy can do. The Patriots will be employing a beloved former Charger this year in their secondary and on their special teams unit. And that is Adrian Phillips. I absolutely loved covering Adrian when I was in Los Angeles. He was the type of player that just was always in the right place at the right time.

And he's in that mold of Patriots special teamers and defenders that I think can really be someone that can really make a difference in this team this year look I think he's able to cover running backs tight ends wide receivers one-on-one and always seems to be at the bottom of the pile and run support he's literally everywhere and he does everything for a defense but you've had your sharp eye on him a little bit closer than I have in the last couple of years albeit my attention has been more on New England than it has been on Los Angeles. But in your opinion, what type of player are the Patriots employing in Adrian Phillips this year, and how do you see him fitting in in New England? Well, first of all, we were all very upset and kind of sad to see Adrian Phillips go,

and we did not believe that the Chargers gave him the amount of contract money in the last couple years that I think he richly deserved I mean this is a guy who got cut seven times and brought back and showed just incredible perseverance and believing in himself and believing in accomplishing his dream of being successful in the NFL. And he did that. He made splash play after splash play on special teams before he knocked the door down to get onto the defense. He forced his way onto the field. And you already talked about it, how just absolutely dynamic of a defender he is because he is so versatile. You can move him all around the football field. He's a high character guy. He's a great leader. I think Patriot fans should be ecstatic that they are getting a player of

that caliber to join the defense. He's going to fit right in and he is going to make an impact immediately. I'm going to be watching him from afar. It's going to be a little sad to see him in a Patriots uniform, but I know he's going to succeed. He is a great NFL veteran and he is going to be a phenomenal player for the Patriots for a couple of years. Yeah, this was a signing that I was so glad to see because again, I really liked covering Adrian when I was in Los Angeles and having him come to new England and bring that special teams and that defensive prowess to this

unit, both units is going to be something that I think Patri that defensive prowess to this unit, both units, is going to be something that I think Patriots fans are going to really enjoy. And I think it's going to endear him to Pats fans right off the bat. And that also leads me nicely into my last question for you today, David, before we flip the script here on this crossover episode. And the key to making a seller to contender type leap like the Chargers are trying to do this year is finding those savvy veterans to bring along the young guns. I think the Chargers have done a great job with doing that this year. First of all, I love the fact that they franchised and

brought back Hunter Henry, someone that I've admired for quite some time. I'll be honest with you. I had him on my very short list of tight ends that the Patriots might target in free agency if he was able to make it there, but I never really believed he would. I didn't think Los Angeles would let him out of town, and I'm so glad to see that he's returned. In that vein, though, I also like some of the other moves that they've made as well. I love the moves on defense, particularly Nick Vigil at linebacker, Linval Joseph at defensive tackle, and of course Chris Harrison, cornerback. That adds to an already prolific defense when you employ Melvin Ingram and Joey Bosa on either side of the edge. That is a fearsome rushing tandem.

In your estimation, David, when you look at what the Chargers have done this offseason? Have they done enough to contend? And what do you believe is their ceiling in 2020? Well, I mean, I think first of all, it's great to see that they finally put an emphasis on bringing in quality players on the offensive line. It's something that I feel that they have neglected for the last several years as they have been ranked towards the bottom of the league

as far as offensive lines have gone and they brought in guys that they know are going to come in and make an impact Trey Turner they traded for from Carolina a five-time pro bowler he is a nasty type of player the type of guy that has a highlight reel full of pancakes and then you bring in a absolutely solid right tackle one of the better right tackles in the league in Brian Bulaga. And you say, oh, man, they got a really good right side of that offensive line now. But there's a giant question mark on the other side. They don't know who's really going to be starting at left tackle,

and there's a little uncertainty at left guard as well. Mike Pouncey, the Chargers center, just got cleared to come back to play NFL football after having another neck surgery. So you'll be seeing him line up on the Chargers offensive line. Now, I do like the moves. I think honestly, Linval Joseph is quietly going to be a huge addition, and it's not going to show up in the stat sheet. It's going to show up in the fact that you're going to see Joey Bosa and Melvin Ingram and even in Chenna Nuoso get home a whole lot more because they have somebody that can actually bring some pressure and some push in the middle of that

defensive line that's something the Chargers have sorely missed in my estimation since Jamal Williams was their nose tackle so and that's that's the name for you if you're a Charger fan but uh yeah as far as have they done enough uh I don't know I mean I just I think there's just such a giant hole at left tackle that if they brought in Jason Peters I would feel a whole lot more comfortable with and I would say I would say absolutely because I think right now they have one of the top defenses in the NFL I think they're they have they have the the quality they have the depth and they have the talent to be a number one overall defense if Gus Bradley is able to put all the players in the right positions. But at the end of the day, it's about, hey, are they better

than the Chiefs? Can they beat the Chiefs? Can they get the division title? Right now, I don't think so. Just because we don't know what this offense is going to look like with Tyrod Taylor. I think the defense is going to keep them in a lot of games and Tyrod Taylor is not going to give away the game, but I don't know if you can trust him to go out there and win a game. So that is where I'm a little bit hesitant, but I think the Chargers have all the talent in the world and they can compete with anybody in the NFL. Agreed.

And I, again, I love what they've done this off season. And I'm glad that you mentioned that you're not sure if they actually have done enough yet to be able to contend. The good good news is and this is the truth for all NFL teams folks the NFL rosters have not been set yet there's still another wave of roster additions still to come whether it be cut down time when you talk about training camp and even a little bit before that when you start seeing some of these guys released that are cap casualties when you're trying to fill out a roster and get rookies and undrafted free agents in there's still a lot that can be done so the jury's still out on this but i'm always optimistic about the chargers and i think they have a good

shot this year at turning some heads and maybe raising a few eyebrows doing that david you have provided a great amount of insight when it comes to the chargers potential in 2020 but this wouldn't exactly be a true crossover, my friend, unless we flip the script and you put me on that Foxborough hoxie. In just a moment, folks, David and I will talk about the tumultuous offseason in Foxborough and what it means for the Patriots this season when this crossover episode of Locked On Patriots

and Locked On Chargers continues. All right, and we are back with the crossover edition with Locked on Patriots. And of course, I am joined by Mike DeBate, and you can follow him on Twitter at mdebatefbc. So I think the first question for me is, you know, it's death, taxes, and the Patriots making the playoffs. I mean, that's pretty much what it's been the last, you know, 15 plus years. They went 12 and 4, but they were taken out by the Tennessee Titans, which was a huge surprise. How did the Patriots fan base kind of handle that loss? Not well. No, I'm only kidding, folks.

No, I think in a lot of ways, Patriots fans saw a little bit of a difference in this team in the second half of the season. Obviously, you start the season off 8-0, and everybody is, it's the era of good feelings. It's, oh, can they possibly go undefeated? Could they run the table? I don't necessarily know if anybody had that feeling about this team, even when they were eking out some wins that maybe they shouldn't have eked out earlier on in the season. Look, bottom line, the Patriots did struggle a little bit defensively when trying to contain the run. They struggled mightily when trying to contain tight end play. And that's two things that ended up biting them pretty badly in the playoffs and even in the second half of the season. Patriots had some real difficulties doing that.

There were difficulties on offense. They just could never find that rhythm that they so richly coveted, whether it be players running wrong routes, whether it be offensive line protection, not being able to run and find seams and get the running game going to take pressure off of Tom Brady. It always seemed to be one thing after another that was essentially going wrong for the Patriots. That being said, they still went 12 and four and they still made the playoffs. So it's, you know, it's, it's one of those things where you take seasons like that in stride. I think people saw and had lower expectations for the Pats heading into the post season this year, but ultimately it was still a surprise to see them bow out in the first round. Tennessee Titans played them tough. They had a great game plan offensively, defensively.

They knew what the Patriots weaknesses were and they exploited them. And a lot of what they've done in the off season is try to take that pressure away and also try to build on some of the holes that they had in 2019. I think they've done that, but there's still a gaping hole under center. And, you know, as much as I do love Jared Stidham, and we'll probably get into that in a moment, and I believe he can be a very effective quarterback for this team, you can't expect to lose 20 years of excellence under Tom Brady and not take a little bit of a step back. It's not fair to Jarrett to put those expectations on him and expect him to come in and equal or eclipse what Tom Brady did.

It's just simply not going to happen. So I think the fan base is reasonable. They were hit hard when they found out that Tom wasn't going to return. But at the same time, I think they're ready and eager and optimistic about what the future holds in Foxborough. Yeah, I mean, you were and eager and optimistic about what the future holds in Foxborough. Yeah. I mean, you were speaking about those 20 years of excellence and, you know, for the first time in 20 years, besides a cameo from Matt Castle, someone other than Tom Brady is going

to be under sender for the Patriots. And right now that man is, like you mentioned, slated to be Jarrett Stidham. And, you know, we don't really know much about Jarrett. I don't know if any Charger fans, you know, honestly, if you ask them who that guy is or what he brings to the table, they probably would have no clue. So, Mike, the question I pose to you is, who is this guy? And what exactly can we expect from him under center? And do you believe he is going to be the guy?

Well, to answer your question about who is Jarrett Stidham Jarrett Stidham is essentially a very accurate uh a very poised and a very confident young quarterback and I think those traits are going to serve him well in Foxborough which is why I do believe he will be the guy there will be some growing pains initially the one knock on Jarrett is the ability to get the ball out of his hands very quickly. That's where Jarrett can have some difficulties and he may struggle a little bit. That's what makes the Patriots additions to the offensive line and their investment in a guy like Joe Tooney placing the franchise tag on him,

who is their starting left guard, their starting left tackle Isaiah Wynn is getting healthy. They need to keep that left side of the're starting left tackle. Isaiah Wynn is getting healthy. They need to keep that left side of the offensive line solidified. That's going to protect Jarrett. And if he has the time, he can step into his throws. He can make them. And folks, I can tell you, he can put it on a dime. I've seen this kid do it in practice. I've seen him do it at Auburn on some of the film and footage that I've watched on him. So I believe he does have the ability to be able to make those throws. Mechanically, he's pretty sound. He does have a tendency to drop his elbow a little bit. If the Patriots see that early on in the season, that may

be where you might see Brian Hoyer come in and maybe make some, I don't want to say spot starts because I don't think he'll take the starting position, but you may see him come into games if Jarrett continues to drop his elbow a little bit. That's a mechanical issue that I think is going to have to be addressed. And I'm sure it is being addressed in the off season. If I'm aware of it, I can guarantee you Josh McDaniels is aware of it. Bill Belichick's aware of it. And Jarrett Stidham is most definitely aware of it. So they're mostly working on that, but that may be something Patriots fans need to keep their eye on. Ultimately, I do believe that he is going to be their quarterback of the future, unless something happens this year that really changes the team's opinion on him.

Because I can tell you from people that I've spoken to within the organization, they're very high on Stidham's capability. They love his poise. They love his decision-making ability. And they really like his arm strength and accuracy. So if he can hone all that in and be able to make better decisions with the football when he's pressured, he could have a bright future here in Foxborough. coming out that former Patriots star tight end Rob Gronkowski was interested in coming out of retirement and resuming his NFL career playing with Tom Brady and Tampa. So tell us about how that trade went down and how it was received by people within the organization and Patriot fans. Well, there was a lot of acrimony that was created, I think, in the narrative surrounding this trade. And in all actuality, folks, there really wasn't all that much of it.

Rob started getting the itch a little bit to come back. And regardless of whether Patriots fans want to hear this or not, I think if Rob was ever going to come back to a football field, I don't believe it was ever going to be in Foxborough. And there are a lot of reasons why you can read into why that might be the case. I don't think it was any type of animosity toward head coach Bill Belichick. I don't think it was the region. It certainly wasn't the fan base. Rob was

beloved up here in New England. He will continue to be. I can tell you, he'll always be a beloved person up here when it comes to the fans. But ultimately, Rob decided that he wanted to come back and he wanted to do that playing with Tom Brady, the only quarterback he's ever played with. You can't really necessarily blame him too much. So Rob went to the Patriots, advised him that this was the case. He wanted to come back. The Patriots realized that if Rob just filed his reinstatement, they would automatically be on the hook for $9.25 million in salary cap that would have necessarily forced them

to make moves at this point that they really didn't want to make. The Patriots understood that. They worked out a trade. And by working out a trade, it allowed them not to take the cap hit for Rob coming back. Rob was able to go back, play with the only player that he wanted to play with, which is Tom Brady in Tampa Bay. And it allowed the Patriots to essentially move on, get a little bit of draft capital for a player that was never going to suit up for them this year. So I look at the trade as a win-win all around. I know there were some fans up here that are still a little bit bitter about the way all that went down, but I can honestly tell you this was pretty honest from the start to the finish. And I wish

Rob nothing but the best. I know he'll have a great season with Tom down in Tampa. And I think it was a good move for the Patriots too. They were able to pick up an extra draft pick that they didn't have prior. All right, well, let's transition to the draft now. I think the Patriots always seem to have some very strange drafts, and this year was definitely no different. Can you kind of give us an idea of the thought process behind what they were trying to accomplish with their 2020 draft picks? Absolutely, and I think essentially what they were trying to do is fill voids that were left behind, bring in players that they knew could fit their system and they knew would provide them with depth and immediate impact. And that's exactly what they did. The Patriots are very

much a plug and play type team. They want to find a player that's going to come in and fit the way they do business. And they do it as well as anyone in the NFL. Kyle Duggar was not a popular selection up here in new England. When he was picked, fans were absolutely livid. They couldn't believe that the Patriots would use the 37th pick that high draft capital on a player that I heard some people say they could have gotten

in the sixth or seventh round. That's complete hogwash. Kyle Duggar was not going to go in the sixth or seventh round. Maybe he would have slipped to the third. I don't know. But the Patriots had a high enough grade on this kid in their draft room to be able to pull the trigger and make that deal. Duggar brings a great deal of speed, length, size to Foxborough. He can cover tight ends. And as I said earlier, the Patriots had a real problem with that last year. I think Duggar comes in and automatically shores that up. Adrian Phillips is another guy that's going to come in and help them to be able to make coverage on tight ends this year a lot easier. So I liked the Duggar pick. Following suit,

Josh Uche, the edge rusher out of Michigan. Josh, to me, is their best pick overall. He's my favorite of their picks, and this one was universally praised. I'm finding very few people that had a problem with this one because essentially just that type of edge rush that he brings, that quickness, that bend, that closing speed, he's the prototypical pass rusher and can really thrive here in New England. They continued it with the next pick with Anthony Jennings out of Alabama. Anthony slipped a little bit, I think, because of the knee injury that he had in 2018, England. They continued it with the next pick with Anthony Jennings out of Alabama. Anthony slipped a little bit, I think, because of the knee injury that he had in 2018.

But folks, he's a strong edge defender. He plays his assignment as assigned. I keep saying that over and over again, but to me, that's the type of player Bill Belichick loves. So I was not surprised for them to bring him in. I think he can make a definite impact on this defense. And then, of course, the tight end position. Patriots tight ends were absolutely abysmal in 2019. And I say that with all due respect to Ryan Izzo and Matt Lacoste, who are hard players. They're good guys, and they absolutely did the best they could last year. But when you get 37 catches being tied for last with two touchdowns

out of a position that is really a very big focal point of a New England offense, you can't continue that. Bringing in Devin Asiasi brings them size, speed, length. He's got an impressive athleticism, and I think he shows some upside as a route runner. And to me, I think he has the opportunity to be a very good tight end in this offense with Jarrett Stidham throwing him the football. Dalton Keene is another guy that they brought in. A lot of people were surprised they didn't go Adam Trotman in this case.

I liked Keene. I liked Trotman. He was, to me, he was the prototypical patriot. He's the guy I wanted. But the more footage I watched on Keene, the more I was convinced that he'd be a good fit, especially because he can play the H-back and the fullback. And that's a position they're going to need some help at this year, especially with the retirement of James Devlin.

So the Pats again— I'm sorry to interrupt you, but the Dalton Keene pick, to me, it just seemed like a bit of a reach. Do you think that was just, hey, we needed to get a tight end, so this is the guy we grabbed? In a way, I think a lot of people are seeing it like that but the more footage that I watch on him and the versatility that Keene can bring both as a blocker as an option in the the passing game and also as an option in the power run game like I said he can

play that H back or that fullback role and with the retirement of James Devlin the Patriots placed such a premium on that I think that's why they went with Keene. You can make the argument that he might be a rush. Will he ever really round into that third-round pedigree that the Patriots used on him? I think the jury's still out on that. I think it's a fair point, David. But at the end of the day, I think that's why they went with him over a guy like Trotman. I think they found the route running and the athleticism of Asiasi a little bit more appealing,

and they brought in a guy like Keene to be that type of bumping tight end that they needed to kind of balance off the yin and the yang at that position so again it's you know the jury is still out on that one but I do believe they'll I do believe that they'll appreciate the pick of Dalton Keene in this role well I think finally in an offseason where there was just so much turnover and so much change, what are the expectations that the Patriots are going to go into with this season? Well, it's tough to say because I think a lot of people are expecting the Patriots to either completely bottom out in the AFC East or they're expecting business as usual. I like to quote Aristotle and say, virtue lies in

the middle. And I think that's exactly where you're going to see the Patriots end up. I think a very realistic expectation for this team this year is probably eight and eight or nine and seven. At best case scenario, they might eke out double digit wins, but it's going to be extremely tough. This is a very tough schedule that the Patriots are facing. And I think people have to remember that. The other point is that the Patriots are now starting And I think people have to remember that. The other point is that the Patriots are now starting a new quarterback with a lot of new faces and the preparation time and the preparation methods are unlike anything that we've ever seen before. A lot of this is all being done virtual. They need time on the field to be able to gel with one another. And we just

don't know when that's going to happen. If the Patriots have to go into the season cold, it could mean for a long year in New England. And I know Pats fans don't want to hear that, but it's definitely a factor and something to consider. If they get the time to put in together and they're able to work as a cohesive unit and they start on time, then I think they could raise a couple of eyebrows here and maybe even eke out a couple more wins than people think. But at the end of the day, it's going to be about preparation. It's going to be about how

Jared Stidham can carry the load. And it's going to be about how the defense is going to be able to carry this team, because I think you're going to see a return to the early part of the Patriots dynasty that 2001, 2002 pound the ball on the ground, manage the game from the quarterback position and rely staunchly on defense to be able to win you games. Well, hey, I think that wraps it up nicely. I really appreciate all the great information you brought to Charger fans. I think they definitely learned a whole lot about the Patriots and what to expect for them in this upcoming season.

Mike DeBate, it was a pleasure talking to you. And remember, everybody, you can follow mike on twitter at m debate f p c that's foxtrot papa charlie so uh man great information and i look forward to doing this again when we do the crossover during the season absolutely david it was my honor thank you very much for sharing the microphone with me today and i look forward to the next time we do a crossover during the regular season. And with that, Patriots fans, crossover week is now charge complete. We have completed our tour of the AFC West. But the week is not over yet here on Locked On, Patriots,

because we've been taking a deep dive into the draft halls and the off seasons of our cross-divisional rivals. But what about our New England Patriots? Instead of simply a crossover evaluation, maybe we need a little cross-roads evaluation. What can we expect from the Patriots as the off-season rolls on? Are there still some moves to be made? How will this team begin to take shape if all of the development thus far is virtual?

Well, to help me answer these questions, I will be welcoming in a special guest, whose wisdom and counsel you all know and love. If you think really hard about it, folks, I'm sure you'll be able to figure it out, but just in case, I'll leave you in suspense until tomorrow's show. And if you're just too curious to see who it is, be sure not to miss an episode. So subscribe to us on Apple Podcasts, follow us on Spotify, and don't forget, you can always listen to Locked On Patriots on your smart device

and it's so easy to do so. Simply ask it to play the latest episode of Locked On Patriots. And if you've enjoyed today's podcast, now ask your smart device to play the latest episode of Locked On NFL Draft. Once again, I'm Mike DeBate. I thank Dave DeGrogemeyer for his time, his

insight, and his appearance today. But most of all, I thank you so much for listening and for staying locked in to Locked On Patriots. Stay safe, stay well, and have a great day, everyone.