Locked On Patriots - Daily Podcast On The New England Patriots - Crossroads: Patriots’ Camp Surprises & Endangered Vets | Big Joint Practice

Starting point is 00:00:00 Not everything you think is going to happen actually happens. We start with three camp surprises heading into the first joint practice and preseason game here on Lockedon Patriots. You are Locked on Patriots, your daily New England Patriots podcast, part of the Locked on Podcasts Network, your team every day. What's up, Patriots fans? I'm your host, Nick Cattels, born and raised. in New England, host of the Everything Pats podcast, co-host of the Greg Bedard Patriots podcast with Nick Cattels and a veteran sports talk show host. On today's episode, there are actually good football players who might not make this team. We'll give you three of our

Starting point is 00:00:47 endangered vets. And we also list three important things we're looking out for Vraebel's first joint practice. But first, let's talk surprises. We all love surprises. We appreciate you joining the show making us your first listen and for being an everydayer the lockdown patriots podcast a proud part of the lockdown podcast network your team every day in today's episode is brought to by fandul right now new customers can get $150 in bonus bets when your first $5 bet wins it is completely justifiable to pay most of your attention during this camp season on Drake May. We've all talked about how critical his development is in this process of trying to get

Starting point is 00:01:34 to being a competitive team. It's also justifiable to put a lot of your attention towards the free agency class. Those guys were brought in for good reason trying to improve this roster, some fun names to talk about, and it's also justifiable to discuss the 2025 NFL draft, especially the guys who were picked in the top 100. It's a very exciting class. And a number of those guys are all ready making an impact in this camp. So it's justifiable to talk about all of that.

Starting point is 00:02:07 May, free agency, the draft picks in the top 100. But I think as we pay so much attention to those three buckets, we're missing out on some of the surprises of this camp. And there have been some surprises. I want to start on the defensive edge. Mike Reese posted watching on. undrafted outside linebacker Elijah Ponder from Cal Poly in one-on-one pass rush drills and his ability to bend the edge sparks the desire to see more of him in team drills.

Starting point is 00:02:39 The 6-foot-3-261-pound ponder gave four backup offensive tackles all they could handle. Now I know some of you might be screaming at me already. Back-up offensive tackles, Nick. Of course he's burning backup offensive tackles. Hold on. wait a minute you get the opportunities to play the ones you get opportunities in joint practice and in the preseason games you get better opportunities by beating the guys who are in front of you one on one if you can take the best of the backup offensive tackles shove it back

Starting point is 00:03:18 in their face win those battles then you should theoretically take a step to the next level You can only control what you can control, do what you can do. And Elijah Ponder, yeah, he's going against backup tackles. But if he was losing against those backup tackles, we wouldn't be having this conversation. He wouldn't be discussed. He has to take advantage of what's in front of him, step by step. And he's been doing that early in camp. Evan Lazzar recently wrote about Ponder.

Starting point is 00:03:48 Ponder is an undrafted rookie making a push based on his impressive reps in one-on-one's. Ponder posted seven sacks and 38 total pressures in his final collegiate season, including five pressures versus Stanford so he can rush the passer. On Monday, the undrafted rookie had three wins, quote-unquote, in one-on-one drills over Demontre Jacobs, UDFA tackle Jack Conley, and veteran Vinarian Lowe. He then drew against Marcus Bryant holding his own in all four reps. He was given in one-on-ones. Surely Ponder will get plenty of snaps in the preseason allowing for a,

Starting point is 00:04:24 a closer look at his 11-on-11 abilities. And that's what this is all about. He's going against guys that at draft time were considered at or near his level. Marcus Bryant's seventh round pick. I believe Vedarian Lowe was a sixth round pick. You can look that up, but I'm pretty confident he was a sixth round pick. DeMontre Jacobs, UDFA, Jack Conley. That's at the level or near the level of what you would anticipate from Ponzi.

Starting point is 00:04:54 because he himself is an undrafted free agent from Cal Poly. And Ponder, fitting along with the rest of this pass rush, it has been a pleasant surprise, the entire pass rush. Kelevon Chase on has had a wonderful camp. Harold Landry has had very good moments. Christian Barmore has been one of the most standout players during this camp. Keon White has been absolutely fantastic for most of this camp. And even more guys on that defensive line are showing up.

Starting point is 00:05:24 The pass rush has been legit in Ponder, at least in the one-on-one scenarios, has been a part of that. He'll turn 23 years old in a couple of weeks. And when we talk about somebody like Ponder, we're just talking about potential. Cal Polly, obviously not a powerhouse in college football. We're talking about the potential of Ponder. We're talking about a need for the Patriots. We discussed this during the offseason. We discussed this throughout OTAs and mandatory minicamp.

Starting point is 00:05:53 they're going to need as much pass rush as possible. So when you find somebody who has that quote unquote bend like Ponder does, it stands out to you. And, you know, when you play for a defense like Mike Vrable and Terrell Williams's defense, that absolutely loves and borderline obsesses over guys who are on the edge with that electric first step, ponder's showing that that means something. ponder's relative athletic score was 9.7 from 0 to 10 that's pretty pretty pretty good let's jump to somebody else Marcus Bryant is making a push during this early camp back to Evan Lazar who writes

Starting point is 00:06:39 Bryant has quietly begun to increase his involvement following a solid showing in one-on-ones the rookie seventh rounder got the nod over Jacobs for the first time in Monday session Bryant had wins over past rushers Truman Jones and Brayden Swinson to finish two one and one-on-ones on Monday. Plus, he didn't look out of place, past protecting at right tackle and team drills. Lazar also posted this from Tuesday's walkthrough. Bryant is getting some reps, suggests they could get an opportunity. He can get an opportunity with the top offense in Wednesday's joint practice. Today, right now, I would say Marcus Bryant is on your 53-man roster.

Starting point is 00:07:22 He's on the roster right now. Just look at the tackle depth. Caden Wallace moves to guard. What do you have at tackle? Vedarian Lowe just got off Pup. Not really sure what we have there as far as him being physically capable of doing much. We'll see. Obviously, past the physical, have to do that to get off Pup.

Starting point is 00:07:41 But how far along is he? The next week or two will tell us an awful lot. Then you look at the right side. We know what Demontre Jacobs is. Wasn't very good last year. Kind of, you know, somebody who you're working with as a project. And I think Bryant is right along those same lines. When you look at the raw potential of just his size, 6 foot 7, 320 pounds,

Starting point is 00:08:08 his athleticism, again, 8.9 in the relative athletic score. at 67320 and 8.9 RAS is pretty darn good. And he played left tackle in college for Missouri. Armand Membue was the right tackle. So we know he can play left tackle. At least he's experienced there. And now he's starting to tinker with the right side. So maybe he brings you a little bit of versatility.

Starting point is 00:08:35 Here's another surprise. It's a quick one. Don't want to glaze your eyes over on special teams. but Andy Boragallis, he was drafted in the sixth round and many Patriots fans lost their minds that the team drafted a kicker in the sixth round. Well, what we have is a legitimate kicking competition in camp. Andrew Callahan posted this on Monday. Nobody giving an inch in the Patriots kicker competition. Parker Romo and Andy Baragalas both four or four on field goals hitting up to 54 yards.

Starting point is 00:09:05 Neither kicker has missed a field goal in the last five plus practices. You know what I say? Two is better than one. I'd rather have two kickers that actually look like they can do the job than one kicker. I'd rather have two kickers that look like they could do the job than having zero kickers looking like they can actually do the job. We went through some nightmares. We lived through the Chad Riland experience in 2023. Grateful to see you on the other side of that.

Starting point is 00:09:36 So I'm okay with the kicker competition. Make everyone on this football team earn their spot. Kicker, long snapper, don't care. Back to back, four win seasons. I want you to win your job, to earn your job, to deserve the spot that you get. So a lot of times we talk about iron, sharpening iron on the offensive line and defensive lines. Maybe we got some kicker iron versus iron here. And maybe just maybe Borogales is feeling a little bit of heap because Romo did well.

Starting point is 00:10:08 and has been doing well. I'm all for it. I know it's kickers, but I'm all for it. It's a big week for three endangered vets on this roster. We'll tell you who and why next as we continue with today's episode of Lockdown Patriots, part of the Lockdown Podcast Network, your team every day. This episode is presented by Yahoo Fantasy. It's the best time of the year NFL kickoff almost here,

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Starting point is 00:11:38 Three vets. Three vets on this team could be gone by campsend, maybe even more, because this team is better than last year's team. You can look at this 53 man roster. I've been looking at all the projections from Greg Bedard and Mark Daniels and Doug Kide and others. Say legitimate football roster. Last year, you had to try to find guys to put on the 53. This time you're looking at it and you're saying, who could be gone? There are legitimate football players who could be gone. There are legitimate football players who could be gone. gone from this roster by Camps, and it is a huge week for three guys, for these three guys that I'm going to give to you. Let's start with my buddy Greg Bedard, who has been writing and talking about this on our podcast, he's been writing at BSJ, about Kyle Dugger and his roster spot not being safe. Butard believes people he's spoken to in the building, he believes that Dugger's spot is kind of up in the air. it is not a guarantee now why would dougar not be a guarantee you start with the coverage

Starting point is 00:12:42 and he's given up some big plays during camp already and you look back at last year you look back at the prior seasons to that and we know dougar has given up plays he has been far from flawless he's given up some big plays in the passing game and last year i know he wants to chalk it up to the injury but when you look at his history his history tells you that there's a bit of a lack of focus, not always fully understanding of the assignment. So that's one issue. Another issue is the safety depth.

Starting point is 00:13:17 One of the deepest positions of this Patriots roster is safety. Gibral Peppers. You got Del Pettish, Jalen Hawkins, Craig Woodson, Marcus Epps. I mean, you've got five or six guys that could play safety at the NFL level. You have Brennan Schooler who gives you some insurance as well.

Starting point is 00:13:41 As we know, he's the special team's guru, but he gives you even more depth at safety because he's actually played some reps there. He's taking some snaps in real football games at safety, which gives you just a little bit more. And then Monday's practice

Starting point is 00:13:57 what we saw. We talked about this on yesterday's episode a little bit. You know, you look at Monday's practice and Craig Woodson starts to take some snaps from Dugger, eating into Dugger's time. Now, here's my question with Dugger. I don't know if he's going to get traded. I don't know if he's going to get cut.

Starting point is 00:14:18 And it doesn't necessarily have to do with how well he plays or doesn't play in a perfect world. If somebody doesn't earn a spot, you get rid of him. You say, you weren't good enough. We're moving on. You need to be better at football. We have guys who are better at football than you are. So we've decided to make this decision. But we all know the reality.

Starting point is 00:14:35 We all know the reality of professional sports. Money matters. Ownership matters. And when you sign a guy to a contract extension, like Elliot Wolf signed Dugger 2 last season, that could be an obstacle towards getting rid of him if the team wants to get rid of him. And so I would lean towards Dugger being gone as unlikely because of the money. Dugger this year would cost $23.3.5 million of dead cap. 23 and a quarter million.

Starting point is 00:15:12 However, Dugger has a potential out after this season. And the dead cap money next year is $9 million. 23 and a quarter million of dead versus $9 million. dead. I would not be surprised if Dugger keeps his job, even if he's, you know, head to head with some of these guys that are a little bit deeper on the depth chart. I would not be surprised if he kept his gig because of that potential out in his contract, which would drop that dead cap hit significantly. So that's my question with Dugger, but I don't think it's a guarantee he's on this roster. I also don't think that Anthony Jennings being on this roster.

Starting point is 00:15:58 is a given. And when you look at what you're getting from some other guys on that edge position, it makes it even more difficult for Jennings to jump in because, you know, when you look at Anthony Jennings, you say to yourself, the best thing he does is he stops the run. And the argument to keep Jennings on this roster is that he would be better at stopping the run than anybody else, than anybody else at that position. And now we're starting to look at things a little bit different.

Starting point is 00:16:28 You could look up Harold Landry's analytics last season with Tennessee, and we all talk about his pass rush win rate, but he was really good against the run. And then Kalevon Chase on during camp, he's been good against the run, and the Patriots reportedly have not been afraid of putting Chase on out there on the goal line. So if you've got Keon White, you've got Chase on, you've got Landry, if you feel like all three of those guys can play good against the run, then you really have no reason to keep. keep Anthony Jennings, especially if you're seeing some of the past rushing pop that we talked about with Elijah Ponder. You just drafted Braden Swinson. He's making this team. And then you have

Starting point is 00:17:10 Truman Jones. You might not know much about Truman Jones, but he was a Chiefs practice squad player, 23, 24. He then jumped the Pat's practice squad in 24 as well. He ended up playing week 18 last year, which, you know, we know what the Patriots were attempting to do week 18 last year, but he played week 18 last year. He was a captain of the Harvard football team, and he's put together a good camp. So Landry, Chase on, White, Swinson, Ponder, Jones, six dudes. Then you get to Jennings. how many defensive ends outside linebackers edges are you going to carry you ain't carrying six

Starting point is 00:17:59 or seven at least I don't think and it would also lead us to the question of how much trade value if he does have trade value do you get with Jennings I think it's possible you could get something for Jennings he's a good solid steady defensive end really good defending the run. He has shown a little bit of pass rush skill during this camp, but I think you could get a day three pick for Jennings. I don't think that's crazy. So maybe you move on. You trade him for a fifth or a sixth, and you put your eggs and chase on, Landry, White, Swinson, and probably one of Ponder or Jones. And you roll with that. Third and final, endangered vet. as we get ready for the joint practice and preseason game this week.

Starting point is 00:18:55 It's got to be Col Strange. Cole Strange went from your starting left guard to your third string center in about two weeks. Life comes at you fast. Jared Wilson goes from not being on the field early camp to taking Strange's spot. Obviously, the coaching staff did not think Strange was doing enough to hold onto that spot. And it goes beyond that because you not only put Wilson, as you're starting left guard, as of today. You also have Cato Wallace, and they moved Wallace from tackle to guard.

Starting point is 00:19:29 And what they're telling us is they think that Wallace is better than Strange at guard. Because if they felt like Strange was better than Wallace, Strange would have stayed at left guard. Wallace would have been the third guard or went back to tackle. But the fact that Wallace stayed at left guard and they moved Strange to center to be behind Ben Brown and Garrett Bradbury. You could flip that probably as of right now, right? Bradbury then Brown.

Starting point is 00:19:57 But third string center is third string center. It's not looking great right now for strange. And he's been inconsistent most of his career. And during this camp, he's been pretty inconsistent. And inevitably, he might just end up being a Belichick guy. And this coaching staff doesn't think glowingly of him. So three endangered vets, keep an eye on. Dugger, Jennings, Strange.

Starting point is 00:20:23 All right, I'm going to give you three things to watch for during this joint practice against Washington. That's coming up next as we continue with today's episode of Lockdown Patriots, part of the Lockdown Podcast Network, your team every day. Summer sports are in full swing and whether you're all about baseball under the lights. And if you're living in Boston and living in New England, you should be right now. Golf on the greener high stakes soccer action. Fandul is the best way to make every game even more exciting. You're already following the action.

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Starting point is 00:21:25 You can even try some of these same game parlays. I love same game parlays. I love betting futures in football. Check it out. Again, you can bet just $5 and get $150 in bonus bets if your first bet wins. Open the Fandul app today or visit Fandul.com slash lockdown to get started. Camp could be long. camp could be long and you know you're not going to circle every single date on the calendar as important but when we got the training camp schedule one of the first dates that we circled was of course August 6th the joint practice with the Washington commanders joint practices are much more important nowadays than preseason games are guys actually play they actually practice they're out there in the joint practice they're doing work a lot of dude

Starting point is 00:22:18 don't play in the preseason any longer. It's just not how the league rolls. So you'll have your starters out there working against other teams starters, which is critical. And during joint practices, coaches love the fact that they can rep specific things. You know, some of the things that they're having trouble with, some of the things that they want to challenge their team with. So you've got the guys out there playing and repping. You've got these reps that are addressing specific questions about their football team. and so the joint practice is much more important.

Starting point is 00:22:51 Wednesday is much more important than what will happen on Friday night. And so we got three things to watch for during this joint practice to get you ready. Let's begin with the offensive line. The Patriots pass rush, as we mentioned earlier in this episode, has been really good throughout camp. How much of that is the pass rush? How much of that is the offensive line? Is it 50, 50, 70, 30, 60, 40, 80, 20, 20, 10.

Starting point is 00:23:16 what is it? What's the break? And we'll get a better idea of that during the joint practice because now you've got your offensive line going against somebody else's number one defensive line. And of course you have to start on the left side. This is the first chance to see Will Campbell and Jared Wilson work as a tag team combination. We don't know if they're going to be tag team champions of the world or if they're going to be forced to break up quickly. We don't know. We're all pretty optimistic. We all hope that Campbell and Wilson are the long term answers at both those positions.

Starting point is 00:23:56 But we get to see a little bit more of it now against a legitimate NFL defensive line going after it. Test Campbell, test Wilson, do those two rookies pass the test. How do they look? At the end of the joint practice, are we talking about two rookies? who struggled mightily? Are we talking about two rookies who kind of held their own? Are we talking about two rookies who exceeded expectations? The left side of the offensive line is something we're watching all year long.

Starting point is 00:24:25 It starts with this joint practice now that Wilson has been moved to the top left guard. Then we've got Garrett Bradbury. You know all the questions I have about him in pass protection. And he's going to get a pretty tough test here because he's got a couple of defensive linemen that could cause some issues. Washington, you know, they've got Kinlawn, they've got pain, some other guys in the mix. So let's see what this center position looks like against another team's pass rush. And let's check on Morgan Moses.

Starting point is 00:24:56 You know, he's been in and out of practice. That's been a management situation. I would expect Moses to get a decent amount of snaps during this joint practice. How does he hold up? How does he look? He had a really rocky start. but he's progressively gotten better throughout camp. And so it'll be interesting to see what he does during this joint practice.

Starting point is 00:25:19 So offensive line, we begin there because it's been such a nightmare the last couple of seasons. I feel like you have to start with the offensive line. Secondly, let's go to the other side. Defensive line. Now, we talk about O line, D line, Patriots practices, who wins, why they win. I want to look at this a little bit differently as far as the defensive line. I want to start with where guys line up. Where do guys line up each and every snap?

Starting point is 00:25:46 We know, according to Greg Bedard, that Keon White has played all four positions on the defensive line during this training camp. In one single practice, he played all four positions. How much is Keon White moving around? How much is Milton Williams moving around? Are you moving Christian Barmore along that defensive line? So I want to know where guys are lining up. How versatile truly is this defensive line?

Starting point is 00:26:13 Was the stuff happening over the past couple of weeks? Was it happening to try things out? Or does this coaching staff actually believe that they have a lot of versatility up front? Is Keon White actually going to play all of those different positions? And this will be the first chance to watch Christian Barmore and Milton Williams against another team's offensive line. And Milton Williams, I haven't heard a ton about him. He's been okay from people that I've spoken with.

Starting point is 00:26:44 He's been all right. He hasn't been a standout. He hasn't stood out like Keon White. He hasn't stood out like Barmore. Barmore, according to many reports, is having a really good camp when he's been out there. They're, of course, managing him because of his health situation from a year ago. So you got Williams and Barmore together. Can Williams get it going a little bit more?

Starting point is 00:27:08 and can Barmore continue to dominate? Can this pass rush? We know that Williams and Vrabels, Terrell Williams and Vrable's defense is about attacking. We've discussed, which could be a challenge against a, you know, an athletic quarterback like Jaden Daniels. You know, it could be a challenge because the old school of Belichick was try to just keep the guy in the pocket, keep him in the pocket, keep him in the pocket. don't lose the edge, don't go too far downfield, try to keep contained. And this defense is more attacking. This defense is not afraid to get downfield.

Starting point is 00:27:48 So when you've got Daniels, and of course, you're not going to hit the quarterback during a joint practice, but will the pass rush stay responsible enough or it doesn't matter anymore? Because I think we're going to see a lot more attacking from this defense. This is an interesting matchup to see if, these edges scream down the field against a quarterback like Daniels understanding the situation and what he can do, the old dual threat quarterback. And Washington's O line is nothing to sniff at. They traded for Laramie Tunsel, as we know.

Starting point is 00:28:20 That moved Brandon Coleman to left guard. Tyler Beattish is their center. Now, right guard, trying to figure things out. Sam Cosmy's on the PUP towards ACL in January. Nick Allegretti, veteran, is on this team. So he's likely to start at right guard. Your right tackles Andrew Wiley versus Josh Connerley, that little bit of a battle. So, you know, they've got some talent.

Starting point is 00:28:44 Interestingly enough, pro football focus ranked Washington's O-line 19th ahead of the 2025 season. I think they could be better than that, especially if Cosme comes back sooner rather than later. And then the final thing I'd be looking for is the battle for the sixth wide receiver spot. We spent a lot of time talking about all these different receivers. and frankly, it looks like J. Vaughn Baker, who we discussed for a moment yesterday, and some news sounds like he moved up during the walkthrough to get ready for this joint practice. Mark Daniels posted the receivers working with May today are Stefan Diggs, DeMario, Douglas, Kishon, Booty, Kyle Williams, Matt Collins, and Jayvon Baker.

Starting point is 00:29:24 Baker's coming off a strong practice. Looks like he's moving up the debt chart with Kendrick Bourne out. So it looks like Baker's going to get that first shot at that. that sixth spot during this joint practice and if he plays in the preseason game. He'll be the first dude to take that Kendrick-Born spot. Can he hold on to it? Can he do enough? Is he going to get opportunities against the top corners of Washington?

Starting point is 00:29:50 What does he do with those opportunities? Can Jalen Polk wrestle it away from him? Can Efton Chisholm make a little bit of noise? But right now, Baker, he's first in line to replace Kendrick Bourne. who's out for who knows how long. And he's been cooking a little bit, Baker. So can he keep that momentum going? Or can somebody kind of leapfrog him during this very important joint practice?

Starting point is 00:30:20 And I would imagine those guys will play on Friday, what they do on Friday. That wraps up this edition of Lockdown Patriots. Reach out to me on Twitter at Nick C. Radio. Nick C. Radio. Don't forget to throw a comment in on the YouTube channel. And don't forget to help us out. hit that like button and subscribe. That always helps. Thank you for being an everydayer making lockdown Patriots your first listen today.

Starting point is 00:30:41 For your second listen, check out lockdown bets. We got Lee Sterling, Kevin Rogers, daily MLB locks, can't miss football futures. Find lockdown bets on YouTube or wherever you listen to podcasts. Have a great day. We'll see you tomorrow. Thank you.

Locked On Patriots - Daily Podcast On The New England Patriots - Crossroads: Patriots’ Camp Surprises & Endangered Vets | Big Joint Practice

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