Locked On Patriots - Daily Podcast On The New England Patriots - Financial Friday: PatsCap Talks Stephon Gilmore and New England Patriots Finances — 6/18/2021

Episode Date: June 18, 2021

The New England Patriots are moving on from 2021 mandatory minicamp. However, the week produced some interesting storylines, one of which could impact the Pats’ bottom-line. Joining host Mike D’Abate is Miguel “PatsCap” Benzan. The duo discuss the details of a potential new deal for cornerback Stephon Gilmore, as well as looking ahead to possible moves yet to be made. Lastly, in a segment unique to Locked On Patriots, Miguel “sets the record straight” on the various cap myths circulating Patriots fandom.Support Us By Supporting Our Sponsors!Built BarBuilt Bar is a protein bar that tastes like a candy bar. Go to builtbar.com and use promo code “LOCKED15,” and you’ll get 15% off your next order.BetOnline AGThere is only 1 place that has you covered and 1 place we trust. Betonline.ag! Sign up today for a free account at betonline.ag and use that promocode: LOCKEDON for your 50% welcome bonus.Rock AutoAmazing selection. Reliably low prices. All the parts your car will ever need. Visit RockAuto.com and tell them Locked On sent you. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

You are Locked On Patriots, your daily New England Patriots podcast, part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day. Hello to all of you Foxborough faithful. You are now locked in to the Lockdown Patriots podcast. It is Friday, June 18th, 2021, and Fridays are always a good time for a little Foxborough Finance 101 here on your daily home for news notes and analysis infused with the occasional opinion on your six-time Super Bowl champions, the New England Patriots. Greetings and salutations, Patriots Nation, and thank you for joining me here on this Friday episode of the pod.

My name is Mike DeBate. I cover the New England Patriots for Patriot Maven of Sports Illustrated, and I'm also your host of the Locked On Patriots podcast, which of course is a proud part of the Locked On podcast network, your team every day. And folks, because it, your team every day. And folks, because it's your team every day, that means your questions, comments, and feedback are always welcomed and very much appreciated. So share that feedback, send it to the internet by reaching out to me and following me on Twitter at M-D-A-B-A-T-E-N-F-L.

And while you're there, sitting there, giving the weekend nod to the Twitterverse and saying how you doing, follow the Locked On the Twitterverse and saying, how you doing? Follow the Lockdown Patriots account as well at LO underscore Patriots. Patriots fans, 2021 mandatory minicamp is now in the books, and your New England Patriots are headed for a brief summer vacation before training camp starts in late July. But don't forget, folks, this is an organization that predicates itself on no days off. The coaching staff is still going to be hard at work. The players are going to be keeping conditioning.

And the media, including us here at Locked On Patriots, will continue to bring you the very latest news notes and analysis from Foxborough. Because even though the action on the field might be taking a hiatus, the Patriots are still doing work in the front office, as evidenced yesterday by a few roster moves. The team announced the signing of offensive lineman RJ Prince, while also announcing the release of kicker Roberto Aguayo and long snapper Wes Farnsworth. And the release of both Aguayo and Farnsworth shouldn't really be a big surprise to a lot of Patriots fans and media alike.

Aguayo is facing an uphill battle. Nick Folk is the incumbent, and boy did he look good in training camp according to those that were in attendance. Making field goals, calm, cool, collected. Pretty much a foregone conclusion that Nick is going to be the starting kicker this year, but he might have a little competition on his hands, but not in the form of Aguayo. Rookie Quinn Norton apparently has quite the impressive leg, and he's expected to at least give Nick Folk a run for his money in training camp. At the very least, the Patriots might have a hidden gem, one they'd like to keep on the practice squad this year. But we all knew that the Patriots were not going to keep three kickers

long term, and to clear out a little bit on the roster, Aguayo finds himself the odd man out. Wishing him the best of luck, he's bounced around the NFL besides the Patriots, drafted by the Tampa Bay Buccaneers back in 2016, spent time with the Chicago Bears, Carolina Panthers, the LA Chargers, and ultimately he was competing on a spot for this team, but now if he hopes to continue his NFL career, it'll be elsewhere. Farnsworth is another name that I don't think a lot of people expected to hang around long term. Joe Cardona is entrenched as the Patriots' long snapper, and I don't think any one of us expected him to be unseated anytime soon. But the Patriots always do their due diligence. It's good to take a look at some of the other talent out there,

and apparently something had to catch Bill Belichick's eye in order to bring Wes into camp. Minicamp, that is. And there is some background here. He did play his collegiate football at the University of Nevada, appeared in 25 games, was given the captain's award by the team at the end of his senior year. Farnsworth originally joined the Miami Dolphins in 2019 as an undrafted free agent, was released by the team a little bit later in the year, and then he signed a futures contract with the Denver Broncos for the 2020 season. The Broncos in turn released him from the team in August. So, Roberto Aguayo and Wes Farnsworth are out, but enter RJ Prince, who also entered the league as an undrafted free agent back in 2018. And Prince can definitely add some depth on the offensive line.

Played his collegiate ball at North Carolina, making 23 starts at guard over the course of his junior and senior years. At the pro level, he played for the Pittsburgh Steelers and most recently for the Baltimore Ravens. Prince ended the 2020 season as a member of Baltimore's practice squad, and his hooking on with the Patriots was as a result of him being in town this week in order to try out. This is an interesting signing to me because, as most of you know, the offensive line depth chart is a bit crowded at this point, but Prince has known to be a solid contributor wherever he's been, so it'll be interesting to see if he's able to push anybody in training camp and maybe make a case to either make the 53-man roster or possibly as a practice

squad addition. So bottom line, folks, the Patriots continue to make moves, and they will continue to make moves throughout the offseason. But those moves also include financials, And when we're talking Foxborough finance, there is only one source we trust and one source we need. That's right. I'm talking about the great and powerful Wizard of Benz on himself. My good friend Miguel Benz on joins me on the hot seat here to close out the week in style on locked on Patriots. And we'll be talking the news of the week, which is Stefan Gilmore's holdout,

what it means for a potential contract negotiation, and a lot of the ins and outs that most of us, myself included, were not aware of when it comes to the contract details and negotiations between Gilmore and the Patriots. We'll also gaze into that Belichickian crystal ball, and Miguel will prognosticate what it might take for the Patriots to pull off another move this offseason. Do they have what it takes in the financial tank right now to be able to pull off a move that might catch your sharp eye? Last but certainly not least, in one of my favorite segments anywhere on Locked On Patriots, Miguel will set the record straight on all those various cap myths that are floating

around out there. Folks, an action-packed agenda. What better way to head into the weekend than to absorb the wisdom and counsel of my good friend Miguel. So sit tight and settle in as the Pat's Cap Top Gun, Miguel Benzon, joins me here on the Locked On Patriots Weekend Hot Seat when this Friday episode of the Locked On Patriots podcast continues. But first, Locked On listeners, Credit Karma has always been there to help you make better financial decisions.

And now they want to help even more. With a Credit Karma money spend account, you can be rewarded for good money habits. Credit Karma money is a brand new checking account where you can win cash reimbursements just for making purchases. When you use your Credit Karma money debit card, you can win daily Instant Karma purchase reimbursements on items up to $5,000. Just pay with your debit card and if you win, you'll be notified on the spot and your Instant Karma cash will be added back to your spend account. Credit Karma Money

has already given away over $3 million in Instant Karma to over 50,000 Credit Karma members and counting. Open your FDI insinsured spend account for free. There's no minimum balance requirements, no overdraft fees, and free withdrawals from a network of over 50,000 ATMs. And when you make a purchase between June 8th and June 30th, you'll automatically be entered to win $1,000,000. Right now, visit creditkarma.com slash winmoney to open your free account

and start winning Instant Karma. Go to creditkarma.com slash winmoney to sign up for free and start winning Instant Karma. Credit Karma money. Progress starts here. That's creditkarma.com slash winmoney. Instant Karma is sponsored by Credit Karma.

No purchase necessary. Exclusions and terms apply. See rules. Banking services provided by MVB Bank Incorporated. Member FDIC. Maximum balance and transfer limits apply. Locked on listeners, get all the latest news, odds, and info for all of your sporting needs, including Major League Baseball, the NBA, NHL, all of your UFC MMA action, and

of course the NFL, with the only place that has you covered and the only place we trust. Bet online. Bet online is the fastest and easiest way to bet on all of your sports action. Before the start of your next favorite sporting event, head over to Bet Online on your laptop or mobile device and check out all the greatest sporting news, sign-up bonuses, and contest information. You can track all the action at BetOnline. Head over to the website at BetOnline.ag and sign up today to receive your 50% welcome bonus on your first deposit when you use the promo code LOCKEDON. Don't sit on the sidelines anymore.

This is your chance to get into the action. Head over to their website or use your mobile device to sign up today and receive your 50% welcome bonus on your first deposit when you use the promo code LOCKEDON. BetOnline, your online sportsbook experts. Patriots fans, the image of mandatory minicamp is beginning to shrink in the rearview mirror, and the Patriots are taking a bit of a summer vacation. But the finances of your favorite team in Foxborough continue to be the hot topic in and around New England. And when it comes to the Patriots' bottom line, we need the definitive word on anything and everything Patriots salary cap.

Today, we seek the wisdom and counsel of the great and powerful Wizard of Benz on. You know him as the Pats cap. He is my good friend, Miguel Benz on. And it's my honor to bring his wisdom and counsel back to the podcast today, helping us close out the week in style. Welcome back to Lockdown Patriots, Miguel. Thank you so much for joining me today. Oh, it's an honor to be on this show.

I got to say, I'm standing up. Let's give you a standing ovation for getting a job on Sports Illustrated. Thank you, my friend. I've been a subscriber since I was a kid. So I'm so happy for you, man. I'm like, oh my gosh. I'm so happy when you tell us that. I'm standing up right now because I wanted to give you a standing ovation.

Well, the standing ovation from the great and powerful Wizard of Benzana is truly an honor. But, no, your friendship is the greatest honor that I can imagine. And I know that those congratulations and those well wishes come from a place of sincerity. I was very fortunate this week to be joined by several good friends, people that have been very supportive, whether it be Murph, whether it be Steve Balistrieri, whether it be our guy, Dougie Mack. Everybody has been so, you know, not only appreciative, but they've also been so helpful and just so amazing in terms of their support. I always appreciate it from the bottom of my heart. And that means a lot coming from you, my friend. So thank you so much. I always appreciate it from the bottom of my heart. And that means a lot coming

from you, my friend. So thank you so much. I'll definitely do my best to keep the coverage as, you know, the best I possibly can and make everyone proud, make everyone happy. But it's my honor and privilege to be a part of the SI team as well, to be able to add my name to some great colleagues that I work with at Sports Illustrated, whether it be through the Patriots Maven site and also through the other Fan Nation sites through Sports Illustrated. It's a true honor. So thank you, my friend. That really means a lot to me.

I was so happy for you. I'm so happy for you. Well, thank you, bud. Thank you. And what makes me happy, what makes me most happy is we're closing out the week in style with a little Foxborough Finance 101, bud. And what makes me happy, what makes me most happy is we're closing out the week in style with a little Foxborough Finance 101, Bud. And you bring the wisdom and counsel the way only you can do it. And let's just let's get right into it. But as we speak, your calculations show the Patriots as having $15,044,051 in available cap space.

Now, of course, a few minor moves were announced yesterday. Still, I believe, correct me if I'm wrong, I believe we're still waiting on a couple of the financials when it comes to those signings and releases. But for the most part, that seems to be what the Patriots are working with. As for the releases, sorry. No, please go ahead. The releases, I know they had no impact on the cap, all right? Because Wes Farnsworth and Robert Aguayo, their salaries were so low,

they weren't in the top 51 list. And they didn't have any guaranteed money. So there's no dead money for those guys. RJ Prince, he should have a get-up salary that's around $660,000. I doubt the Patriots gave him a signing bonus i could be wrong i've been wrong in a lot of things with the patriots but if i'm wrong it's not to be a material difference i look for example what my material i don't think you got a million dollar signing bonus okay you might have got 15 maybe got 15 25 000 signing bonus but it's an immaterial.

When you're talking about a cap, that's over $200 million. All right. Um, and yeah, so the other thing we got away on Mike is I haven't signed the three, uh, the top for the first three drop graphics. And for whatever reason,

like, and I wish somebody asked bill what they have in processes, Patrick Chung's retirement. But it's so let's just pretend those four transactions happened on the same day. That would end up, the Patriots would be around $13 million in cap space. Right. Okay. No, and that's great.

That's an excellent insight. And as for you being wrong, my friend, let me tell you, it is few and far between. As the late great Herb Brooks once said, if you find out that Miguel has been wrong on anything, take a picture and save the receipt because it does not last long. It is not something you're going to see regularly. So that being said, this has been an uncharacteristically busy offseason for the Patriots. They haven't exactly been reliable in terms of Patriot standards when it comes to spending money. They've spent a lot more than we've seen in several years.

And I mean this from the bottom of my heart, my friend. You've done a masterful job in breaking it all down, what these deals mean, how they can be structured, what it means for next year and beyond. You do an amazing job. And I'm in awe of what you do every single day. Obviously, there are still moves that could be made, and we'll talk about the potential for those moves in a little bit. But right now, Bud, let's kick it off with all eyes being on Stephon Gilmore, who we all know held out of minicamp earlier this week for contractual reasons, confirmed by our good friend Karen Garigian. I hate to interject.

Mike, do we really know there was contractual reasons, or do we know he was excused because of health? Well, at this point, I put a lot of stock into what Karen has to say from the Boston Herald. Karen Garigian, obviously, of the Boston Herald, making those impressions that it was indeed a contractual reason. Technically, we haven't heard that from Bill Belichick. Technically, we haven't heard that directly from the team,

nor have we heard that directly from Stefan. I always err on the side of caution. I always err on that to say that until we've heard it directly from any one of those three sources, technically, Miguel, anything could be possible. But that being said, Karen is someone that I trust implicitly. All right. Fair enough.

Fair enough. I'm just – the thing about the Stefan Gilmore thing is, like, people are surprised that he's done this, didn't show up at minicamp. Like, for people who follow me on Twitter, I said before, last year, he only showed up before off-season workout sessions. That was probably the minittrain, mini-camp, right? And then he got the restructure in the fall. I'm not surprised if I was him.

I could see why he's doing it, all right? As a person who thinks the players should always max out their deals, I mean, he signed a five-year deal with a team that liked five-year deals. So, I mean, he wasn't going to ever sign with the Patriots a three-year deal at 2017, all right? That's just now the Patriots have moved off the five-year deals and they're going to shorter deals. But in 2017, if you told me, Steph, they were going to sign Steph,

I'd give him a two-year deal, you'd ask me how long it was. I would definitely have said five years, and i would have bet a good approach a good amount of money on the five years all right i understand where he's coming from like for example he's you know that he moved some money from 2001 to 2020 so his cap here this year is about 16 million dollars which happens to be the highest cap number for any cornerback in the league, even though he's now in terms of compensation, Mike, and if he was to make all of his active roster bonuses, he'd be the 25th highest paid cornerback in the league this year.

So that's a big difference between folks between cap and cash. All right? His cap number is $16 million. What he could possibly earn in cash is $7.9 million because the Patriots have about $8.5 million in signing bonus per ration on his deal. If he's on the roster or not on the roster, that $8.4 million is going to be on the Patriots cap, no matter what. Oh, interesting. Yeah. Yeah, so let me just go over the numbers for you.

He's got a $7 million salary, all right? And, folks, people keep on saying the base salary, he's got $7 million. They keep on forgetting to add in the full – he's got a $411,765 roster bonus, all right? That happens to be 1 17th of $7 million. In the new CBA, the players and the owners agreed if they were going to have a week 17,

the players would get a benefit for one game a week salary as a benefit. But you could not restructure your deal after a certain date. I'm on vacation, Mike, so I forgot the date. Okay?

But I'm telling you right now, so that's why Stephon Gilman, he's not giving up that roster bonus. He's not going to give up that $400. He's including that. So people should think about that when they put that $7 million. Actually, he's $7.4 million, all right,

because an active roster bonus is he might just give it up in a restructured deal, all right? And so we had, folks, Mike and I had talked about what we're going to talk about today, and he's like, let's do a proposed restructure, all right, proposed extension for his deal. And I'm all for extending the man, all right? So I came up with a structure, Mike, all right, pros extension for his deal. And I'm all for extending the man, all right? So I came up with a structure, Mike, all right? I kept his cap number the same, all right?

And I gave him a deal that averages out to three. Extended his deal to three years, 2024, and puts him at $17.5 million API. All right? That's not the highest pay. That's not the highest API. That's Jalen Williams. He gets $20 million.

That's higher than Darius Slade, who's 29 years old, going to be 30 when he signed a deal for $16.7 million. All right? I happen to believe that Stephon Gilmore is a better player than Darius Slade. Darius Slade, excuse me. All right? So I think that's a fair deal. It doesn't change his cap number. All right?

He'll get the money, a lot of money this year. He'll be guaranteed a salary in 2022. All right? And then you could do what the Eagles did with Darius Slade, guarantee some money in 2022. All right? And then you could do what the Eagles did with Darius Slade, guarantee some money in 2023, but not all of his salary. All right?

Right. And then, obviously, with the Patriots, you would always have an offset. So if you did cut him, you signed someplace else, you get some of the salary back in 2024.

I think that's what things would end up doing. And I know I want to just speak about possibly and why he should do the deal. If he takes the deal now, let's say he doesn't take the deal.

If he shows up, he plays out the year for the Patriots. Next year's tag number for him would be over $19 million. Because it's a 20% rule. You trade him to another for the Patriots. Next year's tag number for him would be over $19 million. Right? Because it's a 20% rule. Okay? You trade him to another team. All right?

He's going to be, his cap number, and they don't do his deal. They'll just say, hey, we're not going to do a deal right now. We'll wait until after the season. His cap number is going to be $7.9 million. His 2022 cap number, tag number, would be whatever the tag number is for cornerbacks,

which is about, it was this year, about $14 million. Let's just make it, let's just increase it to let's make it $15 million. Right. He'd be better. So the tag number, if he's on another team, he plays at the current deal, it's $15 million. With the Patriots, it's $19 million.

So financially, it's better for him to get tagged with the Patriots. All right? All right. And I'll say this. For the Patriots, all right, if they – they have to think about this. If he plays this season on this year – with them this year, at the end of the season he'll have 10 accrued seasons. Right?

Right. He signs a huge deal next year. Let's say he picks $20 million a year. Mm-hmm. Because he has 10 accrued seasons, Mike, the best comp pick the Patriots could get in 2023 is a fifth-round pick. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. pound pick the Patriots could get in 2023 is a fifth-pound pick. Wow.

Yeah, yeah. So these are all the things that he and the Patriots have to think about when they're negotiating these deals. All right. All right? And I just want to – and so I think they're going to come to an agreement, Mike. I think it's possible. I think – I wish I remembered the person,

somebody said he's looking for Darius Slay money. I think this way, I think it's possible. All right? Right. If you told me, if I had heard that you want Jalen Ramsey money, then I would say he's gone. Yeah. All right?

All right. And the other thing that people are always asking me about is treating him and the consequences for treating a player, for him to play a player's trade. All right? Let's do, for some reason, I don't know why people think Adele is in his league. All right? Okay. Okay.

Firstly, I think Adele, Stefan Gilmoremore has better value, even though he's older. I think I like, I rate Stephon Gilmore more than I highly, more than I do OBJ. All right. But if they were to trade a player for player trade, the teachers would lose cap space in there because Odell is going to get about $14 million in compensation this year for the Browns. Right. All right? And that's what matters.

When a player for a player, you want to look at the compensation that each player gets this year. And don't look at the signing bonus duration. Look what they're going to get in cash. And I'm talking about the cash they're going to get. So if a player had received a signing on roster bonus, you might just ignore that. That stays on the old team's cap.

All right? Right. Okay. So hopefully I answered. Hopefully you answered any questions about this? No, I think you've addressed them very well. First of all, I'm glad that you mentioned the difference between the Ramsey money and the Slay money.

I saw the tweet that you had put out earlier a few days ago on that and your thoughts on it, whether or not the Patriots and Stefan could come to a happy medium based upon those figures. The Slay seems to be much more of the workable figure. And according to, it was Albert Breer of MMQB that put that out there saying that Stefan was in fact looking for, no, that's fine. No problem. No problem. For once, I actually got to be able to impart a little of my wisdom and counsel to you. Usually it's just the other way around. I'm pretty much going, yep. Okay. Yep. He's, he's, he's going through all his progressions and he's doing it flawlessly. I was glad I was able to drop that in, but no, in any case,

I do agree with you. I think that the slate money would be much more amenable to both sides. I think Stefan is temperate in this case. I think he realizes where his negotiation tactics are going to be able to take him. And he also realizes his leverage and his worth and what he brings to the table. But the Patriots also know that they need to maintain a little bit of leverage as well.

And the deal has to come together and be fair for both sides. But I'm glad you mentioned the implications on a trade. That's a common question we get here on Locked On Patriots, especially comparing it to Odell, because a lot of people believe that this is a like for like or that it's so easy to pick up the Cleveland Browns and say, we're going to trade Stefan for Odell straight up and this is how it's going to work and everything's going to be fine I'm glad that you mentioned that and I'm also glad that you mentioned about the franchise tag because that was a question that I did have earlier this week and I think you answered it and answered it very well in terms of what that would mean and how much a franchise tag for Stefan

Gilmore would cost the Patriots next year because of the 20% rule. So again, my friend, you always, always nail it. Your wisdom and counsel is always top notch in this area. And folks, ultimately, Miguel is correct. We really don't know for sure what the reason is for Stephon's holdout. Only Stephon really knows that for sure. And maybe the Patriots, they may not even know for absolute certainty as well. Haven't gotten any confirmation on whether or not this is an excused or not absent, what types of fines he might be subject to. That's still all in play. Again, I am going by what Karen had reported earlier this week, and I hold her reporting in as high regard as anyone. So we'll take that for what it's worth. We went under that assumption

today, my friend, and I thank you for enlightening us and for entertaining that idea and help bringing some wisdom and counsel on the Stefan situation to the masses here and the listeners of Locked On Patriots. But folks, we're just scratching the surface with Miguel here today. That is why he

is on the very short list of being the best of the best in all things NFL salary cap, especially the Patriots. He's the top mind in the business. My opinion, he always will be. That's why I call him the top gun, the best of the best.

But next year on Locked On Patriots, Miguel is going to give us a quick look into the future and some potential moves that could still be made. Relax, folks. We're not going to get into specifics on players, but what types of moves are still out there for the Patriots to make? And in a segment that is unique to this podcast,

Miguel is going to address some of those cat myths floating around out there and set the record straight. Do not miss this when this weekend episode of the Locked On Patriots podcast continues. Locked On listeners, we've all heard the phrase often imitated but never duplicated. It's a part of the sports fans lexicon. And that's because only the best athletes and sports teams can provide you with the best possible moments. And in that vein, the only ones who could provide the best healthy, low calorie and delicious treats to satisfy all of your snacking needs are the ones who provided the best in the first place. That's right, folks.

I'm talking about Bilt Bar because no one can do it like they do it. Bilt Bars are available in a multitude of delicious flavors. 100% real chocolate, soft, easy to chew, and they're not only low-calorie and low-sugar, but also high- and high fiber. Built Bar has no crazy additives, half the calories of its most popular competitors, and get this, seven times fewer carbs, seven times fewer grams of sugar, and more protein. So don't delay, do it today. Prepare your taste buds for wow, and make Built Bar your go-to protein bar right now.

Go to BuiltBar.com and use the promo code LOCKED15 to get 15% off your next order. That's promo code LOCKED15 for 15% off your next order at BiltBar.com. Folks, again, Miguel Benzon, the Pats cap himself, joins me here today on Locked on Patriots. And insight you'll only find here on Locked On Patriots. And Miguel, we know that the Patriots still have some moves to be made. You mentioned the rookie deals to be signed to kick off the pod today.

We talked about the minor additions and things of that nature. There are still, unfortunately, player cuts to come. We know the Patriots have to cut down to a 53-man roster. They're currently at 89. So there are players that are going to have to be shed from this roster. And there are also additions here and there that will take place because what the Patriots have out there right now is not likely to be the complete final product. We're either going to see some players leave or maybe a new face sprinkled in here and there. Those are the normal transactions heading into an NFL season. There's really no change there. But again, as we said to kick it off today, Bud, the Patriots have been anything but typical this

year. And you really get the feeling that anything can happen with this 2021 incarnation of the Pats. So as you examine this team's bottom line, Bud, what types of moves do you expect, whether it be to create space or invest their current cap space, and is there a potential for a deal that might catch the sharp eye of the fan base? Okay, so Mike, this team is, I think, loaded. If you read Evans, 50-man Russell production, you read 50-man three roster. Another great one.

Okay. You see that the Patriots are going to let go of some players who have treed value. All right? Right. So I expect during these three cuts, okay, and the last cut, that the Patriots are going to trade some of the players on their current roster. All right? Depending on who it is, it may or may not create cap space. All right?

If it's a player in the last year of the deal and was a veteran, it would create cap space. But if it's a player in the second or third year of the deal, it may not create cap space. We all know, but I do, like, for example, I can think of, like, if it's Nikhil Harry, that would probably create cap space. But if it's Chase Winovich, it may not create cash fees. We all know, but I do, like, for example, I can think of, like, if it's Nikhil Harry, that will probably create cash fees. But if it's Chase Winovich, it won't, right,

because they're different from their salaries, all right? Those are things to look for. But I'm saying, for me, Mike, the thing I'm – right now they're talking about $15 million cash fees, $13 million up in the same draft picks, and let picks and finally process Patrick Jones' name. That's right around how much they used

in cash space last year. So remember last year they released Mohamed Samou. Alright? And then after that date, that was on September 2nd, they used about $18-19 million in cap space

between that and the end of the league year, right? And that's because you had the practice squad elevations. You had the COVID elevations. You had to remember to get the – you had to come back from IR after three weeks, all right? So there's a lot of roster turnover. All right? So if they do this and the Patriots have put up 13 to 15 players in the season with 13 or 15 players on IR, all right? If they have one of those seasons where they have a lot of players on IR,

you need to go out of cap space. All right? But if they have a relatively healthy season, you don't need as much. Right. None of us now know how the Patriaches' health is going to be. So that's why the Peaches are going to need a cushion. And right now they're right about the right amount of cushion. Right?

And what happens, so I think they have the room to right now create cap space. Let's talk about earlier about the the structure of Stefan Gilman's extension they could change the way I did it and create cap space instead of leaving the cap number the same they could reach an extension with Dante Hightower for like one year

and create cap space alright so they have the room right now they're in a sweet spot in terms of the cap. All right? Because I want to break down, folks, what they're going to have to do for operating expenses for the rest of the year.

We talked about signing their draft picks. All right? Right now they're only counting 51 salaries on the salary cap. We're also going to cut down. You're going to count players 52 and 53. Let's say, remember that linebacker they drafted, Cameron McCrone?

Let's say you put him on IR for a year at the beginning of the year. You're going to pay for his salary. You're going to have 54 salaries down on the cap. You're going to pay for a practice squad. Now this year, it's going to be 16 players. It's going to be COVID. the cap. All right? All right? Then you pay for practice squad. Practice squad. Now this year, it's going to be 16 players like it was last year

because of COVID. Patriots, that's about $3 million. And depending on who you sign, because the difference in pay if it's a rookie

or it's a veteran, you could go anywhere from $2.8 million and $3.2 million in cap. All right? Right.

And then for the Patriots, they have to use active roster bonuses. All right? So if a player earns a not likely to be an active roster bonus, once he earns it, it hits the cap. Right. Brandon King wasn't active at all last year. Right? So each game he's active.

If I'm going to choose an NFL PA salary cap page, you'll see the Patriots lose cap speeds because of that. Right now, they've got about 38 players

who have active roster bonuses. If they all are active for every game this year, the Patriots will lose over $5.1 million in cap space, Mike. Wow. Yeah. So, they Mike. They need a cushion.

That's a lot of cap space they've got to think about. I'll say this before I scare people away. I'll say this. The roster cutdowns. If the players are not in the top 51, they make the roster, they're probably

going to create cap space because they beat out the highest salary player for a position. Right. Like if a rookie, I'm trying to think of a rookie who's not in the top 51. But okay, the wide receiver.

Okay. Trey Nixon. Okay, thank you. And the Patriots end up trading Mikael Harry away. That's about $2 million in cap space. Right. Okay.

All right. Okay. So that's what I got about that. They have a lot of cap space. I think they're the sweet spot right now. If they have, if it's what I got about that. So they have a lot of cat streets. I think they're the sweet spot right now. If they have, if it's what you want, you have them stay healthy during the preseason. I don't know how many of you guys as old as I remember,

you guys remember, like, yeah, that the Patriots had, like, three starters go down. The last preseason game, one of them was Garen Veras. The last name was Veras. I can't remember the other two guys that I've heard. But that just ruined the season for the one of them was Garen Veras. The last name was Veras. I can't remember the other two guys that got hurt. But that just ruined the season for the Patriots. It's true. We always say here on Locked on Patriots that health is the great equalizer.

And you always hope for good health, not just for the Patriots, but for every team across the league. The one thing that I think a true NFL fan never wants to see is any type of player experience a serious injury, one that's going to keep him out of action for the year or a significant amount of time. You always want to see teams at their best competing at their highest. And of course, when it's your favorite team, you're emotionally invested in that. And there is something to be said about wanting to see these guys remain healthy.

So assuming health, it's good to know that there is the flexibility to make a move that might invigorate the fan base a little bit as we head into this lull, this summer vacation heading into, you know, a training camp. But at the same time, just because there's a move to be made out there doesn't mean that it should be made. You have to be temperate. You have to take a look at everything involved as well as the personnel that you have on this roster. And if these guys are playing on all cylinders, I agree with you. This could be a very fun season, both on offense and on defense, to watch the New England Patriots play football.

Last but not least, my friend, you knew this was coming. Everybody knows it's coming. My favorite time of year, my favorite time of the week, my favorite time of the podcast. One of my favorite parts of having you join me here on the pod, buddy, is your ability to identify some of those erroneous cap reports out there. Things that

just kind of make you go, hmm, as Arsenio Hall used to say. In your infinite wisdom, buddy, confirm or debunk some of these cap myths that are floating around out there. Floor is yours, my friend. Set the record straight. Okay, let's do this.

This is probably moot by now, all right? But I have to apologize to the people who ask me questions on Twitter. All right? If you ask me a question, since I'm such a salary cap nerd, and you use the word training camp, I'm thinking you actually meant training camp. You asked me for a roster bonus, I think you actually meant roster camp. You asked me for roster bonus, I think you actually meant roster bonus.

So, Hightower shows up. Someone says it's because he wants to show up just to get his off-season workout bonus. I get questions about, do players get paid for the training camp? I answer, no. Does a player have

training camp bonus? And they don't. Not one player in the Patriots gets paid to show up for training camp. Some players in the past have. For example, Ty Lott. He got paid one time $1 million just to report to training camp. But none

of the current Patriots had that. I thought that was a reference to reporting bonus. And then somebody asked me, does it have a roster bonus for showing up for the off-season workout bonuses? They don't. Players make... I misunderstood the question, so I apologize to sick people. Somebody finally asked

me the question where it said off-season workout bonuses. I was like, Dante Howard never had an off-season workout bonus that's extra, All right? He just gets $275 per off-season workout session. If he had attended all 32 this year, he would have made $8,800. I know he got married this year, so he probably went on a honeymoon.

Therefore, he probably didn't make that much. He probably missed those sessions. And we know for the other sessions that were available to the media, he didn't get that. So he didn't make the maximum. And for someone who's made millions and billions of dollars in his NFL career,

I just can't think that making another $7,000 is going to make... He's showing up. It's not like for him. I don't, you know, he can make $7,000 by saying football in 10 minutes. That cracked me up. All right.

So he didn't, he never had an off-season workout bonus. And that's all I got to say about that. All right? So he didn't. He never had an off-season workout bonus. And that's all I got to say about that. All right? The second thing we've been hearing about, and it's like, oh, I love Evan. I love Doug. But they put down in their roster projections, if we're talking about Brian Hoyer, if veteran players can't be on the practice squad this year. They can't be.

It's in the new CPA. It doesn't have anything to do with the COVID. Like I said, after this new, you've read the details, the new CBA came out. Tom Brady, with 20-plus years of NFL experience, can be on a team's practice squad this year. They changed the rules. It had nothing to do with COVID. For whatever reason, the players in the group said, hey,

if you're a veteran, you now can be on the practice squad. Before, you couldn't be on the practice squad if you had more than two years of NFL experience. They got rid of that rule. So, that means if the

Patriots cut Brian Horvath, and he doesn't go through waivers folks because he's a veteran. The next day they could put him on the practice squad. I mean whenever the practice squad can be created with this

Ross Cutdowns, they never said when practice squads can be created. I don't know when that day is. But like so I was just, just point is that Brian Hoyer could be signed to the practice squad during the foot of season.

Even though he's a long-time veteran. Yeah, it's Mike. So he would go from making $50,000 a week on the 53-man roster to be making around $12,000, but that's up to his choice. Right. Okay.

So those are two things I wanted to say because I cracked me up about the Dante Hightower thing because I literally laughed. I was like, man, Miguel, you stop being a nerd and try to – I'm like, you've got to think of what they're asking. What's the bigger question that they're asking? I missed it. Right over my – I'm like, right over my head.

So, folks, I apologize for that. I mean, as many times I think I tweeted out what his number comes up, I was surprised someone would say that he was making it – when it showed up just to get off-season workout bonus. For example, and I'll say this, Patrick Chung has an off-season workout bonus. He retired. Julian Elliman had a $300,000 off-season workout bonus. He retired. All right?

If you're thinking that $100,000, $300,000 is going to affect a player's decision to retire, those Patrick Chung and Julian Ellman just proved you wrong. Right. Good point. Good point. You know, especially because the status of a guy like Dante Hightower has been such a hot-button issue throughout the fan base. And is he considering this? Is he not? Dante's wife came out and then made comments and there's just there's been so much kind of circulating

around through this i for one was so glad to see him on the field this week i was glad to hear him on his zoom conference reiterate his commitment to new england and you've laid out quite nicely how the workout bonuses are really not an incentive either way for dante to make a decision if he's going to make a decision to retire he's not going to show up to collect workout bonuses are really not an incentive either way for Dante to make a decision. If he's going to make a decision to retire, he's not going to show up to collect workout bonuses that he would probably be able to do without or collect in other ways through endorsements or anything like that. So it's not a situation where he was looking just to collect that. That's setting the record straight, buddy, and I appreciate it. I also found the information on Hoyer very interesting, especially a point that I'm glad that you made about him being a veteran and how the waiver wire process works. That's a question we get here a lot on Locked On Patriots.

I answer it often, and I think you answered it well, and I'm glad that you mentioned that because, again, there is still some confusion amongst the fan base. And I understand it, folks. Believe me, sometimes things can get complicated. There are all types of rules that apply to different types of players but with the veteran status that brian had he wouldn't be subject to be put on waivers he's immediately able uh to sign with another team or with the patriots practice squad if he chose to do so right like for folks i'll say this

a veteran is a player with four accrued seasons if they they get cut, they don't go through waivers. After the – I'll just say just this one big provision, all right? After the K-9-9, everyone goes through waivers. Why that rule is, I have no idea, okay? But now, a veteran like Brian Hoyer with four more accrued seasons goes through – does not go through waivers if they get cut. And that's going to be on us. For those who report the news, for us on transactions, you'll see, I wish the beat writers would use the word waived for players who can go through waivers instead of the word cut or released.

I think if they kept on doing that, people would then learn, hey, guy's a rookie, he got waived, therefore he's getting going through the waiver process. And then eventually gets cut, he's not going through waivers. People use them interchangeably, those terms interchangeably. I wish they did not. Absolutely. And it is and terminology can give you so much uh you know difficulty in the way that you phrase things the types of words that you use and ultimately the context that you use them in they can mean two different completely different things even if you're trying to get a certain point

across so again bud this is why we have you on you never ever disappoint when your wisdom and counsel graces the airwaves here on Locked On, I could not be more honored. I could not be more humbled. My friend, thank you so much for taking the time out on your vacation to join me here today to help me close out the week in style. Folks, please, I implore you, follow Miguel

at Patscap on Twitter. Again, I call him the Top Gun. He is the Top Gun. That plaque for the alternates, it doesn't exist because this man has no equal. A tremendous friend, a tremendous source of knowledge, and just one of the great Twitter followers and one of the great human beings on this earth. Before I let you go, my friend,

please let everyone know what you have coming down the pike in the coming days and weeks as we head toward the Patriots season and anything else you'd like to inform our listeners on here on Locked On Patriots? The floor is yours, my friend. Take us home. All right. I'm on Twitter at Pat's Cap. If you listen to me, I'm probably going to... If you listen to my last appearance on Blippi's podcast, you know I've been told I'm going to lose my regular job,

my full-time job, in next year. So I'll probably bring back pastcap.com while also trying to still raise money for the Habitat for Humanity. Folks, if you learn anything and you can afford to do so, just see my pinned – please see my pinned tweet and donate thank you so much mike it's always an honor to be on this show and i'm so happy that you're now part of the sports family i'm gonna enjoy the weekend and folks i'll just say this we didn't get to really talk about the draft picks don't worry about them they're not gonna hold out all right that's all i got

excellent news and positive news to head out the week and to be able to uh to go into uh to the weekend with that knowledge that our rookies should be in tow and they'll be in check and they will be here in 2021 in the meantime my friend stay safe stay well uh you know you always have friends here throughout the patriots fan base and uh you know we're pulling for you no matter what. You know that. And we look forward to the return of Patscap.com. So, as always, it's my honor.

It's my privilege. We look forward to talking ball with you again here and Foxborough Finance very soon. But in the meantime, please continue to stay safe, stay well. Always the best, my friend. Thanks for joining me today. Anytime, Mike. I hope to see you at Trading Camp. Absolutely. Definitely. And so Patriots fans,

we put a bow on the week that was here on the Locked On Patriots podcast. And I hope you enjoyed our three day mini camp coverage with our guest, Thomas Murphy, Steve Balistrieri, and our man, Dougie Football. And of course, absorbing the financial wisdom and counsel of our good friend the Pats cap today. But we are still just scratching the surface when it comes to off-season coverage leading into training camp for your New England Patriots.

So to be sure that you do not miss a single second of the action, download and subscribe to the Locked On Patriots podcast on platforms such as Spotify, the Odyssey app, Google Podcasts, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcasts. Just make sure that you are staying locked in to Locked On Patriots. Once again, my name is Mike DeBate.

I thank my good friend Miguel Benzon, the Pats cap himself, for his time, his insight, and his appearance on today's pod. But most of all, I thank you so much for listening and for continuing to make Locked On Patriots a daily part of your New England Patriots coverage. Until next time, Foxborough faithful, stay safe, stay well, be the change you wish to see in the world. Have a great weekend, everyone.