Locked On Patriots - Daily Podcast On The New England Patriots - Locked On Patriots - September 3, 2019: Doubting Thomas?

Episode Date: September 3, 2019

With wide receiver Demaryius Thomas back in the New England fold, Thomas Murphy joins host Mike D’Abate to offer his take on why the reunion between Thomas and the Patriots might not be a reason for celebration.  Also, the pair start to preview Sunday’s matchup with the Steelers.   Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

and hello to all you Foxborough faithful and welcome to your back to work back to school Tuesday edition of Lockdown Patriots your daily home for news notes analysis and the occasional opinion on your six-time Super Bowl champion the New England Patriots Lockdown Patriots as always is a part of the Lockdown Podcast Network I am your host Mike DeBate and I cover the Patriots for fullpresscoage.com, which is where you can always find my written work. You can also reach out to me on Twitter at MDABATEFBC, and be sure to follow Locked On Patriots on Twitter at LO underscore Patriots.

Once again today, I am joined by my main man, Thomas Murphy, who is quickly becoming a resident here at Locked On. And, you know, I like the man so much. I'd like him too much to charge him rent, but I'm always, always honored and happy to have him join me in the chair today and be able to talk some New England Patriots. The season is starting, and, you know, Murph is the preferred guest to welcome today without question

because he has some strong opinions on the Pats, on the Steelers, and one Demarius Thomas. So don't go anywhere, folks. This is going to be a good one. But before Murph joins me this morning, I want to let our listeners know that today's show and the opening week of the NFL here on Locked On is brought to you by Mack Weldon. Mack Weldon is a premium men's essentials brand that believes in smart design, premium fabrics, and simple shopping. Guys, what more could we ask for? Mack Weldon will be the most comfortable garments, whether it be underwear, socks, shirts, undershirts, hoodies, sweatpants,

and more that you will ever wear. In fact, they have a line of silver underwear and shirts that are naturally antimicrobial, which means they eliminate odor. And most importantly, Mack Weldon We'll be right back. use the promo code LOCKEDON, which will get you 20% off at macwellin.com. Visit the website today, and guys, it will be the best sartorial decision you have ever made. My guest today needs no introduction because you already know him well. He is a featured columnist for DieHardsBostonSportsFans.com. He is the co-host of the Sports Infusion and One Patriot's Place podcast, which, again, is truly one of the best casts in the region,

and Sports Infusion is some of the most fun you'll have listening to a podcast that you've ever had before. He is my main green man, the incomparable Thomas Murphy. Murph, as Luca Brasi would say, I am honored and grateful to welcome you into my home on the day of my daughter's wedding thank you my friend thank you

it's always good to be here good to roll off the couch and just you know come and pay the rent this way because you know we don't get paid anything anywhere well I assure you you make me look, and that's why I constantly have you back on here. I told you, the hashtag LockedOnMurph is going to be trending at some point, I'm sure, and with due cause.

You always bring it. You always give great opinions and great analysis, and besides being just a great friend of mine, I really, really value what you bring to the table. Thank you always for joining me, and it really, really means a lot to me and our listeners as well. Your podcasts are some of the most downloaded on the Locked On Patriots podcast network. So just saying, you know, you bring the listeners, my friend. Well, I'm Irish, and I have a huge family. Oh, I assure you.

It's an extended family beyond just the biological connections that you have or the marriage connections as well. There's a big family out there willing to listen to you. Murph, yesterday news broke about Demarius Thomas. Most of Patriot's Nation was elated that he would be returning, but you were the first person that I thought of, and I thought of you for reasons that might surprise some of our listeners, but should come as no surprise to anyone following you on Twitter. Spoiler alert, Murph was not a fan of this move, folks, and I'm

going to extend the floor to him to explain that in just a moment, but first, the Patriots, Murph, are set to open the season on Sunday. Unreal that they're going to unveil banner number six at Gillette Stadium in Foxborough, taking on the Pittsburgh Steelers, who also have six banners of their own, so that'll be a little bit of an interesting dynamic when the Patriots roll out number six, and suddenly the Pittsburgh Steelers are not the only

one sporting six banners in their arena, or I should say stadium, not really arena, but a lot of people started writing off the Steelers when Antonio Brown, Le'Veon Bell left, but I think this roster is actually well-equipped, and I think they might even be better off without Brown and Bell. What are your thoughts on the Steelers heading into Sunday night, and what can Patriots fans expect to see? Well, we didn't have much of Bell last year anyway, and there were, you know, I say we, you know, meaning the NFL fandom

and especially the folks down there in Pittsburgh who are looking forward to chomping on their Permanente Brothers sandwiches out there and start tailgating and whatnot. They've been through this. The loss of Antonio Brown I don't think has really hit them yet because the, how should I say it, the tidal wave that is Antonio Brown and his blondness, the loss of that, that storm missing them, has been refreshing. What they are not realizing is the storm that he brings to the receiving core,

to that team, and what he opens up for the rest of the Steelers in a manner that I'm not sure, you know, a lot of people are. I'm really not sure that they're going to have without him. Juju Smith-Schuster is a fine wide receiver. Connors is a fine running back. But they aren't the same talent level of the guys who have left. I still think they're the team to beat in that division. I am not buying into the lookout for the Browns thing because, quite frankly, folks, putting together a fantasy football team never works in the real world.

It just doesn't. But there are going to be some challenges this coming Sunday evening. I can't believe we're waiting until Sunday. I'm still trying to figure that out, why we're not playing the Thursday night game. But in the end, I think the Patriots have the defensive secondary that's going to be able to tackle this team and probably hold them under 20 points. You take Stephon Gilmore and you put him out there on Schuster. to tackle this team and probably hold them under 20 points. You take Stephon Gilmore and you put him out there on Schuster. You mix and match everywhere else.

You get some help over the top, even though right now you wouldn't think it. The Patriots' safety core has gotten a little thin over the past week or so, but I still think that they're going to come out on top. I think you're going to see a lot of different looks, some of those amoeba looks that we saw at the end of last season that seemed to work so well, and the way that this offense, this defense, I should say, has evolved. Bill has a lot of moving parts that he's going to put in. It's not easy to confuse a quarterback the likes of Ben Roethlisberger.

He's definitely headed for the Hall of Fame when his career is over. But Bill's going to have a plan up his sleeve, and I can't wait to see it. Yeah, I do agree with a lot of what you said, and I think it's interesting that you bring up the point about the defense and how they're going to be able to confuse Roethlisberger and I think that's a really key point here. The Patriots linebacking

core is definitely solidified and fortified from what we've seen last year. There's no question about it. They've added pieces. Jamie Collins starting to look like the Jamie Collins of old back there. Juwan Bentley coming back I think is big as well. This is a guy that the Patriots had a lot of confidence in last year. Let's not forget, he wore the green dot on his helmet during the preseason, even during some regular season games before getting hurt. So they know that he's going to be able to look at

the field and see things that maybe the average player that they would have carried if Bentley had been injured would not see. So that gives them a dynamic as well. And I love the way the secondary is shaping up. I really think that they are carrying definitely a great core of cornerbacks and a great core of safeties as well. Obi Mellon Fonwa was a guy I was a little bit surprised to see make the roster, but pleasantly, I think he can make some contributions on special teams, and he might be one of those guys that you might see play either on a tight end or someone with a little bit of size because he does bring a level of size

and athleticism that maybe they haven't had at that position in the past. So definitely interesting things to watch for, and I do agree with your assessment on that. We're going to get to Murph's take on Demarius Thomas in just a moment, and this is something I can't wait for, folks. But before we do that, I just wanted to remind you that our fellows at DraftKings remind us that it is time to celebrate. Football is finally back, and DraftKings is the leader in one-day fantasy football

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Murph, again, I teased at the top of the show that Demarius Thomas' return to the New England Patriots was pretty much a foregone conclusion after we heard reports on Saturday that he originally had been cut, and that really what they were doing was holding a placeholder for Nikhil Harry to be placed on IR with the designation to return, and it looks like that's been the plan all along. He's going to probably be ready to come off of that in week six, practice a couple of weeks, and we'll probably see him on the field for week nine at the latest with Harry, but Thomas coming back into the fold is interesting. We haven't seen a whole lot of Demarius Thomas, both this year and even last year. And with the Patriots' wide receiver core that does have some questions to it,

it's questionable now to say that the Patriots are definitely stacked at the wide receiver position when they're rolling out Julian Ellman, who is a lock. You know you're going to get production out of Julian. Hopefully the thumb is okay. I don't think there's anything wrong there, but you never truly know for sure until these games start. And then you have Josh Gordon, who is a dynamic talent, but you can't unfortunately count on him right now to give you anything more than what he's going to give you from game to game. And then you have a guy like Demarius Thomas, who hasn't played a whole lot lately. So in your opinion, first of all, what was your opinion on bringing Thomas back? And second of all, on this wide receiver crew as a whole,

which is really being highly touted as a very stacked position, when you actually take a look at it, some of the blooms come off the rose for me a little bit in the last 24 hours looking at these guys. So what's your take on this? And the floor is yours, my friend. Let them have it. My take is that, well, you know, let's just start out with Demarius Thomas.

I've never been a fan of Demarius Thomas. I always thought that he was somebody that shrank in the biggest moments. I understand people that, you know, yes, in 2013 he had, you know, three touchdowns in three games. You know, his catch percentage is, catch percentage is 70s and 80%. But things have fallen off, even from my earlier inclinations. He was slowing down before his injury hit last year. He hasn't caught a touchdown pass since 2014 in the playoffs. It's a little difficult to get on a man who has had the regular season success that he has.

It's also difficult to get on a man who, quite frankly, people keep bringing up he hasn't had any quarterbacks to play with Murph, wait until he's with Tom Brady. But we've heard that before. We really have. I don't know if he is been here and be able to do what is needed. Granted, he is the third receiver, and he's not going to be asked to be the first, but let's pump the brakes a little bit, people, after the performance that he put up against guys that are bagging groceries today during the preseason. It's just health wise. I'm worried that, you know, this is somebody that, that could easily blow out an Achilles week three.

And then where are we? It's this, this wide receiver core while on on paper, looks amazing, there's a question mark behind every single player that's on the depth chart right now. And I don't know how anybody could argue that with me. No, and I agree with you. And it's something that you look at these assessments, and they're done by guys that definitely do their homework i mean you and i know several of them uh that are great great reporters and they do great work and there are criticisms definitely i mean i'm not saying

everything is all you know sunshine and rainbows that they're writing and that's certainly not the case and definitely not an accurate depiction of what they're saying. But you listen to a lot of what you hear. The fans are definitely excited. You look at the names. I mean, I even said that when I was on my show yesterday, that they have the potential to roll out Julian Edelman, Josh Gordon, and Demarius Thomas in week one against the Pittsburgh Steelers. And that, on paper, sounds amazing.

I mean, you say you have those three wide receivers. All of a sudden, you look like you're doing a pretty good job, but there are question marks surrounding everybody here. And I think fans need to set the expectation that they need to be realistic in terms of what they're going to see with this wide receiver core. Now, there's a chance that Tom Brady could come out and make these guys look like pro bowlers, every single one of them. And they have a high-powered, high-flying offense, and all of a sudden everything looks right with the world.

But it could change from week to week. You made very good points about Thomas, about his durability, about what he's going to be able to bring to the table. And just coming back and getting to know a new quarterback. Like you said, we have not seen much of Demarius Thomas, and we haven't seen any of Demarius Thomas catching passes from Tom Brady in a meaningful game. So that's going to be a question mark. Gordon, we've seen a limited sample. Tom was on WEI this morning with Greg Hill and mentioned that as well, that he has limited experience with Gordon, and that's something that he and Josh will be working on a lot. Obviously, there's a good synergy with Julian Edelman.

There's no question about it. That's about as good of a battery as he's going to find. Philip Dorsett, I think, could emerge, especially across these next three weeks, as being someone that Brady could very heavily rely on while he's getting to know some of these new receivers. Speaking of the new receivers, Jacoby Myers, Gunnar Roschelski round out this wide receiver core, and a lot of people did not have either one of these guys cracking the roster before training camp opened, and I was one of them.

I had Gunnar's chances of making this team very low, and Jacoby's actually, I had him being cut in favor of Braxton Berrios, who I know you're a fan of as well. What were your thoughts on adding these two guys to the mix, and what can they bring to the table, maybe more so than anybody else that they had on the roster that they did jettison on Saturday? Well, with Gunner, it's more or less the fact that I believe he's here

to fulfill a role that the Patriots have been looking to fill for a very long time, and that is to keep Julian Edelman from having to return punts. I think he's shown that he can catch the ball. We'll see. We're not sure if this is the next thing in the line from Welker to Edelman to Amendola. And we'll see how things progress throughout the season. I actually thought that Berrios was the better decision than Gunnar. But what the hell do I know?

I've just been watching football all my life. I don't, you know, I am not a coach. I don't see these guys at every practice or in the meeting rooms. So we'll see. Most of the time he's just going to be standing back there and probably raising his hand over his head to catch something, and hopefully he doesn't boot it. Thomas, we've talked about just so many questions,

and like I said, I've seen him shrink in too many big games. Somebody brought up to me yesterday that, well, maybe Murph it's because he's been playing the Patriots in those big games, and that's why you have a tainted view of it. But, no, as the competition gets better, when he gets bodied up, things don't go as well as you would hope from somebody that, like I said, at the time was boasting that he was one of the best in the business.

And he was putting up those kind of numbers for a few years, but it's not 2013 anymore, folks. It really isn't. And that really goes to how I feel about most of this core. Josh Gordon, it's not 2013 anymore. Right now, he is not in football shape whatsoever. I think he's

worked his way in the gym out of wide receiver body type. He's more, I've said it time and again, he's more of a tight end body type. Maybe he's the guy that's going to be running those seam routes that have sent so many players to the tent.

And eventually it drove Rob Gronkowski out of the game, I think, because the beatings that you take running those tight end routes for the Patriots. Questions, questions, questions. I did not expect Jacoby Myers to make this team. I know everybody was really high on him early when, you know, he was going up against, you know, quite frankly, guys that aren't on a lot of rosters. He had worked a lot with Jared Stidham, and they have had a good chemistry,

but we did not see that in the limited time that he was out there with Tom Brady. The passes were coming a bit too quick. Maybe they were a bit too far behind him on the back shoulder throws, but Tom depends on people to make those throws. He's throwing balls where nobody else can get them. Often, Brady will take criticism for throwing something at somebody's feet or behind them, but when you go back and you look at the tape,

Tom's putting the ball exactly where he needs to put it to make sure nobody is picking the ball off. And he expects his wide receivers to fight for each and every one, which is also something that, I'm sorry, I keep going back to Thomas, it's something that he doesn't do. No, I think it's a fair point, and don't apologize at all. We bring you on here to bring your opinion, and I think

that's a very, very interesting point. Some of the wide receivers that have had a great amount of talent, you can go as far back as guys like Joey Galloway, Red Wayne, guys that have come in that have had a lot of talent, Ocho Cinco is one of them, but they just couldn't find the synergy with Tom Brady simply for that reason.

It wasn't a situation where they were able to recognize that Brady is putting it in an area where the defensive back is not going to be able to pick that off. It's not always necessarily where the receiver likes to have the ball. It's where he feels is the best chance for them to get a catch and maybe even some yards after the catch and protect the football. So I think that's an excellent point. Never apologize for that.

Also something that's missing here. Yep, definitely. Philip Dorsett, while he is a fine reception receiver, while he is somebody that you want to send a yard past the sticks and you know is going to grab a ball or wherever you and you know he's going to grab a ball or wherever you put him, he's going to grab. But you'd better be happy with that catch where it is because nobody goes down quicker than Philip Dorsett.

He does not like to be hit. It's just not in his DNA, which is really difficult to play in New England with. He's made another roster because he is somebody that Tom trusts. I'm wondering how much he's going to go to him because we go back to last year. While Tom was putting up his best numbers, while Gordon was on the field. The pace of the offense seemed forced. He was looking for Josh a bit too much. And while yards per catch and maybe points on the board might have been a

little bit greater while he was on the field and on the roster. I think just like it was in the backfield a few years ago, it became more diverse when he wasn't there. And when Blunt was in the backfield, you kind of knew that, yeah, we're running it, and when White's in the backfield, okay, we're passing it. And it kind of felt that way when Gordon was on the field. When Gordon was on the field, Tom was getting him the ball because he was trying to get him on the same page, and they were trying to build something.

It's really difficult to do that during a season. Yeah, and it really is. And I think that it's something that these guys are going to have to work out with Brady. And eventually it will work itself out. I mean, if you see some of these guys struggle to develop that synergy with Brady, you can see that. He will go to his security blankets and not necessarily go to the guys that are going to be the big names on the team. And I think that includes Gordon.

I think that includes Thomas. It could even include Dorsett. I think the one guy he's pretty confident in is Julian. I think that he knows what he's going to get from him, and I think we've seen enough of that battery relationship over the years to know that that will be a security, but he doesn't

have Gronkowski this year, and the fact that these guys need to have that learning curve could be interesting down the line as well. Murph, I'm going to wrap up with you. I'm sorry okay no no the other thing is you know is Edelman you guys got to realize Julian Edelman is getting older he is going to be more banged up can he still you know take that kind of a beating and and be used in the way? Are we going to see him more on the outside than we have in the past? There's a question at every spot in this wide receiver core that gives me pause where other people are dancing in the streets over it.

Name recognition does not mean winning football, folks. Absolutely, and without question. And I think you did make a very good point on Edelman and his age and what we can expect from him in knowing that Brady, probably perhaps more now than in previous years, is going to have to rely on some of the new younger talent that he has on that wide receiving court, and even with the tight end position as well, and even in the running back position.

Murph, I'm going to wrap up with you in just a moment, but I just wanted to take a moment to remind our listeners that it is a new season Antonio Brown is on the Raiders and again folks we do our due diligence we checked he's still on the Raiders Le'Veon Bell is with the Jets and Odell Beckham is in Cleveland but the one thing that has not changed where I'm putting my money down on all of the games. MyBookie is the place to bet on football every weekend. MyBookie has better bonuses and more prop bets than any other sportsbook, period. This year, they're hosting the first online handicapping super contest. First place is guaranteed to win at least $100,000, and it only costs $100 to enter. All you have to do is pick five NFL games against the spread every week

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Visit MyBookie online today. That's M-Y-B-O-O-K-I-E. And don't forget to use the promo code LOCKEDON when creating your account to claim the bonus. Bet, win, get paid with MyBookie. Murph, the half hour always flies by when I have you in, buddy, and I really appreciate you coming on and lending some of your wisdom and counsel and your opinions on Demarius Thomas and I think our listeners will find it very interesting to hear a new perspective on that and some items that you've brought up that were really, really interesting.

Last question, my friend. I'm going to put you on the hot seat. Do you believe that there was any chance that Bill saw my Twitter feed and carried Gunnar Olszewski based on the fact that I just love that damn Spaceballs meme too much? I believe that that was the deciding factor. I thought so. He's a big social media guy, Bill. We now know who made that man a gunner.

He's a big social media guy, Bill. He loves to snap face and all that. He is. Snap face and... Yep, that's it. You had everything to do with this. Absolutely, yep. I pushed for it, guys.

No, in all seriousness, one final serious question before I do let you go. with this. You were amazing. In all seriousness, one final serious question before I do let you go. I don't want to put you on the spot yet. I think it's still a little too early for final score predictions, but in your opinion, do you see the Patriots being able to come out on top on Sunday night against the Steelers? And if so, will it be the offense or the defense that's responsible for the win? I believe if so, will it be the offense or the defense that's responsible for the win? I believe the Pats will come out on top on Sunday night. I think they're going to ride a wave that Patriots Nation will have started when they unveil that banner.

I think we will see a heavy dose of Sonny Michelle, James White, and even look for my man James Devlin to get into the end zone this weekend. It's going to be a very run-heavy game, and the Patriots' offense is going to carry this team to a victory. We're going to play a lot of ball control this year, folks, in a different way than we have in the past because this is a very different team but I see the Patriots coming out on top of this game

24-17. Excellent, no we did get the score in there and I like it. We will definitely keep that on the horizon. No, just kidding. We're not going to throw it in your face Murph if it doesn't come true No, go right ahead. I like it we're not going to throw it in your face, Murph, if it doesn't come true. No, go right ahead. When it comes to final numbers, I am definitely not a guy that you want to quote by any stretch of the imagination. But we always, always love your wisdom and counsel, Murph,

and we thank you again for coming on today. I appreciate it more than words could possibly say. Before I let you go today, I just want to give you a moment to let our listeners, as always, know where they can find your great work and follow you on social media. Oh, folks, you can read me over at diehardbostonfans.com. You can listen to me every week on One Patriot's Place and on the Sports Infusion. And of course, you can follow me on Twitter at TeamERF207. That's usually the easiest way to find out wherever I'm going to be.

And this week I'm in a lot of places, so please check it out. He always is. We use the hashtags FullPressMerf and hashtag LockedOnMerf, and there's a big reason for it because the reads, the listens, and just everything, especially the social media following, all highly recommended. I can't recommend checking out Murph's work in any platform high enough. And as always, I thank him so much for joining me today on Locked On Patriots. As for me, I will be back tomorrow as I start,

and I should say continue to take a look ahead to game one of the regular season as the Patriots take on the Pittsburgh Steelers at Gillette Stadium on Sunday night. Tomorrow I'll be joining the crew from Locked On Steelers. Looking forward to that very much as we have our crossover show for the week. Pat Steelers hooking it up, and the two shows will be able to hook it up as well. As always, make sure to join us each and every day on the Locked On Patriots podcast and subscribe to Locked On Patriots via your favorite podcast provider. Once again, I'm Mike DeBate.

I thank Mack Weldon for their sponsorship today, and most importantly, I thank you so much for listening. Have a great day, everybody.