Locked On Patriots - Daily Podcast On The New England Patriots - New England Patriots, Arizona Cardinals Crossover: Drake Maye, Kyler Murray, Pats Offensive Line

Starting point is 00:00:00 We've got an interesting matchup in week 15 with an upstart New England Patriots team and an Arizona Cardinals team that is reeling, to say the least. Who comes out on top? We'll talk about it. Crossover Thursday. Let's discuss. You are locked on NFL Crossover, part of the Locked On Podcast Network. Your team every day.

Starting point is 00:00:30 Crossover Thursday. For those that haven't appreciated football up to this point, shame on you. It is fleeting in front of our very eyes. Alex Clancy, Locked On Cardinals. Mike DeBate, my buddy, Locked On Patriots. Thank you for making Crossover Thursday your first listen, free wherever you get your podcasts and on YouTube, part of the Locked On Patriots. Thank you for making Crossover Thursday your first listen, free wherever you get your podcasts and on YouTube, part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day.

Starting point is 00:00:51 Today's episode of Crossover Thursday is brought to you by Price Picks. Download the app. Use code LOCKEDONNFL to win $50 instantly when you play $5. Two very different teams, very different seasons, but in kind of the same beginning of their massive rebuild, hopefully back into prosperity. And I'm really excited to see this matchup with a young quarterback. Drake May was taken atop the draft. Good defensive pieces, question mark at head coach,

Starting point is 00:01:20 question marks around the roster. I think there's a lot of things, a lot of similarities between these two teams, Mike debate, flocked on Patriots. And we're going to discuss all of it. Patriots, biggest storyline up until this point. Cardinals, biggest storyline in the second segment and our pass to victory for both of us. Mike, it's good to talk to you, dude.

Starting point is 00:01:38 It's been a while. It is. It's been a while, but you know what? Always worthwhile, my friend. It's always great to share the microphone with you. The Cards and the Pats don't get a chance to cross the streams all that much, but when they do, I always look forward to these crossovers, and I'm in full agreement with you on this.

Starting point is 00:01:53 I really think this is going to be a fun game to watch. Two teams that are trying to find their identities right now. I think the Cardinals are a little further along in that pursuit than the Patriots are, but there are seedlings for Patriots fans to be able to jump onto on this one. So I think it's going to be a fun one in the Arizona desert this weekend. And if I'm not mistaken, the last time these two linked up was the Isaiah Simmons hitting Cam Newton into Superman pose out of bounds, 15 yard penalty, Nick Folk game winning kick. I believe that's what it was when it was an egregious and absolutely egregious personal foul call that sent the 6'5 250 pound cam newton flying um isaiah simmons had

Starting point is 00:02:32 a proclivity to do that that's part of the reason why he's no longer an arizona cardinal so talk to me about what everybody wants to know right away talk to me about the kid talk to me about what he's been like so far yeah you know drake has been a bright spot in what has been a dismal season here in New England. Not a whole lot to be excited about when you're 3-10. The defense has struggled, I think, a little more than Patriots fans would have liked. The head coach is brand new, brand new coaching staff. There's a lot right now to lament, but one thing that has been a bright spot all season long has been Drake May. Look, one of the great things about this kid is he's taken what is, I think, the team's

Starting point is 00:03:08 most glaring weakness in the offensive line. And he's helped to mitigate that a little bit. He's not solving the problem. But his athleticism, his ability to go off script, his ability to be able to navigate through and use play action, even when the running game isn't necessarily facilitating that, has been a great surprise for New England Patriots fans. We knew about Drake's athleticism coming in. We knew about his big arm. So those things aren't really a surprise, but his resilience when he makes a blunder or two, and he has made a couple of them this season. He is a rookie and he has had moments

Starting point is 00:03:42 where he's looked like a rookie, but his ability to put that behind him, Alex, and move forward and get back into the huddle, get back under center or take the snap wherever he's getting the ball as the quarterback and being able to lead his team has been a breath of fresh air. It's been a long time since New England Patriots fans have felt confident on nearly every snap when Drake May gets it. This kid has been everything is advertised and more, and he's still growing as a player, which is something that I know Patriots fans are excited about because the best is yet to come.

Starting point is 00:04:13 And that's something that I think Pat's fans are really, really looking forward to when it comes to Drake May next year and even beyond. Yeah. And the interesting part, like really quick before we pivot, I do have a line that I will give you if you'd like to use it you don't need to quote me or anything um the best offensive lineman the new england patriots has is drake may's legs you can take because i

Starting point is 00:04:36 used that with kyler murray for the first three years of his career here um talking about jacoby brissett what that's done for drake may because Jacoby Brissett is – he's the next iteration of Andy Dalton and the next iteration of these guys who aren't just guys who fill in when other quarterbacks are injured. But I think Andy Dalton should get hired just as that. Jacoby Brissett, by all accounts, ever since being drafted by the Patriots, has been a consummate pro. He's been a dude that steps in during tough spots, and he may not be the best quarterback, but he's going to keep you in games. You saw that with Cleveland when Deshaun Watson went out. Talk to me about him for the growth of Drake May throughout this year. I think you hit the nail right on the head, Alex. Consummate professional. Jacoby Brissett, as I like to say, to quote an Arizona Cardinals legend in Rod Didwell

Starting point is 00:05:25 he's been to the puppet show he's seen the strings there is nothing that's going to happen on a football field that Jacoby Brissett has not seen or done before so that type of experience especially with someone like Drake May who's coming in learning a new way to play quarterback um it is a different game in college from the pros and I think Drake has seen that but knowing that he has someone that is very comfortable with the role that he's playing meaning a mentor role in Jacoby Brissett and also being able to watch him throughout the first few games of the season and learn the nuances of playing a pro level game I think that has meant the world to him and look Jacoby can still make plays I I mean, everyone in Patriots

Starting point is 00:06:05 Nation is extremely excited about what Drake May brings to the table. Yes, they've looked much better in the position than Jacoby, but Jacoby is still capable of going out there and giving you quality minutes, quality reps, and making things happen. So that type of a player is invaluable. I think he's been one of the best offseason signings for the New England Patriots, not just from what he brings on the field, but most importantly, what he brings in terms of charisma in that locker room, leadership ability, and also that mentorship to Drake May, which is so needed when you have a young quarterback that needs to learn more nuances of the game. Yeah, and that's really well put. As we have a couple minutes left here before you pivot to the cardinals i mike and i were talking before we recorded like we could do four hours it's so people think it's so it's so hard it's so hard to do 27 minutes like it's so difficult

Starting point is 00:06:55 because we want to talk forever because we never get to talk to each other so um let's broad stroke this okay so the names that people know the names that i can mention um just to give the cardinals a little bit of a baseline here remandre stevenson up and down yards per carry hasn't been great but when he's good he's very good um christian gonzalez on the other side and everybody two years ago during the draft that i trust in the draft world said that was the steal of the draft that was the steal of the draft and That was the steal of the draft. And he's shown after missing a large portion of last year with an injury, that the dude's an absolute baller.

Starting point is 00:07:30 Talk to me about a couple names, maybe Jalen Polk. Give me some names about what's rounding out this roster on both sides of the ball. Well, a name that I think Cardinals fans will be familiar with, but maybe doesn't get the love nationally that he should for being the player he is on this team, is tight end Hunter Henry when it comes to this offense. Hunter is always a guy that runs the routes correctly. He's open. He's a weapon in the red zone, and he's someone that can get open and make things happen in the open field. He's also upped his game as a blocker. So if you're hearing the name Hunter Henry an awful lot on Sunday, you know that Drake May is utilizing arguably his most well-faceted

Starting point is 00:08:06 weapon. And I think that's a name that Cardinals fans should be looking at. Another name on offense that I would keep an eye on is Antonio Gibson. Antonio is starting to prove to him, to a lot of people in this Patriots brass, that he's more than capable of being a solid number two to Ramondre Stevenson, a third down weapon, a backfield receiver that can catch the ball out of the backfield as a running back. Those guys are clear weapons. On the defensive side of the ball, Christian Barmore being back is huge for this team. What it allows is it has a big body up front that can take on the double team and allow a linebacker like Anthony Jennings or allow a defensive end like Keon White, who is very adept at being able to get after the quarterback to try to put pressure on opposing quarterbacks.

Starting point is 00:08:50 His presence is huge. And in the defensive backfield, he's had his offseason issues. But Jabril Peppers is so important to that secondary, the way he's able to play up toward the line of scrimmage and be a solid contributor in run defense as well as pass defense is something huge. Those are the names that I would watch if I were an Arizona Cardinals fan on Sunday. Mike DeBate, Locked on Patriots. Alex Clancy, Locked on Cardinals. Crossover Thursday. Cardinals under a microscope next. We will be right back.

Starting point is 00:09:22 This episode of Crossover Thursday is brought to you by our friends at fanduel so as we get closer to the end of the season i told you to appreciate football i've been saying it all year if you haven't that's on you but one thing you definitely should be appreciating regardless of what week it is is fanduel america's number one sportsbook because right now new customers can bet five dollars and get $150 in bonus bets if you win. The FanDuel Sportsbook app gives you everything you need to place live bets on the NFL all in one place. So when you get a hunch in the middle of the game, you can check out the latest stats, view live play-by-play, and so much more on the same page where you place your bets. You don't

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Starting point is 00:11:24 What time is it? GameTime. Just fascinating matchup, Mike DeBate of Locked on Patriots. One that, again, as you mentioned, doesn't happen very often. And the time the Patriots are winning is at State Farm Stadium, but it's during the Super Bowl, or was. And that happened at least once. And when we see this matchup coming up, two teams with different trajectories,

Starting point is 00:11:52 like they're closer towards the beginning than at the end, like the perennial team Super Bowl contenders every year. But you're right, the Cardinals are a little bit ahead naturally as they've already got their quarterback for the future. Most think fans would deem otherwise over the last couple of weeks. But for Patriots fans, what would you like to know? I am an encyclopedia for you. Well, I think the question on all Pats fans' minds, Alex, when it comes to this matchup and the few quick things that stood out to me when it comes to the Arizona Cardinals is this team has played some tightly contested games.

Starting point is 00:12:24 I mean, three out of four of their contests were decided by a single point at this point. Also being a little on the streaky side, and that's something that Patriots defense and offense has really struggled to contain. When a team starts getting on and they're clicking on all cylinders, it can be a problem for New England. So if they run into a hot Arizona Cardinals team, it could be a long day in Arizona for the Patriots. However, I should say that since their Week 11 bye,

Starting point is 00:12:52 hasn't all been sunshine and rainbows. They've lost their three games coming out of the bye, as opposed to being winners of four straight prior to that. And a lot of it, I think, is a microcosm of the season that Kyler Murray has had. You've seen flashes of this kid being the number one overall pick a solid quarterback not even solid but I think maybe one of the elites in the conference and then you've seen times where he has struggled like the opening moments of last week's game where he throws two interceptions to open the game

Starting point is 00:13:20 what has been the biggest problem with having consistency when it comes to the Arizona Cardinals this year? I don't know. Hashtag analysis. I have no idea what the hell's going on a lot of times, Mike. It's coming out of the bye. Okay, let me preface it by this. When the Cardinals were on their win streak, when they won five out of six, they were scoring touchdowns, not field goals. That was it. It was very simple. They were the only team, I think they were 16 for their first 16 and goal to go, scoring touchdowns and not field goals. If you score touchdowns when you're down there and you're not kicking field goals, you're winning football games. It's pretty simple. So that was happening. And now what's weird is, especially on offense, everything else has pretty much stayed the same,

Starting point is 00:14:04 save those two picks. So last week, they marched down, they scored a touchdown, a 41-yard touchdown catch by Michael Wilson. You're like, oh, OK, keeping the momentum going, keeping the momentum going. Seattle kicks a field goal on the next drive, and then it's pick, touchdown, pick, three plays, touchdown. It's like, well, it's 17-7 with five minutes left in the first quarter, and nobody knew what the hell just happened over the last couple of minutes.

Starting point is 00:14:30 Now, throughout the rest of the game, everything looked fine between the 20s, and that's the issue. It's like, why does this – the microcosm of the season was last week in the sense that either the Cardinals look like maybe the best offensive football or one of them, and then it's like, well, they just sleepwalk through the remaining 35% of the offensive series. It just makes no sense. And yes, Kyler Murray lost the game for the team last week. I said that on Friday's show last week, I know wins is not a quarterback stat specifically. It was this past Sunday. Your franchise quarterback wins that game for you when you

Starting point is 00:15:02 have the ability to take over the NFC West crown again. You know, the lead in the NFC West. And it wasn't good enough. It wasn't good enough. And I think he'd be the first one to say that. We will be having different conversations about Kyler Murray at the end of the season if it probably starts if they lose on Sunday against New England. Yeah, very good point. And again, I think Patriots fans can relate to that last couple of years waiting for Mac Jones to emerge and trying to show that worthiness of that number one overall or the first round, I should say grade that the Patriots had on him simply didn't come there. And now I think you find Drake May here in New England for that reason, simply because it just wasn't a fit any longer. I'm not saying that's going to be the case with Kyler, but yeah, I think there will be additional heat

Starting point is 00:15:47 that's felt all around for Arizona if in fact they do drop this game to the Patriots. And I think this is going to be a very tough matchup for the Pats in all three phases. Call it the old Belichickian disciple in me, but I love great secondary play, especially when it comes to the safety position and the Cardinals have one of the best

Starting point is 00:16:04 in the game in Buda Baker. I love versatile guys. And this kid can play deep. He can play in the box. His ball protection is not what it used to be earlier in his career. But every single time you need a big play, this kid is always there. The Patriots have struggled when it comes to savvy veterans in the defensive backfield that can direct traffic and confuse a young quarterback. Do you think that could be a key for the Cardinals defense to be able to try to contain Drake May and what he does well this weekend? Yeah. And you're finally starting to see, and when I say finally, I think this is year seven for Buda Baker. You're finally starting to see him just be able to play free safety. Right. There's there's been so for the entirety of his career the secondary has been awful it's been bad it's been Patrick Peterson by himself

Starting point is 00:16:52 and then Steve Kime has the inability to draft Steve Kime wasn't able to bring anybody in via free agency like it was a lost position and a lot of times it was because buda baker would cover up three or four holes on the defense now you're being able to see him just play his role and look at what happens oh don't pay him he's old this is the best year of his career and it's only going to be this barring any sort of injury because of how monti osford is drafted with the other younger uh defensive backs and one and i'll do this test with you because everybody said the same thing when I mentioned somebody besides Garrett Williams and at a Syracuse and your neck of the woods ish in New England and Max Melton at Rutgers, you know, they're playing very, very well. Complimentary football, CB1, CB2, but Daydream Teller Demerson rookie out of, out of, out

Starting point is 00:17:42 of Texas Tech is really looking to emerge as being a Buda Baker light from the strong safety position. And that secondary is almost set and forget starting next season. I'm sure they'll add a piece. The pass rush has really been the issue, but Buda Baker has been able to account for some help with pressuring the quarterback. And yes, they're going to make Drake May's life tough on Sunday. Absolutely. And I know New England Patriots fans are hoping that Drake can get things going. But before we take our leave of the Cardinals' biggest stories and we move into Pats to Victory, I always like to check in on old friends. And the Cardinals have a couple. I know we got

Starting point is 00:18:19 Monty Austin for it in the front office. And believe me, he has an eye for old Patriots too. But Mack Wilson Sr., a guy that I had a chance to get to know very well last year, he's settling into a hybrid role, a little bit off the ball in Arizona, been playing pretty well. And Chad Ryland is actually kicking very well for the Arizona Cardinals. How much of an impact do you think they've made on the Cardinals this year and this pair of expats? Track, track. Chad Ry Ryland let me start first he has three game-winning kicks so um unfortunately the pumpkin is starting to become like he's he's missed kicks last couple weeks and we saw that

Starting point is 00:18:59 last year kicking in the NFL is tough it is and it's difficult to find a home and to – like, for some reason, people just – kickers just kick better in certain arenas. Certain things are just – you know, you have this career renaissance and it can stick, or you can have a career renaissance the other way. And it's 50-50 for him. Matt Prater may play again this year. I think it depends on if the Cardinals win on Sunday and what the trajectory for the season is going to be.

Starting point is 00:19:22 Mack Wilson has been an absolute vision. And I watched some tape on him right when the Cardinals signed him. I didn't know much about him. Right when the Cardinals signed him, I watched a bunch of film on him on YouTube, and I'm like, oh, why was he a free agent? And I think a lot of it was because the offense was so bad. The defense was on the field so much. It's one of those things where it's like you can get lost in the fray

Starting point is 00:19:44 by not having a home on defense. And what Monte Austin Ford has done in successive off seasons, signed Kazir White and signed Mack Wilson. And those guys are working in perfect harmony as the heartbeat of the middle of the defense from the linebacker position. Mack Wilson has been used as a pass rusher. Mack Wilson has been used in coverage. Mack Wilson has been used everywhere. And he has risen to everything and more than Cardinals, that the Cardinals organizations needed him to do. And it's something that if he plays like this next year,

Starting point is 00:20:15 he's going to get a contract extension. He's going to be an Arizona Cardinal for a long time. And it's because your white's going to get his contract extension this offseason. And these guys play well, so well together that I don't even know if you, when you watch him on Sunday, will be like, oh. This – I think the scheme just fits better because Nick Rallis and Jonathan Gannon, they're mad scientists. The packages they put on the field – he said in his introductory press conference,

Starting point is 00:20:43 we don't really have a base. We just kind of get our good players and put them on the field together. And that's what they've been doing, especially with a team that's been devoid of pass rush. Like using Mack Wilson and Buda Baker at the same time running after a quarterback, it doesn't make a lot of sense, but it's been working, and that's what they've been able to do. And he's been such a massively integral part of it.

Starting point is 00:21:02 Let's do this because we're going to do this forever. We need to get the pass to victory next. Mike DeBate locked on Patriots. Alex Lancy locked on Cardinals. We'll wrap things up with our pass to victory ahead of Sunday's matchup next. This episode of Crossover Thursday is brought to you by our friends over at Built Rewards. If you're a renter, listen up. This is a total game changer.

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Starting point is 00:22:14 NFL on Twitter at Clancy's Corner for me. Paths to victory for the Patriots. Go. Run the football. I think a lot of Patriots fans will tell you. Drake May needs to air it out. We need to see that big arm. He needs to put the defense on his heels. Alex Van Pelt runs a system where outside zone is predicated on getting the running back going first to facilitate

Starting point is 00:22:35 play action, allow Drake to take deep shots down the field, but also give him the maneuverability to be able to take the shots that he needs to in the intermediate areas of the field. That means Ramondre Stevenson, Antonio Gibson need to get going and they need to get going early find the holes whatever they may be on that offensive line who are getting Cole Strange back this week and I think having Cole in the lineup is going to help them in terms of offensive run blocking because Cole is very good at being able to block for outside zone. So that's part one of being able to get to victory. The second path to victory is utilize the field, be able to see what this team is doing when it comes to Arizona defending you. If they're showing you man to man, make sure they're accounting for Drake May. If they're not, he's going to run

Starting point is 00:23:21 for big yardage. A couple of weeks ago ago he ripped off a 41 yard run looked pretty good doing it um and also when they tried to play him in zone he started to attack the intermediate areas of the field a little bit more so be aware of everything on the field and that essentially goes for the defensive side of the ball to keep kyler murray in your sights at all times know when they're when arizona's offense is trying to put you in motion. These are so important for the Patriots to be able to gain victory. And the last path to victory sounds so rudimentary, Alex, but it is so key. The Patriots have to not turn the ball over. They have to stop committing egregious penalties that are putting them in a bad position.

Starting point is 00:24:00 The Patriots this year have committed 88 penalties for 718 yards you cannot sustain victory that way Patriots have to be more disciplined and they also have to be a little bit smarter when it comes to taking care of the football they do that they get a puncher's chance in this one they fail at any one of the three I think you're looking at a certain Cardinals victory yeah you know it's interesting with the Cardinals in their past of victory because this is the season every every game for the rest of to victory because this is the season. Every game for the rest of the year is this is the season. Last week was a massive disappointment.

Starting point is 00:24:32 I don't say that lightly. You know, I'm not a – I don't speak in platitudes when it comes to this team. I'm very existential in the moment. Like every week has been some sort of barometer or litmus test for the rest of the year. And for this one, it's you got to lay a pound into this young team that's not ready yet. Like this is one where it's like you need to show everybody that the last three weeks are not the rule. They're the exception to the rule. I know it's difficult when that's a quarter of the season or close to it. The actual pass to victory, one,

Starting point is 00:25:06 Kyler Murray needs to get out of his shell and really be special. And they don't need him to be special to win. He needs to show people that he's special and for himself as well. You know, it's something like this needs to be about him. This needs to be three or four all-purpose touchdowns. This needs to be one of those special-purpose touchdowns. This needs to be

Starting point is 00:25:25 one of those special Kyler Murray games where it's like, okay, not all hope is lost. Chill the hell out. The Cardinals still have a shot. Now with that, running the ball is also, James Connors, the guy. James Connors has been the guy. James Connors will continue to be the guy with the contract extension that he got. He played very well last week. He had over 100 all-purpose yards and a touchdown. And the Cardinals just need to set the tone early for a young team that's a year away from playing like week in and week out really competitive football. Now, that's not taking away what they've done so far. Drake Mays has been great. I've really enjoyed watching him play. It's just a different thing where the Cardinals very rarely can look at another team and be like,

Starting point is 00:26:02 okay, this is a game that you got to win, and this is one that the Cardinals need to win. Now, defensively, this is the most important part because I think the offense will be fine. Defensively, the pass rush has been devoid pretty much the entire season. This is going to be a tough game for Drake May because this secondary is legit. So all the Cardinals will need to do in an effort to be opportunistic and turn the ball over, which they haven't been great at the last handful of weeks, is just a little pressure. Just a couple smacks in the face, just a little rattling of the cage, and rookies throw bad interceptions. That's what rookies do. It's their first time playing in the NFL.

Starting point is 00:26:38 It's the avatar that is a rookie quarterback. It is not a direct corridor to two Drake Mays, a human being. And those are the things that the Cardinals need to do in an effort to regain some sort of confidence that's been completely lost over the last 12 quarters of football in an effort to position themselves for the rest of the season and potentially backdoor into the NFC West title or the seven seed. This isn't overlooking this. This is the most important game for the Cardinals for the rest of the year. So this isn't one that's going to be overlooked. This is one that, you know what, it's kind of a blitz all night, remember the Titans kind of situation where it's like,

Starting point is 00:27:13 if they don't win this game in somewhat convincing fashion, we're going to be having very, very different conversations before Carolina two weeks from now. So it's a very serious thing. And that's not poopooing what new England is because you know, it's just, it's not, it's just, this is, I very rarely get to say this during this conversation where it's like, I don't think the latest SmackDown for so many different reasons.

Starting point is 00:27:41 And it's, it's something that if they don't do we're going to be having different conversations. I mean, is that unfair from your end do, we're going to be having different conversations. I mean, is that unfair from your end to say that from where the Cardinals are, where the Patriots are currently? No, I don't believe it's unfair at all. Look, Bill Parcells once said, you are what your record says you are.

Starting point is 00:27:55 The Patriots are a 3-10 football team. They're coming off of a bye week. New England right now is facing a little bit of an identity crisis of their own. They need to come out and play strong. They need to come out and play hard, play through every play, make sure they're completing plays. If they're not doing that, that's a sign that this team may be checked out. And then you need to start worrying about evaluating the coaching staff and maybe the positional coaches and the coordinators. Are they doing their job to motivate this team? So the Patriots have uncertainty surrounding them. The Cardinals are in a prime position to be able to pounce.

Starting point is 00:28:27 And you're right. This is a game on paper that they should win. And I don't think Patriots fans would take exception to that. If the Pats do win this, it's an upset in every sense of the word. So no, I think right now from where the Cardinals are in terms of contending for a playoff spot, they're right there. Patriots are what they say they are right now and what the record says there is. So it just is

Starting point is 00:28:47 what it is right now, Alex. At MDebateNFL on Twitter, MikeDebate locked on Patriots, Alex Clancy, Clancy's Corner on Twitter, locked on Cardinals. That was another Crossover Thursday. Cherish football, damn it! We'll talk to you on our respective podcast tomorrow.

Locked On Patriots - Daily Podcast On The New England Patriots - New England Patriots, Arizona Cardinals Crossover: Drake Maye, Kyler Murray, Pats Offensive Line

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