Locked On Patriots - Daily Podcast On The New England Patriots - New England Patriots: Meet the New Coaches, 'Clean Slate' for Mac Jones? Trade the No. 3 NFL Draft Pick?

Starting point is 00:00:00 Gerard Mayo's coaching staff with the New England Patriots has finally met the media and it's a new era in Foxborough. What does it mean on the field? What does it mean in the draft room? Stick around. You're about to be locked in to the Locked On Patriots podcast. You are Locked On Patriots, your daily New England Patriots podcast. Part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day.

Starting point is 00:00:40 Hello to all of you, Foxborough faithful, and thank you once again for making Locked On Patriots a daily part of your New England Patriots coverage, and hopefully your first listen each and every day. Remember, Locked On Patriots is free and available on all platforms, including YouTube. So smash that subscribe button and download and follow wherever you get your podcasts to ensure that you get the latest episode as soon as it's available. I'm your host, Mike DeBate. I cover your New England Patriots for Patriots Country of Sports Illustrated.

Starting point is 00:01:10 So reach out to me and let me know what's on your mind on X at M-D-A-B-A-T-E-N-F-L. While you're out there showing some social media love to Lockdown Patriots, please follow our account there as well at LO underscore Patriots. And Pats fans, it's time to meet the new coaches. On Wednesday, Gerard Mayo introduced his inner sanctum of the New England Patriots coaching staff to Marcus Covington as the defensive coordinator, Alex Van Pelt as your offensive coordinator, and Jeremy Springer coaching the special teams. It was exciting to meet these guys, but one guy we don't have to meet here in Patriots Nation is the gentleman that is joining me today.

Starting point is 00:01:51 And we're going to break this all down, close the week in style as we opened it in style here on Locked On Patriots. My good friend, the legend himself, the Don of Locked On Patriots, Thomas Murphy. Murph, thank you so much for coming to me today in friendship and for helping me cap this week in style. Don Murph. Thank you. Thank you so much for having me.

Starting point is 00:02:12 Yeah. You know, in the immortal words of Pappy O'Daniel in O Brother Where Art Thou, these folks are going to be my brain trust. And the New England Patriots definitely do have a brain trust. For the first time since 2017, all three top-of-the-line coaches in New England are going to have titles. They're all going to be coordinators. And Gerard Mayo hinted at this. When he took the reins of the New England Patriots, he expressed the value of titles.

Starting point is 00:02:41 He expressed the value of open communication, of availability. Well, he kind of put all of them on display on Wednesday afternoon. His executive level coaching staff folks has now met the media and you could sense there was a different tone in the air from the moment that Gerard Mayo stepped to what is now a seated dais as opposed to a standing podium. Gerard basically put it all on his new coaches he said today is really about the new coaches the new coordinators we're excited to have them we're excited to get to work murph you've followed this team you've covered this team for a number of years now yeah and you know the differences in certain coaches that have taken the reins here

Starting point is 00:03:21 in new england when you take a look at what mayo had to say, because I know you've had a chance to go over the transcripts, see some of the clips, read about what he had to say, your impressions on how he handled his first press conference, New England Patriots head coach, and what you think it means moving forward for a fan's experience when it comes to relating to this team. I think he handled it really well. I thought it went swimmingly

Starting point is 00:03:45 in his favor. It was, as you said, a communal sit down. You know, everybody sit down around the campfire. He was open and I think honest. I thought he did a fantastic job. I also thought that, you know, me, he might've glossed over a few things with the fact that, you know, his offensive coordinator is the last offensive coordinator. I mean, his offensive coordinator was the last one that, that he interviewed and, you know, others turned down the job because right now this is not a very attractive job.

Starting point is 00:04:26 You look at this offense and what has been said about it. I mean, we have no idea who the tackles are on this team right now. Never mind you talk about the weapons that people say that this team is lacking. It was eye-opening. He was as candid as any coach that I've ever seen over the past 20 years or 15 years that I've covered this team, 20 years since Bill Belichick walked through those doors, 20-plus years now.

Starting point is 00:05:02 And, yeah, he did good. a lot of what gerard had to say on wednesday really was cloaked with a lot of optimism uh you could hear it uh that was the central message that's the message he wanted to get across whether he believes it in his heart of hearts or not i truly believe he does gerard mayo is a very transparent individual folks and i say that with reverence that's exactly who he. If he's feeling a certain way or he's thinking a certain thing, he's going to tell you and he's Covington, and Jeremy Springer as quote-unquote relationship guys. Stuff that he had to say about Alex Van Pelt, saying that before you get into the X's and O's, you have to know that the coaches care about you.

Starting point is 00:05:55 And he knows that Alex Van Pelt is the type of guy that's going to communicate that to his players. He mentioned the same thing about to Marcus Covington, saying that he's a great relationship guy too. He develops players in mind in body and in spirit and that really is DeMarcus's catchphrase we've heard him use that before on conference calls and Zoom conferences Marcus is very very big on that that seems to be a prevalent theme throughout now what's going to be the Mayo regime here in New England when you think of relationship guys and you think of that type of back and forth with the players, what do you think that's going to translate to

Starting point is 00:06:31 in terms of the product that we see on the field? Could we see a more loose New England Patriots team next year? Because of that, do you expect the play on the field to respond to it? I'm not sure. That all comes down to talent. It really does. What happens on the field is execution. And that didn't happen last year for whatever reason. Talent level, respect for the coaching. It was on the offensive, it just did not happen. And it did on the defensive side of the, of the ball. That's for damn sure. Um, it, uh, that was fantastic, but it's all going to come down to this team gelling together and getting on the same page and wanting to, uh, embrace what is being told to them from the front of the room.

Starting point is 00:07:27 I'm not sure if that's going to happen or not. We are going to see a tremendous amount of turnover on this team in the next six months. And those type of people, those types of coaches are generally successful in the short term. Whether they can be successful in the long term is the question. And I'm not saying that they're going to come out as gangbusters next year. They're going to end up in the playoffs, win a round, and shake up the world. I certainly don't mean that they're going to make a Super Bowl run no matter who's under center.

Starting point is 00:08:09 But the feel-good thing is always nice. But I never got the impression last year, with the exception from Mr. Brown, who was released recently, that there was much divisiveness or the fact that, you know, people did not want to come to work. Yes, you bring up a very good point in that it's almost a situation where people are reading into that and saying, well, that means that there was a lot of tension in the room last year. That means there was a lot of negativity. We hear the term all the time, and this is a term that gerard used himself on

Starting point is 00:08:45 wednesday ego free zone i want this coach's room to be very open very candid i want there to be a lot of free dialogue going back and forth it gives the impression that that hasn't been the case here in new england you and i know from speaking with people that were in those rooms both players and you know coaches and front office members and and people that were in those rooms, both players and coaches and front office members and people that are connected with the team, that that doesn't necessarily the case. Yeah, there are moments of tension in every NFL locker room, in every coach's room. But you also look at it and say, well, it wasn't necessarily so much of a departure from what they had last year. I think the transparency and the fact that we're going to have much more of a front row seat to what happens behind closed doors that's where the difference is going to come

Starting point is 00:09:29 in it's not necessarily such a difference in how things are run behind the scenes i think the transparency is where the difference is going to come in and that's where that ego-free zone comes in uh i think that's kind of what gerard means by that. Okay. Well, I mean, I'm sorry. I keep feeling like he's taking shots at his mentor and the man who gave him a shot, not only on a football field. Anybody would have given Gerard Mayo a shot on the football field, except for a few people who passed on him that year in the draft. But, you know, welcomed him back into coaching. And in a very short span of time, he has managed to make his way without any kind of coaching title to become a head coach of one of the most successful franchises in NFL history. Judging on what I've seen from Gerard and judging on what I saw from him all year last

Starting point is 00:10:23 year and the transparent nature of the way he does handle questions even under a Belichickian regime folks for everyone who thinks that they were under some sort of pseudo gag order that they weren't allowed to speak uh Gerard is always very candid he always has been um and I don't think that's changed I think that's only gotten more prevalent as he's taken this head coach's position for the New England Patriots. I don't necessarily know if it's a shot at his former employer. I don't necessarily know if it's taking shots at his mentor, but I do think it's more about him trying to forge his own identity. In order to do that, you almost have to take a look at what the former regime did and step out

Starting point is 00:11:01 into a completely different pillar of light and say that was then this is now this is how I'm going to do things I get the impression it's more of the former than the latter but again it does have that type of overtone to it and I can't understand it I do understand where people are coming from but Gerard has all has also seen in the past that, you know, coaches that have left New England and gone on to be head coaches, being a Bill Belichick clone does not work. Yeah. And I will give him huge credit for that. It doesn't work with the media. It does not work with the players. These players know that they aren't sitting in front of Bill Belichick, six-time Super Bowl champion, head coach, and he's going to have to do things differently, whether or not it works out that way.

Starting point is 00:11:49 And, you know, we're all sitting around the locker room singing Kumbaya in week 12 has yet to be seen. It's true. Absolutely. And yeah, I think you make a great point because Bill Belichick- I'm sorry, I've said it before. I mean, it's a completely different animal being an assistant coach, a coordinator and being a head coach of any team, of any team. The assistants are always everybody's best friend. Before we take our leave of this subject, I know you had touched on this briefly before and you talked about the new coaching dynamic and being a Bill Belichick clone, not necessarily being the best thing. We've seen guys continuously trip over themselves,

Starting point is 00:12:30 trying to be Bill and not being able to be Bill, whether it be Eric Mangini in New York, whether it be Matt Patricia in Detroit, whether it be Josh McDaniels in Denver or in Las Vegas. If you're not packing the room with guys that you know are going to buy into your message, no one that's sitting there is going to buy into it. It's just you have to have the right people at the right time to buy into it. But one of the things that Gerard pressed yesterday and one of the big takeaway items from this press conference, at least until he introduced his three coaches, he mentioned how the Patriots in the past, didn't mention Belichick by name,

Starting point is 00:13:08 but did say that the Patriots have typically had small coaching staffs. The Patriots have welcomed a total of 19 new coaches, 17 of which are new faces in new roles. Historically, that is not the Patriot way. So this is going to be a departure and gerard followed that up by saying it's hard to get things done that way in today's nfl more people in the room more voices to be heard you think this is a good thing for the new england patriots moving forward

Starting point is 00:13:37 um i think right now it's a good thing um gerard mayo needs as many people there as sounding boards and guys who have been in those positions before as he possibly can get. Personally, you know, over the years, that small coaching staff had worked really, really well for New England and for Bill Belichick. And it put a lot of it put a lot on the plates of those few. All right. And now hopefully with things spread out a little bit more, guys will walk away from the table a little bit hungry and and want to move up. We talked about the fact that, you know, you now have defined roles. Well, Bill Belichick didn't have defined roles for his coaches because their roles evolved so much, and also because he was, quite frankly, thinking of them. It's a lot easier if you want to leave and take a coaching coordinator's job

Starting point is 00:14:41 if you don't have a coaching coordinator's uh title okay there's nothing keeping uh keeping someone here if if coordinator's not there and or or wide receiver coach or this coach or that coach and um i i'm not going to turn this into a let's defend bill thing but um no i i do believe that that bill expected too much out of his coaches, that he expected them to handle a load that was probably bigger than they were able to. And I think these guys might be able to do a better job focusing a little more on their position and not everyone else's or not having to, to, to polish off everything that was on that large plate. Yeah. Good point. And I think you heard that yesterday to each his own specialty was really a common takeaway that I had from that room, listening to Alex Van Pelt, listening to Demarcus Covington and listening to Jeremy Springer. They talked about personal relationships,

Starting point is 00:15:42 but they also talked about making sure that the players knew their roles, making sure that the players knew the coach's roles, who to go to when you have a certain question, when you have a problem. Those were issues that were prevalent the last couple of years in New England. And for better or for worse, that needed to be corrected, whether Bill came back or whether Gerard now is the new man and the head coach's seat whoever was going to be the head coach this year knew that had to change and it had to change in a big way but for all of you folks out there that think that this is a complete 180 in every aspect of the New England coaches room Murph I give you Demarcus Covington and this is my takeaway quote from yesterday

Starting point is 00:16:20 talking specifically about the defense and saying that we're not going to reinvent the wheel there's not going to be a lot of drastic changes why would you this is seventh overall ranked defense in the league last year folks and the team was 4 and 13 that should tell you how good that unit was demarcus's quote sounds familiar let's just say it sounds familiar quote i think what we want to see is a physical team, a team that plays with good discipline and fundamentals, a team that attacks the football and takes it away from the opponent. That's what we're trying to look for with our defense. A team that goes out there, plays together for one another, that type of togetherness. Maybe with the exception of the word togetherness, sounded very Belichickian of Demarcus Covington.

Starting point is 00:17:06 And folks, that influence will still be there. So for any of you Belichick purists that are worried that that is going to be completely taken out of the room, I think guys like Demarcus Covington and including Gerard Mayo and including Dante Hightower, who played for this guy and won championships with this guy. Yeah, I don't think it's completely going out of the room. And, and Van Pelt was, was not an echo of that, but he, he talked about putting players in their best position to succeed and using his players in the best way possible, you know, and depending on how this, this roster on his side of the ball fills out. And people are talking about how the fact that you want to build a team that can win in a myriad of different ways. Van Pelt talked about how he's bringing stuff in from Cleveland

Starting point is 00:17:57 and from Green Bay and all the stops that he makes. Well, I mean, for years here, people, how did the Patriots win? By beating you where you're weakest, by being able to adapt week to week. And that's something that I'm finding also quite Belichickian in thinking going forward. And I'm all for that. I'm all for that. I mean, if you can keep the best of Bill Belichick in, in, in your coaching plans, the better. So very well said, because there is a little back to the future in some of these coaches, including Alex Van Pelt, who you just mentioned. He used the term we heard last year, taking a little trip back into the Bill O'Brien DeLorean folks and mentioning the words clean slate.

Starting point is 00:18:45 Now, that's right, folks. You know who he's talking about, the same guy Bill O'Brien was talking about last year at this time, Mac Jones. I feel like Lloyd Christmas, Murph, so you're telling me there's a chance? Yeah, folks, there actually might be a chance based on what Alex Van Pelt said on Wednesday. Is that chance really a good one?

Starting point is 00:19:04 Well, Murph and I are going to discuss that in just a moment when this episode of the Locked On Patriots podcast continues, a proud part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day. Locked On listeners, are you the kind of drivers that like to push things a little further? Ever wonder what adventure could be around the next corner well our friends at nissan have a lineup of suvs with the capabilities to take your adventure to the next level the 2024 nissan rogue is perfect for city drives and for great escapes their class exclusive google built-in is your always updating assistant and you can call

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Starting point is 00:20:37 today on Locked On Patriots. Close the week in style here with our good friend, the legendary Connor Murphy Fisto himself, Thomas Murphy. Murph, we met the coaches in the previous segment. We friend the legendary conor murphy fisto himself thomas murphy murph we met the coaches in the previous segment we talked a little bit about gerard mayo's new leadership style how some belichickian elements are still going to remain in that locker room and we touched upon alex van pelt and some of what he had to say in terms of making sure that all the players that play under him are put in the proper position to succeed well there was an eerie familiarity in the air on wednesday when van pelt addressed the media

Starting point is 00:21:11 and he mentioned two words that i know may send chills up and down the spine of a lot of patriots fans out there yeah that's right folks he used the words clean slate yep yeah stop us if you heard this one before mac jones getting clean slate, he was talking about everybody, by the way, folks, he did not specifically single out Mac Jones. Everyone gets a clean slate with me, but he was asked about Mac and did include him with that. Murph. I know we've been very vocal about the fact that we believe it's in the best interest

Starting point is 00:21:43 of the team. It's in the best interest of Mac himself, clearly in the best interest of Alex Van Pelt to move on from Mac in this off season, give him an opportunity to rebuild his career, rebuild his confidence elsewhere. And our Patriots move in a different direction at the quarterback position. Now we know the Pats own the number three overall pick in the upcoming NFL draft. They could roll the dice on a potential franchise quarterback, but regardless, right up until Van Pelt made these comments, it looked like almost a certainty that the Patriots would have a new signal caller. But when a coach makes a statement like this, you can't simply dismiss it as being nothing.

Starting point is 00:22:19 First of all, do you think this idea of a clean slate has any merit at all? And is it the right rhetoric for Alex Van Pelt to be using when it comes to all his players, including Mac Jones? Yeah, I do think it has credence. I really do. If you are a coach worth your salt, you think you can fix anybody. You really do. All right. And this is a man who worked with how many, how many quarterbacks last, last year? Six, seven. Yeah. You know, um, one 11 games too. Yeah. And one 11

Starting point is 00:22:54 games. Uh, he picked Joe Flacco up off the, the, I don't want to say the scrap heap, but you know, he made him relevant again, made the man, um, comeback player of the year i could i could do that with mac jones that's what alex and pal was thinking right now also you don't want to show your hand to the entire world when it comes to what the patriots are going to do in this upcoming draft as as for a clean slate with everybody else yeah he has a clean slate with everybody else and saying that is is only a smart move on his point because he doesn't know which of these guys is going to end up being on his team next year. Okay.

Starting point is 00:23:31 He's going to have to work with the Devonta Parkers and he's going to have to, he's going to have to work with the Ramon Dre Stevenson's and he's going to, he's going to have to work with, with, um, you know, uh, hopefully the Hunter Henry's and the Pharaoh Browns of the world and, and convince them that, you know, with a clean slate and under me, we can fix what was broken last year. We can, we can, you know, get a little movement going a little more movement, uh, going pre-snap and, and get you guys open a little more. Um, you know, it's, it's, he needs to build these guys up before he tears them down. OK, usually if you're if you're if you're a long term coach there and you have somebody coming in, sometimes you need to tear them down before you build them up.

Starting point is 00:24:17 And like Tom Brady, you know, what the hell you do? Run that again, Brady. But other than that, no, I do think it's prudent. And I do think that if Van Pelt is going back and looking at college film of Mac Jones, and he's going back and looking at film of him in his rookie season, he's seeing somebody that he can work with and quite frankly, probably could run the types of offense that he wants to do week in and week out if he sits down and he works with them and things can come together. That might be a pride thing with coaches. I think it is. I mean, I've succumbed to that and overcome that on several occasions with different ball players in in my in my personal history and that kind of allows me to play devil's advocate for a moment as well and saying okay well you know even if it does have credence and this is a situation where

Starting point is 00:25:16 alex van pelt does believe because i do believe it is the prudent course of action i'm completely agreement with you you don't want an offensive coordinator to get up there before he's conducted a single practice or a single team meeting and say oh yeah i know he's on the roster but he's not in our plans you're not going to hear a guy say that any coach worth his salt would never do that i would say health is a very good coach he's not going to do something like that that being said we've talked several times about the damage done to mac jones reputation in that building. And our good friend, ESPN's Mike Reese, had a very interesting tidbit to make on Thursday morning, the day after Alex Van Pelt was introduced to the media, saying that there is a slight undercurrent in the New England Patriots organization that believes that Mac Jones can be salvaged. That believes that there could be a little bit of a turnaround

Starting point is 00:26:06 if he's given the right opportunity to do so. However, that is a slight undercurrent. The vast majority in the room right now seems to believe that the relationship is damage beyond repair, and he would have to win over an awful lot of people in order to do that. Not impossible, but very difficult. But we've talked about it before.

Starting point is 00:26:25 It's not the coaching staff. It's not the crafts. Okay. It's the guys in that locker room. Okay. It's the guys in that locker room. the deflation of, for lack of a better word, of Mac Jones and his swagger when walking into that room. It's just not what it was even two years ago as a rookie.

Starting point is 00:26:59 It's going to be very difficult for Mac Jones to, if he's here in any capacity, to win back those guys that have walked away from him. And that's the bottom line as to why I think he's done here. I think he could go somewhere and be a good serviceable quarterback, just like I thought on draft night. I still think that he's the second best quarterback in that draft. Sorry, I told you all that. And I still believe that he could end up being a good journeyman quarterback.

Starting point is 00:27:34 I don't know if you put him in the right surroundings, he could do a lot of winning. But the right surroundings are not here. Yeah, I agree. And I think that at this point folks what you're probably looking at is the beginning of the end you will start to see the hand be tipped a little bit more as the patriots make their decisions free agency i think is going to tell the tale as well are the patriots going to be active and looking at veteran quarterbacks backups guys that can come in and mentor a young quarterback that they may want to bring in, or are they going to try to go aggressive in the trade market and maybe try to bring in an established veteran,

Starting point is 00:28:09 someone that can take the helm of the ship right away? In that case, then you're looking at maybe some whole new options for the 2024 NFL Draft. And Murph, the draft season is in full swing. Senior Bowl's already taken place. We are only a couple of days away from the start of the NFL Scouting Combine in Indian swing. Senior Bowl's already taken place. We are only a couple of days away from the start of the NFL scouting combine in Indianapolis, and NFL Network's Daniel Jeremiah has met with the media via conference call. Folks, the annual rite of passage when it comes to that point of no return between draft or no draft season has passed. Daniel had some interesting things to say about

Starting point is 00:28:43 the New England Patriots on this call. Murph and I are going to break that down in just a moment, and whether or not there might be a trade in the Patriots' future, you could see them out of that number three spot. Folks, don't worry about it. We're going to go over all the options. We're going to discuss all the angles when this episode of the Locked On Patriots podcast continues, a proud part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day. This next segment is brought to you by our sponsor, BetterHelp. And folks, sometimes we all need the opportunity to get something off our chest. Whether it's big or small, certain things can really start to get to you.

Starting point is 00:29:24 It's important to let that out, especially to someone who's unbiased on your life. So today, I want to say how I really feel about something, and you may even be thinking about the same thing this week too. As Patriots fans, we're all excited for a new era here in Foxborough, a new head coach in Gerard Mayo, a brand new coaching staff, and hopefully the start of a new championship run. But I know there's also a bit of melancholy out there. Bill Belichick is no longer the head coach. Matthew Slater is officially retired. And it just feels like the glory days in New England are slipping away. You're conflicted, and it's understandable to

Starting point is 00:30:01 be overwhelmed by your feelings. Well, the same concept is true with all of life's circumstances, and therapy can help. Therapy can be different for everyone, and let's face it, most of us have bigger problems than our favorite sports team, and it's important to get things off your chest every once in a while. If you're thinking of starting therapy, give BetterHelp a try. It's entirely online, designed to be flexible, and suited to your schedule.

Starting point is 00:30:27 Visit BetterHelp.com to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp.com slash Locked On. Patriots fans, thank you once again for joining us here today on

Starting point is 00:30:44 Locked On Patriots and closing the week in style the way we open the week in style with my good friend, the Count of Murphy, Fisto himself, the legendary Thomas Murphy. And folks, earlier this week, we do apologize for some technical problems that prevented us from being able to bring you Mock Draft Monday on Mock Draft Monday. It really became mock draft Wednesday, but you know what? You guys still turned out in droves to watch that episode. I thank you so much for that, for staying locked in and for staying loyal to locked on Patriot midweek.

Starting point is 00:31:15 And the mock drafts that were sent in were phenomenal. And folks, we cannot wait to showcase your great work. Once again, mock draft Monday, we'll be back. It will be on Monday this time, and we look forward

Starting point is 00:31:27 to showcasing all of your great insight. So make sure to send those mock drafts in at mdabatenfl at teamerf207 or at lo underscore patriots, and you can even send them in by email. We had a phenomenal amount of email submissions

Starting point is 00:31:43 last week. LockedOnPatriots at gmail.com. You can send it into any one of those options. It's the best time of the year. We love it. And every year before the combine, NFL's Daniel Jeremiah has his annual conference call. And he meets with members of the media. I had the good fortune of being on that call.

Starting point is 00:32:02 And a wealth of knowledge. He really is. Daniel takes this very seriously, does his homework, comes in and is very well prepared to discuss all of the teams. And of course, here on Locked On Patriots, we're going to discuss Patriots. And the first thing that came up was whether or not the Patriots would consider doing anything at number three than picking a quarterback. The question specifically that was asked to him was, it does seem like a tricky decision because of the wealth of options

Starting point is 00:32:30 that you have at this position. If you're the Patriots, do you just take whichever quarterback falls to you, or do you really consider someone like a Marvin Harrison and one of the wide receivers or maybe even an offensive tackle like Joe Alt. Well, Daniel Jeremiah seems to think that the Patriots should go with conventional wisdom. I'll quote you exactly what he said here. I think obviously they'll do their homework on all of the different options there. To me, it would be tough to pass on a quarterback. You're not guaranteed to be up here again.

Starting point is 00:33:05 There's no guarantee of future years or what it's going to look like at the position i look at whether whichever one is there if it's any of those top three quarterbacks those guys that bring so much energy and life to your franchise it just feels right you have a new leadership in place they're 30th in points per game tied for last that needs to change that being said he did express some love for Marvin Harrison at the wide receiver position I know some people will argue vehemently that if the Patriots are not sure about going with the quarterback that Marvin Harrison is such a generational talent that you can grab him at wide receiver and plug in your pass catcher at a later time I don't think the Patriots go that direction I don't think they're built to sustain success in

Starting point is 00:33:45 that fashion. You can't bring in an expensive sports car like Marvin Harrison without someone that can drive it and without a suitable garage to protect it. Patriots don't have either one of those right now. So in essence, you're wasting his talent until you're able to surround him with adequate talent. By that time, you may have lost or disenfranchised the player that being said daniel seems to be very confident about the quarterback based on what he had to say and based on the arguments that you've made before does this challenge your thought process in any way are you still steadfast that you have to build from the o-line doesn't challenge me in any way shape or form good none i didn't think it should. Okay. Daniel Jeremiah brought up the fact

Starting point is 00:34:27 today that he was in Gillette Stadium last year, and there was no energy. None. Okay? Zero. And that by drafting a quarterback, it will re-energize Gillette Stadium, and that's one of the reasons that they should take one of these three quarterbacks. I think that is flawed thinking. I think that's an analyst talking. I think that's somebody who wants talking points on television. I'm not about that. I'm about building this football team and getting it back to a Super Bowl, and this isn't going to take place overnight. We mentioned drafting Marvin

Starting point is 00:35:06 Harrison as one of those exciting pieces to bring in. Who's getting in the ball? And is that guy going to be upright and be able to get him a ball downfield? We've seen all year long, these past two seasons, that with the Patriots basically turning their back on the offensive line, what that has gotten them. Look at the people that have left here. Joe Tooney and others in the past few years that the Patriots have just walked away from. And now they have this mess to fix. You have to fix this first. Okay?

Starting point is 00:35:43 Or there will be no upright quarterback. There will be another shell of a human being back there, all right? If you have those wide receivers, the quarterback is not going to – that quarterback that you draft, even with the wide receivers that are here, guys like Tyquan Thornton, don't have enough time to get downfield and do the things that they were drafted to do. You know, that you guys were all clamoring for. He's a speedster.

Starting point is 00:36:10 You've got to be able to sit there and pat that ball twice and let him get into his pattern. And that didn't happen. The line is the place to start. And I know you guys have taken me to task in the comments down below over the past few weeks. And I don't mind that. You know, this is me. This is who I am. This is how I believe that you're going to build a winning football team. And with Alex Van Pelt, believe me, there is going to be a lot of running the football.

Starting point is 00:36:47 There's going to be a lot of play action passes. You can't do any of that without an offensive line. You can't implement the things that he wants to do without that offensive line. Now in this draft, I have, I have, you know, we're talked about mock drafts. I have mocked this draft. I've mused this draft, I should say, in over a dozen scenarios. And in most of them, I have been able to trade back profitably, getting five, six, seven top 100 picks by using this second round pick and i still get my man all i haven't i haven't i haven't gone back farther than the sixth pick in this draft that's a good point and i'm glad that you mentioned that because that's my follow-up question here if the new england patriots are not

Starting point is 00:37:38 going to go quarterback at number three and there's still a very good chance that they will folks or for those of you clamoring for a jaden Daniels or a Drake May or who knows, maybe a Caleb Williams falls to number three. If you're envisioning one of those guys in a Patriots uniform, I can tell you there's still a very good chance that happens. But it almost seems like the only move that they can make at that point is to trade down incrementally to get someone like a Joe Alt or like you've said before, get a solid player and maximize that draft capital.

Starting point is 00:38:05 To me, the only way you stay at three is if you're going quarterback. That's it. There's no other reason to it because there's just so much that is going to be thrown at you. There are so many people that are, uh, so many teams that are, um, that are, uh, quarterback starved and fan bases that scream for it so much and, and, and ownership and GMs that listen to it. And they think that, you know, my entire, uh, career is going to depend on this. I have to take the guy that's left there at three. Otherwise I'm going to get run out of town. All right. Nobody's getting run out of town this year for making this pick. Um, But what could set you back is if you do make that mistake, if you do take the quarterback and you don't think that he is the man.

Starting point is 00:38:52 Personally, I don't think any one of these three are a quarterback that I would take with one of the top three picks. I'm sorry. That's just the way I feel. Okay? None of these guys is Peyton Manning. Okay? None of these guys is Andrew Luck.

Starting point is 00:39:12 None of these guys is Patrick Mahomes. These comparisons are going to be brought up at nauseam, rolling up to take Rattler in the third round. I mean, I've seen as much out of him as I have some of these other guys. When you look at the competition that they go up against, the mental makeup that they have, or, you know, the fact that, you know, surprisingly, all of a sudden, when they're surrounded by first-round picks at wide receiver,

Starting point is 00:39:46 they're balling out when they didn't a year earlier at Arizona State. Okay. And I'm not saying that these guys won't be successful. I'm just saying that I don't know that I could take that shot when I have these other options, when I can move down and, you know, with Arizona and see if they will give me a couple of their twos, and then I can move down with the chargers and, you know, see if I can pick up one of their picks, you know, I, and you could end up, like I said, with four, five, six top 100, you could end up with six or seven starters when you include your own second round pick out of this draft.

Starting point is 00:40:28 Those are seven holes that you could fill in this draft. And then you go get your quarterback. You find the veteran to come in that you really like. Or you find the Spencer Rattler there in the fourth round. Or you find somebody, a quarterback with your second pick in the second round and take a dice roll there. I'm just not willing to give up all of that for one of these three guys and the last one of these three guys.

Starting point is 00:41:03 And I'm not trading up with the cost it's going to make. Not that I can see the Bears doing that again, but passing on somebody. Everybody knows who they're going to take. It's a foregone conclusion. But no, there's too much age on this team. They're, they're, they're looking to get younger. This draft class is, is super top heavy, be it through trade or free agency or next year's draft, as opposed to throwing it all, pushing all your chips in on one of these three guys. Yeah, I think Jeremiah would agree with you in this regard. Surprisingly, it actually does coincide with what you had to say. Trading up for a quarterback does signify a few things. One, it signifies that there

Starting point is 00:42:11 is a team that's willing to move off that spot, that they've looked at the options available there and they're willing to move from that spot depending on the haul that they're going to get back. Traditionally, that has not voted well for teams that were aggressive coming up for guys. guys. We saw this happen with the San Francisco 49ers a couple of years ago. Granted, the San Francisco 49ers were in the Super Bowl this year, folks. That is an extremely talented team, but who let them know? Not the guy that they took with the number three pick, the guy they took with the last pick in the draft. Brock Purdy is the starter, not Trey Lance. So it just goes to show you that aggressiveness and trading up in those regards doesn't necessarily guarantee you the guy that you think you're going to get, but a lot of teams want to go ahead and do that. And the moment that

Starting point is 00:42:57 the chance of the Patriots trading out of that number three spot was dangled. Yeah. You can already see the beat writers from other teams kind of grabbing that chum kind of going after that bait and the raiders came up the raiders sit at number 13 right now a lot of people asked about them trading up daniel jeremiah had a hell of a haul that the patriots could get in return oh i'm sure yeah he says let's see here the raiders you want to go up to number three. Here's your cost. 13th overall pick your first rounder and your third rounder in 2025 and your first rounder in 2026.

Starting point is 00:43:33 That is not cheap folks. That is two ones and the 13th this year, and then two more. So three total number ones, as well as a third round pick. Even if you were going to go quarterback, that's still tempting. Yeah, it is tempting, but it's something that I'd say no to. You're pushing these picks off to the point where you're going to lose so many pieces between now and then on the defensive side of the ball that you would just be plugging other holes. Okay. Well, the scenario that I, that I paint out for you allows this team to get very young, very good, very quickly. Okay. And then you just need that final piece. Yes. It's the biggest piece in pro sports. I understand that folks, but like Mike

Starting point is 00:44:19 just said, look what San Francisco has been able to do the past two years with mr irrelevant okay and he was put in there after all these other pieces were put around him all right and and you know uh they they use a a fullback bottom line i think murph makes an excellent point because by pushing the picks off it does prolong the inevitable and sometimes prolonging the inevitable can take you so far away from your goal that you can't find your way back and that's something that can be so detrimental for a team that's looking to re-establish its identity like your New England Patriots Murph it's not an exact science there's always pros and cons to every move that can be made bottom line folks none of that matters when the draft arrives. The Patriots have a decision to make,

Starting point is 00:45:06 and whether they choose to decide on number three or not, it'll still be a choice. And Murph and I are going to continue to bring you the very latest, all of the updated information on what that choice may be, how the Patriots can make it educatedly, and how they can also move forward in getting back to the level of respectability that we all know and love from our New England Patriots. Murph, it's been a blast this week.

Starting point is 00:45:28 It's been a little bit of a disjuncted week here on Lockdown Patriots. But once again, folks, a tip of the cap to all of you everydayers especially. In the meantime, I'm Mike DeBate. And on behalf of my good friend Thomas Murphy, I remind you all to stay safe and to stay well and to be the change you wish to see in the world. Have a great day, everyone.

Starting point is 00:45:46 And we'll see you back here again on mock draft Monday on locked on Patriots.

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