Locked On Patriots - Daily Podcast On The New England Patriots - Pivot: Should Patriots Target Kyle Pitts If A.J. Brown Trade Doesn’t Happen?

Starting point is 00:00:00 If the Pats fail to land A.J. Brown ahead of the draft, there's another pass catcher that could impact Drake May in the offense significantly. This is Lockdown Patriots. You are Locked on Patriots. Your daily New England Patriots podcast. Part of the Locked on Podcast Network, your team every day. What's happening? I am your host, Nick Cattels. Mike Vrable sets the expectations for 2026. he's not running away from 2025's success. In our

Starting point is 00:00:39 second segment, Elliot Wolf makes explosive and revealing comments on what went wrong pre-vrable. But first, the available pass catcher that could change this offense. Today's episode is brought to by Fandul during the tournament. Fandul is

Starting point is 00:00:55 offering $300 back in bonus bets every day for 10 days. Had to Fandul.com to get started. We had a mailbag question during yesterday. today's episode about pivoting from A.J. Brown. What happens if you don't trade for A.J. Brown, what would then be the pivot for the Patriots at Receiver? There was an interesting comment this week in Arizona. Now, I've been thinking about that mailbag question for the past 24 hours.

Starting point is 00:01:25 And then I started to think about this interesting comment in Arizona. And I think those two things could be tied together. Ian Cunningham, who is the new GM of the Atlanta Falcons. Now, of course, Matt Ryan is the true shot caller, but Ian Cunningham, GM, met with the media this week in Arizona at the league meetings. And here's what Pro Football Talk wrote about Ian Cunningham. The Falcons placed the franchise tag on tight end Kyle Pitts. However, they have not ruled out trading pits if the right offer comes along.

Starting point is 00:02:00 unquote. This is what Cunningham said. Quote, it's my job as the general manager to do what's best for the organization. Kyle is a great player. We've seen his skill set. Also, it's my job to listen. We're excited to have Kyle. We're excited for his future. Unquote. That to me, if we're going to translate that message from the GM of the Falcons, the translation would be, we're open to moving Kyle Pitts, but we're not going to give him away. We're perfectly fine keeping him. We think he could help us as a football team.

Starting point is 00:02:35 But if you call us and you make it worth our while, we will listen. And we might pull it the trigger on a trade. Now, let's not forget Kevin Stefansky is the new head coach in Atlanta. Let's not forget that David and Joku was just in Cleveland with Stifansky. David and Joku is still available. Could you see a scenario play out where the Falcons trade Kyle Pitts for picks and then they pivot and sign David and Joku while also drafting a tight end in this year's draft and rolling into 2026 with David and Juko and Joku draft pick and Austin Hooper? I'm not telling you it's going to happen, but I don't think that's a crazy idea. Now, as far as Kyle Pitts, would I be interested? Absolutely. Let's talk money first.

Starting point is 00:03:34 Kyle Pitts on the franchise tag, $15 million this season. If you compare that to A.J. Brown, AJ Brown's cap hit in 2026 is $23.3 million. Now, what's interesting here is that, yeah, Kyle Pitts, you can say, well, Nick, Pitts is on the franchise tag. That means he could be a free agent next season. Well, guess what? A.J. Brown could be a free agent. next season as well because A.J. Brown has a contractual out after 2026. For all intents and purposes, either one of these two guys, if you acquire either one of these two guys, whether it's trading for Kyle Pitts or trading for AJ Brown, you're going to have to extend the guy that you bring in. So if we look at an extension for Kyle Pitts, you have to compare him to Tray McBride the

Starting point is 00:04:27 best tight end receiving tight end in the game because I can guarantee you Kyle Pitts's representation is comparing him to trade McBride's contract so again pits is set for 15 million this season tray McBride average per year makes 19 million so financially just just talking about the finances financially it makes sense to acquire Kyle Pitts instead of AJ Brown but there are other reasons why I would absolutely unequivocally be interested in Kyle Pitts. And one of those reasons is that Pitts turns 26 years old in October. He was drafted at a very young age. He's not even walking into his prime.

Starting point is 00:05:11 I mean, you could look at prime as 27 to 29, really. If you want to back it up to 26, you could say he's just walking into his prime. The fact is he's younger than A.J. Brown. and he is significantly younger in football years than A.J. Brown. If you told me you can bring in a Kyle Pitts who turns 26 years old in October and you compare him with Drake May for the next five or six years, I think we're cooking. We're cooking a bit. And Kyle Pitts is coming off of his best season in the league,

Starting point is 00:05:43 and it's not even close. And you could argue that Pitts, he's coming off his best season because he finally figured the NFL out. Because he was drafted so young, because he was stuck with some mediocre quarterback play. When you look at his 2025, 88 catches, 928 yards, 5 touchdowns. Yeah, I'm interested. But of course, the million dollar question, how much would you have to pay? Not financially.

Starting point is 00:06:11 Not the money. I think you can work out a deal with pits financially. But what would Atlanta want in return for pits? What would you have to give up? How much of your draft capital are you giving up for Pitts? The closest example that I could find, if you look at, you know, a tight end and not just any tight end, a good tight end, right? And you would now say Pitts is one of the better tight ends in football after what he did last year. And some might argue Pitts is more of a receiver than tight end, whatever.

Starting point is 00:06:43 The closest example, you go to Greg Olson. Greg Olson was traded from Chicago to Carolina. When Greg Olson was traded to Carolina, he was 26 years old. Again, Pitts turns 26th in October. Carolina traded a third round pick to Chicago for Greg Olson. Now, do I think you could get Kyle Pitts for a third round pick? I do not. Because if you look back, if you compare 2025 and what Pitts did on the field to what

Starting point is 00:07:17 Olson did before he was traded in 2010 for Chicago, Pitts had the much better season, much better season. Greg Olson, before he was dealt for that third round pick, had 41 catches, 404 yards in five touchdowns for the Bears. So, I mean, 41 catches compared to 88, just over 400 yards compared to over 900 yards for Pitts. So you'd have to give up more than a third round pick. My offer, my offer for Kyle Pitts that I think would make sense, I would be willing to give up a second round pick in this year's drafts of number 63. I would call Atlanta and I would offer them number 63 and either, either they get to pick one of two here. That second round pick and either a fifth round pick in this year's draft or a fourth round pick in next year's draft. I think that

Starting point is 00:08:15 would be fair value for Kyle Pitts because before 2025, he did not explode like people thought he would because you have to give him a contract extension, which is going to be a significant financial investment in going off history at that position. So if I were the Patriots, my offer would be a second round pick this year and either a fifth this year or a fourth next year. and if you could get that deal done. Now, I would lean towards A.J. Brown because, again, the position he plays and the need that this team has.

Starting point is 00:08:51 But if you're not sold that you're going to be able to trade for A.J. Brown. If there's any doubt and you have concern and you don't get a Brown trade done heading into the draft and you say, I'm not going to wait until June because, God forbid, we swing and miss on Brown, then we get stuck with what? If you want to pull the trigger, you want to bring a talented guy. in a pass catcher, not a wide receiver, a pass catcher who will absolutely help Drake May and significantly upgrade the tight end room and help this offense. I would offer that package to Atlanta for Kyle Pitts, and I would be happy with Kyle Pitts

Starting point is 00:09:29 as a New England Patriot. Coming up, Elliot Wolfe's stunning comments about how bad things got in New England before Mike Vrable. This is Lockdown Patriots, part of the lockdown podcast. network. Now the number one sports podcast network, your team every day. The tournament is here. One of the best times of the year. Brackets, buzzer beaters, upsets. It's nonstop action from tip to final cut down. And right now, Fandul is giving new customers a way to stay in the action all tournament long. Here's the best part. You get up to $300 back in bonus bets every day for 10 days.

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Starting point is 00:11:13 helps us bring more eyeballs to the product. don't forget to throw a comment in. Are you in or out on the Kyle Pitts idea? In or out? Don't forget to comment and don't forget to subscribe. 10,000 subscribers is the goal by draft. And we'll see if we can actually get that done. Of course, if you're listening, you might tell.

Starting point is 00:11:33 Just plug in some power here on my computer before it fails me. You might be able to tell that my voice is not as strong as it usually is going through some sinus stuff. I don't know what's going on. some allergy stuff, but hopefully it is not impacting your day negatively. Let's get to Elliot Wolf. You know, you didn't have to work in the facility. I did not have to work in the facility at Gillette to tell you or you tell me that 23 and 2024 was an unmitigated disaster for this organization.

Starting point is 00:12:09 But Elliot Wolf spoke to Mark Daniels of Mass Live out in Arizona. at the league meetings. And this was an incredibly revealing, and I would even say explosive comment or comments from Elliot Wolf. And this is not going to be talked about a lot because a lot happened this week. Robert Kraft spoke, Mike Rable spoke, but tucked in between all of that. Was this quote from Wolf to Mark Daniels?

Starting point is 00:12:40 Quote, I definitely think it's more enjoyable. we had varying levels of dysfunction over the last three years before 2025. So we're talking 2022, 2022, 2023, 2024. And Wolf is saying there were varying levels of dysfunction within the organization during those three years. Back to Wolf. It was kind of rewarding to be able to, first of all, we won. but we also had some stability for the first time in a few years.

Starting point is 00:13:17 This function, instability, back to Wolf. That's always rewarding and just kind of understanding that for our staff. It's easier for them to understand exactly what kind of players were looking for. What's that tell you? 22, 23, 24, scouting department, front office. didn't always understand exactly the type of player that was desired, that they were scouting for. Mark Daniels writes, multiple sources have told Mass Live that part of the issue in 2024 was that the team lacked direction under Gerard Mayo.

Starting point is 00:14:01 When it came to free agency in the draft, there was minimal input in what the coaching staff wanted in their players at certain positions. Daniel's rights, the lack of direction changed drastically under Mike Vrable. Last year, the coach held a team meeting with the scouting department before the combine. Vrable told the staff what type of player he exactly wanted from every position. The coach also gave scouts a chance to give their reports on the prospects they scouted. It took some time, but Elliot Wolfe's living his childhood dream. And last season, there were moments when it hit him.

Starting point is 00:14:36 Wolf said, quote, it's interesting that there are moments. and it's usually like out of practice. If the sun's out and you're just on the practice field and it's kind of like, this is pretty awesome. You look over there and you see a real quarterback. Ouch. Apologies to Mack Jones and Jacoby Preset. You look over there and you see a real quarterback

Starting point is 00:15:00 and a real head coach. Ouch. Apologies, condolences to Drod Mayle's NFL career as a coach. and other good players. And it's just kind of like, this is what it's all about. There is a lot to unpack there. There is a lot to unpack. Let's first address the dysfunction word.

Starting point is 00:15:21 I don't take that lightly. Elliot Wolves been in the NFL, no matter how you feel about Elliot Wolf, no matter how you feel about the 2024 offseason, which we'll get to, Elliot Wolf's been in the league for decades. He is well respected in the league, and he has seen organizations run well,

Starting point is 00:15:40 and he has seen organizations run not so well. So when somebody who has the amount of experience within the front office of an NFL franchise call out dysfunction, I take that seriously. I think that is a significant shot across the bow. So what was dysfunctional? Well, in 2022, you had Matt Patricia and Joe Judge,

Starting point is 00:16:05 you had that entire mess. In 2023, you had the Bill Belichick versus Gerard Mayo dynamic, which my buddy Greg Bedard reported about in depth in real time back in 2023, and Belichick and Mayo, not necessarily getting along, not speaking a lot. And then we found out why because Gerard Mayo had this promotion worked within his contract by Robert Kraft. So you had the Belichick Mayo dynamic. you had Belichick and the crafts, that relationship kind of boiling over.

Starting point is 00:16:41 And then in 2024, you had the Gerard Mayo promotion to head coach and the debacle that ensued. So dysfunction, not a little bit off, not a little bit of trouble, dysfunction, fundamentally broken. Now, I'm not excusing the 2024 off season.

Starting point is 00:17:02 And some people still believe that I just excused the 2024 off season. I don't do that. My prior podcast, I did independently everything, Pat's. I gave Elliott Wolf a failing grade, a failing grade going back to 2024. That was a bad off season. There's no other way around it. There's just not.

Starting point is 00:17:28 However, my beef, my beef the entire time that when we look back to the 2024 off season, My beef is just I would have liked to see, if not loved to see. Elliot Wolf do his job and his job only with the correct infrastructure. The fact is that wasn't the case in 2024. The infrastructure was messy. Elliot Wolf was not only tasked to do his job because he had a head coach who was not even close to being ready to be that kind of guy in the the league. He just wasn't. He wasn't ready to lead a program. Some of that is on Robert Kraft. Some of that is on Gerard Mayo, not doing the homework, not leaving New England, going to other

Starting point is 00:18:14 jobs to learn and to meet new people. Gerard Mayo had no network outside of New England, not many connections outside of New England. He apparently had no detailed or clear vision as to what types of players that he wanted. I mean, if you just reasonably look at that situation in 2024, again, Elliot Wolf failed. But if Elliot Wolf passed the test in 2024, that would say so much about Elliot Wolf's ability to compartmentalize, handle chaos, handle doing multiple jobs at the same time while also being the shot caller for the first time of an NFL team in your career. It's a lot going on.

Starting point is 00:19:01 You had an unknown head coach. You had lots of quote unquote new on the coaching. staff. You had an unapproven quarterback, even when you eventually drafted Drake May, he was unproven. You're coming off a four-win season. So free agency was an uphill climb, which is why you signed mostly your own guys, the Kyle Duggers and Ramandre Stevenson's and Michael Wenus. And then the draft, if you don't know what types of players your coaching staff wants, you're throwing darts. You're throwing darts at positions. And you're hoping for best. Again, that is not to excuse

Starting point is 00:19:37 Elliot Wolfe's bad off season. It's to add context and to understand the situation that he was thrown into, which was less than ideal, far less than ideal. This is also to shine a light on Mike Vrable and how good he has been

Starting point is 00:19:54 in his first year plus because the fact is Vrable flipped this program. He took the dysfunction of the three prior years he walked through that door, and he turned it into a fantastic culture, a team that got to the Super Bowl. Mike Vrable flipped this program.

Starting point is 00:20:17 And frankly, I said this on the Badaard podcast recently. I don't care where Elliot Wolf sits on the totem pole. We know that Mike Vrable makes the final call. And Mike Vrable deserves the vast majority of the credit for last off season, and he will deserve the vast majority of credit. or criticism for this offseason, seeing how the draft unfolds and how it impacts the actual on-field product. That's how this works.

Starting point is 00:20:45 The final call gets the credit, gets the praise, gets to criticism. Elliot Wolf, whether he's second, third, fourth, fifth, tenth, in power now, in reality, not what his title says. It doesn't matter to me because last offseason was a really good offseason. And as far as this free agency period has gone, I'm fine with it. Now we look towards the draft. But I do think that this is a comment, this is a quote from Elliott Wolf that should not be ignored. Because I take it seriously.

Starting point is 00:21:19 And it really gives us context to how bad things were behind closed doors in the organization, 22, 23, and 24. And I think makes us even more thankful for the job that Mike Vrable did and continues to do. We should all be thrilled that Mike Grable. Vrable is the head coach of the New England Patriots. Speaking of Mike Vrable, he discussed Drake May's homework, Stefan Diggs's absence, and more coming up next. This is Lockdown Patriots, part of the Lockdown Podcast Network, your team every day.

Starting point is 00:21:57 Don't forget to like, comment, and subscribe. Some important leftovers from Mike Vrable's time with the media in Arizona. We did the mailbag yesterday. I wanted to slide in a couple of more thoughts from the head coach when he sat down, earlier this week. Number one, Vrable was asked about what Drake May needs to do to improve in 2026. And Vrable said, look, physically, he doesn't have to do really anything. Physically, he's ready, physically he's there. Vrable made it a point that May has to improve at the line of scrimmage.

Starting point is 00:22:30 Now, what does that mean? I believe it means that, you know, if you look at some of the issues that May had in the postseason, especially in the Super Bowl, teams tended to feast on the offensive tells and tendencies, especially the Seahawks. And so, you know, sending a corner the very last second from a spot where Drake May wasn't even thinking that corner would be sent. You know, the pre-snap stuff,

Starting point is 00:22:58 what do you see as the quarterback pre-snap? That's the challenge. That's the homework that May has received from Vrable and this coaching staff. Get better at the line of scrimmage. Be ready to audible. be ready to set your protections in the right spots so we can function at a higher level, more consistency moving forward.

Starting point is 00:23:21 Secondly, Vrable had much different expectations than Robert Kraft when he was asked about 2026. Now, we discussed Robert Kraft earlier this week. I was actually surprised that Kraft tempered expectations about 2026, talking about how tough the schedule is going to be, how, you know, They had exceeded expectations in 2025. Here's what Vrable said about the team's goals heading into 2026. Championships will remain the goal.

Starting point is 00:23:54 That will never change. Appreciate Roberts' support, but we want to win the division. We want to host playoff games. And we want to compete for championships. We'll play whoever we have to play. We understand what this looks like. We're going to play the division winner's schedule.

Starting point is 00:24:11 And that's how it goes. unquote. Love it. Love it. It's a different audience. Robert Kraft is talking to a different audience than Mike Vrable. Now, both of them are talking to the fans, both of them are talking to the media, but more importantly, Robert Kraft is not necessarily talking to the players. Mike Frable is. Mike Frable's responsibility is to send the message to the players. Talk to the locker room. Tell them what the expectations are. And when you're talking to the locker room, you're selling them on the program. You're selling them on what you need to do to win a championship. That is the goal in professional sports. So Rabel's not trying to placate to the fan base or

Starting point is 00:25:00 try to placate to the media. This is a direct message to his team. And this is the consistency of messaging. And this ties into the last. segment about, you know, flipping the culture, building something that players can believe in. And it has a lot to do with messaging. Aim high. Motivate the guys to exceed expectations again. 2025 was great. Why can't we do it again in 2026?

Starting point is 00:25:30 If Mike Vrable walked into the locker room around camp time and said, guys, we're just hoping to make the playoffs. Yeah, I know that we made the game. the Super Bowl last year. But have you seen the schedule? Have you seen that schedule? Take a look at that schedule. It's pretty rough.

Starting point is 00:25:51 Not so sure we're going to get there again. That's not what he's going to say. He's the head coach. He's building belief within that room. Championships are the goal. Hosting playoff games. That's the goal. Get to the playoffs, win the division,

Starting point is 00:26:10 host playoff games. Win a championship. Consistent messaging from up top. That's what I want. I'm sure that's what you want. Some thoughts on Stefan Diggs also stood out to me. And the absence of Diggs. Vrable said, this is according to Mike Reese, quote, it's literally about targets, the efficiency. The efficiency in which he was able to catch the ball was impressive.

Starting point is 00:26:37 So whether that's Drake's accuracy, ball location, or Steph's ability to catch it, that's something that will have to recreate. I'm not worried about the catches and the overall production. We just have to be very mindful of the efficiency. So why was Stefan Diggs so efficient? How did he help the offensive passing games efficiency? Number one, contested catches. Diggs was really good with contested catches.

Starting point is 00:27:05 Now, not always downfield. He had a couple of those downfield, right? They weren't always downfield. Most of them weren't downfield. But still, a contested catch is a contested catch. In traffic, defensive back draped all over you, hands catches. I mean, just difficult catches. That's another area.

Starting point is 00:27:23 So contested catches, difficult catches. Maybe Drake May did not throw a perfect pass to digs. And he had to make some kind of adjustment. I mean, think back to the, it was an unbelievable pass by Drake May. but the touchdown against the Texans in the playoffs by Diggs. That is just a crazy catch. The catch in the corner of the end zone. Was that against Tampa?

Starting point is 00:27:47 I think it was against Tampa, right? At the end of the first half, that crazy catch in the corner of the end zone, it's covered well. Hands catch taps his toes in bounds before he goes out. You know, so it's the contested catches, the difficult catches, catches on third and fourth down. And so, you know, you don't want to

Starting point is 00:28:07 replace Diggs's production with more throws and targets. You know, you don't want Romeo Dobbs to have the same type of season that Diggs just had, but Dobbs gets like 25, 30 more targets because that's not the type of efficiency you're looking for. That's what Vrabel's paying attention to, the efficiency, not the statistics. What do you get done with the opportunities you are given? Finally, Mike Vrable on the run game. This is from Taylor Ciles.

Starting point is 00:28:43 Vrable says the Patriots explosive runs last season hit some of the ground games and efficiencies, noting how those inconsistencies affected their ability to use play slash run action. I completely agree. House calls count, right? When Trayvion Henderson takes it 70 yards to the house, it's a great play, explosive run.

Starting point is 00:29:03 We're all losing our minds. He takes it to the house. to see it. But those types of runs, they can mislead you about the consistency or inconsistency of the run game. Because if you pop two or three of those runs and you end up with 120 rushing yards on the day, yes, those runs count and they should count. But we're talking down to down. And that's what Vrabel is focused on. Again, efficiency, down to down productivity, down-to-down run game. So your run game isn't just one big hit

Starting point is 00:29:36 and then the next 10 runs are misses. You've got to be able to have that down-to-down consistency. And when you look back at the running game from the Patriots last year, next-gen stats, the Patriots had the 10th highest stuff rate in the league, runs going nowhere. In short-yardage, which we've talked about,

Starting point is 00:29:58 the Patriots were 26th in Rush, EPA, 26th and Rush EPA in short yardage situations in 2025. And they had the 20th ranked offense in the red zone. If you can run the football more consistently, the stuffed percentage rate will go down. That stuffed rate will go down. The Rush EPA and short yardage will be much better than 26th in the league. Your red zone offense will be better than 20th. So yeah, it's great that you can hit a big run every once in a

Starting point is 00:30:31 while, but what are you doing? Down to down, quarter to quarter, half to half, week to week. And adding Reggie Gilliam and Julian Hill and Elijah Verit Tucker, all of that is to focus on better run

Starting point is 00:30:47 game, more efficient, more consistent, while keeping that explosivity. All right, that wraps up this edition of Lockdown Patriots. Thank you for making us your first listen and for being in every day. Reach out to me on Twitter at Nick C-Radio. Don't forget to throw a comment in on the YouTube channel, hit that like button and subscribe.

Starting point is 00:31:05 And if you never miss an episode, the Everydayer Club is built for you. Get Lockdown Patriots, ad free, plus members-only discord access and more. Head to Lockdownpatriots.com or check the link in the show notes to learn more. Have a great weekend and we will see you next time.

Locked On Patriots - Daily Podcast On The New England Patriots - Pivot: Should Patriots Target Kyle Pitts If A.J. Brown Trade Doesn’t Happen?

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