Locked On Patriots - Daily Podcast On The New England Patriots - Turning Point Tuesday: Are the Patriots Contenders, Again? - 11/17/2020

Episode Date: November 17, 2020

As the New England Patriots continue to savor their 23-17 victory over the Baltimore Ravens on Sunday Night, the question of whether they are back in contention for a playoff spot is still to be answered. On this Turning Point Tuesday, host Mike D’Abate is joined by Wayne Harvey of 92.9 The Ticket, ESPN Radio in Bangor, ME. The pair discuss the Patriots chances of making the playoffs, the Pats’ place in the Boston sports echelon, and Mike provides his analysis of Sunday Night’s win over Baltimore.Support Us By Supporting Our Sponsors! EchelonRight now, you can try any Echelon Fitness equipment at home for 30 days. Go to EchelonFit.com/NFLBuilt BarBuilt Bar is a protein bar that tastes like a candy bar. Go to builtbar.com and use promo code “LOCKEDON,” and you’ll get 20% off your next order.MyBookieINVEST IN YOUR INTUITION. USE PROMO CODE LOCKEDON AND DOUBLE YOUR FIRST DEPOSIT. NEW PLAYERS GET UP TO $1,000 IN FREE PLAY - DESIGNED TO ADD MORE EXCITEMENT TO THE SPORTS YOU LOVE AND THE GAMES YOU BET. YOUR WINNING SEASON BEGINS TODAY...ONLY AT MYBOOKIE!BuiltGoVisit BuiltGO.com and use promo code “LOCKED,” and you’ll get 20% off your next order.Door DashRight now, our listeners can get $5 off and zero delivery fees on their first order of $15 or more, when you download the DoorDash app and enter code LOCKEDON.SimpliSafeGet 30% off SimpliSafe plus a free security camera today by visiting SimpliSafe.com/lockedonnfl Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

You are Locked On Patriots, your daily New England Patriots podcast. Part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day. Hello to all of you Foxborough faithful. You are now locked in to the Lockdown Patriots podcast. It is Turning Point Tuesday here on your daily home for news notes and analysis, infused with the occasional opinion on your six-time Super Bowl champions, the New England Patriots. Lockdown Patriots is presented today by Pepsi, made for football watching.

This football season will be different, and Pepsi is here to get you ready for game day, no matter how you watch this season. Pepsi is the refreshment you need to power through game day and become a member of the League of Football Watchers. Because Pepsi isn't made for those who play the game, it's made for those who watch it. Pepsi, made for football watching. Hey, Pats Nation, how you doing? Today is Tuesday, made for football. Watch it. Hey, Pats Nation, how you doing? Today is Tuesday,

November 17th. My name is Mike DeBate, your host of the Locked On Patriots podcast, which of course is a proud part of the Locked On Podcast Network, your team every day. And folks, your team every day means your questions, your comments, your feedback, very much encouraged and greatly appreciated. Feel free

to share that feedback anytime by reaching out to me and following me on Twitter at M-D-A-B-A-T-E-F-P-C. And while you're out there doing some Tuesday traveling through the Twitterverse, please be sure to follow the Lockdown Patriots account as well at L-O underscore Patriots. Patriots fans, I know all of you out there continue to bask in the glow of the Pats' 23-17 victory over the Baltimore Ravens on Sunday night. And I don't blame you one bit. This was a the glow of the Pats 23-17 victory over the Baltimore Ravens on Sunday night. And I don't blame you one bit. This was a solid win for the Pats. There's a lot to like on both sides of the ball and the way they played. And it definitely gives all of us here

in Patriots Nation a lot of enthusiasm about this team and maybe even a little bit more optimism than we had just one week ago at this time. After all, a victory over what many consider to be an elite team in the NFL right now has everyone believing that the Pats can play with anybody. And if they can play with anybody, they can rattle off victories. Anything becomes possible, and all of a sudden this team might be looking at contending for a playoff spot. But is it too premature or even too aggressive to label Sunday's win as a turning point in

the 2020 NFL season? Well, folks, that is the very question we are going to address here today on Locked On Patriots. It's Turning Point Tuesday. And for starters, I'll be providing some of my thoughts and observations when it comes to the strategy, personnel, and play execution that we saw on Sunday. Was both the offense and the defensive strategy that we saw on Sunday only the beginning of what's to come with the Patriots?

I believe that it is. And in just a moment, as the great Don would say, I will give you my reasons. But turning points aren't just about logistics and X's and O's that you see on the field. A lot of it is about mindset and attitude, and some of it even spills over into the fan base. Was Sunday's win over Baltimore the turning point for the team, the media, even the fan base to start believing that this team is a legitimate playoff contender. Well, when it comes to answering questions like this, those that deal with the pulse

of Patriots Nation, who better to assist us in answering that question than someone who checks the pulse of Pats Nation each and every day on Sports Talk Radio. Wayne Harvey, host of ESPN Radio's 92.9 The Ticket, which is ESPN Radio's affiliate in Bangor, Maine, joins me here today on the hot seat. And we will talk about Sunday's big win and whether or not he believes it tells us anything about the Patriots' playoff chances. I'll also ask Wayne who has impressed him most on the Patriots' roster thus far, and whether that person or persons will continue to impress him as the season progresses. And last but certainly not least, we'll talk about what might end up being the biggest

turning point in the history of the franchise. That's right, folks. I'm talking about Tom Brady's deflection down to Tampa Bay. Wayne doesn't just cover the Patriots for 92-9. He's well-versed in the entire New England sports scene. And I will ask Wayne whether or not he believes that Brady's decision to migrate down south was the turning point in the Patriots' popularity maybe leveling off a little bit when it comes to the three remaining top professional sports,

the Red Sox in baseball, the Celtics in basketball, and the Bruins in hockey. With his daily dealings in Boston sports, where does he see the Patriots in the pantheon of the New England sports landscape? Folks, on Turning Point Tuesday, we have a ton to cover. Logistics on the field, hypotheticals off it, an action-packed agenda, so sit tight and settle in, and in just a moment, Wayne Harvey of 92.9 The Ticket will join me to talk a little Patriots turning points. But before Wayne joins me here on the Lockdown Patriots Hot Seat, I wanted to give you my

own thoughts on why I believe the Patriots have reached a turning point in the 2020 season. And I'm going to leave their playoff chances and their place in Boston sports to the discussion I'll have with Wayne in just a moment. But when it comes to logistics, meaning X's and O's on the field, I think the Patriots showed some solid strategy and game planning on Sunday. And I believe that a lot of what we saw the Patriots do against the Ravens, both on offense and on defense, will continue to be seen on the field, and I think it's going to give them their best chance for success as we head into the home stretch of the 2020 season. We'll start on the offensive side of the ball, and one of the things that impressed me most was Cam Newton being cool under pressure. That's something Cam has struggled with at times throughout the season, and Baltimore definitely knew this. They were going to send a blitz on almost every down, try to take away the

checkdowns, and then force the Patriots to beat them elsewhere. But on Sunday night, two things prevented that from happening. And no, folks, the weather is not one of them. Even though it was a factor in this game, I want to give a lot of credit to some solid game planning and great execution by the Patriots. Let's start with when Baltimore did send some extra pass rushers. Cam Newton's stats under pressure show that he went 9 for 12 for 105 yards, and of course he threw the touchdown to Rex Burkhead under pressure as well. Those stats are a marked improvement over what Cam had just two or three weeks ago. The reason? He's gaining familiarity with the offense. He's recognizing the pre-snap reads. He's identifying the blitzes when they're coming. He's completing the checkdowns quickly,

and that's led to him finding a much easier time utilizing the running game to his advantage. Even when Cam has been good this year, there were always still some areas where he lacked in field awareness. I didn't see that at all on Sunday. Cam looked much more comfortable in the offense, and for that reason, the Patriots ran a much more efficient offensive game plan. And I look for that type of game plan to continue, one that makes Cam comfortable and efficient in the way he runs this offense. The other big reason why I believe the Patriots have turned the corner offensively is because of the play of Damian Harris.

Damian had a career high on Sunday night, 121 yards on 22 carries, and he did so against one of the better run defenses in the NFL. He's got great vision, very tough, very physical, and because of that, he's running the ball with ease right now. And I know that Damian is very high on all of your fandom boards right now, and rightfully so. But I wouldn't be telling the full story if I didn't say that part of the reason why Damian is such an effective runner is because he's getting amazing blocking from the fullback position. Jakob Johnson has been excellent this year, folks. And on Sunday, I thought he had one of his best run-blocking games of the year. You heard our good friend, the Count of Murphy Fisto himself,

the marvelous Murph. And yeah, folks, I'll continue to give him nicknames each and every time I take the microphone because the man is that damn good at his job. But all kidding aside, Murph mentioned Jakob Johnson yesterday, and he is a big part of that. One of the prettier blocks that Jakob threw in this game was on Malik Harrison. That sprang Damian free for a 25-yard run,

also made a nice juggling catch in the rain for a big first down, so Johnson continues to be a big part of what the Patriots are doing on offense. And his presence in the running game has helped not only Damian Harris, but also Rex Burkhead and even James White out of the backfield. Of course, in the passing game, what can you say about Jacoby Myers that hasn't already been said? Precision routes, great hands, and now we know he can even drop back and toss one into the end zone.

And the best part of this is that all of these factors came together to help the Patriots turn a big corner on offense on Sunday night. A cool, comfortable, and efficient Cam Newton running the quarterback position, a speedy and tough Damian Harris getting the job done on the ground, and Jacoby Myers out there reliably catching passes, all bodes well for a Patriots team that is starting to find somewhat of a groove on offense. Of course, the constant throughout all of this with the Patriots offense has been their offensive line. And as Murph and I said yesterday here on the pod,

the offensive line is, was, and will continue to be the crown jewel of this Patriots offense. And while the emergence of the skill position players may have helped the Patriots turn the corner, there wouldn't be a corner there to begin with if it wasn't for the offensive line building a solid foundation. But the Patriots offense isn't the only unit on this team that's turned a corner or experienced a turning point this year. One of my biggest takeaways from Sunday night's game was some of the looks and personnel we saw from the defense. And I think their performance against the Ravens will continue to help set them up for success as the season progresses. The first thing that I saw from the Patriots defense on Sunday that really impressed me

was flooding the field with players like Kyle Duggar, Adrian Phillips, Jonathan Jones, Jason McCourty. Versatile players that can play multiple positions. Since Bill Belichick took over as head coach of this team, they've always prided themselves on being one of the most versatile teams in the league, mostly on defense. By most accounts, Kyle Duggar was the standout on Sunday night, and it's really hard to argue with that. The more I went back and watched footage on Sunday night's game,

the more I was impressed by the versatility that Kyle showed, especially given the fact that he's a rookie. And Murph talked about this a little bit yesterday. His knowledge both of the field and where he needs to be on that field really is something that's showing wisdom beyond his years. And that knowledge has helped him to play multiple positions. Nesson's Doug Kai had pointed out in one of his recent columns that Kyle actually played slot corner on Sunday for a good chunk of time. And as I went back and looked at some of the footage, he's absolutely right on this. As the Patriots dropped into zone coverage, which was usually a cover three and dime personnel, Kyle showed a tremendous amount of poise and really

helped to neutralize what Lamar Jackson does well in the passing game. And that's fine Mark Andrews. Duggar was all over Mark Andrews on Sunday night. And even though the stat sheet will tell you that Andrews had seven catches for 61 yards, a lot of that came in zone coverage. When Kyle was covering him, Andrews found it very difficult. Duggar was just as effective in being that hybrid linebacker and coming up and helping defend against the run. On at least three different occasions, he had impact plays on Lamar Jackson, Gus Edwards,

and J.K. Dobbins. This type of versatility allows the Patriots to be able to play in a number of different defensive sets. They may not employ Kyle the same way as they did against Lamar Jackson and the Ravens. Let's face it, there aren't many quarterbacks that can do what Lamar does, and a lot of what they did on Sunday was tailor-made to stop Lamar Jackson, but the fact that Kyle is more than capable of playing safety, a little bit of a slot corner, and even coming up and playing a hybrid linebacker, allows other defenders to be able to move more freely throughout the field.

We saw that at the linebacker position, especially when it came to Josh Uche, who I think also had a very good game at outside linebacker. He had the one sack, another quarterback hurry. He was in on 16 pass rushes, which I think is where the Patriots will employ him most. But we even saw him take snaps both in the run defense and also dropped into coverage a few times. If the Patriots continue to utilize Chase Winovich in the same fashion, then again, New England might be looking at a pretty fierce pass rush tandem with both Uche and Winovich, and that'll allow the interior of the defensive line to really shore up and be a solid presence

when it comes to defending the run. So folks, the adjustments and improvements in strategy that we saw on Sunday night might just end up being on-field turning points for the New England Patriots from an offensive and a defensive standpoint. But the one thing that I want to remind you is just because these turning points on the field may lead to greater success that the Patriots have in individual plays, there's still a lot that has to come together for this to be a turning point in their season. Meaning, can a team with a 4-5 record that currently ranks 10th in the conference

end up making a playoff push? Well, adjustments on the field are only part of that. And in just a moment, Wayne Harvey of 92.9 The Ticket, ESPN Radio's affiliate in Bangor, Maine, will join me here on the hot seat to discuss whether or not the turning points on the field will lead to a turning point in the standings for your New England Patriots. This and more when the Locked On Patriots podcast continues. But first, all of this talk about turning points and adjustments on the field may have

you sitting there wondering whether or not you could possibly put on the shoulder pads and take the field for the New England Patriots. Well, folks, I hate to break it to you, but thanks to a lack of natural athleticism or commitment or overbearing sports parents, fewer than 1% of 1% of 1% of people will ever play professional football. It's true. But instead of entering the NFL, they've joined another league, the League of Football Watchers. This season has been and will continue to be different, but Pepsi is here to get you ready for game day no matter how you watch. Pepsi is the refreshment you need to power through

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I'm Mike DeBate, host of the Locked On Patriots podcast. And folks, if there's one phrase that we've heard a lot of during 2020, it's quote unquote new normal. And some may embrace that phrase, some may find it annoying. But one thing most of us can agree on is that it's true. I'm sure that we can all relate to our classrooms, our workplaces, even our places of recreation are pretty much all the same place now. And because of that, time can be more of an illusion than a luxury. Between never-ending laundry cycles and incoming emails, you've got plenty on your to-do list.

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Any, any time. And it's always my honor, always my privilege to join you guys on 92.9 The Ticket. Folks, I highly recommend checking out the morning show. One of the best you'll find anywhere in sports media. To be a small part of that and to be able to contribute to that every now and then is truly an honor, one of the great honors of this business for me so bud patriots nation is still riding the wave of the pats 23 to 17 victory over the baltimore ravens and uh you saw the game as well as i did they might literally be riding a wave after that massive wind and rain that went through foxborough

weather i've ever seen uh you know in a football game. And it worked to the Patriots' advantage, say what you will. But the Pats seemed pretty well-versed to be able to play through it. But any way you look at it, this is a big win for the Patriots. It came against a tough team at a time where I think they really needed it the most. And some are even starting to call this a turning point of the season. And that's why I'm calling today Turning Point Tuesday. Now, in the previous segment, Wayne, I outlined some of the ways that the Patriots have turned things around on the field,

both from an offensive and defensive perspective from the X's and O's aspect of it. But Sunday night seemed to turn the tide when it comes to fan buy-in and even those that cover the team, like myself, starting to think that the chances of this team competing might be a little bit better than we had originally thought. Wayne, you always have your finger on the pulse of Patriots Nation. And just from what you've seen and heard in the past day or so, both from the fan base and from the local experts that you speak to on a regular basis, would you characterize

this win as a turning point for the Pats? Not yet. it's close though because i you know this team is so confusing to me because you see them struggle against the jets a team that they really should have handled but then they come back and they beat a team in baltimore that everyone was drooling over at the beginning of the season. And, yeah, this is a weird year. 2020 doesn't make any sense. But to see the Patriots beat the Ravens like that in the fashion that they did and controlling the ball and really kind of beating the Ravens in their own game, I'm still kind of confused as to what Patriots team I'm watching.

But I wouldn't quite see it's a turning point yet. If they get to the, you know, if they, they should beat Houston this weekend. So if they get to that one and then they beat Arizona, now they've got a four game win streak. That's when your turning point comes. You enter into December, you'd be six and five and kind of knocking on the door. I think we're close to the turning point. We're right at that edge, but we're not there yet. Yeah. And I think you make an interesting point. And something that I talked about a little bit in my opening to today's podcast was the turning point that happens on the field in terms of how this team is going to

employ their offense, how they're going to employ their defense, the personnel packages that they might be using doesn't always translate to a turning point in terms of wins and losses and the record that you're going to see. And I'm glad that you made that distinction because that's something that I tried to do early on, and I think you definitely articulated that very well. And I appreciate that because that is, I think, something that the fan base needs to hear.

Maybe some of the pundits that we talk to all the time need to hear it as well, that it doesn't necessarily mean that just because it might have been a turning point on the field, meaning that it's going to be a turning point moving forward and wins and losses. There's still six teams with six wins in the AFC above them, and they've got to jump at least two of them to get into a playoff picture. So there's still two wins away,

and that's a lot of work to get done heading into week 11 of an nfl season absolutely you're every 100 right and one of those teams that they'd have to leapfrog is a team within their own division the miami dolphins are playing great football down in south beach uh well coached by brian flores to a tug of a low it definitely looks to be the present and the future uh for that team And Miami just continues to get brighter and brighter. Buffalo Bills playing solid there at the top of the division right now. So a lot still to come for the New England Patriots. So then based on that, the take on this team has been up and down all year.

I've seen it. I've covered it all from this team is going to contend for a conference title after the win against Miami to open the season to, well, maybe they're not so good after a couple of questionable performances against Seattle and then against Kansas City. And then we got the, well, they're trash. They need to tank. This team is terrible. They're lucky if they win two games. And now we have the current state of affairs, which kind of that lloyd christmas so you're

telling me there's a chance type thing and we've kind of we've kind of danced around this a little bit but based on what you observe from your listeners and you've built upon this but i'm going to ask you have you talked about this but i'm going to ask you to build upon it just a little bit from what you've observed from your listeners and the experts with whom you speak on a daily basis, do you think that the playoffs are a reasonable chance for the Patriots? Not necessarily if you expect them to make the playoffs, but do you think that fans and maybe some of the media are tilting at windmills here when you're talking about a team that could compete for a playoff spot?

Yeah, I kind of do. I think people have their sights set a little too high, considering what we're already seeing elsewhere in the AFC. Because, again, you've got to deal with those six teams that have six wins, and the two of them are directly in front of you, still on the outside looking in. I think what's the easiest and best and most kind way to say this? I think a lot of the people that are pundits are also fans,

and they don't look objectively at what the schedule looks like, what the injury situation looks like, the COVID opt-out situations look like. There's not a whole lot of depth on this Patriots roster. And while the offensive line is good, we don't really know anything other than that. There's question marks all over the field. I think saying they're heading into the playoffs or if they win this game, if they beat Houston, they've won three in a row, and they're on the right track, and this is where they're heading, that may be a little bit of a rosy outlook at this point, in my opinion.

I think realistically they could challenge. I think it's optimistic to think that they can easily, or all they have to do is control their own destiny. And they got to get in. They still have some other people that have to help them out to get there. Absolutely. And again, we talked about Miami being one of those six and three teams.

Miami is a playoff team right now, two teams that are sitting at six and three that are currently on the outside looking in would be Tennessee and Cleveland. And two of those teams are, you know, Cleveland starting to play very well. Tennessee sputtered a little bit, but we know their prowess on both sides of the ball. That's a team that can come on as of late. So bringing a little sense of realism to the show today, Wayne, and I do appreciate that because it's a perspective that does need to be, you know, at least heard and at least

absorbed. And there is a lot that needs to happen for the Patriots. So you can ride the wave of a nice win on Sunday night, which is there's no question about it. But the Patriots still have a long way to go if they want to even try to compete for a playoff spot. And that's not something we've had to say in a long, long time here in New England, my friend. Even after a win, it still looks like a bleak position to make the playoffs, and that's something we're not used to. I think people may go back and start kicking themselves

and looking back at that loss against Denver on October 18th. That's the one that may come back to bite them. That's a game they should have won, and they dropped them to 2-3, and it really kind of changed the flow for those next couple weeks. At the end of Week 17, it may be one game that has the Patriots on the outside, and that's probably the one. Yeah, it probably will be the one. And I know a lot of people are talking about,

oh, Seattle, if Cam Newton doesn't get stuffed on the one, all of a sudden they make it in. Maybe they're on their way to win that game. A lot of people talk about the Buffalo game, where Cam Newton's fumble may have caused them to lose that game, where those games could have gone either way. I think the Denver game is one that does come back to them. I think that is probably one they should have had.

They're home. This is a game that, unfortunately, was a very difficult game for them to play. They had it postponed, you know, by COVID. And so much happened as a result of that game that that may end up being the epitaph for the season. And we hope not in Patriots Nation, but we look at it and it's a good way to realistically look at the second half of the season or at least the second part of the season coming up. Again, my friend, always a blast sharing the microphone with you. It's fun being the host. I kind of like this.

And we've talked about the Pats. It really, really is. I like turning the tables a little bit because you always play the gracious host whenever you host me on the show. And I hope I'm trying to show my hospitality in return. But we've talked about the Patriots this season. But since the departure of Tom Brady, a lot of the region and really the sports world has been wondering if the Pats

popularity would decrease. At four and five this late in the season, Patriots are in unfamiliar territory, but are they still in the driver's seat when it comes to the popular sports teams in this region, folks? In just a moment, 92.9 The Ticket's Wayne Harvey will lend his insight on whether the Patriots are still the most popular ticket in town. More Turning Point Tuesday when the Lockdown Patriots podcast continues. Lockdown listeners, breaks in the action always make me evaluate what I've accomplished and what still needs to be done. And no matter how much remains on your to-do list,

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Let's go! Pat's fans Wayne Harvey of 92.9 The Ticket. We've both agreed that Sunday's win over the Ravens was a good thing for the Patriots in a lot of aspects. Might it end up being the turning point in the Patriots season? A lot of differing opinions on that. But I think we can agree that the biggest turning point of the team's history occurred way back in March and that was when Tom Brady announced his intent to leave New England nearly two decades

in the region he took his talents to Tampa Tom's down there and he's doing very well with the Buccaneers and even though most fans would deny it there was a pretty good exodus uh in terms of members of the fan base that followed tom down to florida and it had many in our industry and really all over the fan base worldwide wondering if the days of the pats being the hottest attraction in new england had passed us by would the prime spot now be occupied by the red sox by the celtics by the bruins will the patriots finally be taken off of that pedestal? Wayne, talk radio is generally the voice of the region, and your show is one of the best in terms of bringing all of New England together, not just Boston, but all of New England. And I'm sure that your fans

and listeners are quite vocal about their desire for Patriots coverage and where it ranks among the want of the coverage for the other major sports teams. In your opinion, my friend, has there been a turn of the tide when it comes to Boston sports fandom or are the Pats still the king of the mountain? I mean, that's a really good question because, and I think it depends almost on where you are because in Maine, there's still a Red Sox nation is huge. And I don't know if the Red Sox in the state of Maine, in my area, in the northern, eastern, central part of the state, if they were ever knocked off the number one point, even with this Patriots great run.

I would – but that success of the Patriots and there were so many people that changed their license plates to TB12, to GoPads, to whatever it was. If the Patriots didn't knock off the Red Sox in that run of 20 years, I don't think anything can. But I think New England is always going to be Red Sox country. Yeah, in a lot of ways, that's interesting because you take a look at southern New England, where I'm from, at the very tip of southern New England and Rhode Island. And obviously, you know, we're closer to Foxborough than we are to Boston. And Patriots Nation has definitely eclipsed coverage of the Red Sox here, eclipsed coverage of the Celtics, of the Bruins. The Bruins were probably, you could make the argument that in the heyday of Boston sports and in the Red Sox that

the Bruins and Red Sox were very close in terms of fandom even the Celtics Patriots may have even been a distant fourth at one point but the arrival of Bill Belichick the arrival of Tom Brady even a few seasons before that with Bledsoe and with Parcells tended to get the Patriots back into the national spotlight and really I think increased the stronghold of the fan base here. But since the Brady and Belichick era really took off, it's been mostly Patriots. You can count the number of Patriots jackets, the number of Patriots hats in the region. Maine has always been an intriguing state for me because I always looked at that as solid Red Sox country. I think you can really make the argument that Maine may be the most loyal state when it comes to the Red Sox.

And I include Massachusetts in that as well, because in some popular opinion polls, the Patriots have outpolled the Red Sox in terms of popularity in the state of Massachusetts. But Maine always remains that stronghold. So the more north that you get, the perspectives change and the perspectives are different. I still think there is still a lot of groundswell for the New England Patriots here, but things could get interesting. If you get a couple of seasons where the Pats either miss the playoffs or are not in contention, we've seen that with the Red Sox kind of being up and down, having World Series caliber seasons where they've won and then following it up in a season in which they missed the playoffs completely or a last place finish. It's been a little bit up and down to me.

I think that's a very, very interesting case study. And who knows, maybe we'll discuss that at length even more here on the airwaves of lockdown Patriots. But I'm glad you brought that perspective because that is something that intrigues a lot of Patriots fans to wonder where they rank and to hear in that area, especially in New England, that it's still Red Sox country in a lot of ways is something that I think is interesting. And our fans that listen to Locked on Red Sox will be really, really happy to hear that.

Gabrielle will definitely be happy to hear that one. I know she's listening and it'll be something interesting as she hosts our Locked on Red Sox podcast. It'll be something that I'm sure she'll want to bring up in the coming days or so. Well, one of the things up here, too, is even when the Red Sox were struggling before 2004, when they would have bad seasons, the Red Sox were still in the forefront.

When the Patriots were struggling in bad seasons in the Grogan-Eason era, there weren't a whole lot of public Red Sox fans, public Patriots fans. But the Red Sox fans were still very open and adamant about their Red Sox fandom before the titles came in. It did increase, you know, with the Pink Hat Red Sox fans, and I think you saw with the exodus of the Brady fans to Tampa Bay of,

well, I'm rooting for Tom Brady, I'm a TB12 guy. I think you saw some of that too. And I think the true fans remain now for both franchises. But I do, I think the growth of the Patriots has been outstanding. Like you said, I think they were in fourth and now if they're not one, they're 1A. Yeah. And I would definitely agree with that, especially with all of the success. And of course, it always helps that the NFL is still the king of the mountain when it comes to the national spotlight in professional sports.

You know, that does, that drives an awful lot. And it has penetrated this area, even if technically it is still Red Sox country, the NFL still holds the key when it comes to sports coverage throughout the country. So I think that has, you know, definitely helped a lot as well, but it is locked on Patriots. And I do want to bring this back to a Patriots perspective. And I think we'll probably end our conversation today on just asking you in terms of what you've

seen from the team this year, from a Patriots perspective, who has been the most impressive player or players or coaching staff, whatever has impressed you most about this Patriots team so far? And do you think it'll be that same person or group or aspect that continues to impress you as the season progresses? Or do you have your eye on someone that's kind of lurking below the surface right now that you think is primed for a pretty big breakout in 2020? Well, I think you could talk to 50 people and get 50 different answers of what you of what they would think in this one uh I have I really enjoy watching Rex Burkhead play uh he has so much he just does a little bit of everything and you know catching that touchdown pass from Jacoby Myers just shows off a little bit more versatility of him and Jacoby Myers

throwing the touchdown pass shows some of the things that he can do. I love the way Harris has been running. But really the key, the most important cog in all of the Patriots' success has got to be the offensive line. Just to see the way that they've developed, the way they've moved. I mean, Tooney moves around seemingly every third play to a different spot on the line, it seems like. And he's successful everywhere he goes. And with Andrews back, I think he is the big difference. I think he's now healthy, 100%

and involved, and I think he controls that offensive line. I would say David Andrews is the most important player for the Patriots. And it's hard to argue that point. I definitely agree with you on the offensive line, and several times here on the airwaves and locked on Patriots, including to open this show today, I've talked about the prowess of the offensive line and what they've been able to do, despite having difficulties where you've had players playing out of position and opt outs and things of that nature. players being on the shelf, a rookie right tackle that is really a guard that's playing right tackle and playing at such a high level that he continues to be among pro football focuses, highest rated players at the position, not just rookies, folks, highest rated players at the position. And Michael Wainu, he's been amazing. Joe Tooney continues to provide the anchors that you need at the guard position. Isaiah Wynn, I thought, has been excellent as a left tackle,

really protecting the blind side of Cam Newton. But it does. It begins and ends with David Andrews. This unit looks so much more comfortable this year. With him in the center position. All due respect to Ted Karras. Who I think did a great job last year. The best he possibly could.

But Andrews is a pro bowler. He is the captain of this team. And there's a reason for it. And he has been nothing but solid. So complete agreement when it comes to the offensive line, and I think that is going to continue to be the ref's factor moving forward. Yeah, I think the tackles, as you mentioned, are just outstanding. If it's not Andrews, if you want to go somewhere else, I think it's either tackle that you want to pick.

Yeah, absolutely, whether it be Wynn or whether it be uh you know obviously uh a way new has been phenomenal and even shock mason is starting to play like the type of player we've needed him to play i thought he had a phenomenal game on sunday night really in the thick of things making blocks making key um you know stops when he needs to and really doing a great job with protection so that offensive line has continued to be great and if if the Patriots are to make a run, if this ends up being the turning point that I've labeled today's show, I think it's going to be because of the offensive line. And I think they're only going to get better now as they're getting healthier

and each of these players are getting more comfortable in their position. Jermaine Illuminor coming back is a big, big factor in that as well. He provides a good amount of depth. And I think the Pats offensive line is definitely looking bright. And we talked about it on your show several times about the departure of Dante Skarnecchia looming large for this team. How would this offensive line look? They've looked pretty well. And that's a testament to Dante having these guys well coached. And of course, Carmen Brasillo and cole popovich doing a great job um you know coaching the line this year in dante's absence wayne what can i say i really appreciate you

taking time out of your busy schedule to come in and lend a perspective i think we all needed to hear on whether or not this is a turning point for the patriots where they currently rank in the grand scheme of things in boston sports and of course, your thoughts on the 2020 Patriots as well. For the benefit of our listeners, my friend, please let everyone know where they can find you, your great work, and let us know what you have coming down on the horizon on 92.9 The Ticket and in any realm where you provide your great insight. You can always follow me on Twitter. Just Wayne Harvey is the easiest Twitter handle in the world to find.

Who knows what I'll be tweeting about there. It could be youth soccer. It could be my dog. It could be what's going on with the Patriots or Celtics or something with UMaine Athletics. You never know what you're going to find there. And if you want to listen to the show, you can either download our app or just go to our website at 929theticket.com,

and you can listen live right there weekdays, Monday through Friday, from 6 to 8 a.m absolutely and folks i could not recommend it highly enough every now and then between this 7 and 8 a.m hour uh you might hear a familiar voice on there from time to time every now and then i have the good fortune of joining wayne and the crew and all kidding aside folks it really is one of the greatest joys of this business to be able to join that great crew and that great show that they do each and every day wayne thanks so much my friends stay safe stay well if i don't speak to you before the holiday please have a great holiday and uh as always we look forward to having you back here on locked on patriots to continue to discuss the very

latest in patriots nation thanks for everything like i. I appreciate it. So to ensure that you do not miss a single second of blending both of these topics together, please be sure to download the Locked On Patriots podcast wherever you get your podcasts. Subscribe to us and follow us on platforms such as Stitcher, Spotify, Google Podcasts, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcasts. Just make sure that you're staying locked into Locked On Patriots. Once again, my name is Mike DeBate. I thank Wayne Harvey for his time, his insight, and his appearance on today's pod. But most of all, I thank you so much for listening and for making Locked On Patriots a daily

part of your New England Patriots coverage. Until tomorrow, stay safe, stay well, continue to be the change you wish to see in the world. Have a great day, everyone.