Magic: The Gathering Drive to Work Podcast - #1363: Online Negativity

Episode Date: July 17, 2026

I use this episode to talk about dealing with negativity online.

I'm pulling out of my driveway. We all know what that means. It's time to another drive to work. Okay, so today's topic is online negativity. But I have a little bit of a preamble to get how I got to this podcast today. So, just a little behind the scenes of my life. My family and I, especially my wife, and I like to watch a lot of television. And among that, we watch some number of reality shows.

But one of the shows that we watch with my youngest daughter, Sarah, is a show called America's Sweethearts. For those that do not know the show, it's on Netflix. It is about the Dallas Cowboy Cheerleaders, also known as the DCC. So the Cowboys obviously are a football team out of Dallas, and they have cheerleaders. And I don't know the history of all of the NFL's cheerleaders. but the DCC go back pretty far. I think back to like the 70s. They go back many, many years.

And it is, there's 36 members of the team, and it is very serious. For those that might think of cheerleading as being some very passive thing done on the side of the field, this is basically a dance team, a very serious dance team. And so,

so my daughter, the reason we watch the show, is my daughter, Sarah, when she's the athlete of the family. For a while, she did competitive gymnastics, then she did competitive dance. And in college, in high school, she did competitive diving.

But there was a period of time when she did competitive cheerleading. And for those that are not aware of competitive cheerleading, it is as much as sport as any sport you can name. If you ever, you probably have seen some stuff online, like there's a lot of people throwing people in the air and making pyramids and I mean essentially

it is churling really is dance it's a very particular kind of dance um but it is dance and so um the Dallas cowboy cheerleaders is a pretty famous you know one would argue probably the most famous of the NFL cheerleaders um and every year there's a huge competition to become like I said There's only 36 slots, and there's a giant competition. So there used to be a show on, I think it was TNT, called Dallas Cowboy Sharellators Making the Grade, or Making the Team, making the team, the DCC, making the team. And we used to watch that.

And then a couple years ago, I think they're in the third season, they stopped doing the show there, and they started doing a show on Netflix called America's Sweetheart. So one of the interesting thing about it is I don't know how many people watch the old show Not nobody, we did, but they got a lot more Being on Netflix just, they're in front of a lot more eyeballs And all of a sudden, I mean, it's not that the DCC wasn't always famous

And wasn't always had some level of exposure But being on Netflix, I don't know the amount But it did way, way, way raised sort of the stakes that they were used to as far as public awareness. And so anyway, I'm watching the latest season of the DCC, of America's Sweethearts with my family. And there's an episode that's talking about them interacting with the public. And the idea essentially is that once upon a time,

they would, they were damn stupid. People were aware they existed. but now online, you know, they have following this all their own. I'm not going to have people that care at all about the football game itself. Obviously, a lot of people care about football. But people who are sort of fans specifically of the DCC and who do a lot of commentary on the DCC. And what has happened, by the way, this is not just Netflix.

I think Netflix is sort of exacerbated things, but also just the nature of social media that people are not just, aware of the team as a whole, they're very aware of individual people on the team. If you watch the... So America's Sweethearts, for those who don't know, it's a documentary. And the idea is, it's, I don't know, seven shows, I think. A lot of the shows are focused on who's going to make the team this year. There's a lot of focus.

But then they spend some amount of time just showing what it's like to be a Dallas Cowboys cheerleader. The show is really well done. As someone who's watched a lot of documentaries and reality show type stuff, it's very well done. And they do a really good job of kind of giving you an insight. Like, what is it like to do this? Which is part of any documentaries. You want to sort of like, okay, you don't know the ins and outs of this, but what's it like to be the ins and outs of this?

And because of that, a lot of people have gotten a lot of spotlight. One of the things about the Dallas Cowboy Chiladers that you find out, if you, like me watch the show, is it's not a full-time job. Like, one of the things that was really interesting, especially on the old show, is you would watch. like most of them have full-time 40-hour jobs, and on top of that job, they then are being a cheerleader. And for a long time, they were paid very, very little, very little.

I mean, enough in which they had to have a full 40-hour job to support themselves. One of the things that happened on the first season of American Sweethearts is they raised the idea that it paid so little became a major throughpoint on the series. And then what you found out in the second, in a series of the show is responding to that, they finally gave them a raise, which was

something like five times what they were making before, which is not that they gave them a huge raise, it's they were paying them nothing before. Very, very little. But anyway, so a lot of people now, in order to sort of pay their bills, are doing

a lot of influencing, that a lot of the DCC, the way they pay their bills, I mean, they get paid something now, a little more they used to, is they do a lot of influencing. So a lot of people are very conscious online. People are very aware of them. Anyway, the reason I bring this all up is they do an episode about all the negativity

they get online. And I've never watched an episode of the Dallas Cowboys cheerleaders that spoke more to my heart than this episode. And that's why I want to talk a little bit about it. I've talked in past podcasts about a little bit about the celebrity. of sort of being someone who's a face people recognize. But I haven't... I really decided this was worth an entire show

because a couple of things. One, I don't think people are necessarily aware of the amount of negativity. And two, it has just gotten worse. The last 10 years... I mean, I've been online for a long time. I've been a public face of magic for a long time. And the vitriol and...

The, you know, it is just really grown. And one of the things that's very interesting is, if you'll notice that like Gavin and I, Gavin Verhe and I are very online. We both do lots of things and we're very public. I tend to do a little more longer form than Gavin doing podcast and articles and my blog. Gavin does a lot more of the short form content.

I'm trying to get more into short. That's where the, I know where the world is moving. I got it. I'm trying to get more into short form content. But anyway, between the two of us, we do a lot of online stuff. But you'll notice there's not a lot of magic people online. They're there. I'm not saying no one else is around.

But one of the things that's really hard, one of the reasons that most people are not that much online is the amount of negativity is really hard. I mean, as they explained on the documentary, which I thought was really interesting, is one of the people they were talking to, said it's like, you know, everybody has insecurities. Everybody worries about things.

And it is sort of like having insecurities and then going online and having hundreds of people go, oh yeah, those insecurities, they're right on. You know, that is, it's very hard. And I know a lot of people in R&D like keep a distance from social media because it is, it can be quite vicious. One of my metaphors is I talk about not wanting to attract the attention of the angry bees. And the interesting thing is I mostly am interacting with magic fans.

Every once in a while, I will post something that gets interests of other communities. Many years ago, I won't get into the details of it, but I posted something. it wasn't even about this other person. I was making some commentary about something that happened in the news and I sort of like made a tiny reference to them. I didn't even tag them

but the community of fans of that thing, some overlap with magic obviously, and it became a thing. And before the end of the day, I had to apologize because I was like, you know, Jess, there was this group that was quite mad at me for something I had said

that they really blew into something I didn't say, but I just because of people even thought there's a possibility, I apologize just because it became a thing. And that is just, I mean, that's not even my normal day to day. I mean, so one of the things that's interesting is, I decided as somebody online, I want to see what people are saying. I make a conscious effort to do that. And there's a couple different places I interact online.

One is my blog. That is my space where, people come to me. And the way that my blog works is people can post messages to me. And then I can respond to them or not respond to them. It's up to me. I can read all the messages. Although I get so many messages.

I don't always read all the messages. Like I get way more messages than I can read. Some days, I try to go on every day. I try to answer questions every day. Every once in a while, I don't. Usually I'm just busy in my personal life for that is true. But usually every day, I try to go online a little bit. And when I say a little bit,

And I just spend like an average of 30 to 40 questions a day. So even me a little bit is quite a bit. So I see that. I'm also on a lot of the social media. I'll be honest. I really don't go on Twitter much anymore. Twitter has gotten so, so mean. It is, it's hard.

It's really hard to function on Twitter. That there's the, one of the things I look for is how much, how much content I'm getting versus how much noise I'm getting, you know what I'm saying? And that one of the things... Oh, anyway, let me finish this and I'll get back. So, I'm on most of the social media is I peeked my head in Twitter, but I'm not on Twitter all that much. Blue Sky, Instagram, TikTok, you know, a little bit on Facebook,

but I... And I also go on stuff like Reddit or, you know, other places where people are commenting. And so I want to hear what people are saying. when I put out a new set and there's new cards, not even I put it out, there's a set we put out, magic puts out a new set. I want to hear what people are thinking.

Even if they're not things I personally, I mean, when I had a special hand in, I'm a little more interested in the average, but in general, I want to hear what people have to say. Do people like it? Do people not like it? You know, part of my job is, I need to understand what I'll call the zeitgeist.

I need to understand what do people think about things? What do people like or dislike? And so I, look, I made an active effort to go out and read. But when that happens, being one of the more public figures on magic, my name gets evoked all the time. One of the things that's really common, for example, is I'm answering questions every day on my blog. Some number of times, and I mean, I know sometimes when I'm going to answer something that I know will get, people will push it in other places. I mean, I'm aware sometimes I answer a question where I know I'm tackling something a little more controversial.

I know it'll go other places. Other times, like, one of the things I find really interesting is I'm just answering a question where the answer is not public. It's been said before. It's the 10th time I've said it. But somehow, the person who reads it that day doesn't know it and feels it's new news and it gets posted on Reddit or other places, other social media. In fact, it's funny.

This is back in the day. This is maybe probably 10 years back. When the Magic brand team used to be structured a little differently. that it is now, back when the Magic Brand team was separate from R&D. Every once in a while, we'd have a new set come out, and I'd answer some question about something not about the new set. And then that would make it to Reddit, and then the brand team are like, why are you talking about not the new set?

Focus on the new set. And I'm like, look, I answered a question giving public information that's been public for months. I had no idea something's going to post this on Reddit because I didn't think this was news. I just, people, I mean, I answered the same question all the time just because not every, My blog is long, so not everybody reads all the questions. So I repeat answering questions all the time. And especially if I haven't answered for a couple months, you may be able to answer something.

So I don't really have control of, like, one of the things about social media is, I have some idea when I'm giving new information. And I know, for example, when I do my teasers, okay, that is brand new information. I know I'm giving it. I know that will go to Reddit and other social media. Like, okay, I know what I'm doing. I'm putting out new information. and those kind of things will get attention. I understand that.

But anyway, the point I'm making is I do go online in a lot of places and I read what people have to say. I want to hear what people have to say. And the amount of negativity online, like I said, I've been doing this for a long time. It just keeps growing. And people have gotten meaner, a lot meaner. people have and and once again uh i i have no problem with honest to god criticism if we make something you don't like i i do in fact want to know that and i have no problem with people not

liking something just because i or my co-workers make something doesn't mean that everybody i mean a doesn't mean that everybody likes it and me we make mistakes we do things that you know maybe with more feedback, we will do it differently next time. So I'm not, my issue here, we're not talking about negative online negativity. I'm not talking about not liking something. I am perfectly fine with us doing something and someone goes, hey, I didn't like that. I don't even consider that negativity. That's not what I'm talking about.

Negativity is not, I don't like something. That is fine. Negativity has to do with how are you presenting it. So first and foremost, a lot about negativity I should stress is, when your negativity is not about the topic at hand, but about a person related to it. A lot of the negativity, for example, is not, I mean, and this is true, I think, of anybody.

I mean, I'm more used to it than most. And I should stress, me being used to online negativity does not make online negativity okay. Does not mean it's acceptable. It means I've learned to live with it as part of my job, and I've grown a thick skin. But the idea that if somebody, if somebody, like,

the interesting thing to me is I go online to read about something, the latest set. And the amount of times that I have to read, not about criticism of the set, but criticism about me personally, as a person, is shockingly high, you know, where people,

and I don't know the, nature of this. I'm not quite sure why. For example, one of the things that people like to go after me all the time about is that I, look, I work for the company. It's not, I'm a spokesperson. I mean, I'm not, none of this is a secret. Do I emphasize positivity over negativity about my own product? Absolutely. Now, to be fair, I do like my product. I did work very hard on it. My coworkers worked very hard on it. I'm very proud of what we do. Um, you know, and I mean, I, but at the same time, um, I'm, I'm aware of negative. I mean, I do, I do entire, for example, I do entire podcast about

let me talk about all the lessons we learn from this set. Um, I tend to do that a little after the set. I mean, part of it is, it's very, it's hard to understand a set in context until really like six months have gone by. It's really hard to understand. Um, you need to see it play out. and see people people do with it, and it takes time to sort of absorb. So I admit, I'm not, I don't really get negative of things until they've been out for a while, mostly because I can't understand them until they've been out of a while. Also, look, I do work for the company. When we are selling something, it is not my job to convince you not to buy it.

I'm trying to convince you why you might want to buy it. Now, the reason I want to convince you to buy it is because I think you'll enjoy it and I think it is fun. I mean, obviously, I'm talking to magic players about magic. So hopefully if you're here listening to the head designer, about magic. Maybe you like magic. Maybe that's something you enjoy. That's why you're listening to me on a podcast or, you know, however you're interacting with me on social media. So the first big thing is, um, think about people are people, they're actual people. They say this on the DCC, too. Like people sort of think of them as there's these personalities rather than, as almost just their characters. Like sometimes I get treated online as if I'm, it's like it's some persona.

Like, you know, there's no real Mark Rosewater. I'm just, I'm Joe Smith and I'm pretending to be Mark Rosewater or something. No, this is actually me. When you attack me, it's me. You're attacking me or my coworkers. When you attack my coworkers, it's actual people. Real people with real feelings. And I'll be honest, just because I have a thick skin, just because I'm used to it,

doesn't mean it can't hurt. It doesn't mean it's not nice to read negative things about you. especially I mean, in general, it's not nice to read negative things, especially not in negative things that aren't even true and a lot of things said about me

aren't true. Like, one of the interesting things is because I'm online all the time, I say a lot of stuff. I write, you know, between my podcast, my articles, and my blog, I believe I produce a million words

a year on magic. A million words. That's a lot of words. And if people want to pick at something, they very often will take my words and use them as a means. Now, that's fine. If I publicly say something, you can use my words. I have no problem with that. But, but you need to use my words in the context they were given and not out of context. But one of the things, for example, that I get yelled at a lot is I will say something. And then years later, we do something opposite of what I say.

We are not planning to put universes beyond in standard. When I said that, that was the plan. We were not. We changed our mind and then we started doing it. But the idea that I said we were planning to do something and then we changed our mind, that is not me lying. That is me saying what was true when I was saying it. And so there's a lot of, a lot, I mean, and like I said, some amount of negativity is just people who dislike what I represent. That's fine. I'm the mouthpiece of magic or whatever. And like I said, I'm not, I'm very open to people being critical.

And if you read my blog, people are critical all the time. If you don't like something, I mean, really what I was, my key to online negativity is there's nothing wrong with criticism. If you want to be critical, you can be critical.

But I would ask, first and foremost, true criticism is explaining in detail why you do or don't like something. and why that is good or bad, meaning it's critiquing the work, not the people, not making editorials about the people. Like one of the things I find in my blog all the time is people who have a good point and present it in the cruelest way possible.

For starters, let's say you want to say something positive. You are allowed to just say it positively. You don't have to first say something negative in coaching. in negativity, you know, normally I hate all the stuff that Mark does, but I like this one article. You can just say you like the one article. You don't, it's not important to the context that, oh, I normally hate his articles. You can just say you like this article. You don't have to, you don't have to couch in negativity.

That if you like something, and I will say this, when people who work on things, we spend a lot of time and energy making these things. I mean, years making them. One of the reasons I go online is to see, are people enjoying the things we're making? And when they are enjoying the things we're making, it is delightful. It is really nice. It is why I, a big reason of why I do what I do is

I'm trying to add positivity to the world. I'm trying to make the world a better place. I'm trying to give people something that makes the world better for them. And I love, I get letters all the time about people talking about how magic is shaped their lives for the better and how it has helped them. And, you know, there's all sorts of positivity that come from magic.

That, I love that. And so the point is, if you want to make magic better, I want to make magic better. I really, if we do something, you're like, I dislike this template. I dislike cards like this. I wish you did this rather than that. That is all awesome. I love to hear that. That is great.

One of the reasons that I read all the, that I read all the social media that I do is I do, in fact, want to hear what people, like, I want to hear criticism. But there is a big different, like, how you criticize something is really important. Like I said, focus on the thing you're actually critiquing, which is the work. Explain what you don't like, which is great. Explain why you don't like it. That is great. It is fine if you would like something different.

And once again, regular people who listen to my podcast know, players are much better at identifying what they don't like. like than correcting it. And the only reason it's not your job to correct it, you don't know all the, there's a lot of parameters that go into making magic. Obviously, I have a whole podcast where I explain them. You know, if you don't like something, a lot of times we can fix it, whether or not your idea of how to fix it is the thing to fix it.

It can vary. Like I said, there's a lot of moving pieces. And I tried to, on this podcast, explain to you a lot of them. But even then, there's things I don't explain. And even the stuff I do explain, I don't think the average person has any working knowledge of collation any you know like i talk about collation a little bit but um and that's just one example something that's hugely impactful that the average person really is no idea um so when you're criticize the thing and uh you do not need to add negativity just to add negativity you don't have

to if you like something just say you like it you don't explain why you normally don't like something or why it you know like you the thing i would say is Criticism has a place, 100%. And I'm not even saying that negativity doesn't have a place, although I would want the negativity to be used structurally for good, if you will. I honestly think there are people who are doing actual real harm, real harm. I'm not talking about you wish we did something and we didn't do it. That is not real harm.

I mean, people who are actively harming sections of the world and are causing like true bigotry and things that we're. which the real pain is coming out of that. And I'm not saying there's not rule. I'm not saying there's not need for negativity. Magic is a game. Hopefully it's a game you play because you love. And I want you to feel free

that if we do something you don't like to voice that displeasure. None of this today is about saying that you shouldn't ever say things. What I'm really what I'm trying to say today is how you say it, matters and that I understand we live in a world where the algorithm rewards people for being negative like the professor, Tullian, he does a comedian in college. Every year, at the end of every

year he makes two videos, one about the best five things Wizards did for the year in magic and one about the worst five things wizards did in magic. And he experiments every year and the negative one always gets like at least two times the viewers of the first one. He changes the order of them. He referenced each one and the other one. Like he's tried whatever he can to try to see if, and no matter what he does, the negative thing will get twice the audience of the positive thing. I understand how algorithm's work.

I understand that it is, maybe is it more fun to read the negativity? The thing I'm trying to point is that it's not done in a vacuum. the people you're being negative out often case are reading the negative thing and it is actually actually harmful to people when you once again I'm not talking about

criticism I'm not talking about giving honest to God opinions about what you like or don't like but I mean like I said I will read Reddit threads I will read you know I

as much as I dislike Twitter I do occasionally go on Twitter these days I go on places with high, high amounts of negativity because I do believe fundamentally underneath the negativity are people trying to give actual real criticism. And I've gotten pretty good of hearing really negative things and going, okay, let me ignore the negative things.

What are they trying to say? And I've gotten really good at reading through negativity. Like I said, I'm still online. I mean, like I said, if you want to get some sense of my daily life, just Google my name on Reddit and start reading comments about me you know and that is

that is the thing I'm sort of trying to stress today is that when you're online and when you are talking the people you're talking about very often are aware that you are talking about them and that the way I would describe it is you shouldn't treat online any different than you treat real life would you say these things

to the face of the person like would you say it to the face and if you would say mean mean things to their face that's that also is a problem by the way there wants me some amount of civility and like I said

it's not if I do things you don't like you can say I do things you don't like if we make cards you don't like or do things in magic you don't like none of this is about criticism none of this is about voicing your opinion What I'm stressing here is

you can focus on the actual thing you dislike explaining why you dislike it and talking about motivation. I don't like this thing because. Here's why I don't like it. And I am fine if you want to bring up opinions, feelings, bring up your feelings. You know, bring up your feelings of

I don't like this because here's what this does for me that I dislike it. And, you know, I'm, I just want to sort of voice that there is consequences for online negativity. Real consequences. It's why watching the America Sweethearts on Netflix, wow, it's because they interviewed the girls and were talking about how hard it was for them. About, you know, that people are saying things. And, like, one of the things about watching the show is what they do is so hard. They practice so much and they are so good and they're just doing something that's very complicated and very hard

And then online like people take screenshots and like look right here. They're not completely in line in this one moment in time And I'm like they're moving across a football field doing a sing-a-dagnated dance Hey, everyone wants to allow their lines aren't perfect that will happen. Okay? And that's not like some great injustice to society That is people at the top of their game great athletes doing something really, really hard. It's kind of like I described about magic is making magic is really hard, especially balancing for competitive formats, because we are predicting things without lots of information, and the point is, occasionally we'll mess up. And I'm not saying you can't criticize when we mess up, but somehow treat us like we're idiots, or some of us treat us like we don't care,

or treat us like we don't spend a lot of time and energy on it, we do. We spend so much time on it. And one of the reasons that a lot of my colleagues really shy away from being on the is, oh boy, if you are not used to it, it is really hard to have people, like, put your insecurities online for everybody and agree with them. So anyway, that is my point today, which is when you're online and commenting, whether it's directly to me,

the amount of negativity I get directly to me is amazing also, or even just where you're talking about something, but somewhere else, people will come there. If you're talking about magic cards, I guarantee you, R&D goes and read stuff about magic cards. If you're talking about magic somewhere,

there's a high percentage chance someone I work with is reading it. I might be reading it. I just ask you to think about what you're saying. What are you adding to the world? What are you putting out there? And that, you know, I think a lot of negativity comes from

people that are just personally in bad places where, you know, things are going bad, which has nothing to do with this. the thing they're talking about. And I think there's just a desire when you are feeling bad that somehow putting out this negativity like is venting or something.

But I don't... I honestly believe that all you're doing is creating more negativity. I don't believe it... I don't believe create negativity helps you in your life. I believe maybe in the moment it feels good, but it's just creating

a... We're creating a society where we reward negativity, and that's just bad for society. That's just not good. Society thrives when people help each other, when they're there for each other. Society thrives when people come together. And that the idea that social media

is all these algorithms are trying to break us apart rather than bring us together, look, humanity is at its best when people are together. I mean, no matter what it is, whether it's magic or whatever, pick whatever it is. If you play magic, hopefully it's because you love magic, And it's like you'd like to interact with other people that love magic.

Well, you can interact over your love of magic rather than your hatred of magic. You know, like, that is what people truly bond. People truly bond over finding people with like interests that are making them feel at home with one another. And that is my major thing today, which is, look, they're, I just want you to be very conscious. When you go online and you add negativity to something, you are just, making the world more negative. That is not making the world a better place. That is making the world a worse place. And that just, I guess my point today is think about that. You know, maybe you didn't come on a magic design podcast to talk about the state of the world, but I will say that at least in

my own little circle, in my own little area of magic, for people who want to talk with me, I want to make magic better. I want to improve. I love criticism. I love feedback. I want to hear how we can make the game even better. But you can do that in a way that is not knocking down the people making it, the people who like it, the people, you don't need to knock people down. All knocking people down does is make other people feel bad. You don't want to feel bad. You don't like when people knock you down.

That's just be part of the solution and not part of the problem. And if you want to do criticism on magic, I'm here for it. I want to hear it. But you can do it politely. You can do it with thought. And you can do it by explaining why you dislike something. Explaining what about it makes you unhappy. Not attacking.

Not going for the throat of the person you blame for doing it. And the other fun part of my job is I get blamed for everything. The vast majority of which aren't even things I did. But anyway, guys, that is my podcast today. My podcast today is, Magic is, Magic is. community, we come together, let's be there for each other, and let's, even when we are trying to be critical, we can be critical without being negative. And that is my point today. Okay? I know this is a little more serious than I normally get, but I believe is important.

And if anything from watching that episode of America's Sweethearts, we can be better. You can be better. Okay? Okay, guys, well, I'm now at work. Actually, I've been at work for a few minutes, but we all know that means the end of my drive to work but instead of talking magic is time for me to be making magic. I'll see you next time.