Magic: The Gathering Drive to Work Podcast - #1383: Reality Fracture Creative with Meris Mullaley

Episode Date: September 25, 2026

In this podcast, I sit down with Meris Mullaley, the creative lead for Reality Fracture, to talk all about its creative elements.

I'm not pulling on my driveway. We all know what that means. It's time for another drive to work at home edition. So I often use this to do interviews. And today I'm doing exactly that. I'm Maris Malaley with me, who is the creative lead for reality fracture to talk all about the design, a creative designing of reality fracture. So hello, Maris.

Mark, thanks for having me. Okay, so let's start at the very beginning. How did you first learn that you were doing this project? I first learned I was doing this project shortly after starting in my role as a narrative designer. I had worked previously as a producer and managing the narrative team and then took on a different role. And the timing worked out that I was able to step in, support Doug Beyer in late vision world building on this alternate reality world. story that was going to end the current story arc and then launch into writing the world guide. So it was learning a lot for real fast.

Okay, so what was your first impression? I mean, this is, like I said, this was a big story with a lot of component pieces to it. Yeah, I mean, I'm someone who has enjoyed a variety of science fiction and fantasy. So alternate reality and what if stories or something I've enjoyed, whether it's in Star Trek or Marvel or other spaces. So it was really fun to be like, okay, what does that mean for magic? Where we are, or what we define as a multiverse is sometimes different than what multiverse means in other, in other IPs or other story settings. Um, talk just for,

talk to that a little bit. How are we different? What, when people think of multiverse, what do they think of, but what is the magic multiverse? Sometimes when I think most commonly when people think of multiverse, they think of many,

many, many, many, different versions of a location or characters. Um, and for us, for magic, multiverse has always been multiple different worlds, planes, And there's only been one version of that character and, you know, some settings,

tarquier with this fun time shenanigans. But for us, it's been more like a galaxy of worlds that is our multiverse, rather than different dimensions that have different versions of me across it. So one could argue that reality fracture is our first multiverse and what people think of as being a multiverse. Yes, yes, which made talking about what we were trying to do, very challenging. Because when you, it was like, well, no, but it's, so we, we, I think what was very helpful early on was internally, we all collectively were just like alternate reality.

That's how we're talking about this. It's, multiverse means its thing. So let's just, what this is is a singular alternate reality of our multiverse. So I know when we began, we began with much more grandiose ideas and what that was going to be. Yes. I'm going to talk about that a little bit. Yeah. And that actually predated when I joined.

But originally, I think we were looking at probably a alternate reality version at the scale of March of the Machines, seeing everything. I know we had started to talk about like seating hints at. alternate reality characters earlier in the arc than we ultimately ended up doing. And by the time I joined, I think that was, we had kind of realized we wanted to narrow the scope. Jase was still going to create the entire multiverse, but what you're asking everyone to focus in on, let's go with a singular setting or a singular epicenter. So were you, so the first singular setting was not Hex-Saven. Were you there for the first singular setting?

I remember hearing about doing Mirited. Yeah, it's going to be Mirrenuous. That's our first idea. Yeah. And we moved away from that because we're like, oh, here's the plot point from 15 years ago that, like, most people might not even know about. So let's talk about making of Heck Savin since. Yeah. Yeah.

What, okay, we're saying we're doing, all the really, really decided was it was like Strick's Haven, but it was ally schools. and it was whatever Jace needed it to be to like, you gotta change it up however he wanted. So, sure. It's both creating new schools, but also within the confines of having some similarities with the Strixhaven counterpart. So I liked the,

we made the call to have the broad subject matters be the same. We were going to have a history school, a science school, an art school, a language school, and a math school. I'm like a forgetting one. What's the one I'm forgetting? And a math school. But how those subjects were expressed,

that was where we got to lean into something different. And when I was writing the World Guide, the thing that I was thinking a lot about was, especially because this is a version that Jace has created, what is a way that control is present in all of these subject matters, not necessarily in the like blue mana control across to every single school, but how are the teachers and the students using that subject to exert control in some way? So in Constrari, the students are learning more precise engineering and architecture,

sure it's less emotional expression and personal expression of art. Fatehold cares more about trying to define and create a very specific future, which is different than Lower Hold, which is looking to the past to understand where we've been. And Vigr-Bloom is like trying to, in some ways prevent death, but just doing the best they can to keep everyone alive, moving, and plant, planty. Yeah, I mean, one of the things I know we did very early on was the idea of, we like this being a little more military feeling and the idea that the school was completely made to some sort of what Jace needed the school to be.

And you guys had a lot of fun with that. I, I, I, yeah, yes, it was like, giving them the,

like I would always think about Strickshaven is the place you go to, it's like the, the joy of learning, the freedom of learning, that the opportunities that you feel when you walk onto a college campus and you're just like,

oh my God, the potential, I just feel like the world, the potential that's in front of me is is, is, is, is glorious. And Hexhaven is like a lot of dystopian organizations. It's rigid. It's structured. It's more, it cares more about assigning people to specific schools based on their qualities and less about, well, what do you want to major in? What do you, what, what's the thing you want? It's not about what you want. It's, do you, do you, what, what's, do you, what,

have the competencies to be a theorics, reality bending, math mage, or are you better at insulting people and being a Stinger Quill person? Well, let's walk through the schools. I'm going to Wurgaarder here. So we'll start with white blue. So what we did with the schools was we said we wanted to keep one color. We tried to keep the color we thought was kind of more the center color. and then moved the other one

from an enemy color to an ally color. So the history school, we kept white, but instead of being white red, we moved to white blue. So you want to talk about that? Yeah. I think with our history school, with

fate hold, it was, you know, and then, you know, for those who play magic, you know, that it's also the same colors that Azores shares and thinking about, like, you are looking at history and but also looking at the future. So we were thinking about ways that there's always, there's this, my background is in history. So there's always the sentiment that we say that you look to the past to understand your present to shape your future.

And fate hold is like the extreme of that where to shape your future, we need to change the present and past to make sure that you've created a timeline that's going the direction you want. And so to me that because we kept one of the colors from the schools, to me, white always felt like, well, that's the history. White is the timeline part. And red in Lorhold was the, you know, exciting study, the excavation, the like uncovered. of history and Blue and Fatehold was more about the control of that timeline and that history. Well, the thing that's interesting to me, I just, I love looking at the enemies, is that red is about emotion, right? Red is about how you feel. So a lot of Lorhold is, I'm studying history,

but I want to understand what it felt like. Yeah. Blue is the intellectual side of thing. It's not about feeling. And so you really get the intellectual, like, I want to understand it, but I don't, I don't care how people felt that that's meaning. Yeah, there's no, yeah, they don't care about how people felt, it's all about, like, let's predict. What are the different possibilities? Like, that's the other thing is when you think about, um, the blue and the color pie, it's often a lot about like, it's research and possibilities and, um, what are the opportunities that come from that? There was many, many possibilities. And so there were, Fadehold has these majors who are doing divination and like, prophecy to be like, okay, you, I can get some vibes from you. You're going to go one

of three ways and I want you to go the third way. So I'm going to affect something right now in your present or your past so that I can get that outcome. So I'm going to answer a question that I got asked. Yeah. People are like, you have a school almost the future. Why did you not do scry instead of surveil? And we did early on. We actually had scry early on. We had enough of graveyard component that surveil made more sense than scry. But we were, when we moved to surveil, we felt bad because like, oh, we really wanted to scry. So it does. It really. It really does. And I think the, I think the mechanic ended up saying, if you scried or surveil. Yeah, it is. So it acknowledged scryd. But we had so many conversations about that.

Okay, next one of moving to the math school. So that was blue-green in original strict saving. We felt that blue was a little more core to what math was. We married with black. So let's talk about the math school of Hexhaven. Yeah. So the math school is our is theorics. And it is. I also I also want to apologize to math majors out there because I said before, I'm a history person. I'm not a math person. But we, because you also had Jace creating this whole reality, we looked at kind of conceptually theoretical physics, math that thinks about impossible numbers or stuff that's not. quite real, but could be. And Theorix was using math and theoretical physics to change reality. So it kind of like fate holds working in history, just working with the present. And Theorex is kind of like, I'm going to create a portal. I'm going to use my math to create a portal. I'm going to reach through and I'm going to grab something from,

this other reality. I'm going to have to sacrifice something because I can't just pull things from one reality into mine and just make mine heavy. I've got to give something up. And so that kind of, you know, play a little bit of that graveyard space.

But also I think the Theric students are just very like, I'm in this, bringing in that black, they're like, I'm really good at this. I'm going to be, I want to see what kind of power I can get by manipulating reality. Here's the way I like, like, I like looking at the, because the color that was and the color that is and hexadeon are enemies, right?

That's right, that's right. Green is all about exploring what is and recognizing what is. So when green gets married to it's like, oh, math is a thing. I want to understand the natural world. Yeah. Black is about, I want to exploit. The reason I want to learn things is so I can use it to my advantage. Yes.

And so blue green math is like, I want to learn what math is and I want to understand it. And blue black math is like, how can I use it to my advantage? Yes, exactly. And Jace is like, how can I use Theorix to my advantage? The, we have, we have, Jace was using all of the different schools for different purposes, but the students from Theorex and Fatehold were more likely to be, pulled into his calculations for what he needed to do to build the ecoverse. So he was very invested in those two schools, which makes sense because they have blue in them.

Okay. Next up, we have a language school. So language was originally white and black. We decided, I mean, once we made a decision, we had to go in the same direction for everybody. Right. And so black ended up being language. So we get black there. And then instead of white, we moved to its enemy red.

So let's talk a little bit about the language school of Hex-Av. Yeah. Well, I mean, and that is the, just as the opposite of what we said with the history schools is we've gone from logic and orderly conversation to passionate, like, emotional-driven insults and attacks and ways to use the language to evoke emotion, to gain power over people. And it's in some ways, you know, like Silver Quill had a very broad range of language arts and language magic. And Stinger Quill is very much just like, I'm going to hit you with the best insult I can come up with. It's they do poetry.

They do, they're like not quite musicians, but they do like to. own the stage, which is kind of, the red, I think, is pulling that part out of black of like, it's the, this is the front man of a rock band or something as well. Yeah, like, once again, the white red conflict, I agree that white tries to use things to, right, create structure, to make things orderly. And red revels in the disorderly and revels in the,

the, you know, and I love the, idea that this is cool, like, I'm just attacking you. Like, I'm, you know. Yeah. There's no orderly debates. It's only duels. Black red is our hedonistic color pair. They are. They are. So they also got to be our punk rockers in terms of aesthetics. That was cool. Yeah.

Okay. So then we get to art. Sorry. Yeah. Art was blue red in Strysavon. We kept the red. And then we moved to green. Yes. This was one of the interesting things is when we made the shift and figured out where to go, we had a couple. Like, we could shift left or shift right, basically.

Right. And we decided there were a few of them, like signs not being green and math not being in blue, a few of them that felt so off that that expression we shifted. And I'll admit, when you say art and you go to green, that seems a little bit weird. Yeah. How did you do red green art? It took us, it did take us a while to settle on. what red-green art was going to be once at one point we unlocked the idea of architecture

and construction, more like constructive art, sculptural engineering, which engineering also maybe doesn't feel super green, but it was what are they, what are they engineering? What are they building? That was the, that was the thing that became the green aspect is they are using natural materials to construct these massive puppets that are able to be magically controlled by tether mages, and then those can be used in battle. And there's still with that red expressiveness, there's still a bit of personal expression in what types of puppets, what somebody, chooses to build. But they are kind of about, it's about big. It's about big bombast. And so that

fits very well into green and red together. Yeah, the way I like to think of it is, so if you look at the blue green, it's sort of nature, nurture sort of thing. And that, when red gets together with blue, we sort of say that's creativity, right? It's sort of like the passion and the mental sort of mix together. When red and green get together, it is very much about instinct and feeling and like there's no thinking. Red and green are the blue. So like red and green are all about what are all the things that drive you that you don't consciously think about? Right. And that's really, you get very primal stuff in red green. Yeah. Yeah. And the the majors of Constari in order to puppet, to control the the puppet beats that they've created, they have to basically like,

siphon off a little bit of themselves in a way, like the little bit of their, their essence into these magical threads that they can then connect with and give animated life, temporarily animated life to these puppets. And that also felt very like red green where it's like, it's a little instinctual. It's maybe not, maybe it's not the instinct you want to have of taking a little part of yourself and giving it to a puppet. But you're definitely, not thinking much about that. Yeah, I read green, not about thinking, that's for sure. No.

Our final school was our science school. So in strict saving, it's green black, really playing in the life death start cycle of things. Yeah. So we ended up moving it to white. So talk about green white science. Oh, yeah. This green white science, we, you know, we've seen in green and white before there's healing. it's less about the decay of life and the cycle of life,

and it's more about the growth and the healing. And so it became our, effectively kind of our like pre-med or medical school, where using the growth of green, that was then kind of the, orderliness of white, the thinking about the larger community, that was taking that growth and saying like, okay, I'm going to heal people with plant matter, with nature. I'm going to somebody, you know, received an internal injury. I'm going to patch them up. I'm going to mend them with vines. And the life of that greenery is going to become part of their life. And then

kind of the dystopian part of it is like, they don't necessarily get a say. I'm going to fix them up whether they want it or not. Yeah, the way I like to think of it is one of the things about black, I know a lot of times we lean into sort of the selfishness of black, but black also is sort of the color that just accepts things as they are. Black is kind of the most realistic of the colors in some level.

And black just like, hey, death is a thing. Why are we so afraid of death? Like, it's just part of the natural thing. And then black and green get together, it's like, okay, we're just respecting the natural order of things. Yeah. And when you get white in there, white is like afraid of death. White doesn't like death at all. And all of a sudden, he's like, well, we need to do everything we can to avoid death, which is just a very different take for the science.

Yeah. And it also fits in nicely with kind of Jace's own denial of, he also wants to prevent all this death that happened from forever. and the Eldrazi and like he's resisting. And so this is kind of, in some ways, this also reflects his own like resistance in that cycle. Yeah. Which is our major mechanic of the set was Empower Jace. I mean, we handed off that was done very early.

How exactly did you bring Empower Jace to life? Like, Jace was really important and one of our guidelines was, we wanted Jace to kind of permeate everything. thing. Yeah. You guys took that and ran with it. So talk a little bit about like, oh,

so, yeah. We jes defying the echo verse. We jays to find the echo verse. So there's a few different ways we did this. High level wise, I approached this set with, it was basically going to be a,

it was like a third. One third was going to be Hexhaven. One third will be the mirrored pairs, which we'll talk about. And then the other third was like, emphasize Jace and the story. And because this is Jase's base of operations, like he has set up his base of operations in the Tower of Hexhaven,

he's creating a whole multiverse, but he's doing it from here, and he's a mind mage. So while he's busy trying to calculate what's, you know, you know, what dominearia looks like without the phrexians. His subconscious is doing stuff. And so we were able to visually, just in the design of the Hexhaven campus, there's, college campuses always have statues. They always have beautiful architectural stonework.

And here, all of those just happen to be like statues of Jace. there he's also because he's he's controlling he's little paranoid he's got all of these different surveillance system so he's got animals and birds that either have his symbol in their iris or have birds with his head that are just kind of monitoring what's happening on campus to make sure everything's still stable everything that I'm trying to create is still working got to hold it together until we can do the final act. And so there was that aspect just in the visuals of the campus design was finding ways to put Jace or elements of his subconscious.

Like there's a lot of sphinxes. Our elder Sphinx founders of the Hexhaven schools are sphinx, not necessarily because Jace wanted them sphinxies, but Sphinxes are very top of mind for him in his subconscious. And that just is what happened when he made Hexhaven or when he made Arcavios, I guess. One thing that's really interesting is the idea that the story really is a story of trauma. Yes. And that you see Jason's trauma is all over the place.

Everywhere. His bullies, the people who bullied him back on Vryn. Somehow they are the hall monitors of Hexhaven. And then the other thing that, that we did that was more story-based. But we took a page out of the strategy for War of the Spark where we had a number of cards that depicted story moments. And we had 13 official story spotlight cards

that at least one per fiction episode, plus a few other ones for the finale, because there was just a lot of, A lot of big centerpieces and emotions happening there. But then we also just went through the story outline and identified maybe close to 30, 20 or 30 additional story moments that could be paired up with cards or occasionally I would ask Yanni. Like, can we get a card that is this moment? Liliana resurrects her doppelganger as a litch and then fights Jace. I need this as a card.

How do we get that? And so that was another way of showing, that was another way of making sure the set showed Jace, but the story, expressing the story of the set. Yeah, just to people realize in Capstone event sets, which is sort of what this is, because of the story, like, first and foremost, it's trying to capture the story,

we do more, there's a little more outlining done ahead of time. There's more, like, trying to capture it in the set, more important because like this set very much is about this story more so than anything else. Yeah. I would say in general when we're approaching world building and fiction, and actually this is kind of also how I think about world building with the card set is the world building that I do is creating the sandbox in which the card set can take place in and the fiction can take place in.

And there's going to be plenty of places where those two things overlap, but then there's going to be times where the camera pans over here and it's purely fiction and there's going to be other times where the camera pans over here because we need a card that does a very specific mechanic that is relatively irrelevant to the story but we need that mechanic and but with reality fracture because it was an arc ending capstone it needed to do everything okay so let's let's get to the third part you said there were three parts we talked tox haven We talked Jace. So the pair creatures were actually very, very foundational.

Yes. They're one of the earliest things. In fact, we built us that around it. So let's talk a little bit about the creative of what did it mention? Like, okay, you're making, I don't know, 43 pairs or something. There's a whole bunch of pairs. Yeah. Yeah.

We started off with just brainstorming lists of characters. We wanted to see characters. that were a mixture of well-known characters, beloved, characters that people play a lot in their decks, and also just ones that we haven't seen in a while. And then came the harder part, which was, okay, but what ones can we actually get into the set? And it was a beautiful balance and a beautiful dance between creative and game design, where we is like, okay, creative wants these characters. Okay, well, game design, we need to make sure that we don't just have a bunch of color shifts all into the same color.

How do we get the right? Okay, how many white to greens, how many greens to blue? How many, like, we have a mixture of everyone who's color shifting. Some folks are monocolor to monocolor. We have a couple that are two color and one that's monocolor. There are so many amazing characters in magic that it was a very fun and difficult task to figure out who we were going to feature. Gideon, who was just previewed, you know, when we're recording this, Gideon was just previewed yesterday. But he's the only dead character that we put in the main set because we've established his statue.

So we could say like, here's his real multiverse version. It's a statue. But then here's his echoverse version that many of our other recently dead deceased characters don't have a good counterpart that's not just a corpse at the ground. So we did, by the way, just for the audience, we didn't talk more about having more dead characters. It's true. It's true. There was a point in time where all the deans were dead characters where we went and found like, oh,

well, Jaya is the, this, and that, like, we, we, we didn't have a problem with that. In the end, we decided, I think that we really want to do at least one. We did Gideon. We do, you want to talk, we do reference time ago. She doesn't have a card. And I believe at this point, Commander has been previewed. I mean, when they hear this, it's all pretty much time they hear this. So, yeah.

We can talk about whatever, because we've already heard this all of time. They've already heard all. But, yeah, I mean, I'm grateful for Commander, for being. a place that, because one of our restrictions, when we started to set up restrictions of like, what are our rules for this pair sheet? And one of them was like, okay, this is Jace creating a copy of the multiverse at this moment in time. So mostly it's going to be characters that are alive and contemporaneous. They have the same spark status. They have, you know, yeah, go ahead. Just for great, bring up Spark status.

Yeah. We did. In fact, I have a handoff document, my vision, handoff document that I'm going to be posting, and probably it'll be up before you hear this. We had a one point, we were goofing around, we were like, you know, each of the five characters of the Lower One Five, like, here's a Plainswalker, plainswalker version, here's a creature, planeswaker version, here's a creature version, here's a creature version. We had a version of that, and then I think it was decided, it was just cleaner and easier.

if Plainswalkers became planeswalkers and creatures became creatures. And so we did explore that. We did. Simplicity purposes, we decided to make it clean. Yeah. And I think it ended up making sense because often what happened, and Liliana is a good example where the event that caused her to spark in the original multiverse is her failure to save her brother.

She ends up cursing him and turning into a zombie. and in Jace's version of reality, she succeeds in healing him. So she never has that emotional, like, moment where she failed to save her brother. So she just never sparks. And I think that was a made a lot of sense for characters who were like, oh, yeah,

even though we know you lost your spark because of the events of March of the Machine and the phrexene invasion, you, your other version just never had. had that trauma. So one of the things is interesting about this to explain is Jace only in a few special cases, like really went in, like Lillianna being one of them.

But Jay's mostly, he didn't go person by person and fix them. He just made major changes. And then whatever sort of came came. I think it's interesting that there's two characters that he clearly, like two women that mattered to him that he said, I'm going to try to make for the life better. Lillianna clearly the trauma of losing her brother. brother, Sean to the problem of losing her dad.

He's like, okay, I'm just not going to let their loved ones die. Right. I'm honestly going to try to do right by them and make, you know, and then I for those work out. And also Vraska, like the alternate version of Raska wasn't put through the torture that she went through on Ravnika. She was raised in more of a, like, supportive foster system that Ravnika had implemented. When we were working through what the alternate versions of characters could be, I was very insistent on I want a range of outcomes. I don't just want everybody who was good becoming evil and everyone who was evil becoming good.

This isn't like, oh, I've got to go tee. That's how you know I'm the evil version. I wanted to show a range of different paths that were taken. Some folks are very like mirrored opposite versions of themselves. And others are just like you just grew up in a slightly different circumstance. And you're still, who you are deep down is still the same. Like Dahlia from Inestrade, she's still a like Cathar, who's fighting for the good of the people,

she just was betrayed, and now is a ghost, but she's still protecting people even as a ghost. So who she is didn't change, but what she is is what changed. And then other folks, who they are was dramatically altered. Gideon is a great example.

Gianngu is another one who, his poor dog Mo'u was killed, and he's gone on a, vengeance mission, personal vengeance mission. So he's less... The internet keeps asking me why Jace doesn't like dogs. I mean, sometimes you just have to figure out, how do you articulate that somebody is the villain?

But, yeah, yeah, he also makes... I mean, everyone will always... I mean, I saw people also asking about, like, what happened to Yoshimaru? And the question I want to, I would be like, you should be asking what happened to the wanderer. Yeah. Well, and one of the neat things about this is, as you dig in deep, there's so many hints at other worlds and what happened. And one of the things about the pairs that's super fun is the pairs are all set in the world where their actual world.

Yeah. Yeah. see Karn, he's on Mirrodin, but a very different mirroden. A very different mirroden. The key glimpses, like, the parochets do show his glimpses of all the different worlds. They do. And it was really important to me when we were figuring out the characters, like that, especially characters who are showing up on the same plane,

have a internal logic that makes sense. So there's all of the different characters that are on Dominaria. There's, like, common history. Same with Inestrade. You can see threads of a common history that took place in this reality. I will recommend for people for the Vorthos is out there.

We did write an article that talks about all the legends and if you want information about things, there's obviously flavor text as well. And the commander deck also goes deep on the Echoverse. So if you want to see more of that, a lot of work was meant

at sort of hinting at different things that went on. I mean, the set had to focus a little more on, safe and such. But, uh, yeah, but. I want to tell you all out there.

Those resources exist. You want a little more dipping into what, what you did. Yeah. The, the Legends article is, is for everyone who read the fiction. It was like, I want more of the Echoverse.

Legends article. That's for you. That is exactly for you. And the Commander Deck. Yeah. Yeah. But anyway, we've talked through all three parts. Mm-hmm.

And I can see my desk from here. So we need to be wrapping up. But I, any final thoughts you had on the making of the echoverse and reality fracture? Ooh. I think the thing I would say is, you know, it's okay to grieve for the echoverse. It's okay to feel unsure how you feel about the ecoverses fate.

We definitely talked about it throughout the development. We knew from early outlines Emmer Kool was coming. But for me, it was always fun to give as much, as much, like, realism to the world, to this alternate reality as possible. Yes, it's all something that Jace has manufactured and created, but it's kind of that the analogy, if you, if you're living in a simulation and you don't know you're in a simulation, everything's real to you. Like, that's your reality. and that was kind of the mental framework I approached the echoverson is I know it's not real, but they don't. The other final throw I want to say is if you've not read the story by Alison Lurves, it is very, very good. Numerous people have been talking about how excited.

As recording this, it just finished up. So having all sorts of people saying how much they enjoyed the story. So I hardly recommend, especially for a long-time Magic Player, like I said, this is the first time of Lerwin-5, in the story together, which is kind of crazy. That is true. Yeah. You get some amazing character dynamics and interactions. So. So anyway, I just want to thank you, Maris, for being

here today. It was so much fun talking. The set was a blast of work on. And so thank you for all your hard work. Thank you. It was a lot of fun. So everybody else, I'm at my desk. So we all know what that means to the end of my drive to work. So instead of talking magic, it's time for me to be making magic.

So thanks, everyone for being here. And I I will see you next time. Bye-bye.