Magic: The Gathering Drive to Work Podcast - #678: Small Talk with Sarah

Episode Date: October 4, 2019

This is another of my mailbag podcasts where I answer all your questions. I do these with a carpool guest. Instead of "Mailbag with Matt" or "Replies with Rachel," we get the first-ever "Small Talk with Sarah" where my guest is my youngest daughter, Sarah.

I'm pulling out of the driveway. We all know what that means. It's time for the drive to work. Okay, we've got a special treat for you. Back in the day, I used to have, when Matt Cavato would come with me, we'd occasionally do a thing called Mailbag with Matt. And then, when I was driving Rachel to school for a while, we did Replies with Rachel. So today, it's Small Talk with Sarah! Say hi, Sarah. So what we've done here is you guys have mailed.

I asked you guys to tweet me all sorts of questions. Sarah has a list of all the questions. She will pick out whatever question she wants. These questions were addressed. Some are to me, some are to her, some are to both of us. She can pick out whatever question she wants. And then either I or her will answer depending on who the question is for. Okay, do you have a first question for me?

Yeah, first question. So say who it is and then read it. Okay, it's for you. This is from, should I say their app? Yeah, say who it's from. From Sander for Kyle. What are your thoughts on Wild West Plain? I know it was a meme a while back, but I actually thought it was a super cool idea.

It is something that has come up numerous times. We like doing top-down worlds. And I love doing genres. I love doing sort of pop culture genres. So I would like for us to do Wefturn. I think the biggest problem with Wefturn is it's just kind of been out of favor for a while. Like this is from the 1950s. It'd be a shoo-in. So part of it is we need to find our way to do a magic take on it. And I think while we've discussed it

we haven't really found the perfect way to do it. But I do believe one day. I believe it's something we will eventually do one day. Next question. Next question is from Jeremy Quinn. Hi Sarah. Does your father repeat stories to you as much as he repeats them to us? Yes, he does. He loves, I don't know, he loves to, probably everything that comes up in our lives, he'll probably retell to you guys.

He doesn't have to retell them to us so much because I'm in most of them and I know what happened. But yeah, he definitely will come home and tell us stories about what happened at work or when he's on a vacation. But yeah, he does that a lot. So what Sarah's saying is I treat you guys like family. Aw, how nice. Okay, next question. Next question.

From Luna. What are the biggest things that you two share in common with one another? Okay, what do you think? What are the biggest things we share in common? That's a good one. We both love, like, working our brains, you know? We both love puzzles and, like, escape rooms and different sort of, I don't know. Mental challenges. Mental challenges.

Mental challenges like that. He's gotten me to absolutely love games. Play them every Friday night as a family. We're both, I don't know. Those are the two big ones I was thinking. Creativity, puzzles, games.

A lot of the mental stuff. Mental. On the physical, no. Sarah's the jock. I was thinking. Yeah, creativity, puzzles, games. A lot of the mental stuff. Mental. Yes. On the physical, no. Sarah's the jock. I was never a jock. As I'm on my way to rock climb. Okay.

Yep. Next one is from Ebert. What lessons learned from magic design have proven most useful in raising a family? So here's probably my number one thing is part of learning how to do game design is making the game be what the game wants to be and not what you want it to be. And I think raising kids is very similar where the goal of raising a kid is to make the kid the best version of what they want to be, not the best version of what you want them to be. And so that is my answer. I like it.

Okay, this one is from Silly Draco. Mark, for the love of cheese and all that is holy, when will we see our squirrel planeswalker? Well, first, first I've got to get, I got, well, that's a big ask. I mean, I'm trying my hardest to get squirrels into Black Border. I believe that squirrels deserve to be in Black Border. Obviously, I put them in Silver Border whenever I can. I don't know if we'll ever get to the squirrel planeswalker.

I don't even know what that means. Well, so the planeswalkers in Magic are the main characters that cast magic. Like you, the players, when you play, you're a planeswalker. Oh, okay. That makes sense. And so our planeswalkers mostly are humans, but we have, like, a minotaur planeswalker and an elf planeswalker and a merfolk planeswalker. So they want a squirrel.

It's a big ask. Just because we don't even do a lot of squirrels. Forget planeswalker squirrels, just normal squirrels. Okay, this next one is from Beefcat. Beefcat, okay. Beefcat, if you weren't designing magic, what would you be doing? I assume I would be writing. I mean, my career before this career was writing, and I really did love writing.

If I hadn't gotten into game design, I assume I'd be writing. I probably have a top TV show right now, and I don't know. That'd be funny. Okay, this one is from saint patrick given that your father is who he is how much does magic have an impact on your life um well again with the games thing i'm always doing games and i bring up games to my friends and stuff and um a lot of the times people will recognize me for my last name because it's not very common. And there's a few people that are like super into magic that are, I don't know, that really enjoy it.

And I mean, they tell me how much they like it. I'm like, oh, that's so cool. I don't understand it. How much did you understand? You try to teach me, but I never really caught on to it. I did teach you how to play way back when, but I never really caught on to it. I did teach you how to play way back when, but you never really took to it. I mean, it's just, it's not, it's not for me personally. I don't, I don't even play that many games anyways. Like, but you

play more party games and you play like strategy games. Um, but it has a big impact on my life because, um, I don't know. I, that's one of the big topics I talk about with people just cause they're interested about it. Um, but I think it's really cool. Um. Okay. Next.

Next question. Okay. Next question. It's from Nick. Sarah, is your dad a safe driver while he's doing the podcast? Good question. Am I a safe driver? Yes, he's a very safe driver.

He's a really good driver, actually. He's currently teaching me how to drive because I have to get 50 hours for my driver's ed. You do. And I have 13 or 12 so far. 13, I think. Yeah, he's the person who comes with me on all my drives. He's my mom. Sarah's mom.

Absolutely terrified of me driving her around. But yes, he's a safe driver. He's a good driver. Let's see. These are funny. Okay. The next question is from, let's see, Michael Cox. Okay.

What's the weirdest thing about having a dad who makes games for a living? What's the weirdest thing? I don't know. What's the weirdest thing? I don't think there's anything weird about it. I think it's really cool. Um, it's a little weird that, I mean, it's not weird, but it's more I'm not used to it like people freaking out about it and then coming up to me and like

trying to talk to me about it, and I don't understand the game and I'm like Like I know I know what the game is like oh, it's cool You play it, but like they try to talk to me about it. I'm like I don't understand what you're saying That's probably it. Okay, next question. Next question is from CJ. Do you think there will be another You Make the Card near in the future? Okay, so the You Make the Card, we've done four of them so far. It's something where

we let the audience sort of make decisions. So pick a color, pick a card type, and we let the audience sort of, through voting, craft a card. The biggest problem we have with You Make the Card is it takes a lot of time and there's just a lot of energy and stuff. And so I do think we'll do it again, but it is a humongous amount of work. Way, way, way more than it takes to make any normal magic card. Now, we know that the audience enjoys doing it. We know it's fun to sort of get you guys involved. So I do think we'll do it again. But it is tricky.

And not only is it tricky, you guys don't, when you make the card, you don't know what we're doing. Like we're putting in the set that you're unaware of what's going on in the set. And so finding the right place where we can do something, where we have the ability for you guys to make what you want, but it makes sense in the set. It's just, it's difficult. It's tricky to do. Okay, this next question is from Napoleon. Mark, which color or colors best describe Sarah and why?

Sarah, do you agree? Well, Sarah does not know the magic colors. I don't know. I can name them, but I don't know what they mean specifically. Okay, so let's see. What colors is Sarah? I think you have some red in you.

You have a little bit of impulsiveness and you definitely have some aspect to you that's driven by your emotions. I also think you have some blue in you because I think that you are very always trying to perfect yourself and get better. You like a lot of mental things. You like mental challenges. And I think there's some white in you because I think you look for the greater good and you try to make things right by all people. So I will say you are red, white, and blue. That's my way.

Awesome. American. Okay. This next one is from Lawland. I'm sorry if I'm, like, really bad at saying names. I think I'm the same. Okay. Favorite movie of the year so far.

What is your favorite movie? Rocket Man! Yeah, Rocket Man. That was so far. What is your favorite movie? Rocket Man! Yeah, Rocket Man. That was so good. Why do you like Rocket Man? I thought it was really good. Okay, well, I really like Elton John in the first place, and I also really like the lead actor.

Okay. It was a really good movie. And it was a good movie. It was such a good movie. My pick, which should not be a surprise, I think Avengers Endgame was the movie I was most excited to see and probably enjoyed the most. I saw it a bunch of times.

Anyway, as a lifelong comic book fan, it is hard not to enjoy a three-hour epic that has like 25 superheroes in it. This next question is from Connor Stanley for Sarah. What's the best thing your dad can cook or grill? What is the best thing I can cook or grill? He can grill Some nice steak Some nice

I don't know hamburger We do like steak tips I don't grill a lot though I grill hamburgers, I grill hot dogs I'll do steak tips every once in a blue't grill a lot, though. I grill hamburgers. I grill hot dogs. That's about it. I'll do steak tips every once in a blue moon. I mean, he's not Gordon Ramsay, but he can make pasta or something.

There's other things I cook. I don't grill a lot. I do cook some stuff. Yeah, that's true. What's your favorite thing that I cook? Everything that you cook. You don't cook a lot, though. I do not.

Okay, I cook some. Spaghetti. You make spaghetti. Spaghetti? Okay. Pretty not. Okay. I cook somewhat. Spaghetti. You make spaghetti pretty good. Okay. This next one is from Truman. Sarah, have you gone anywhere cool through your dad's job? Yes, I have. A little while back, we were flown out to Disneyland because they wanted my dad to speak at Pixar.

Not at Pixar. They're mixing things up. What? Wait, did they? No, no, no. They wanted dad to speak at Pixar. No, not at Pixar. You're mixing things up. What? Wait, did you? No, no, no. They wanted me to speak, or I did speak at Walt Disney, what's it called?

Walt Disney Imagineering, I think. Oh, wait. I spoke at Disney. Oh, was Pixar a different trip? Pixar was a different trip. Psych. I have a friend that works at Pixar, so we got to tour Pixar,

but that was a different thing. So anyway, I spoke at Disney. And instead of getting paid, well, I mean, I got paid through hotel and tickets for my kids. And VIP. And my family. And it was so nice. Oh, we had a VIP tour. I ruined Disneyland for my children.

I know. I can't go back without a VIP tour. So what a VIP tour is, is they take you around the park and you get a cut to the front of the lines. Anyway, it was... So I think we had a six hour, right? It was a six hour VIP tour. Yeah.

And in six hours, I think we went on like 30 rides or something crazy. Anyway, it was fun. Okay. This next question is from William. Does Morrow's hatred of bananas run in the family that's funny how you guys know that do you talk about how you hate bananas it's a thing they know i don't like bananas okay no i love bananas my entire family loves bananas my dad despises i mean i know adam loves bananas mommy loves loves bananas, you love bananas. Does Rachel, will Rachel eat bananas? Probably.

I mean, it's sweet. I've never seen Rachel eat a banana. It's like, okay, well. I mean, she might not dislike them, but. I mean, I know that you and Adam and Mommy love bananas, so. Yeah. Yes, it does not run in the family. It does not run in the family, no. Let's see.

This next one is from sasha okay you do have to agree to share an ice cream oh to share ice cream and can only get have one flavor to share what is that flavor uh it's one of two things my guess something you normally go for like a triple chocolate well i mean my guess is it'd be some form of chocolate or it'd be like mint chocolate chip. Oh, I love mint chocolate chip. I'd say that.

Mint chocolate chip's my guess because I like mint chocolate chip too. We'll go with mint chocolate chip. Awesome. Okay. This next one is also from William. What is Morrow's

favorite dad joke? I don't know. He just comes up with random things like on the spot all the time. There's just too many dad jokes to name one. Too many. Yeah, I know. He just comes up with random things on the spot all the time. There's too many dad jokes to name one. There's too many. Yeah, I know.

And I was telling dad jokes before I was a dad, so I was prepping my whole life. This next one is from Antonio. How do your classmates treat you knowing your dad is the lead designer of MTG? What about relatives and friends in general? leader, lead designer of MTG. What about relatives and friends in general? Okay. So, um, it depends because some of my friends will know like what magic is. Some of my coaches or some of my teachers or something will know what magic is. Um, only a few of them really like get really excited about it because only a few of them are like, yeah, yeah to be... They have to play it, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. A lot... I know quite a few people that do play it, but some of them are, like, really, really

big fans, and that's to the point where they start asking me questions, and, like, oh, my God, and I want to meet him, and, like, all this stuff. But they treat me normally. It's not anything crazy. Like, I'm not getting mobbed or anything. But they just... You're not getting mobbed. No, not, not, no.

But, I mean, I have had a teacher that's just all... It was a sub, and he read my last name. He's like, oh, are you... Yeah, you told the story. Yeah, I know. And then he went crazy about it. And I'm like, I don't know anything about the game. But, no, they treat me the same.

They know who he is. Okay, next question. Okay. This next one is from Ringo Durbar. Ringo, okay. Ringo Durbar. Durbar, okay. What is the reason why previous standard staple cards like Lightning Bolt are not printed anymore in standard?

Well, Lightning Bolt. So sometimes in early Magic, early during Magic, we come up with something. We think it's fair. But as we start playing with it, we realize, ah, not as fair as we thought. we start playing with it, we realize, ah, not as fair as we thought. And Lightning Bolt is a very powerful card, so powerful that it tends to warp environments that it's in. That having Lightning Bolt's environment really restricts what other things we can do in that environment. And so that is why we just can't, you know, just because we made

something once doesn't necessarily mean it's appropriate. You know, we try things sometimes and they prove to be a little more powerful than we intend. Stuff like Lightning Bolt, that's why we don't often reprint Lightning Bolt. This next question is from Logan. How big a role does elegance play in card design?

Has it changed over the years? I think elegance is something you aim for. When you make a truly elegant design, as a designer, that's the thing you want to make. Sometimes to do something cool, it just requires a lot of words, and it's not quite as elegant as you hope.

But the goal is you always try to be elegant. You can't always be elegant, but that is what you try to be. And hopefully if you make a set, you get to make some elegant designs in the set. Okay, next question. Next question is from Jay. What's the best story either or both

of you have heard about people meeting from playing MTG? I haven't heard of any stories of people meeting while playing. you oh i've heard a lot of i mean i get a lot of mail like like for example numerous times i've gotten letters that are like hey i just want to let you know i'm getting married next week and i would not have met my wife husband you know uh had it not been through magic we met through magic um i even had somebody who sent me a birth announcement saying that they had met their significant

other through magic and that, you know, now they're having their first baby. That's cool. So anyway, I've had a number of people sort of talk about how they've made friends, you know, relationships have been formed through magic. I get a lot of letters like that, which is always cool. Keep sending them. I like reading them. This next one is from Scott P. Do you feel like you have less impact over finished cards

with the change to vision set and play design versus the old system? Oh, yeah. I absolutely do. I mean, the current system of vision, I just work on sets less time each. I know the vision thing. It used to be I just work on sets less time each. Because I know the vision thing, it used to be I would work on a set for a year before I handed it off, back in the old design development model. Now I'm working on a set for four months before I hand it off. What that means is I have a bigger impact on each set. Like, I used to not work on every set.

I used to just work on the big sets. But now that every set is a big set, it allows me to, like, I definitely have my work on every set. I used to just work on the big sets. But now that every set is a big set, it allows me to... I definitely have my fingerprints on every set, but I make less of the final cards because I work closer to the beginning and farther away from the end step. But I've made plenty of magic cards. I've made literally thousands of printed magic cards.

I will not... I do not feel like I've not made a major stamp on making cards in the game. And I still... Plenty of my cards I make still get through. So it's not like I don't make some cards. I just don't make quite as many as I used to as far as finished cards.

Next question. Next question is from Aqua Volsi. Okay. Can you convince your dad to cosplay at the next event he's at? Do you know what cosplaying is? I do know what cosplaying is, and I think you would love to go as yourself. You're pretty good.

I've actually seen people, like, dress up as you for Halloween and stuff. Yeah, one year in my whole office, all of R&D dressed up like me for Halloween. That's so funny. I guess it's an easy costume. You can cosplay yourself. Oh, super easy. I'm not that big into cosplaying, so I'm not sure you'll see me cosplaying as something other than me. So, Sarah's failed.

Oops, sorry. Okay, next question's from Indigo. Okay. When you set out to do a new expansion, is the first consideration the artistic flavor of it or the mechanics? Well, I talk about whether something's top-down or bottom-up. Top-down means you start with the flavor and then figure out mechanics to match the flavor. Bottom-up is we start with mechanics and then figure out flavor to match the

mechanics. I like doing both. We do both. Part of what makes Magic fun is we keep trying. Each set is made slightly differently than the last and so it changes. There are different sets that go both directions. Innistrad is very much started from a top-down. Ravnica was very much started from a bottom-up.

So both end up making really cool sets. Okay. Next question is from Andin. If you could purge one card from the entire history of Magic, which, if any, would you remove? I would remove Leeches. It's the only card in Magic that gets rid of Poison. I would get rid of that. That's what I'd get leeches. It's the only card of magic that gets rid of poison. I would get rid of that.

That's what I would get rid of. I mean, there's a lot of... I mean, as far as other choices I can make, there are a lot of color pie breaks and soft that annoy me, but there's a whole bunch of them. There's only one card that removes poison that shouldn't be there. So if I only get to remove one card, I'll take the one that I can fix the one problem.

Color pie breaks, there's so many. I can't fix it with one card. Okay. Next question is from Basic HP Fan. What is your favorite card you have ever designed? Oh, so the funny thing is I get asked this question all the time. If you've ever listened to me be interviewed, this is a super, super popular question I get. In fact, if you ever watch me interview, the line I usually use when someone asks me that is they'll say,

so which of my children do I love more? That's the line I always use. Oh, that's funny. So, I mean, there's a lot of answers. I've made a lot of cards. I mean, the card I most often will talk about is either Morrow, just because it's named after me, and it allowed me to become part of the game, and that was kind of cool. Or I'll say Doubling Season, because that's just the mechanical card that I made that I'm kind of proudest of having made.

But there's lots and lots of cards. Mindslaver, it was a problem I had to solve that I eventually figured out how to solve that was really cool Walk the Plank there's a lot of individual cards I made they're just kind of nice little very elegant little bubbles of things that I think are really cool so there's really no one

card if I have to pick one it's either Marrow or Doubling Seeds that's what I normally give as my answer next question is from Isaac If I have to pick one, it's either Mara or Dublin Seas. That's what I normally give as my answer. Next question is from Isaac. How does the crew of Weatherlight board the ship? Hashtag Weatherlight. So what happens is the ship can come very close to the ground.

It doesn't actually touch the ground, but it can come very close and float close to the ground, and then they have ladders they can throw over the side, and they can climb down. That is how they board and onboard. But they can get pretty close to the ground, and then they have ladders they can throw over the side and they can climb down. That is how they board and onboard. But they can get pretty close to the ground. Not on the ground, that would damage the ship, but they can get very, very close to the ground. Close enough that the ladders

can get them there. Next question is from Whitman. The most useful thing I learned about games from Mark's podcast was how certain parts of a game can restrict the possibility space of other parts of The most useful thing I've learned about games that I've learned. What's the most useful thing you've learned? Like about designing the game?

I don't know. Games. It's an open question. About? What have you learned? What is? About, okay. Specifically about know games. It's an open question. What have you learned? Specifically about designing games,

you have to be open to other ideas and stuff. You can't be restrictive to only what you're thinking. It's nice that you have a whole team that you get to work with. For just the most useful thing about games in general, maybe like, I don't know. Okay, that's fine. That's, maybe like, I don't know. Okay, that's fine. That's a fine answer. I don't know.

Okay, next question. Next question. Let's see. From Ford1, what's the best advice you've ever received but didn't take? Okay, you think about that and I'll think about that. I have no idea. There's advice that I didn't take at the time that I look back and I realize that I made a mistake.

It's funny. Probably the thing that most impacted my life where I think I made a wrong decision was back when I worked in Hollywood. My very first agent was back when I worked in Hollywood. I, my very first agent named Talia, who I really liked,

she decided to not be an agent. She had, I was one of her very first clients. She tried it for like a year and then decided that it wasn't what she wanted to do. So she ended up, she worked with another agent, so I ended up taking that new agent. But that new agent really didn't have room for her clients.

And so she set up a meeting with two different people for me to talk with. And I went and I met with both of them. And one of them I felt that I had a better connection with. I just intuitively felt better about. But the other one on paper was a lot better. They had a bigger agency and in theory they could do more for my career. And I had to choose between sort of following my heart and following my head. And I was instructed by a bunch of people that your heart could lead you

astray. Follow your head. And I think I made a huge, I did, I did. I followed my head in that situation and it led to bad things happening. And, and I mean, on some level, I don't think my life would be where it is. I wouldn't have my daughter. So maybe me making the decision was all for the best, but, uh,

it is a decision. I, I since realized that following my heart is more important than following my head. That my, my gut tends to be a little bit better than like on paper, this is the right move is not, not as good as this feels.

Right. So I, I, since that time I've become a very intuitive decision maker. Okay. Next question is from Richard. What's the best last worst thing about having an awesome game nerd for a dad? I don't think there's anything bad about it. I think it's all good things that I'm introduced to all these games and all these people and like i said earlier we need to go places and um i don't know it's there's nothing bad about it um oh this is fine oh good yeah yeah they're trying to get you dish on me so no no okay so we we have time for like two more questions two more questions okay

um this question from magic follower what does your dad do that makes you laugh the most? What do I do? What do you do? No, just every day he comes up with different dad jokes and different random things that makes me laugh. There's not one specific thing that he does. One thing I do find really funny, though, is that he gets really emotional whenever we watch movies and stuff. And the rest of us are laughing about it and joking. And he's over in the corner tearing up. We think it's so funny. I'm glad me having emotional considerations.

I mean, we just think it's really funny. Because the rest of us are fine. We're laughing. And you're, like... Yeah, well, it's a touching story. In the corner, like, crying. Okay, we have time for one final... One final question. This is the big final question.

So, do you have a big finale, a big final question? Um, not really. I mean, it could just be a question. I know. Um... A lot of these are excellent, like, for Rachel, but that's fine. Rachel's my older sister and she's the one in college

yeah a few people who wrote in questions when I said I was with my daughter I said Sarah specifically but they confused her with Rachel so there's a couple like

how are you enjoying college and Sarah's like well I haven't gone to college yet I'll let you know I'm enjoying high school though okay last question

okay last question oh my gosh why did I pick that pop pop what pop potatoes it's like hippopotamus i think but popopotamus oh no that's not it's potatoes oh potatoes oh potatoes potatoes potatoes potatoes potatoes okay okay how old were your kids if when did you wait wait what oh how old what okay sorry how old were your kids if when you introduced them the magic how did that go i've got three kids with the oldest about to turn four so i've got time to plan any recommendations for kids games are appreciated

too okay so i taught all three of my kids roughly when they were about eight. Yeah. And Adam, my son, is the only one that has stuck with it. Both Rachel and Sarah have said what else you got. So, but yeah, I taught you eight. So what I find is kids seem to be ready somewhere between six to eight.

It depends on your kid. I find that eight is the point where most kids can handle it. And that six is some kids. And it kind of depends. Uh, one of the things I recommend when you're teaching kids is just stripping down and do a simpler version. So when you play with them, there's just less, less stuff going on. And lean into what your kid likes.

If they love goblins or elves or dragons or whatever, you know, lean into so that the thing they're playing with is something they're really excited by. Or like we have dinosaurs. or dragons or whatever, you lean into so that the thing they're playing with is something they're really excited by. Or like, we have dinosaurs. Whatever your kid's really into, make their first game experience something that they really love. Okay, so today Sarah

is going rock climbing. And we are now here at rock climbing. So I hope you have a good day rock climbing. And thank you for answering all the questions. So this has been

Small Talk with Sarah. So anyway, I hope you guys enjoyed it. And this means it's the end of my drive to work. Well, technically not the end of my drive to work, but the end of this drive to work. And so instead of talking magic, it's time for me to be making magic. I'll see you guys next time. Say bye, Sarah. Bye-bye.