Magic: The Gathering Drive to Work Podcast - #754: Cedric Phillips

Episode Date: July 3, 2020

In this podcast, I talk with Cedric Phillips about streaming and doing commentary.

I'm not pulling out of my driveway. We all know what that means. It's time for the Drive to Work Coronavirus Edition. So I've been having a lot of fun guests and I have another one today. So it is Cedric Phillips. Hello, hello everyone. Mark, thank you for having me. I'm looking forward to sort of, kind of driving to work or driving to my desk at least. You were driving to my desk. So, yeah, it is true. The pandemic has done strange things to us. But I have a lot of fun interviews and I expect you will be another one. So let me start where I've been starting all my interviews, which is how did you start playing Magic? A story I am more than happy to tell.

So when I grew up in Strongsville, Ohio, a suburb of Cleveland, I had a friend named John Cross who I met on the school bus because he could beat Mega Man X and I couldn't. And so we became friends based off solely that video game. And over time, you know, we would play video games. And one day we were on the bus coming home from school and he showed me a Polar Kraken. And he said, this card is a card from Magic the Gathering. And I'm like, I don't even know what that is.

But the artwork in this card looks really cool. So that night, you know know as i did most nights in elementary school i went over his house to play video games and then we played he showed me in some capacity how to play magic and how to cast the polar kraken and what was going on with that and i was like this looks fun and different and then we started playing like some free-for-all games in his basement with some friends and then all of a sudden i was hooked and i was going to the local card store and buying booster packs occasionally when I could. Then I found out about tournaments and now 20 odd years later, here I am on a podcast with you.

So that's, I guess, how it all started was Polar Kraken. So was Ice Age, what was the set that was out at that time? That's Ice Age. I mean, I know Polar Kraken was Ice Age, but it was, Polar Kraken was the set at the time? I'm pretty sure, I'm pretty sure Ice Age was the set at the time. I can't say with absolute certainty, but I know for sure that the first booster I bought was Ice Age because I remember opening up a Woolly Mammoth.

Okay. Okay, so we're talking 94-ish if it was Ice Age. Or 95 is Ice Age, sorry. 95 is Ice Age. Okay, so did you play continuously? Or is it something where you played off and on i can't say that i've ever meaningfully stopped um you know so i started you know in my friend's basement and then we would play free for all games and stuff like that we actually had a

ridiculous rule where we had like these decks that were i can't even tell you how big they were but we had a no attack for an hour rule um between the three of us and then after the hour commenced then we could start doing things um so you know it was basically like building up a big fortress and then you were allowed to actually start attacking your opponent so that was how things really started for me and then i found out that there were tournaments locally uh so whatever vintage was back then type one you know i played in one of those at the local store with like a land destruction deck and you know got destroyed but almost won a game and like almost winning a game was a really cool feeling.

And then, you know, I found out about like local tournaments like Grand Prix and things like that because the Grand Prix came to Cleveland in 2002. And then I was like, man, I really like this. And there was JSS during my childhood a little bit. Played all throughout college. And the only real break I took, I think, was my second year in Seattle when I was, you know, getting a real job, quote unquote. And so I wanted to focus on that for a while. But I noticed that something was missing in my life. And my mom told me what it was, which was magic. And so I started playing again and haven't stopped then. So I think the only break I took was, like, in 2011 for, like, eight months.

So your mom, that's responsible for getting you back in magic? Mom is responsible. I blame her for my career path and everything else. I was honestly pretty lost at the time with knowing what to do because, you know, you go to college and you graduate and you're supposed to use your degree and all these other things that you're, quote, supposed to do, unquote. And I just wasn't really happy. You know, I had a professional magic career that we may talk about at some point today that had moments of success and moments of failure. But I remember uh very vividly uh because you live in seattle

so you probably know the city queen anne was sitting in a parking lot in queen anne um with like no money no job had no idea what i was doing and i called my mom you know basically crying and being like i don't understand what went wrong high school was so easy college was so easy i was a winning magic player for a long time and now like i don't have what went wrong. High school was so easy. College was so easy. I was a winning Magic player for a long time. And now, like, I don't have anything. And she was just like, you should go back to playing Magic. And I was like, I hate Magic. I don't want to do that.

And she's like, you don't hate Magic. It's actually one of the only things I ever see that makes you happy. So you should go back to playing Magic. And I was just like, all right. And then all of a sudden, you know, like, people, this was, like, right in the infancy of Twitch, right, when that was starting. And I was like, I don't know. I guess people are doing this. So I guess I'll try that.

And one thing led to another. I got a pretty popular Twitch stream, I got coverage opportunities, and then boom, I'm making a career out of it. So thanks, mom, I think. Okay, let's back up a little bit because we'll get to the Twitch stuff. But let's talk about your professional career. Because that is something of interest. So how did you get into playing professionally? All right, so JSS is kind of where it started um my dad would take me to uh a store like uh like there was a day it's like about 30 minutes from where i grew up and so can we play with jss you you and i know what jss is but why don't we explain what jss is i'm saying it like everyone knows what it is which isn't true it's the junior super series and you might

actually be able to explain this a little bit better than i can but you know it was tournaments for i think uh kids like 18 years and younger yes and then uh like if you did well then you could win like money for college uh scholarships yeah so i'll explain i mean real quickly for those that don't know um so what happened was back in the day due to some weird rules we couldn't award prizes to people that are 18 or under so what we did instead is we made a separate ceremony but what we were allowed to do due to some weird rules, we couldn't award prizes to people that are 18 or under. So what we did instead is we made a separate ceremony. But what we were allowed to do was give them money

that we could use for scholarship. So we set up this whole thing called the Junior Super Series. And the idea was it was for 18 and under. And the money you won went toward paying scholarship. That's how it worked.

And some younger people, you could be on the pro tour. If you were under 18, you were allowed to play on the pro tour, but there was weird stuff that went on. But the Junior Super Series was really meant for the younger players, and a lot of pros that people know, a lot of them, started on the Junior Super Series.

So anyway, how old were you when you started? Oh boy, I want to say like 13 or 14. I don't remember for sure. I remember with, like, incredible accuracy the store that I played in for JSSs. It was a store in Cuyahoga Falls, Ohio, called Game Trader. And this was, like, you know, this is... Cuyahoga Falls.

That's my... I'm from Cleveland. Yeah, yeah. So this is, like, you know, I'm going over there. It's a store over in Cuyahoga Falls. And, like, I'm playing there. And, like, this is my first experience of, like, hey, my dad's going to take me to a tournament with a bunch of people I don't know.

And like, I have to make friends and I don't know what their decks are going to look like because this is also like really before the internet is all set up and everything like that. So, you know, I've got my deck and I think it's good. I'm not sure if it's good.

And then, you know, you start making some friends and you might see them in other JSS locations. And it's kind of in the same way that, you know, you might make friends playing sports on travel teams and stuff from other areas that aren't the same you grew up in. So I met some friends that way. And then I found some local stores that had tournaments where I was from. There was like, you know, a ten dollar tournament on Wednesdays at Hoppy Town USA in Strongsville. And then every Saturday in my in my years in high school at my my local store, which is still there and I still go to when I go home, Ground Zero Comics in Strongsville, Ohio.

There's a $5 win a box tournament. First place was win a box. No other prizes. Right. And so I used to love playing those tournaments. And we got like 30 people for those tournaments. It got like this recognition around Northeast Ohio of, oh man you gotta go on saturdays to round zero uh because like it's a cool environment and like there's a lot of good people there

so i started playing there started meeting people in ohio like tim ayton um who was a really accomplished magic player in the area and all of a sudden like i'm kind of learning from these people that are way better than me uh grand prix cleveland comes to town in 2002 and you know some of my local friends are playing in that and then some of the people i've met at other stores are playing in that i ended up getting 20th place which was second place for amateur prize which was a thing they used to have way back in the day and now all of a sudden i'm like wait a minute am i like really good at this which i mean i think i was okay um and so you know now now i'm starting like okay mom and dad can i like go to grand prix detroit you know because that's like a couple hours outside of cleveland and all of a sudden my mom who was really protective is like

i don't think so that's like two and a half hours away and then you know my friends and their parents convince them it's okay and so we'd go there and you know have a good time at that and all of a sudden like i'm working myself into like this is really fun traveling is cool playing magic is cool i'm okay at the game but not not great, but I love doing this. There's, I think the Dojo was online at that point. Star City Games is online at that point. Magic Online is working itself into its infancy at that point. And then Grand Prix Columbus 2004 is where I kind of had my breakout performance. I ended up making top eight of that tournament, a tournament that a colleague of yours, Mike Turian, won his last Grand Prix victory that qualified me for my first Pro Tour in Pro Tour San Diego, which I believe Turian top aided as well. And all of a sudden, it's just snowballs from there.

I'm in heaven. This is all I want to do is play Magic. Okay. So how long did you do professional play? How long was that? I would say that I kind of wrapped up my professional career realistically at the end of 2010. I would consider my last professional tournament that I really cared deeply about was Pro Tour Amsterdam. That was won by Paul Rietzel with White Weenie, which was a deck I was known for playing that I did not play in the tournament.

Severe regret to this day, because it was probably the best deck at the tournament. And I get made fun of a lot for not playing it when it was actually the best thing to be doing uh and i decided to step away from from the game then uh for a lot of different reasons frustration with performance um monetary reasons i needed to actually just get a get a job and get a little more stable because i was just out of college at that point and you know i've kind of come and gone professionally and you know i've qualified for probably seven or eight pro tours past that and, um, have won a state championship and at top eight at a Grand Prix and some other things like that. But, uh, as far as like when I was, you know, all the way deep in the deep end of the pool of playing competitive magic, that's when I stopped was at the conclusion

of that tournament. Okay. So how long after you stopped was the moment in the car talking to your mom? What's, what's the gap of time there? there oh i want to say probably two years maybe a little bit less than that okay um where i had just never forget like i had just i i picked up some life insurance job selling life insurance like door-to-door life insurance salesman and i was just like this is horrible i can't do this like i don't know what happened i went to school for restaurant management and now i'm a door-to-door life insurance salesman, and I hate this, and people are screaming at me when I knock on their door. And I'm just like, everything's going wrong.

I don't understand. And my mom's like, well, you know, you can always just go back to magic. And I'm like, I don't want to do that. And she's like, you do. You do. So I think it was two years later. Okay, so was Twitch, what was the first thing you did once you started getting back in? Twitch, really.

You know, like I started playing online a little bit, but, you know, I just, I talked to some of my friends, and I was like, I don't really know how to set up a Twitch stream or everything else. So I just kind of started looking at other Twitch streams and decided, you know, one of the things that, sorry, I did my research on this was, okay, if I'm going to do this, I actually have to know what I'm doing. This isn't a thing where it's just like, I'm going to do this casually because I don't really do anything casually. If I'm going to do it, I'm going to do it to the best of my ability. And I was like, I want to learn and see who's doing well and what's doing well.

So at that time, you know, players like AJ Soccer and Michael Jacob were having success streaming. And I was like, OK, there's there appears to be interest in this. So let me figure out what's what the positives and negatives are. And the biggest thing I figured out while doing this, Mark, was like no one had a set schedule. They would just go live when they wanted to go live. And I was like, that doesn't make any sense to me. It would be like whatever your favorite television show is. It's just, and it's on.

It's just like, well, I didn't know it was coming on today. Like, I would like to know when to actually go watch, you know, Breaking Bad or whatever. I mean, I guess it's 2020. So whatever the show is that people are watching right now, like what I, you can't just have shows come on at random times. So I decided I was going to make a schedule and stick to the schedule and people would know when to find me every day uh and i would schedule for the same amount of time no matter how long it was going i think it was generally three hours and you know after my three hours was up you know i

wasn't going to stay any longer and if you enjoyed what you saw i'll be back tomorrow or whatever the next day is my schedule and i think that gave me a competitive advantage and then the biggest thing too is I was just really enjoying it it was just really fun to play magic and entertain people and um started to win a little bit again and you know all that together was just like I'm building a community I'm having fun with people I'm listening to music I'm singing I'm being myself turned up to 10 I'm just going to keep doing this okay so you do twitch you're doing the streaming okay well what what's the next step what what

goes beyond that all right so here's the next step uh this is another one of my favorite stories to tell so at that time star city games was running a um was running the as the it was called the open series back then um and i young me brash and full of confidence and vibrance decided i was going to tell them how bad they were doing it which is not the best way to go about getting a job. But I'm vocal. At this point, I've got my confidence back, and I'm building a social media following. And I was telling them that they're just doing such an awful job. It's really bad and everything else.

And at some point, the people in charge are like, hey, if you think you can do so good, why don't you do a show? And I was like, okay, fine, I will. So I do a lot of prep for the show. I do first show with joey pascoe it goes well and after the show's over i get a phone call and they're like hey we'd like you to do more shows like that's a really nice feeling and you know looking back on this now do i feel like a jerk with the way that i approach this yeah this is not the best way to do it but you know 24 25 year old me was a jerk sometimes and so i decided to be pretty vocal about it they gave

me an opportunity i took advantage of the opportunity and did as good a job as i as i thought i could do they liked it and it went from you know do you want to do one show to like do you want to do like you know another show it's all of a sudden it's like hey do you want to do like a show a month and and and to note my my life at that time is my streaming my my streaming income is my income. And then these shows that I'm getting offered to do with very little pay, it's like, well, this is what I got to work off of. And I'm living out of my friend's bedroom. And here we go.

So I started doing a couple more shows. And people were enjoying the commentary. And I was enjoying doing it. It was a lot of fun. I wanted to bring a much more professional approach to it. And I was fortunately given the opportunity to do that. And all of a sudden, now I'm streaming and I'm doing coverage of the SCG, well, the Open Series then, the SCG Tour now. Okay. So, and how long have you been doing that? It's been a while, right?

My first show was in June 2012 at Origins in Columbus. We are in year eight. So let's talk a little bit. One of the things I like to dive in a little bit is what people do and what goes into being a commentator. What is the special sauce that makes you good at it? Well, I think the first thing is prep. I think that's the biggest thing. If you're going to do this, you have to come off as an expert in the booth. So that means you have to know the names of the cards,

all the texts on the cards. You need to know the players and what their accomplishments are and who they are to the best of your ability. And you have to go into this knowing your stuff, right? Like if I don't know that Giant Growth is a green mana instant plus three plus three, what the heck am I doing here, right? If I don't know that Reed Duke is, you know, one of the best Magic players of all time and his personality and the way that he plays and, you know, his tendencies and stuff like that or William Jensen or Kai Bude or anything like that, you know, first things first is you've got to do your prep. After that, you have to, I think, practice. The nice thing about the Internet is there's tons of footage of games.

You can put that footage on mute and do your own thing if you want to, you know, in the same way that, you know, if you're a kid and you love basketball and, you know, you've got the ball in your hand and you're doing the turnaround jumper as the clock is going down, three, two, one, you shoot the shot like you're Michael Jordan or preferably LeBron James, then, you know, you practice. And you're going to be terrible at it to begin

because you're going to be terrible at every new thing you do generally. But you practice over time, you try to get better and you get feedback and stuff like that. And you try to be comfortable in front of a camera and you learn from your mistakes and you review the things that you've done and you just consistently try to improve. And that's all I ever try to do.

Okay, so one of the things that I'm always very interested in when I talk to people is one of the things that's awesome to me about magic is that there's a lot of communities, right? There's a lot of different people enjoying it in very, very different ways. Yep. is sort of have them, like, what are things that you love that you do kind of introduce to people that maybe they don't like, either streaming or commentary, watching, like, the live stuff. How do you introduce to somebody that's never done that before?

For example, let's take streaming. How would you introduce streaming to someone who's never watched streaming before? So just a brand-new person who's never watched a magic stream before? Yeah. Well, I'm a magic player. I've never seen streaming before. Why might I want to watch streaming?

Why might I want to do that? Well, I think you want to watch streaming because you like magic is the biggest reason. And the nice thing with magic streaming is because it's grown so much from when I was doing it eight, nine years ago, I guess now, is there's a ton of different audiences. If you like limited streams, there are streams for that. If you like, you know, modern or pioneer or whatever format suits your fancy, you know, you can find that. And the nice thing is you can find a personality that you like or matches up with your personality because the common bond is the fact

that you like magic, right? That's what's getting you in the door. And then after that, you have to find, okay, well, what aspect of magic do I like? And, you know, obviously you know this because, heck, you designed the game. There's a million different ways to play magic. From commander to standard, you can be competitive, you can be casual, you can be somewhere in between, whatever.

And so now it's about finding which tree branch of magic is the one for you. And fortunately for people who like magic, there's a ton of streams out there, and you can find the person or the format of the personality that resonates with you and learn more about that person and maybe, you know, ideally enjoy that person. And that's why, you know, you see some streams that have a really big audience and you see some streams that have a small audience, but for the streams that have a small audience, the people who watch that stream really like that person, you might actually like that stream. There's plenty of streams that I watch across different games and in Magic that the people only have like 40 viewers. But like, I actually like that stream. There's plenty of streams that I watch across different games and in Magic that the people only have like 40 viewers.

But I really like that streamer, so I'm just going to watch them. It's not always about how many people they have. It's about what resonates with you as someone who's watching a stream. Okay, how about professional play? So one of the ways, I mean, it seems like a lot of what you do

is create entertainment through Magic for audiences, right? The thing that ties the stream and the professional play together is you're presenting magic to people. So let's talk a little bit about watching more professional play. What's the draw for professional play? How does that differ from... Well, the draw for professional play to me is pretty simple.

If you want to watch the best people play this game, that's what professional play is. And the analogy I'll draw here is because I'm a big sports guy, I'm actually wearing a basketball jersey right now, and surprisingly, I want to watch the best basketball players play basketball. It's not a knock to college basketball,

it's not a knock to the G League or anything like that, but I want to watch Kawhi Leonard, I want to watch LeBron James, I want to watch Joel Embiid. I want to watch LeBron James. I want to watch Joel Embiid. I want to watch the best people play and do their thing on the highest level. And if that's what you want to watch, that's where you go to competitive play. That's where you're watching a Grand Prix.

That's where you're watching a player's tour event, a mythic championship, whatever we're calling them nowadays. That's why I gravitate towards professional play, and that's why I know a lot of people gravitate towards professional play. But I also understand that it's not for everybody. So for the people that love it, by all means, check it out. Turn it on. And if there are people that are new to the game that are like,

hey, I want to see what it's like to maybe play at the highest level or see people who do play at the highest level, that's when you tune into those events and you're watching people who have these storied careers and histories and also people that are trying to make a name for themselves play Magic at the highest of levels. And for me, that's a lot of fun to watch. So one of the interesting things,

I always like to find parallels between myself and my guests. I too very much enjoy the entertainment part of Magic, of making content. I mean, you and I make very different content, but... We do. We are both in the content-making business. And one of the things that I find interesting is what drives you to make content?

Why is this the thing that you do? Why are you an entertainer on some level? It seems the things you do is really bring magic to the masses in a way. I don't know. Like, I guess the main reason to the masses in a way i don't know like i guess the main reason i was gonna say i don't know but the main reason is is because it's something that makes me happy uh and if it also makes other people happy then that's totally cool with me um i have loved magic for basically all of the 20 plus years that i've played um there have been some super there have been some high highs and some low lows, but on the whole, you know, I still love, I still love playing like a one mana, two power creature and attacking on turn two. Like that's just never gone out. And if that

ever does go away, then maybe I'll find something else to do. But, you know, I've always enjoyed, you know, streaming when I have the time to do it. I've always enjoyed commentating on matches and bringing entertainment and making people smile and laugh and also just creating moments, too. Because I think that, you know, there are some people out there and I was one of them at one point who take competitive magic and their magic incredibly seriously. And so to be able to frame and narrate that moment for them is also something that I find to be a lot of fun. frame and narrate that moment for them is also something that I find to be a lot of fun because you know for me when I when I was playing competitively heavily in like 2008 2009 2010 you know one thing I would love to do if it were available which it really isn't is just go back and watch the old matches that I played you know at some point over the course of my career now we weren't where we are now with regards to magic coverage but like that'd be fun for me to just

go like yeah that's like the pro tour top eight in 2009 that's my top eight match or anything like that like that stuff's cool to me and to be able to be the voice of those moments is i think a lot a lot of fun i have to say so one of the things that's you i don't know you know uh back in the day back back in the day i used to do commentary um and some of those tapes maybe are floating around. I was not particularly good at it. But the thing I loved most, my favorite moment of doing commentating, was when someone won and you got to do the so-and-so champion. Just that sort of like the moment of announcing them of a thing

and just the sheer excitement. There was something so electric about that. Like I used to interview winners, for example, after they won. And it's, I loved interviewing winners. It was just the most fun interview in the world. Well, you know, they're, they're so happy. And, you know, hopefully they're emotional and they're really feeling the moment because that's, that's how I am personally. And I gravitate towards that sort of thing. But again, with me being such a sports person and being raised so heavily on sports, sports you know I think of infamous sports calls in my head and you know nowadays with Mike Breen doing basketball and there's so many I mean there's so many great

baseball commentators over the years um and even some great ones right now um you know the calls that they have made you know I think I think of there's a call I've been listening to a lot recently of Brent Musburger's call uh and you live in Seattle, so of Griffey rounding third and, you know, them beating the Yankees. I think it's the ALDS in the kingdom, which is no longer here in Seattle. I mean, the crowd is going crazy, and the call is great. It's just like that whole moment of the call,

like the double from Edgar Martinez, the call from Musburger, Griffey running around the bases, all this the crowd going crazy i mean just the whole moment it just is going to live in time basically forever and you know i'm not saying that we're doing those kind of moments here with the commentary we're doing it would be awesome if we can have moments like that enshrined but like just the whole thing uh when it's done well it's like kind of iconic and i i i just really really like that i really enjoy that so what is favorite, like, what is the most iconic moment you can think of,

of all your broadcasting, where a thing happened, it was just, it was sort of, I don't know, the thing that stands out for you? Oh, I mean, that one's, you're not the first to ask this question. Probably won't be the last. But there was a Grand Prix in New Jersey. I can't believe I'm going to say this. Either six or, five or six years ago now it was that gigantic Grand Prix

with like 4,500 people and it was Legacy and Star City ran it and it's just this huge, huge, huge mass of people I'll never forget it when I was doing coverage of that event with Patrick Sullivan with Dias Hunt and Tom Ross made this update with Infect and he was playing against

the person's name always escapes me unfortunately and he was playing against a the person's name always escapes me unfortunately um and he was playing against a land still deck uh that had like main deck copies of sudden shock i mean it was about as bad as the matchup we could get for tom but this is when tom was at the top of his game and i'm calling this match from matthias and yeah the opponent's at like 19 life and tom just comes on in with a noble hierarchy and it's like all right i guess uh i guess we're just gonna try to go for regular damage now which is a fool's errand but all right and then all of a sudden the opponent's down to 14 and now they're down to 11 and i'm just going to myself like is he actually going to pull this off like tom has won some unbelievable games of magic on the std torn and and on the pro circuit

of magic but like this one i'm just going like okay so like they're going to get to five and then they're going to stabilize and tom's like you know fired off pump spells and the opponent's like yeah it's good and i'm like what's happening right now like and this match you can find it on youtube but you know he comes all the way back and i'm just sitting there i'm it takes a lot to make me dumbfounded because i've been playing magic and competitive magic for so long but i'm just sitting there i'm just going like i can't believe what i just watched like he won the match and he ended up losing the tournament in the finals to Brian Brunduin. But just watching that match of the opponent.

And one of the times that I think the opponent draws a sudden shock and blows Tom out and Tom's just moseying on along, more regular damage in his infect that can end up winning the game. The opponent's kind of stunned. I'm blown away and Tom, nothing. Just like business as usual for him. Yeah, the portrait one that I'm reminded of is Brian Davis

versus Bob, Bob Marr Jr. I know this one. Oh, yeah. Yeah, it's that equivalent to on the Pro Tour where like,

the joke is that, the joke is that Brian Davis went 5-0 and lost the tournament. He did. He did. He did with that match. 5-0,

but Bob won. Yeah, so anyway, I think that is online if people want to go watch. Like, just, I mean, Bob Margino, obviously a pro tourer, Hall of Famer, I mean, an amazing player. Just, he manages to win, like, a match that I have no idea how he won it. He should have lost every game. Literally every game he should have lost, and somehow he kept pulling the games out and uh so anyway that's i i do from uh back in my day i used to do a lot of uh i used to do the producing for the pro tour for all the the final day i did that for like eight years um and it is fun because one of the things that uh i always enjoyed was there's this raw energy that

is there in competition that it's so neat when you can be part of that and contribute to that. And I mean, it's one of the things I, I mean, the sense I get from talking to you is how much you enjoy what you do. And yeah, I do. You know, like with any job, you know, there are always going to be positives and negatives,

but on the whole, am I happy doing what I've been doing for the past eight years? Absolutely. You know, this is never how I would have drawn it up. Like I said, I think a little earlier, I went to school for restaurant management. I worked in restaurants for 10 years and playing Magic. And I was hoping to maybe top eight a pro tour one day. And I did that and maybe have some Magic success and really got into it a lot.

But did I expect that I would be someone who people see as one of the faces of the game or a magic commentator or anything like that? No way. But as I did it more and more, you know, I fell in love with it. I decided to study it and learn it as best I could to try to have a voice for it and be able to create those moments. And, you know, one of the nice things that's happened over the past decade, and certainly when you were doing it, it's just, you know, we can see, we see continued growth. The world championships this past year that we did in hawaii uh at the end of that tournament uh i cried i was so happy because like i never thought you know

the reason i started doing coverage mark was because i went to a dota international at pax uh west in like 2011 and i sat there and i wasn't yeah i played some dota at some point in my life but i sat there and i was just like man look at all these people they're just here screaming and like loving this and like the game's on big TVs behind us and everything. And I'm like, what the heck is going on, right? And I'm just thinking to myself, man, magic is so awesome. It deserves to have something like this. Even though magic is so much different from Dota,

our game has been around for so long. And it's unequivocally the best card game of all time. And one of the best games of all time. And I feel like the game deserves to have that. And at Worlds, I was so happy and so emotional because on day three, there was a crowd in the Hawaii Convention Center that we were at. And, you know, I was calling matches with Alias B

and Marshall and Paul were there and Maria was there and Becca was there, you know, we're putting on a show and there's fans, not a ton, but there are people there like cheering as Paulo is making his plays and on his way to winning and stuff like that. And I'm like, yes, let's keep doing this. Like, is it possible? Now, I'm not saying we're ever going to get to the level of like we're filling up gigantic stadiums, but I hope we do.

You know, because I think that that's something that this game really deserves because I just feel like it's the best game in the world. And I don't think it's out of the question that people will be happy to pay tickets for seats to watch like Paulo and William Jensen and Reed Duke and all these great players just do their thing because they're so good at it. And these are entertaining people and personalities. And they're playing the best game in the world. And I always look at it as if other games can do it, we can too.

Well, I have every faith we can. So I see I'm pulling up to my desk yep finally made it there um so any one last thought before we we uh today any reflecting thinking back on sort of your years your 20 years any final thought um it's been a wild ride it's been up and down and all around i've had a lot of fun doing it um i don't know what the future holds with regards to you know we're obviously going through a pandemic right now, so when's the next time I'm going to be able to fly to a convention center and call a tournament? Who knows? We're doing it online

right now. I'm having a blast doing it. Players Tour coverage, STD Tour online coverage, all that other stuff. So I'm hoping that people are enjoying Magic right now. There's so many things coming down the pipeline with Corset 2021 and Jumpstart and Double Masters and everything. And, you know, as I know that the Magic Twitter community and everything else can be up and downstart double masters and everything and you know as i know that the the magic twitter

community and everything else can be up and down and all around and stuff like that but ultimately we're all here for the same thing which is we enjoy magic so you know everybody especially during times like this let's just enjoy playing some magic on arena or magic online or via webcams or however the heck you're doing it just just enjoy playing magic and um appreciate that a lot of people are putting a lot of hard work into to make this thing the best that they can. And I'm trying to do some fun stuff with it. I know a lot of people are, and we're just all trying to get through a turbulent time. And maybe doing that, the easiest way to do that is just, hey, a Plains and a Savannah Lion.

Okay. Well, thank you so much. So I've arrived at my desk. So we all know what that means. It is the end of my drive to work. So instead of talking Magic, it's time for me to be making Magic. But Cedric, I want to thank you for being here. I appreciate you having me. It was a lot

of fun. This is our first, I would say this is our first official meeting, so this is actually pretty cool, even if it is via Zoom. Yes. Well, thank you. It was a joy having you on our show. So anyway, we've got to wrap up. And guys, I will see you all next time. Bye-bye.