Magic: The Gathering Drive to Work Podcast - #804: Luis Scott-Vargas

Episode Date: January 29, 2021

In this podcast, I interview Pro Tour Hall of Famer Luis Scott-Vargas who has worn many hats over the years.

I'm not pulling out of my driveway. We all know what that means. It's time for the Drive to Work Coronavirus Edition. Okay guys, I've been using my time at home to do lots of fun interviews, and today I have one of the best players in Magic. Luis Scott Vargas is here to join us. Hey Luis! Hey Mark, how's it going? Good! So, I'm going to start with a question I ask everybody. How did you learn to play Magic? How did you get into Magic?

Me and my friend Seth, when we were in the fifth grade, we bought a starter deck of Revives and two packs of the Dark each and muddled our way through a bunch of games without knowing the rules, and it just kind of captured me ever since. Were those the sets on sale at the time, or were they older sets that you bought? Like, when was this? Those were the sets on sale at the time or were they older sets that you bought? Like when was this? Those were the sets on sale at the time.

I remember very distinctly a couple weeks after when I was starting to really get into it, saving up for a pack of Legends, which was an old set at that point or older, a year old, whatever. And then when the store ran out, they never got another pack in. So that pack of Legends never materialized. Yeah, so 94. So you started playing in 94. Yeah, in 94. Okay, so 94. So you started playing in 94. Yeah, in 94. Okay, so fifth grade.

So how did you go from playing in fifth grade and not necessarily knowing the rules to actually starting to play competitively? What was that transition? It was a long one. The first competitive tournament I played in was in 2003. So I didn't actually really compete until... Basically, I was in college,

and I had stopped playing magic for a couple years actively and at one point I wandered into a card shop they were going to draft in like an hour and that that's kind of where it went I started drafting on Wednesdays then I started drafting on Wednesdays and Fridays then the the guys at the card shop were like hey you should come to this PTQ and I'm a pretty competitive person and it did not take long for me to get hooked on the like, oh, I could win a PTQ and play on the Pro Tour. All right, I want to do that. Now, had you drafted before that or that your very first draft?

No, I had drafted quite a bit. I used to play a lot. Actually, the reason I took a break from Magic was in high school, my parents got concerned about my grades, which were actually suffering as a result of Magic. was in high school, my parents got concerned about my grades, which were actually suffering as a result of magic. I mean, I think you know what this is like to pour your whole mind into something. Magic has always been like that for me. So when I needed to focus on school, which I'm glad I did, I had to kind of like walk away from magic for a little bit in order to make space for

learning other things. Okay, so you start playing PTQs. So what was the space of time between playing PTQs and actually going to a PT? What was your first PT? It was about a year later. I started playing PTQs in 2003. And then in 2004, there was a Pro Tour in San Diego. And I was living in Northern California at the time. And I remember thinking like, wow, this is a pro tour in California. That sounds awesome. I want to play in that. And I had never really considered flying to a tournament before that. I actually top aided a PTQ for the PT in New Orleans, I want to say, and ended up deciding that I didn't want to fly to a tournament. So I didn't win the PTQ. Okay so San Diego was your first how'd you do your first PT? I went eight and seven and I was very happy with that I made day two I had more wins than losses I

didn't win any money or anything but I played against a bunch of awesome players felt like I could hold my own like I actually felt even though I didn't do like fantastically I felt that I had a really good shot in every match I played I didn't I didn't feel like i didn't belong there okay so what was your first top eight uh my first top eight was berlin in 2008 so that four years later okay oh your first top eight was your first win yeah yeah okay and i've never gotten back there since actually uh but uh yeah i i ended up it it's funny how these things work where going into ber, it was like near the end of the season. It was the second year I had played professional Magic. Like I consider myself a Magic pro starting in 2007.

That was the first year I played all the pro tours and kind of got a pro level as a result. End of 2008, I wasn't doing well that season. I thought, hey, you know, maybe it's time to move on to something else. Ended up squeaking into top eight on tiebreakers at 12 and 4, winning the Pro Tour. And that opened a lot of doors. And I haven't left since. OK, so one of the things is, I mean, there's a couple of different places this goes. So I'm going to pick some and we'll bring it back, Fred.

So one of them, I know in 2009, you launched Channel Fireball. Let's talk about that a little bit. in 2009 you launched Channel Fireball. Let's talk about that a little bit. Yeah, it was, I was working for a card store slash website in Northern California called Adventures in Cards and Comics. Great friends with the owner, Avram. He took a chance on me and Paul Chion in 2006 when no one had any idea who we were and we were going to nationals and he sponsored us. And that was like a pretty big deal to us. But in 2009, John Sassa, who's the owner of Channel Fireball now and was the owner of Superstars of Sports back then, had an idea for this visionary magic website that would make draft videos,

which at the time weren't even really a thing. And I bought into his vision. I thought he had a good thing going, and we ended up launching Channel Fireball in 2009, kind of right after I top-aed Pro Tour Kyoto, where I lost Tennessee from the finals. I want to... I'm a huge pun fan, and it took

me years to get that Channel Fireball was a pun, sadly. Yes, the original logo had a TV, because it was Channel, like a TV channel, and Channel Fireball, of course, the magic combo. One of the first magic combos. There's not many older than that one. Yeah, well, yeah.

I mean, there's other alpha combos, but that is probably the classic. I mean, there's a few other famous early ones. But yeah, that is probably the most powerful win-the-game combo, I guess. Okay, so you start doing Channel Fireball. It means you start writing articles, doing videos. So there's an interesting track right here that starts to happen part of your life is you're you're still a pro player you're you're playing on pro tours and you're also kind of a becoming a personality becoming a a magic so which path you want to go down first well it's funny because i i've always

considered those two paths they are different but, but linked, because even before Channel Fireball, I wrote for Star City Games. I made videos for adventures. And I always saw the job of pro Magic player as not fully complete without doing something else. And it made so much sense to make content because you're already spending all this time thinking about Magic, playing Magic.

And it's a way to kind of have your cake and eat it too, where you get to write articles about your process and your decks and all that, and then you also get to use those in the tournaments, and hopefully both of those can provide you with a bit of security. Yeah, one of the things I know that's one of the weirder things for pro players who write is there's this tension between wanting to provide interesting content and not kind of giving away your tech, if you will, that you want to sort of share what you're doing,

but, you know, there is a competitive edge when you're a good player. How did you balance that? I've always been much more on the side of just writing what I want to write about and not worrying too much about it. It changes kind of based on how I'm preparing for the event. If I'm preparing with a team of other players, I don't feel it's my place to write about a deck we're all playing because that could put them at an advantage.

Whereas I'm perfectly fine taking that risk myself because I've always felt, I don't know, I feel like some portion of it is responsibility to people who are reading. I would never want to write something that wasn't true. But part of it is I just think it is more interesting. Like you said, it's more exciting to share breaking news. And I've actually kind of liked the move to open deck lists at tournaments recently, which has kind of happened out of necessity thanks to everything being online now.

But I like it because I get to post my deck list as soon as they're turned in, and I get to talk about all the different things that go into it. And that gives people up-to-date information where they can play the same deck I'm playing in a Pro Tour in a PTQ that same weekend, because I've already written about the deck. So do you find... Being a Magic celebrity, if you will, being someone that people know,

is a weird thing. I mean, obviously, I have some first-hand experience here, but... So what is it like? So you spend a lot of time sort of getting out there, letting people sort of be a conduit to to to magic. Share a little bit. What is that like interacting with the public in a way where they just know who you are? It's interesting. I think a lot of people have started to like the term parasocial relationship has started to become more more widely known where, you know, and I know you know what this is like too,

where people feel like they have, they know you because they've listened to you talk for hundreds of hours or watch your videos or watch your stream. And it's not, it's a sort of thing where I, it doesn't really bother me. I like parts of it and parts of it can be a little, a little interesting. One thing that it has kind of made me feel is i'm glad i'm not a real celebrity like i'm not you know a movie star who who walks out onto the street and people want

to take pictures with them because i don't know about you but that's that's not my life there's a lot of magic fans there's not that many magic fans and yeah i would really not like having you know going to grab a bite to eat and have people like kind of kind of uh wanting to talk to you there that would feel pretty weird to me yeah it's interesting like uh i think it's fun when i go to magic events that there is a certain amount you know like you get to be the celebrity but then if that was me at the grocery store if that was all the time everywhere oh my i don't know how i would handle that that that really made me understand like what uh a truly famous person must go through.

Yeah. And I've had a couple, you know, I've had a couple dozen experiences where someone recognized me outside of a magic context, but it's rare enough that it's cool and it's not like invasive, you know? So I really like it. The thing I like most about what I do is when people say, hey, I got into magic because of you, or I had quit magic, but your videos got me back in, or you have made me enjoy magic more. That's the part that I think is the most fun about it, because what I do somehow made someone's life a little bit happier. And there's not really a much higher compliment you can get than that.

Okay, so while we're talking about stuff you're doing, I need to bring up limited resources. So you have a podcast that you do. Now, how did that come about? How did you end up on that? So Marshall and I have been friends ever since kind of like the, actually the Magic Cruise, the one in 2012, I think it was. We were on the Magic Cruise together and we played in the Community Cup together, the Magic Online Community Cup. And then, of course, we've since then also done many hundreds of and we played in the Community Cup together, the Magic Online Community Cup.

And then, of course, we've since then also done many hundreds of hours of coverage in the booth together. And at one point, Brian Wong had decided his time with the podcast was done. He wanted to move on to other things. And I knew Marshall was looking for a co-host. So I asked him, hey, do you want me to be on the show? And it's funny because I feel like the new guy, I feel like the new co-host, but I'm actually the longest running one, except for, of course, Marshall at this point,

because I've been on for seven years now, which it feels like it's been a year. I don't know. It's crazy how time works in some of this stuff. Yeah, for the audience that might not know this, explain real quickly what Limited Resources is. What kind of podcast is it? Limited Resources is a weekly podcast, kind of nominally about limited but we we as podcasts do talk about life other parts of

magic what you know kind of a lot of what we feel like talking about but our main focus really is trying to give people actionable advice to to get better at limited and to make better decisions so that's that's kind kind of how we approach things. And yeah, it's a lot of fun. I love doing it. Okay, so let's go a little bit to the other path, the pro player path. So let's talk a little bit about what that was like.

So you win, your first top eight is you win in Berlin, but that's the first of what, 10 top eights? Yeah, it's 10 now. And then whatever the, like, Zendikar championship... I don't know. The systems have changed a lot the last couple years. I top 8-ed a Premier event recently. I don't really know what that means

in terms of that sort of thing. But, yeah, I've had good fortune, been in the right place at the right time, and I think I know how to play cards. So I've gotten some top 8s as a result place at the right time, and I think I know how to play cards, so I've gotten some top hits as a result. So what, I mean, so what, 2013, you made the Hall of Fame. So let's talk a little bit about your sort of rise in Magic. What is that like?

I mean, by any account, you were one of the best players to ever play Magic. I mean, you know, there's arguments about, you can rank the top people and never, you know, but you're clearly in the top echelon, you know. So, like you said, you started playing competitively and then sort of, you started paying more attention and then talk a little bit about that,

that sort of rise up the ladder of being a pro player. It's funny, I feel like there was a lot of, like, exit opportunities for me, but they never materialized. And I'm really glad they didn't. I feel like there was a lot of like exit opportunities for me but they never materialized and i'm really glad they didn't i i feel like i'm happier doing this than almost anything else i could be doing but uh the big one that really put me on this path was i qualified for nationals in 2006 and this is back when u.s nationals was like a really big deal you know this is all the best players in the u.s coming and there was a big prize you got to be on the national team and represent the u.s at the world championships and uh i tried to cancel my

flight there because i decided i just didn't really want to play magic competitively i decided yeah that maybe this isn't for me i don't know i i've gone back and forth you know in terms of committing to this and uh they wouldn't give me my money back so i said all right well i'll get on the airplane and uh i ended up getting third and uh my best friend paul chion got first who now you're not one of your co-workers actually yes what what year what year was that 2006 2006 okay so that was both of our first breakout performances and we got to be on the team together uh along with ben lunk which is another good friend of ours and who actually also works at wizard now my time is limited apparently but uh yeah we we went to paris did badly but you know at that point i had the bug and i really decided that i was going to

take a year i just graduated from college that same year to figure out if this was going to be for me and ended up you know doing well enough in 2007 to to get the equivalent of platinum for that year and that kind of set things in motion where then in 2008, I won the Pro Tour. And at that point, you know, we launched Channel Fireball and I followed it up with like a second place finish in Kyoto. And I was pretty firmly ensconced into wanting to compete professionally and do the best I could. A lot of that was about wanting to prove myself.

And I have this competitive urge. When I wasn't playing competitive Magic, I was playing competitive Street Fighter. There's something about competing against other people that really drives me and is something that I think I need to some degree. So there was one point I know... One of the things about being a professional player

is there's some hot and coldness that goes on, right? There's seasons where you do real well and then seasons where you kind of struggle. I know early on you had some hot and cold seasons. What was it that sort of kept you around? I know that, like, one of the things that's interesting of watching Magic is, like, you have this drive to compete, obviously,

but what was it, what about Magic, like, what is it about Magic that sort of, why is that the thing you choose to compete at? Well, I mean, part of it, I think, is my aptitude for it. Like, I clearly, you know, something about the game speaks to me in where I understand it well. Like, I'm not arrogant enough to think that I would be the best at anything I tried.

It so happens that Magic, you know, pushes my buttons the right way and I understand it. The other is I think it's the best game ever made. Like I think that Magic has this combination of luck, skill, new content every couple months, infinite combinations. All of that together means it's this infinite process of exploration and discovery that I just don't get tired of. And yeah, sometimes there's lulls. Actually, right now, right before call time comes out, there's a couple of magic formats

that I'm not really interested in playing because it's been the same cards for a couple months. They've kind of been explored. But guess what? In two weeks or whatever we're gonna have all these new puzzles to kind of decipher and figure out and understand and something about that has always made me really like it's always captured me and even when i wasn't playing competitively even when i was you know a teenager in high school just spending hours upon hours just thinking about magic and building bad decks and all that stuff.

Like, I didn't need an end goal besides that itself. So you mentioned commentating. Let's talk a little bit about commentating because that's one of the many hats that you've done. How did you get into commentating, and how do you feel about commentating? So I got my break into commentating because Rich Hagan and bdm uh asked me to be in the booth

with them for the pro tour finals and i want to say 2013 like put your gate watch i think might have been the first time uh and then that went pretty well it was really fun commentating with those two guys they're excellent at their at their at their job. And then I was hired on to do Worlds. I wasn't qualified for Worlds that year. So I went and Marshall and Zach Hill and Rashad and Sheldon are among the folks who I remember working with that year. At some point, Greg Collins, of course, starts to be in charge of all this. I didn't know as much about the organization when I first joined, so I could be getting some of the names wrong in terms of what they were doing. And then from then, I was kind of a mainstay in terms of I always did the Pro Tour finals. And then eventually what we kind of transitioned into was if I didn't make top eight of the Pro Tour, I would come in and be in the booth on Sunday.

And I think I got prepared for this by the fact that I'd been doing draft videos for four or five years at that point. And, you know, now streams, I guess guess like what sitting there talking about magic was something that came naturally to me and I can react pretty quickly to what's going on so I'm able to keep up with the game though many players make it kind of easy because people don't tend to play that fast when you're watching the higher the stakes the slower the plays is what I found but I've at this point done many many hours hours of commentating. Not as much recently every now and then, but you know, sometimes I do more of one thing, sometimes I do more of another. I mean, I took a year off to do commentary in 2016 actually, so I spent that year doing commentary instead of playing. So what, for the people that have never

done commentary, what is the hardest part about doing commentary, do you think? The hardest part is that walking into the booth, you have to have this pretty vast reservoir of knowledge to be able to do your job, to be able to competently commentate. And so commentators come in kind of like two flavors. There's two roles, at least. That's how Magic is set up. And that's how many sports broadcasts are set up. There's a reason for this. It's the play-by-play commentator who's kind of narrating what is happening and then there's like the color commentator or the analyst who's kind of telling you the like whys and explaining the bigger picture and context and i tend to be in the analyst role i have done a fair amount of

play-by-play but you know usually i'm better suited for the color commentary role in both roles you have to just know all this stuff because you don't have time to look it up or think of it. It's kind of like if you watch someone commentating basketball, you watch a basketball game, the play-by-play commentator is not looking up who the players are. They know everything about every player on the court, all their stats, and maybe when one of the third string guys comes in,

they might not know quite as much about them, but you can tell they just know tons about every single person who's playing and magic it's kind of like that you have to know every card in every deck and you have to know what matters in all the matchups and then you also have to talk about what's actually happening and why it might be happening so there's a lot of prerequisites to doing it but i've also found that once you get there you can pick up commentary and kind of go back to it even if you haven't been super current as long as you spend some time familiarizing yourself with what's going on yeah the thing i find interesting about commentary is a lot of commentary is making sure the audience understands what's really going on

because magic uh back when i i i used to come here a long, long time ago, I was not very good at it, but one of the challenges was the director used to always, because I was the producer as well as the commentator, the producer never understood like, he didn't know magic, and so he was always talking to me, and like, nothing can be going on on the table, yet all

sorts of things are going on, or lots can be going on on the table and nothing's really happening, and that trying to communicate to the audience, like, like one of my favorite, sorts of things are going on or lots can be going on the table and nothing's really happening uh and that trying to communicate to the audience like like one of my favorite uh yeah i see about your favorite comment my favorite commentating moment of all time was um it was brian weissman and um um chris bakula doing you know what i'm talking about? I know what you're talking about, yeah. It was U.S. Nationals 97 or 98. Yeah, it was Lindy versus Mike Long, right? Yeah, it's Lindy versus Mike Long.

And the funny thing was, they're playing, like, multiple football fields away. And they did a really good job of setting up what was going on in the match. And basically, it's like, if Lindy drew a certain card, he was going to win, and nobody wanted Mike Long to win. He was, you know, the villain of all villains. And

he, like, draws the card he needs, and the commentator's done a great job of making the audience understand that this was the moment. If he drew the card, this was the thing. And there's this tiny window that Mike could lose, and Mike was going to win the game unless at this moment this card got drawn, and he drew it, and they screamed so loud, Mike knew he had drawn the card, even this moment this card got drawn and he drew it and they screamed so

loud Mike knew he had drawn the card even though he was like four football fields away yeah I think it was a band Mike Long was playing like yeah yeah and I think and what Lindy was playing uh wait we need there was a video like a cassette tape of the of this this Nationals that got

put together and we would always watch it the the night before PTQs, actually. And I remember they're interviewing Matt Lindy, and he's just like, yeah, we tested so much for this event. Me and my buddies, we worked on this White Leanie list for hours. It was just, it was amazing. I love that video. Okay, so what is your favorite, what's your all-time,

what's your all-time favorite commentating moment in Magic? My all-time favorite commentating moment in Magic? My all-time favorite commentating moment? It's not quite as serious, but it's really funny. So there's our running joke with Marshall. Basically, at one point, he was doing commentary, and some disgruntled Twitter user, or otherwise known as a Twitter user, called him a high-functioning chimp because they said they didn't like his commentary.

And me being the good friend I am, of course, brought that up many, many times. And so we'd all make ape jokes about Marshall and stuff like that. And this is the finals of Pro Tour Oath of the Gatewatch. And one of the players who's playing an Eldrazi deck has Cavern of Souls in their deck. So it's a land, you know, you name a creature type, when you play it, you can tap it for any color

to cast that creature type. And it was to be able to cast Uncounterable Eldrazi. This deck also had Simian Spirit Guide, which is the 2-2 you can pitch for a red, which is obviously there to accelerate out Eldrazi. But I started setting this up because I could see this was going to happen in about two turns, which was they drew Cavern of Souls in their colorless deck, but already had a

cavern naming Eldrazia, and I said, I explained why they were going to play Cavern of Souls naming Ape to cast their Symbian Spirit Guide, which is just like a very odd sequence of plays altogether, and I was doing commentary with Marshall. I don't know. It was one of the more fun moments that I ended up having

in commentary. Okay, so we'll move on to probably your biggest accomplishment, I think, as a Magic player is 2013, you're inducted into the Hall of Fame. So let's talk, how did that come about? What was that like getting inducted into the Hall of Fame? It was incredible. I mean, it's one of, certainly one of my best memories

when it comes to Magic. I got inducted alongside Ben Stark and William Jensen, who are two of my best memories when it comes to Magic. I got inducted alongside Ben Stark and William Jensen, who are two of my closest friends as well. And it was really cool just getting this, you know, like getting this validation that I've done something for Magic, that I deserve to be there, that my results are good. And honestly, it's not just about results, that, you know, results aren't the only thing that go into the hall of fame and it was something that motivated me a lot too i remember um in 2010 at pro tour san diego i was like 12 and oh so i was locked for top eight and i played my next round because i got pared down and i was 13 and oh and at this point 100 locked i could lose my next three rounds and make it and i

remember thinking like i'm gonna try to go 16 and oh because no one's ever done that. And that will help me get into the Hall of Fame. And I ended up doing that. And I remember when I went 16-0, I thought, you know, I've got a really good chance of making the Hall of Fame now. And it was just something that means a lot to me because, I don't know, magic's been a part of my life for now 27 years or something like that. It's undoubtedly, like, the biggest single influence in my life besides my parents. And so getting to be in the Hall of Fame, it's the sort of thing too, where like if you tell someone who doesn't know anything about magic that you're in the Hall of Fame, like they know that means something.

You know, you can explain what a pro tour is to then tell them you've top eighted a bunch. But for someone who doesn't play magic, a pro tour could be a 10-person tournament. They don't really have any context there. So yeah, getting into the Hall of Fame was huge for me. So where did you get inducted? We were in Dublin. Oh, that's a good place to get inducted. Yeah, Dublin's awesome.

They've since actually made the ceremony and the timing a lot better. The induction was 10 minutes before round one started of the Pro Tour, which is, like, honestly one of the worst times you could pick because no one's really wanting to watch because everyone's stressing about sleeving their deck and getting ready for round one. We knew we had to go play in our like suits and stuff like that. And like, you didn't give speeches or anything. The dinners they have now are much nicer, but honestly, that doesn't really matter. So something else that the average person might not know is, what do you get when you get into the Hall of Fame?

You get a very nice ring, like a Super Bowl ring, and then you get lifetime invites to Pro Tours. Kind of weird to talk about that right now because Pro Tours don't exist right now, and Hall of Famers aren't currently getting invited to anything. I meant the ring was part of it. I was actually kind of cool. I don't know if people know that the ring, that there's an actual Hall of Fame ring. Yeah, I've got it with all my cool magic stuff.

It's not the kind of ring you wear around town. I'll say that. Yeah, it's a little splashy. Yeah, here's a little tip. I don't know if you knew this, but as one of the people that put together the Hall of Fame, the invites for the players was added at the absolute last minute.

As a, oh, why don't we invite them to future? That was an afterthought that we did very, very late in the game. It has contributed to John Finkel playing and Kai Booty playing in a lot more tournaments, which I think is pretty cool. Also, I hear we're going to get a new revamped Hall of Fame at some point, and I'm speaking for myself that there's no way you shouldn't be in it. I've always thought that was

an oversight with, or at least it was hard for me to kind of have a Magic Hall of Fame without you in it, but that's new to here and there. My joke had been, if I could get 100 pro points, I think I'd be a shoo-in. Yes, I suppose that's true. So anyway, I'm almost to my desk here.

So is there anything in your years of magic I was trying to hit upon all the different things you've done? But did I miss anything? Is there anything sort of something you want to hit upon that I didn't touch? No, I think that it has done a good job of summarizing all the different places the game has taken me. Well, I want to say that one of the things, so here's a game I normally play with people. Do you remember the first time we met? Oof. I think I do, yeah.

So the running joke is, I'll tell you when I think I first met you, but usually they met me before I remember meeting them. That's the running joke on this show. I'll tell you the first time I think we met and see if it's the same thing. So I think we first met at PT Barcelona. Okay, so that was in 2011?

Something like that? Something like that. Okay, I also thought I met you in 2011, but I thought it was at the Community Cup. Oh, okay. I mean, the Community Cup was before Barcelona, then you met me at the Community Cup. Okay, whichever one of those. I don't remember which one came first,

but it was something like that. I remember, so I was at PT Barcelona, because the one before that was the first time we had done constant all-day coverage. Before that, the finals were coverage, but we didn't do all-day coverage, and I was very excited, so I went to PT Barcelona, which was the second one we had done constant all-day coverage. Before that, the finals were coverage, but we didn't do all-day coverage. And I was very excited, so I went to PT Barcelona, which was the second one we had done.

And you came up and introduced yourself to me. That's what I remember. So I guess you were right then. That was before the Community Cup. I got to turn it around on you, I guess. You did, you did. So it is great talking with you.

And like I said, the... Okay, so you can use a little plug in here. So obviously you do limited resources. If you want to listen to you and Marshall talk about magic every week. Where else can people see you? Where else can people read you or listen to you? You can all go to channelfireball.com. That's where all articles and videos all get posted.

LRcast.com is a good place to find limited resources. And then twitch.tv slash LSV is my stream. And I stream maybe a couple times a month, depending on what I'm feeling up to. And also I'm at LSV on Twitter. So I've got a lot of places for my nonsense if you're so inclined. Okay, well, I want to thank you.

I see my desk here, so as we all know, we know what that means. This is the end of my drive to work, so instead of talking magic, it's time for me to be making magic. So thanks for being with us. Yeah, I actually wanted to thank you, too. I think that you've been a hugely positive force for magic, and I've loved magic

my entire life, so I would feel remiss if I didn't thank you for your contributions to that. Well, thank you very much. That's very nice. Okay, everybody. I will see you all next week. Bye-bye.