Makes Sense - with Dr. JC Doornick - Making Sense of Change - Who Moved My Cheese - Episode 87

Starting point is 00:00:02 Hmm. Makes sense. Great morning world. Great morning friends. This is Dr. J.C. Dornick and welcome to another edition of the Make Sense with Dr. J.C. podcast. Today we're going to be making sense of change. What's really cool about making sense of change and attaching it to this book summary that we're going to connect.

Starting point is 00:00:24 Just imagine what it's like to make sense of change. And if you don't like the way you look at change, and you want to change the way you look at change and see the way you look at change, change. Well, then this episode is for you. We're going to be making a connection today with the unbelievably popular, life-saving book called Who Move My Cheese, definitely in one of my top five. I don't know if I have any room in my top five all-time, most impactful books,

Starting point is 00:00:55 but I'm going to squeeze this one in, even if it has to be like a five and a half, just because of how amazingly impactful it's been in. my life. So today's making sense of change, a book summary of who move my cheese. If you're someone who's been feeling like life is moving a little bit too fast or faster than you're ready for it to move, maybe you're facing a change that feels overwhelming, uncertain, or even unwanted, today's episode is for you. And I'm just thinking right now, that's probably everybody, or at least the ones that are willing to admit it. So today we're going to be making sense of one of the most universal and challenging experiences in the human experience and journey, and that would be change.

Starting point is 00:01:35 To help guide the conversation, I'm going to be unpacking some delicious takeaways from one of the most well-loved and deceptively simple books on this topic, and that is Who Move My Cheese by Dr. Spencer Johnson. Stick around because I'm also going to show you how this powerful little story and parable aligns perfectly with our four-step interface response system. The interface response system is a system that will help you change the way you look at things so that the things that you look at change. So we're going to take this book, Who Move My Cheese, and make a connection and integrate it into the interface response system to help you actually execute on the lessons that you're

Starting point is 00:02:16 going to learn from this book. Now, what I want to say about this book is it's one of the easiest books you'll ever read. I'm a speed reader, and I read a lot of books, but this is like a one day, a half day read. I'm going to show you how it can help you do more than just survive and navigate change. I think a lot of people are trying to just navigate and survive change. It's going to also help you move through with more awareness, agency, and peace. If that sounds good to you, stick around and let's dive in.

Starting point is 00:02:44 So I just want to take this moment and welcome everybody to The Make Sense with Dr. J.C. podcast. This podcast covers topics that expand human consciousness and performance. On the Make Sense podcast, we acknowledge that. it's who you are that determines how well what you do works, and that perception is subjective and an acquired taste. When you change the way that you look at things, the things that you look at begin to change.

Starting point is 00:03:09 The Make Sense podcast is sponsored and primarily funded by the Make Sense Academy, and that's our private community where open and curious seekers of growth and expansion apply the Make Sense principles and systems to move from simply going through life to growing through life. Check out the Make Sense Academy. Risk free for less than you will probably spend in the next day or so on some shit that you don't even need. Welcome, my friends, to the uprising of the sleepwalking masses. Welcome to the Make Sense with Dr. J.C. podcast.

Starting point is 00:03:39 So let's dive into this. So first of all, this amazing book very often gets read without knowing too much about the author. So I always like to take these books that we're going to use and comment a little bit about the author. Who Move My Cheese was written by Dr. Spencer. Johnson, who's a physician and thought leader who has a special gift, like all of us, his gift is for turning complex human behavior into simple story-based steps. That's a superpower in this world where we're trying to explain things and make sense of

Starting point is 00:04:10 things. Everybody's trying to make sense of things, which is the premise of a lot of the coaching that I do. So if you have this talent of taking something and turning it into a story so that somebody has an easier try at making sense of that, that's going to be greatly appreciated. So that's why his books are so wonderful as he uses stories and fables to explain deep concepts that you might not pick up otherwise. So he co-wrote another very popular book called The One Minute Manager and the book that we're going to cover today, Who Move My Cheese, which by the way became an instant classic in personal development and the corporate leadership spaces. It's been published in over 40 languages with over 28 million copies sold. That's a pretty good, successful book story. and you're going to see why. So why is this such a massive success, you know, for such a short book?

Starting point is 00:04:59 It's just like a little half-day read. It's because it hits a deep shared nerve that sits inside all of us, and we're going to cover that today. This book is about change, but not just changes as a concept in general. Change as a personal experience with confrontation. This is what makes this book really interesting. It's one thing to learn about change from afar, but he's going to talk about our interface with change, our confrontation and experience that we have with change, because that's the only aspect that we control. We don't control change. If you're just watching change from afar, you're watching a show that you didn't produce and you didn't direct. But if you're looking at your experience and confrontation with change, there's a lot that can be done. So yes, this book is about

Starting point is 00:05:43 evaluating and interfacing with change and helps us change the way we look at change, which makes the way that we look at change, change. Hmm. So it's about how we respond when life stops going the way that we expected, or when something we were counting on gets taken away from us. Those are the kinds of change that we need to learn how to interface with more successfully. And even though it reads like a children's story, which you're going to see soon, the message is for grownups, navigating the real world loss and identity shifts.

Starting point is 00:06:15 So there's his superpower. He makes this like a children's book. And by the way, children will read this book and be able to get it as well. That's such a powerful move. I see that as a flaw in personal growth. And I just want to make a little bit of a disclaimer about my thoughts on personal growth and self-development. I feel like personal growth and self-development have amazing things and distinctions and insights and breakthroughs. But like Alcoholics Anonymous, you have to have a problem before you get access to them.

Starting point is 00:06:43 I would love like this amazing author has done if those greats, on up to the greatest, would take their books and write them in a way that a six-year-old could understand so they could proactively teach them things that would help them avoid the problems that people have when they end up seeking personal growth and self-development. This book is about change, but it's done in a way that children can understand, but it's made for adults. And even though it reads like that children's story, you're going to see. In short, it's a parable that takes place in a maze.

Starting point is 00:07:14 So obviously in the book, the maze is representing our lives, the maze of our lives. And in that maze exists four characters. This is the fun part when you look at the characters because they all represent different ways that we look at things and respond. So character one, his name is sniff. Sniff is somebody that sniffs out and senses change early. They see it on the horizon. And then the other character is scurry. Scurry is someone who races into action. So the idea as I go through these characters and we go a little bit deeper into it, is you want to try to identify which character you are at this time.

Starting point is 00:07:49 Because I identify that I have the ability to be all of these characters, but one of them is predominant. So try to figure that out. So sniff, senses change early. Scurry, races into action. Hem denies and resist change. Oof, that's a tough one.

Starting point is 00:08:05 I've been there. And then Haw, Hem and Haw, learns to adapt over time. And I think that probably represents most people that are involved in personal growth and self-development. Each of them is looking for cheese. That's the story.

Starting point is 00:08:18 Sniff, Scurry, Hem and Haw are all looking for cheese, which in the story represents anything that you're seeking or relying on right now, like success, love, peace, security, health, status, money. Whatever you please is your cheese. I wrote that. Make sense? In the beginning, everything looks normal, right? All four characters happen upon a massive piece of cheese in the maze,

Starting point is 00:08:41 and that's referred to this spot in the maze called Cheese Station C. It's almost like a scientific project or experiment going on. So they show up every day, eat their fill, and build routines around going to Cheese Station C. Some even start to take it for granted. So he starts to mention how we start to notice that people take for granted that which is always there or who is always there in our life. But then, as fate would have it and as change would have it, upon returning to Cheese Station

Starting point is 00:09:11 C, one day, the cheese has disappeared. It's been moved. It's gone. So we get to see how all four of those characters, which you're going to be trying to figure out which one you are at any time. And if you can phase place your character and see that your character is an inefficient version of yourself, then that would be you catching yourself drifting and then unveil the opportunity to shift. So it's really fun to start playing around maybe with your friends and know the characters and be able to phase place and identify yourself as a character that is not going to get the job done or is wasting time. So the cheese has been moved one day and we get to see how all four characters react.

Starting point is 00:09:51 So Sniff, right, who senses things early, sniff is not surprised at all. He saw this coming and understand that change is actually inevitable. And Scurry, the one that goes into action, who's all about taking radical responsibility and action for his life, doesn't spend too much time analyzing things. So sniff and scurry are a great team, especially if they work together. They lace up their little maze running shoes and do what? Start searching for new cheese in the maze. But there's Hem and Hall.

Starting point is 00:10:21 Hem and Hall, as soon as they notice that there's no more cheese, they freeze. A lot of rhyming going on here. I don't know if you notice. So Hem refuses to accept the loss. He digs in. He gets angry. He positions himself as a victim of the cheese being gone. He gets angry.

Starting point is 00:10:39 He keeps going back to the same empty station day after day, hoping and praying that things will return to what he called normal. He doesn't find that this is a fair thing. Who did this? He wants to know whose fault it is. So that's hem. And then on the other hand, there's Haw. Haw at first takes Hem's lead. Haw is actually affected and influenced and persuaded by him.

Starting point is 00:11:06 He's bummed out. He says, yeah, me too. You know, he joins a movement with him. And over time, he starts to realize, he starts to get more conscious and realize that this is not working out. That's what Haw does. Staying stuck at this old spot, waiting for Godot, like the other fable, this place of denial and frustration isn't getting him anywhere. So, Hall actually has the ability to recognize the definition of insanity, trying to do the same thing and expect different results. Hemp can't see that.

Starting point is 00:11:36 Hem digs in and he buys real estate below the line of responsibility. He's a victim and he's going to sit there and wait until somebody comes to save him. And all the messages that we hear in life is that nobody's coming to save us, right? So eventually, Haw musters up the courage, this is us, most of us, to leave the comfort zone and head back into the unknown of the maze. Brave, brave move for Haw. As he goes, he begins to leave messages. This is such a sweet part about this book.

Starting point is 00:12:05 And these messages are great. gold. So as Haw is going on an exploration into the unknown, you've got scurry and sniff who are running around saying, with all this shit, there's got to be a pony somewhere. But Haw took some time and he's going around, but he's also considering paying it forward to others that might be lost. Are you somebody that pays forward what it is that you learn in your insights? When my book comes out, you'll see that's what it is all about. He starts to leave messages for others on the walls, this is about wisdom being accessible to everyone that follows. Whenever we go through life and we learn a breakthrough, like I had some of the most life-changing breakthroughs ever. I don't leave those

Starting point is 00:12:46 messages for others, especially my children, then I won't get to keep those breakthroughs. I always say this at the end. If you want to keep something, give it away. So here are some of the ideas of some of the messages that Haw leaves so courteously for us. What would you do if you weren't afraid? So these are the things that are going through his mind that are helping them go. Smell the cheese often so that you know when it's getting old. Do you know when Cheese Station A is getting old? Because remember, the other character sniff who can see things coming before they happen. That's a talent of his. He can smell the cheese before it gets too old or before it disappears. And then the other one is movement in a new direction helps you find new cheese. There's so many valuable lessons in that, right? So these are

Starting point is 00:13:32 messages that he's leaving on the wall for others. Highest level of consciousness to serve mankind, the greatest gift that we will ever receive is the gift of helping others to be useful in helping others get what they can't get. Paying it forward. And of course, here's the big one. The quicker you let go of old cheese, the sooner you will enjoy new cheese. So there's a time constraint. There's a time suck in being stuck in our old ways. As a matter of fact, a lot of people die with that written on their tombstone. The moment that you're dissatisfied in life and you're sick and tired of being sick and tired and things like that, the quicker you move on from that, take action today, the sooner you will enjoy new cheese. Now, here's the thing. This story is so

Starting point is 00:14:18 simple that your brain actually might be tempted to brush it off or overcomplicate it. The trick to this book is to keep it super simple. But don't let simplicity fool you in this book. It's actually a mirror. It asks, which character are you at this time? Are you sniff right now? Give it a try and tell me which character you are. I'm going to read through them right now. If you're listening to the podcast, write it down and send it into me. Write it out a little bit and explain to me some characteristics that you've identified

Starting point is 00:14:50 about yourself. Are you sniff? Tuned into things early. Fully embraced change and challenges as ingredients in the recipe for more cheese. Not surprised when confronted by change, see change as an expected guest, that sniff. Or are you scurry, ready to move, no matter what. Obstacles are the way, and your antidote for change is action. That's scurry.

Starting point is 00:15:13 Or are you haw, scared but curious, easily influenced, but not insane, not looking to stop and do nothing, not insane. Sooner or later, you're going to go. Or are you poor old hem, holding on for dear life to what's already gone and spending eternity in that dark space? Now, what I'll tell you is no matter which one you are, the goal would be to be able to identify if your sniff, scurry, hem, or haw. And the reason why is only then would you be able to make a conscious decision if it's serving you are not.

Starting point is 00:15:50 We'll also be able to see that you're a little bit of all of them, but one of them is predominant. Here's where I bring in the interface response system, and that's my four-step system. The interface response system, as a reminder, is a four-phase framework that I developed to help people respond to life more consciously. Our brains run 95% of the time subconsciously, unconsciously, unconsciously on autopilot. So the idea is to take that 5% conscious window and try to expand it. Very, very hard to do, right? Most of the decisions that we make in life and the perceptions we make and our responses are run by our regularly scheduled program. So the interface response system is a tool that anybody can use, and this is what we teach in our Make Sense Academy, to apply at any time

Starting point is 00:16:34 when you're evaluating things. That helps you, as I said before, change the way you look at things. So it's a four-phase framework that I developed to help people respond to life more consciously, especially when they're being emotionally or psychologically triggered by the adversities associated with change. Here's how it aligns beautifully with this amazing book. So in phase one, in accordance with this book, and here's some of the lessons. In phase one, we call it perceived. So this is where we become armed with awareness. Phase one arms you, equips you, weaponizes you with awareness. Awareness of the conditioned nature of your mind. Your mind's been conditioned. Aware that the thoughts and feelings that we see and feel in the face of change are not all our own. It came from

Starting point is 00:17:21 somewhere else. But they're ones that we acquired as gifts and offerings from what I call our MFTPSE, which stands for our mother, father, teacher, preacher, society, and the paying forward of evolution. So this awareness validates the insertion of phase two, which is what we call the pause. The idea of practicing cognitive distancing and pausing and thinking about something first, distancing yourself from the response, is a very, very hard thing to do if you don't understand. and become armed with awareness of your condition mind, because that's what validates you saying, hey, maybe I should think about things first, considering what I'm thinking about right now came from mommy and daddy.

Starting point is 00:18:02 So phase two is pause. So instead of reacting to what's being lost or spiraling into fear, you pause using the make sense coaching technique that we call, hmm, and that is HMM, a sound that prompts us into the space that distances us between the stimulus and our response, our problem. programmed automatic response. It stands for the HMMM, it stands for, haven't made up my mind. Why do we have to make up our mind so fast? See, that's one of the things that we want to do with our condition mind, is not trust it right away, unless we have to jump out of a way of a speeding train or something like that, or somebody throws a rock at your head. You're allowed to think, because if you don't think,

Starting point is 00:18:42 what you're going to do is you're going to allow your knee-jerk reaction to call the shots. That's not being the dominant force of your life. That's handing over the keys of trust to, a program that somebody else did. This places you in the space between the stimulus and your response where you may evoke phase three. So in that space is where you can practice phase three of the interface response system, and that is called process. Now, in this space between the stimulus and your automatic response, we give ourselves permission. So you have to actually take the right protect switch off of your SD card, which means that you're open and curious to new information. So you have to give yourself permission to evaluate the perceived change.

Starting point is 00:19:21 change in this case through the various lenses and perspectives outside of the one that you always use. This is why J.C. wears glasses with no lenses. And everybody says, oh, it's funny. It's a funny gimmick. It's just a reminder. It's an anchor for me that I get to choose what lenses I look at. So I don't want some external lenses put in my glasses. Now, the funny thing is, is I've been doing this so long that I'm almost blind without them. So I put them on and I can. can see better. I can't explain it, but that's the way it happens. So we do this by running the perception of change through what we call a sorting filter. And we teach this in our Make Sense Academy. If anybody's interested in that, just say, make sense. And we'll tell you about that. This sorting filter has

Starting point is 00:20:06 built into it. And you've programmed this sorting filter to ask specific questions like, what's happening here? What's really happening here? What actually changed? What assumptions am I making? Does this really affect me? Is this happening to me? Or is it happening for me? What am I actually a afraid of here. What is the change revealing about me? Oh, I love that question. And here's the last one. What might be possible now as a result of the change that wasn't possible before? So these are questions that we program into our sorting filter and we just give ourselves permission now that we're in this conscious space to pass what we're perceiving through these questions. And if it makes it all the way through and check, check, check, check, and it's worth your time, well then deal with it.

Starting point is 00:20:51 I don't like to just deal with things with my knee-jerk reflex that I learn from mommy and daddy and teacher and preacher and social media. And remember, whatever we consume with regularity is what we assume with regularity. I'm not letting those guys make the decision. Here is where Haw started his transformation. Remember, Haw is the one that, like, eventually goes out on his own. So when he finally noticed that clinging to Cheese Station C was not working because there was no cheese there, In fact, I believe that Haw is actually a good representation of most people, especially those that

Starting point is 00:21:25 come to me that are taking interest in makes sense coaching and make sense academy. These are people that are sick and tired of being sick and tired. When somebody comes to me and claims that they're stuck, that's a Haw move. I'm like, what's up, Haw? That's somebody that goes, I don't want to be stuck anymore. Is that you? That's not a bad place to be. The worst place to be is hem when you're like, I'm not stuck.

Starting point is 00:21:47 This is not my fault. This sets you up after you look at things through different lenses and different perspectives and you get to pick the one that is most in support and conducent with your goals and dreams. That's the process phase. Then you can move into phase four and that is called proceed. So now that you've paused and properly processed things, you're ready to move. This is when Haw goes out there and he starts exploring. But you're not doing this reactively. You processed with alignment.

Starting point is 00:22:16 You process things and you question. whether they were in alignment with your intentions and whether or not they're in support of your goals and dreams and the things that matter most to you. So if you've done that, congratulations. You're ready for a healthy response. And that's the whole premise of changing the way you look at things so that the things you look at change. If you change the way you look at things, that changes the way you're looking at them. They start to change and you get to see if they're actually worth your time. Isn't that cool? Their value either comes out or diminishes. This is how I've gotten rid of people. in my life. Can you relate? So you don't run away from change. You actually start to move with it. And this is where sniff and scurry live. They move with change, right? So you start to evolve from Haw into sniff and scurry. You start to take on their traits. We do so with alignment with our, with our highest wants, needs, and desires. This is when Haw kind of starts to re-enter the maze, unsure of what he's going to find, but knowing that he can't get stuck, knowing that he can't stay stuck. That's that moment. If you feel like you're stuck and you don't want to be stuck, you're going to

Starting point is 00:23:23 throw a haul move. You understand? You know, that's the Martin Luther King would call it the fierce urgency of now. You know, there's that moment where you don't care about how you're going to get somewhere. You're either attached to a goal that's super sexy and valuable for you, or you're in such a situation that you hate so much. And I've been there that you'll do anything but it. And I always give that analogy if I put your head under water and you can't breathe, what do you want? You want air. You don't know how you're going to get it, but you're going to do everything close to dying to get that air. That's the way human beings are. So I want to give some of my own thoughts on this. I call them dragon thoughts. So the most important lesson that I picked up is that change is not the enemy.

Starting point is 00:24:04 Let's create a different relationship with change. Change is not the enemy. Our relationship with change and the way that we look at it is what actually determines whether we suffer or grow. So if you feel like you're suffering right now, I'm going to contend and challenge you to look in the mirror and say, am I actually suffering or am I just looking at this situation as me suffering? Because all you have to do is change the way you look at things. Come learn how to do the interface response system, and you'll learn how to do that. And then you'll start to grow. And that's when somebody starts to say, maybe I'm actually growing through this instead of just going through this. So catch yourself being a hem. at least advance yourself to a haw,

Starting point is 00:24:46 and then maybe you get to the sniff and scurry. So if you're clinging to something that used to feel secure, you've been waiting for your cheese to come back. If fear has kept you from exploring what's next, then this actually might be a window, an opportunity, and your moment. A moment like this. I love that moment where I recognize that all of my uncomfortable discomforts

Starting point is 00:25:10 and frustrations and sometimes anger and things like that. that is an opportunity and a moment. Potentially, you could look at it as something called a wink from God. And it's a wink saying, lace up your shoes. Stop Hemman and Haun and step back into the maze of life and start sniffing and scurrying. Not recklessly, not seeking perfection, but more consciously and trusting in the process and embracing change as a necessary ingredient in the recipe for success. So using the interface response system to help you execute the goal of change.

Starting point is 00:25:43 the way that you look at things so that the things that you look at change. That's the idea of the interface response system. And anybody can use it. Even the ones that don't believe in themselves, which is not a precursor for success. Neither is timing or motivation. So this is some good shift as it places you in control of change. That's the idea is change is not the enemy unless it's running your life.

Starting point is 00:26:08 But you're going to shift and become in control or capture claim control of change, thus equipping you to proceed phase four with power and confidence. So let this story be more than just a summary for you, and please go read the book. We're talking about like a book you could probably read in three hours. Let it be a call, a small wise nudge from the part of you that is open, curious, and ready for more. Sick and tired of being sick and tired, but open, curious, and ready for more. And I'll leave you with this, something that Haw wrote on the wall for us all, and I didn't share it for you yet. He says this, old beliefs do not lead you to new cheese. Old beliefs do not lead us to new cheese. So what beliefs are you willing to outgrow today?

Starting point is 00:26:56 I want to thank everybody for listening to this episode of Make Sense with Dr. J.C. podcast. If it moved you like it moved me, this book saved my life at a very, very tough time. Somebody handed this book to me. I suggest you go buy it. All of the resources to be in the notes. Go buy this book, read it, and then give it to some. somebody else. I don't have my book because I've given it away. I buy a lot of these books. Very small, very cheap. I encourage you to read it and share it with a friend who may be standing on the edge of change, hem. And if you're ready to go deeper in building emotional intelligence and conscious responding in your life, I'm going to encourage you to check out the Make Sense Academy and just say

Starting point is 00:27:32 make sense and I'll send you information for that. It's not for everybody, but it is open and available to everybody because it's a timing thing. You've got to be ready for gross. And start taking the steps towards becoming the dominant force of your life. So until next time, stay curious, stay grounded, and remember, you don't control the maze. You just have to learn how to move with change and move through the maze. Remember, if you learn something today, give it away. That's the only way it's going to stay. I'll see you next time. Have a great day.

Makes Sense - with Dr. JC Doornick - Making Sense of Change - Who Moved My Cheese - Episode 87

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