Mark Bell's Power Project - How Pro Athletes Optimize Their Recovery (Cold Plunging)

Episode Date: June 4, 2023

In this Supercut, Kelly Starett, Mike McCastle, Jason Khalipa, Louisa Nicola, The Founders of the Cold Plunge, Mark Bell, Nsima Inyang, and Andrew Zaragoza talk about Cold Plunging and all of the benefits that it can afford you in your day to day lives.   Check out the full episodes:   https://youtu.be/rDs8_Ct8CVA https://youtu.be/ZkUdFTTM6IE https://youtu.be/yeVyDF46VSI https://youtu.be/p3i0b4vsj-A https://youtu.be/-zJj39GpYfU https://youtu.be/Ha8IHhHRRfQ https://youtu.be/rI2PYr_ilRI   How Pro Athletes Optimize Their Recovery (Cold Plunging)   0:00 Trailer 0:51 Is Cold Plunging Overrated? 2:52 How To Boost Health and Reduce Stress Via Cold Therapy 11:53 Jason Khalipa’s Benefits 15:44 How Mike McCastle Utilizes It Simply 21:53 The Science Behind Cold Shock Proteins 25:21 How It Builds Resiliency 30:14 How Cold Plunging Can Benefit Auto-Immune Disorders 34:14 Nsima’s Experience and Why Shivering Is A Choice 44:52 How Does It Help With Hypertrophy 51:14 How It Helps With Mental Health   New Power Project Website: https://powerproject.live Join The Power Project Discord: https://discord.gg/yYzthQX5qN Subscribe to the new Power Project Clips Channel: https://youtube.com/channel/UC5Df31rlDXm0EJAcKsq1SUw   Special perks for our listeners below! ➢ https://withinyoubrand.com/ Code POWERPROJECT to save 15% off supplements!   ➢ https://markbellslingshot.com/ Code POWERPROJECT to save 15% off all gear and apparel!   ➢ https://mindbullet.com/ Code POWERPROJECT to save 15% off Mind Bullet!   ➢ https://goodlifeproteins.com/ Code POWERPROJECT to save up to 25% off your Build a Box   ➢ Better Fed Beef: https://betterfedbeef.com/pages/powerproject   ➢ https://hostagetape.com/powerproject Free shipping and free bedside tin!   ➢ https://thecoldplunge.com/ Code POWERPROJECT to save $150!!   ➢ Enlarging Pumps (This really works): https://bit.ly/powerproject1 Pumps explained: https://youtu.be/qPG9JXjlhpM   ➢ https://www.vivobarefoot.com/us/powerproject to save 15% off Vivo Barefoot shoes!   ➢ https://vuoriclothing.com/powerproject to automatically save 20% off your first order at Vuori!   ➢ https://www.eightsleep.com/powerproject to automatically save $150 off the Pod Pro at 8 Sleep!   ➢ https://marekhealth.com Use code POWERPROJECT10 for 10% off ALL LABS at Marek Health! Also check out the Power Project Panel: https://marekhealth.com/powerproject Use code POWERPROJECT for $101 off!   ➢ Piedmontese Beef: https://www.piedmontese.com/ Use Code POWER at checkout for 25% off your order plus FREE 2-Day Shipping on orders of $150   Follow Mark Bell's Power Project Podcast ➢ https://www.PowerProject.live ➢ https://lnk.to/PowerProjectPodcast ➢ Insta: https://www.instagram.com/markbellspowerproject ➢ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/markbellspowerproject   FOLLOW Mark Bell ➢ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/marksmellybell ➢https://www.tiktok.com/@marksmellybell ➢ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MarkBellSuperTraining ➢ Twitter: https://twitter.com/marksmellybell   Follow Nsima Inyang ➢ https://www.breakthebar.com/learn-more ➢YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/NsimaInyang ➢Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nsimainyang/?hl=en ➢TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@nsimayinyang?lang=en   Follow Andrew Zaragoza on all platforms ➢ https://direct.me/iamandrewz   #PowerProject #Podcast #MarkBell #FitnessPodcast #markbellspowerproject

I do think it has, you know, a lot of positive impact. And just even from a mental perspective, it seems to be pretty awesome. If you get hot and get cold, you will go to sleep no matter how stressed you are. The bigger the engine, the bigger the set of brakes you need to have. But more so than anything, again, it's just this mental side, like it's something I'm not good at and I want to overcome that. We're delaying the onset of those negative physiological effects that will screw you in the times that would matter the most in a fight in a competition in life and anything that you're doing and that's all we're trying to do with the cold it's just a tool when we you know submerse ourselves in cold water we release

something called cold shock proteins and these cold shock proteins are amazing they can immediately raise the amount of norepinephrine that is secreted. That's that hormone is involved in vigilance, focus. That's why it's so good to do these first thing in the morning. Cold plunging. Cold plunging. I'll be real, yo. I'll be so real.

Under, over. You're saying over? All right, why? Why? Oh, just because it's like just so much on the internet. I don't think people can stand one more but i will say that i i do think it has you know a lot of positive impact and just even from a mental perspective it seems to be pretty awesome yeah uh i know it's all over the place i know every fitness influencer is talking about code plunging for their mental yeah yeah but yo like

training as much as i do and the amount of fatigue i get on my body like the cold plunge has really made a big difference i'm doing a lot of jujitsu i'm getting in i'm getting in the gym it has you've mentioned it before how like after a hard run or something you'll get in there and afterwards you just you just feel better the inflammation's down you recover faster i'm so thankful that actually we were able to start doing this a while ago and that we're on the cold plunge train. I know it's trendy. I get it. But at the end of the day, I don't give a fuck if something's trendy, if it's making a difference for my performance. I really don't. I'll be that guy. I think it's underrated. And I know some people,

you may not be able to get in a cold plunge or whatever. I get it. It is what it is. But if you are able to at some point and you're an athlete, it will benefit you. That's it. Yeah. I love the, I've mentioned it many times before, but like the mental benefits, you know, I've tried a bunch of stuff to help put me in a better mood or whatever. They all can't even get close to this. And then also, you know, kind of like I've never really done too many difficult things in my life. I have a pretty good life. I noticed that like more people signed up in my division for my tournament coming up. And I'm like, these fuckers aren't getting into a cold plunge.

And I jumped right in because I'm like, I'm doing the hard thing that they're not willing to do. So there's like some mental toughness. I don't know if it's mental toughness, but there's some thing going on there where you're like, not a lot of people are willing to do this. I'm going to go do it right now. And then you come out of it and you just, you feel like a freaking superhero. It feels incredible. I see you guys doing all kinds of weird shit. And I think you guys are like exercising on the bottom of your pool and stuff like that sometimes. I don't know what the hell's going on over there. That's why I haven't come over in a long time. I'm like, I don't want to be subject to any of this stuff. You don't want to drown. Look, the research is really clear. Sauna is great for you. There's more and more data coming out around cold water immersion exposure, just getting cold and shivering, making yourself cold

for a few minutes. Brown fat. Brown fat. I think one of the reasons, forget all that. We love that if you get hot and get cold, you will go to sleep no matter how stressed you are. So one of the feelings that we have is the bigger the engine, the bigger the set of brakes you need to have. And for us, we're lucky enough to have a sauna and a cold plunge in our house. We don't have to go anywhere. And no matter how stressed we are, we go sit in there. It's kind of dim. We have to talk. It And no matter how stressed we are, we go sit in there. It's kind of dim. We have to talk. It's super hot.

Then we get cold, and then it breaks us every single time. You can look at it simply as warming up and cooling down are two of the most expensive things your body does. And if you swing back and forth and make your body do that, it's going to exhaust you. You're also going to become more effective at it. So if you end up in a cold environment or a hot environment, you're going to be better at handling those things. You can look at a range of motion for your vasculature just so that you can handle and have better circulation to your feet and your hands. But also it's fun. It's super entertainment. So there's the JSTAR. I mean, I would just like to say though, one other thing that is not always appreciated about

the sauna and is that, man, we've had like some of the greatest and best like interactions and conversations with our friends in the sauna you're gonna say sex you already said genitals earlier and i felt that comfortable no we um we use the sauna as like a social tool like just as an example not to make a sad example but one of our dear friends lost his parent recently. And he and Kelly just sat in the sauna for an hour and a half. And, you know, they talked and connected and processed. And, you know, it just was, you know, it's a phone free, you can't bring your phone in there.

So it's just this lovely place to actually have some human connection. And whether that's with your spouse, your friends or whoever. So it's just like one of the things we love about the sauna. So how about you come down and sit in the sauna and we won't even make you go in the pool both of you both of you guys is that a burger place still next to you guys no we're not a business god damn that place was good i know and you were on the wall grass fed grass finished beef that was awesome wait you're on the wall for what what'd you do they put like a picture of me squatting or something on there it was you you guys came in one time and then she took a photo, and they were like, world champions eat Wheezy burgers.

Yeah. And they had a fat chicken was their logo or something. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Of course, it's called Wheezy's. That's the way you used to breathe. I know, right? Yeah. That's all I could hear.

Andrew, I sent you over a clip. We've got more of the scientific facts on the cold plunging. Andrew, can you bring it up? Yeah, Huberman says. This is from a guy that's in Huberman's lab, I think. Oh, God. Hold on. You know, I just saw research that came out around cold water.

They put military in the cold water, and guys had better sex. They had better subjective perceived readiness. So some of this is just can be entertainment. You know, I think Michael Easter wrote a great book called the crisis, the comfort crisis. Yep. And there's a reason like being a little bit uncomfortable, disrupting homeostasis is good for us. I think it's some why some people don't like exercise. It's uncomfortable. So any way where we can find ourselves to be uncomfortable a little bit, I think, you know, die a little bit every day. That's, you know, getting cold is simple.

I think here's our clip. Plunge probably two or three times a day sometimes. What I like to do is really keep my body guessing and I'll just find somewhere to plunge naturally. If I'm walking out on a hike and see a creek, it's cold outside, The creek's cold. I'll jump in and get a plunge. See, the benefits to cold plunging are.

Oh, my God. I love his hair. I'm obsessed with his hair. Where'd the sound go? Oh, it's still going. It's cold plunge. My bad. Your body's guessing on multiple levels.

I actually created my own method for cold plunging. I call it iso-plunge, and what I do is isolate a body part from the cold. You can do a hand at a time. You can do a foot at a time. You can actually do it at home if you just open the freezer door. Look at his arms in the freezer. I read somewhere that if you cold plunge regularly, you don't really even have to watch your diet or your exercise because your body's going to be out of any doubt. He's got all the facts right there trying to stay warm yeah i'll hit a plug how do you guys uh or love this guy you you've heard of how how it affects inflammation so like post lifting cold

plunging how do you guys feel about that because that's some people are fighting against people cold punching because of that partially i would say that huberman says, no, we actually started to realize that cold was blunting the body's response to adaptation. So it's blunting the adaptation response. So if you're trying to have, and we started to see this in a lot of our professional soccer teams, premier soccer, they were keeping some of the cold water immersion as far enough away from the training as they could so that the athlete could have a natural response. We could maximize that and then get cold. So getting cold first thing in the morning when they've overnight sleep, they were finding and they were using it sort of periodizing the cold. Yeah, they would.

Sometimes they put it in. Sometimes they'd want to want to wait on it. I think for the average person, if you can get cold and it's something you enjoy, do it when it works for you. Stop being, but if you're trying to get really strong or you're trying to change some aspect of your physiology and that cold water immersion maybe limits that in some way, because that's really the limiting factor, then maybe you need to, again, just put it a little bit further away. I think the only exception to that is we have athletes like at the CrossFit games who are, it's 100 degrees there, and their core temperature is really high. So jumping in to drop your core temperature after a hot run might be a really good way

to speed up your ability to recover because you're not spending all that energy cooling. You're spending that energy recovering. Again, I think we're like, well, I'm elite. I'm a 50-year-old middle-aged mountain bike guy with a fake knee. I'll keep my cold plunge away from my five squats with 60 kilos. I don't want to blunt my adaptation. I think we're a little precious. What has been a message that maybe has been hard for you guys, where you communicate it

to people, but it seems like they're having a hard time to adapt to it? Is it the changing of eating more protein? Is it the sleep? Like, where do you find most people are just even with all the suggestions and saying like, hey, make your living room your kind of mobility area? Like, what do you think most people are struggling to actually adopt? I'm sure Kelly will have an idea, but I think what I think, and it is also a challenge in our regular business, the Ready State, is to get people to care now about their range of motion.

As you guys both know, a lot of people find us because they get injured, and that's sort of their first foray into, you know. Or they've got pain that's limiting them from doing something. Yeah, the pain that's they're injured or pain's limiting them. And, you know, we and I think this book is one of the ways we're trying to do this is to, you know, teach people to care before they're injured or before they're, you know, suffering from chronic pain. they're injured or before they're, you know, suffering from chronic pain. And so I think we hope we've taken a swing for the fences here with this book to try to make it really accessible and relatable and explain to people why they should care and why they should care about spending some time working on their range of motion, even

when they're 30 years old. Not just because you want to sit with your grandchild when you're 67, but because you know now it's going to reap a lot of benefits for your athletic performance or reduce your chances of injury or make sure you're pain-free. I mean, there's a lot of reasons to do it now at any age. But I think that's the biggest challenge is people kind of know they should care about nutrition and sleep.

And breathing is becoming more of a thing with Wim Hof and it's become kind of hip, so people are sort of aware of it. But I think it's getting people to care about their range of motion and really care about working on it now because a lot of it is use it or lose it. Range of motion, maybe even in just a sense of like being able to do most of the things that you're. Yeah. And that's exactly what I mean. I mean, without pain. Yeah, exactly. Like if I were to describe like what mobility is to me, mobility is the ability to move freely and do the things you want to do without pain. I mean, to me, that's.

And someone says, hey, let's play some volleyball and you don't tear your Achilles tendon. Exactly. Like you want to be able to do that off the couch or you want to be able to go on a rafting trip with your family if that's what you're going to do this summer or whatever. You don't you just want to be able to do what you want to do physically. So to me, that's what mobility actually is. What you know, a lot of the things we do are mobilizations, which are, you know, soft tissue techniques and other mobilizations that help what mobility actually is. A lot of the things we do are mobilizations, which are soft tissue techniques and other mobilizations that help support mobility. But to me, that's really what mobility is, is to be able to do what you want to do with your body.

You've been cold plunging for a while now and you do a lot of work. What have you noticed? How has it been a part of your routine? Yeah, I mean, I think the cold plunge for me, it's really hard. It's really hard. I I'd love to admit that I'm some tough guy when it comes to the cold. I'm not a tough guy. I just, I I'm, I'm weak and it's an area of improvement for me. That's why I wanted it. Whereas Ava, dude, she gets right in that thing. Like she makes me feel like such a wimp. And so, but the cold plunge has been good because the mental side, right? You don't want to do it and you overcome that adversity, right? Then when you're in it, I think it has good benefits in terms of like recovery, but also

just keep my body cold and having it to use, expend energy to get back to core temperature. I think it's some nice fat loss tool, but more so than anything, again, it's just this mental side, like it's something I'm not good at and I want to overcome that. And that's the most beneficial thing. So I probably do it on average four or five days a week. Ava does it every day. How do you feel when you get out? Cause I, you don't feel like cold, but do you feel like I personally, like I don't, I'm cold adapted now and it doesn't, I'm not driven to go in and do it, but every time afterwards i always feel good

for hours afterwards yeah i don't know if that's something everyone experiences but that's what i experience oh dude i feel like i feel like a million bucks okay how long do you usually go in for five minutes at 52 degrees hey you dropped it down though i did drop it yeah thank you very much andrew i really appreciate that acknowledgement well i'm about to roast the fuck out no the reason why i appreciate it is because my goal was to get to 55 because i'm like fucking kalipa can do it at 55 i could do it at 55 but then after a couple things happened i didn't get into it for a while and like so i re i set everything up i put water in it and then like i checked and i'm like damn it's only at 65 i'm like this will be easy

i got in dude it was the coldest it had ever been because i haven't been doing it for a long time and i was like so shook. So I'm going to get back down to 55 and hang out there and then see if you can stop looking at me that way. Dude, so here's my logic, okay? They say the health benefits of the cold plunge occur when it's something that you want to resist. And makes you shiver. It makes you shiver. You're like, I'm there. I'm shivering. If that for there i'm sure if that for me is 52

exactly it still takes my breath away even at 60 right now the other the other logic is and this is like totally this is just me making this up but i figured because i have my kids in it so much if there was gonna be any haters or even for myself, be like, hey, dude, you shouldn't be exposing your kids to these colds. I'd be like, bro, Santa Cruz Ocean's 50 whatever degrees. I'm just putting it at ocean temperature

here at the house. Sneaky. So there's nothing to get mad at me about. So you don't want my kids to go in the ocean? Okay. You know? You're just the one making 39. 100%.

It's so funny. I blame it on when people are like, oh, how cold are your cold? I'd be like, dude go in so you know i keep it i keep it at 52 the real idea is 100 on me oh man it's it's and i haven't been able to get my hands in yet dude so your hands stay out bro i get i get down to my neck i'm good but dude my hands like have you tried going in with like, have you tried any breathing practices other than like just screaming and crying? No, I thought you were going to say, have you tried a wetsuit? Maybe I should try a wetsuit.

That would be dope. A wetsuit and a winter cap and you're just like in there and you still don't have your hands all the way in. I've tried. I've tried some breathing techniques, but for the most part man like i wonder what my neighbors think because i go in like early in the morning i think that too yeah i have like my like this sound i'll be like i'm just thinking my neighbors probably this motherfucker's not gonna plunge oh man oh that's awesome dude i do have a good time with it though the plunge has been a

good addition i do like cold showers i do like saunas. Right. But is there anything that people can do outside of this that could be easy and not even easy, just like something that they can do without having to get into a gym and get an ice bucket? Is there things that they could do that could yield this benefit? Yeah, absolutely. And you mentioned a great one is cold showers. Again, you want to build up to long, cold showers. When I was training for the ice submersion record, and we can talk about that, but I use cold showers to kind of initiate that adaptation to cold exposure. It works. You expose yourself to cold water. You might start out with a warm shower, do your normal warm shower.

Then let's say the last 30 seconds of your warm shower, turn it cold and go for 30 seconds. And the next go for about 45 seconds. Then over, you know, the next week, go for a minute. And then maybe you build up to where you just start with that cold shower. But you see, you'll notice that your response to the cold, that whether it's at the last 30 seconds or 45 seconds, and you do the whole thing, your response is what you have to look out for your heart rate your breath right it always comes down to the breath so that first time that last 30 seconds or even 15 seconds you might just go you see that oh my god it's fine next time you do it 30 seconds you're just like and then now you're and then you now you could do a whole shower where you're just like and that's adaptation i mean your body has adapted it's delayed the onset onset of fight or flight

and that's really what we're doing we're delaying the onset of those negative physiological effects that will screw you in the times that what matters most in a fight in a competition in life in anything that you're doing and that's all we're trying to do with the cold it's just a tool you mentioned earlier about like stress and focus. And some of the stuff I've heard is that due to your interpretation of stress and maybe interpret interpreting the stress as being harmful or just bad in a sense that are our focus gets to be pinpointed on like one particular thing. I mean, we see this sometimes when someone's frustrated with somebody

and they're mentioning all these things to you and you're kind of thinking in your head, you're like, man, I wonder why they're so frustrated with this one particular person. But maybe they're so frustrated because they are focused on the singular thing and they can't really zoom out at all. Have you noticed with some of the training that you're doing that it's helped you in your personal life be able to maybe interpret some stresses that are coming your way in a little different manner? Or is it also maybe been effective for some of the clients that you work with? Our Project Family has a go. And as you

guys know, we have been talking about cold therapy for a while. Mark, Andrew, and myself, we all use cold plunge XLs since we're pretty big. But the cold plunge is amazing. And there are a lot of cold therapy tools out there. Obviously, you can use your shower. But the amazing thing about the cold plunge is, number one, it doesn't take up much space in your home or your backyard. And number two, you don't need to change your water, unlike other cold therapy devices, for six months to a year. It filters itself. Let's not even talk about all the benefits of cold plunging, like the dopamine release, how good you feel after doing it, and just the cascade of hormones that happens after you get in some really cold water.

It's crazy, and we love it. So, Andrew, how can they get it? Absolutely. You guys got to head over to thecoldplunge.com and at checkout, enter at checkout, enter promo code power project to save $150 off your very own cold plunge. Again, the coldplunge.com links to them down in the description as well as the podcast show notes. Absolutely. So, you know, I found, I found in my life, you know, when, when things are, when I encounter a stressor, it's more helpful for me to focus, to not necessarily be a multitasker and focus on the task that's in front of me or the stressor that's in front of me.

So when you're exposed to cold, when you're exposed to an external stressor like cold, it has a way of trimming the fat. So it has a way of eliminating what isn't useful to you in that moment. So when your hands were in the ice bucket, you were better able to focus on your breath than if your hands were not in that bucket. Why? Because your breath was the key to removing the stressor. You found that through a calmer breath, the perceived pain would be less and you were able to so it's true so when you're faced with a stressor you you tend to zone in on only the critical elements and so the guy who cuts you off in traffic is less relevant when your hands are in ice or when you're when you're exposed to a stressor so knowing that knowing the mechanism at work that it is trimming the fat and

getting rid of really what's not necessary will help you kind of better handle and better handle stress management with other things that may happen in your life. It trims the fat. It puts you in. And the same thing, I mean, we can talk about cold as a tool. Another thing in life that does this, and some people might be familiar, is when you're going through bouts of just sadness or you know perceived depression even it trims the fat your words when you talk to people are more succinct you're not as long-winded you only say the things that are just critical to get your point across because you're battling right you're in a fight in your mind it's a stress your body doesn't know the difference it trims the fat it makes life more succinct and you focus on the things that matter most and it's good to have control over that and

this type of training will help you have control over that i'll say absolutely like for sure when it comes to like i notice this most when i do jujitsu because i mean you're in a situation where you're grappling with somebody but the the level of calm I'm able to keep in all situations and rolling makes a massive difference in terms of like my gas tank. And even if I'm not in the greatest situation against somebody, I just, I don't panic because the breath controls it. It makes a fucking huge difference. People like to sleep on the breath. They like to focus on the tangible, the things, the size of the muscle. They like to look at the, tangible the things that the the size of the muscle they like to look at the but the breath is the engine your lungs and your heart are the

engine that controls all of that and it doesn't get enough i don't think it gets enough uh focus is there anything you do as far as your athletes in terms of utilizing cold or hot or any type of like sauna cold like what do you do anything there do you utilize anything there? Do you utilize anything there? Love cold therapy. What kind? Cold plunge. Cold plunging. Yeah. Okay. Versus cryotherapy, because I don't do cryotherapy, but I've heard people talk about it, and I'm curious, do you know the differences? Yeah, you're not going to get the same effects from it. Also, one of the biggest things that we need to speak about is adherence.

Adherence to anything, whether it's a diet, exercise regime, that's probably the biggest risk factor to anybody getting to where they want. It's not going and doing it once. So cryotherapy is a lot of money, right? Kobe Bryant had one in his house. Why can't we? Yeah, exactly. And Tony Robbins also has one. So if some of my athletes want to get one, I'm like, no, just get a cold plunge. And the cold plunge seems to work a lot better, especially so when you're, there's differences. You have got, when we, you know, submerse ourselves in cold water, we release something called cold shock proteins. Likely if we go into the sauna,

we're releasing heat shock proteins. And these cold shock proteins are amazing. They can immediately raise the amount of norepinephrine that is secreted. And that's that hormone or neurotransmitter, depending on where it's coming from, is involved in vigilance, focus. That's why it's so good to do these first thing in the morning. Yeah. So I love that. And it also has an effect when it comes to TBI in the brain through this pathway called the RBM3 pathway. TBI? Sorry, what's TBI?

Traumatic brain injury. Okay. Yeah. So it's really great for athletes who are getting hits to the head, traumas to the head, which is just so deleterious. I don't know why people are doing these sports. So it can help with that. So I love the cold for both the mood boosting benefits but also the brain boosting benefits however i think there's a myth around the window of when to get into these cold baths yeah so you can mitigate the effects of a hypertrophy session if you get into the cold bath you know 10 minutes after training let me ask you this because like there's so many people that we've heard say this um and we even tell people, be a little bit careful. But let's say you do lift, right?

How long later would you suggest somebody get in? Maybe the next morning? Is that something that you would have them just keep it away from your lifting session? I would generally say a three-hour window. Three-hour window. Yeah. That's cool. That's okay.

Yeah. You know, when I was a triathlete, no one was getting into cold plunges, but we were straight after swimming. We'd have in our, yeah, for some reason we'd get, but you got to remember Australia. So I was training in an indoor pool. So we'd train and he'd be so hot because we'd be training. So he'd just push us into this cold bath and the, where we would be training, they'd have a cold bath. and then we'd go from there into the spa back into the car and he used to just throw ice on us it was i trained with all men as well and 100 of my athletes now are men why i know where are the ladies at i don't know maybe they're scared of me i don't know but if it's yeah it's it's funny. All of my lads are lads. Because I work with NBA, NFL, cricket. I wanted to work with Serena.

She was my gold athlete. And then she went and retired. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You got Osaka? Maybe you can get her. Naomi Osaka? I want to get her, yeah. She actually, I think she needs me.

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ebook and you can get it now on our website at powerproject.live. The link's in the description along with the podcast show notes. What do you guys think of like, you know, cold plunging versus exercise? Obviously they're different things, but we were talking a little bit in the gym about like maybe for some people it might be a little easier just to get in a cold plunge i think so yeah yeah it depends on the person like you guys live in the gym so like maybe the gym's easier but for most people yeah you said it's like passive right you just like sit down in there and it's so quick 90 seconds is a good enough plunge or as a workout you gotta take time then you're sweaty and then you shower so it's a more time commitment it's

like the roi can be like super quick yeah my biggest resistance is working out is like actually thinking about the working out like i have to prep it out like that's a lot for me beginning in the cold it's like do three minutes and you're gonna feel that like my mind can grasp like it's only three minutes away and you say roi like for me it's a lot easier we're also talking about how you feel after a workout and what he's saying is like how you feel after a plunge to me is always amazing like you're smiling you get it like you feel incredible sometimes after a workout you feel worse you know but for a plunge it's like every time i'm smiling. Yeah, after a workout, I mean, you could have kind of overdone it. You could have slightly tweaked something.

And by no means are we comparing exercise and cold plunging. We still think you need to exercise, but we're just talking about kind of changing your mood. And I think that it's a really simple thing, just like getting in your car and putting on music that you like or music that you enjoy or listening to your favorite podcaster. That's something that might make your drive a little bit more enjoyable. And to me, getting the cold plunge in the morning, even though it's not always the easiest thing, it's so simple that I'm like, let me just, let me just go in. And then sometimes there's that negative thing that says, you know know you got other shit to do you

got places to be you gotta you know and i find myself um doing dad stuff like turning lights off and like putting stuff away and like i don't ever do any i don't ever do any of that like so and then i'm like i gotta just go on the goddamn this is ridiculous like what am i doing i'm doing all this shit that i normally would never do. Right. But then you do the thing that you're kind of afraid of, right? And the more you do that, you get the momentum and you start looking at everything. Oh, what else am I like afraid to do?

What else am I avoiding? Go do that. Like, if you have that rhythm, like you're a force, right? It's helped a lot of reinterpretation of a lot of things. Just it raining out like i'm just i'm like driving to go do my run like i'm not even it's like okay it's raining oh shit okay now it's actually pouring all right well i still i'm going to do i'm still going to do my run so it's really helped a lot of stuff and then even just in terms of temperature regulation i saw paul

check the other day uh talking on instagram saying like how he thinks it's kind of ridiculous that people are so unhealthy they can't regulate their own body temperature. And I don't think that people even think or realize that A, this is a problem and B, this is a solvable thing. When your hands are really cold all the time, I've seen Wim Hof talk about it before, this practice of putting your hands in cold water or ice for like three minutes. So somebody that's always cold thinking like, this is the worst thing for me to do and my hands are always cold. I forget what the symptom is or what it's called, but they said that a lot of it can be solved simply by putting your hands in ice water for, I think, three minutes for like a week straight can really help the symptoms to go away. And it's like, holy shit. Okay, that's difficult.

But the outcome and the result, and that's what I'm obsessed with. That's why when I do have something that deters me from doing something slightly, I'm like, no, you want the result. Like, don't forget about the result. The result's going to be great. Like getting out of the cold plunge is going to be amazing. So just go into the cold plunge. I was curious about the autoimmune stuff that you guys were talking about a bit. Cause I want, like you guys probably get so many people that call in and send you guys reviews and just how's helped them but what kind of stuff have you seen as far as autoimmune issues and how it's helped and maybe why is it helping

with that? It's lowering the inflammation is number one. I mean Mike our sales guy Michael has MS so he's in like two three times a day and I mean he just feels way better.

Do you have any other like? I mean, I think to me what I'm noticing, it's like autoimmune tends to be a imbalance of the nervous system. It's like whether it's parasympathetic, sympathetic, like your body, there's an imbalance going on in the body. Cold is a way to balance that.

I mean, like Doug Steine, he was a guy that was on his deathbed. He's a Wim Hof practitioner. We've had him in to teach at our company. You know, his story is incredible. He was one that was a realtor, high stress lifestyle, farthest from breath work, cold plunging, any of it. Thought he was fine. Within 48 hours, he was paralyzed in a hospital. And they were like, we don't know if you'll ever walk again or if you'll live. We don't know what to do for you. Sent him home. Paralyzed in his house for months. He had young children. He was in his 60s at that time. So he had had kids a little later. And I mean, it's on YouTube. It's an incredible story. And his dad, his son found out about Wim Hof and was like,

dad, there's a guy that doesn't get sick and he can heal himself. And that was, you know, from his nine-year-old son, that was the story. And he was like, okay, that doesn't... So his dad's like, his son was like, all you got to do is get cold. You got to get in cold water. And so they would wheel him in, plop him into the shower and just splash cold water on him yeah within i mean i don't want to butcher the it was within like six to eight weeks he was moving walking he is now can do the splits overhand like he can snatch anything is the epitome of health yeah and this was deathbed to all he did was they rolled him in, poured cold water on him. He learned to breathe in there.

And his body adapted and kind of rebalanced itself from a nervous system standpoint. So I think there's – it varies per person in what they're going through. But that to me is the – we see that group have the quickest results. Like it's, they get it a weekend, I'm noticing a massive difference. So it's an area that we would like to, you know, from research and study, like kind of figure out what's going on there. But it's when someone calls in and they're like, I think I'm getting a plunge. I've kind of, I've lost all hope. I don't know what route to go. I get really excited when I hear about those people. Cause it's like, you're on the right path.

Yeah. Have you noticed a big difference for people that are really, really resistant to it, it having maybe a stronger impact for some of them? People who are like there's just cold and me, like we don't mix. That's my girlfriend. I can't do it. I'll never do it. I'll never do it. I'll never try it. And then if there is some sort of encouragement and they do actually get in, have you noticed a profound difference for some of those folks? I think what we notice is partners.

The husband wants it. The wife's like, I don't want this thing. It's not going to take up space. Well, he gets it. She gets in with him for the first time. And then she becomes the one that's doing it all the time. So I think from a resistance standpoint, I haven't really seen anyone that's resistant unless their mental –

like how they perspective on life. They just are all about the resistance and they go into it. Usually it takes someone that kind of backdoors it in for them that gets them to want to get in. It's not one that's – it takes a mental resilience to actually be like, I want to get into a cold plunge or I'm willing to. I think one of the big things it helps with is like breathing, helping you to be able

to be more resilient. Wim Hof has talked about it helping with the immune system. And one thing I noticed is like cold showers are cool because like they get you ready for the morning, but I've noticed that as I've cold plunged more and as I've gotten used to it, I just seem to be a bit more calm. It does have performance effects, but I just seem to be able to just be in just general, more resilient. My breath control is better. So it's pretty dope. So I love how you're talking as you're making this super elaborate protein coffee thing or something. And what is this? Cause this, yeah, dude, it's the, uh, fair. You guys have to, you don't understand how like

strange and SEMA is until you start to hang out with them every day. It's the fair life salted caramel mixed with some fair life chocolate. And I have some coffee down there and then, um, yeah, it tastes fucking amazing, man. So good. It tastes so good. You have salted caramel. I have some coffee down there and then um yeah it tastes fucking amazing man so good it tastes so good you have salted caramel I have I'll give you some I have some of my trunk so I'll give you you if you mix them it's a 60 gram protein bomb man oh my gosh and it just goes down the hatch super easily damn yeah so the cold plunge you think it's uh helping you to be just maybe a little bit calmer in life in general? I mean, you're already pretty calm.

Yeah. No, no. I think it just helps me be a little bit more calm and a little bit more resilient. And it has its immune system benefits, which I dig that a lot. But try taking a cold shower each morning. Just try that. You don't have a cold plunge at home. Take a cold shower each morning and get yourself used to that.

You'll notice some just differences throughout your day. I'll say that. You got to try it first. And then Andrew Hoodman did a whole episode on cold therapy and cold plunging and all that. How cold is the thingy? This morning it was 40 degrees, but it can go down to 36. So yesterday morning, I just got it this past weekend. I just finished setting it up.

You have it at your house? Yeah, yeah. It's in my backyard. Is that from the place in Sacramento? Yeah. So the cold plunge people are based in Sacramento. So they're, they're really dope. So it, they, it came out this weekend. Um, but I finished setting it up. It, I think it can be like up to, they have a one that's a hot and cold, but mine's just cold. So it can be 60 degrees or you can take it all the way down to 36 degrees so yesterday morning i did 44 degrees this morning i did 40 degrees

and tomorrow i'm just going to take it to its lowest because it doesn't like it otherwise it'd be frozen right yeah yeah yeah but 36 degrees and it's it's nice sitting there for five minutes in the morning there's some stupid weird stuff that i mess around with just from having different people on the show and just from like, I don't know, studying like philosophy and kind of like thinking about how things are a choice and things of that nature. And, you know, it's been cold. It's been windy. It's been kind of rainy. And when I go to go in my hot tub, it's like really cold outside. I got to walk out of the hot tub and it's windy and rainy at the same time.

And plus the temperature is low. I used to go out and I used to be like, I used to kind of anticipate, okay, it's going to be cold. And because I already thought that in my head, I was already like up in my own head and I would shiver. I'd go out there and I would just, now I'm just like, just go outside and see if you have the ability to practice not shivering yeah I'll go out and sometimes it's pretty cold and I gotta just like breathe out a bunch and calm my breathing down but I found that I don't I like I don't have to shiver it's amazing at all the different things that you can control you brought up Wim Hof and I haven't really dove into, like, messing around with a lot of his stuff,

but I'd imagine that almost naturally you would probably want to breathe pretty rapidly, like you're hyperventilating almost, getting into that cold water. Is that something that you're doing, or are you just trying to be, like, super calm with your breath? Yeah, so Wim Hof has his own breathing, like his whole Wim Hof breathing thing. And he actually says do not do this in water because it causes some people to get lightheaded and some people have fainted. So there –

If you faint in water, not a good idea. Oh, yeah. There have been some people – that's why he warns people do not do the Wim Hof hyperventilating hold breath holds or whatever in water. In cold water. Because if you pass out, yeah, you're dead. And that's happened to people, which is why you shouldn't do that specific breathing in there. But the initial feeling when you get into a cold plunge is like, people, that's what

they want to do. But what you want to do is you want to calm your breathing down. Because you notice once you calm your breathing down, and we, what was his name? Mike who- Mutzel. Not Mike Mutzel. do is you want to calm your breathing down because you notice once you calm your breathing on down and we what was his name mike who mutual not not mike mootsill the guy that we had on that he um pull up record oh yeah mike castle mike castle um mike yeah yeah he also talked about this where if you're able to calm your breathing down your heart rate like i have my apple watch on and it's it's interesting how once i sit in the cold plunge, my heart rate goes from like 67 to 90, 100. Then once I start just slowing down my breathing, it'll come down to 65, 60, 55, 50.

And it'll just stay there if I control my breathing. But if I lose control or if I start to feel it and get too cold, then the heart rate starts to skyrocket back up. So you also get the ability to better control your heart rate, your breath, calm down. And you notice that it just is easy if you're able to stay calm. And you're getting a little bit of feedback from your watch, but we've also talked, we've heard Andrew Huberman talk about this a lot, where there's a lot of science and research to back up particular types of breathing for particular conditions. He's a big fan of kind of the double breathing in. The physiological sigh. Yeah, there we go.

Yeah, and then followed by a good sigh. In his research, or not his research, in research that he's studied, I believe, there was a lot of evidence showing that it can help calm you down, help kind of bring that heart rate down. And it's like, well, shit, like if that to me is something that's like, that's too easy not to do, not to not, it's too easy not to pick up that habit. Like the habit sounds great. You just got some really bad news that your Bitcoin isn't worth what it used to be or whatever the thing is. Go ahead and try the double side. It's not going to fix the actual thing that threw you off, but it will help to alleviate some pressure, help alleviate some stress.

talks about not doing that breathing in the water because sometimes in my hot tub, I've been practicing trying to change my oxygen to CO2 ratio in the hot tub just to see how long I can hold my breath. Be careful, my friend. We've been walking here for a very long time. So it's probably good that I've only tried like small doses of it because I haven't,

because I think he wants you to do it for like X amount of minutes, you know. Multiple sets of it. And at the last one, you're apparently able to hold your breath for like two or three minutes. You're just able to hold it. Yeah. So like in just doing like, I don't know, maybe 20 breaths in and out, you know, kind of, I'm not doing the hyperventilating. I'm actually, what I'm doing is I'm just breathing in excessively.

That tastes gross, doesn't it? God dang, this is bad. This is bad. I'm not doing the hyperventilating. I'm actually, what I'm doing is I'm just breathing in excessively. That tastes gross, doesn't it? God dang, this is bad. This is bad. Okay. You've been closer, though. Since we got the new show, you've been a little closer. Maybe when we get the newer, newer show, maybe you'll start to make some money. But anyway, I've been breathing in and breathing out and changing that like um probably

my percentage of co2 to oxygen or something and i'm able to hold my breath probably for three or four times longer uh just going under the water than than i used to be able to so have you ever tried interesting stuff uh i i i did it enough because i did i tried the cold shower thing and i didn't really like that but then i i well then I mentioned on the podcast before, it's totally coincidental. But I did the cold therapy thing in the shower or I just turned it cold. I had the worst cold ever shortly after that. So I was already going to be sick. There's no way to avoid that.

But getting that cold that fast, I think just like, let's no way to avoid that but like getting that cold that fast i think just like yeah let's go and that dude i got so sick but doing the breathing thing i remember like my pinkies were getting numb so i'm like i probably shouldn't do this anymore and it felt really weird so i haven't done it since then yeah it's pretty interesting practice i've done i have the app i haven't done it in a while, but I've done it a few times. And after you finish the Wim Hof breathing, like if you follow the way he does it, you feel like you have this head high, and you're just like, let's fucking go. You feel it. It's like a shot of caffeine.

It really is. And it only takes, what, seven or eight minutes a day. Y'all should try that. Download Wim Hof's app. Give it a shot because it's pretty fun. Just don't do it in water, please. Just don't do it in water. I didn't even know there was an app.

The cold therapy type stuff. I mean, just I have a sauna, so I go from my sauna to the shower. And it's pretty easy to do the cold therapy from there because you got really, really hot. And so it's not nearly as difficult. But I still found some utility in just exposing myself to the cold. I also have like a double showerhead. I have like a detachable showerhead. And I've actually just kind of messed with that in a way where I'm just using like almost like localized cold rather than like getting crushed by by a ton of cold water.

But I found the shower to be fairly easy to adapt to. I don't want to say easy, easy, but it doesn't take long. Just be a real pussy about it at first. Honestly, don't be like, oh, I got to make it all the way cold. Don't get too crazy with it right away. But just. You can start at warm. Yeah.

And then go to cold and then go back to warm. 70 degrees might feel cold when normally the temperature is 100 or 110 or whatever the normal shower temperature is. And then plus, you know, in a shower, like the water is only hitting like a certain part. In a shower, the water is only hitting a certain part. So I found that my back and my sides isn't as bad. Now if I turn to the front and it gets on your chest and nippies and your weenus, then it starts to get – it's a little harder to deal with. But what you'll find is that if you practice breathing and you try to calm yourself down you'll be super stoic and just standing there in the fucking cold ass water like without it without sweating it yeah power project family shut your fucking mouth we've been

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Enjoy the show. I will say because there's going to be someone who's going to comment but you want the inflammatory response after you work out. You know there's research to show that it wants hypertrophy. Mark, what do you think about it? I'm just curious, dog. I think it's crap, man.

I think consistency is king. So fit stuff in wherever you can. And I don't know exactly how this research paper was done. I never really looked at it. I never really tend to care about the research of stuff. I think it's overbl about the research of stuff. I think it's, I think it's overblown a lot of times. And like, let's just say hypothetically that it shows one hour after training that maybe it has detrimental effects on your hypertrophy. It's like how many people

have access to the cold, you know, literally one hour after training. Plus how do we know that, okay, maybe it showed that it didn't have a positive impact on hypertrophy in this condensed period of time with these particular people but how do we know like over time over the six week period that the overall benefits of the cold still didn't have more of a positive impact on people so I don't really love to look at that kind of stuff, but I have changed for myself when I get into the cold, but that actually has more to do with just my activity in the morning. I, I've been running every morning. And so I was like, I want to try to amplify my run. And I was trying like coffee and some kratom and stuff. I was like, you know,

let me just get into the, let me just get into the cold. Nothing's going to fire me up better than that because sometimes coffee will work. Sometimes a little caffeine works, and other times it doesn't land on me perfectly. And then plus I don't want to have any digestion issues as I'm running. So let me just hit that cold plunge up for three minutes. But I don't think there's really a big concern about muscle hypertrophy. And I might be way off, but I think that one of the studies at least that people point to like if you actually dive into it it was something like uh they they did like a run or a workout whatever

and like they put like one foot into an ice bucket and they're like showed that like oh you're left and right or a lot different therefore right cold plunging is bullshit like whoa like and again i could be way off but i'm pretty sure memory serves me correctly on that one no totally they were putting their calf yeah in the cold one calf okay measured the size of the the muscle growth so if you want to base a lot of your belief in this one fucking study that i think we can all agree was like not done properly. Again, how many people are very specifically also training for hypertrophy? So if you're super worried about it, I guess you can just not cold plunge on that particular day after your workout.

No, I think that's a good, I mean, if you're training for some competition, like maybe you want to bring that in. I think for the average person, to me, it's a long game. Like, am I trying to show back up tomorrow and like get my workout in? Like you're talking about jujitsu, like, you know, you can, you're able, you're capable now to go again. I think that's where most of us lie. But yeah, if you have a massive bodybuilding competition, maybe, maybe you don't do it right after a workout. I don't know. I don't think we have enough really research to understand that.

But I think to me, it goes back to like listening to our bodies. Like how do I feel after I – like if I work out in cold plunge, like measure yourself over that month. Like am I still working out hard? Am I feeling good in my body? To me that's the most important thing. And if the answer is yes, then I think it's a great program as opposed to like I can't do it because this this paper said that and these practices have been around forever i mean

athletes have been doing this for a long time but just uh people didn't have there wasn't like cold plunge companies there was like i guess there were maybe different versions of them but there was like you know the 49ers and all these teams they've had versions of some sort of cold plunge or some sort of ice bath after their training. And I realize that's after conditioning maybe and not necessarily after strength. But people have been utilizing these techniques for many, many years. Totally. And I think, again, find out, discover it. Like people got to go and kind of see how their body responds to it.

It's not a one size fits all. Yeah. see how their body responds to it. It's not a one size fits all. Yeah. And definitely like if, cause it's not like we're shitting on research, but like I'm someone who I'll pay attention to it. Right.

So like if I lifted, sometimes I'll only cold punch for 30 seconds to a minute. Like I won't use a cold punch for three minutes or four minutes. Like I typically do in the morning, do 30 seconds to a minute because I just feel better. And then boom, keep the, keep the progress going.

Cause it's, if you're worried about that, it's not that big of a deal. Oh, it's very comfortable. It's Lulu. It's fleece. You guys got to feel that. Hit us up guys. Um, but dude, it, it is really crazy how much better you feel, especially after like a hard jujitsu workout or Mark, you know, a hard run, cold punching for a little bit. Just, you can tell the recovery difference on a day-to-day basis. And I kind of think about that. Like if you are a lifter, one thing to think about is what if you're able to work out more often and with more volume because you feel better each day. So you're doing a five week training program and usually you're, you, you you know you feel beat up on the next day you have to work out in the next year to work out but let's say that now the next day you feel a little

bit fresher and you can move more training volume i don't know there's been no research into that but maybe the amount of more volume you're able to work with counteracts the slight inflammatory you know response or decrease inflammation that you get from cold plunging it's just test it out and see what you actually feel because sometimes this research is bullshit yeah and you can't you cannot deny like how how much better your workout is when you're just feeling good like when you're literally like in a good mood like the music's hitting today like the coffee was hitting today or the pre-workout whatever and then you're like dude i just had such a good day and then i had such a good workout it's like well what if you can have

a good day every time you went to work out like i dude yeah no absolutely just something to try what was that researcher who we were talking about one day where she like she did the research on how people certain people see stress as like this stress like you when i when i do jiu-jitsu when you do running you know that i'm going to have a benefit after i do this right when we do certain things that are just like cold plunging it may actually be physically stressful but you know on the other side of this it's going to be beneficial so we interpret that as being something good for us rather than something that's going to break us down and that it takes time to constantly reinterpret, but that makes a huge difference.

I heard a quote kind of recently, and it really made me like, maybe just like rethink a lot of stuff. And the quote said, if you're so smart, why aren't you happy? I was like, holy fuck, man. That's incredible. Like that was an incredible quote.

Like people read a lot of books. They do a lot of thinking. They go to universities. They do a lot of school. They get a lot of, they get as much education as they can. And all those things are awesome. But if they kind of aren't leading you to, not that you have to chase happiness, but if they're not leading you to have a net positive, net happy life,

then maybe none of it's worth it. Totally. Naval talks about that a lot. Naval? Oh, yeah. Might even be his quote, but he talks about like, you know. He has a lot of quotes on Twitter.

And then I think he's been on Joe Rogan before. Yeah, he's a great, you know. Philosopher, yeah. Philosopher, great business individual too. He created Angel's List. But he, yeah, that's his thing. Is like, Philosopher, yeah. Philosopher, great business individual too. He created Angel's List. But he – yeah, that's his thing is like happiness. Like he speaks in the same way. Like if you're so intelligent, like that is intelligence is actually are you happy.

What's the goal? It reminds me of Andrew Yang. His actual goal was like health and happiness for people. Yeah, it's like outside of GDP. It's like how do we measure society's health and happiness for people. Yeah, it's like outside of GDP, it's like how do we measure society's health and happiness? It's like I've just never heard that from a politician. And that should be the goal, right? Like you're saying, like everyone's so smart.

Like what is your goal? And like a lot of people by default have it be money or you're chasing the next thing. And what is the goal well health i think is like the foundation right like if you don't have the health you can't enjoy the wealth you don't have the health you can't enjoy really much of anything i'm always so impressed with people that though are not healthy and they just have this like half like they're these anomalies to me that are like so happy you know i'm talking about like someone that's like just whoever it is it's like like they're maybe really obese or something but

they're just like so joyous i'm like what is what's that secret going on there because i i'm very much like if i feel off health-wise like i'm just a it's such a rarity though i'm such an asshole most people i come into or I'm like this person's electric like they're usually like totally very fit you know it's usually like high cardio yep like I mean oh you're a huge runner or cyclist or something it's like always something like that it's very rare to find the overweight person totally do you guys think that I'm just curious from from of your perspective your perception this, do you think that you do need – because maybe there's an aspect where I think about this. Maybe we're jaded since we're in fitness and we feel there's such a need for this.

Because from what you said there too, I couldn't imagine not having my physical habits that tie into my mental habits to feel good, right? that tie into my mental habits to feel good, right? But like the person you mentioned, right, that even though they're extremely out of shape or extremely unhealthy, they're still extremely happy. Do you think you need to use your body physically to maybe the extent that we do or a part of that to be happier? I don't think there's an absolute answer to that. I think from my experience, it is, your odds are exponentially higher if you are moving your body, sweating, using that physical

for aligning to have a mental, to be mentally stable or meant to like be happy. Um, so I think from my experience, that's all I can speak from. Like when I'm not being physically like moving and whether it's just long walks, like whatever the movement is, not as happy. Like there is, this isn't a chemical erector set that's going on in here and it's just

pulling the right lever. So for me, it's, it's been essential for me. I think the body is designed like the body, mind and spirit is designed to burn an equal amount of calories that it consumes. So you have like your kind of like resting metabolic rate, which means like just calories from doing nothing. But I think that literally you got to expend just in general probably about 1,000 calories a day almost.

I think it's ingrained into our DNA. I think it's like part of being human. I think locomotion is way undersold and it's just extremely helpful. Some sort of motion, like you can, you can go in like lift and you can, I don't know, there's a lot of things you can do, but I think they used to say that people used to move like five to seven miles a day and that might even be really modest. So you have like, what, what is the calorie expenditure associated with traveling in a pack with your family, with a little bit of weight on your back, maybe you're holding a child and you're, you know, a little bit of weight on your back maybe you're holding a child and you're you know going from one area to another uh you know just as we probably did hundreds and thousands of years ago there was there's always there was so much uh like especially here in america there was so much like building and

there was just so much shit going on that like there was people working on the railroad there was construction workers there was um just people fucking riding horses to deliver mail. I mean, like the list of shit goes on and on of like the amount of activity that it took to bring this place to the spot that it's at now where we have the luxury of not expending those calories. But I think that I think that motion is ingrained in there somewhere and i think that's why when some people start to get in motion they get so obsessed with it it's it's like a psychedelic in there like it's totally it's it's in your fucking brain i've talked to some people that swim and then talking to some people that run and i don't know what the connection and fighting definitely falls in that category.

There's problem solving going on. And then there's also, I have this weird idea that there's some sort of particular motion that your body needs to go through every day. And it has something to do with like your hands and feet being kind of far apart from each other, away from the midline of your body and your body twisting. I've heard Joe Roggan kind of describing it and i don't he's just like talking really generally but he's talking about like wringing out stress and anxiety that's fucking running it's like you're you're literally wringing out your body like i was showing you guys with that continuous rope yeah you're pulling that rope like that spinal twisting that you're doing and david weck and all these people that are so

enthusiastic about these kind of movement patterns I think that's why we're nuts about it I think that you have to feels good to run dog like after I started running again because like you were you know you started running I was like I gotta bring running back into it I've been doing jujitsu for years already

but getting my running gait back and that feeling, when you get your gait back and when you feel good running, it just feels so fucking good. Even if you're not running for fucking like 10 miles or whatever, I'll just do two mile runs, but it feels so damn good afterwards, you know? Even during.