Mark Bell's Power Project - Is Athleticism a Birthright? Mike Israetel's Take Examined

Episode Date: November 24, 2025

In this episode, Mark Bell, Nsima, and guest Marshall Jones unpack a spicy claim making the rounds: “When you’re a good athlete and you’re Black, that’s your birthright.” We push past hot-takes to ask what really shapes performance—genetics, culture, environment, reps, or all of the above? Along the way we hit stereotype threat, why “raw talent” can be a backhanded compliment, how music/rhythm cultures translate to movement, and why focusing on work you can do beats obsessing over gifts you can’t control.Follow Marshall Jones: @marshalldavisjonesCHAPTERS:00:00 - Intro02:10 - Reacting to Mike Israetel05:52 - Understanding Stereotype Threat11:36 - Success: Environment vs. Genetics17:49 - The Role of Genetics in Success20:10 - Words and Mindset Impact27:40 - Essential Equipment for Success28:28 - Interview with Mike Israetel28:54 - Your Body's Potential29:18 - Analyzing Gordon Ryan’s Athleticism30:10 - Defining the Word “Athlete”32:40 - Gordon Ryan’s Jiu Jitsu System41:25 - Learning to Dance: A Process43:50 - The Biological Benefits of Music48:36 - Methylene Blue Benefits51:54 - Exploring Unfair Advantages55:43 - Genetics and Racial Factors1:00:50 - Environmental Influences on Success1:03:16 - Expanding the Gene Pool1:04:15 - Was Steve Nash Born Gifted?1:05:48 - Key Takeaways for the Audience1:11:53 - Outro🥩 HIGH QUALITY PROTEIN! 🍖 ➢ https://goodlifeproteins.com/ Code POWER to save 20% off site wide, or code POWERPROJECT to save an additional 5% off your Build a Box Subscription!🩸 Get your BLOODWORK Done! 🩸 ➢ https://marekhealth.com/PowerProject to receive 10% off our Panel, Check Up Panel or any custom panel, and use code POWERPROJECT for 10% off any lab!🧠 Methylene Blue: Better Focus, Sleep and Mood 🧠 Use Code POWER10 for 10% off!➢https://troscriptions.com?utm_source=affiliate&ut-m_medium=podcast&ut-m_campaign=MarkBel-I_podcastBest 5 Finger Barefoot Shoes! 👟 ➢ https://Peluva.com/PowerProject Code POWERPROJECT15 to save 15% off Peluva Shoes!Self Explanatory 🍆 ➢ Enlarging Pumps (This really works): https://bit.ly/powerproject1Pumps explained: https://youtu.be/qPG9JXjlhpM?si=JZN09-FakTjoJuaW🚨 The Best Red Light Therapy Devices and Blue Blocking Glasses On The Market! 😎➢https://emr-tek.com/Use code: POWERPROJECT to save 20% off your order!👟 BEST LOOKING AND FUNCTIONING BAREFOOT SHOES 🦶➢https://vivobarefoot.com/powerproject🥶 The Best Cold Plunge Money Can Buy 🥶 ➢ https://thecoldplunge.com/ Code POWERPROJECT to save $150!!➢ https://withinyoubrand.com/ Code POWERPROJECT to save 15% off supplements!➢ https://markbellslingshot.com/ Code POWERPROJECT to save 15% off all gear and apparel!Follow Mark Bell's Power Project Podcast➢ https://www.PowerProject.live➢ https://lnk.to/PowerProjectPodcast➢ Insta: https://www.instagram.com/markbellspowerproject➢ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/markbellspowerproject

When you're a good athlete and you're black, he's just black. That's your birthright. This idea is constantly put forward about not just black people, but many people. It makes your life a little easier by just saying, oh, this person or those people have it easier. Sometimes you feel like you want to discredit how they won because it makes you feel better about losing. We hear white privilege, but I think there's different privileges of different ethnicities and races. Imagine thinking like that you couldn't learn something from someone like a Michael Jordan because you're just like, oh, he was born perfect. If there's a certain person that grew up in a neighborhood of a bunch of people that don't dance and don't listen to highly rhythmic music with tons of drums and beats and things that you have to coordinate your body to, that person would not have the coordination and the ability to dance. I think when most people talk about athleticism, what they mean is a totally subconscious fluidity of movement and balance.

It requires absolutely zero logical forward planning. It appears that there's differences genetically across races. If you spend enough time in the sun, my friend. spend that same amount of time in the sun. We're going to cook differently. What do we got here in Seema? All right. So in this episode, we're going to talk about a few things, but first I want to say, Mike Isertel's been getting themselves to hot fire for PhD stuff and whatever.

This isn't going to be about that. I just think, you know, I say a lot of things online and people have picked those things apart. But Mike has been in a position of he is powerful and he puts forward certain ideas. And it is frustrating sometimes when there is no pushback on these ideas. And this is an idea that I believe needs some pushback or at least needs to be analyzed. Perspective. There needs to be perspective here. And let's just let this play. Just by the way, I got to mention real quick, we got an Oreo cookie going on here.

You want it? You want to get smush the cookie, bro. Hey, what's the best part of the Oreo cookie? Oh, fuck you, bro. You know, and we walked right into it. Literally, yeah. Yo, there you go. That was smooth. That was smooth.

All right, let's check it out. When you're a good athlete and you're white, that impresses me. When you're a good athlete and you're black, you just black. That's your birthright. If you're a great athlete on you're black, that'll impress me. But good, you feel me. All right. All right.

born perfect you're born perfect all right fair enough so he's got he's playing playing with an easy card all right pose so the one thing i want to mention before it continues it's i feel like sometimes when these conversations are had um some like when i first heard this i kind of had a little bit of a visceral response i do not like to paint the idea of someone being racist on them because I think that that is overused. People call people racist willy-lily nowadays and like not like real racism is something. He would say my best friend's black.

Right. And this is, but this is the thing. Sometimes racist things can be said, even though the person isn't racist. I don't think Mike is there tells it racist. I wanna say that straight up. But that idea right there, there's, there's a lot to that. What do you think is wrong with it?

it's one of those backhanded compliments that people throw forward when it comes to when it comes to like not just black people when it comes to any type of person when when an Asian person's good at piano you know that that kid didn't like that kid just he's Asian right you know he's good to be good at piano but when I see a white kid that's good at piano that kid worked pretty hard right and when you're looking at like he's talking about Ashton hall Ashton's built et cetera but Ashton's been doing this for a long time. Ashton's been an athlete working and he's gotten to a point with his work. He's making it sound like

just, he's making it sound like some black people are just gifted like literally gift, like gifted this athleticism. And maybe there wasn't work done for it or the same amount of work for some other athlete. No, my umbilical cord was creatine. What the

yeah, yeah, yeah, no, like yeah, that's what was going straight through. Now we're getting the truth. Here we go. I knew there was something up with that. what that's how it goes but yeah you know you're born with 20 inch pythons you dig um and something else that's obvious you know which right so python yeah i mean look there's like if you live in dougastan right your first teddy bear is actually a real bear okay because that's that's that's at least it's what they say they teach them out of wrestle with bears what they do yeah so most likely if you're Dagestan, you're from Dagestan, you're going to have some serious grappling skills because the

culture cultivates that. If you're going in and, you know, you're from Iceland or you, those guys, those strong dudes, like freaking Thor and all that, like, I mean, they just come like, you know, stock footage just that tall and, you know, that large or whatever. But if you go like somewhere like Amsterdam where like the average height is like 60, right? Like, you know, there is this like sort of gene pool of attributes that's fine you know there's like how many variations of the butterfly they all have wings but some of them have this spectrum of colors some of them have this spectrum of colors but one of the things is also interesting is that you have this epigenetic change that happens based on what your what your pressures you put on your environment or what the

or rather the input for on you, right? There's a book called Whistling Vivaldi. And the title is exactly what it is, and there was a black guy who would in white neighborhoods whistle Vivaldi because it would give people the impression that he knew classical music. In fact, they looked at college applications and sometimes people would put that they were interested

in classical music because if they put they were interested in hip-hop or something else, it would be like, oh, you know, you're in stereotype. I actually want to examine what he said, though, about being born perfect. Because it actually says more about what he believes about himself than what he believes about me, being black. How much Mike Isertel stuff have you seen?

I've looked at his stuff. Okay. Because, like, you know, you see him, and he has that Alexander, the Alex Hormosey thing going on. Listen, you go on YouTube. you go and you scroll and there's somebody, bam. Anything that they're saying, you're like, this must be true. You see these pythons, okay?

You know, so Alex Romosey sits there and got the being marketing. And you're like, yeah, I guess I should do that, maybe, you know. And so his content, you know, the stock, the stature and all that stuff. Yeah, Mike's done a great job with being very popular. Oh, absolutely. Now, I watch and I move through it. I don't deep dive because he's not necessarily in, I guess, a category of movement, blah, whatever. But I see him.

He's everywhere. And, you know, he says some provocative things. But again, when he said, you're perfect, that, I'm like, yo, bro, that's interesting. Because what do you believe about you? If you think I'm perfect, then you're saying, you're not. but if what what let's thought stack it i walk around and i believe i'm not perfect where did that come from and where did the idea of perfection go like we're don't we're dosey don't went out perfection pellets here right so now it's easy because it's like well you know yeah like

we expect black people to jump high and stuff i mean i don't know where that comes from i think it may come from national broadcast television having a high statistical outcome of showing people in a certain sort of melanated complexion playing sports and jumping high and doing things and then you put that in every TV in America you might just assume that we all do that I don't know I don't know I have no idea but um you're perfect and then I put it back on black people because black people We don't see them, you know. Their thought stack is we're not, for whatever reason, based on whatever we're looking at. So in Whistling Vivaldi, he had students take a test.

No, well, he didn't, but there were studies about this. Same test. White students were told, this is testing your natural intelligence. Black students were told this is testing your natural athletic ability. The white students that were told to test their natural intelligence scored higher. Same test when they were told to test their natural athletic ability scored much lower. because there's something called stereotype threat that he was pointing at.

So everybody has this stereotype that they try to live into. Perfect example. I went to a conference. Somebody said, where's the weed, bro? I'm like, I don't have it, versus of all this.

I don't smoke it. But you look high as far. But I look like, you know what I mean? There's something about this hair that just says this rolls so I must roll leaves. You know what I mean?

But yeah, we can't escape that, right? so you know what is it that what is it that you guys are looking at when you see this when you see his when you see how mike is in the industry um particularly for this conversation how do you guys feel about this move moving this needle the thing i do want to mention like going back to your cultural thing yeah going into some of this is that you know i do not think that some people realize how much a culture and how much what's around people can affect their outcomes and where you see you know, a group of people. It's like when you, you mentioned, you see a lot of black people in basketball. You see a lot of them, football, et cetera. A lot of the sports that you see a lot of

these people in are sports that are easily accessible. They don't require expensive courts. They don't require, they don't, they don't, there are less boundaries for entry. Yep. Yep. Yep. That coupled with certain opportunity coupled with the importance that that has within said cultures, like these types of sports, you'll see a lot of people there that look like that. And you may then just say, oh, all these people that are just like this, or they're just gifted with that. It's the same thing like when you, in, for example, Ethiopia,

there's a lot of long distance runners that come from Ethiopia. And some people look at the altitude and say, oh yeah, it's the altitude and obviously they're Ethiopian. But within that area, there's a big culture, of running and it's one of those things that if you applied the culture and the infrastructure that's set up for those people to become high level runners there and you put that in some other part of the world I think the Finland had a period of time where they were called like the flying fins at a certain point because there was there was a for a period of time they had

a hard a log like a big infrastructure for distance running and they start they were dominating the sport at the time because the infrastructure changed the culture changed to put a importance on that idea. So are we saying that Finnish people just have the genes for that and they're born gifted for that? Or is it the environment and the culture that help form the outcomes you see? And the problem with this is this idea is constantly put forward about not just black people, but many people.

And it's one of those things where I'm just like, I hate this because you'll say that we are just born gifted, but you have to work harder for it. Now we didn't have to work. Right. We didn't have to, we didn't have to, we didn't have to, we didn't have to, we didn't have to study we didn't have to use our brains no no no we didn't have to look into the science to get better no you're just you're just born gifted is born this way well i mean then that gets everybody caught up because every i think doesn't and it doesn't matter what the genre is there is like a belief

that like oh you're this so you should have that you're like they were looking at they were looking at how being socially economically viable people is about congruency they were like if you were like high economic status but you were black or Latin American you were less liked stereotypically because that's not a stereotypical expectation and versus it's like oh if you're poor and white it's like what's wrong with you like how did like where did you fall through the cracks where is that credit store where's all this like but again it comes you know we have this language about like what things should be which sometimes is positions to to people right um you see you see all these white boys playing basketball right now crushing it yeah you yeah bro like what where did that come

from like he's an anomaly like no um there is an environment that's being cultivated where i think they so they were showing how they were scouting for him like when he was like a kid teenager yeah yeah yeah right they were like yeah no you you you'll be in the NBA five-year-old um so this idea about it just gets it just gets us it just gets us riled up because it's like if if somebody wins sometimes you feel like you want to discredit how they won because it makes you feel better about losing and that doesn't matter what we're talking about i think that's exactly what it is is uh i think in in the communication of like this message i think the under the undertone of it is that it's taking away something from me yeah right and that's what you said is like well

i think it probably has more to do with him and how he feels and so he feels like he's coming back from from a further distance right yeah um but i think i think most of us just feel that way in general like uh if you make it as an entrepreneur like oh people don't understand my background I don't understand like how hard I had to work or I had these circumstances or this person died early in my life or whatever the things are that are, you know, that seem like they would be, you know, very challenging to overcome. You were able to overcome these things and you feel like if you don't have that story, then like what is your story? So I think people have to hold on to a story that's complex that has a lot of friction. Yeah. You know, I made it in basketball, but, you know, I'm white. And so, I think people have to hold on to a story that's a, that's complex that has a lot of friction. Yeah. You know, I made it in basketball. But, you know, I'm white. And It's like, well, there's a lot of great basketball players that are white. What are you talking about? Right. If you just change the event, you sometimes change some of the – because there's a particular value in maybe running in Sweden, you know, or Finland or whatever you were talking about.

There's a particular value in Kenya for running, right? But the fastest sprinter of all time is Usain Bolt if you go 100 meter. and if you go like 200 meter. But so you just go to 400 meter, he's not. If you go to 60 meter, there's an Asian guy that is the fastest we've ever seen and has the fastest start that we've ever, like it blows everyone's mind.

He's, it's not necessarily blows people's mind because he's Asian, it blows people's mind because of his stature. Yeah. He's a shorter guy. Usain Bolt, though, broke the code too by going the other way because he's 6'5. Yeah. So I think it's just,

it makes your life a little easier by just saying, oh, this person or those people have it easier. And maybe in a black community, maybe sometimes that's done towards someone that's white that is wealthy, like myself. Right? Like we hear white privilege, but I think there's different privileges

of different ethnicities and races, perhaps, but it's not necessarily just because someone's white, someone's black, it's not necessarily the colors. It's maybe just the way our society is kind of set up. It's the way that our society has always been. Because some people, by the way, do not see that privilege that are white. They're like, yo, where's my money? What's going on here?

I'm not, where's my white privilege? And when they hear that idea, it can sound actually extremely offensive. And I'm not offended by it. Like, I think it's interesting to get offended and what it is you're getting offended by and who you're getting offended from. I'm not offended if someone says you're white privilege. I would say, yeah, I can't deny, I can't deny what you just said. My grandfather did really well, and he had nine children.

He was able to provide really well. On my mom's side of the family, there was a little bit more of a poorer background. But my dad kicked ass with his finances, and he figured things out really well. well and then not only that both my parents were always there for me for everything i'm a big time mama's boy you know so like i i had everything everything i needed i had it i had an environment that was going to allow me to maybe start off on the track of life maybe a lap or two ahead of some other people that maybe had similar goals to me and i it doesn't hurt doesn't hurt my accomplishments i don't think i still feel great about the things i've done and that you know the challenge here's

you're looking at all right certain environments where there were certain elements and environments where those elements were not there and so you know you look at all right well you here's in an urban environment this urban environment has a bunch of access to but to a massive population distribution of narcotics those narcotics have particular um physiological mental physiological effects which then reduce certain structures like a family blah blah blah blah blah blah blah over time this will create a certain sort of culture. Like, that's that. And if you don't grow up in that environment or you maybe escape that environment, you know, it's like if you're lucky you got out or you didn't have to experience that. And we're fascinated by people

who grow in an environment where they were basically they weren't supposed to. Like if you're in an environment where it's like this is the track. The track is you're going to get into some sort of criminal activity and you're going to go to jail. Just because the rules are set up in a way

where it's like that can happen highly. Kind of like Tyson's story. Exactly. So he's an anomaly. We celebrate it, right? This idea of, I guess, the genetic predisposition to certain athletic capability

is, you know, if you're looking at one group of people who do this a lot and then another group of people who don't do it as much, they come up in the ranks. We're like, well, you're not supposed to be here. And everybody,

else that's doing it by by way of what's easy or whatever like we look at them in a certain way i don't i think what's challenging is that we're we look at what people say about their life experience um and then we kind of i mean there's just room to feel like what you mean like what you're talking about like i had to put effort in to do this it's not just because i was born this way you know or somebody would say well jeff basso's had a family trust that put the first amount of money for Amazon. I mean, yeah, that might be how you started. But, you know, when you follow sort of like business decisions

that had to be made for Amazon to be Amazon now, that trust fund money got things started, but it ain't what kept things going. As an example, when you throw words out that become, they become like a barrier of another possibility. if I say you have privilege I can go back into my life narrative and give myself privilege

you can't undo that but if I'm financially poor I can learn how to become rich that's very different linguistically oh you're poor well there's a way out of being poor but then I don't really know what you do with being underprivileged

it's like where do you I don't know what's the escape for this choke I don't know. And so that language kind of being tossed around, one, it will create a sense of guilt for one group, a sense of anger for another group, and then either animosity, and then it's, you see the divisiveness just built into this right away. We're going to fight. But if I'm like, yo, tell me, like I think Floyd Mayweather said it.

He said, yo, tell me how to make money. Like, as cool that you like that, I fight, that's cool. He's like, but show me how you got those things. That's a very direct question versus trying to unravel what part of my historical makeup is the thing that got me here. You want to overcome the history. Like, that's the thing. Again, I'm listening to him.

I'm like, look, bro, if that's how you feel, that, you know, we're genetically predisposed to that. I'm like, you know, just people. that uh that sprint that i'm not sprint that do the long distance running um the thing have you ever have you ever hunted a deer on foot the thing of persistence yeah persistence hunting that was a survival mechanism to eat game because we can we can run for 16 20 30 miles and that deer is just going to die of exhaustion lay down and then we do our thing if you live in an environment where that's how you get to your food then most likely you know

it creates a certain embody type for like our basic survival and so we're looking at like we're like doing like the decorated version of life now like i'm an NBA player I'm a world recognized strong man like that's like cool all of that is decoration on top of why does your human form what is the actual function of your human form and how would that human form help you to survive in the environment that it's born in? Oh, kind of having a massive, like, because you know, just like the strong man, super cold, lots of body fat on the body. What was the value having a lot of body fat to burn? Well, if I live in a super cold environment, having a lot of fat to burn, it's kind of good for surviving. I don't know. It has nothing to do with Eddie Hall being one of the world strong men for

the trophy if we're looking at just to survive and when i hear him say that it's what it sounds like it so i hear these people have bodies more fit to survive not the sport forget the sports that's the that's the that's the decoration they're perfect we're not because the the body being strong has nothing to do with the sports like that's just how we entertain ourselves entertain each other with our bodies. But, and so it's, it's, man, when people say stuff, if we can find the place where it's like, yo, what's hurting you, bro? That you, that's how you're moving and that's how you're talking versus it hitting me.

And that's not always easy because they're just laughing with friends and saying these things. They, you know, and they, it kind of listened and they were kind of cool, but, you know, you those guys don't want to sit there and think I'm not perfect like imagine accepting that whole thought he all those those other two guys would have to be like yeah I guess well I'm not perfect either well who wants to think that right like who wants to you know imagine thinking like that you couldn't learn something from someone like a Michael Jordan because you're just like oh he was born perfect right so when he's going to show me this basketball thing there's nothing to learn. If you ever seen, there's some videos of Michael Jordan describing like specific basketball

moves and stuff. You usually don't see that from like the high level guys. But when he's describing things and he was even talking about the shape of your thumb and your hand and stuff like that and he had certain genetics and stuff. But probably one of the best things that Michael Jordan had that is very rarely talked about is a brother. He had his brother was like my brother was way better at basketball than me. He's like my brother kicked my ass. And his brother unfortunately just didn't have the height and didn't have maybe some of the same other circumstances and so forth. But his brother even had a bigger vertical. And it was shorter.

Yeah, right. Right. Yeah, his brother can jump better than Air Jordan. Is that crazy? I mean, the original Air Jordan, I guess he'd say, right? So you have luck of the draw. He gets to shoot deal. Environment. Big part of it. Yeah. So I'm just very curious because

all I know is that I went on YouTube one day and it seemed like this guy was getting incinerated. And because I try my best to not jump in fires. I have no idea what's going on. I didn't, like, that's a good thing. YouTube video, YouTube video, YouTube video.

I was like, what did this guy do? Yeah. That everyone's mad at him. Because just two weeks ago, you know, people like, yeah, he's cool with the bro signs and all the good stuff. I'll give you just a quick summary. But I think this next clip also kind of is, would be a good clip to play that will go along with this.

But pretty much he is put on, he's put forward a lot of good information in terms of fitness and building muscle on hypertrophy. Okay. right um and it's you know he's peasant apps put up programs and it's been come to see that his PhD because he always introduces himself as doctor like gizratel he has said on multiple occasions that he is probably one of the smartest if not the smartest you know coach out there as far as physique sports he's put forward that he has a genius level IQ he's said that oh okay okay um he has said

things like i look better than uh for a bodybuilder that's past mike menser and i'm stronger than he's he he's so the man has spoken with a lot of hubris about things yeah and then it ends up that his PhD said bigger and stronger athletes are better couldn't be better athletes and there's a lot of errors and the thing that you've been stacking all of your I guess uh all of your authority upon your PhD is kind of a shit PhD you know what I mean like so so that's why he's getting a lot of fire now because you go and you speak about things with such absolutes yeah um and such an exacting nature, and then it comes out, and this is actually, I think, just a lesson.

It's a lesson for me, it's a lesson for everyone. Comes out that like, how you built your house is kind of shaky, your foundations can be, your foundation is shaky, yes. He's getting a lot of crap for that. Right, right? But this rhetoric and the way he puts some of these ideas forward about different ethnicities

and just some of these things is quite interesting to me. And this, I think this clip right here with him and Brian Callan, I think it'll add more to this conversation. Power Project Family How's it going? Over the years, I've learned a lot from guests that have come onto this podcast, and I've taken the time to learn many different movement practices.

So, for example, if you wanted to learn rope flow, which is a practice I think is just beneficial for everyone, I have a free Ropeflow Foundation's course at school.com slash the Stronger Human. Now, the Stronger Human community actually has over 11,000 members, so it's a great community there, but you'll also be able to learn rope flow for free, Along with many other things I teach in there, like kettlebell flow, kettlebell juggling, all that good stuff.

So head over there. Along with that, if you're looking for where to get your equipment as far as ropes, maces and clubs, sandbags, all that good stuff, you can head over to the StrongerHuman. And on that site is where I have all of the different functional fitness equipment that I use to become a stronger human. So check those out. Let's get back to the episode. Fuck is that? I heard Matt Mitreong, who was in Bellator and played pro football. for I think seven years and Matt's huge Matt's like you know six four two 70 love I do want to

mention that like Brian Callan is a comedian and Mike Eursa tells a pretty funny guy when he even talks to people so like um there's probably an air of some comedy here too okay so I just want to preface that you ever met him no one of my favorite people Matt said something I never forgot he said he described the best way to describe an athlete he said my body will do whatever I tell it to do. Oh, that's so sweet. That's such a great way to put it. My body will do whatever I tell it to do.

That's when you, that's a great, because you can communicate with your body, and it'll do, you can watch something, and you can mimic it, right? Gordon Ryan recently, on a, I saw a clip of him, he said, I'm not athletic, so I had to create a jiu-jitsu that was about control so I could do it later on.

And I text him, I go, that's a ridiculous thing to say because you're the goat and you're insanely athletic. And he said, no, I'm not. I'm strong, but I'm not athletic. But I can see moves, I can see, you know, three or four moves ahead. And I say, well, that's part of being athletic. You know, there's a, there's a genius to that. Yeah.

You know, it's an interesting debate. It's an interesting thing that kind of like you could, because you've got to, you've got to put that into the equation. Where he may not even know how sensitive he is to what somebody else's telling him, like where you're, he might mean, you know, something like Gordon Ryan. I'm not sure exactly what he's referring to, but he could just mean that typically is uncoordinated what he could mean

with a baseball or basketball or something like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you might hear? So this is one of my favorite things to do. Once there's like a word or a term that people start getting really like grungy about, I'm like, let me see where it comes from.

So the word athlete comes from an ancient Greek word athletics, which means a competitor in public games. Greek Athlos contest, Athlon prize. The term was later adopted into Latin Athleta. Then entered English, okay. So contest, prize, to compete for a prize, okay.

So the word athlete just comes from the ability to, I guess, just compete for a prize. I mean, I guess chess players would qualify as athletes, you know, or athletic. But then that word becomes relative. What are we competing in? What he said, he says, I can't compete in. I can't compete in the realm of speed and maneuvering. So I had to work on restricting your speed and maneuvering. But I don't think about, I think so.

I hear him saying like, oh, you can't say you're not an athlete, you know, or you're not athletic. But I also hear this a lot in Jiu-Jitsu. When if you do have the capacity to move like that, it's kind of frowned upon. Oh, you're being an athlete. so there's almost like uh not all and not all i just i just heard it and it becomes like a thing where you kind of get asked to mute a certain attribute of your capacity because it doesn't fit

the realm of comfort for your your counterpart but yeah this idea of that word even like we're arguing about a word that just means i compete for a price um So what this, this also comes to how language, again, if I say underprivileged, I can't move. It's almost like a submission. You're underprivileged. That's why your life is like this. Okay, well, if I take that word, lock, stock, and burrow, own it. Can't do anything about that.

You're poor. That's why you're at where you're at. Oh, I can find a who way out, take the back, get rich. I'm an athlete or not an athlete. it's a restricting word like where now like there's a prison of what that word means that then affects your behavior and so I just find it fascinating because Gordon Ryan has figured out how to masterfully in in a within the arena of micro movements established control and he's an unbeatable jiu jitsu player now how did he get to that point you know were there any other

things that assist him in his skill besides his brain there are people who have their debates and say things in the rumor mills but you can't argue with his capacity. So why does he not think he's an athlete? What is that? Again, I think it's something for him to hold on to, you know, so he can say that even despite the fact that I'm unathletic, I'm still able to whip up on everybody.

And I think he probably has trained himself. He's like, I'm going to go in the weight room a little bit more than everybody. I'm going to do the things that are necessary that are sort of out. side of that scope. But again, I think a lot of times in America, when we talk about athleticism, we're basically just talking about being able to play football and basketball. You know, being able to do a layup from both sides of the hoop and being able to shoot a good jump shot and being able to catch and throw a football. Okay. And then you look at wrestlers and you're like, oh, no, that's athletic. Correct. Which, you know, you start to look at regions.

Like Iowa, that's a place where that wrestling is rewarded, right? So if wrestling was rewarded in New York there'd be a robust wrestling program there but that's not what we do but again you know the capacities of what wrestlers are able to do like we're talking about the back the somersaulting and the subplexing and why do you have the back flip and do

all that to grapple is that more or less athletic you know maybe like maybe we just need a different word to describe what we're looking at. I wanted to add to what you were saying about regions like that's super interesting right there's even certain

regions of the US so someone could say like if you're from uh Wisconsin or something like that that it might be harder to be a beach volleyball player much much more difficult but you could be right like maybe your parents moved to California when you're 15 and you fall in love with beach volleyball and you become Olympic you know but it's harder right yeah we love play we will love to plant a desert cactus in like Trinidad and be like well in spite of the fact that the humidity is super high here, this cactus still grew. We're drawn to the displacement of things for some reason and it growing in a spot in spite of, which is beautiful.

It's fascinating. All the great stories. We love the overcoming kind of thing. And there seems to be an issue with certain things being easier. Like if this is what grows here because of the environment that allows it to grow, why should I be ashamed of that? Like what, what, and then what does that create, right? So then now you're holding on to something, then it's just, it's just, it's just,

look, it also goes to show that it doesn't even matter if you're like the best or you're certified, you're the goat. Like, these are the things people still think about. Like, there's still some sort of underlying layer of insecurity based on something. And in order to make it matter or relevant, there's this interesting comparison. So it sounds like it doesn't really seem happy. it's almost like you can't be almost like you're not really

proud of this position are you that's what I hear he's like well yeah even though I'm not an athlete had to build my game on control so you're not really proud of what you had to do to do this that's what I hear I can be wrong so that that's again

when people say offensive things one thing I want to get context on I think the Gordon Ryan yeah Gordon and the Donnaher guys and this is going to be continued in the clip when we get to it. Gordon and the Donner guys. Donner has built a system. Yeah. Jiu-Jitsu. That's how he puts it forward. Yes. You have A and then you have your tree of things that you can do depending on what your opponent does. And that system is marketed to the

idea of like you don't have to have athleticism to develop this system of jiu-jitsu. But what is that? You'll see. Like you'll see as that continues. But that's the thing. It's like this is a system of Jiu-Jitsu that can beat the natural athletes, something that we're gonna get to as this clip continues. So that's why when this guy has in his mind of I'm not athletic, it's more so that it's my system of Jiu-Jitsu. When Gordon Ryan has his instructionals on DJJ fanatics,

it's marketed as like the back system, this system. It's a system that anybody can plug themselves into and reach a level of success despite not being an athlete or athletic that's that's the depth of like i'm not athletic i just have a good system which i can teach you and i see i see i see i see i mean when you watch them when you watch them fight like you know you can extremely impressive yeah like you have like at a certain height like bro um you have to have something in the in the can the way that a boa constricted hunts its food is very different from the way a lion hunts its food ballistic movement i'm chasing

this thing down right right right right right then i got to like do something and then bite the right right spot and do all that whereas the boa constrictor just puts you in a space where you can't move does it make either animal less a hunter no like so the but the the the the the the the attributes that are required for that hunt to be successful have to be built into that animal. Like if the boa constrictor does not have a constriction that is strong enough to sustain the animal, it loses the animal. So I just think, let's let this go play. Because there's some stuff that I think was going to tie in well with some of the things you're mentioning. We how to counter that. Maybe that's just from 10,000 hours. I think he, so I think his point,

so I think when most people talk about athleticism in that regard, what they mean, mean is a totally subconscious fluidity of movement and balance and seeing feeling your weight feeling out the opponent and making the right transitions to do what you need that stuff is correlates incredibly well with your ability to dance it correlates to your ability to pick up and play almost every conceivable sport and it is requires absolutely zero logical forward planning and so i think i want you just just let's not even continue let's we'll keep playing but it contains no logical for planning. No logic.

Just think about that. Real second and then we'll continue to let this play. But just hold this belief system that's continuing to run in the back of this person's head. That's okay. About these attributes. It's not logical. All right, let's keep it going.

What Gordon Ryan is talking about is there's a shit of like Brazilian dudes who are fucking mega athletic? They got that shit, you know? Yes. Like they're on top of you and you push them off, but all of your forces vectored kind of out of them. Like they just shift one little bit and you're like, nothing's happening.

Why is this fucking not? working. They've got that, but they typically think a few moves ahead. And Gordon Ryan has two things. One, he can think further ahead, but I think his best asset is him and John Donahir run a system to where they start a series of moves and they know all of the probabilistic patterns of fanning out of what could happen. And they've plugged every single hole. And so you think you're doing jiu-jitsu with them, but they're doing it to you. And so you're like, ah, I countered with this. I put my hand here. And then you're like, oh shit, JK, that was where

he wanted me to put my hand. But I'll counter with my athleticism and I'll do a backflip into his guard and now I'm being triangled. So he expected you to do that. Coms out was that way. I think with Dracus Duplessi, I think Comzot probably feels that way. Like you're trying to stand up.

No, man. That's again, a boa constrictor has the constricted its prey by feeling out the different possibilities following the animal's breath rate knowing when to squeeze to make it more difficult

to breathe over time until it suffocates it. That's how it hunts. And that that system of getting preyed it would not work if you had to chase a gazelle. A lion though has to chase a gazelle. So I mean

it's how do we go from what the attributes of like natural athleticism are to the Gordon Ryan system like the jump I'm not really seen like the straight jump but yeah one thing that I find interesting is that he acknowledges and that this idea of athleticism being related to dance okay right and yeah now when we say that and then the the the next logical tie is like this requires no level of logic it's just feel you don't need to think about it but the thing is the thing is is dance is I think and activity that some people believe well there's a certain type of person that can just dance

and there's a certain type of person who doesn't have that right and when we look at that with sport it's like well you know black people brown people can dance like they have rhythm you know that that's something that's kind of put forward in jest and then there's the link to the athleticism side of things but why is it that we think that certain people can dance is it just because they can dance, because I guarantee if there's a certain person that grew up in a neighborhood of a bunch of people that don't dance and don't listen to highly rhythmic music with tons of drums and beats and things that you have to coordinate your body to, that black or Brazilian or whatever person would not have the coordination and the ability to dance.

But what is it within certain cultures? My people in Nigeria, and I listen to Ibibio music a lot. Okay. There are these just, there are these, for me, they're not complex. I can move my body to it, but there are these complex. to drum beats and rhythms that you don't hear in a lot of different music. That's right.

That's the stuff that my mom, when I went to African parties and Nigerian parties as a kid, people just danced. And it's not like you come out of the womb, like boom, you can hit a beat. Right. Like you're exposed to something

that you learn to coordinate your body to. And the cool thing about learning coordination is coordination can then transfer to other forms of movement. So you see the Brazilian soccer team. Yeah. When people were exposed to the way the Brazilians move,

in soccer. You'd hear commentators, they're like, oh, this is beautiful, it's, it's so almost disorganized, but it's, it's poetry, but the people didn't understand. And you look at the culture, you look at the music, you look at what these people do. Exactly. It's not just because they were born Brazilian. It's because of the epigenetics and the community around them

that made this form of movement something that was praised and desirable. And that's something anybody can learn. That's the thing I wanna bring down here. Like, why this comes back to people who listen is I believe that people like Mike have an authority when they speak. Yeah. And when you have an authority,

when you speak about something, it's important to put forward ideas that will help people believe in themselves. I'm not telling you to lie to people. Right. I'm not just trying to tell you to be a motivational speaker. But the thing is, is this man doesn't believe certain things about himself.

So because he doesn't believe it out himself, he speaks in a way, that will also make people not believe that they have that possibility to learn those things too. And that's the point that you're saying. Like there's the landlock. You know, speaking about like the polyrhy rhythms in certain music, it's like, you know, dance is relative because have you seen them the Russians when they got that the thing where they do that the day, man.

What? Yo. Yo, I can't do that. Hell no. You know what I'm saying? Like they, you know, they got their beats. They have their rhythm. Irish got step dancing.

Exactly. And so which you're looking at really, which is really a discussion, it's powerful because a friend of mine, Jesse, he does, he teaches drumming. And, you know, he says that drumming is, when you drum, it's an agreement of now. When you drum in a group, we all have an agreement of what now is. When you're introduced to different rhythms like the, when you go out, they in Capoeira, they have that instrument that they play to inspire the movement. And you hear the music and sound, every sound that hits is giving you where now is. And some cultures have different polyrhythms

of the different possibilities of what now is and that can be these kind of steps or you do the bachata or you do whatever it is. And so you, and with exposure to those rhythms, people are able to then transform their movements because they now have this, oh, I can, so now could be that. or that or that like so then that would if that's if it starts so you start to look at well what is

the biological value of the things that we do as behavior including music like why did they drum i found out that the jembe drums all that stuff was actually to get the seeds to move you know that was the you know you know you hit the percussion you get to you get to rattle some seeds to help things grow again we start with the decorations and once we start looking at the decorations then we get lost in the sauce and we say wild things. Gordon Ryan's an athlete, bro. Like Gordon Ryan is athletic. By the way, like when you mentioned Gordon Ryan being an athlete, you know you do

Jiu-Jitsu. Like when he mentioned that thing where you know, you just put your pressure to someone and they dissipate that pressure, Gordon's doing that all the time. Are you not watching the same? When you don't understand something, you'll think that that person isn't doing it. Gordon understands pressures of people so well. You watch him, roll. He gets that.

Yeah. dude's an athlete right and so he also might not be the greatest dancer but he might not might not but the thing is yes he might not be a great dancer but i have no idea those are those these are capacities that anybody can learn that can bring a level of improvement and it's not landlocked to black people and people love to say black people have that rhythm everyone can have rhythm with things that they practice but certain things people don't want to practice because it can feel embarrassing to put yourself into something you know when it's part of your culture it's not embarrassing no

Is something you've done since you were a kid? Yeah, absolutely. You know, I don't have me square dancing, bro. Yeah, yeah, you're going to be in a minute. I think, you know, you look at, you know, sport like hockey. Like, again, it's played in an area where there's cold weather. Yep. Canadian, a lot of Canadian friends that I have, not all, but a lot of Canadian friends I have,

they're like, yeah, you grew up, that was your dream, be a hockey player. Yeah. And I'm like, oh, so interesting, you know, here in the U.S., it's usually like football or basketball. Right. In Ohio, every baby boy is born with a football in its crib. You think about the Russian weightlifting team and the old Soviet Union and stuff. There's a lot of regional, and you mentioned how strong some of the Icelandic people are. There's a few Icelandic crossfitters that also won the CrossFit games for many years in a row.

Iceland doesn't have a huge population, so it's interesting, right? I think we just have a tendency to like look past our own attributes. And I think that's probably the worst part of this whole thing is when you get into conversations like this, it's saying that like there's a block for me because someone else is already better. They were born better than me. And I'm, I don't know, I'm coming from this background that it would be near impossible for me to be able to do just as well. I first started hearing about transcriptions from Thomas to Lauer. and you know Thomas is somebody it's an animal with working out you got a chance to work out with

him I worked out with him and he's kind of always on the front lines of like you know finding out about these new companies that have cool things and but I didn't really realize that transcriptions was the first company to put out methylene blue and now look at methylene blue it's so popular it's everywhere it's one of those things if if you guys listen to this podcast you know I'm very iffy with the supplements that I take um because there's a lot of shady stuff out there you got to be careful. The great thing about transcriptions is that when people want to get methylene blue, usually they'll go on Amazon, they're going on with these other sites. It's not third-party testing. It's not dosed. A lot of people end up with toxicity from the blue that they get because

there's no testing of it. Transcriptions, they have third-party testing for their products. It's a dose so you know easily what exact dose of methylene blue you're getting in each troki. So you're not making some type of mistake. There's not going to be anything in it. It's safe. You can have it dissolve and you can turn your whole world blue. if you want or you can just swallow it they have two different types of methylene blue they have one that is I believe dose at 16 milligrams and they have another one that's dosed at 50 milligrams so make sure you check the milligrams I don't recommend anybody start at 50 milligrams but the 16 I feel is

very safe you can also score the trokies and you can break them up into smaller bits so I do and in addition to that on top of the methylene blue they have a lot of other great products of stuff as well they got stuff for sleep they got stuff for calming down all kinds of things. I got to say, I use it about two or three times a week. I use it before Jiu-Jitsu. And the cool thing that I've noticed, and I've paid attention to this over the past few months, is that after sessions, I don't feel as tired. So it's almost like I've become more efficient with just the way I use my body in these hard sessions of grappling. And it's like, cool. That means that, I mean, I could go for longer if I wanted to and my recovery is better

affected. It's pretty great. I know Dr. Scott, sure, we had him on the podcast and he talked quite a bit about how he recommends methylene blue to a lot of the athletes that he works with. And they're seeing some profound impacts. And one of the things I've heard about it is that it can enhance red light. So those are you doing red light therapy or those of you that have some opportunities to get out into some good sunlight? It might be a good idea to try some methylene blue before you go out on your walk or run outside or whatever activity is that you're going to do outside. And this stuff is great but please like first off they have stuff for staying calm they have stuff for sleep but remember this stuff isn't a substitution for sleep this isn't a substitution for taking care of nutrition

this is supposed to be an add-on to all the things that we already should be doing and it's going to make things so much better if you're doing everything else too and i think this is just a little different too than just adding some magnesium to your diet i think this is a little different than you know treat these things appropriately make sure you do some of your own own research but Oh, if you're taking medications. It's SSRIs, you better talk to your doctor first. Don't, don't be popping these things. And if you're taking any medications at all,

it would be good to double, triple, quadruple check and make sure that you're safe. Transcriptions has a lot of great things that you need. So go and check out their website when you have the opportunity. Strength is never a weakness, weakness, weakness, and catch you guys later. Or impossible for me to improve almost. Well, I mean, we also,

I also don't want to ignore the concept of unfair advantage. businesses don't ignore that what is our unfair advantage well we have this this and this and this and this and our competitors do not right and if you have the unfair advantage of exposure to polyrhythm if you have the unfair

like a lot of the Brazilians that do Jiu Jitsu they also have done Capoeira like they have that that's an unfair advantage to like they have a whole like yeah yeah yeah Yeah, like, you know, we grapple, but we also know a couple other stuff.

They have little other things that have been in their lexicon of movement, which gives them an idea of what's possible. What about just straight genetics, too, though? Do you think there's components? Oh, so every Brazilian is going to be a Brazilian jiu-jitsu champion? Like, that would be the supposition. Right, but there's structure sometimes, though, like, and I heard this recently, I think your height is actually only, like, 60% genetic,

which you would think, like, how it can only be 60, but your environment probably plays something into that and your nutrition and so forth. But there are some people that are, look at Wembeñana, right, from the Spurs. I think he went from like 7-3 to like 7-6 while he's playing in the NBA already and already dominating. Wait, hold on.

I just want to make sure we're... So he's grown three inches. He's grown three or four inches since he started in the NBA. Has anyone seen it like a family picture of him? Like, where is his tribe? Where has he come from? What is the gen egg? How did he?

Because we even looking at that, I don't know where the hell he came from. Right. I mean, in Giant, what is on? He's 7-4 now. I think he's like French, right? He's French, but obviously he has African ancestry, the last name woman, Miama. Right. Yeah, I'm not sure what that's from, though.

Let's see. Well, let's see the rest of his family. Like, what else? Like, you know, who else is this talk? Like, where did he get this from? Congo. Okay. Genetics, look, I'm not a geneticist, right?

So, like, this is a place where, you know, I'm out of my will. house but i think that you know again the the wanting to be able to decorate yourself with a name you know to be a champion or to do whatever and all that other good stuff i think the main thing that you're saying about discounting oneself based on what you're you're saying that's again i'm not offended by oh you assume black people just do this like no no no you need to figure out how you feel about you bro and because you're because that's also perpetuating an idea but i would also say the same thing to black people because black people also have to reimagine what they believe because if I start with my identity is, you know, I began as a slave. That's why I, that's my

brain just goes there, right? It's really, you know, whether how that fell into the history is one thing or another. But you really can't do much with that thought as the predominant narrative for yourself. You're like, yo, I started from some lowly position versus this is where we are in the world and these opportunities to do whatever is that we're going to do. So it really just speaks to how people can negotiate against themselves. And so it's like, listen, man, you might not want to shock put if you have a javelin body. Just but don't blame the shock putter for predisposition. because, you know, there's a good chance that you guys might even come from the same race.

Why did you? Why did this? Why did you get the shot putter body? Why did he get it in? And not me. I just think it's very, it's silly because then you would just assume everybody. And it's not everybody.

But do we think, do you guys think there's, there's, I mean, we can't ignore that it appears that there's differences genetically across races? I would say that we, like, when people say that there are differences among races, the thing is,

is that always the environment and the culture of wherever the people that you're looking at came from is an extremely important factor. And then, of course, the choices that they decided to make with that. Because you can look at any athlete, and then you'll see maybe some people in their family are also good athletes because they chose to do things,

but you'll see people in their same family with their same genetics that are start, different from these people. It's like, how can that person be that great person's sibling? Right? Right. And then I think it comes even lower than that is now for you, the person that's taking in this information, how is it that you're receiving this information? Because that is one of the arguments when it comes to this. Oh, these people are just this way versus the culture and what's what's going on with these people and the choices that they've made. And for me, like, I honestly, I think it's important to pay attention to the things

that people do to get those outcomes. You're not going to, I'm not going to be seven, six. I'm not going to play in the NBA. But could I potentially, if I'm someone who like really looks up to Victor Webb & Yama or for some reason, right? Well, you do because he's, you're going to have to do. But if I'm looking at somebody

and some of the things that they do, for me it's going to be a jiu jitzyu context. The first thing I'm going to pay attention to isn't that like necessary that this person is Brazilian with a crazy wingspan or whatever, the first thing I'm going to look at it, the things that they do that I can replicate and I can do for myself. Because the funny thing is within the realm of bodybuilding and physique training, Mike and a lot of these guys, there's this idea of putting forward science-based fitness with this amount of repetitions,

this volume. And there's always switching in terms of what the research says. But the thing that always comes it comes back to when it comes to building muscle is working hard because everyone's always trying to find the best program all everyone's trying to find the next thing to do to get that edge but with any program that anybody does the the big thing that it's always coming back down to is working hard and that's something that everybody's able to do despite their structure their genes etc and i think one other thing is it's dangerous to look at groups as monoliths it's dangerous to look at this black people as they're all like this. They're better like

this. They're just to look at Asian people like they're like this. You know it though and see, well, here's the challenge right? Because allegedly the science also says we're all predisposed of believing that everybody else

everybody else's life is very simply boxed and we're the only ones that have complexity. Like that's how our brains, it makes it easier for us to mass categorize. Yes. Because if I, because think about like when you say I'm close to somebody, right?

If I'm, if I have a friend that I'm close to, usually what that means is I have an awareness of the complexities of that person's life. Because it has nothing to do with being next to them physically because like, oh, we're sitting right next to each other. But closeness is how aware am I about their complexities? And we can't do that with everybody, right? So what happens now is we have to do we have to look at well how many stereotypes have been handed to us as like well like you go to the market like this is the aisle for the Asian food this is the aisle you know for the whatever here's what it means to be this culture and we you know in every culture as they will either defend or support their stereotypes right they be like yeah no that's us you know what I mean or nah come on African time Brazilian time exactly exactly and we're And like there's certain things you'll just own. You know what I mean? Like this to the Tibetan, the Tibetan monks, they said that they have a gene for breathing at that altitude in that temperature.

There's another culture that has a gene. Like there's spleen that they swim and they go. And the spleen evolved so that they can do that. You know, so like, you know, there is some genetic predispositions to certain things that are. for our survival. I think that once we go beyond that, it gets, you know, again, it's like my baby's ugly, your baby's ugly. It's like, now, bro, you just didn't win the genetic lottery to get tall and get large. It's not because you're white or black or any of that. It's just this, your concoction of chemistry slash what you did with your life did not equal this. And, you know, so, you know,

I guess what, oh, we also can't ignore this one thing, though. We can't ignore this. If you spend enough time in the sun, my friend, and I spend that same amount of time in the sun, we're going to cook differently, right? He'll get more vitamin D than you do. In that same amount of time, he'll get more vitamin D than you want. Oh, really?

100% because you're melanin. Oh, see. Your melanin makes you produce vitamin D much slower rate than Mark would. But he's going to burn real quick, so he needs to get inside. Right, right. So, yeah, just get in. get out, bro, it's a walk for you. So I have to stew. All right, fair

enough. And there's nothing I can do about that, right? So you have these environmental things. I think it's cool. I just think that people are hella competitive. And as long as competition exists in anything, you're just going to, you know, like we're going to talk our trash.

We're going to say our stuff. We're going to say wild stuff like that. We're like, well, you know, the greatest baseball player of all times in Asian man named Shohei Othani. Yo, that that dude. is a unit and like let's let's really discuss the idea okay you know with the stereotype of like Asians as far as height all this stuff and then this guy is like six five yeah on both yeah on both sides of the ball like not even just oh you can pitch and he can swing well you know

what did they make him a lab you know what I'm saying did the Japanese get a special upgrade in their genetic gene pool that we're gonna that just rolled out with him I don't know but you know there's this there's this clearly something that was cultivated and I would be curious I'd actually want to know like okay like what's the story he wanted to play he wants to play pro baseball since he was a kid and then three four years old baseball bat was putting his hand and then what did his parents do they they encouraged and they fed that facilitated that and then you know what other elements in that environment then he became whatever he became he made decisions early in his baseball career when playing in Japan yeah when they wanted to just make him you're only pitching

Now he's like I'm playing both sides. He made that decision and took money moves so that he could do that. And now look at him. And I think that speaks to the expansion of like MLB or NFL, like NFL is playing more games outside and then that will get more, that'll get other races attracted to these particular sports.

Other ethnicities attracted to these sports because there are more exposure. And the more kids that you have growing up, then you'll see more diversity. So now we start to invite this conversation, right? Because when they started with the Polyne, when the Polynesians, they started bringing them in, like, why? Because they were like, yo, you see these guys?

Like, there is a genetic predisposition. But, you know, they're in a closed environment with not much diversity, but genetic diversity, which creates a likelihood, statistical likelihood. But we also also have to look at people that are performing on this stage, the actual percentage of the human genome that these people represent is, if somebody find a number.

I just wanted, like, if you take all the top professional sports athletes and say, here's how many humans are on Earth and here are these people. And we're arguing about the entirety of the human race based on a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of a percent of other humans on the planet. And I think that we're already playing a losing game trying to do that. So an interesting thing, too, because I know we're wrapping this up.

That was like, this idea started with this a born gifted thing. Steve Nash, was he born gifted? Oh, Steve Nash, man. Was he born? Looking at look at him. He doesn't look like he, but Steve Nash was quick. He had this, he had this coordination ability. Yes, fast as fuck.

But, I mean, there's an idea when we look at something and look at someone where most people wouldn't say Steve Nash was born gifted. They'd say that he worked hard for what he achieved. Yes. That rhetoric and that idea has been put forward in sport media for the longest time. And this, there are research and studies to back this up in the way broadcasters and coaches have talked about certain types of athletes. The quarterback, Tyler is cerebral. He has this work ethic.

He's gritty. He puts, when he goes on the field, like he has this. grit that you don't see well it's not like a film review okay well um jibari over here he has this raw talent jabari so he's jabari he has this this he has this beastly this beastly gifts these there's this uh intangibles that that you know this this this raw stuff it's there's different verbiage that has literally been studied and used and can you imagine it comes to certain athletes usually white athletes and i'm i'm not saying this i'm no there's a picture that's been painted it's fair and this has been in so many sports so this isn't just mike this is the way

that people look at people and it's like we we have to we the reason why i want us to talk about this he really he really is he did work for it and everything but he he he has genetic components that allowed him to be that that allowed him to express and expose his best when he put forth the training yeah right but for for tom and again tom has worked hard just like all these other athletes have worked hard. But that is the thing that is put under the microscope for Tom, his work ethic. The reason why I hate this rhetoric is because we need to focus on the work ethic for more types of people versus just painting them with this broad brush of talent and genetics.

Yeah, Dion Sanders or something like that is kind of a person that people don't think. I mean, maybe things came a little easier for him or Bo Jackson. I mean, Bo Jackson just flat out, he just discredits it. himself and Barry Sanders too they were both just like yeah gifts came from God they just flat out just say they just say that which is probably easier route to go hey there's one thing about the culture when it comes to that my mom and then a lot of like you're taught to put your gifts to God and thank God for what he's giving you especially in Pentecostal churches it's like I'll praise be to God it's not me it's God when you're someone who's been doing something like

a Dion or Barry right and maybe that's your upgrading like you're going to give all praise to god not it's not me this is like this is god given and it's it's like that can also be a culture thing in the way you put these things forward where you don't even like you don't praise yourself and say i did this and i did that it's like it's god and then everybody else kind of follows what i was going to finish saying about dion sanders is that what people don't know is that he didn't have a single family member that ever went to any of his sports so that's what that's where his drive was you know what i mean it's like how how hard is that guy working?

You know, how hard is that guy working that's hungry, that that's all he has and his parents never went to a game, never went to anything that he ever did. And you start to look at a certain level of exceptionalism based on, I just want to be seen. So I'll make, like, no one's going to see me,

but I'll be so good that you have no choice but to see me. And, you know, that goes into narrative. Like, you know, the idea of what you're, what is it that's going on what are you doing this for that drives you and you know you really can't systemize that you can try you know i would you know you when you love to sit down and say let me well what's the story here like what when you get that belt when you get that trophy when you get that medal when you get

that ring if you ask anybody who's one and you ask them what does this mean to you they're going to give you wildly different you know views and vantage points and sometimes you You know, that story is enough to give you the drive to push your body to its limits. But one of the stories that won't is the idea of believing in the concept of raw talent. I have a question for both of you, because I know you gotta go.

You gotta get to the airport. Now, my question for both of you guys is what is it that you want people to take? Like, what is it that you want people to take away from what we just discussed here? Yeah. It is okay to recognize the things for you that are easier than others.

And it is also okay to explore expanding what is easy for you to explore those boundaries and energies and limits around your comfort. So like great, you're very comfortably able to do X, Y, and Z. Be great at that. Everyone who is great also spent time pushing the edge of that greatness to see just how great they really are and so yeah be raw be real but also be willing to explore the edges outside of the raw material because that's how you're forged by the fire i agree 100% put the work in for yourself and see what you can make of yourself because you don't know we have we don't have any idea what

somebody else went through or what somehow somebody else worked things out but it really doesn't matter it like literally doesn't matter it doesn't matter if they were halfway gifted three-quarter of the way gifted 100% gifted or they weren't gifted at all when they started they're if they're currently better than you then they're better than you and you have to figure out how are you going to get better if someone if you're doing jiu jitsu and someone's better than you you what are you just going to complain about it i mean they're they're they're beating you you know somebody else saw you get tapped out by that person yeah and is it helpful you'd be like oh he's got genetics he's got this he's got that his dad you know did jiu jitsu to

and, you know, just sit there and complain. I mean, what kind of, what kind of athlete is that? Right, right, right. Well, I'm going to keep this short. You know, I saw this cool story about how Wayne Gretzky did ballet to develop better balance and coordination, and he found that that helped his hockey. And, you know, my mom always told me,

there's this American idea that the sky's the limit. And my mom, when she first heard me mention that, literally said that stupid. Why would you put limits on what you can do? And this this like even comes from the verbiage of how people speak in Nigeria, but she was like never say that again The sky is not the limit. Why would you say that? So that's why I have like I limit with a line through it on my hand because it's a constant reminder that I am not going to be a person that places limitations on the things that I can do and learn and achieve for myself So for any person remember that like Wayne Gretzky did ballet People nowadays make fun of dance and this man did

something that people wear two-toes in pink dresses. Like, you know what I mean? To get better. So use that and potentially explore the things that you wouldn't typically explore because there could be potentially

growth there for you in what it is you're trying to do. Amen. Strength is never weakness. Weakness never strength. Catch you guys later. Bye.