Mark Bell's Power Project - MBPP EP. 640 - How Cameo Was Built & The Impact It Makes ft. Co-Founder Martin Blencowe

Episode Date: December 15, 2021

Martin Blencowe is the Co-Founder of Cameo, an app that allows you to purchase personalized messages from celebrities. Martin was a runner at USC and eventually became an Agent in the NFL. After having his client, Cassius Marsh, send a congratulatory video, they both realized video messages were the new autograph. Matin has also worked with and directed movies with Dewayne The Rock Johnson, Bruce Willis, Nick Cage and more. Follow Martin on IG and see him with your favorite celebrities here: https://www.instagram.com/martinblencowe/ Special perks for our listeners below! ➢Vertical Diet Meals: https://verticaldiet.com/ Use code POWERPROJECT for free shipping and two free meals + a Kooler Sport when you order 16 meals or more! ➢Vuori Performance Apparel: Visit https://vuoriclothing.com/powerproject to automatically save 20% off your first order! ➢Magic Spoon Cereal: Visit https://www.magicspoon.com/powerproject to automatically save $5 off a variety pack! ➢8 Sleep: Visit https://www.eightsleep.com/powerproject to automatically save $150 off the Pod Pro! ➢Marek Health: https://marekhealth.com Use code POWERPROJECT10 for 10% off ALL LABS! Also check out the Power Project Panel: https://marekhealth.com/powerproject Use code POWERPROJECT for $101 off! ➢LMNT Electrolytes: http://drinklmnt.com/powerproject ➢Piedmontese Beef: https://www.piedmontese.com/ Use Code "POWERPROJECT" at checkout for 25% off your order plus FREE 2-Day Shipping on orders of $150 Subscribe to the Podcast on on Platforms! ➢ https://lnk.to/PowerProjectPodcast Subscribe to the Power Project Newsletter! ➢ https://bit.ly/2JvmXMb Follow Mark Bell's Power Project Podcast ➢ Insta: https://www.instagram.com/markbellspowerproject ➢ https://www.facebook.com/markbellspowerproject ➢ Twitter: https://twitter.com/mbpowerproject ➢ LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/powerproject/ ➢ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/markbellspowerproject ➢TikTok: http://bit.ly/pptiktok FOLLOW Mark Bell ➢ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/marksmellybell ➢ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MarkBellSuperTraining ➢ Twitter: https://twitter.com/marksmellybell ➢ Snapchat: marksmellybell ➢Mark Bell's Daily Workouts, Nutrition and More: https://www.markbell.com/ Follow Nsima Inyang ➢ https://www.breakthebar.com/learn-more ➢YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/NsimaInyang ➢Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nsimainyang/?hl=en ➢TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@nsimayinyang?lang=en Follow Andrew Zaragoza on all platforms ➢ https://direct.me/iamandrewz #PowerProject #Podcast #MarkBell

Power Project Familia, how is it going? Now, working with a lot of different clients and also talking to so many different coaches that have come onto this show, I've seen that and I understand that people have cravings. We all have cravings. And the crazy thing and the rough thing is that when you're dieting,

you can't just eat as many donuts or eat all the cereal you wanna eat, but that's why we have good, healthy treats. And our new sponsor, Magic Spoon, has amazing cereal. Now, number one, a lot of cereals have a lot of carbohydrates and a lot of sugar. Let me tell you the macros on this. Zero grams of sugar, four grams of net carbs, 14 grams of protein per serving, and 140 calories per serving. might be good a lot of times these healthy snacks taste like cardboard and crap but when you eat magic spoon when you take your first bite you're going to be reminded of the childhood cereal used to eat i'm serious bro when i had that peanut butter man i was like oh my god is this reese's pieces like damn man it's good yeah so you guys need to check him out andrew how can people learn more absolutely there's one more thing i wanted to add. So like my wife, she has a gluten intolerance.

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because you're going to be able to try different flavors and figure out which one you like the most um so again that's at magic spoon.com slash power project you'll receive five dollars off that variety pack links to them down in the description as well as the podcast show notes head over there right now big will's a legend on this podcast i'm guessing just by the nickname he has a huge dick because i don't know who this is no it's just big will harris but i don't know i don't know if what he's you know i don't know what he's working with i'm not sure oh i thought it was a dick thing yeah it might be it's like i'm just he does have huge arms i i did meet him right yeah at gold's okay wasn't sure oh yeah okay so this wasn't the guy with like the shorts no no that was uh that was horse cock yeah that's a different

guy okay martin's never met horse cock but well he has a different guy's name a different uh friend oh yeah yeah we'll get to that later okay tell us about mike tyson what was going on with him oh mike you're just telling us off air a bit. Yeah, I was just saying. You're going to box him? No. You asked, have we ever paid anyone to join Camion? I said, no, we've never done that.

But in 2020, a buddy of mine said, look, we can get Mike. If you sponsor his podcast, he's doing one with Eminem. And I was like, okay. I was so desperate. I mean, I really wanted Mike Tyson. For years and years, it was like trying to get so desperate I mean I really wanted Mike Tyson for years and years it was like trying to get Mike trying to get Mike and I was like hey I'm sponsoring a podcast and it's with Eminem and he's gonna do cameo great so I went to Vegas met with Mike and it was kind

of a crazy day you go see I go see Mike at his house next thing I know he takes me to a music show I see Chris Angel meet Chris Angel then Chris Angel takes me to his studio I meet with Flavor Flav and I'm like what am I doing? I'm a guy from England from Brighton what is this?

you know and it was just a just a wild journey that Cameo is like even like right now you know a funny story I'm like I'm the biggest Game of Thrones fan like for the building Cameo

my phone was always on I was always on trying to get people on yeah Game of Thrones was the only thing I would do. I'd get my phone and I'd turn it upside down for that hour on a Sunday. Maisie Williams is staying at my house. And if people don't know that, Aya Stark.

She's at my house right now. Her and her boyfriend stayed at my house in LA. And I'm like, this journey is so wild and mental. It's like kind of your stuff. You're sitting there in Starbucks. Your wife lost her job and you're sitting there in starbucks yeah your wife you know lost her job and you're sitting there i got keep tearing my pecs it's it's right and then a bunch of weird shit happens from yeah basically so how did how did cameo get started it's uh it's an interesting

idea like you came to me like i don't know how many years ago five years ago early yeah four or five years i thought you'd be the perfect guy inspirational guy i'm like get the fuck out of here i'm not doing that yeah he says yeah yeah you did but i did get a free hat i did get a free hat here's some merch two hour drive from san francisco i think it was like there and back i was like i gotta have i remember i remember that you uh you like you i think you drove up from like sanford from um la i think on one of the days or something. And I was like, oh, this is a big deal. Because I already knew you a little bit through my brother. And I think you and I, we hung out in Los Angeles a little bit.

So I was acquainted with you and stuff. But when you said you were going to drive up, I was like, oh, this isn't just like, hey, I think you should be on this app. This is like a real meeting. And I took it seriously. but I was just like, I give so much stuff away for free. At the time, I just didn't think it worked with what I was doing. But where did the idea stem from? Where did it come from?

So in, what year was it? 2016, I became, I think 2015, 2015, 2016, I became an NFL agent. And I met a guy called Cassius Marsh. And my thing was, when I saw Cassius Marsh and my thing was when I saw Cassius Marsh I wanted to find a way to make him off the field money like that was it

like I'm not CAA I'm not WME I'm not a big agency and I needed to find a way to prove my value to kind of you know really make myself an asset

to these players and go look what I can do for you so I could put Cassius I put Cassius in a move I could do things like that it was September 11th 2016 Cassius in a move. I could do things like that. It was September 11th, 2016. Cassius Marsh was player of the game. It was Miami Dolphins against the Seattle Seahawks,

player of the game. And there's all these videos going like, if you didn't know him yesterday, you know him today. It was all these things. I'm like, how do you monetize that? How do you monetize that? Especially with social media and all that. Just to be clear too, like an NFL player, they can make good money, How do you monetize that? Especially with social media and all that.

Just to be clear, too, like an NFL player, they can make good money, but unless they go through like, unless they come out of college, like really, really drafted or drafted really well, they're not making like crazy money. And usually you make money when you're a free agent and you get signed a second time, right? Yeah, basically. And so, and the reality is is they have a short career. And not only that, professional athletes between the age of,

I believe this is still correct, but professional athletes between the age of 20 and 30 make 90% of their lifetime income. So that's even scary. And I was just desperate to make money off the field. A few months earlier, I had Cassius record a video message for a friend, congratulating him on the birth of Maverick, and my friend went nuts over it.

And then a month goes by off this game. I was with my partner, Steven, and we decided to make that a business, the video shout out, and it's just been a wild journey. We have like over 50,000 people using it now. And like some of the people aren't using it now. It's like, oh, blow your mind. If you look at the Chelsea soccer team, they just won the Champions League.

Most of the guys are on, like Jorginho, who came third in the Ballon d'Or. He's on cameo. And it's just this wild journey. And it's been a blessing. I get to meet a lot of interesting people. But it's not without challenges. I mean, about a few months ago i was asked oh you had the dream job you know i got to meet like you know i'm a big nerd basically so i love you know uh back to the future i got to meet

christopher lloyd doc brown and i did his intro but he goes great scott marty like i was like oh this is so cool right but it was like no it was like, no, it was like the next one, the next one, the next one, the next one, the next one, the pressure. When you start a business, I remember selling my stuff just to pay the bills and you're sitting there going, what am I doing? Am I a dumb schmuck? I remember being in my brother's kitchen in 2018 crying going, shit, I might have to go live with mum.

And within a few years, it's all changed. So I kind of, you know, i'm rambling here a little bit but i guess what i'm trying to say is i think you've always got to be honest about the struggle of people because the success is not easy and you've got to have a dedication determination and a drive every day to do something and if you don't have that you don don't have that want and that clear North Star what you're trying to achieve, I don't think you're lost. Who are some of the first

biggest notable people that you guys were able to get on the app? Oh, I'm trying to think. Well, the most notable was a guy called Cody Ko. So there's three founders, Steve and Devin and I.

And this was early on. And I didn't even know what influencer was early on and I didn't even know what influencer was like I didn't even know what that word was and so there's a now he's flying by the way

he's got island boys and all kinds of stuff going on yeah the island boys they made a fortune oh yeah that's good and they got Cody Co

he said you know got on and that's when we first saw all the bookings coming it was like it might have been $2.

It was like, I mean, you went, wow, this actually works. So that one, there's just a lot of notables. This is good. My mind's like mush now with all the years. I remember some of the actors were like child, you know, former childhood stars. I saw Frankie Moon is on there. I remember there was some fitness influencer people like CT Fletcher and people like that in the early,

pretty, pretty early stages. The most, what the most notable early one for me that I got on was CT Fletcher. That was your brother. Your brother called me up and said, Martin CT Fletcher wants to do cameo. He had a heart attack on,

I believe it was June 16th of that year and was basically need to find another revenue stream because he couldn't travel on the road and do other things. And your brother said, look, Cameo would be great for you. And at that time, we didn't even have an app. It was Telegram. And so what happened is you get a request come in and you had to kind of like remember the request and then read it. And it was a little more get a request come in, and you had to kind of like remember the request and then read it.

And it was a little more of a lengthier process. And CT came on and was in true CT fashion. He was just like that energy, that positivity, that inspiration, just such a great human being. And he was just really, he was just turning them out, doing well with it. And then he would really rant for like two, three minutes on these things. He had to give his all.

But what was crazy about it, he would give all his energy to these cameos, to individuals. And then January, I think it was January, he called me and says, Martin, I have to come off cameo. I'm like, why? He says, I'm out of breath after each video because of his heart. He was waiting for his heart transplant, and he just couldn't do it. And I said, look, CT, I said, why don't you raise your price

so you don't do as many, and why don't you just don't do that? Don't be, hey, motherfucker. And he says, that's not who I am. And I just thought that was amazing. The guy was, to be inspirational to people, that's how far he was going. I think people don't even understand that. So that was one of the most notable people for me, and I think he's a fantastic, fantastic person.

How many cameo, real things have you sold? I don't know what you call them, but how many orders do you think have happened over the years? Because one thing that I think is awesome, it is cool that, and we can get in like the fundraising and like how you pulled some of that off and how you're working on a lot of that stuff, maybe still today, but there is a lot of dollar signs involved,

but there's a lot of orders. And within those orders, there's a lot of happiness. Like, I think that maybe you buy someone a pair of jeans or something that's really cool. You buy someone a pair of headphones. Maybe they wear them a lot. But this is like a pretty memorable thing.

Sometimes fun or funny. Sometimes just something silly. You buy someone at the office and it's their favorite saying or quote from a movie or something like that. But sometimes, and I would imagine many times, this involves like children. And maybe children that are dying from cancer and all kinds of crazy stuff. So about how many orders do you think have happened, have transpired since you started? And then what are some of the more impactful ones that you remembered where you're like, oh my God, I didn't even realize like I was getting into this part of it like that. I want to say there's been millions. I don't know

the exact number of us off my head. There's been millions. I don't know the exact number off the top of my head. There's been tons. There's so many impactful stories that you've seen, and that's one of the things that drives me. The impact of some of these messages to a person is just unbelievable. It's like you have your favorite person talking to you. It really does melt your heart. I'm going to read you one.

I told you about Back to the Future. I like Back to the Future. There's great foundations, like Make-A-Wish Foundation. There's all kinds of things where people go visit kids in hospitals, and that's amazing, but not everyone always has the time to do all those things. This gives people an easy line to be able to get to and communicate with celebrities. Yeah, everybody values a time of a celebrity. They always go like,

when anybody meets a celebrity, they're always like, hey, thank you for your time. So they do appreciate it. But this review was sent to me. This was from Tom Wilson, who's better known as Biff from Back to the Future. And he was always like,

he was tough to get. You know, he only joined this year, but he sent me, he says, this is why I do Cameo. It says, my son, who is autistic and rarely smiles it was a wonderful moment watching view tom wilson wishing him a happy birthday he smiled for the full three minutes trust me this is more special than a hundred christmases rolled into one thank

you and there is so many videos messages like this that i see and it's like wow and and it's like not every celebrity's on camera. They're not. They've got something in their head. They've seen some talent do something. They go, oh, that looks cheesy. I don't want to be that. But I see these things.

And it's like a lot of people that join that don't want to do it, you show them that and go, I'm in. They don't need the money, but they see that and they go, I'm in. There's an emotional connection to like, okay, cool. I also don't think that people don't realize that really no one's going to see it or care. Like it's going to be posted obviously on social media.

It's probably the person's right to do so once they make the order or whatever is probably part of the thing with cameo. But at the same time, it's like, I don't know if somebody who has 800 followers is going to post it it's probably not going to be that big of a deal it's not going to i'm going to blow up and mess up your brand in any way no no you're spot on but they're getting the anxiety of a talent you're dealing with people that like people don't really think about this but like to

me actors the most fucked up people in the headspace. They're too tall, too short, too fat, too thin, too good looking all at all in the same day. It's not only about their acting. So like they're constantly perceived like worrying about what people think about them. So there's this, so like doing cameo, what do people think about me by doing this?

There's such an anxiety, an anxiety to it. Whereas like a sportsman who's making 20, $30 million a year. Yeah, sure. I'll do it because only being judged by how they play. So they don't really care.

And it's just unbelievable. You start seeing all these things about these people that you meet. I lost my point on that one. Oh, the brand part. Yeah, but the thing is, I always say to people, look, put effort into the video, have fun with it. That's it. If you're having fun with it and do a nice video,'s nothing bad about that that was my concern for myself i was like i don't

i can't picture myself like uh being that into recording them and so because of that i don't maybe i wouldn't uh give the energy that was necessary i'm trying to as i mentioned to you when you walked in we were talking about for it's like, I have a certain amount of stuff on my plate. And if somebody puts something else there, I'm like, what's that? I don't normally eat that. What is that? Like, I don't normally consume that. It's not normally part of my day. And I'll need like a lot of convincing and I'll have to figure it out. And ultimately, and you know this, like it needs to be implanted into your head in a way that it becomes your own idea where it's like, oh yeah, that would be in my best interest. You're like, that's what I've

been saying the whole time. Yeah. Well, well for me it was just like you and your brother is such a great inspiration in the muscle fitness community and i just felt wow i think you mean i think you had such a great story i've always said that i consider mark like the richest man i know because you've taken a passion of powerlifting which no one can make money out of like you didn't make money in powerlifting at all. And you've done pretty good for yourself. A thousand bucks and a one-pound bag of M&Ms. Peanut M&Ms.

But, like, you took your passion, your love, and you – that's huge. Like, your passion, and you made a business out of it. Like, wow. And you did it with your wife. It's just an incredible story. It's an incredible story. And I just find that such a – because I feel like this – I look at social media now. It's like private jets, this and that. And I'm wife, it's just an incredible story. It's an incredible story. And I just find that such a, because I feel like this,

I look at social media now, it's like private jets, this and that. I'm like, oh, fuck off. You know? Yeah. And it drives me insane. Because at the end of the day,

you're just a great family man. And you were under pressure to provide. How was your private jet here today, sir? It was a little bumpy. There was hope. That was Delta, by the way, people. What gave you the i'm hoping i've come diamond status today honestly i do i think i might get diamonds what allowed you to have the uh the skill set at the time to pull it off because you said you were an nfl agent so were you like always in that type of business or like how'd that work out no

so originally i was doing some film financing, producing. And then that business was basically dying on me. The way I could make money, it just was. And also the other thing is whatever you made, you spent. So you weren't really growing. And in the process of that, I met Lee Steinberg, who if people don't know who that is, he's like the super agent. He now has Patrick Mahomes. But back in the 90s, he was basically Jerry Maguire.

He had Troy Aikman, Steve Young, all the guys. And he thought I'd be a great agent. And so I went and took another test. The NFL test passed. It was a very hard test, by the way. But I wanted to help these athletes. I did. I wanted to sign them, help them not make the mistakes I've made in sports,

really try to make them off the field money, try to put them in some movies and try and create like a brand and a celebrity. So take a sportsman and make him a celebrity because I think that's

where you can make money after the career's over if you become a personality and that stuff. So I was in a transitional port. I didn't, at the time,

I really didn't have a lot on my plate. Does that make sense? Like it might seem that way but you're just basically trying to pull a rabbit out of the hat. You're just frantically trying to find how do I, how do I make this work? But that's the best thing about fear and pressure,

right? When you're under pressure to do something and the fears on you, that's when you do your best stuff because that will drive you every day, but you just got to harness it and that will drive you forward. It can cripple you, but it is such a great gift it really i mean honestly like it killed me every day like the fear of shit i might have to go live with my mom i got a wife and two kids they ain't the most exciting thing to say hey mom i might

have to come back to england and by the way i'm the biggest i've wanted to come to america since i mean before i could remember oh you know arnold Schwarzenegger, you're good to America, you know? So I had that. I had that. And so the idea of losing America, go to England with my mom, I was like,

ugh. So, I mean, the thing is, I signed up about 5,000 celebrities and I never cared about going up to anybody because to me, it was like,

either I shoot my shot or I'm living with my mom. And that was feeling pressured. But now, you might be like, I don't need a guy. I'll leave him be. I'll leave him alone, that guy. You know, it's different.

It sucks when that little part is taken away from you. But I think you've mentioned to me that you used to do like 100 text messages a day before like 1 p.m. or something like that because you were just firing off messages and calling people to try to get them on Cameo, right? Yeah, but that number's a lot higher. Basically, what I learned about sales, that's what's basic sales. All it is is volume. That's all it is, is volume, volume, volume.

So I used to get up before 8 a.m., I would send out 200 messages. I was sending out about 5,000 messages a week. Uh, that's email, text, DM, whatever. Um,

and so, but what I try to tell people, I said like, you think about, I said about a million messages in the four or five years, but I signed up 5,000 people. So what does that say to you? You fail a lot.

People don't respond a lot. A lot of people aren't interested. But you've got to keep going forward. And I think it's so important to keep talking about the failure part because even now to this day, I see people that work in sales, even at Cameo, and I'm like, how many messages have you sent out today? 30. I'm like, they ain't going to get it done.

It's just not going to get it done.'s just not gonna get it done and i think there's so many people that think they're doing a job which they did not and the only way like it's that's the thing that blows my mind but then i realize it all goes back to the individuals want and desire to be great or successful or whatever it might be great great a tough work because greg will fuck you up i think i don't know if you watch the show Yellowstone, but this woman on the show was talking to John Dutton that owns the ranch, and she was pleading her case on not getting kicked out. And she said, I always showed up early. I always did my job.

And he kind of sat there and he looked at her and he's like, okay, you always did your job? And he's like, is that true? And he looked at the other people and like, yeah, she always did her job. And he's like, you that true? And he like looked at the other people and like, yeah, she always did her job. And he's like, you thought that was like working really hard? And she's like, yeah. He's like, that's the problem. That's why you're gone.

Pretty much like he's just like, okay, you only did your job. But I didn't hire you to only do your job. I want you to do your job and then some. Yeah. I understand. But a lot of people don't have that, unfortunately. But I also think a lot of people just don't have the hindsight of what they're, of,

they don't understand that the journey of how to get there. And then also the other thing is people lack the confidence to do it. I think that's the other thing is they lack the confidence to do it. They lack, they don't have a, what's, what's your want every day? Like, no,

you want to be a powerlifting champion. It's a great thing. Every day you wake up, you just, it's easy. You're going to lift some weight. You're going to keep stacking away, eating more food.

A lot of people don't even have that and then they don't have the self confidence to do it. And you've got to remember, cameo, I went off the talent. I didn't know these people. I was,

you know, okay, I had a little bit of a head start, I would say, than the average person because i've done some movies and but reality i'd have a rolodex and so like you're capable of great things but you have to have that repeat myself here that clear one you like it seems that when you're with people because i've met you once before and you're a great conversationalist it

seems like you're great people and i would assume you like to be around people, but you're the head of the company. So you came out to meet with, can I say who you met with or Skip Bayless? Yes. So you personally came out to meet with Skip Bayless. Do you want it to get to a point where you can just send somebody out to go, hey, go meet with this person, even if they're an A-list celebrity, or is this something that you want to keep doing up until a certain point?

I, um, no, I, everybody, the company should meet with, with wherever celebrities on the platform. It shouldn't just be me.

That's not a great business. It's just you. Right. Um, I do like connecting with people. I love that. I love building a relationship. I love also kind of like changing how they think about cameo

and from like a money a money to like a place where they can make money to like hey we make people happy that's very very important to me because i find that like once they understand how much this video means to someone they really go above and beyond and then we see the impact from the fan of how much it means them and that really is what touches me and makes me go, wow, this is something special here. But when you go and talk about money, it just gets dirty. It's kind of like, hey, it's just, for me, it's very important to train people and make sure that they feel comfortable. And also give them a face to the company. And that doesn't have to be me.

It can be anybody. But then there's a trust. They know who they're talking to. They're not just texting some random. And you don't have to be me. It can be anybody. But then there's a trust. They know who they're talking to. They're not just texting some random. And you don't have to check with anybody. Yeah. But I love meeting people. I've got to meet so many.

I don't know about you, but you're probably similar. I slept with my older brother until I was about 10 years old because I watched Nightmare on Elm Street. I'm terrified of Freddy Krueger. Are you fucking kidding me? Absolutely.

Yeah, Robert Englund. And my younger brother got the promotion when my brother went left the house so i slept with my younger brother till i was 13 i mean i literally pissed the bed most nights honestly because the nightmare on elm street the worst horror movie ever no it's terrifying just don't go to sleep you're like fuck and you try it for a couple days and you can't do it and uh this summer i finally got to meet him somebody said look take him for lunch i don't know if i can meet that guy and it was awesome like i turned my head i turned my head i was i was talking to someone over here right and he was sitting next to me and then he put like all these like like what i guess knives and forks and spoons in his

hands and he goes martin he goes and i was, it was just, that to me is just, you know, he screams in my face. And, you know, that to me is just like, those are the moments in your life that you remember. Because, I mean, I had this guy who terrified me for a good part of a decade, you know? So I connect to my people. Yeah, I love it. I do love it.

How the hell are you staying on task? You're moving all over the place. You're flying in and out of places. You're meeting with high level people. And I'm sure you still have a lot of shit to do at the office. And you have two kids at home, your husband, how are you able to stay on track with so many things going at once?

What makes you think I do? Well, I mean, Hey, you just, yeah, when I'm his wife here to ask, that's true.

We'll also skip Bayless and a couple of other people on Cameo now. Seems like it's working. No, I think the thing is that work balance, I don't think that really existed. I've missed so many teeth. I make a point that I'd be going on a plane,

I'd be like, Sabrina, do not lose that tooth. Keep that tooth up there. And then I'm literally on the plane, my wife would send me a picture of the tooth. I'm like, fuck, I'm not the tooth fairy. You know what I mean? That stuff breaks your heart like uh the nativity play for christmas i haven't been to one and like i i've really that's one i'd love to go to

little christmas thing the excitement their faith they're singing the little christmas songs never been i've seen the videos sucks um it it but i don't regret what i did because i did what i did for for my family um now i've been able to get some of my life back and so but you know it's not it's never easy but what i've tried to do is if i had to go for a couple of weeks somewhere i'd make a point of booking something like disneyland or whatever it is so I could build memories so that, you know, I might have been gone but when I come back, we'll build some memories kids, we're going to do something special, doesn't matter how tired I was

because I think back when you look at years you look at those like the vacations you took and stuff like that so this year I really got to have an awesome time, April I was able to take the kids to Wrestlemania that was awesome that was incredible, I was able to take the kids to WrestleMania. That was awesome. That was incredible.

We did a partnership with WWE. So that was great. And then I took them to Disney World. That's the stuff you remember. Let's try some of

this mind bullet, huh? Did you try it yet? I haven't tried it. What's it going to do to me? Give it a little shake. We'll give it a little cheers.

All right, cheers. Cheers. Cheers. Finish my other half. There you go. go all right just down it it doesn't taste very good actually it tastes pretty good no it tastes like grape juice i love that they tell everybody like halfway through purple drink oh you should only had half oh well wash that down there you go i'm keeping it in there to see what oh that was on point that was close that was really good

on point I gotta move the trash can I don't want it that close to electronics it got blocked over there yeah you mentioned yeah

you mentioned actors they're too tall and too short and too fat and too skinny and too this

and too that and they feel that way And they feel that way. Do you feel that way? Because I kind of sense that in you with your urgency to push this thing to the top or at least maybe used to have maybe more of that in you than you used to. I've also heard you many times before, even just in conversation and on podcasts, refer to yourself many times as a loser. Oh, yeah.

And I don't think anybody would consider you in that category. Oh no. No. No, it's, my, yeah, listen,

I'm in the social job, right? So I'm always connected with people talking to them. So yeah, I do care what people think. Do they like me? Do they this? That's,

you got to let that go. You have to let that go. If you've got a good core, you've got a good heart you've got good values I mean you were on the USC track team yeah any sports with USC is like

it's a big fucking deal it's not a loser to be on the USC track team I think the thing is did I achieve what I wanted to do did I go to the olympics no potential did i did i did i reach my full potential no a lot of the time it's just you is that real though or is that you're trying to be like a perfectionist no there was you know i mean when i was when i was like 14 years old i came on you know i ran one south of england okay i came

second at the for 200 meters in the uh for national for england but my time was one of the fastest times in the world for 200 meters at that age group i never ran for 200 meters for England but my time was one of the fastest times in the world for 200 meters at that age I never ran 200 meters ever again so I went from

I had the Sussex record and I had this record and this and that and I never ran it again a lot of injuries a lot of injuries yeah a lot of injuries

but also it's like your head space is such a vulnerable place and I really highly recommend anybody to see a therapist I've started seeing a therapist it's like your headspace is such a vulnerable place. And I really highly recommend anybody to see a therapist. Like, I've started seeing a therapist. It's been amazing.

A sports therapist or any? I've started seeing a therapist. Honestly, it's a gym for your brain. This is how you think differently. And those little differences, like, it could be like 1% of thought process different. It can have such a huge impact on you i mean at 16 years old believe it or not this this where is the cameras where's a good light where's a good light dude actually you know what you can see it through the sweatshirt i don't

know why you're wearing a sweatshirt right now he's totally he's fucking hiding shit no yeah when you did that we see it it's um i was saying was taking steroids at 16, and I struggled with, am I good? Am I great? Am I this? I think tracing that word great, I think growing up in our generation,

it was like Michael Jordan, this and that, and you always want to be the greatest, and if you weren't the greatest, you're a loser. And that really fucked me up because it was, what is great? What is this? And the reality is being great is turning up every day and just getting one percent better and that just compounds uh do you think the

steroids played into the oh i felt it hit you know i could see it it was a line drive too don't even try it again That's basically a dunk right there. Do you think the steroids played a part in any of the injuries? Like maybe your body was trying to, I mean, there's speculation on that all the time. Like a lot of times somebody only tears a pec or tricep when they're on stuff. It happens often in the fitness space where somebody's claimed they're natural for a long time and they tear their pec and everyone's's like see he was on shit the whole time i know i think i think if you're taking stuff there's an intensity to your mindset right i think that's what it is i was like i was intense i wanted to be great i want to be amazing i want to be the best i i don't again it's like i'm sure you both similar you wake up lift run lift it was just i was i needed to have the confidence say that was

a great workout done for the day. And I didn't do that. So I ran my body to the ground. But I didn't come from a family of athletes, so no one told me, don't do this, don't do that. Oh, it's Rocky. Rocky's always running. So you just kind of had that mindset.

I remember I had these black trousers, and I remember one day they were white with sweat, and I was like, oh, that's dope. That's a good workout then. And that's dumb. How are you meant to be powerful if you literally run yourself to the ground like that?'s dope that's that's a good workout then and that's dumb you know how you have to be powerful if you like literally run yourself to the ground like that yeah that's interesting though you say you came from a family of athletes no no not oh you didn't come from family because no that was the interesting part you didn't come from family of athletes

they end up going to uh ufc for or usc for track um a lot of people think that like to be able to do something like that you need to come from, like, you have to have great genetics or something like that, but you worked your way to that. No, I was fast from day one. You were fast from day one. Speed was always, I always had speed. I was always the fastest. There's all these articles in England about no blocks, no this, no that.

I think speed is different. I think it's kind of similar to power maybe to a certain degree. You're either strong or you're not strong. Maybe something with your nervous system like are you just were you really fast out of the gate or just fast period just fast yeah um and but you know it's it's funny like i hate the sport now right because you know it's funny i always want to go to the olympics right and i never did that and there's guys that i beat as a teenager that went and it's like so it's like i put i put so much time and effort to this thing and that i beat as a teenager that went and it's like so it's like i put i put so much time and effort to this thing and i never i wasn't even like a has-been that's

the worst part like we've you know what i mean like it was like fuck you know but then i realized something recently it was like you know and like i'm oh i'm that guy you know that guy that's like hey i used to be fast oh there's that guy i guess like you know that that guy. You know that guy that's like, hey, I used to be fast. Oh, there's that guy again. That's that. Hey, I used to be really strong when you're out somewhere. I'm that guy now, unfortunately. I used to bench four plates. You're like, oh, God, there we go.

Yeah, here we go again. And I realized something, though, though. It's the things that you do when people aren't watching. You're getting up and you're doing that. That work ethic doesn't leave you that makes you great when no one's cheering you we're not going to pat on the back and you're just keeping going

you just keep going that loss that stays with you and if you can apply that to other things wow I think that's really powerful but like you've got to take the you've got to try and find the positive out of all these things what do you think was like the main thing when you saw a therapist and at what age?

I didn't see a therapist forever. In England, if you saw a therapist, you're a psycho. 10, 15 years ago, it was kind of that way just about everywhere. That was like, oh man, did you hear about Martin? He's going to see a shrink. Something cracked. Something went haywire. Oh yeah, no. I try to recommend some people to do it and uh i only started going in around april um one of our board members called called me up in april and said oh martin you must

be really proud you got a billion dollar company and i went i didn't care no it wasn't wasn't it wasn't um yeah it was cool it's like great work, but I just didn't care. And I thought, something's not right with me. So I thought, I better go see someone and get myself into a good headspace. And I just started just, I found the right guy that I kind of meshed with. I think that's important. Don't just go to somebody and like, got to find somebody that can really help you think differently.

And I've always struggled with trusting people. And my dad was made bankrupt. This thing really likes to eat at me. My dad was made bankrupt by his best friend. And it used to really fuck with me because how would you do that to someone? Two kids. It's like me making you bankrupt.

You've got to sell your house. Kids are out of school. Toy's gone. Like, what the fuck? Who does that? And it's probably very confusing for you to hear that as a kid

and maybe you didn't have all the details and stuff either right I didn't have all the details and you know I went you know this guy told my dad

to invest in something and my dad basically went all in he went all in and some and the next day basically it went to zero

and the guy went to me and I've always thought about it like why did this guy make my dad bankrupt why did this guy make my dad bankrupt? Why did this guy make my dad bankrupt? Why did he do that? And I'm convinced that's why he died of cancer, you know, as well, later on.

And then the guy goes, the therapist goes to him, your dad fucked himself. I said, what do you mean? He goes, you're going to put 10% in. You don't have to go all in. What an idiot. And I'm like, oh. And this weight left, this thing they've been eating for like for years yeah this thing ate at me like that for years

you didn't recognize that your dad had a choice yeah i never realized and like i'm saying like a one percent just how you think differently and that's not even like that that's so simple but that wasn't my thought process and there was a lot of things like that and it's just like you know for example i mentioned about like being socially accepted hey was i good but doesn't matter doesn't matter your dad he did he have like a comeback story because from what i remember you guys ended up uh being pretty well off right that was my mom oh it was your mother yeah my mom so uh my mom no education after 15 she's probably gonna kill me if she sees this uh no education after 15 she's probably going to kill me if she sees this no education

after 15 years old she was from Iran came to England met my dad and when when my dad

went bankrupt he basically couldn't get out of bed he just couldn't get out of bed you know like he was done

and so my mum was just so desperate to keep us in private education she's like because she didn't have education my mum's a beautiful because she didn't have education.

My mom's a beautiful woman, by the way. So mom, thank you for that one. And she'd knock on people's doors selling 9X, and then it became cable and wireless. So selling DirecTV, basically. And she used to say, Mark, walk up and down the house. I said, they haven't got this white box. Let me know.

I'll go knock on the door and sell things. Fucking hustler. Yeah. God. And so she would knock on people's doors selling the cable not for herself for her kids to put them through school obviously this created drama my dad was doing well in business and now all of a sudden he's got his wife knocking on doors you know he hated it my dad hated it so much to the point my dad had a gold rolex uh watch he took it off and threw it as hard as he could on the

floor and broke it and my mom was so devastated yeah how many boxes that's gonna take me to get we could have sold that you know and so she was pissed and uh but then she my mom was able to scram up some money and she bought a building and my mom is a beautiful woman and she was living in this like she was had an office in a homeless unit. By the way, in this building, people are getting stabbed, raped, drug overdose. And there's my mom there just trying to basically provide for the family. And so I think it's also,

I think that was something that I saw early on about that work ethic of just that commitment you need to have to do something, and it's not always glamorous. There's probably something pretty powerful about having money and then having it be scarce. It's the same thing happened in my household when my dad lost his job at IBM. You know some of our stories.

He was with them for 19 years, and he got let go right at the last. If he had one more year, he would get a pension, and all these other things would happen. But he cost them too much money at the last like if he had one more year he would get a pension and all these other things would happen but um he cost them too much money at the time and they were downsizing and they could bring in three four other people for a cheaper cost than what he cost and things like that is just that's just business you know and so i saw that as a young kid and my reaction to money was way different than my brothers they were um i guess they're a little bit more okay with like they they were maybe didn't learn how to manage their money the same

way that i did because i saw that like this shit can be really scarce and you don't know when it's going to get taken away my dad though had the ability to shift gears without any uh i mean he lost we lost some money for a bit we had to downsize and sell stuff and do things um we kind of started in a trailer park we ended up back in a trailer park but then we ended up doing well again in the end because my dad was just like i'll just all right i can't work for ibn anymore i'll just do taxes and then he started doing real estate and taxes and he made up for the income that way yeah but it's like you you do if you don't evolve, you die, right? So you have to adjust to that.

But the story I love the most about when your father lost his job at IBM, he came home and goes, Chris, I got good news. You can get an USC now. I mean, you've got to tell the story better than I can. I thought that sums up a father, and that's what I think sums up the Bell family. Yeah, because it's easier to get financial aid if you're making X amount of money,

then you've got to pay for it. And so my dad was like, hey, now we get financial aid. This is going to work. Yeah. And then Chris got to go to USC film school. So that's an amazing story. And it's sad.

But I think, again, it's like this year, last year hasn't been easy. This year hasn't been easy. And I think it's listening to these stories. I mean, shit, these, I think again, it's like this year, last year hasn't been easy. This year hasn't been easy. And I think it's listening to these stories. I mean, shit, these things happen even in a good economy or stuff's going well. There's not a pandemic. So it's just kind of, I don't know, the way it goes, the way it goes. I'm just curious, man.

When you said that, like when you found out you had a billion dollar company, you didn't feel anything or didn't make a difference for you. Why is that? And then also, was there a certain point where, I guess, like you never really stopped working, but the thought of like making more, has that, do you still, are you still like on the grind of, I need to make more money?

Or what is it now? Because it might not be money that's driving you because it seems that you probably have plenty. It's focusing on, I've said this a few times now now it's focusing on the one like what do i want what's going to make me happy what gets me excited and so i have a passion for the entertainment space uh and i never really did it the way i wanted to do it when i first came out uh of university that and so i just started going okay let me start pursuing what I want. And that's pretty much – so I'm producing a travel show with Oliver and James Phelps, who are better known as the Weasley twins from Harry Potter.

Oh, shit. And so each episode, we filmed five episodes. We had Bonnie Wright, who's Ginny Weasley, in Iceland. We had Luna Lovegood – or sorry, Ivana Lynch in Ireland. We had Sophie Skelton from Outlander in Poland. We had Luke Youngblood from Harry Potter in Dubai. We had Maisie Williams in St. Lucia. And we've got one more guest coming up,

but no one knows that one yet, so I can't. And it's just like, I guess it got me excited. Like I see the fans on camera, how much they love Harry Potter. I'm like, but these guys don't really have any content outside of what they did 10 years ago so i was thrown into that and then i got friendly with uh rick flair and i thought you know what i thought he'd be a good cartoon character and i'm convinced of it and so i said you know what do you want to do a comic book with me so we're doing a comic i'm doing a comic book with rick flair and i really have a passion for

entertainment so yeah i want to take the celebrities i've got to meet over this this journey and now with me. So we're doing a comic, I'm doing a comic book with Ric Flair and I really have, I just have a passion for entertainment. So I want to take the celebrities that I've got to meet over this journey and now start trying to do things. Now look,

you're going to get things wrong and right but I just kind of say, am I enjoying the process and doing things like that. I think you'd have to have a movie that has all of them in it.

Oh man. That might take a while. Yeah. But you know, that's kind of it you know you just try and do that

and yeah the hustle is different now but then at the same time you're in a situation where you can hack it a little bit now if that makes sense where

what was so hard for me then isn't as difficult for me to do now because I spent so many times connecting with people I feel like I'm that guy that's like

oh I know a guy you know and so the guy that's like, oh, I know a guy. I know a guy. And so... You're the guy that knows everybody now. A little bit. So I find if I want to get hold of someone, it's easier. It's just kind of,

again, my struggle sometimes with Cammy, not everybody's on it. They've just got some mental block of how they perceive it. And I just wish they would get over it and see, again, the emotional connection to the fan from receiving. My brother met you before your dad passed, right?

Yes, correct. Your brother actually came to my house, met my dad, because your brother took me to my first ever movie set on the set of... The Rock, right? Yeah, the movie was Faster. So my dad was like, he was so excited. My dad came and went, you're doing it, son.

I said, what am I doing, dad? You're going to a movie set. I'm like, wow. That's what my brother said my brother is like uh he said your dad was so appreciative he's like he made it he's on the set with the rock and he's like we're not doing anything we're just uh we're barely allowed to be there barely allowed to be there but you know the coolest thing is the rock came up to us say hey guys let's get a photo i thought that was dope oh he's extremely i thought that was dope he's extremely uh kind

uh today is the anniversary of my oldest brother's death and i think that was a big uh connection uh with you like when we first met you you were still grieving your dad's loss and all i remember having great conversations with you in the car about your dad so that has probably been a uh a driving force for you to you have have twin girls. I want to say two twin girls, but you have twin girls. And from what I remember, one of them had a condition, right? When they were real little. Yeah, you're right. This was 2014. This was a really challenging time. My kids were born in 2013. And when you have kids, it normally comes out of prosperity right

you're having kids things are going good I had a good year in 2012 well this is this is easy making money is easy you know I've been with my wife

since I was 16 damn and so and then we you know it was January I'm feeling good about myself I think I'm going to make

a lot of money this year you know if we have a baby great you know I guess now I can say I'm an overachiever that money this year. If we have a baby, great. I guess now I can say I'm an overachiever. That's why I had twins. But shit, that's really expensive.

And the other thing is none of my deals came through. So nothing, like all these deals I thought were going to come, but they didn't. And so it was a really like challenge time, very scary, very like, oh my God, you're spending money that you made last year, but you're not making, it terrible it's a scary time my kids were premature um they came in september not october and there was some obviously some complications of that and you know december i thought you know what i'm gonna fly back to england i'm gonna be with mom we're gonna be with some family we need some support because we have nobody in Los Angeles. So let's go back.

And so we went back and I was like, it was quite nice being at home. Like with, you know, after getting your ass kicked for a whole year, you're like, and the babies are kicking your ass. You're like, you know, have somebody to help out. And it was New Year's Day. This guy picked up my daughter and coughed in her face. And I went nuts. I went nuts.

Obviously, you're the crazy guy. You lose your temper, you're the bad guy. That's it. Right? Anyway, a few days later, Savannah was like, her chest was a bit bad and things like that.

The doctor came over to the house. I said, if she gets worse, take her to hospital. I said, okay. She actually, the next day, made a turn. Great.

Then Sabrina. She actually, the next day, made a turn. Great. Then Sabrina. She's gone very quiet. She's gone very, you know, like, her breathing, her chest, and she just was non-responsive. Like, just not being, you know, we rush her to hospital. And me being dumb, they go in there,

they flush her nose out, get some bogeys out. And I was like, oh, okay, cool, great. We can go home. No, no, no. They take her to a hospital room and they went, Martin, it's deadly. This could be deadly with her. It's bronchitis.

It's very common. It's very, very common. It's not everyone, like 97% of people get it. But with her, it was like just deadly because she was premature and her immune system. And it was just terrifying. And I remember being in this hospital room and i've been always been very honest about it uh my wife doesn't like me saying it but it's true i said um

you know i said i remember lying there when they said it could be deadly thinking fuck i can't kill myself because i got another baby to look after and i because i've only had one and she died i'd been done i know that like i i felt it in that room yeah and i remember being frustrated being like fuck i got fucking Savannah. It's like, fuck. And there was another kid that came in. I think his name was Lucas. And they're like, look, we might have to send your kids to London.

I said, why? Why are we going to send the kids to London? Like, Brighton is 60 miles south. We don't have the right machines to look after them. I'm like, are you fucking kidding me? Like, Brighton's not like a, it's an affluent town. I'm like, what the heck? Anyway, so what do you do in when you're desperate you pray to god unfortunately always pray at the the wrong

times right and they were like hey thanks for this um and i go he's like fuck it's you again this guy's always bitching and i go god you know like look i'll do a pact i said look if you save sabrina i'll make sure we get these machines in every room of the hospital. And I was like, if, but if you don't, I'm just not going to be that motivated. Just heads up. It was something along the lines of that. I'm not going to be a good guy. Yeah. I mean, yeah. And so anyway, like, you know, Sabrina was up and down and, but she, she got through it obviously. And I remember the second, I didn't leave that bedroom. I did not leave that bedroom. Not once. And the other thing is I was so scared. I was kind of a little bit crippled.

And then I realized someone made me say, Martin, talk to her, read her a book because your ears are still going. And I never thought of that. And so I started reading the books and talking to her and putting clothes next to her that she could smell, even though she wasn't necessarily present. And so anyway, when she turned around, I went, the second she got up, hey, mommy, you got up, I'm out. Went home and slept.

And then I just did one, I just got on the phone. And I just started calling everyone, donate, donate, donate. It was a Vivo 50 ventilator. I called up everybody. I probably met you when I was four years old. Hey, do you remember me in the playground? Hey, look, you got to donate. Five bucks, good, there. Go fund me, whatever the pageator. I called up everybody. I probably met you when I was four years old. Hey, do you remember me in the playground? Hey, look, you got to donate five bucks. Good. There. Go fund me whatever the page was. I called up everybody and I thought I need to make an impact. I need to make an impact. I need to make an impact. How do I do this? At that time, I was doing a TV show,

producing a TV show with the creator of Baywatch, a guy called Greg Bonan. So I called Greg. I said, a guy called Greg Bonin. So I called Greg. I said, Greg, can we do something? Can we put at the end of the credits, thank you to the Royal Alexander in Brighton for saving the life of Sabrina Blenka.

He said, absolutely, Martin. And I called up a buddy. They put it in the newspaper. Baywatch creator dedicates an episode to the hospital. As you can imagine, then the news,

then the TV shoot, TV cameras came around. They recorded it. And we raised cameras came around. They recorded it. And we raised all the money. We got the Vivo 50 ventilator in every room in the hospital. Damn. I always get confused. We've won some awards, you know, national.

I've had emails, oh, you've won an award for this or you've won an award for that. And it's been very satisfying because kids have been coming out of record time. So that's been dope. Because as a parent, the stress of, you know, your kid out of record time so that's been dope because as a parent the stress of you know your kid being in hospital

so that's great to hear but the thing that was like like now was a light bulb moment is it's kind of like the power of celebrity like I set up 5,000 people and like

the ability to do something great with that not for any money gain the monetary gain there's a lot you can do to help people with that because the the amount of influence they have like martin going hey doesn't have the same impact but the guy from baywatch saying it is in the newspaper then it was like made national news because it was interesting um so i think losing my father and seeing that struggle and seeing you know that he was my dad was

tortured i mean there's no way about i mean he was he was tortured five years what kind of cancer did he have it was in his liver uh and then it went through like i mean it's just liver but then it went to when he had a liver transplant there was a lot of surgeries first time it was in a liver resection i never knew this but you could cut the liver up and it grows back right i never knew that so they cut out like three quarters and it grows back. I never knew that. So they cut out like three quarters of his liver. It grew back and he seemed to be doing good. And then it came back.

He had a liver transplant. And then he had all these issues from radiation from years past because it dried up all the veins. So they had a lot of complications there. Then he has a liver transplant. I'm good. Great. And then they find that he had cancer in his spine. And then he was terrified about his neck breaking and then began being paralyzed. And so every time there was a pain, it just, there was so many things. And, you know. It's like you get a couple of good days going and

you're like, oh, this is kind of promising. And I'm like, no, he has more, right? That stuff's brutal. The best thing about cancer, the best thing about cancer is you get to say I love you. And every day I was, you know, I love you, Dad, and I would massage his back. I mean, all the years of being a sportsman, I had people massaging me, so I kind of had an idea what I was doing. So I would massage his back, massage his feet, do all these things to try and make him feel better and take away that pain. And I remember one day I was lying in bed and I'm massaging his feet his feet were really swollen and i was massaging his feet

and he goes to me son this was like in december as well he goes son um i'm gonna beat cancer for you because i know how much you love me i said that's gonna the toilet you know i just went and just fucking cried i mean i i knew i could feel him dying, you know? And so you go for these things, and I'm not a person that will go like, fuck you, God, why did I do that? I look at it like, this happened for a reason, and you've got to help people. And I haven't really found that thing yet with cancer,

or it might not even be cancer, it might be something else. Because you write a check to cancer research, but it's like, well, it's still cancer. You know what I mean? So I haven't found my, like buying write a check to cancer research, but it's like, well, it's still cancer. You know what I mean? So I haven't found my, like buying the lifesaver machines, that was a no brainer in a way. You haven't got this machine? Okay, let's raise money.

But I always want to do something to honor my dad and, you know, people that have left us. And I think it's important to do that. You know, the funny thing is people think that they can't eat steak when they're dieting. Andrew, what is the macros on the Piedmontese center cut ribeye? Yes, that's actually my favorite cut of steak right now from Piedmontese. For an entire 10 ounce cut, you're going to get five grams of fat, 65 grams of protein and zero carbs because we're just eating meat. And you would think that you could not have a ribeye steak and still be on a diet. But with Piedmontese, you can.

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Links to them down in the YouTube description as well as the podcast show notes. Head over there right now. I think we're just a few years away from cancer being not beaten completely, but a lot of the cancers that once killed people, I think over the next five, 10 years, they've been saying that for like 30 years, but I think we're getting super close because they can diagnose stuff so much earlier now,

which is one of the biggest things. Got something over there, Andrew? You know, you've been waiting to chime in. Oh man, I'm over here. I'm hurting thinking about like what you're going through with your daughter, but like, that's very inspirational thinking like, Hey, get me out of this. And I'm going to make sure no parent has to go through this again. I mean, I guess, was it just in that moment or have you always had that, like, I guess that big heart to think that way as opposed to someone else like get me out of this and you know i'll stop cussing for a year something stupid you know but you

thought if i get through this i'm going to give back bigger better than anybody else ever has do you know i was sitting here and you said that to me i'm thinking i don't know where i got that from honestly i was thinking that way and then the light bulb went off my dad my dad when he was a kid was very poor very poor you know there's a story about him playing cricket and he couldn't afford you have to wear whites right and he couldn't afford to buy the whites and he was going to pay for this big county team he's going to go try out for whatever and his grandmother stitched some stuff but it was too baggy and he looked like, looked like a poor kid, you know? He hated it.

He turned up, he was so embarrassed he ran off. And so my dad always wanted to make sure we had the best, you say cleats over here, that's a weird word,

am I saying it right? I'm going to say boots, but the best cleats, the best things because he didn't want us to go through what he went through as a child.

And so that, you know, for example, he said to me his dad would have in the fridge lemonade and he would, you know, mark off off where the lemonade was finished like where he'd put it back and he hated that and so like my dad was like you want lemonade my dad could be dying of thirst here's lemonade so i think that's just from how i was raised by my father like he didn't want us to

go through with the things that he went through and i think that you know you don't realize it you don't realize it until you like honestly I didn't really clock it until then I was like I don't know why I think that way so I guess it's just good parenting great parenting I'm curious

I don't mean to segue because this was a very deep conversation but I was wondering apps like Instagram and TikTok, right? What would stop an app from that, like from adding something like Cameo to their app? Because you know how they're always copying other apps and what they do, like Instagram's out here copying everything that TikTok does. Could an app do something like that? Yeah.

Listen, anything's possible yeah I mean it hasn't it hasn't happened is there even another app that's similar? to be honest with you the one thing I've learned is because you put a little shiny button there doesn't mean a talent's going to press it and do it

so I think the thing with a cameo, it's a brick by brick thing. You've got to sell each individual. So I think that's probably the reason. There's a complexity to it. You're dealing with difficult individuals. When it comes to the sales side of things,

I'd like for you to share with people, when somebody takes, you mentioned the volume, just like rifling through people, when somebody takes, like, you mentioned the volume, just like rifling through people, right? I'm just in my head, I have an idea of what you're going to say, but I'm interested to see what route you'll go, because I don't know what the answer is, because I've never done what you've done. In your experience, the people who are like, I get it, boom, they're in.

Is that usually pretty smooth and the relationship is good? And do you find that the people that it's like you have these long conversations and it just is a lot of back and forth and it's just, it's not going quite the way that you thought once you do get them? Does it not work the way that you thought kind of thing? Yeah. Sometimes you devote a lot of time into somebody to get on and you get excited about it.

And for whatever reason, it just doesn't take off. And some of that could just be not enough eyeballs are seeing their page, their price too high, whatever it might be. That's been my experience too. It seems like whenever someone's a pain in the ass, or this is like a drug deal thing too, they talk about that in drug dealing,

like once things go sideways, they're sideways, and you shouldn't go back to it. No, but I think most of, there's just so many different scenarios. I mean, some of the guys you speak to, you hit it off, and at the end of the day, a lot of it has, it's a tricky one. Like, the reality is it's the service you provide.

The relationships that I've developed sometimes come from the guys who have done the best on Cameo, unfortunately. And the guys that have done okay with it, your relationship isn't as strong. You know, it's kind of like – that's the only thing I can tell you in my head. Cause they're all in, they vibe with you. Well, the product vibes with them. Well,

it works for them. So they enjoy talking to you because they've had a very positive experience with the app. Um, there's been a few scenarios where I've spoken to some people and I could sense they were beating up and I could hear it in their voice and they were scared if they were going to be successful. Uh,

one that comes to my mind is a guy called James Buckley. You wouldn't know who he was. Unless you've got some English fans, they wouldn't know who he was. He plays Jay Cartwright from The Inbetweeners. The Inbetweeners is probably one of the most successful comedies of all time in England. Had two hit movies, three TV shows, massive.

And he's one of the most popular guys. And I guess his's kind of, his career kind of, you know, wasn't doing what he had done when he came on thing. And they did a reunion show in 2019 and he got a lot of negative press about it. Like, cause he wasn't this like, you know, funny self or, you know, which is harsh, right?

Like you're getting judged by media because, you know, you weren't in a good head space, but yet they just like you're getting judged by media because you know you weren't in a good headspace but yet they just think you're an asshole basically and that's not the case and I could hear in his voice

like the vulnerability like I've got two kids I'm looking after I could hear do people love me do people care about me like I could sense this pain so I would call this guy up

all the time and be like dude you made a grand this week that's great people love you I would honestly do that. So I would call this guy up all the time. And I'd be like, dude, you made a grand this week. That's great. People love you. I would honestly do that. Man, you made $1,500 this week.

People love you. And I'd make an effort. Like, how can I help you? Because I could feel his pain. And about maybe two months later, Lad Bible. You know Lad Bible? It's like a big account. They go, James Buckley will call you a bus wanker for 41 pounds

do you know what happened that weekend he did a hundred thousand dollars yo damn and the thing is what was great i was able to call it people love you he's like i gotta go man i've got a bunch of cameras to do yeah and this person is completely transformed i I mean, it's unbelievable. And then he texts me. He's doing a play in London, 2-2-2, in the West End or East End. Forgive me. West End.

I'm probably going to get tortured. It's like Broadway, you know, or whatever. And he texts me, he says, are you by any chance coming back to England anytime soon? And I said, I might come back in January. He says, well, I'm doing this play, and I wouldn't be doing it if it wasn't for you. And that really, I said, I might come back in January. He says, well, I'm doing this play and I wouldn't be doing it if it wasn't for you. And that really, I said, I'm 100% in then. And so there's people like that that I've found.

But honestly, Mark, the guys that do the best are the ones that have the better relationship, unfortunately. When you're in conversation with people, have you found it to be really tricky? Because I know for myself, sometimes if I get invited to something, I might, I think they, I think sometimes people think they have a persuasive way to communicate. And they'll say, oh, this person, this person, and this person are coming too. And I'm always thinking like, I'm nothing like those fucking people. Like, I always just feel like, because it's just like, it's my mindset. I'm like, I'm on a different level than all those motherfuckers. I don just feel like because it's my mindset, I'm on a different level than all those motherfuckers.

I don't want to go to that. Do you find you run into that sometimes? I realize I don't like really going to those events. I'd rather go for a dinner with somebody and hang out and have banter that way. When I go to a party, I'm like, there's too many people. What do you do?

Who are you? I'm talking a little bit more about selling someone on Cameo so if you're like oh brad pitt's on you know brad pitt's on the platform too you should be on there too yeah no well you have to probably be careful with the celebrity mindset they might not want to be lumped in with yeah that does happen people you know well i you know i don't want my picture next to this person's picture i don't want this thing that it happens all the time again it's like it's like that branding issue that brainwash of like no your brand your brand your brand and it's like i do i find talent so interesting i mean it's like do you have a manager an agent no publicist a lawyer

nope they're already gonna take 25 of you know you're right right and i i just don't i mean right i yeah i um tricky tricky man nothing's easy but the thing is you learn so much in the journey of doing this which is amazing like you get such an accelerated course and understanding the complexity of so many individuals like it's so made like comedians like they're those are like i find them really impressive geniuses i find them so impressive yeah but then when i speak to them that all of they've all come from such abusive backgrounds and they're not really happy people because they but they try to make people laugh because they want people they want to make light of stuff and it's just like

i'm around chris gethard on. Yeah, like his comedy is dark. But that's exactly what I was thinking about because it's all about like depression and the medication he's been taking. But he's a funny guy, but he comes from a dark past. Yeah, but it's again like those people are very difficult getting them and getting those guys on, communism because of they're always thinking

about the negative parts of doing some of this. I think the reality is just hearing people's out on their concerns and then just basically I'm a big believer of this. If someone's got a concern on camera like, oh, you know, I remember I had lunch with Billy Boyd. He's

pepping from Lord of the Rings. So we had Elijah Wood on, we got Sean Astin on, we got Dom on, so we got the three hobbits. This is the final hobbit, right? This is the final hobbit to get on. I'm so excited, right? I've been...

He's a huge Harry Potter fan. I am. I'm a big... I'm a huge... I love all that stuff. I love fantasy. I love escaping the real world. And so I'm meeting this guy

for lunch. I'm meeting Billy for lunch. It was like a Wednesday. On the Tuesday in England, it went, it went viral. A woman,

I think it was maybe Carol Baskin, shouted out somebody inappropriate, you know, said the, you know, and it was everywhere,

but people thought it was hilarious. They're like, oh my God, that's so funny and then I see Billy the next day for lunch I said Billy how are you doing what questions have you got for me

he says Martin I know I was going to come to your cameo but I've changed my mind because I saw this Carol Baskin video go viral and I don't want that to be me and I said it won't be you he said what do you mean don't say the last name and that was it

and so I always think if someone's got a concern about something dismiss it quickly because then it's like oh I'm worried about don't say the last name oh okay

it changes the energy flow when they're allowed to think about why they don't want to do it that can take a lot of the headspace up and then they're not going to do it so what I've learned from the process of selling is dismiss things quickly like oh i don't want to be doing them in bed well you won't be doing them in bed then it's pretty simple but

it's funny how people get caught up on how they've seen someone else's cameo they don't want to be like that was that carol baskin from tiger king yeah you'll find it it was like it went everywhere i'm curious, man. Like, I know you've learned probably the most from in-field work, talking to people,

your work as an agent, but are there any books or anything that you've read in the past that have been beneficial for sales, business, et cetera?

Because people would probably want to know if there's anything that you think would be valuable there. I am the worst person to ask. I was going to say, like,

I don't think he's a good person. But I'm not sure. No, I didn say, I don't think he's a good person. But I'm not sure. No, I didn't read it. I think what I've done, this is probably the only thing I've done, is I've pieced things together from things. You see something, that makes sense. And you just kind of hear things. With sales volume, okay, that makes sense.

You just start applying it to you. There was no book i read unfortunately uh i wish there was i'm sure uh you know i know i had a lot of books chucked at me early on read this read this but i was always like that's an hour and a half to read no fuck that i would spend an hour and a half messaging people i'm gonna spend an hour and a half trying to get in front of people uh maybe you gotta write one huh maybe you have to write one maybe you have to write one i'd read the shit out of that but again i think it's um i think you have to write one. Huh? Maybe you have to write one. Maybe you have to write one. I'd read the shit out of that. But again, I think it's, I think you have to be, an individual has to be quick to find the solution to their problem, right?

What they're trying to accomplish. And it's funny, recently I've, I've, I've, I've started, like I said, I make a point, I started thousands of people, but there's not many people I can call and talk the shit with. You know, like when you're a kid, you can go, hey, you, you know, I don't really have a lot of that. And I felt, you know,

I said to my, I felt, I felt, to my wife, I'm a little lonely. I know so many people, but I don't really have, you know,

I said that. It's a weird thing. You can't, it's hard to celebrate because if you do, it feels like bragging. Like, hey, I signed this guy,

this guy, and this guy. We made this amount of money this month. I'm taking my kids over here. It's like, someone on the other line is like, this guy's an asshole. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, I'm not trying to be an asshole.

I'm just trying to celebrate some victories I had this week. Yeah, but my point was what I was trying to say about the solution. So I felt lonely. So I said to myself, you know what? You've got to make an effort to be friends with people. So I met this guy that I like

got him on Cameo so last year I met this guy Shavo from System of the Down right and he was not sure about whether he wanted to do it we went for sushi drank a load of sake

had a great I mean honestly had such fun like I think if you look at the intro video you can see I'm a little intoxicated and it's like I've grabbed his phone

he's live now like I recorded the one thing he used to do to be live is record an intro video and so like he was now he's like now he's live but we Like I recorded the, the one thing he used to do to be live is record an intro video. And so like he was, now he's like, now he's live. But we had a great time. And, you know, I kind of was like, I like that guy.

I want to hang out with him more. But you're doing business. So I wasn't trying to do, and then, you know, I went out for lunch with him a few weeks ago, had a great time when I again, and I said, you know what? I said to my wife, I said, I'm feeling lonely. I've got to make an effort.

Hey, shall we go out with the wives for dinner? But if you don't make the effort to improve your situation, you can't improve it. And it's simple. If someone's nice, make more of an effort. Being lonely, I think, is a choice. Yeah, but you can complicate it. You can be like, oh, I'm lonely. Or you make an effort.

And you just text someone. It's simple. And other people, I think, maybe don't realize that you can be married and you can be very lonely you can be successful married and lonely you can have kids be married be successful it doesn't really matter if you don't have people that you can really just talk very openly about you know too and not always just talk business and you know be able to talk about more intimate things and And it can be really challenging. Yeah. So, I mean, that's the thing I've learned from everything is just like there's a simple answer.

And the other thing I think why I've been able to learn is I've heard people's stories. Like of them, their stories of their journey. Like, for example, John Lovitz, the comedian. You know, for 13 years he didn't make it. He wanted to quit acting. And, you know, you hear these stories. And he told me, like, you know, he woke up one day, punched a pill. I don't want to quit because he wanted to quit.

I don't want to quit. And he goes, listen to a pastor. I always find I'm saying pastor, pastor on the radio. And he goes, are you willing to do what you've got to do to get what you want? And the guy, but John says it in an accent, and he just said, I'm not working hard enough. So he started working harder. He started creating characters. So he created like the liar character and another character, acting, you know, he has. And then he was on Johnny Carson. And then next thing you know, he's got invited back again. Next thing you know, he's on SNL.

But it's like that shift of like, can I be doing more? And that was, you know, so you hear these stories from everybody I've spoken to. And it's just like, you can pick things from that. But that's just having a conversation

with somebody that's been, well, I'm lucky in my case, most people I was speaking to had success at some point in their career. Yeah, early on uh because i know you had mentioned you're sending out like 200 texts before like eight o'clock and you're just we can tell that you're just a hustler you're running all over the place but what were some of the tactics that you might have used i mean you probably didn't have tactics right you just did what the

hell you were doing but to get in front of some of these people like i mean like i could even i could send everybody can send ds to everybody these days. But the problem is everybody can send DMs to everybody these days. So how are you getting people's attention back then? And I guess even now. So again, it was like, when I was doing it, I was like, how do I stand?

I wasn't verified. And we've had this from a lot of the salespeople like, oh, well, you're the co-founder of KM. I said, it doesn't mean shit. I was a co-founder of a company that no one knew wicked wow and i wasn't verified right so i realized that and i think this is probably the best advice because i get hit up all the time on my thing and people trying to sell me stuff and if i think a lot of these people on these accounts they don't have a good social profile so you look at this message request you click and you go

the heck is this i'm looking at it's, you don't know who you're talking to. It looks bogus. So I think it was important to have a good social profile, like the pictures you're posting. You know, you've got to have a good, where if someone's going, oh, I kind of, you can see who you're hanging out with, what business you're doing.

It kind of is like a highlight reel than more necessary who you are as an individual. So that when someone looks at your page, they go, okay, cool. Then I looked at things, okay, how do I make my name stand out? Then I put in block capital letters. I was like, okay, great.

That stands out when, you know, pops a bit more. So I was trying to find ways, how do I pop more in the DMs? Then I'd be like, my picture now is a picture of me and my kids. But back in the day, it was a picture of my face and then a color. So it popped, it was blue, color being face and then a color yeah so it popped it was blue color of

being verified so i did all these little things um and that was it and then you know what i would do if i sent out well i was doing a quality i sent out a load of messages i would put a story up or something about cameo or something that i don't know something that i would feel like would give you some type of more like oh this is actually a real person messaging me. But then what I want to do, I was looking at my, who looked at the story? Oh, this person looked at it. And then I'd be like, so there was a lot of things I was doing there. You know, I always used to say to people, follow me on Instagram.

Hey, I'm better on Instagram. Follow me on Instagram. Now I actually am better on Instagram than I am on anything else. And the reason why I did that is so when I messaged some celebrity, it would be, oh, followed by I have a mutual friend. So then that popped up. So there was like all these little things that you do that don't seem like a big deal, but it has somewhat of an impact. But yeah. And then the other thing was because I was so, I always followed up. but yeah and then the other thing was

because I was so I always followed up I always followed up I didn't just send one I followed and followed and followed up followed up

so I think there was something like this guy really wants me this guy really wants me on camera keeps hitting me up about it so then there was

like an intrigue and I had no issues chucking my number down there because if they want to call me private that's fine and if somebody so that was it

I had a really cool message recently talking about the DMs right this really made my day so someone asked me to call me private that's fine and if somebody so that was i had a really cool message recently talking about the dms right this really made my day so someone asked me like at my company said can you please message um let me pull it up oh this is matt this is cool so i said can you please message max major for me i said sure no problem, no problem. So I messaged him. And he texts me this back. He says, hey, brother, I'll check it out. This made me so excited.

Because like that hustle, you know, like you want people to appreciate. He says, totally fucking random. But a few years ago, I sat behind you on a plane. And you spent the whole flight messaging huge celebs trying to onboard them. And then, I'm sorry, I can't speak. Celebs to onboard them and would celebrate the positive response of the dude in the row next to you. I love the hustle. Like, this guy saw me just on a plane. Like, if I was on a plane, I was just messaging the whole time, finding emails.

But the thing is, if you're on the plane, I could ramble about this. The thing about social media, you could then find who they're friends with, hit up those friends. They have an email, hit up that. There's IMDB Pro, hit up the agent, manager, publicist, lawyer. And you could quickly like blitz it. I'm curious about something. Do we have time still? Absolutely.

Okay. I want to know this because on the internet these days, there's a lot of – how long have you been with your wife? 20 years next year. 20 years. Damn. Wow. So how old are you? 35.

35. Well, yeah, so next year. I'll be 19 years in a bit, but the 20 sounds more impressive. So almost two decades. Almost two decades with your wife. You guys have two kids. On the internet these days, there's a lot of young men. There's a lot of like – I guess there's these communities of relationships like Red Pill, all this type of shit, right?

You've been with your wife for two years. You are a CEO of a company that's doing extremely well. How do you navigate that? Because you're someone who probably a lot of – you probably get a lot of women that are coming your way even though they know you're married, right? How do you deal with that being where you are currently so women coming after me yeah well thank you he thinks i'm handsome well i'm not like not just that you like you are you know you're a good looking dude but at the same time you also are a wealthy individual and it's the accent let's be real appreciate it i'm gonna stay here and this is good for my company. Because within that realm of this whole Red Pill community,

they say that men like yourself who are so high value that you should just be able to, even if you're married, it's not ideal to stay married or be married. You should play out your options. What is your viewpoint on that, actually being someone within that tax bracket success level etc i just honestly i'm not interested in any of that i'll be honest i'm not like my wife's been through this shit with me she's been like you know those down moments and

i have such an appreciation for my wife but also i've only been with my wife oh i've been with my wife 16 okay so you gotta realize that sex is a big deal for me i've only been my wife so that is a mental does that make sense i got you yeah that makes sense so um i i think that's basically been it and then also like can't really get away with anything what am i doing you know it's like i mean it doesn't make sense. And then also, I don't know if you know this, but divorce is expensive. Extremely in your case. So that in itself is like- Especially all the people that invested in the company

would be like, fuck. Divorce is expensive. No, I just, it's, yeah, I just, I don't thank good touch wood. I just don't have that. When I was a kid, I did have a lot of girls. Before I met my wife, I had a lot of girls,

you know, ringing my doorbell and like chasing me around town and, you know, all these things. I never liked someone chasing after me. It just was the most turn off.

So the second you go, hi, I'm interested, all the eyes do this. I'm like, oh. It's like, no,

I'm serious. But like, that's my journey. So my journey is a little different. If you were a guy that wasn't didn't have that and a girl does that

you might really love that for me I didn't I never had that my wife my wife I sound like Borat she goes she went to me

I would message her I'd text her like hey you want to go like she wouldn't message me for eight hours it took me a few years before I knew she knew

like liked me damn so she played hard message me for eight hours. It took me a few years before I knew she liked me. Damn. So she played hard with me. Like, she knew, like, she really, like. Yeah. And so, yeah, and obviously as a younger man, yeah, in my early, like, yeah, probably 1920, yeah, I was like, man, I wouldn't mind being a single guy. And I remember going to my wife and say, I'd like to be a single guy.

I want to just be young and, know and just have some fun and and uh she just burst into tears she'll be pissed off me she hears this i'm not i'm not playing away this one and so she burst into tears and cried and the thing is if you're in my circle i don't want to do that to you i don't want to do that to you like i'm being selfish. All right, cool. So that was what it is. But again, my journey's been a little different. So I think, again, I was never in search of that. That's interesting.

You had a conversation with her like that? Yeah. I'm a very honest person. Yeah. I just think I can't be bothered to edit myself. And she was like, no, that ain't going to work. No, she started crying. Yeah.

She was heartbroken. And I'm like, if someone's never done anything bad to you, and you break their heart. Right, right. Sorry, like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Yeah. So, but, you know, again. Fucking tough thing to bring up because they might be like, well, kick your ass out the door. Yeah, so that's that.

But there's more to it. I think finding a good life partner is everything, right? But if it's not your path, that's not what you're interested in, you want to be a bachelor, cool, have fun. Does she help make sense of stuff for you? Like you're chasing after these people to try to get them on cameo. You're always talking about this. You're talking about that. And she's probably just, boom,

she probably hits you with something and you're like, fuck, she's right. God damn it. She's always right. She knows what I'm thinking before I'm thinking it. She's, um,

unfortunately she's been my therapist for so many years. The things that you can't say to somebody, like you feel like, like the dumbest little, you go like for that support system. Yeah, but she knows exactly what I'm thinking. She's been supportive. The thing is, there's also been a confidence

that, hey Martin, you're going to do it. You're going to get the job done. She's never had that kind of doubt in me. So I guess that confidence, that quiet confidence she had about me kind of helped me. And the other thing that's really important to me is I've got two brothers and a sister. My Lucinda is the only person who knew my dad.

That's so important to me. That is, she can tell stories to our kids about my father. That is so gold. That's huge. What about these NFTs and all this weirdness going on? Is that going to somehow connect to cameo type stuff or they're not related?

No, we just did an NFT drop with the Island Boys. It happened last week. I actually haven't followed up with it and seen how it's done, so I don't have any exciting information to give you. But yeah, I mean, look, in the world of celebrity

and things with these NFTs, but again, it's like there's so much still to learn about these NFTs. It's not just about like, you know, you just drop something and you're a big celebrity.

It looks like a money grab and no one's interested and it flops. So I think there's a lot to learn there. I personally don't get it. I get there's a social flex to it. I don't get it still.

You know, it's like, hey, you want to show you just spent 100 grand? Wicked. There's a board ape. I don't get it.

I don't get it. I don't get it either. But I don't have to get it. You know, it doesn't matter. Yeah. Is there anything like a part of your day-to-day or part of, I don't get it. I don't get it either. But I don't have to get it. You know, it doesn't matter. Yeah. Is there anything like a part of your day-to-day or part of, I don't know, being a CEO at Cameo

that you actually don't like doing? Like, is there anything that you have to like, fuck, here we go again? And how do you get through it? So the other thing is, right, so my thing is I am not, everyone thinks I'm the CEO because obviously I started the business.

Stephen is the CEO. So that's fine. We started the business togetherven is the ceo so that's fine we start the business together so there's a everyone i get this probably like 10 times a day i'm like oh geez um but no uh my is you can repeat the question i just want to correct oh yeah no just asking like is there any part of your your day-to-day stuff that you like because it seems like you enjoy everything you do uh is there anything that you have to do that you don't like as far as i don't know your daily tasks we're like fuck we got to take care of this fucking report or some shit

the thing that frustrates me is there's a lot like sales guys at the company and you know i spend a lot of time like really trying to motivate them and get them excited about like what they're doing and really get them pumped up and the thing I learned that really is crushing, no matter how good you are, you can't level somebody up if they don't want to be leveled up. And you're sometimes talking to, I remember last week I was like, guys, this is Thanksgiving week.

And I've stopped doing the DMs and that stuff like that. But I said, you know what? I'm telling you guys to do volume, volume, volume. Fuck it, I'm going to do it with you. I'm going to send a thousand messages out on Wednesday. I'm going to send 1,000 messages out on Wednesday. I'm going to send out 1,000 messages on Friday. And the guys just went with it. And it was like, what the heck?

And again, it's like I try to tell these guys all the time, but if you want a career in entertainment, Cameo is the best job you could have because you can connect with any celebrity. So you can build this amazing Rolodex. Shit, if you want to get in the startup life and you know all the celebrities like look at jimmy ivy and what he did with beats by dre he went to all the celebrities put them on all the celebrities heads i don't think beats was better than bows but he sold for three billion right because he's had the ability to put on every celebrity's head and i'm like i try to explain

these to some individuals and they just don't get it. Now, I can't relate to that. And that's frustrating because you're trying to like, hey, use me. Come on. That's really drained me. That has drained me a lot because it's like, it's frustrating because it's like you're not taking advantage of this life. There's someone in hospital right now, someone who is begging for your opportunity. And you're just going through the motions like the girl from Yellowstone. Yeah, just don't talk to people that don't sweat,

the people that aren't willing to put the work in. I don't want to say they're a waste of time, but they're a waste of time in terms of trying to get more out of them business-wise. They're just not going to do it. They're not going to turn the corner. You've got to hire the right people. And that's hard to do. It's really hard to do. And again, I think

a lot of it goes down to confidence. People have lack of confidence in themselves and there's all these things. They don't know what they want and it's just very frustrating because I feel like that's why you have to see so many problems in the world with anxiety and all these other things because anxiety is looking at the past and the future

not living in the present. Like, oh, but if you love what you do and you have this, you probably never struggled with anxiety and depression, I don't think. Never. Because you've had a clear. Yeah. Want. I'm always doing shit.

Yeah. That's the thing that drains me. Andrew, that's the thing that drains me. So do you know Stan Efferding? Yeah. Yeah. The rhino. Yeah.

Rhino. Yeah, rhino. So that's our rhino, but you know a different rhino, or knew a different rhino, right? That's right. Mark Rhino Smith. What's his name? Mark Rhino Smith.

Mark Rhino Smith. What's going on here? Does anybody know how to Google Mark Rhino Smith? I mean, it auto-populates. He was a gladiator. He was a gladiator. Wow, but these aren't the pictures that we're talking about, though.

There he is. All right. Wait, that's him? That's not him. It says Mark Reiner Smith. That was my boy, yeah. Is this the same guy or no? I don't know.

No. That's not the same guy. That wasn't the guy that's sitting down, no. What's that meme? If you know, you know. I don't know what it's called. So did you say that he knew that guy? You know the guy?

I thought that he did know that guy. Okay, the guy with the giant. Oh, no, I don't know what it's called so did you say that he knew that guy you know the guy I thought that he did know that guy okay the guy with the giant oh the that no I didn't know that guy oh we try to no we try to get him we try to

once we saw this thing go we wanted him on cameo we're looking for this guy everywhere unfortunately he's passed away he passed on he'd probably make a million bucks if he was around

poor guy damn yeah oh okay so would people I'm just thinking would people request is gonna be proud about that one yeah i'll take that yeah so then if that guy the the meme guy that we're talking about would be on cameo i'm sure people would want to pay to actually get somebody to

i mean the the whole trick right is like you you uh send somebody a link and it's like oh here's this dude in his giant cock so i wonder if cameo would have been able to do something like that with that i'm just uh setting up the question does cameo do anything like with nudity or anything like that no no okay no nudity but he would have done well because that it's one of the he's one of those guys it's so bad it's good it's like oh my god that guy and it's like so he would have done well because he's one of those guys that's so bad, it's good. It's like, oh my God, that guy. So he would have been huge. He would have made a fortune.

He would have made a fortune. Who's some people that you haven't got that you're still working on? There's loads of people. Hulk Hogan. Hulk Hogan. I've had a journey with wrestlers. So when we start the business. Have you met him? Have you met Hulk Hogan? Yeah. I've met Hulk. I've had a journey with wrestlers. So when we start the business... Have you met him?

Have you met Hulk Hogan? Yeah. I've met Hulk. I've got my little stories. So when we start the business, there was another company called SlebVM. And they had a lot of old wrestlers. Just a lot of those old school wrestlers

that we grew up watching from the WWF, not WWE eras. And I remember in 2018, basically getting laughed at in the Wrestle, going to WrestleCon, trying to talk to all these guys and show them cameo.

But through the years, I've been able to go sign up pretty much all the wrestlers. And, you know, everyone's, you know, some have been easy

and some are hard. It is just what the process is. And this year, I got to meet Hulk Hogan. And I was like, oh my God, Hulk Hogan, like, yeah, oh, my God. Hulk Hogan. Like, yeah, I was so pumped.

I go back to being four years old, and you could wear your own clothes to school day, and I had a Hulk Hogan T-shirt. I was like, oh, yeah, I'm going to be the coolest kid in class. You know, I'm like, brother. And I was so pumped up. And my grandma bought me like a polo top. It wasn't even a polo top.

It had a camel on it. It was like, it was a camel. it it was like it was it's a camel I'm like what that's great and my mum made me wear that and I was so devastated by that you know when he lost to

like Ultimate Warrior oh my god heartbroken oh yeah WrestleMania heartbroken right so I see him I go to his

in Tampa he's got his place Hogan's Beach Shop I go in I'm so pumped up oh yeah I meet him I'm actually I'm so excited you oh yeah I meet him I'm actually

I'm so excited you know and he gave me a wrestling name Movie Star Martin I was like oh my god that's the best name oh nice I was like that is the best name Eminem

I was like oh dude I love you you know it was like this so I talked to him about it he said okay cool I'll do it he says come back tomorrow we'll do the intro video to be live

you have to record an intro video and again Hulk Hogan what he did for wrestling his personality that he gets he gets in front of this camera it's completely different like him it is unbelievable and he gets out there it's the best intro video i've ever seen that never went never went and like that evening I got a phone call from his lawyer. Yeah, we want, you know, it just changed.

The lawyer got involved. When you get representation, get involved, things get different. You're worth more than that. Yeah, and so, but Hulk was great. He was really nice. And that, honestly, on Sunday, it was kind of weird. Again, I go back to my weird moments. On a Sunday, it was a Super Bowl

I didn't go to the game I went to Hogan's restaurant and I watched the football with Ric Flair and Hulk Hogan so it was a very interesting I never thought in my life I'd be watching a Super Bowl

with Hulk Hogan and Ric Flair and be like woo brother woo brother I didn't know what to do I'm like what you know but it was a really cool experience

and like that I would love to get Hulk Hogan he was one of my childhood heroes yeah and there's a there's a few of those type people but again people have whatever reason in their heads and you got to respect that how do you handle nose nose i cry uh nose is more frustrating because it doesn't make sense to me like because there's everybody can use this. And what I mean by that is like, if I went to anybody on the street, I said, for certain talent, this definitely applies.

Three minutes a day, seven days a week, you make 100 grand a year. Damn. Why would you say no? So to do 100 grand a year, it's $300 a day. So three minutes a day, because you might read about Crest, and you know, like a lot of people can do that,

and yet they've got some block. And it's frustrating, but then it's like, okay, you don't need the money. Cool, I get it. But then look at this and this and this. Okay, you don't care about the fans. Okay, cool.

Do you want to do it for charity? Or, to me, everyone can use this. There's no reason not to. But then, you know, again, people see it as dumb. They see the bad stuff. They don't see the good stuff. A lot of people put so much weight into all the bad things,

just saying, screw it. Do you know what the unbelievable thing is, right? I tell you the line that's worked for sales, and we've seen it everywhere. Give it a try. I said, give it a try. If you don't like it delete it i mean that line honestly is the reason why i signed up most people i said just give it a try if you don't like it delete after a week the company is worth like a billion dollars at this point yeah and it's like people don't sound like that's because the fans

want this so it's like you understand that and there's a great line that Elvis had take care of your fans and they'll sure as heck take care of you and so like and the other thing is you're not even charging the fan like over 90% is a gift

so like you know Mark you're going to buy a cameo from me for your brother that's just what it is but then

Chris gets the best gift from well he wouldn't he would hate my cameo but still he'd get the best gift from me, right? And be like, oh my God, that's amazing, that's amazing.

You got, and then you'll become a fan of me because you just bought the best gift for your friend. So now what you're doing is creating super fans who, guess what, are buying your book, buying your merch, because they have a connection to you. You know, you look at social media when you comment on someone's comment

or you like their profile pic or you like one of their pictures or you respond to a DM. you just created a super fan. And we're that on steroids. And if you think about all the time that we do spend on social media, for most people, or for a lot of people, they're not making any money off of social media. So you're just putting time into something slightly different that has at least some potential to make money. You're just putting time into something slightly different that has at least some potential to make money. What is like a mid-range amount of money that somebody, you know, there's all these like ads that say, you know, make five grand from sitting at home. Or like, you know, there's all these bots on the internet that sell you on these things.

But like, is it like someone that has maybe 100,000 followers or a modest amount of followers, but maybe not big time celebrity, maybe they're not an actor, maybe not on TV all the time? You do get some interesting ones. You get some influence out there that haven't got a huge following, but the people that they have

and the things that they do, they're a personality. It just works and they just take off and they price themselves low. Some people don't have that. Some people, it's like, you know what? I just like to look at your stuff. I have no interest in getting a cameo.

That does happen. Again, with cameo, it really, again, it's like anything in life. It comes down to the individual, how much they want to hustle it. And it's like the three Ps, I say. Price. You can price yourself out of it. Literally, 50 bucks, you can price yourself out of it. 20 say price you can price yourself out of it literally 50 bucks you could price yourself out of it 20 bucks you could price yourself out of it so if you've got

an ego like i want to be the same price as this person well that's can be done and again why do you care about what other people are charging focus on yourself but everyone in the entertainment space tend to focus on other people. And then promotion. Hey, you're on Mark Bell's podcast. Hey, shout out your cameo page. Or you're in the radio, your newspaper. Hustle it, you know,

tweet it out there. Instagram stories. And then the final thing is doing good video. Our best talent isn't our most famous talent. It's the guys that put the most effort in it. They create the wow for the fan. So like if you're a hall of famer do it by your bust if you've got a super bowl ring boom

put it out there if you've got um your movie posters or use the catchphrase from your your thing like i'm using tom wilson again butthead or wayne knight you know from seinfeld he goes like Or Wayne Knight from Seinfeld. He goes, hello, Jerry. He'll go, hello, Mark. And so he's given that. He's taken the show, or the people from Harry Potter, see you at Hogwarts. They're taking and bringing that movie or TV show live to the fan, which I think is awesome. But again, if you don't do those things, it ain't going to work.

For some people, it might sound a little silly, but if you think about it, many entertainers go around the world and do this anyway. People that are musicians, musicians go and they play the same music all the time. You know, I'm going to Metallica like next weekend and, you know, they're going to play like some of their most famous songs

and they've been doing, they're celebrating their 40th year. They're going to do some of their most famous songs, and they're celebrating their 40th year. They're going to do some of their most famous songs there. And then when it comes to comedians or it comes to public speakers, if you see a great public speaker, like a really high-level public speaker, they go around the world, or at least around the country, and they say the same shit over and over again. They even have their catchphrases a little bit like a professional wrestler. I mean, how long did The Rock have all those sayings?

You prepare for those, and you get the whole entire audience keeps saying what because of Kurt Angle or Stone Cold or whatever it might be. Jabroni. There's people that are kind of already doing some of those things, and if you can figure out a slightly different way to monetize it, it ends up working out well for a lot of different people. No, everybody loves it, and that's the thing.

Again, it's the complexity of an individual's mind. That's the thing that's really… What does Baba Booey make, the guy that's on Stern? He crushes it, doesn't he? Yeah, he does. They talk about it on Stern all the time. Yeah, they do. I don't actually know,

but I believe, I think even Stern said he bought a truck. Yeah. No, they make a lot of money, but oh my God, Howard Stern. He says something. It was like, people went to me.

Oh, high pitch Eric? No. But it's crazy. It's like, people go like, oh, I don't want to be on Howard Stern like making fun of me right and i went to you know the crazy thing is you actually want howard stern to say your name

because your bookings go through the roof yeah he makes fun of it a cameo all the time he like talks about it he thinks it's dumb and stuff and but the thing is what the people don't realize if he says your name yeah it doesn't matter jackpot so like in my thing it's like so again but think about it it's ego yeah so something that no one's going to remember

in England we used to call it fish and chip newspaper right it'd be forgotten like you know it's forgotten about yeah and you could probably make

I don't know six figures from that because he shouted your name out but oh shit oh shit for 15 seconds

it's crazy. And again, but then again, it's different, right? Your dad's, my dad went bankrupt. So I have an appreciation for money as a security thing. And I don't think, don't disrespect money. Listen, you're always going to get laughed at by someone. Someone's always going to criticize you. Like the thing is, I was looking at him,

I always get, going back earlier, going like, I'm so worried about people thinking about me. I'm like, you watch like, you know, Tom Brady getting criticized think about me. I'm like, you watch Tom Brady getting criticized. He's too old, this and that. And all these people. And he's one of the greatest people of all time. I'm watching Man United, and they're talking about how old Ronaldo is.

And he's scoring every game. And it's like, you can't help it. And I think that's where you've got to have a good self-confidence, have a good core. Listen, that's something to train for. It's not going to come. What do you want for your girls? What do I want for my girls?

What do you want them to take from their dad? I want them to do the things that they're passionate about. I think that's really important to me. It's not always about the money. It's about doing what you're passionate about.

Sabrina wants to do fashion. She wants to be a fashion designer. Great, go for it. It doesn't matter if it's... Is that the one passionate about like Sabrina wants to do fashion she wants to be a fashion designer great go for it like it doesn't matter if it's is that the one that wears the same clothes every day? oh she wears one ass every day she's going to have to work on that I know but it's like

I love that Jim Carrey line and I'm probably going to butcher it but it was like Jim Carrey said my father gave me the greatest lesson in life my father failed at something he hated so I rather fail at something I love. And I'd rather my kids have that.

I just want them to have a real clear determination of what they want. It doesn't have to be what everybody else wants. I just want them to find what makes their heart pound in the morning and go, I'm going to go get that. That's it. And then hopefully they'll marry well, because I've got two little girls,

so there's going to be a lot of interrogating process. The guy's like. What's your agenda with my daughter today? Does your wife yell at you about your phone? You being on your phone?

No, she's good with that. She's actually very good with that. She hasn't thrown it in the garbage yet. My wife has the patience of a saint.

Honestly, no joke. She really does. I've never met her. No, yeah. I'd love to meet her sometime. Yeah, it's a shame that.

She's got the patience of a saint. It's kind of a crazy thing. Hey, Lou, to london next week okay imagine if like my wife came i'm gonna go to london where you going woman what am i gonna do with the kids who's feeding me where do they go to school uh my kids no you know like your wife leaves and you're like trying to figure out what to do i was just thinking about i'm not gonna say where that school they go so that might be a security breach my wife security breach i don't know i don't i love it that's funny so do celebrities come to cameo or do you have to attract all of them like how does that work like i guess yeah

can anybody just sign up so there is an enrollments so people can like hey go go to the website and ask to like say that their talent like i've got this many followers and then there's a code that talent need to join so there's that but a lot of it is obviously us reaching out we do get enrollments through a lot that enrollments was is mainly tiktok we occasionally get like a big one that will pop through like a few years ago christmas eve sean astin came through that channel which was awesome because sean asked if people don't know that's rudy uh that's i think i think it's sam from the goonies or mike from the goonies stranger things he's samwise gamgee from the hobbit that's what probably getting confused

and uh that was a fun that was a really it came on christmas eve that was awesome i was dressed up as santa claus because I was trying to surprise the kids. For me, I was always about if I could sign one up, maybe I can relax a couple of hours. I never had that, but it's going to take off the... I suppose I hit him on Christmas Eve, and I got him set up. I really was able to enjoy Christmas Day because of that. He's such a great guy. He's one of the greatest, really cares about his fans and everything like that.

Awesome. What are you doing for exercise these days? Because you're looking pretty jacked. Come here, give me a hug. I love you. I love you. No, I just, I think like most people, well, not most people, during COVID. TRT, okay, go ahead.

Carry on. I built a gym in my garage. There you go. And so what I do is. Look at the shoulders. They're popping. Right? It's not just me. I really wanted to take a sweatshirt off.

Easy now. Easy. Don't go there. I've had my disc placed on my back. I feel like. And my. So what I do is. You know, I know I do like a little circuit.

I'll do like bench press, deadlift, and abs. And I'll do that know I know I do like a little circuit I'll do like bench press deadlift and abs and I'll do that and then I do that 10 times that's 30 sets tends to be 45 minutes to an hour

that is a full body workout like that's a lot of work so then I'm done you're making it sound like it's nothing no and then if I'm tired

I've got a treadmill I jog 5 miles which is kind of a little bad if I'm tired no that's a fucking runner right there but what i mean but what i find about cardio long distance five miles that was a sprint to it so that's look but um my five miles how many times a week i don't know i

was probably no the last week i probably did it five days five times but 25 miles a week but cardio this dude's a fucking savage and he's just talking hella plainly about it the thing about cardio

is you can like with weightlifting it's you've really got to think you've got to like the stress and like pick yourself up with running

you put a speed going on a bike is actually pretty easy actually you don't need any hype for that you just like go but like when you're lifting it's like you kind of need to be inspired it's like a little bit more of a thing especially where you guys live fuck i don't move in close to that you know but it's so

funny because in my garage it's so great i put my music on i start screaming in the gym i'm the strongest man in my gym by the way do your uh girls come in and try to lift some stuff yes they do it's so cute they mess around a little bit yeah but it's good but I think it's good to see you living a healthy lifestyle I think it's really important it's not always

look for me what was important for me which is different to you guys I just wanted to get to a point where I could take my top off at the pool and not feel like

I'm pulling my shorts up a little bit higher you know like doing the dad bod thing and that was it I just wanted to feel yep you know and the other thing that felt really cool was it i just wanted to feel yep you know

and the other thing i felt really cool i was picking i hadn't lived for a few years because of cameo and i pick up the kids i get heavy and now i pick them up like oh they can steal my babies for a little longer you know i mean so i any dad out there lift so you can pick up your babies yeah awesome take us on out of here andrew sure thing thank you everybody for checking out today's episode sincerely appreciateincerely appreciate it. Please like and comment down below and subscribe if you guys are not subscribed already. Please follow the podcast at Mark Bell's Power Project on Instagram at MB Power Project on TikTok and Twitter. My Instagram and Twitter is, wow, at I am Andrew Z.

And Simo, where are you at? And Simo Enning on Instagram and YouTube. And Simo Yin Yang on TikTok and Twitter, Mark. Oh, Martin. At Martin Blenko on Instagram. M-A-R-T-I-N Blenko, B-L-E-N-C-O-W-E. I'm at Mark Smelly Bell.

Strength is never weakness. Weakness is never strength. Catch you all later.