Mark Bell's Power Project - Recovery Is a Skill | Move Better, Heal Faster, Stay in the Game

Episode Date: August 10, 2026

In this episode, we discuss how to recover smarter, manage pain and stay athletic for the long haul. We break down sleep, training volume, cold plunges, sauna, stretching and myofascial release, while explaining why pain is not always coming from the area where you feel it.We also discuss how excessive training can hurt motivation and recovery, why athletes need to create and release tension, and how better body awareness can help you move, perform and feel better.#PowerProject #Recovery #Mobility #MyofascialRelease #AthleticPerformanceSpecial perks for our listeners below!🥩 HIGH QUALITY PROTEIN! 🍖 ➢ https://goodlifeproteins.com/ Code POWER to save 20% off site wide, or code POWERPROJECT to save an additional 5% off your Build a Box Subscription!🩸 Get your BLOODWORK/TRT/PEPTIDES! 🩸 ➢ https://marekhealth.com and use code "POWERPROJECT" for 10% off Self-Service Labs and Guided Optimization®.🧠 Methylene Blue: Better Focus, Sleep and Mood 🧠 Use Code POWER10 for 10% off!➢https://troscriptions.com?utm_source=affiliate&ut-m_medium=podcast&ut-m_campaign=MarkBel-I_podcastBest 5 Finger Barefoot Shoes! 👟 ➢ https://Peluva.com/PowerProject Code POWERPROJECT15 to save 15% off Peluva Shoes!Self Explanatory 🍆 ➢ Enlarging Pumps (This really works): https://bit.ly/powerproject1Pumps explained: https://youtu.be/qPG9JXjlhpM?si=JZN09-FakTjoJuaW🚨 The Best Red Light Therapy Devices and Blue Blocking Glasses On The Market! 😎➢https://emr-tek.com/Use code: POWERPROJECT to save 20% off your order!👟 BEST LOOKING AND FUNCTIONING BAREFOOT SHOES 🦶➢https://vivobarefoot.com/powerproject🥶 The Best Cold Plunge Money Can Buy 🥶 ➢ https://thecoldplunge.com/ Code POWERPROJECT to save $150!!➢ https://withinyoubrand.com/ Code POWERPROJECT to save 15% off supplements!➢ https://markbellslingshot.com/ Code POWERPROJECT to save 15% off all gear and apparel!Follow Mark Bell's Power Project Podcast➢ https://www.PowerProject.live➢ https://lnk.to/PowerProjectPodcast➢ Insta: https://www.instagram.com/markbellspowerproject➢ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/markbellspowerprojectFOLLOW Mark Bell➢ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/marksmellybell➢https://www.tiktok.com/@marksmellybell➢ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MarkBellSuperTraining➢ Twitter: https://twitter.com/marksmellybellFollow Nsima Inyang➢ Ropes and equipment : https://thestrongerhuman.store➢ Community & Courses: https://www.skool.com/thestrongerhuman➢ YouTube : https://www.youtube.com/c/NsimaInyang➢ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nsimainyang/?hl=e#PowerProject #Podcast #MarkBell #FitnessPodcast #markbellspowerproject

You need to be able to create tension when you need it, and you need to be able to not have tension when you don't need it. We have a tendency to just think the best athletes ever are like only smooth, but they're not only smooth. They're able to create a lot of force and a lot of tension. The doctor said there's a 99% chance that I'm going to have to cut your adductor tendon at some point. And he worked on the adductors, and then three days later, no more pain. Soft tissue work and being able to do this, especially self-mouthed fast release,

is really a skill. Sometimes something that's bothering you on the back side. your body comes from the front side of your body. Your pain could be upstream or downstream from wherever it is that you have the targeted pains. Invest in your awareness of your own body. It will give you an awareness and a tool that will allow you to heal yourself for the rest of your life. Body liver feels good. You know, the ropes actually are great for foot stuff. I don't know if you've ever like massaged your feet on the ropes. Those thick, thicker ropes are great for that. Kind of linked to all this stuff. I've been, you know, working on a little bit like striking.

I saw your video. And a lot of what I used to work on, I used to be like a little bit more square. That's how I kind of learned how the box was to be more square. And I'm trying to learn to like get a little bit more bladed, you know, to be turned a little bit more. Yeah.

And I, because of the breathing, because of the mechanics and because of trying to like just like relax and just like to let everything go, I kind of tweaked my neck. So now I can't, now I got to be like this.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, that battle. But a lot of it was the breathing. I just, I didn't like, uh, have a good exhale. It was kind of like, it was kind of like, I was holding on to too much tension. Yeah, yeah.

I remember like, and it still will happen from time to time. But when I was, when I was first starting to throw those strikes, I noticed like, I'm holding my breath while I'm doing this because I'm trying to throw hard, fast strikes. Like, I'm not relaxed. So you mentioned this. I saw a few comments. Like, I've had to just, you know, slow down, breathe and just try to be smooth. Like, I treat it like, I treat it like everything. Just try to be as smooth as possible, as efficient as I can be.

and the speed, it'll just get faster. It's so strange because a coach will show you, like just put your hand up. A coach will show you, they'll say, hey, throw a jab like this, and then you'll go. For some reason, right? Isn't that so weird?

Like, you're trying to, like, do good for the coach as if the coach is going to see some miraculous jab that he's never seen before. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But someone who's newer not going to, like, impress anybody anyway, so just, you know, but it's hard to, that whole thing, it's an art to, like, slow down

or to relax. You know, we mentioned this before. How are you going to relax in Jiu-Jitsu if the other guy is way better than you? Yeah. That's the guy is going to probably try to make you uncomfortable, right? Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Get you in some shitty positions.

Yeah. But I have a question before we get started on everything today. Why is soccer gay? And why is everybody paying attention to it right now? You know, it is funny. I've seen like a few sock. Ocho Cinco has a soccer-based podcast. There are a few others.

I think people like a lot of athletes, first off, are realizing people know how big podcasts are. Athletes have started getting into podcasts in the past few years. And then these athletes now realize soccer is the biggest sport in the world. And I should probably should be talking about it on a podcast, right? So I'm glad that like there's more respect that's put on soccer because that game, I mean, fucking, I think I saw a really cool video of somebody mentioned how American football is kind of like a literal. battle in a sense because like you have your you have your whatever your director who's calling out of play and then boom clashes right soccer is like just like constant military shifting and constant

strategic shifting of the whole you know everyone trying to adjust on the field so that's why they call it a beautiful game because there's to be able to penetrate with 11 players towards a single like towards that net the whole team has to be working together and they have to find the gaps within the defense. It's like it's fucking awesome. But people don't like the lack of goals. It's interesting with a sport like baseball where like if you don't understand baseball at all, you don't really realize how much strategy is going on. And you would think like no one's even moving in baseball. So how is their strategy? But there's a lot of stuff going on that you don't know. And then with this game, I know nothing about soccer. So me watching some of it and like my family looking to me

as if I'd have the answers because I usually am pretty good with like hockey and basketball and football. Like I know at least the basics of almost every sport, but not this one. Soccer's pretty foreign to me. Yeah. What are they doing at the end when they do like a penalty kick and it confuses the hell out of me? They have a bunch of guys lined up and then the guys are like covering their dicks and stuff. Like what's going on with that? Oh, okay. So free kicks.

So like that's not towards the end. That's a free kick will happen anytime there's a foul outside of the box. And it was, if it wasn't in the box, it won't be a penalty kick. A penalty kick is like when it's one player and the goalie. That's if somebody gets fouled in that box, they'll have a penalty kick. A free kick is if a foul happens outside that box within the half of the other team and if it's close enough to the goal you'll see like five guys from the team that the free kick is being kicked against. They'll make a wall so that the guy doesn't have a straight shot onto the goal. And you got to try to curve the ball or

got either try to curve the ball or actually Ryan can you look up just look at messy recent goal, Messi had this beautiful goal. I forgot the team he was against, but you'll see, just look up. We're going to talk about Mile Fast release and a bunch of cool stuff, but I just wanted to ask some soccer questions. I like watching it, actually. I've been having fun watching. Oh, this was so beautiful.

Oh, my God. Boom, just weaved it right through. You'll see the replay. Like a cannon. Yeah. But he, okay, so the crazy thing about whenever you hear professional soccer players talk about Messi when he trains, because a lot of these players, they'll have like, they'll they'll just like do shots on goal multiple shots on goal try to hit each corner etc

you'll see some some of the a lot of the pros they'll hit like five and six and that's really good messy doesn't miss and sometimes if he has a bad day people be like oh you hit nine you hit nine of those goals are you sick oh do you see that how he just weaved that right through oh fucking beautiful and so those guys standing there are not really allowed to move much they're not Once the ball is kicked, they're allowed to move. And they're not allowed to like, you know, use their hands. Exactly. Never allowed to use your hands.

Obviously. There is actually a, Tieri Anoree, he's a sportscaster now who's on Fox with Zlatani Bohemovich. And Tiri, there is a goal that was, not a goal. There was a rule that was made specifically because of Annery's World Cup. I think they call up the hand of God. he because they didn't have um video uh officiating right i love this kind of stuff they didn't see that like before henri scored he boom he tapped the ball with his hand oh he did that twice

remember jordan remember jordan pushing uh the guy from the Utah jazz i don't on the hip i don't when jordan did that like crossover dribble he he he you know like there is a little bit of like you're allowed to like do a little bit of stuff but he shoves the guy on the hip hard I'll surprise because back then you're lots of like back then basketball is way more physical way more physical. Is this this isn't the hand moment is it? Oh yeah. Okay. Okay. Okay. Yeah. After this happened twice. Like that's when video officiating became part of the game. Oh, this is Maradonna though. This is Maradona. It happened twice in the same game. Yeah. So Maradona there's a there's a hand of God moment where like that that goal was just crazy. But Tieri Just type in Tyrion Rie handball moment or World Cup handball moment. I love that we put so much emphasis on sport that like it has this like godly, you know, name this particular game or particular play.

Yeah. What's the player? Oh, just type in H-E-N-R-Y, hand, and you can erase everything else. Yeah, yeah, there you go. Okay. Henry, hand. Yeah, maybe hand on re hand. So the goalie is allowed to use his hand.

and to you can throw the ball in. What do you mean? You can throw the ball in bounds of your hands or no? Yes, yes. When you have a throw one on the sideline. Yeah, okay, this is it. This is it. Boom.

And he passed it to him. Oh, shit. So he tapped it before it went out. Yeah. And the officiator didn't see it. Oh. And this is what knocked Ireland out of the World Cup. I think he did it twice in this game, too, unless I'm mistaken.

Oh, my God. But people were so. So pissed. Refes are paid off. Yeah, people were so pissed. And that changed the rules of football. What Henri did changed the rules of football ever since then. They brought in video officiating.

They brought like just like they do in the NBA. I've been digging. I watched the game the other day. I forget what the teams were, but they did have some free kicks at the end. It was really interesting because like one guy tried to get like tricky with his kick and he like tricked himself out. He faked himself out. And then a bunch of other guys just kind of went real straightforward with their kicks and they were able to score.

Like it looked. guarding a net like that, it looks like it's impossible. It looks like you have to kind of just guess. Oh, absolutely, especially on the penalty kicks. You have to guess. Yeah, that's what it kind of looked like a penalty kick. It was just a goalie versus the player. And they weren't very far apart.

Yeah, yeah. But it's actually been really cool, like the new, I guess a lot of the new guard of like modern soccer. Like there's this a striker, Erling Holland. It's cool how these guys, some of these guys really let people in. Because I think Erling even has like a huge. YouTube channel and he talks about training. And he's literally like top three strikers.

He's a guy they're going nuts about with the liver and he's like, you know, he's 6'5 and all that stuff, right? Yeah, yeah. Norway brought their whole, they said they don't trust American food. So they brought meat, fruits, vegetables. They ship that all because they don't want to eat American. I'm not mad at them for it. I think it's a good idea.

Like we don't want to like glyphosate and whatever the hell else is sprayed on your damn foods. I don't know if we're filming, but one of the really cool things about Erling, I sent you the video about him is he does cardio with his mouth taped. And he actually does it in like a kind of a, what's it, an altitude type chamber. But he talked about how these in soccer, like, especially if you're a striker, unlike midfield where they sprint up and down, up and down, up and down. Strikers, of course, they sprint, but you have sprint stop for a bit, sprint stop for a bit, sprint stop for a bit. So he was mentioning how like he finds that that type of exercise. helps him recover faster from his in-between sprints in the game. Get used to that CO2 tolerance.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's not get going on Mike Isertel. Well, we're going to talk a little bit about some mild fascia release stuff. And In Seema and I've had some amazing experiences with it. We've shared a lot with you. We've had a lot of people come on the show talking about fascia and talking about all these different kinds of things. Sometimes it's hard to tell like what's real and, you know, what does what.

but I can't tell you guys enough. I can't communicate to you guys enough on how amazing this is. It's like how well it really works. Even just with a small tweak in my neck from working on some striking, I'm like, okay, I know how to fix that. You know, I can go to somebody and I can have someone help me and they can, you know, work on some of the kinks and stuff. And some people will go to chiropractors and stuff like that.

And that's a whole kind of different type of therapy. but I think that mild faster release is something that can keep you in the game for a really long time. And it's something that I still do on areas that I don't even know if they hurt or not. Like I'm just exploring sometimes. And I'm like, ah, shit, what's that? After a lot of sprints the other day, I started digging in on the quads. And I found like a crazy knot on one side, nothing on the other. That's the same side that my hamstring bothers me on.

So it's like all these things are probably connected. You know, I think a good game for us to play. Jeff Nippard, he's back in the game, he's making, he's making educational content. He made a video recently ranking, ranking recovery practices on a tier list. So I think like, if we have his video play, we can kind of put where we'd rank certain things versus where he ranked. I don't understand these different tiers and stuff. What does it mean? A tier list is like A, B, C, or actually, S, S is top tier.

Yes, yeah. S-A-B-D-F. Yeah, I'm a, I'm already. already so messed up with letters and numbers. I don't need any more help with it getting more confusing. Yeah. Well, let's just say S tier is the best tier. All right, there we go. And then ABC, D, F is just like grades in school. You know what I mean? As stands for first, I guess. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, yeah, let's let's let's let this play. Check it out. One is an F tier. Cold plunge. They can't reduce muscle soreness, but research shows they might actually

blunt muscle hypertrophy. And hot water seems to be better post-workout. D-tier. Sona. He can have. Okay. So I'd say, you know, honestly, no, I put cold plunge in S tier. Even though, and the thing to think about, I think, if you're someone, because Jeff is an athlete who's focused on muscle gain and not losing muscle. So at the top of the mind for Jeff is like, I need to gain muscle. Then just don't cold plunge close to your workouts or don't cold plunge after your workout since you're trying to keep that inflammation going so you can grow. maybe do it 24 hours later, 48 hours later. Because the fact that it can blunt inflammation and have you feel fresh is one of the reasons

why, for example, when I played college soccer and we were doing double days of training, we would cold plunge in between sessions because right after that cold plunge, blunts the inflammation from that session, boom, we're able to get on and get another hard training session. For a lot of athletes outside of those who are purely focused on the inflammatory effects of training that help with hypertrophy, the cold plunge is an absolute godsend for being able to have higher training volumes and not have hard training negatively affect your performance. I can't really see a scenario where cold plunging, unless you maybe were doing it like all the time super religiously to where it would negatively impact your body's own ability to deal with

inflammation. And I think that might be some concern that some people have post-workout, let your body do its own thing. Yeah. I think we all are in agreement with that. Yeah. But at the same time, let's say you had a really hard leg workout. you had a great workout and your back is just a little you know your back's a little bit just doesn't

feel great I see no harm two three hours later in getting that cold plunge and I think that I could be wrong but I think I think you'd get a 10 out of 10 if people went in and they didn't have like some sort of serious back blowout they just had like a issue with their back a little tweak and it didn't feel great I think you put people in a cold plunge for about three minutes if they can safely handle it I think all of them are going to say they feel better coming out of there. And yes, we can say, oh, well, kind of numbed it and then it started to like hurt again later. Yeah. But you could have, I've had hours of relief from that before.

I don't know if it's completely washed workouts away 100%, but it's gotten damn close to it for me, I think. Absolutely. And the thing is, too, it's like there are the other benefits that come along with it in terms of allowing you to learn how to breathe calmly and calm yourself down. Like that has a, that's a great nervous system effect because people, the initial response of a cold plunges, fast breathing helps, makes you more sympathetic and makes you stress. But if you get in there, you do what, you're supposed to do what you're doing right there. Breathe slowly. It allows you to calm down and allow, and that that's beneficial in a sense so that you can calm yourself down in a stressful environment. So yes, it blunts inflammation, but it also is good kind of training for your nervous system.

And it doesn't have to be something you do every single day at the coldest temperament. But it's amazing intervention for kind of like, honestly, washing away levels of fatigue. You know, I love it. I do it about once a week right now. I'm doing it every Saturday before I work out and been doing it with some friends. And it's great to have other people to do it with. Yeah. Sometimes when you're there by yourself, you're like, I don't want to walk around it a few times. Yeah, I really want to go in. But I would also say like, you know, if you are trying to do it and you're trying to make a commitment to it, then just lower the bare. of entry a little bit. Make it a little warmer for a little while.

And just, you know, like it, I understand, like, you want to get it at 37 and make it brutal, but, uh, just figure out a way to get in there. 55, even 60 guys. Figure out a way to get in there. But we, we both feel like it's super effective. Let's see what we got next. Help with recovery, but the research isn't super clear yet. Until there's more data, I'm thinking high C tier, low B trips. He put sauna at C tier.

You know, the interesting thing is I think that when it comes to sauna, if you're using it as a recovery thing, it's something that you've got to be mindful of the temperature you're using and how long you're in there because a sauna is kind of like a bit of a workout. I mean, if you have that thing around 180, 190, 200 degrees plus, your heart rate's going to go up. You're going to get dehydrated so you need to make sure you're hydrating. I think that it can be really good for recovery, but if you're using it purely for recovery, you just got to be mindful of how long you're in there. And along with everything that happened around the sauna. So when you use the sauna, was this also a day that you had a hard training session and whatever sports you do or a lifting session?

If that's the case, then it might actually be better for you to have a lower temperature for a shorter duration or a high temperature like 180 for like 10 or 15 minutes versus some people, if it's a day that I'm only going to sauna and maybe, you know, do some other things, but light workouts, I might have it at like maybe 190, 200. And if that's the only thing, okay, 30, 40 minutes. But if it's a day I worked out, 180 degrees, 10 minutes, 175 degrees, 10 minutes. Nothing crazy. Just get the heart rate up and make it easy to do some massage.

Do you ever use the sauna just to get rid of like bloat? Like maybe you ate a little bit weird for a day or two. And you're just like, I'm kind of, I mean, you're always in great shape, but you're like, I'm a little puffy, little fluffy and I want to just like lose a little bit of water weight. I like how that's a passive benefit of it. Like, I do like that benefit. I don't think I just use it for that. But sometimes I am.

I think it's a little bit of a thing because you do hold on to more water when you eat a little bit differently than what you're used to, right? And for us, it could be three pounds. It could be like six pounds. It's a big difference when you got six extra pounds on you. And if you could, uh, you know, safely lose like three of the. that and not have it not have a negative impact. I think it's kind of great. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I know O'Hern uses it for that. Like, he'll use it sort of like almost like as prep to his,

to his diet almost. Kind of feeds into his nutrition. And just the big thing is just make sure to hydrate in there. Have some water and electrolytes with you. A lot of people I see sometimes when I go to outside sanas, they don't have liquid with them. I'm just like, yo, yo, you don't want that. Come on now. The other thing about a sauna and a cold plunge, both these things, Cold plunge is like a little bit more hectic. But man, I'd love to see what the data would show if I said in Seema, I want you to spend 15 minutes just by yourself, just over there in that corner with nothing.

I'd like to see what the research would show, you know, that versus the sauna, like if you didn't have your phone with you in the sauna, you know what I mean, stuff like that. Because I do think these practices you can, you can like amplify them. You can kind of boost them up. I know you bring the body lever in there. so you're doing a little bit of soft tissue work. But this is an opportunity for people to really, people that have dogs,

people that have kids, people like just got a lot of responsibilities, a lot of things going on. Lock yourself in this little, in this little heat thing, and you just chill for a little while. And you're not really doing anything. I've never really,

I don't really fall asleep in there, but you do get pretty relaxed. Absolutely. Absolutely. Last thing I want to share is that when it comes to heat, you know, you were saying like it's kind of like a workout. with the heat coming and it's going to start to get really hot soon,

keep in mind if you're doing workouts outside that your heart rate, for most of the time, your heart rate's going to be a couple extra beats higher just because it's hot out. Could be three beats higher, could be five beats higher, could depend on who you are. And so with your rest intervals, that might be something to keep in mind if you're sprinting,

if you're running, if you're out there and you're trying to do a 10-minute mile pace and all this kind of stuff and you're like, man, why am I just totally dying? A lot of times it's a heat. Yeah. I really wear on you. So maybe a little extra rest interval. Next up.

Dehydration or trauma under a medical supervision. I'd skip it. Oh, phone rolling. Okay. So Jeff just mentioned IV drip. He put out of Eptier. Honestly, I've never done an IV drip.

It's supposed to like hydrate you very quickly, right? Yeah, I've used them before. I haven't really noticed much from them. I guess like in powerlifting. we would use them like after a way in and then you would you know try to rehydrate and all that kind of stuff and i've heard i think joe selvin and briani came within the context of like let's say you're cutting a lot of weight and you need to high rehydrate fast i think it's great for because i've heard a lot of athletes ufc fighters i've heard you have you can safely do it with somebody that knows

what they're doing sounds like a pretty good idea to me it seems like a pretty specialized type of recovery you know what i mean yeah you need to have like a nurse or somebody potentially. Somebody who knows what the hell they're doing. Yeah. But it is a great way to get hydrated quickly. It's going to get you hydrated a lot faster than just drinking water, that's for sure. Mm-hmm.

Some research does show that it can reduce muscle soreness, but the effects are pretty small in my experience. I'm still feeling low B-tier, stretching. Low B-tier, okay, that's higher than I would have expected him to mention for foam rolling. You know, I think that when people think about foam rolling, I think that they typically kind of lump, all soft tissue work into foam rolling. And today we're going to end up talking quite a bit about soft tissue.

I put that at S tier. And there's a lot of reasons I put it at S tier, but one of the big reasons, as I learned over the years, is it's really important to have all of the tissues of your body move. Right. So this is one of the reasons why movement is really good for recovery, going and taking a walk, some rope flow. Whatever your movement is, if it's gentle,

it can be really great for recovery. A lot of athletes, sometimes they'll go on an exercise bike after. after a hard workout just to slowly move. Now, soft tissue work and form rolling allow you to actually do the movement of your tissues. So instead of you going out and moving, you're now moving those tissues. And it gives you the opportunity to move tissues

that typically don't get a lot of movement, which enhances your awareness of these tissues. Because certain tissues that haven't gotten movement in a really long time or haven't been touched in a really long time, there could be extra tension being held there that you don't realize until it's touched. And when you touch, it and then you're like, oh wow, this side is so much more tense than this side. And then you work on it

through, you know, whether it's foam rolling, whether it's using a body lever, whether it's using a tennis ball, whether it's using the ground. You're going to be able to, let's say, relieve tension from that tissue. And then you're going to find, oh, wow, downstream of that feels better. You know what I mean? So I think it's like, I think it's S tier because again, from my practice, I want to touch every tissue of my body throughout the week. It's like somebody in the strong human community. His name's double R. He says it's his system check at the end of the night. You know what I mean? So you're able to like check on yourself and see what's weird. The check engine light on or what's going on here? Do I need windshield wiper fluid? Yeah. I put it at an S tier. Yeah. I never personally used to like the

foam roller because I was I always thought like why are people coming to the gym and the first thing they do is like laying on the ground. You know, I always kind of thought that like didn't make sense. using it in other areas and if you're someone that doesn't mind laying on the ground and relaxing and doing certain things I guess the foam rollers not even necessarily for relaxing but that is my my one negative against most foam rollers is they're pretty soft and in my opinion the mild fascia release stuff it doesn't have it doesn't have to hurt really bad to be effective as Jill Miller showed us with her balls they are softer and you can you can actually dig in deeper with some softer balls

that could be like super effective but yeah foam rolling I think is a good diagnostic you know it's a good it's a good check of like yeah how's how's my back feel how does this feel how does that feel and you know you start to do that on the sides of your legs on your calves your shins you can really get into some good spots

and as we said earlier we're both huge fans of mild fascia release how'd you rank it S tier okay all right it can help with flexibility and range of motion but for recovery, doesn't seem to be any better than just resting. So low C tier.

Eating enough cal... Okay, stretching. If we're talking... I think when he's talking about stretching, he just means static stretching. I look at stretching. I kind of lump stretching into just like long range movement.

And I think it is kind of good to let your body move into certain ranges and see the limitations. Again, it's like, it's a movement practice that builds awareness on your stiffness or where you don't have a level of pliability in the way you move. You know what I mean?

So, I mean, as a, again, this is about recovery. I'd put it in a tier. Just because like I don't think you need to sit there and static stretch everything for 30 seconds to a minute. But it's probably good to allow your body to get into these ranges. Like this is a dynamic kind of stretch movement. I could hold here and stretch it or I could allow. myself to dynamically go there and if I'm here on this side and I feel some extra tension in my in this tendon here I know that okay maybe I want to maybe I want to get a little bit more movement

there so I would put out of eight here because I look at it as just kind of another movement diagnostic I think you and I are in a similar category here where we're Jeff Nipper's obviously highly dedicated all this stuff and he's all in on this stuff too and he's in on this stuff 24-7 as well yeah but in Seema and I really view this as a 24-7 seven practice. Like you're, you're practicing this stuff all the time. So, um, there's probably times where I lounge, uh, there's probably sometimes when you lounge and relax and you're literally doing nothing necessarily to like progress yourself forward because sometimes we just need downtime. We need like relaxation. But those moments for me and I'm thinking

for you are really few and far between. I'm almost always working on something. So if I went for a run either day and my groin's a little tight. Yeah, I might be in my recliner for a minute as like eat my food and hang out my dog or something, but then I'm on the ground. Yeah. And I'm on the ground. My legs are spread wide, you know, as wide as I can get them. And I'm, I'm stretching. Yeah. I'm there stretching. Then I'll move my other, you know, leg, try to get in like a hurdler stretch or something. I'm always trying to move and make myself more mobile. So as much as I don't actually like physically spend a bunch of time with an actual like full on stretching routine. The stretching routine is done throughout the entire day.

Yes. Almost all the time every single day. Absolutely. Like just like you mentioned there, I'll sit on my laptop, you're getting some work done. I'm in different positions. Stretching,

but I'm not looking at it like stretching. I'm looking at it just like it's allowing my body to relax into these positions. And for myself specifically as somebody who does Brazilian jiu-jitsu, there are positions that my body has to be able to access without feeling a level of stress. Maybe if you're like Jeff, you're a bodybuilder or a powerlifter,

maybe you don't find as much importance in those positions. But long term, I think you probably will find that there is some importance into being able to access those positions. So you might want to do some static, some dynamic. And like, I mean, think about sitting on SESA. Technically, it is a stretch of the quad. But it can also be a position that you relax in. And many cultures relax in those positions.

And you find that those cultures, their elderly move better than those who don't. So it makes you wonder, stretching, good or bad? Probably good, depending how you dose it and how you use it. I think in America we just tend to do everything. It all reminds me of the same exact. It all reminds me of sunbathing where it's like, oh, the UVs nine. I'm going to get out there and I'm going to get some sun.

And you're like, you haven't been getting sun the whole time. Now you're trying to get a tan, but then you're using like SPF 30. or something. It's just... And now you have melanoma and you blame the sun. It's such a backwards weird like a thing that we do. We tend to do that with a lot of stuff. But I think,

I think stretching, you know, like some of what he's kind of viewing and he's simplifying everything for everybody. He's like, does this help with recovery? Yeah. Well, you know,

I could do a really hard workout and then guzzle down a protein shake and be like, well, I don't feel anything. You know, this is all like, this is all like a really long process, right? Yeah. And,

if we played a pickup game of basketball yesterday or something and I'm real sore, stretching immediately may not be the best idea if I'm super sore, but maybe a few days later, stretch and relax. But if I play basketball and I stretch and I play basketball and I stretch and I keep working on it, I keep getting more relaxed with basketball, I keep getting more used to it, the stretching will become effective at some point. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

All right, next one. Oh, wait, pause. Where would you put it? I think I put it at eight tier? Maybe like a B. Okay, that's fair. Calories. You can recover in a deficit for sure, but if your calories get too low, your recovery will drop off.

High A tier. Appropriate training varieg. Yeah, that's a stolid one. I think he put like appropriate calories or higher calories because it wasn't a deficit. So what would you use? Higher calories for recovery? Yeah. Well, again, I think it's like more of like a long-term play.

Like if you're really smashing yourself with training and you eat a lot more food. Yeah. It's one of the most powerful levers you can pull. Absolutely. It's unbelievable. Yeah. But in like little bursts, I don't know how good it would be, but if you're doing what you're doing, I think you'd probably really feel it. Like if you're doing jujitsu and you have like, right?

If you have a day or two where you just eat and like chill, probably feels amazing. It feels great. I'd agree with him. It's an eighth year for sure. And this next one is appropriate training volume. Volume. If you try to do too much for too long, you'll dig yourself into a hole. Easy S tier.

Sleep. Agree. Getting seven to nine hours. with the appropriate training volume and the food, both of those things are where motivation lingers and hides, motivation willpower, those things kind of hide within exactly what he just said right there. Explain that.

Within a lot of these recovery tools, but mainly what he said about like your food and your sleep and having more calories and having appropriate training volume, when you start to overdo it, you're going to be less motivated. Yeah. I don't really want to, you know, I don't know. But this is like something you just signed up for recently.

Like you literally might have just signed up for it. Like you might have just paid for it to have a coach help you with a particular protocol where you're getting your arms bigger or your squat bigger or whatever it is you're working on. Yeah. And then now you're like three weeks in and now you're kind of talking yourself out of it. And it's because somewhere along the lines, something is getting to be too much. Maybe your training is a little bit too hard.

It's impacting your sleep negative. maybe you're training so hard that it's negatively impacting your appetite. Like all these things are really connected. And then we end up with people that ask a lot of questions about like motivation. And when you think of, when I think of why people are losing motivation sometimes, I think it's because they're overreaching. Agreed.

Agreed. And it's very interesting because why do you, I get it. We overreach because we want to challenge ourselves, right? and we chase that feeling of like a hard, hard workout, but what are you rushing for? Right? If you had better training volume, lower volume, if you maybe gave yourself a few, a day in between certain sessions versus going as often as you do, you'd still reach that goal,

but you'd reach that goal in a more joyful way where you feel continuous amounts of motivation because your body, yeah, maybe you don't recover the best on certain days, but you're not feeling as absolutely wrecked. But for something, I mean, I get it. of people seek that because a lot of examples we see 75 hard Goggins like it's it's all about kind of leaning into that and and kind of building your discipline so you can handle it which I mean there is benefit within that but doing that chronically I don't necessarily think that's the best way to go about your your movement practice it's super funny because if I was like to just a pass a basketball

over to you it's like you're not going to you're not going to go and do a layup You know what I mean? You're not going to go next to the hoop and be like, boom, bank shot and bank it off. You're going to shoot a three-pointer. Yeah. Every time, right? And then it's like, who knows what the hell happens?

An air ball. Yeah, total air ball. Hit the backboard and not the rip. And it's like that's the equivalent. Like if you were to think of the same thing, like in the gym, you come in and you try to do a, you know, 48-inch box jump out of nowhere cold to just coming out of your car. It's like, you're going to totally kill yourself doing that.

Yeah. Why do we do that to ourselves? Oh, no. Appropriate volume. definitely like an S-tier thing, I think. Great. Sleep is this one. First boost recovery, performance,

and improves health across the board. S-tier. Recovery tier list. Two on an S-tier, one is an F-T. A good point. A nitpick on that one at all. Yeah. That's the gold standard is to get some freaking sleep,

but sometimes you can't sleep because you train too hard. Yeah. So you've got to be kind of careful of that. Like if your shoulders are aching and your back's aching or different things are kind of bugging you while you're trying to sleep, that's probably somewhere along. in the line, you overdid something somewhere. All those adaptations going on.

So we did talk a little bit earlier about mild fascia release, and I got this little handy-dandy band right here just to kind of show you guys something. And this isn't actually the way the ligaments and tendons and muscles and stuff work. But I think it is a good illustration. I've seen Nauti Aguilar talk about this before, where, you know, your body is kind of like elastic, right? Mastradamus. It's doing this guy right here, right?

It's got this elasticity to it. it and then maybe you end up with a quote unquote adhesion or you end up with some sort of injury or just some sort of a fuckery in your elbow or something like that and then you end up with you know a knot right and then we try to get rid of the knot through like training or through stretching you know just keep and like it's not really it's not really getting the spot right and again none of this is really like scientific but you're trying to get pressure on the spot in some way via using like a ball or something. You know, you say this is your hamstring and you sit your hamstring on this ball and you

get pressure on it. And maybe you get pressure on it for a minute, three minutes, who knows. Try to get in there a bunch of different ways, maneuver around a bunch, see if you find something on the other side, go upstream, downstream, because you might find stuff in the hip flexor and all that. and then hopefully, wah bam, hopefully it goes back to here. But from what I've seen, from what I personally seen,

I haven't seen chiropractic be able to fix that. I haven't seen stretching, be able to really address that. All the stretching might help sometimes if maybe you didn't mess yourself up that bad. But I would say that like mild fascia release is like the one thing that for me, I've had injuries to where I'm like,

man, I'm really screwed up. And then within, in a few days, oftentimes within just a few days, I'm like, wow, I think I can still do what I've, what I've been wanting to do. And it doesn't usually take me that long to recover. So yeah, yeah, no, that's a, I mean, that's a really good explanation. And one of the things to keep in mind, because we're going to get into some stuff with Tom Brady talking about his soft tissue experience, which I think is pretty amazing. So many things when we talk about on this show, we talk about

breathing and breathing with a level of not holding your breath when doing certain things, right? Soft tissue work is one of those things where you need to learn to breathe through the practice because with soft tissue, there's like there's two archetypes of people who get into soft tissue work. There's archetype A, which is kind of like the person I was when I started doing soft tissue work. You look at it at almost kind of like a competition. How much pressure can I handle. How much can I like push into this and deal with this pressure? And the tendency of what happens is you have a high pain tolerance. I have a high pain tolerance. You're putting pressure on a certain area. You hold your breath. When you hold your breath and you're doing soft tissue work,

there's going to be a, the body will want to tense up. And if your body is tensing up and those tissues are tensing up, you're not going to be able to actually get as deep into the tissue as you're looking for because your body's not allowing you to relax. So when you're doing soft tissue work, your breath is going to be kind of like, it's going to be a thermostat. It's going to be a thermostat that tells you you need to calm down with that pressure if you find you're holding your breath with that pressure.

Or if you're breathing pretty calmly and you're good, you can handle more pressure. There's that person B. I mentioned person A who's like holding their breath and they're the masochist. Person B is like the pressure-averse person who any type of touch, oh, ah, ah! Everything.

their pressure averse. This is the type of person who needs to use lighter pressure initially, but they need to still allow themselves to use the lightest pressure possible and breathe with that pressure and then slowly increase the grade but still use the breath as a thermostat because once you start holding your breath, release and use the pressure that allows you to breathe through it. No matter if you're person A or person B, that'll then allow you to ideally become the third type of person who uses their breath as a thermostat and is able to modulate how much pressure they can need to use

on any single part of their body so that they can fix the problem. Right? That's the middle way right there. That's what we're trying to find. Breathe real crazy and tense up. You're not going to be able to get the results that you're looking for. It might cause more damage than anything.

You do have to try to breathe through it, but at the same time, just as you're saying, maybe the key is to let off the pressure a little bit. If you find yourself where you can't breathe, that's a great indicator on whether you can handle it or not. The other thing to think about too is like if you, at first, you might need a lot of mildfash release. You know, you start to mess around with it.

You start to get kind of addicted to it. And next thing you know, you're like rubbing your butt on everything in your whole house, right? Over time, though, you should have your programming and you should have a lot of these issues taken care of to where you need way less of it, in my opinion. And like you could get to a point. I mean, I've gotten to a point before where I've gone months without really doing hardly any of it. And then I've gotten other points where I'm working on like three things at one time, you know? So try to get appropriate training in as well and make sure you understand that that could be the big reason why you need all this attention on all these ligaments and tendons and so on.

Let's see what Tom Brady has to say about some of this stuff. So a lot of it, so I'll give you an example. I was a quarterback. I threw the ball a lot. I had significant elbow pain. It was tendonitis, basically. And the tendon in my elbow would get inflamed. Every time I would throw, I would go in the weight room,

I would lift weights because everyone says, you got to lift weights if you want to do better. If you want a stronger arm, you got to lift weight. So I would do bicep curls. I do tricep push downs. I do bench press. I do pulls. I do all the things.

Then I would go on the field. So in the weight room, those muscles are getting stronger, but they're also getting tighter and thicker. Okay? Now I go on the football field and I've got to create this really elastic movement where all these muscles need to be really long and elastic But in the weight room I've changed them to be very dentally tight So now I this this is really interesting Because when you talk to an exercise scientist

They'll say you do muscles don't just get tight You know you can't change the length of a muscle But again I I just love hearing how a practitioner describes it versus someone who's an exercise scientist. Because a practitioner of anything knows the feeling of a muscle feeling and being tighter and a muscle feeling and being more elastic. And anybody who does the thing understands what he's talking about.

But when you just pay attention to the research side of things and potentially the textbook physiology side of things, you end up being so cramped into the nuances of what he's saying and picking it apart in a negative way. So I just want to mention that. There's so many different ways. that he could be training. There's so many different rep protocols and stuff.

So someone could be like, well, not if you're on this rep product. But he's not talking about that. He's talking about what you're talking about, which is this elastic component that we've seen a lot of other people try to mimic in the gym with these kind of herky jerky movements

and these other movements that you would basically do on a field. The difference between what you do on a field and what you do when you're lifting weights, they're massively different. It's not to say that they can't complement each other, but they are just way different. You know, everybody knows I love certified Piedmontese beef,

but I also love Good Life proteins because that brand and that company and that website is where you can get like a crazy variety of meat. Do you like a lot of different kinds of meat other than just red meat? Dude. Well, of course. Before we even get to that, I do need to mention Good Life's sausages. Are they sausages?

They're not just hotlings. They have like chorizo baked turkey sausage. They have different types of bacon. And I'm talking a lot about red meat right now, but like their assortment of meats over there is scrum chis. The Bratworth has like cheese in it. Yeah. Yeah, that one's amazing. Oh my God.

But they also have like they have chicken. They have scallops. They have literally anything that, any type of protein you dig, they have it there. And it's high quality protein. Lamb. Yeah. I get shrimp, scallops, all kinds of different fish, salmon, cod. I mean, you name it.

they have it. Absolutely amazing. It makes it convenient to be able to get everything all in one stop. And then also, Good Life Proteins has certified Piedmontese beef.

So all the same cuts and all the same things that you would enjoy from Piedmontese.com you're getting now over at Good Life Proteins and they have a code. And code power

at Good Life Proteins is going to get you 20% off your entire order. Hobot tendon, that's like, hold on, what do you want me to do? Do you want me to be dense and tight, or do you want me to be long and elastic?

So this tendon is now becoming very inflamed through all repetitive throwing motions, day after day, to the point where I couldn't throw anymore. I would have to take days off. You take this day off, and then you come back and you practice every other day. And after practice, we're going to ice your elbow. Can you pause?

There's a bunch of things to keep in mind here. I mean, this is Tom Brady. However, even someone like Tom Brady sometimes changes mechanics down the road. I think we have a tendency to just think, like, oh, this guy is amazing. And we automatically think that their mechanics are awesome. But sometimes their prowess and sometimes many other attributes that they have kind of skip past their mechanics.

Now, Tom Brady is known to have really good mechanics. But I'm saying, what I'm saying is it's a mistake to just think like, oh, his elbow hurts even though he has the best mechanics. He may not have for a period of time and may have had to alter. over time because when you're younger, you're like, I don't mind taking these risks. Like, we're winning football games. Like, this is awesome, right?

And I can throw the ball with this, like, weird sidearm thing that I got going on. But as you start to get older and you start to have more and more throws and more and more volume on your body, you start to recognize maybe there's a slightly different way to play this game so I can still do it longer. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. You're an anti-inflammatory and you're going to rest.

So I was like, how a career is that? That's what we do. That's what we do. Anti-inflammatory ice rest. And then finally, it wasn't working anymore because you get older. You're like, hold on. I used to at 19 that worked and at 20 it worked, but at 22 it's not working that much. At 24, it's not really getting better and it hurting more and, you know, it's becoming more irritating.

So I meet Alex, one of my teammates, William McGuinness, who was a great defensive end from USC, a first round pick for the Patriots, I think in 1993. He says, Tommy, we can't have you. I already won a Super Bowl at that point. He's like, we can't have you mispractice. you're coming with me now. You're going to go work with Alex. And I'm like, what can he do that no one else was ever done for me?

He goes, just let's just shut up. Just grabs me, brings me into this little side training room. And Alex says, what's the problem? He said, my elbow hurts. Okay, this is what we're going to do. We're going to through manual therapy, muscle work. We're going to lengthen and soften all the muscles in your forearm, all the muscles in your bicep and all the muscles in a tri-up

to relieve the tension on your tendon. Your muscle does it, your tendon doesn't hurt because they're too weak. They hurt because they're too tight. Pause. So one thing I want to mention that's like really cool about what Tom saying. Something I noticed with my body over the years is doing soft, with doing soft tissue work is that the, you need to be able to create tension when you need it. And you need to be able to not have tension when you don't need it.

And what happens a lot of the time when you focus on hypertrophy and lifting and tension and breath holding is that you tend to take that tension into the places where you need to rest. So you don't even realize it, but now your forearm is still kind of on. Or your glutes, there are certain aspects or tissues in your glutes that are still chronically kind of on and tight. And then they're pulling on certain areas,

which gives you a little bit of lower back pain or elbow pain. And one of the benefits of what he's talking about in terms of soft tissue work is when you do this manual therapy, whether you're having somebody do it on you or you do it on yourself, is you learn how to breathe, and you learn how to relax, and whatever tissue is being worked on, that tissue will just kind of lose its tone

when you're sitting there. Because think about it. That tissue shouldn't have high amounts of tone when you're sitting there. You should be able to just kind of dig into it. And then you then hold on to that lack of tension when you're actually recovering and to be relaxing. But now you have access to being tense when you need it

and being relaxed when you don't. You know what I mean? So it's like, we'll keep it playing, but like that's huge. And it's really important, especially if you listen to this podcast, you're definitely someone who lifts. You definitely want to get on some soft tissue work. That's the definition of like the best athletes ever.

You know, I think we have a tendency to just think the best athletes ever are like only smooth, but they're not only smooth. They're able to create a lot of force and a lot of tension. It's just that when they do it, it just looks nicer because they have other components going on simultaneously. They're not just like getting stiff and holding certain positions. We need to, through muscle work, relieve the tension. So now, instead of these muscles being very short and dense, we're going to make them a long and elastic through the treatments.

So now, after three or four days of him doing the treatments, I would ice the tension. So I was made aware of active release therapy probably around 30 years ago. It was the first time I was exposed to it. and active release therapy is like where someone will dig in, let's say like a thumb. And then what's supposed to happen is somebody else is actually supposed to move your leg or move your arm

or whatever it is, the area that someone's working on. Other practitioners might just do it themselves or they might just ask you to move your arm. As Ian Danny, I think, worked on your elbow one time. He was kind of doing stuff and you were moving your arm around. And they'll dig in there pretty hard. But the idea is exactly what he was talking about.

where they're trying to kind of lengthen some of that. And at first it will hurt. It might hurt like crazy. But over a few sessions, it will hurt less and less. And the main selling point of A.R.T. When it first came around, active release therapy by Dr. Leahy out of Denver, Colorado, he was like, you know, you're only going to see me like two or three times. And then that's it.

Which is different than the chiropractic model where they would try to kind of get you in there for like, oh, your neck is really messed up. They do an x-ray. They show you that you have cervical, whatever the hell they want to call it. And they try to get you in there for 16 sessions or so. With active release therapy, a lot of times they're like,

you probably only need like two or three 90-minute sessions or 60-minute sessions or something like that, which is way less and might be expensive, but it's still going to be way more affordable in the long run because it's not nearly as many sessions. So I found that to be, like when I first found that years ago. I was like, this is like, and I, you know, it was back many years ago before I ever had any money. I was just like, I need to spend money on this stuff sometimes because this is really

valuable. I didn't really know about mild fashion release doing it yourself. There was no Kelly Sturret and stuff like that back then. And, you know, now learning that you can just grab a lacrosse ball and a baseball and softball and some other different things. And you can be on your way to doing it Yourself is pretty amazing. To bring a little inflammation out. I stayed on the anti-inflammatory for a little bit. But then after making these muscles a little bit longer through the muscle work, the inflammation and the tendon came down.

And then there was no elbow pain. And I was like, that's so interesting. There's someone to be like, you can't make a muscle longer. Just like, don't even trip about that. Just don't. Yeah. Anyway. Somebody could also have diagnosed him.

You have a tendonopathy. And then you're like, oh, I got tenet. And then you don't even really think about what it even means. You just now all of a sudden have this like disease in your elbow. And that means that that's just going to flare up. Anytime we like overuse that, it's going to flare up. You're like, I don't know how much sense that makes. You know, I want to mention something about that real quick.

I remember we had a foot doctor on here years ago who told me I'd probably have some arthritis in my big toe. Because of some big toe pain that I was feeling at that time with a lot of stuff. Those are sexy as fun. I know, right? I could sell these things. But I don't have any pain in my big toe. I haven't had pain in my big toe in a very, very long time. So it's just one of those things.

When you hear a diagnosis, don't relate to that diagnosis because it'll stop you from being able to take actions that can allow you to then make whatever you're trying to work on progress. I was the first time in my life since I was that boy playing baseball that my elbow pain went away. And I was like, well, fuck, can you do it from my shoulder? because my shoulder's sore too. I'm going to lengthen out your peck.

I'm going to lengthen out your deltoid. I'm going to lengthen out the muscles in your back that you've created a lot of denseness and stiffness through working out. Now I'm going to lengthen those out. Well, I didn't have any shoulder pain. And I'm like, well, can you do it on my knees? Yeah, I'm going to work on your calves, on your quads,

and your hamstrings, and we're going to create space in the knee joints so that the knees aren't in pain. And I was like, it was an unlock for me. So it was like, okay, once I started getting the right muscle work, It was like, okay, when I go away from you, what I do? You got to stay really hydrated because I want your muscles to be more like beef tenderloin than beef jerky.

If your muscles are like beef jerky and we put tension on that, they're going to tear. So we got to be really hydrated, which how do we get dehydrated? There's a lot of things that dehydrate us. Travel, certain, you know, drink coffee, drink alcohol, dehydrating. You sweat a lot.

You go in the sauna, you steam room. You sweat a lot. But if you don't rehydrate, your muscles get really dry. If you get dry, they tear easy. So, okay, we're gonna stay hydrated. We're gonna put a lot of electrolytes and trace minerals in what you drink. And then-

One thing I wanna mention is like, you know, we had Ian Danny, I think I asked him a question about that level of tone and muscular suppleness, right? And Ian mentioned something that that is good to keep in mind. There are some athletes who potentially that is a feature, not a bug, that muscular tension that's a necessity. You look at athletes like Olympic weightlifters, bodybuilders, of course, power lifters.

And then there are certain sports where maybe that's not something you need. Look at dynamic sports, soccer, basketball, you know, anything that requires a good amount of dynamic movement. Even gymnastics kind of stands out to me because of the way, the way that a lot of gymnastics athletes will stand. You know, their butt is way back and yeah. And they seem like they're just like a little. block, but they can move really well. They can move really well. And that's right there, what you said

there, made me think, like, because like a gymnast, generally a gymnast, they move really well, they're supple, but think about a person that's really good on the rings, getting into an iron cross, the amount of tension that's needed within their tendons, especially. But then if you see them just walk around and stand, they look like, some of them look like they don't have muscle or much muscle, if you get them saying. So hearing that kind of made me, I mean, I'm not, I'm I still think to myself now, like, I don't think that even if you need to be someone who does a power-based sport, of course, you can have that chronic, you know, tone, but I still don't think you need that. I think that you can still have the spectrum of where you can access that tension and that when you need it. But outside of that, you can still have muscles that are very supple that you can literally like almost kind of pull off the bone in a sense.

So that's something that I'm now kind of grappling with. Because, yes, there's always going to be a range of athlete. But I'm trending towards the idea of, like, shoot, all athletes could probably be pretty supple. It just depends on in their sport what they have access to and what they need to be able to access. Does that make sense? It makes a ton of sense. And I'm just thinking of like George Foreman and Muhammad Ali and Sonny Liston and Rocky Marciano

and all these different athletes over the years that, were great long before we ever started getting into like doing, but a lot of these guys would just, they'd grab like a wheelbarrow. You know, they, they would chop down a tree. You know,

Mahama Ali has that famous promo where he's talking about, I've been chopping down trees. And George Foreman literally would like chop down trees. He'd chop wood. That was something that he would do. And you're like, you know, why doesn't big George just get his big old fat butt like in the gym?

He's lazy, you know, but no, he's doing something that's actually probably harder, but probably has more application to what he's, what he's, you know, what he's working on and what he's doing. So I think that like we've, we've been on to some of this stuff for a long time.

We kind of know it. And I'm not saying that weight training by any means is, is a negative. I think there's a ton of positive to it. I think maybe what we kind of missed is, we missed the fact, is that Ali? Yeah. Maybe something that we might have missed was,

the fact that that weight lifting is a great intervention, but it doesn't need to be the main intervention. It just needs to be some. Like a little bit of lifting goes a long way. I think for you, like if you did, I don't know, three or four different lifts for the week

and worked pretty hard on them with a couple little accessory work things, you're probably good. I feel like I'm in the same spot. I don't need... Now, I like variety. I like doing things. I like doing like doing like a crazy amount of variety

just because I, have workout ADHD and I don't like to just do the same movement week by week. But I could probably pick like three things from the weight room and just live off of those for the rest of my life along with the other stuff that I'm doing outside of the weight room and and be fine. Yeah, no, absolutely. Absolutely. But novelty is beautiful.

Novelty allows you to learn new things, brings your awareness on new things. So, hey, I'm always going to love it. Let's keep it play. For years, it was like, well, what I need to eat? Okay, we're going to cut down on the, sugars basically anything that can cause inflammation in your body we're gonna try to just cut down on the inflammation you can have a little bit of you know sugar and a little bit you know you can go out and have fun with your friends but you just can't

overdo it all the time so over time it became the right muscle work the right treatments the right hydration the right nutrition I would take kind of the generic supplements like a multivitamin or a fish oils or things like that and then finally it got to I did a little brain training exercises which kind of came into Bogue. And then I changed my workouts a little bit. Instead of doing the as I got older, instead of doing the heavy weights really slow,

like a deep squat, I started doing much more bandwork that was more elastic and a little bit quicker. So those were probably the major changes. I think it is noteworthy to understand and to embrace the fact that he already made it to being the greatest of all time quarterback in football with the basics.

with some weight training. And then he moved into bands and stuff to get like an extra title or two. So again, it's not a knock on lifting. But he did discover something that I think we can all learn from. We can just learn from, hey, like lifting can be really good,

especially when you're young. Probably a good idea to kind of get after it, get strong, get robust. But also, if you're trying to play a sport and you're trying to remain athletic and trying to remain healthy, maybe having like a little bit more variety

is going to be a better, better option. A cocktail, man. Yeah. The other thing I wanted to say is dehydration. I think just, I mean, we've had all kinds of different people to say all different kinds of things on the show. I don't know what's true and what's not true. But I feel like the body, I think the body can get like kinks, can like kink and like shut off an area. At least that's what it feels like to me.

And it feels like certain areas can get more dry than others. I don't have any information or any research to like prove that. but that's what seems to happen to me to that's that's what seems to happen like in my head when I heard Brady talking about hydration and and water and electrolytes those are really really important but they won't do much for you if you're not fixing your movement patterns yeah if you still have crappy movement patterns you're still over training and you still have tons of areas of the body that need mild fascia release I think you can just drink water and you're just going to pee more and you're not going to really get the benefits that he's talking about. So, you know, he's, he's mentioning all these

things together. They go together in concert. The better eating habits. Everything goes together. And when you start to get everything together, that's how you play into like your late 40s or mid 40s like he did. Yeah. It's it's a bunch of habits that are added on top of each other. Not just one magical thing that he did with tissue work, but a bunch of things. So I hopefully we can get to the groin part. Yeah, let's maybe just skip to that part. I think, that was really interesting when they were talking about him potentially getting a surgery, right? Yeah. Have you guys ever had groin problems in soccer?

Yeah, hernia like a whole. Or like an adductor? Yeah. Okay, same thing. In 2006, my groin was hurting. I was doing a lot of single-leg squats in the gym, which creating a lot of density in my adductors. And then as quarterback, you move laterally a lot. It's not a lot of straight-ahead sprinting.

It's more shuffling with your feet. You're dropping back, you're crossing over. So there was just a lot of tension on my adductors. And I was doing a lot of weightlifting because I was told it. So I go to the, after the season, I go and I tell the doctor, you know, my groin's just really sore all the time. Like every time I move, I can feel it, just grab. And he says, and that wasn't, I was working with Alex a lot. We had developed a relationship over three years.

But I go to the team doctor and he says, well, this is what we're going to do. We're going to do an adductor release. So we're going to go in there. We're going to cut the adductor tendon in your groin. And while we're in there, we're going to cut the other. other side as well. So it never becomes a problem. Right. I was like, oh, that sounds. Isn't that just legit just sound crazy? It sounds wild. Like, like, rather than us figuring out other things, let's just cut that shit, right? Cut that shit, recover. You're going to be just fine.

Like, what? It sounds like such a crazy. I mean, cutting any areas of the body sounds crazy. But to me, I'm like, that area seems like really bad area to mess with. I think that's like one of the interesting things. Like, I mean, I, I think it's kind of a somewhat of like a Western. athletic thing where, you know, let's just get this replaced. Let's get this totally scoped. Let's get this totally removed, right? It's the, it's the fast solutions to an issue rather than maybe addressing the tissue, addressing the movement. Let's just cut shit out or replace stuff. You know, I don't know. I think it's crazy. And also too, maybe that doctor had success. You know, maybe he's done that on a bunch of other people or something. But props to Tom Brady and

his trainer for thinking like, oh, maybe we should, you know, maybe we should second guess this thing. I think in general, it's a good idea. You know, when someone gives you a suggestion, when someone says that you have like this crazy big toe inflammation and that you only have three years to live,

maybe you should get another opinion. The other thing is, too, you mentioned this earlier, but like don't embrace whatever the thing is that someone says. Someone says you have a tendonopathy or arthritis. I'm not saying to be blind to it and not accepted at all because that's not great. you know, the doctor tells you that you have heart disease.

Like it's not great to be like, no, I don't. That's not, I'm not saying, I'm not saying you treat it that way. What I'm saying is that you still allow yourself to have hope. Because without hope, you got nothing else left. So you need to understand while it may seem like you can't do anything for certain types of things that happen. I think that all of us feel like we're unique individuals and we feel like the experiences that we're having, Like, no, no, no, you don't understand like how this experience is for me. Right.

It's like, that's kind of what you want to kind of tell people or a particular problem that you might have. Like, no, no, my problem is way more severe. Your suggestions can't help me because, and that's what people tend to do. And I'm guilty of this. We tend to like, no, I have this thing and it just can't be fixed. Yeah. And you're like, well, there's got to be. You got to be able to make it at least a little better because you can always make things a little better.

Like maybe you do have a really horrific disease or something, but could you find ways to make it more comfortable? Probably, right? There's always, there's always like, I just believe in this world that for everything that's like, you know, quote unquote bad, I think there's a good. And I think there's a solution to just about everything. The hard thing to figure out sometimes is,

can we find a solution before it's too late? Yes. not like what I want to do. So I called Alex when I left the office. He was out in California. That's where he was living at the time. He would fly in to see me two days every other week. Alex Carrero, by the way, is his name.

And I said, Alex, I had this, the doctor told me to do this adductor release. What do you think? He was, absolutely not. Just fly out here to L.A. with me for three days, and I'll fix it. Fly out there. We worked on the adductors. We lengthen and soften both adductor, both adductor muscles,

my hips, all my glutes, and basically relieve the tension on the tendon. Was it painful to do? Yeah, I mean, when you have a tight muscle, you have a tight hamstring and someone starts working on your hamstring, it doesn't feel very good. But it gets to the point where,

after you do it long enough, it does start to feel good, there's a lot of relief to the relaxation of the muscle. So I worked on it, he worked on the adductors, and then three days later, no more pain. The doctor said there's a 99% chance that I'm going to have to cut your adductor tendon at some point.

And to this day, nothing to have a high. What a club okay? We have the doctor said there's a 99% chance I have to cut you. Man, sometimes, honestly, people just have are too much too sure about things and speak with that. That is insane. Think about somebody else who wasn't Tom Brady heard that from a doctor. They'd be like, cut my shit then. You know what I mean?

It's, it's insane. I was watching a documentary on one of the tennis players and I can't even remember which tennis player it was. I should remember since I watched a whole documentary on it. But I watched a lot of crap when I was flying back home from Greece. I think it was Nadal. But anyway, he thought to himself, if I have a surgery, like all these other guys, you know, he's staying in shape and he's lifting and he's doing all this stuff.

And he's like, if I fall victim with surgery, like, I'm done. Like, that's going to be that. And he had to have a surgery. And sure enough, he just couldn't keep up. He played longer and he did really well. And he was still, like, insanely competitive. but he definitely had like a drop off. And he just knew like if I have to get cut on.

And unfortunately for him, he was like at the end of the road with his options in terms of his, it was a knee surgery. But if we were able to rewind a bunch and go back a couple years, imagine if he knew about mild fascia release, imagine if he knew about some of these interventions, maybe he could have had a slightly different outcome. Maybe he could have played. I mean, he already like played so well who gives a shit. but I'm sure that he would have wanted maybe go out a little bit more on his own note rather than

being forced out. I wonder which tennis player is that you were talking about. Nadal or Federer? Oh, Federer. It was Federer. It was Federer, yeah. Okay. Yeah, he's like, man, if I have to get a surgery like everybody else, that's going to be that.

But he, I mean, he still played, you know, he wasn't a young guy when he retired. So he still had a very epic, very, very epic career. He was so smooth. visiting different people and the coach Belichick. What are you happy were you seeking? It was hard, you know? Again, it's hard for these coaches to feel like they're not in total control of everybody. I'm sure Alex Ferguson wanted to be in control everything.

Still does. It still does. I bet he does. I bet he does. Yeah. And that's probably a great quality for a coach, but it's also a little bit of a destructive quality for a coach too. What was Belichick like, Tom, in that.

I guess that was it. Tom Brady is, Tom Brady's of me. Like when I, when I see some of the, these athletes get interviewed, even, you know, even like knowing somebody like John Cena and like seeing him get interviewed and then seeing him say certain things. And then also knowing like behind the scene stuff, the way of these people conduct themselves is like unbelievable. Because he could have just went off right there about like how they treated Alex Guerrero and how they treated some of the athletes are being trained by Alex Guerrero at the New England Patriots,

but he just didn't at all. Yeah. He just chose. not to even talk about it. Because I've heard, and I don't know how true it is, but I've heard that Gronkowski was getting in trouble from training with him. I heard that Brady was getting in trouble from trading from him. I heard they, like, ban him from the facility, like the owner.

Why did they? So it was, you know, I don't really know of all the, all the nuances. It's not like I have some dirt on the whole situation that wasn't public because, like, they did talk about this before. But kudos to Tom Brady. It was because he was, there was a,

there was a rising friction and power struggles between Guerrero and the Patriots official medical and training staff. So the training staff must have not liked some of his potential interventions. Right. Right. And that's insane. That's especially amongst like these really high level pros, you know. Yeah. I understand like, so, you know, if you have a team and your main guy goes out and he's always working with somebody else, and you're supposed to be training as a team together,

that would be disheartening for sure. But I don't really know if that was what's happening. I think that they were seeking these people out. Like if you were, if I was your employer and you were seeking out something different on our time that we agreed upon that you would be part of this team, then I definitely would have a problem with that for sure.

Right? But if you were doing it on your own time and your own dime, and it made you better, better, I'd be all for it, especially if over time I kind of was like, I shouldn't have been so like reluctant or shouldn't have been so weird about that situation. It looks like he's having a great time with it. But again, I don't know how you tell the younger guys like, oh, these guys are getting outsourced treatment from it. Right. Yeah, you got your ass needs to stay here. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But yeah, that's, I think though that's just one of those things again,

you know, you'll, you'll get professional opinions about things. You go to the doctor. with an x-ray or this or that. And it's a good idea to try these out-of-the-box interventions, these things that are people see as fringe. Because even still, people see soft tissue work is kind of like a fringe practice. Nippert had it, I think, is like a, I don't know if he had like a C on his tier list, right?

It's generally just seen as, you know, I've heard Steffico and multiple times say it's just placebo. And it's unfortunate. Because you can just, you just know that many of these people haven't really put these things into practice with the level of depth and understanding. They're probably, and they are just speaking from what they see from research papers, rather than kind of gleaning from the experience of those who have put in real practice and even giving it a shot themselves. So that's one of the reasons why, instead of listening to what somebody says about getting a surgery or ignoring an intervention, maybe give it a try. if you think that there's something there for you. I know for myself,

I've experienced times where I've like completely lost strength on one side of my body, you know, in my elbow or shoulder or elbow and shoulder at the same time. Or maybe it's even like my neck and my nervous system feels like shut down on one side. I'll bench like all crooked and all kinds of weird things have happened over the years.

And mile fast release has helped me come back almost every single time. Yeah. like fuck your elbow video that I always talks about but like I um towards the end of my power of thing career it was my elbow that took me out and part of that was part of the reason why I retired was because I didn't want to I didn't want to have to go backwards so far to retrace my steps just to get back to where I was because where I was at the time when I was experiencing that pain was only at like 80 or 85% of my best and I was like that

That's a lot. I already did a bunch. I'm going to just move on. But I could have. I could have worked on it. I could have taken my time. I could have taken a couple months off. I could have worked through some of the injuries. But I'm like, I don't want to just keep chasing my tail. And if I just actually just remove myself from this, I get rid of a lot of that pressure. Competition is going to also cause a lot of injuries. Competition is going to cause a lot of havoc on your body. So you won't be able to probably fix everything, but with the right amount of time and the right amount of protocols,

I think you can fix a lot of stuff. Yeah, absolutely. And I would just say, soft tissue work and being able to do this, especially self-mile fast release, is really a skill. It's like learning how to deadlift. It's like learning how to sprint. It's a practice that your body will get better at handling.

Because when you are, I've literally seen, tissue therapists say you can't do nearly the amount of work that a soft tissue therapist can do on yourself because you can't relax yourself like you would be able to if you had another set of hands on you. And again, that's a statement that is like maybe for you. But of course, there are areas of your body that are going to be harder to reach and a therapist will be able to get in certain areas of your back, et cetera. But it's a skill to be able to put pressure on an air. And a therapist. It's a skill to be able to put pressure on an area, move that area, breathe in a calm way, use the right type of pressure there,

and understanding what to do. It's a skill. And you'll have to do that multiple times over weeks and months to really get the kind of hang of being able to do it without it taking a lot of tensing and conscious thought and effort. And also there's the fact that I think it, for generally most people, it takes around 80 to 120 days to be able to see like collagen restructuring. We learned that when Keith Barrows on the show. We've also had different people come on the show and mention that Larry Parasino, et cetera. For that, like you will get a level of relief from that session, but for the collagen and the structures to really change, we'll take a period of time. So your experience doing soft tissue work right now is going to be a very different experience

from you doing soft tissue work three months from now, six months from now, et cetera, which is why I've had the same experience you have, where, I still do soft tissue work almost every day, a little bit. But I don't need to do as much as I did when I first started because there's really nowhere on my body that can't handle a good amount of pressure that I can't access. And if there is any part of my body, that's like super tender, I know that, ooh, there might be a bruise here

or there's something I really need to address here because this is very abnormal for the way that my tissues are. Right? So just know that, just like everything, it's a skill. and you'll notice a lot of just continuous returns if you can just keep it kind of a small part of your movement practice. Something I think is pretty crazy is that sometimes when someone's working on you or even you're working in certain areas,

you can actually just feel yourself if you go to like the opposite side and you're like that's about how much pressure I'm putting on this side that hurts like crazy. So you could be putting like 10 pounds of pressure on and it feels like you're going to die. It feels really brutal. I think it'd be good for us to talk about some tools a little bit. At my gym, I have some tempering tools that I'm a fan of, but they are cumbersome. They are a little bit of pain in the butt to use

because you have to have somebody else kind of help you with them sometimes. But I do have some rumble rollers and a bunch of things that I could just get on a bench and sit on the bench and then just put it on my quad and they're like 40 pounds, 60 pounds. I even have one that's 180 pounds. and they can just like roll out gross tissue like on the quad. If I have someone there with me, I can just lay face down. I got this like Donnie Thompson pad thing.

That's pretty cool. And then you can just have something there for like minutes at a time. I think one of the things that maybe is misunderstood about some of this mild fascia release is that you kind of want to do stuff for like a little while right there. I'm doing kind of a release for my ankle and my calves just by. And that probably doesn't look like anything. but as I'm inching forward and rolling that thing kind of down near the heel and Achilles tendon, like that's doing a lot of crazy, cool stuff.

But, you know, we've referenced, so you got those things. Those are called rumble rollers. Looking kind of fat there, Mark. Yeah, look a little chunky. Not a fat. How much you think you're weighing there that way? You look like you're maybe 240. Probably.

Yeah? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know how long ago that was. But yeah, and you have to stack them up kind of weird. See how we have the dumbbells there and everything? that's so it doesn't like run away.

But this, you know, some of this stuff might look kind of ridiculous. This feels amazing. Like that for your calf or your shin rather. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Man, that's unbelievable. And like you said, yeah, it is hard to get to certain spots. And so you're going to have to get a plethora of tools if you want to be able to do this stuff.

You got the Gemini, the butt plug from Kelly's Tourette. Yeah. That thing's a chunk of gold. The balls from Jill Miller. We always reference those. The Supernova, Kelly Strech came out that long ago. That was like one of my first tools that I ever got back in the day. And then you and I use the body lever a lot.

And the body lever is amazing. You get it on your neck. You can get it on your shoulders. You can get it on your leg. And some of it's tricky. Someone's like, I can't figure out how to get it on my shoulders. Well, if you just lay on the ground, you can start to find different positions. You can get some good spots on the shoulders and elbows and all kinds of things.

Yeah. I really like the body lever because like, I don't know. Even though Steve, this is what I'm pretty sure actually probably was what he was thinking of when he named the tool. But the fact that you can use the leverage of your body to bring pressure to certain areas. Because like what you're showing there, yes, you can squeeze like that. But you can also like wrap the lever around an area, around another area and just kind of chill and just like let your body relax. Lean into it. Lean into it.

And you can lay more pressure than you could if you were muscularly pressing together just by contort. contorting your body and understanding that leverage. It's truly like I it's it's I think the best tool for soft tissue work because you can live you can get everywhere and you can leverage your body with the tool and really modulate that pressure what you you mentioned earlier when you were talking good that way like on the hamstring and groin yeah yeah yeah yeah and you mentioned earlier stacking things right so you know Jeff was saying that sauna is this tier foam rolling is whatever it's here that and the sauna is money or having like let's say if you do soft tissue work I'd suggest get in a hot tub not in a hot tub take a warm shower beforehand or get in a sauna

beforehand or do it in the sauna because when you're able to get your tissues warmer it actually changes the structure and how much tension you're holding not just in your muscles but also your tendons you're gonna be able to actually get deeper work and because your body's already warm your tissues are warm your soft tissue work is going to be able to have an even bigger effect if your body is warm. So I love, that's why I always, there's not a sauna session I have where I don't do some level of tissue work because it's going to be this that much more effective, right? So whether you have a sauna or whether you can go and find a sauna at your commercial gym or if you guys have a bath house around your

area, have something with you that you can take it and do a little bit of soft tissue work because it will be different. It's great advice to get warm first. You know, get some movement going first. You're going to be able to kind of cut through some of the muscle tissues a little bit easier. But yeah, the body lever is a great one. It's got like a little like knob on it that you can kind of find certain spots. And, you know, Ryan, I know you went and did a session recently and I don't think you've done a lot of body work sessions in the past. What was that experience like versus you trying to do some stuff to yourself here and there? It was it was extremely helpful. Yeah, I went to Oscar. You had a session that you couldn't make. And so I went into, uh, to that. And, uh, yeah, it was,

it was great. I mean, it's, it's nice because like I had him work on my hamstrings. So I was having some tightness there. Um, I just feel like he's able to do a better job. Like, he can leverage his body into it very, very easily. And, and, uh, when you try to do yourself, it's just kind of a pain. Like, it's not always that easy to get into that, unless you have the right tools. Um, and, uh, yeah, it was great. Yeah, you need the right tools. you need the right amount of space, and you also need to be like the right frame of mind. But once you get used to this,

but I do want to encourage everyone to go and find a practitioner, find someone in your area that does some body work, so you get like a reference point. Because when you go in there and they start working on something, you'll go, oh. Now, whatever it is they're doing to you, it shouldn't hurt really bad. So if you have a practitioner who for some reason is really, like,

obsessed with, like, putting you through a crazy amount of pain, you need to tell them like chill like it doesn't need to be there's no reason for session one to be like a 10 there's no reason for any session probably to be a 10 unless you request it unless you're like I just want you to blast through this thing just go for it yeah

I would say that levels of discomfort it's going to vary for each person somebody might not want to go over like a 5 but I'd say like a 7 is kind of reasonable spot like to kind of just you know let people kind of do that and see and see if you can kind of handle that. And over time, that amount of pressure that they put on will feel less

and less. It will feel like a five. It will feel like a three. But yeah, go and find a practitioner in your area just so you get a reference point of how much work maybe needs to be done. And then you'll have a better understanding of, oh, like when I'm doing this, like, this is work. This is mild fascia release work. This isn't, you know, I'm just in the sauna. I'm kind of just messing around and wiggling around. You're actually like really working pretty hard. Yeah. I have my mom go to Oscar. She and my sister go to Oscar, I think, once or twice a month. But I try to encourage her to try to do some of her own soft tissue work. And I don't think she's really been doing much of it. That's one of the things. It's like, you said it, it's soft tissue work. You know what I mean? Like,

you're, you're going to do some searching. You're going to compare one side to the other. You know what I mean? But if you just take that, take that bit of time and like invest in your awareness of your own body, man, it will give you an awareness. and a tool that will allow you to heal yourself for the rest of your life, right? And this isn't actually anything negative about Oscar, but I haven't been to Oscar in years. And that's because I've gotten to a point

where I haven't, I don't need to, because there's a point I was going to Oscar twice a month. And it was great, and it is great, because he does such a great job. But now I'm able to do that on my own body. And that is like, I travel, if I go anywhere, I can deal with, I can heal my body, right? And everyone has the capacity to do that if they just start.

You know? Yeah. So. Yeah. And try to keep these things convenient. We've mentioned this a million times. But like if you have some of these different balls and some of these different gadgets kind of close by, you know, I have, I have dogs. I have some twins that my wife and I watch.

Like I have all these things that are like, you know, I go to find the ball and like one of the kids, you know, threw it outside or whatever. Or like your dog took it or whatever. or the dogs want to like snuggle or pile up on you. Like I got all the same weird distractions everybody else does. But I just make it a habit of it. Just do it when I can. And when it annoys other people

or annoys everybody else in the family, then I don't do it. Or if the dogs start barking and they want me to like snuggle on them, then I'll do that instead. So give some of this mild fashion release stuff a try. It's obviously worth it. You saw some of the...

Ooh. Yep, go ahead. Before you on the show. Got that video from that old white man. Oh, yeah. The old guy talking about the hammy. Yeah, I think that's just another concept we didn't really touch on, but it's powerful. So we had a gal yesterday that was fighting hamstring teninopathy.

And she said she felt the hamstring grab on a lunge, you know, when the leg was behind her. And so we worked on the hamstring, and there was nothing really remarkable there. And then we flipped her over. and I walked through her abdominal structures. And when we got in the Iliosos near the spine, it was super tender. She lit up like a Christmas tree. And we worked on that and we got the tone to reduce and we got it pliable and got the soas moving.

And she got up and did a lunge walk test again. And she didn't feel her hamstring at all. So that extension, that she was getting looked okay, but at what cost? So she was over recruiting the hamstring to get extension because it was fighting this restriction on the anterior side of the Iliasoist. So we had a gal yesterday that was fighting hamstring. That's yeah.

Yeah, that's a great point is that a lot of times you'll find whatever it is that your injury is. a lot of times it's like on the other side, on the opposite side. Sometimes something that's bothering you on the on the back side of your body comes from the front side of your body. We also have this idea of downstream upstream, which I first heard that from Kelly Sturrette. Your pain could be upstream or downstream from wherever it is that you have the targeted pain. So if you have knee pain, you're like, man, I got jumpers knee. I got this stupid knee that's always bothering me. You got this, you know, knee tendonopathy or tendonitis, tendonosis.

if you work through the quads and you work through some of the shins and maybe some areas of the calves and maybe even the hamstrings, you might start to find something that gives a ton of relief to the knee and in that area. There's a physiotherapist names Diane Lee. It was from anatomy trains. And she mentioned this quote. It's the victim that cries out on the criminals. So when you hear, what do you feel? And it's not always the case. Sometimes it could be that you legit have a bruise on your hamstring or something. But a lot of times it's like the, the, the victim is the hamstring and the criminal is something the glute, right? Or the victim is the wrist and the criminal is something in your forearm, right? So it's, that was, it just ties into this idea and I think it's pretty dope. And that's also why so many different tools are made.

You know, he's talking about the SOAS. There's that product called the SORite, which is like, just looks like spikes that you lay on. You're like, what the hell is this thing? Some of these things are a little, a little aggressive, but there's, ways to, there's way, like if you purchase some of these things, you find that they're kind of aggressive, there's ways to kind of manipulate them so they're not so crazy. But these are all things that if you get used to them over time, you're going to find yourself being more elastic, you're going to find yourself feeling healthier and

feeling stronger and feeling better. Strength is never a week. This week, this never strength. Catch you guys later. Bye.