Mark Bell's Power Project - Ryan Fischer - The Most Controversial Crossfitter || MBPP Ep. 763

Episode Date: July 6, 2022

Ryan is the owner of Crossfit Chalk, and the Crossfit Chalk Performance app. He is the author of several ebooks and training programs including the popular Carb Cycling Lifestyle and the Earn Your Carbs Challenge. Follow Ryan on IG: https://www.instagram.com/ryanfisch/ Join The Power Project Discord: https://discord.gg/yYzthQX5qN Subscribe to the new Power Project Clips Channel: https://youtube.com/channel/UC5Df31rlDXm0EJAcKsq1SUw Special perks for our listeners below! ➢https://thecoldplunge.com/ Code POWERPROJECT to save $150!! ➢Enlarging Pumps (This really does work): https://bit.ly/powerproject1 ➢https://www.vivobarefoot.com/us/powerproject Code POWERPROJECT20 for 20% off Vivo Barefoot shoes! ➢https://markbellslingshot.com/ Code POWERPROJECT10 for 10% off site wide including Within You supplements! ➢https://mindbullet.com/ Code POWERPROJECT for 20% off! ➢https://eatlegendary.com Use Code POWERPROJECT for 20% off! ➢https://bubsnaturals.com Use code POWERPROJECT for 20% of your next order! ➢https://vuoriclothing.com/powerproject to automatically save 20% off your first order at Vuori! ➢https://www.eightsleep.com/powerproject to automatically save $150 off the Pod Pro at 8 Sleep! ➢https://marekhealth.com Use code POWERPROJECT10 for 10% off ALL LABS at Marek Health! Also check out the Power Project Panel: https://marekhealth.com/powerproject Use code POWERPROJECT for $101 off! ➢Piedmontese Beef: https://www.piedmontese.com/ Use Code POWER at checkout for 25% off your order plus FREE 2-Day Shipping on orders of $150 Follow Mark Bell's Power Project Podcast ➢ https://lnk.to/PowerProjectPodcast ➢ Insta: https://www.instagram.com/markbellspowerproject ➢ https://www.facebook.com/markbellspowerproject ➢ Twitter: https://twitter.com/mbpowerproject ➢ LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/powerproject/ ➢ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/markbellspowerproject ➢TikTok: http://bit.ly/pptiktok FOLLOW Mark Bell ➢ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/marksmellybell ➢https://www.tiktok.com/@marksmellybell ➢ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MarkBellSuperTraining ➢ Twitter: https://twitter.com/marksmellybell Follow Nsima Inyang ➢ https://www.breakthebar.com/learn-more ➢YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/NsimaInyang ➢Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nsimainyang/?hl=en ➢TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@nsimayinyang?lang=en Follow Andrew Zaragoza on all platforms ➢ https://direct.me/iamandrewz #PowerProject #Podcast #MarkBell #FitnessPodcast

I'm out here just doing this pop-tart dance. These legendary pop-tarts are so great. Power Project family, I hope you guys are doing well today. But I want to show you guys from Legendary Foods, we have the Tasty Pastry. Now, you know, these things are 20 grams of protein and 5 grams of net carbs. Sometimes you're dieting and you want to be able to have a good tasty snack that doesn't taste like cardboard. Well, this baby, it's not even warmed up. Imagine if you warm up this freaking tasty, in a microwave for like 20 seconds.

I got my coffee right here. Tasty pastry. I'm living life and you guys can too. Andrew, tell them about it. Absolutely. Yeah. So the other thing about this, so again, and see, we just mentioned 20 grams of carbs for a total of 180 calories for the whole thing. And the whole thing tastes amazing. If you guys haven't tried it, you need to right now. Head over to eatlegendary.com and at checkout, enter promo code POWERPROJECT to save 20% off your entire order. They have those tasty pastries.

They have all kinds of amazing flavored nut butters. They have almonds. They have all kinds of, and you cannot help but laugh when you say nut butters. Nut butters. So yeah, you guys need to head over there right now. Eatlegendary.com. Links to them down in the description as well as the podcast show notes i agree that whole deodorant thing is some real fuckery um anti-perspirant like why do why would we think that there's not like a price to pay with like prevent like let me just prevent

my body from sweating like that doesn't sound like a good idea yeah i mean for me i literally like the color white shirt was not it was never an option never ever and and then once someone told me one day like dude you just just try not to get antiperspirant and then i went to the grocery store and i was like like 90 of these are all antiperspirant like and i never even no one ever even told me this isn't news to your girlfriend who's sitting over there, right? Like she already knows you're gross. That's what I'm always thinking with my wife. I just look at her kind of disgusted. Like, how is she into me?

Like, I'm gross, but she's disgusting if she's in, like that makes it even worse. She's staying with us. It's her problem. Yeah, exactly. That's the way I look at her. Well, like our text threads, right? Like my wife, she knows my, like whatever unlock code, like she can have my can have my phone whenever but i'm also like all right you can look at whatever you want but like the thread between me marking and sooner like just yeah like just be careful and like trust

me you like fell in love with the right person i'm not somebody different i promise yeah you never know when you have a standard operating procedure about what happens when certain texts are read, that's fucking good. Things are probably heading in the wrong direction. But, I mean, you got to realize if Annie's with you, there's an equal reason or she's equally disgusting in a way. There has to be something about her, right? And the same with Stephanie and the same with my girl. I will not say anything about Zoe as she's equally disgusting in a way there has to be something about her right and the same with stephanie and the same with my girl i will not say anything about zoe as she's right there but i mean everyone's gross we're savages oh yeah 100 oh yeah and we believe what we want right like for 18 years girls didn't poop right like like when you were 19 is when you believed it it was

like santa claus well no maybe that took me a little too long to not remember that one my girl's proven that my girl's proven that wrong in so many ways she poops a lot all the time all the time door open yeah yeah we've gotten there i started it i was gonna say that's you though this is the thing i start the comfort thing so i will be the one to fart i poop. I think that we need to get rid of doors. Yeah. That's a great idea. These fucking barricades, you know? Public bathroom or not. Public bathroom or not, you know?

Insuma has pooped here at ST with the door open as I walked in. I have. It has happened. And it's just like, hey, how's it going? Yeah. I'm doing something that I do every day. I have to do it every day. But the thing is, it's tactical because it makes everyone Yeah. There he is. I'm doing something that I do every day. I have to do it every day. But the thing is, it's tactical because it makes everyone extremely comfortable with each other.

If you can see someone poop and not care, I mean, what else? Yeah. Then you're on to that next level, right? But you don't just stare, though. Right? You talk. You have conversations. Yeah, I don't know. So, Ryan, do you get into the whole hippie thing?

Do you go as far to try to to get rid of like parabens in your like soap? And like have you gone down that rabbit hole of getting weird deodorant and smelling like a hippie? I actually tried the salt stick, which is apparently what we're all supposed to use. It's just the regular salt stick. Have you guys ever seen this before? I've never even heard of this. Let's find this. So this is like the original way you're actually supposed to like use like anti kind of smelling

type of things for your armpits and stuff. And I have a lot of friends that do really, really well with it. But for some reason that just doesn't work for me. And then like, did we, I don't know if it was on the air or not, but basically for me it took me until I was like maybe 25, I'm 35 now where I was like, man, I just like, I, I, my armpits sweat no matter what, like all my shirts are fucked. Like you'd literally be like encrusted to the point where it's like, you know,

it's terrible. Like a 16-year-old boy's bath towel after he found out how to jerk off. The people will. Let's go. Break it in half. It looks like it went through the civil war people will go as far

to go to the doctor for their smelly armpits or whatever, their armpits making their clothes yellow and then they'll get like prescription they'll get like an RX for it it's probably a little bit like the shoe thing you know you get into the shoe thing the feet thing and it's like we put all

these cushions underneath our feet and maybe uh maybe one of the best things for us is to hardly have shoes at all yeah for sure and i mean i think that we're probably not really meant to really be having like all these beauty products on our body 100 i'm sure that we like have adaptations in our body just like we do with muscles and stuff like that. Our body's like, all right, well, we're going to get this. I'm just wearing a little bit of foundation today. It's not much. He thought you were in your 30s.

I know. That's because of the makeup. He's a beautiful man. Maybe it's Maybelline. I thought you were in your 20s. Holy shit. Dude, I will take that all day long. Apparently, men's makeup is actually going to be

the next frontier right now. That's what I'm hearing. Yeah. I don't know. HR to be like the next frontier right now. That's what I'm hearing. Yeah. I don't know. HRT is like the first part of male. Right. It's our breast implant. Yeah, not bad.

Yeah. You know? I'm down with that. I know some guys that are getting Botox. I'll need to like learn. I don't know what I'm doing brushing my teeth. We're going to be so late if we all start putting on makeup. Yeah.

Before we continue, have you tried this yet? I have not. I have been looking at it for a while.. Yeah. Before we continue, have you tried this yet? I have not. Oh, there you go. I have been looking at it for a while. What exactly is this? Mark, would you like to? We have some Kratom. This is my product, Mind Bullet, and this just puts you in a good mood.

Yeah. You won't be hot. I'm going to fire some up. I took the slow release. You may be a little hot. Even if we got hot, I'd be down. Oh, how was the slow release? Because I haven't taken it before sleep.

My dumb ass, I saw them, and I saw slow release, and I haven't taken it before sleep. My dumb ass. I saw them and I saw slow release and I thought they were chewables. They're not. So it tasted really like, tasted not as bad as what you just had. Yeah. But it was fine. Didn't taste good. Yeah. And then also before I forget, I don't know exactly when this is going to come out and

all that good stuff, but we're eventually at mindbullet.com. There's going to be a way to get like free samples of shit coming up very soon. So links in description. Just stay tuned to that shit. Just keep clicking till you see something tastes disgusting right it was kind of like a shot of tequila for sober people it was like no i'm so right on drink all right i got something for you how's your day now did i fuck you up it's like my day's worse now no i think i'm gonna be excited about this in a couple minutes. What's going on with this mustache? Is this a newer thing? I have a mustache?

Yeah, I think so. Do I? Wait, you didn't know you had a mustache? I mean, I thought it said facial hair. Well, maybe it's a little bit thicker. It's mainly just a mustache. Fuck. No, he has the other stuff, but the mustache just looks thicker than everything else.

Well, it's not connected. So it's a mustache. Oh, yeah. So I don't grow hair in that place. So it's a mustache oh yeah so i don't grow hair in that place so you have a mustache yeah fuck me okay no no no no because i know the feels it actually it looks good though the look isn't bad the look isn't bad because some guys they don't connect and it just you can tell like there's problems i didn't even i didn't notice you didn't connect you look good that way Like this guy and his girlfriend, they poop together with the door open. They don't wear deodorant.

He thinks he has a full beard. It works well, bro. It works well. Yeah, yeah. It's never really grown there. You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah.

That's weird. I could grow out hair on my neck really impressively that's my genetics just just the neck yeah just the neck i can grow out some really so you have like no pubic hair but a lot of hair on your balls yeah exactly you've been there before you've seen pictures it's horrible but like i could grow a pretty good mustache we saw the mustache a while back when i try to grow a beard it just grows mainly on my neck. I'm like, that's disgusting. It's amazing what happens when you have a mustache.

It has its own superpower. How so? Like when you go to the grocery store, like you just look around and things are different. You know what I mean? Like even the person at the register is like. Because everyone else is acting different. You know? And you get like a different set of women hit on you.

What are those set of women? I'm curious. They're not good ones. I had to take a pee. They think you're a perv automatically, right? Oh, yeah. And they're into it. They're into it.

You know what I mean? I think it's called OnlyFans now. Only mustaches. So if you have a mustache, then they know that you're called OnlyFans now. Only Mustaches. So if you have a mustache, then they know that you're on OnlyFans. Yeah, or they know that they can do something weird with you that they've been thinking about for a while. And you're like, that's the guy. That's the guy. That makes a lot of sense.

When I do see men with mustaches, or women, but when I see men with mustaches, I'm like, there's something odd going on. Typically, it's never normal. But that's weird yeah people with mustaches don't suck they don't suck yeah they're great people yeah immediately you already know you're gonna have a connection it's funny how like once you grow a mustache then you're thrown into that category if somebody's first time seeing a mustache it's like you gotta be my sash you had that shit forever you can't explain it you can't explain it to people like i only have this for like a month you know it's just a little phase i'm going through oh man need like my sash isn't temporarily inflamed at the moment you need like a fucking sweating right now bro you can Me too. You can take your shirt off. It's one of these kind of places. That's true.

We've done that once. Yeah, we have. We have. I'm surprised we haven't done it more than once. Actually, no, we've done it twice. Episode 500 and then the one with Nikki Rodriguez. Episode 1,000. I mean, you know.

Episode 1,000. Our shirt's coming off and we're smoking on air. I like it. I like it. Come for the comedy. Stay for the shirts off. There we go. I like it. I like it. Come for the comedy. Stay for the shirts off. There we go. I like that slogan.

Sounds catchy. I love how we've gotten. Whenever you guys want to take them off, I'll pop the top. There is so much to talk about with this dude. And we haven't gotten to any of it yet. All right. Well, I want to know why he's so jacked. Yeah, actually.

What's going on with that? Honestly, you know when people are jacked and you're just like, I just don't really feel all that jacked? I look at myself in the mirror. I'm like, you despicable man. You know what I mean? Like, put your mustache back on. When did the body dysmorphia start for you?

Honestly, I probably started working out when I was like 12. I was really lucky. I grew up in a little town in New Jersey called Tom's River. Oh, that's where I go on vacation. I'm going there in July. No way. Or August. In August, yeah.

Yeah, so I grew up there. I hang out on the Jersey Shore, believe it or not. That's my vacation. In August, yeah. Yeah, so I grew up there. I hang out on the Jersey Shore, believe it or not. That's my vacation. It doesn't make any sense, right? That's where people go with mustaches. That's right. They go to the creepy places. Tom's River has an amazing baseball team, right? Oh, yeah. Tom's River High School East Little League

World Champions. Yeah. I went to school with the Little League World Champion guys. There you go. Yeah. Oh, shit. I'm that old. Wow. old wow but yeah i mean i grew up in new jersey and um i was lucky enough to when i was like 12 or 13 i went into the gym uh my friend's parents own the gym so i got to go when i was like 12 and everyone else got going like 16 and i remember going into the gym and i remember seeing this guy his name was pavle and And he would, like, I would go in and I would see him doing, like, power cleans sometimes. It's a bodybuilding gym. There's no platform, just none of that stuff.

And I'd see him, like, doing the power clean, which I thought just looked insane at the time. And then I saw him do, like, box jumps with dumbbells in his hands and, like, all these crazy things. And he was the first person I saw who, like, kind of had arms like Mark right now. Like, his veins were popping out. Like everybody else just looked normal. And then this guy just looked like a, you know, like, man, like he was like made in like a lab type of thing. Maybe he was. Actually, he did fail his drug test later on when I get to this. But anyway, come to find out he was on the Olympic bobsled team. And, you know, he would go there and train

for like the summer or whatever it was and he'd go back to utah or new york uh and um in olympic training centers and he would train for the olympics and i remember like going over to him and just talking to him as a young kid and i was just like hey man like you think you can like help me um and he was always so nice and it was kind of like my first introduction to like lifting and understanding different things it took me a while to like really get straightened out you You know, when you're younger, the only thing that matters is bicep curls and bench press. I mean, I've took it as far as to like figure out

that decline bench was stronger than all my other benches. So I would just decline bench every single day. Oh, that's wonderful. You know what I mean? Like the things you learned back then. Yep, keep hyping up those strengths, right? Yeah, but I mean, you're so young, it doesn't even matter.

Like you could, you know, you jerk off and your forearm gets bigger. This is true. It doesn't matter what you're doing you could, you know, you jerk off and your forearm gets bigger. This is true. It doesn't matter what you're doing. You can come over to me and be like, you know, you're doing everything wrong. And I'd be like, well, motherfucker, the mirror says no. So, yeah, that was kind of like my first kind of start to, like, understanding, like, I want to get bigger and, like, seeing other people that I was, like, admiring and stuff like that. Yeah.

We just went from, like, so many jokes to so serious. It really changed, didn't it? Well, did you also play sports or? Yeah. So like a full life story there. We got like from there. I actually, you know, what's really crazy is I wound up moving to Utah later on. And I trained on the Olympic bobsled and skeleton team for five years.

Five. How old were you? At that time, I just graduated college in 2010. Dude, what the fuck is skeleton? Skeleton's head first down the bobsled track. No, come on. That's not a real thing. Yes.

I mean, that was kind of how I started. A lot of people don't realize like right after school, when I graduated high school, my first thing I did was I went to, I moved to Hawaii and I was a helicopter pilot. That was my first thing that I did. And then when I was in school, I met this kid named Eric, and he was an All-American for West Point. And he was also an All-American in high school. I was a football player. And I saw him in my dorm, and he was the second person I'd ever seen who looked like a lab person.

Like, he just looked insane. And he was like, hey, man, you want to go to the gym with me? And I was like, I do, but like not with you. Like you look like, you know, you're like my goal. So like being around you just makes me feel insecure. So I don't know. Either way, he's just like, oh, man, just come. You know, we started working out together.

And come to find out, I was just naturally super, super strong. And like I was within six months of training with him, an All-American, I was as strong as he was. And then, you know, because he's a football player, we pulled out the timing eyes and all the different things. And I was running a four, four 40. I mean, I was just like a crazy freak athlete without even, without ever really knowing any of those things. And then, uh, and like with laser too, I mean, I was actually really, really fast. Yeah. Yeah. And then, uh, You have to be to make a bobsled team. Yeah, you also have to be big.

So that was like part of my story here at some point. But like after, you know, all this training with him, he was like, you really should play on the football team. And I was like, I don't know if I want to play on the football team. Like I'm like, you know, I want to go in the military to fly and all this stuff. And then I wound up just like one day, I see a flyer from the Verizon phone company. And I'm living in Hawaii at the time. And it says it says like hey we're looking for athletes for the Olympics and all this stuff and it said skeleton and bobsled and I thought about that guy Pavle from when I was like 12 and I was like oh how cool would that be yeah you know so I went and did this testing it was

like back squat a power clean like you know running through the timing eyes all that stuff um it was like an underhand ball toss a bunch of like crazy like little combine stuff and i got like third in the nation on it damn and they're like you should come to utah and like see if you like this whole sledding thing you know what i mean we'll chuck you down the track see if you die or whatever and then you know i went down and i went there and i told all my friends when i came back hey guys like i'm gonna go train for the olympics and they're like what i mean these are all friends that i was like smoking weed with every day like you know they're like in what yeah you know what i mean like they didn't understand like you're gonna go from hawaii to utah you're not gonna like that and then

secondly like that's not you is it and i was like i mean like in my mind i was always like a super dedicated person like when i was younger i begged my mom to be in the military academy i was like mom i just like want to be fucking insane. You know what I mean? Like I just like, I like love the regimented style. Like a military school. Yeah. I wanted to go to military school so bad.

Do you like rules in that way? Because like I would hate that. So why do you like that? That's my question. I love things that nobody else wants to do. And then as soon as they don't want to do it, like I'm like getting off on it. Like I'm just like, I love that you don else wants to do. And then as soon as they don't want to do it, like I'm like getting off on it. Like,

I'm just like, I love that you don't want to do it. And I, it makes me want to do it that much more. You're psychotic. It's awesome. That's great. One of the things I really like about Mark was like,

I remember like, I loved the documentary, you know, that your brother made. And it was like, I remember when you were like, you should be as strong as possible. And he was like,

no excuse to be as strong as possible. And it was like, I know you have a different mindset you should be as strong as possible. And he's like, no excuse to be as strong as possible. And it was like, I know you have a different mindset now probably in, but probably not like, you know, like you should have the best business ever. And like, there's no, no excuse not to. And then whatever you're doing now, you should be the best at it possible. And there's no excuse not to. And I just love that because like, like, I don't really know you that well, but I'm assuming that you still have that mindset and like anybody else that wants to come in and challenge

it. You're like, wait till you see what I do next and i love that i just think it's such a fucking savage mindset and i just feel like that's like what we're we're lacking you know what i mean like you know the next thing is going to be male fucking makeup and meanwhile like i want to eat people you know what i mean like i already know that i'm going to be more successful than you let's talk about that for a second who would you eat because i think and i think in the same amount like he might not taste that good because he's too lean like you gotta go you gotta find somebody you

need some fatty meat but he is natural so you don't get the hormones right like with me i wouldn't my meat like i think it would be tough you'd be rancid and yeah the fat would be like all like coagulated in there and stuff like it wouldn't be good i just feel like anyone who's like soft like wants to bring you down like any kind of negative vibe they would taste good you know what i'm saying i just like i would like to eat them because i know that they're a pussy you know what i'm saying so like they would be in the organic grass-fed section of the grocery store but um i okay so so you like to do real quick you like to do things that other people are like no fuck that i don't want to do is that other people are like, no, fuck that. I don't want to do it.

Is that the main reason? Or because the military school thing, did you actually like that specifically? Like, did you like that? Or was the reason you like it because other people didn't? And generally, is that kind of what goes off in your mind too? I think it's interesting. And this might be the first time I've ever actually thought of it this way. But like when I grew up, I grew up in a house of five brothers and sisters and I like, I was

always the, I was the youngest and then my brothers and sisters were like always way older than me. And they had a lot more going on. And like my one brother, you know, I mean, they were all pretty bad kids. And like, as a young kid, you look up to your brothers and sisters. But for me, it was like, I want to do the exact opposite of what they're doing. I didn't like what they were doing. And I wasn't even really smart enough to understand that what they were doing wasn't good. But I just knew it wasn't for me. And I remember when I was very, very young, I got my first bicycle.

And I used to ride my bike, what would be equivalent to a 30-minute car ride away from my house. And I'd get a flat tire and hit up my mom and be like, hey'm like in this town I've got a flat tire she's like what the fuck like you're 12 like how would you ride your bike that far and it was just like to me it was like you know I don't know I would get on my bike and I just feel like you know like I just never really wanted to be home my mom will hate to hear that mom I'm so sorry I don't mean it that way but it's like you know I just like I always like just I would tell my mom like all the time when I was younger I was like mom I'm gonna do something so cool I don't even know what it is but it's gonna be fucking awesome like all the time and my mom because of that my mom like always let me like it didn't matter how insane my dreams were she

always supported them but I feel like my other brothers and sisters if they had a dream like that she probably wouldn't support it like to me my, my mom is all time. Like she's the best. Um, and then on top of that, you know, I didn't actually meet my dad for the first time until I was 24. Found out who he was when I was 18, met him when I was 24. And then when I met him,

it's insane because, you know, I grew up with these five brothers and sisters that were so much different than I were. I was, I like, I liked sports. They didn't. I wanted to be regimented. They weren't. Everything I was looking for in life was the complete opposite. And then when I met this guy when I was 24, we were the exact human being to a T. We grew up playing the same sports. We both wound up owning our own business. We both moved away from home

at the same age. All of the things that you could ever line up were like exactly the same. And I had never met him or even knew about him for like my entire life. So like, I feel like, you know, and we all have like these genetic traits of things that we really want to follow. And I feel like they're like deep in there. And I always tell people all the time too, because everyone's like, you know, like in the entrepreneur space, especially for you, I'm sure you have a lot of people that are like, hey, Mark, how'd you find your niche? Like, how did all this work? And it's like, well, fuck, it was there the whole time. I just didn't know it was there. It was like this one, I kept wanting it to be this other thing, but it was this the whole time. You know what I mean? Like for you, like you wanted to be the strongest person on earth, but like you probably liked training more than you wanted to be the strongest person on earth, but like you probably liked training more than you wanted to be the strongest person on earth. You probably liked being in the gym with like camaraderie and all that stuff. And like you created,

I liked other sports. Yeah. And you created products around it. I liked other sports. And then lifting was just always sitting there. It was just like, Hey, like come back,

you know, that this is the right spot, you know, and did that happen like three or four different times. And then finally it was like, all right, well, I'll just be full-time power lifter yeah and i just accepted it yeah i kind of felt like in some weird way that it chose me in some way uh-huh and i really feel like a lot of people right now they're struggling and it's like what you really love to do is right it's staring right

at you and you just don't you just don't know how to apply it yet did how did things go with the bobsled team because you said you did that for five years. Did you go to the Olympics? So I was on the Olympic training team for the whole five years. The year of the Olympics, I actually like tore my hamstring. So we have three sleds that go. That's what I was thinking right away. A hammy. How much does a sled weigh? Like 500 pounds or something, right? Yeah, the sled weighs a lot. So like for me, I was always a smaller guy. I'm only five foot5", but at the time I weighed like 170 pounds. So I did skeleton for like the first three years, which is by yourself headfirst.

And I always wanted to be a bobsledder. That sounds so scary. I was just never, I was never big enough for bobsled. But as I get more and more into training, as I first start on the team, I kept getting bigger and bigger and bigger. And eventually I went from 170 to like 185. And then as I go down the track,

like the coaches would always look at your body and like if your body's jiggling, like your butt's jiggling, like everything's like kind of moving around, they can kind of see that you're really relaxed, that's a good driver. So I would come off the top, one of the fastest starts in the world,

and then I would lose it all down the track just because like I wasn't like a good driver. You know didn't have great aerodynamics and i remember like there was a point where the coach was like dude it doesn't really matter how fast you get on that start you can have the fastest one in the world but like you're just not super aerodynamic and nothing jiggles on you so he's like you're built like spongebob squarepants literally right so he's like why don't you try doing bobsleigh you just gotta put on like, you got to get up to 200 pounds though. And I was like, fuck me, 200 pounds, bro. It was pretty big.

It was so big, you know, and I actually got up to 208 pounds. And how I did at the time actually was I went to, I would go to Whole Foods and right before they would close, I'd go in like five minutes before they close every day and I'd ask for a full pizza and I'd ask for like a discount. I'm like, hey, can I get a discount on the pizza? And they'd sell me a whole pizza for five bucks. Wait, did they hate you because you got there right before they closed it? No, I had this like really cool guy

who every time he was like, it was a Jamaican dude. And like every time he'd be like, hey, you want the pizza? And I'm like, yeah. And like every night I'd just crush a pizza and then eventually I got big enough. Like I had no cardio obviously, but I could just sprint like a motherfucker. And on a four man bobsled team,

I was the second person. So you have the driver and then you have the second guy and then the last two. And essentially they put each person in depending on like, you know, how powerful you are. So my like zero to 15 meters

was like 1.9 seconds, which was like super, super fast. And then I still was good at the 30 and the 60 meter mark for our timing splits. But not as fast as the other guys. So like the brakeman actually is like the fastest guy for like a, probably like a hundred meter sprinter.

Yeah. Like I met the Jamaican bobsled team, like from like the movie Cool Runnings. Like I met those guys and all that stuff. Oh, those specific dudes? Not the specific ones, but like the guys who train like for that and everything. It was like really super cool. Like. That's sick.

It was like my childhood dreams were just like unfolding so many times. I got to see the guy Pavle, I got to see the Jamaican Baza team and I loved the movie Cool Runnings. And I just got to be in like this really cool just community of people that is just like

a once in a lifetime thing. Yeah. It definitely put my life on hold for a little bit. Those four or five years of training was like something that I mean,

I was a machine at the time like all i cared about was training and eating and sleeping and recovering and all that stuff and like you got paid well for this because i'm hell no yeah i was wondering about that yeah we got made no money that's why i got the five dollar pizza yeah yeah i didn't have any money and like you know i had to try to look for sponsorships and all these things it It's tough. Anybody who's an Olympian in America in a sport that's not super popular, if you're not like Sean White or Michael Phelps or these people who are like, it's a sport that people really want to watch in the Olympics. People like watching bobsled in the Olympics,

but they don't give a fuck about it for four years. So you just don't make any money. I think the top-tier guys make like $800 a month. But in Europe, they give you like hundred thousand dollar contracts you get a you get an audi or a bmw like whatever you know i'm just trying to think like how you'd even like draw attention to that sport like people have a helmet on you can't really see them there's a bunch of people in the sled there's like six people in a bobsled or something right four of four people yeah so four people, yeah. So it's like, you know, the NBA or NFL, they do a really good job of like focusing in on some of the marquee players

and then they just hype those guys up. And you hear so much about Tom Brady and Patrick Mahomes and stuff like that and it gets people fired up to watch. But in that case, plus there's no understanding of it, right? Like no one knows what the fuck's going on. You're just watching people go down a hill, I guess. Yeah. Did you adapt to the cold? Like, or did you not really care just because of your mindset? You're just like, I just want to do the best and I'll be good at this. So fuck it. I'll just go do it. I mean, living in the cold was not my favorite. Um,

but then like, actually, I don't think a lot of people realize this, the suits that people are wearing when they're doing bobsled, it's a a swimsuit like it's the same swimsuit that like michael phelps wears when he breaks records it's like just it's literally made by speedo and it's literally what you wear when you go in the pool so it doesn't help with the fucking temperature you're literally naked yeah so like you know what i mean like it's what about shrinkage oh dude so i mean i mean a lot of us actually at the time i don't know if I'm allowed to say this but it's been a while

now we would all take like Viagra because it was a you know basal dilator and especially like at elevation is it a band substance

I don't think it was no it wasn't at the time I think if you misused it it was frowned upon but you know so you guys would

have some serious wood while you're pushing the sling it was a sword fight up there. But, I mean, no. I mean, obviously, you still got to be attracted or something like that for that shit to work. But, like, either way, I just thought that was a funny joke. But, I mean, that was the reality.

A lot of us were doing that and kind of helping with the push and all that stuff. Wow. Explain to us a little bit, because we get on this topic a lot, and it's part of the fitness culture, this whole natty or not thing. Just explain to us how freaky some of the people are that you ran into, that you encountered. Now, all you know is what you do and what you don't do, but you can't really speak for anybody else on what they do and don't do. But I'd imagine being part of the Olympics,

you've probably seen some just shit that you just can't even explain right yeah i mean i think your rotors documentary is really good where it's like you know there's a lot of people doing it and they don't talk about it or you know you have a family to support or whatever like what are you gonna do and stuff like that and um i remember i mean fuck dude like you're so bored you're like in these mountain towns and like it's just you and a bunch of bros and your Olympic training center. And, like, there's, like, after you train and you eat, like, there's, like, nothing else to do. Like, people are literally just researching, like, ways you can cheat.

You know, like, what can I do to cheat? Like, if I take that, how long is it going to last in my system for and all this stuff? You know, for me, I always was, like, I never really wanted to do anything in that realm because, like, my mom meant so much to me. And my mom was always like, Ryan, I don't ever want you to do those things. And so to me, it was really hard to do that and take the risk and like really let her down. So like I was always like really, really hesitant. But I had tons of friends who did all sorts of stuff. I mean, I watched a lot of people fail things.

When you're in the events, like the world championship style events, like you see the guys from Europe, they're fucking massive. Like they're so big and like just so powerful, like for how big they are. These guys are jumping up doing backflips, you know, and like they're just so – a lot of them were like going to be in some sort of professional sport, like whether it's the NFL or like some other sport in Europe or whatever, and then they just just like they don't make it in that sport and but they can run really fast and they can run straight they don't need to cut or anything and they're good to go

but all these guys whether they're doing stuff or not doing stuff they're mutants right like you probably run into people that are you know hopping up onto a table like this off of one foot and doing it fucking backwards and they were gonna do that whether they did it or not. You know what I mean? Like, it didn't really even matter. I mean, a lot of these guys just wanted to take it to the next level. You know what I mean? I almost feel like a lot of people who do that stuff,

it's like, it's such a small... I mean, we all have friends that do that stuff, and you watch them do it, and they expect all this craziness to happen, and it doesn't. It's like, if you're a pussy, you're just going to be more of a pussy, kind of, but you're going to recover faster. But if you're a pussy, you're just going to be more of a pussy kind of, but you're going to recover faster. But if you're a savage, you're probably going to be like 10% more savage.

What would be your guess? Like from what you've seen in Blobsled and I guess from what you know, do you think it's a majority of people? Because some people think that in the Olympics or whatever sport, that a majority of people, especially power type sports like gymnastics, lifting, et cetera, they think a majority of people are on something. Would you say it's a majority or would you say it's a minority from your purview? I'd almost say it's like 50-50 maybe.

50-50? I would say it's like probably 50-50. Okay. I mean anything that's like – I would say like anything that's really like not detectable type of stuff. Like a lot of people would do like growth hormone or something like that just because you got to get like a blood test essentially. It's wild to me's really like not detectable type of stuff. Like a lot of people would do like growth hormone or something like that just because you got to get like a blood test essentially. It's wild to me that that's not detectable. I don't know the science of it, but growth hormone?

Yeah. Like I don't know. Yeah, there's some things that are like harder to detect and isn't taking stuff and they are beating people that are taking stuff. And on top of that, everyone in that pool has outstanding genetics. So you look at some of these football players and some of the people in the Olympics. You look at like Michael Phelps. But like who is another guy that's winning? Even if Michael Phelps was to fail a drug test and it's clear that he uses performance enhancing drugs or whoever it might be that's in question, there's still somebody somewhere. So what I think is interesting is we use the natty or not thing

so often. And especially you're seeing a lot of people point the figure at Liver King. And I think it's really easy just to say, hey, he's doing stuff. But the reason why they say he's doing stuff or why they say others are doing stuff, just so it's like a get out of jail free card for themselves. So they don't have to put in the same amount of work because I'll never look like that. If I did that, if I switched over to that, then everybody better look out. Yeah, I mean, there's a lot. I like the way Louie Simmons looked at it

where he would say, you know, people who are doing stuff are training way harder than people who don't. I mean, I agree with that to some extent. Like, I mean, if you're doing it, it's probably because you're super, super dedicated. And then, you know, we have friends who do stuff who don't really look all that much different. Or, you know what I mean?

It's like, I mean, I've never really frowned on anyone for any of that stuff. Like, especially like my, my time in CrossFit, a lot of people, you know, are always like accusing everybody for doing drugs. And for me, it was always like, I mean, have at it, bro. There's so many different things to do. Like you need to be good at running. You'd be good at swimming. You need to be good at Olympic lifting.

You need to be, you know, all these different things. So like, go ahead and go get as strong as possible you go ahead and do that and then I'll fucking run right past you a little bit later you know what I mean like and then even if they made it you know legal I still feel like it wouldn't change things that much um I think it would in terms of recovery and all that stuff and people be a lot stronger yeah but like as a full well-rounded athlete i still think like a totally natural dude could totally win just like if they made it a really fair competition in terms of like every every like true mastery of this of the sport and i think they already do yeah that's my point is like somebody's natural like

there's somebody that's like not you know like you can just run down a list of of who you think is great and not everybody is always on stuff. It just might seem like they are because what they do is out of this world. What they do is unreal. And I'm a believer that there's a lot of people that are getting ahead without. And just like there's a lot of people that are getting ahead with. For myself, at a young age, I think I was around 20 years old, I was able to get to about 205, 210 pounds or so,

and I was around 8% body fat. And that was at 20 without the training knowledge that I have now. I don't know where I could have pushed it to. Could I have gained another 10 pounds? Could I have gained another 20 pounds over 10 years, 20 years? I probably could have gained at least 10 pounds, right?

But that would kind of put me in that, you know, very questionable space. In your time in CrossFit, did you, or in your time of any of this stuff, because I'd imagine being part of the Olympic team and the CrossFit events that you participated in, I'm sure you've been tested before. Did you ever fail any tests? I have failed a test, but it wasn't actually like a failed test. It wasn't what they said. No, no, no.

Honestly, I mean, dude, I'll tell you guys anything. I don't give a fuck. Anybody who knows me is like, yeah, Ryan's raw. So like for me, like in my entire life, like I, you know, when I was younger, I used to go to GNC and get so excited to buy all the pro hormones and stuff like that. Like things that were borderline. I used to love like stuff like that. That's to buy all the pro hormones and stuff like that, like things that were borderline. I used to love stuff like that. That's the best.

The shit that's in the back. Like the T-bomb. You remember all these weird things? It's in the little plastic thing up front. It's in the glass case. How is it all 50 or whatever? It was like one of the Gaspari brands. I've taken that stuff.

Gaspari. Throughout injuries of my athletic pro career, during various different sports where I was competing at a very high level, I had to take growth hormone before. And it was, to my knowledge, I was going to recover faster and get back from the injury faster. It was never my intention to do it in terms of, like, I'm going to use this to get a competitive edge. And then even if I did, it would be like I would run out of money

by the time I recovered from my injury, and I couldn't even use it anymore at that point. Expensive as fuck. But to this day, I still have never taken any like true steroids. Now that I'm 35, I get my levels tested right now for testosterone every year. And I'm like strongly considering it. I've even told my girlfriend Zoe's over there. I'm like, I might do it.

Like, I'm not really sure. Hey, man, good for you. My levels are a little bit lower than like i'd like like what are they they're 350 really yeah would you consider that super low or you know i'm actually kind of lower range yeah you are uh you're a high level entrepreneur you we're going to talk about your businesses and stuff but it seems like you work a lot do you get a lot of sleep do you like are you even in all those things i don't think this guy gets a lot of sleep do you like are you even in all those things i don't think this guy gets a lot of sleep i wonder i think this guy's got to be careful with a cup of coffee i

think i'm a six to seven hour guy okay yeah i have my eights here and there as well yeah i would and i would ask like have you tested your test like a long time ago like i think last year i was like 400 this year i was 350 and then the year before that like like think last year I was like 400. This year I was 350. And then the year before that like two years ago I was like probably 400 again. So I think I've always naturally had kind of

like on the lower side. But you feel good, right? Or do you not feel like I do? So that's the, I always ask my friends who take it now, I'm like, dude,

like what would I feel like at a thousand? You know what I mean? Like, you know, is it that much different? And some of my friends are like, dude, totally. And some of my other friends

are like, I kind of wish I didn't do it. Really? Because like a lot of them, you know, in California, you know, once you take much different? And some of my friends are like, dude, totally. And some of my other friends are like, I kind of wish I didn't do it. Really? Because like a lot of them, you know, in California, you know, once you take it, I feel like a lot of these older guys, they're just on forever, pretty much. It's like just TRT forever.

So that's the one thing about it for me that's kind of like deters me a little bit. I'm like, I just don't want to take it forever. So that's the one, I love to travel. I don't want to like deal with having it and all that stuff. So that's like one of the things. It's funny because everybody on social media, they look at me and they think like for sure this guy takes something. Of course.

And I'm like, I don't know. I'm like, I look good, but I'm nothing crazy. You know what I mean? So like I don't ever really go out of my way on social media to ever say that I'm natural or any of that stuff because I just don't feel like even arguing about it. But your fitness level too. It's like you look great, but your fitness level, especially like we're, I wanted us to talk about the CrossFit stuff, but you do a lot of things at a very high level. And that's when people are like, oh, he's just too good. Right. So actually after bobsled, how long did it take you to get into CrossFit? And then what was that change for

you? Cause it's not like you were doing all those types of things that they have. You get good at a CrossFit before it, right? Yeah. So, I mean, so I moved to Utah. I started training on the team. And then when the Olympic stuff was all over, my goal was to just go back into the military and kind of go be a pilot and stuff. But at this point in time, I'm like, shoot, man, like I'm an athlete. Like, fuck, I'm like, you know, I love working out and I like the camaraderie of the guys and all that stuff I was like I can always be a pilot why don't I go into the military and do something

really fucking cool like I like the the regiment and all that stuff that we were talking about and like I want to eat people right so like I'm like I'm gonna go be a fucking seal why not yeah so I trained really really hard I like I swam a lot I like my training changed a ton and then all my friends were like you should go do CrossFit and I was like what's that you know and then like basically I you know went and checked it out

and I went and did like my first class and I remember just being like wow this is super cool and then the owner of the gym came over and he's like you know the time you just got on that workout is pretty impressive and i'm like what's impressive and he's like he like points to like a leaderboard like they have it all written in the gym and like i had like i got like the best like the best time in the gym like ever and then i was i was like oh like how good is that

and he's like well the person up there that you just beat is me basically and i was like, oh, how good is that? And he's like, well, the person up there that you just beat is me, basically. And I was like, oh, okay. And then he's like, I just got second place at the world championships this year. And I was like, oh, okay. And then he's like, you need to stay here and train. And I was like, I don't know. I kind of want to go in the military and all this stuff. And they told me how much it was.

It was so expensive to me as a young kid. And I just was like, fuck, I can't afford this. How old were you, by the way? Man, 2010. So so yeah or 23 2000 my first crossfit regional was 2011 so yeah 2010 so whatever i am now 35 minus the years we're in yeah 2021 2022 um so yeah then i that's how I got originally into it. And he's like, dude, I won't even charge you. You just come and train with me. I just need a training partner.

And we'll just work out together and we'll just make it rain. So then we just did it. And then I got really good really fast. And I remember it was kind of funny. I was like, I got so good so fast. And I just was like so bad at certain things that I just didn't really have the time. Yeah. But the things that I was good at, I was so good at.

And I remember like beating like Rich Froning's times on workouts and all these things. And I would like, I wasn't real big on social media or anything, but I would just post on Facebook. I just got this time on a workout and people just be like, fuck. And then it would just kind of like lead from one thing to another, like CrossFit was like, Hey, we have a new dark horse, like, you know, living in Utah and like all this stuff. And then eventually, like I would just go to events and, and, and do really well. It was interesting. Like every time

I'd go to a regional event, I would like do so well in like all these events. And then like one thing I would just get like last on. Cause I was just like, didn't have the skillset. It's like handstand shit or what was it? Yeah. Like the first one actually was a handstand and then the next year after that was a hang clean. It was weird. I'd never done a hang clean in my training. We always just did regular power cleans

and the thumb grip thing got me. And then just stupid stuff like that, right? The year after that was when I threatened to kill a judge. We can get to that if you want. So essentially all this was going on, and I'm like i'm i'm like i'm putting everything on hold i want to i want to i want to win this crossfit games thing and then it's funny from there i wound up moving to san diego california i like

got a job at a crossfit gym off of craigslist um and then i worked there for a little bit and then i quit my job because i didn't like working at the gym the lady told me i was going to be able to make the workouts and do all this stuff. CrossFit Invictus is down that way, and that's pretty prominent. And I used to go work out there actually once in a while. And essentially, at this point, when I quit my job, that was when the true Ryan Fisher started to get built.

So for me, I quit my job. I had about five grand saved. And after about four months, I had lost all my money and I had nothing. You guys are going to love this part of the story. So when I get here, I'm just like messaging everyone. I'm trying to get jobs and all these things are going on. And the gym that I'm working out at, it's the guys who own it is Brian Borstein and Anders Varner. And Anders Varner know you've probably met him before he's the he's like on barbell shrugged so they invite me into their gym to like come work out basically i told him i don't have any money and all these things this is like two months prior so i've been working out there for about two months when i run out of

all my money i tell everyone i have to go back to new jersey i'm gonna drive home like you know i'm gonna go back to school or something i just like I have nothing meanwhile no one at the gym knew that I had no money and then I was like broke as fuck and to be completely honest a lot of people know this about my social media like I would go to the grocery store and steal like food like I had nothing it was like it was really really bad for like most of the time like the last two months like I mean I just was like I would like cry myself to sleep just was like I'm such a badass athlete I have nothing to show for it like I mean I just was like I would like cry myself to sleep just was like I'm such a badass athlete I have nothing to show for it like I hate what's going on right now in my life it's such a shitty shitty deal um and then when I told everyone I was leaving Anders got some girl in the

gym to like basically let me sleep on her couch for like you know until I got my life together and I wound up sleeping on this girl's couch for four months which is way longer than I wanted to obviously and dude for four months I slept in this girl than I wanted to, obviously. And dude, for four months, I slept in this girl's couch or like an inflatable mattress on the floor. I didn't know who she was. Like literally, I would forget her name sometimes. Like I literally just no clue. She just out of the goodness of her heart helped me. And at this time, dude, like I'm still stealing food. All these different things happen. A lot of people don't know. I actually wound up getting arrested trying to steal presents for some of my friends for like holidays and stuff like that. I got like

1500 hours community service. A lot of different things were just kind of going wrong. And throughout this time of being on the couch, you know, I wind up like putting myself into some online competition to go to one of the big CrossFit competitions. It was called the OC Throwdown in Orange County, which is where I live now. And I remember like doing these events online and I would do them barefoot because I didn't, I only had one pair of shoes and I didn't want to ruin them. So like every time I'd work out, I'd just go barefoot. And you know, in all the videos that I would have to submit, everyone would see this barefoot guy doing all these workouts and he just looked like insane, right? I was always like really jacked,

like especially from Bob's side, I was 210 and then now I'm like 180, 185, just shredded out of my mind. I don't have any money for food, so I'm not eating anything. So like I'm fucking shredded, you know? Everyone thinks I'm a freak show. And then I've actually,

I make it to this competition called the OC Throwdown. And I go and literally when I get there, freak show um and then i've actually i make it to this competition called the oc throwdown and i go and literally when i get there it's all of the athletes that i'm watching on youtube like i'm like starstruck i'm like holy fuck i can't believe i'm here and i didn't want to ruin it and i got i got second place in this event beat people who were like on the podium with the crossfit games and all this stuff and everyone's like holy fuck this guy's for real um and then i would i mean i would literally just post shit all the time. I just beat everybody in the world in this workout.

Like, I just did this. I just did that. All these different things. And I'm like, and I'm doing all this thing. I'm doing all this while all you motherfuckers are doing cryo and you have all these sponsors and you're eating all this food. Like, I'm eating fucking cockroaches and I'm sleeping on an air mattress. I'm sleeping like three hours a night

i'm stressed the fuck out i have no fucking shoes i don't have anything um i literally the only thing i have is the passion in my heart and i'm just gonna fucking destroy you with it and like when i was in the warm-up area i would look at people and just look straight through them be like i just want everyone in your family to die like just like the only thing that matters is me winning this competition. And I think a lot of people misunderstood that because by the time 2013 happened, that was when I was in the best shape of my life. And I went to the CrossFit regionals and I was going to go to the games that year. That was like my shining moment where I really wanted to, you know, finally everything was going to work out for me. You know what I mean? Like

finally everything was going to come together. And I think I've always been such a passionate dude where it's like, I almost let my passion like get the best of me. Cause like, I remember they were judging me and they were like, no rep, no rep, no rep on this, on this event that I was for sure going to win. It was my favorite event of the comp. Let's, uh, can you pull this up? How would he search for it? You can just go to YouTube and type in Ryan Fisher, no rep.

There you go. And then, um, I remember just telling the judge like dude I'm gonna fucking kill you and it was like a two minute workout you know like emotions are high you know energy's high and stakes are high right like if I don't go to the games then it's like a whole other year of training

and like you know I keep putting my life on hold I want to be a pilot I want to do this I want to do all these things and I'm putting it all on hold just to you know be a pilot. I want to do this. I want to do all these things. And I'm putting it all on hold just to, you know, be able to do well in this competition. And actually, you'll be able to see me here in this video just, like, freaking out. Like, so mad because I was going to win. Jesus, your fucking legs. It looked like you were already kind of yelling at him there. Yeah.

So if you actually watch, like, I'm not doing anything wrong. You're locking out those deadlifts. My arm's never been or anything. And you'll see a point where the guy judging, he's not even looking at me. Like he's actually, he'll start looking at the other guy and no repping me. Yeah, like right now he didn't even look at that last one. Wait, so this is just deadlifts that you're supposed to do? Yeah, so it's 21 reps.

So it's 21, 15, 9 of 315 deadlifts and box jumps. And I'm doing like you know 27 25 like way more reps than everybody else and because of it it's just like so like right here you can see me getting really upset and to me you guys are hearing my story now like i'm i don't have anything i'm getting arrested like and all these things and that's what I see in my mind in this moment. I'm like, dude, my whole life is for this event right here and you guys are taking it from me. And did I react incorrectly?

Yeah, I think I probably went a little overboard. I feel like my actions, like I still feel like I was in the right in terms of what was going on, like judgment wise. But my reactions were obviously just really bad but at the same time you know that next day they pulled me aside and they videoed this whole fucking thing and there's some footage of that too yeah and it's like dave castro just being like you know he basically like humiliates me in front of everyone it's like really really, really bad. And I don't think he understood in that moment,

like how much all this stuff meant to me. Yeah. And to take it one step further, it's like, I go to open a gym a year after this that literally revolves around the sport that hates me. Like you can't like love, you know, it's almost like, you know, a girl, like you cheat on your girlfriend or whatever and she still loves you or, like, whatever. Like, everything just comes together.

Like, for me, it was like I wasn't trying to do anything, like, really, truly bad. Like, I just, like, I was so passionate about what I was doing to the point where even as much as I hated what happened there and it felt like to me like my whole life was was ruined I still opened a gym for the sport that still kind of hated me and to me it was because like that's what I'm passionate about and I think a lot of people now back then it was like oh that's like Johnny McEnroe of CrossFit you know he's a fucking maniac but now it's kind of like dude I remember like that guy like he's just like yeah he's like all in on everything like if he's if he's in he's in you know what I mean like if he's gonna like, yeah, he's like all in on everything. Like if he's, if he's in, he's in, you know what I mean? Like if he's going to make programming that I'm going to follow it, like, because that's how I am about it. Um, and when I look back now, I think that that was

probably like step one that was needed for me to start refocusing my energy at a different thing, which now is business. And I look back and I'm like, fuck, you know, like if I had went to the CrossFit games, I probably would have kept competing. I would have kept beating my body up. I would have loved every second of it, but I know I would not have, I would not have what I have today in terms of like a business and a career and all that stuff. And deep down inside for me,

I wanted all of that accomplishment as a prerequisite to tell people that you can listen to me and believe me. For me, it was like, it would be like Mark being like, I can't own the slingshot brand without having squatted a thousand pounds. But like, he doesn't need to squat a thousand pounds. He could have probably squatted 800 and still had slingshot and it'd still be pretty fucking awesome. So, but for me, it was like, I really thought I needed i needed it i genuinely was like this is the only way people are going to listen to me um but i didn't need it you know and i look back now and it's just like i'm happy the way things turned out like in certain aspects i wish i would have maybe put my sights on business a little bit sooner but man i appreciate so much more like

what i have now and like everything everything that happened is just like it's so much sweeter you know what i mean yeah are you uh frustrated in some way to be known in crossfit kind of as a guy that uh you know blew up at a ref instead of like being known more as an athlete i saw some back and forth between uh matt frazier and i can't remember josh bridges josh bridges i never actually saw that but i heard that they actually spoke well about me is what I heard. Yeah, neither guy said anything directly negative, but they're like,

all I know of him is like that no rep thing. Yeah. That's all they know. Honestly, I'll take any publicity. Right. You know what I mean? If it's bad, if it's good, whatever. It's like, at least they remember me.

But I mean, obviously, some people might say that that's like a shitty way to look at it, but it's like, you know, if I'm not going to win the CrossFit Games, I'm going to go down as the motherfucker who tried real hard. You know what I mean? And I'm cool with that rather than getting like fourth. You probably also have one of the most successful businesses of anyone in CrossFit, even though

you didn't win the games. Yeah. Which I think is cool too. And, um, you know, it's just funny now to look back and it's like of all of the hits that you can take people say like oh i started this from zero and i did this and i did that and it's like dude i really started from zero and then you can go to zero and you can just go ahead and subtract like another 50 like i was below like i started a gym when everybody hated me i started you know i i stole things i lost everything i like i mean i way down. Yeah. You can't make me unhappy.

It's impossible, dude. Like I wake up and I'm like, this is fucking sick every day. I love it so much. And anybody who knows me, like I always try to tell people like my one, my one thing for everyone in life in general, like if I had to give you just advice on anything, like people are always like, oh, what's your one thing you tell like all younger people or this or that? I'm like, just be fucking unforgettable.

Bring so much energy into the room that you're such a contagious fucking force like you are the covid of fucking energy you know what i mean and people are just like like i would i would genuinely be upset if i left here and people like oh how was ryan fisher guy he's like oh he was cool like i want you to be like dude he was fucking fucking dope yeah and that's my goal is just be like just be like, you know, opportunities will never be limited in your life if people like you. Did you ever apologize to that ref or did you ever feel there was anything necessary to apologize about? Actually, he apologized to me. Reverse.

I actually opened my gym and he asked to come to the first anniversary party. Yeah. And he came and apologized. So it probably felt pretty good. It was pretty cool. Yeah. And he even said, you know, like, it really wasn't like my call kind of. It was kind of like it was a weird thing where it was like, you know, the head judge told me to kind of say no and blah, blah, blah.

And I did that. And I'm not calling it like a conspiracy by any means. And like you should listen to the head judge. But he was just like, you know, like I didn't really I didn't feel great about it. Yeah. OK. I actually am just curious, though, the explanation for why those reps were wrong. Because when you watch it, they look like full reps of a deadlift.

Why were they wrong in that instance? They say that I'm bouncing it. Oh, bouncing the weight off the ground, perhaps? Yeah. So, interestingly enough. But it's bumper plates. Yeah. Interestingly enough, we had never used competition plates in a competition until this year.

So we're all used to having rubber plates, which really do bounce a lot. That's fair. That's a fair assessment. The weird thing, though, is if you watch everybody else in my heat, I swear to God, I'm like one of the least bouncy type of guys here. And in my own defense, I have have at this point in time i am the strongest crossfitter in the world pound for pound like i had a 650 pound deadlift at this point and everybody else maybe max had 500 pound deadlift yeah yeah that to me was like a toy so

i'm just trying to go fast and to be honest the 30 pound box jump to me is like a two-story motherfucking building so i'm just trying to get that shit done so I can go do the box jumps. Yeah. How did you manage to like, you know, at this point you weren't making much money and then a year later you open a gym. How did that work?

Like what did you do to be able to do that? Yeah. So I actually was training a client who just basically seemed like just another client. You never really know who you're talking to. And, you know, he had created, he basically made the operating software for MySpace. He was worth a lot of money. And he would always ask me, you know, what do you want to do with your life and stuff? And I was like, man, like, I just like want to be in fitness. He's like, what do you

think about opening a gym? And I'm like, hmm, way too many around. I was like, but if I did, I'd want it to be like a million dollar gym where you came in and you're like, fuck, this is nice. I'm like, I don't understand

why all these CrossFit gyms always look like shit and they always like start in someone's garage and eventually go to like another bigger piece of shit looking thing. I'm like, but then there's like, you know,

there's Barry's Bootcamp and they all look really nice and then there's boot camp and they all look really nice and then there's orange theory and they all look really nice like i didn't know shit about business but i was like you know what i mean like why would i start a gym with two rowers and two bikes and two barbells and all this stuff and eventually you know wait to get enough people where i need three and where i need four and where i need five i was like i would start with 10 of everything and then i would have all the nicest shit, and then people would come.

It didn't really seem that hard to me. I was like, dude, if you give me a million dollars, I will give it back to you. So we opened a gym. I didn't even wind up needing a million dollars. I needed like 350 grand maybe, and I think I paid them back in two years. The crazy thing was, I think most people thought it was successful

if you had 100 members after one year. I opened the doors with 100 members on day one and then by the end of the first year I had 300 members and I knew nothing about business so Instagram was like getting bigger and I remember just being like I would just take photos of everything I'd be like hey guys I just bought 30 grand worth of plates I just bought this just bought that and I this was fucked up but I would hashtag every gym in town. So if you're on Instagram, you type in like, you know, CrossFit name of the town, then like all of a sudden my shit would pop up and they'd be like, Oh, there's a gym in town popping up. That's like way nicer than mine. And people would be like, dude, it's kind of fucked up that you're,

you're tagging the gym. I'm like, well, it's kind of fucked up that you give your members a piece of shit equipment. Um, so i just always had like that mentality of like if i'm gonna do this i'm gonna do it right um and then you know it it became this really popular thing and i everything changed for me when some girl walked in one day and she's like your workouts are amazing like i travel for work i go to different gyms. I've been to a hundred different gyms just this year. Um, and I've been to your gym like three times. And every time I'm so excited to come to your gym, I love the way you guys, I love the way you make workouts. I think you should put them online. And I was like, I don't really see the point of putting

them online because at the time, every CrossFit gym, you could just go to their website and the gym was on there for free. But I was so busy. When I first opened my gym, a lot of people don't know this, I coached every class every day. We had 10 classes. I coached 5, 6, 7, like 8, 15, 9, 15, a noon, 4, 5, 6, 7, and like 8 p.m. I coached all these classes. And I did it every day for like a month. And then on the weekends, I would go to the park and i would clean up trash for 15 hours for my

community service i did this for three years you can't like i mean the amount of work ethic that i built during that time is just straight madness um and it was just like i mean me coaching all the classes lasted for about two or three months but But then the nonstop of cleaning up garbage and, you know, working 16, 17 hours a day every single day lasted for three years. And, yeah, like that was just like it was just a really, really, really tough time. I forget where I was going with that. But that was like kind of like the work ethic part of the gym in the beginning. Andrew, see if you can bring up that shot of Castro. And then you can maybe walk us through kind of – just let the audio play.

And then we'll have him tell us what happened afterwards. Because this is pretty interesting. CrossFit doesn't fuck around, so we'll hopefully be okay. Make a bunch of noise over time. Yeah, so they don't know that it's copyrighted. pretty interesting. CrossFit doesn't fuck around so, well, hopefully we'll be okay. Make a bunch of noise over top of it. Yeah, so they don't know that it's copyrighted. I actually haven't seen this in years. I hate watching it.

Yesterday, this guy told the judge I would fucking kill you. Stop hollering at that shit, man. You have one chance to stay in the top picture. Where are the judges? Judges, bring it in! You can see in my eyes, I'm just like, do you have no clue what my fucking life is about right now, bro? And you see all the other athletes are like, yeah, he's getting like,

he's getting it. Yeah. I'm still just like, dude, I watched the video. It's fine. Hey, you can cut it. Did you apologize? Sound like you just had more stuff to say to him there yeah I was like I'm sorry for saying I'll fucking kill you

that was literally what I said that's what he wanted me to say basically and then it was just like dude I watched the video several times and it's totally fine and then Castro's like no we're not talking about the video and it's just like dude that seems very unnecessary but they posted that on the CrossFit website and that was when –

But that's the way CrossFit has been kind of run. Yeah. It's been run that way from the beginning and they – What way? Like what do you mean? They'll just be pretty forceful. They'll kind of like run people out. Right.

They have kind of an aggressive tactic. I mean I kind of – in some ways I got to admit I kind of agree with what he did there. Like let's not have anybody fucking threaten anybody you know i actually would have just probably asked you to leave i'd been like you're done from the competition yeah you come back another day maybe but i can't have anybody do that i mean i mean i agree to be completely fair during the moment i actually didn't even know i said that to this day i don't remember saying any of that i just remember just being like in the moment and just like working out and just being like i don't even know what the fuck to be honest i don't even know I said that. To this day, I don't remember saying any of that. I just remember just being in the moment and just working out and just being like, I don't even know what the fuck. To be honest, I don't even know

what I actually said. I think if you've slowed down the video and watched my lips, I don't really know. Have you ever killed anybody? No. That'd be a tough one to admit. Be like, actually, well... I don't know. I think it was kind of like... I don't know. It was like a real... Like when you get in trouble in elementary

school and the teacher's like, no, you need to go apologize to whoever, like, and whoever, let's make this really awkward, go over here and say a very, like, meaningful apology. Right, right, right. Like, we all know that, like,

you were going to be pissed off. Speaking to you in private. And we're adults. That's what I mean. Like, he didn't have to film this. He didn't have to get all the, like, your fucking peers around you to be like, hey, we're all going to, like, you you know whip this guy's ass a little bit real quick you know let's all like

take part in this i think that was kind of bullshit in my opinion a lot of people wanted me to sue for like defamation of character and like all this stuff especially because i was about to open i was just about to open my gym like within like six months after this or whatever and it was like my mom was crying she's like oh my god everybody's gonna hate you like no one's gonna go to the gym and like you should sue because like all this stuff and it's like oh mom i just don't even want to deal with it it's like i think i'm like people will forget you know yeah obviously no one ever did we're still here um but but yeah i mean you came out winning honestly yeah for sure you've won so yeah like if we go back to you, pre video here, it was like that girl came

in and told me to start that programming. And I was giving you the backstory on basically how much I was working and how hard I was working. I was only doing that for $4,000 a month. That was my, that's my salary. Um, and that was what I agreed to pay myself and everything else would go towards paying the gym back. And it was interesting because the first day that I launched my online program, I literally made $4,000. And I was like, fuck, this is cool. I just like doubled my paycheck. And it was like it's something that was probably going to keep coming because it's an online subscription.

Is that different from the app you have right now or is that the app that you currently have? It's the same app, yeah. Same app. And then I would just like create more programs for online because in the gym was was only like one two programs i was really going on like i have a conditioning class and then the crossfit class and then i just put on a lot more stuff like we talked a little bit before the show where it's like you know your your training changes as you get older just because like shit changes in your life like you get older and like you know you maybe certain things just don't feel as good anymore or all these it's not that like you believe in things differently it's just that like you have to work around

you know whatever you have to deal with yeah um so i've i've created styles of training now that you know make me a very sought after coach like for me right now my most popular program which was literally it made me extremely nervous to even launch because i was doing muscle-ups i would still do the open with my gym the crossfit open and i was doing muscle-ups. I would still do the open with my gym, the CrossFit open. And I was doing muscle-ups one day and I snapped my bicep tendon. Doing a muscle-up, literally my bicep just shot into my shoulder and I was just, it was a horrible feeling. And then I was always kind of scared to come back and do CrossFit. So I literally was like, all right, well, you know, as soon as it goes, gets better,

I'm going to do bodybuilding and just going to do that for a little bit. Cause I'm probably going to need to do that to build my strength back up and everything. And then I started to realize, I was like, well, all right, well, you know, I can't really do like a proper shoulder day or a proper arm day or any of these things. So like, I'm going to try to like, maybe like look into something else. Um, so I looked into like full body training and I was like, all right, well, you know, because you get to do one exercise per body part each day, like it really makes training a lot, a lot more fun. Cause then I get to just work around it like pretty easily. Uh, like if something bothers my arm, I just won't do arms that day, but I still have like, you know, chest and back and legs and all these different things.

So I started looking into like a lot of different avenues in, in training and like, you know, how many sets can you be doing per muscle group, you know, per week and all these different things and all these like just all these different styles of training. And I started to bring in the full view of everything I've ever learned and kind of because I'd spent so much time in a gym, I was like, what do people like and what are people lacking? It's like, what's the real thing that people need that they don't really necessarily want to do themselves because it's boring or it's this or it's that. Uh, and then what are they realistically going to do on their own anyway? Cause like no one really follows the a hundred percent. This is what you should do plan. Um, and it's like, it's like coffee. It's like, everyone knows you probably just drink regular

coffee, but we're going to add all this other shit in there because it tastes good. Right. And it's the same thing with training. It's like, you really should do this, but all this other stuff's really fun. Um, so I created something called the Full Body Aesthetics Program. And I abide by, you know, a certain amount of sets per muscle group per week, depending on your ability level and all that. But I only have like one or two movements each week that are progressive. And we measure them every single week. And then all the other movements, I call them accessory movements.

And they're like constantly varied, which goes by the kind of the CrossFit protocol. And in my mind, I think people, because they have more variation, they put out a better RIR or RPE because it's more exciting. And, you know, because of that, they wind up potentially putting a little bit more effort into the lifts.

So when you put more effort into the lifts, you get better results. And then because you have some progressive overload, you actually can track some progress. So I always say, you know, stop guessing, start progressing, stop exercising, start training. All these different things to give people like a little ring in their mind of what's important. What are some examples of the progressive movements that you have them, like those two movements? What are some examples of like how some of those would look in different training programs?

So each day I have a priority movement. So like let's just say Monday would be like a leg progressive movement yes um and it could be sometimes it could be like a leg and a chest and the next day would be like a back and a bicep or something like that it depends if i pick one or two movements to progress but each day would have that one main movement and then we would actually have all those accessory movements and is it classic like you know some people have that big compound movement as the progressive movement is it something like that it's usually a compound movement as the progressive movement? Is it something like that? It's usually a big compound for most

of the part. Fuck, in this video right here you just did five different movements I think, right? Six. Six, fuck. So then you might advocate that somebody goes through that maybe a couple of times. So it's just like regular bodybuilding. It'd be like three or four sets

and it depends how many days a week we do it. So I have three day per week programs, four days, five day week programs. And then I do custom, like one-on-one coaching stuff where people call in and I, I create, you know, custom stuff. Um, but on the app right now we're, we're on a four day per week cycle. So when it's four days per week, I up the sets so that everyone's getting a certain amount of sets in per week per muscle group so there is full body programs where you have emphasis

points for the day and then the way that I do mine is you literally do one exercise per body part per day per session so you will literally do one thing for chest back, arms, legs so arms being biceps and triceps and then at the end of each session every other day

like one day is at is abs the next day is calves so abs and calves i alternate but then every other day during the training session you do one exercise per body part and what i found was anyone who's ever getting nagging little injuries super easy to work around yes um also anyone who gets like bored with a traditional bro split, super fun way to switch things up. And you get to have those varying accessory movements. You don't really get bored following the same movements that are progressive. There's only like one or two of them.

And then here's the really cool part. So because of CrossFit and my background with all that stuff and being in the gym for thousands and thousands of hours i had one day that it started off as like 100 reps of each movement so you would still have your seven six or seven movements okay and you would do like 100 reps and you have about seven minutes to do it okay so i call them density sets so every week you'd have those same movements and your goal was to do either a few more reps with the same weight or go a little bit heavier and get a few less reps but overall more volume. So I started having these like we call them density Saturdays or density Fridays.

Depends how many days are in the training session. So now we have the full body template and then on one day of the week we always have the density day. And density days everyone gets super hyped. So sometimes they're just like AMRAPs. It's's like a seven minute am wrap of a certain amount of of a certain lift you just do that lift with 30 of your max um for as many reps as possible in seven minutes or it's 100 reps and you have to pick a weight that's 30 to 40 of your max and i do stuff like that now on those days you kind of have like an interval day you're getting a full body training session which is basically the concept of CrossFit is just, it's a full body session. Um, minus like

the super, super high intensity. And then I mix in like the RPEs and all these different variables, but dude, the program fucking made people insane. And for me, it was one of the, it was one of the most terrifying things in my business career because I was known as the CrossFit guy and I was known for making like very very well thought out training programs for CrossFit and like interval training yeah I always kind of shied away from the true CrossFit like uh training style and that's why a lot of people sought me out because I would stay away from like tons of handstand push-up tons of overhead squats tons of snatches and cleans and all these different things and i would kind of focus more on like squats deadlifts and presses and we would do some power cleans kind of interrupt for just a second was it uh was that mainly because those are attributes that are more for the competitive athletes and it's like not fun to

do in your gym if you're not a competitive athlete. That plus I took personal responsibility of what you looked like when you walked outside my gym. Personally, for me, it was a really big deal for you to leave my gym and people to be like, bro, you look great. Like, where do you work out? And then you would say chalk. And to me, that was everything. And I remember watching classes where I'm like, dude, I really want everyone to snatch. I want people to like snatching as much as I do. And the reality is not a lot of people are going to be in that position probably anytime soon.

And then if they are doing that and it's the only hour of the day they have to train, I just gave them like, you know, we basically just fucked around and did like some practice. So I want them to have like really quick body composition changes and be like aesthetically looking like a savage. But I can't do that if I'm doing a lot of high skill stuff yeah so i would take that out and i think that's why a lot of people come to my gym and they love the program so much because it was stuff you could do you didn't have to like sit there and learn it and when i started to realize that like only one percent of someone's gym is really going to have people who want to go to the crossfit games and stuff like that and i understand you might want to snatch but if you want to snatch that bad, you're probably the person that will stay after and do it anyway. So if that one hour of the day

is like the most important part of your day, and that's the only time that I have with you to make you look as good as possible, I'm going to take away all that stuff. And that's what I used to do. So I would tell people, they'd be like, well, what's your program like compared to Invictus or compared to whoever?

I would say, well, a lot of them are really focused on performance. And while I am focused on performance by having this high intensity interval stuff in here, my main focus is aesthetics. So if you want to look better and also move well, that's me. If you want to perform better and, and all that, then yeah, you go to these other guys. And I was fine with it. Um, a lot of people came to me and it was, it was great. Like a lot of people came to me and it was great. Like a lot of people found me. But then after I got injured,

even all that stuff was like kind of scary to me. And I was kind of burned out on it because I had done it for such a long time. And I was kind of nervous to talk about the bodybuilding stuff because like I look good, but I don't look like a bodybuilder. Like I would never tell someone like, you know, you should do my bodybuilding program like in a gym full of bodybuilders. Like I would, you know, I'm not going to go't look like a bodybuilder. Like I would never, I would never tell someone like, you know, you should do my bodybuilding program, like in a gym full of bodybuilders.

Like I would, you know, I'm not going to go to like the dragon's lair in Las Vegas and tell people about my amazing bodybuilding program when there's like some fucking Mr. Olympia right next to me. Like it makes you a little bit insecure. So to talk about it to me was, it was hard, but then all these athletes are like, dude, I've been doing the full body aesthetics program and it's fucking insane. Like I feel so much better. Um better um this is this is such a great way to train like i'm all i'm all in and i've been asking recently like in emails and in my facebook groups and stuff like hey you know i have seven programs i write every day still to this day i'm the only person that's ever written any programs for my training and i'm like how many of you guys are following like

which program and i'm like like 50 60 of you guys are following like which program? And I'm like, like 50, 60% of just people following the full body aesthetics program now. And I like, you know, officially like made that kind of switch and been like known for that. And it's, it's crazy. Like it's, it was a really scary time for me because I was like, if I go into this, it could be something that kind of people don't like. It's going to be a, it's a, it's a scary jump, you know, cause I'm,

I'm known for this and now I'm doing this and it's, you know, people really like it and I'm, I'm happy with it. Yeah. I've had all these times in my life where there's like these like really big, scary jumps. Um,

and I'm just happy everything's been working out so far. Pat Proctor family. How's it going? Hope you're enjoying the episode. And this episode is brought to you by Merrick health, the premium telehealth clinic from Derek, from more plates, more family. How's it going? Hope you're enjoying the episode. And this episode is brought to you by Merrick Health, the premium telehealth clinic from Derek from More Plates, More Dates. Now, if you've been wanting to get your blood work done or you wanted to get your blood work analyzed by a physician, Merrick has your back on that. And you can tell them how to do that. Yeah, absolutely. So if you guys know exactly what labs you want to get, you guys can load them all up into your cart and check out enter promo code POWERPROJECT10 to save 10% off all labs. But if you're like me and you're not sure exactly where to start, you guys can get the Power Project panel. You guys can head over to MerrickHealth.com slash Power Project and you guys will see a whole panel of like over 26 different labs, everything from head to toe that you're going to need to know what's going on under the hood. And again, to get in on that, head over to MerrickHealth.com slash Power Project and that checkout enter promo code Power Project to save $101 off of that entire panel. Links to them and all the information down in the description as well as the podcast show notes.

In the gym, we were talking about the idea of people being scared to start something as you were just talking about. And you were talking to me about a cool thing that people should be adding. Because whenever people ask me, how should I start jujitsu? Or I'm too big to start jujitsu. I need to build mobility before. I'm just like, just start. You'll figure things out as you go.

But there's an aspect of it that you were mentioning that's actually pretty fucking cool that people can take into their minds. Yeah, so like in business, and I'm sure you get a lot of stuff for this, everyone always says, like even Gary Vee, all these people on social, all these people on social media now, like you just have to start. Just start, just start, just start. And, you know, as someone who's scared to start, no one ever tells you why you should start.

And I think that there's a missing piece that is very, very important. And it's like, if I had ever started something when I thought it was perfect, I probably would never start anything. And that's why people tell you to just start. But also, when you start something, when it is perfect, it's still not perfect. It's perfect in your eyes. So whether you start it when you think it's not ready, or whether you start it when it actually is ready in your mind, they're both equally shitty moments.

So you have to start it so you can figure out what's wrong to make it best. Does that make sense? So it's like the best things I'd ever created, literally, I didn't really like them nearly as much as everybody else. And then I would change them and make them better, in my opinion, and they like the other version better. So it's like, there really is no perfect starting point. So I think it's interesting when people say you should just start. And it's like, if you're someone right now, you're listening to this and you're like, man, I really, I really wanted to start, you know, my, my mind bullet company, or I really wanted to start, you know, a slingshot company or whatever it is, or an online training program, but you don't think you were just quite there yet. You're never really going

to be quite there because when you launch it, like that's when all the things fucking hit the fan. And it doesn't really matter at the, at the starting point when it is because the perfect never really happens it's just a start you know you just started and then you're going to get feedback from people and uh hopefully from that feedback then it will help mold into a product right yeah i just think it's always amazing when you think it's great that's that's when everybody hates it and it's it's the other version that was so much better. Yeah. Is that like, for example, the full body aesthetics program is by putting that out and then realizing that people couldn't necessarily be doing all the snatches and stuff. Is it after you put it out that you realize that? Or did you have an understanding that like some of this shit's just too complex for most people to do?

And I need to do something like this. Dude, I just looked at data. I'm like, I'm so amazed that people don't look at more data. You guys are very data-driven individuals. But in the 70s, there was this guy named Pat O'Shea. He invented interval weight training, IWTs. I didn't know that. Right?

So all of a sudden, we have Greg Glassman, and we have Jim Jones. You guys know Jim Jones? Mark Twight? Yeah. Is Jim Jones the machine guy? The guy that made some of the machines? No, it's Arthur Jones. You guys know Jim Jones? Mark Twight? Is Jim Jones the machine guy? The guy that made some of the machines? No, it's Arthur Jones. Jim Jones is G-Y-M Jim, like the Jim Jones,

and he's in Utah. That's the name of his gym, Jim Jones. He actually became famous when he trained everyone for the movie 300. Oh, right. I did? Okay. Yeah, so he and Greg Glassman at the same time started these interval training programs.

And they both broke off and made their own training certifications. So CrossFit Level 1 and then there's the Jim Jones certifications. They kind of butted heads and kind of created their own little community separately. So this is Jim Jones. That's actually Brian McDonald. Who's one of the top

trainers. But regardless, these companies came up, they blew up, and basically the ideology was interval weight training, which everyone thinks that all of this is from Greg Glassman, but this whole interval weight training thing started with Pat O'Shea in the 70s. And essentially what it was, this is how fucking crossfit was supposed to be and it got out of hand just like most things so essentially it was supposed to be like a lift like a five rep back squat or a three rep power clean done with like great form and control and everything and then you would hop on your cardio machine for a given period of time and those would be the intervals that's why it was iWT, interval weight training.

So you would do, for instance, a workout is three pieces. So let's just say you would do your power, your strength, and then your accessory. That's typically how it would go. And then there would be segments in your training where you would have endurance focus or power focus or whatever you want it to be, and I'll explain that in a second. So a typical workout would look like this.

Three power cleans, two minutes on the rower at 90% effort for max meters. And then you'd rest two minutes and you would do three cycles of that. So you have your power, you have your cardio. You'd rest five minutes. Part two would be now your strength movement. So you'd have like five back squats

and then double unders for two minutes or assault bike, like maybe 30 calories on the assault bike at like 90% effort. And you would repeat that for three rounds. And then maybe you'd have a ladder of like 10 to one pull-ups and handstand push-ups. So like 10, 10, nine, nine, eight, eight, blah, blah, blah. And like, that's the training session.

This is, and then you would also have days where, you know, you do a squat and then it'd be like four rounds of a Tabata, like 20 on 10 off. If you're looking for more of something like that, that kind kind of realm and that was the kind of training that they started to realize that these like compound lifts mixed with cardio people were getting stronger and they were getting leaner and it was like that kind of stuff but then with Greg Glassman when he was training his his personal training clients he was trying to get more training clients in in a

shorter window so he started making AMRAPs and started making things a little bit more intense. And then he started to realize people were getting really great results because they're getting a lot of work in in a short period of time. And then it kind of created like what we have now. But essentially, the safer way to do it was the old school IWT. So for me, I'm like, I take that stuff with the CrossFit stuff, with the, what I like to call the 80% of what people should do and give them the 20% of what they want to do. Now, it might not be the smartest thing to do the density days that I, that I have on the session, right? Those are pretty tough days. But taking that mentality of a person who likes that type of stuff, you're going to put more effort into it like no one ever talks about the fucking x factor in training yeah there's volume there's intensity there's this there's that and then there's x factor which is like i have to like this shit you know what i'm saying yeah if you don't like it doesn't matter who your coach is it doesn't matter what the training program comes from but you know it's the factor that a lot of people don't talk about if you don't like it you're gonna fuck off right you're not gonna you're not gonna do half of it or after a

while you'll just fall off and you won't you're not you're going to fuck off, right? You're not going to do half of it or after a while you'll just fall off and you're not participating in it enough to get the results. Yeah. And honestly, I think everyone should change training programs every maybe like a year. I don't know. Whether it's you're following someone's training program and you follow like a different program that they have or you just follow someone else's program in general. follow like a different program that they have, or you just follow someone else's program in general. I used to tell people when they'd come to my gym, I'd be like, you know, after like a year, they'd be like, um, they would say something about the gym. And I'm like, you're welcome to go try another gym. You should, you actually, you should, cause I'll see you back in a couple of days.

You'll realize how much better this place is. Um, and then people don't really know what they, what they're really missing until they try something new. Yeah. So like, I always think that's great is to just go try something else and either come back to it or you know whether it's a training program or your gym but like you know I always think it's interesting when people

they get bored of training and they don't try new stuff. They just keep thinking that this is the only way and that's it. I don't even know if I've ever done the same workout twice

ever in my life. Oh I love that. I think every time I go to the gym there's a different order there's a different weight there's a different rep there's a different Even when you're at different weight. There's a different rep. There's a different –

Even when you're at Westside? Always, yeah. Just always, yeah, switch stuff. I mean sometimes even before like a particular like max effort squat workout, I might have done eight sets of ham raises or something before it. And then especially at Westside, he's constantly changing. I think CrossFit utilized some of those Louise methods and stuff too. The conjugate stuff.

Yeah. With the conjugate stuff, changing the heavier lift often. So I've, even when I was younger, even, even when I, all I knew was kind of like progressive overload type stuff. Uh, I just didn't have the attention to, to do like the five by five and then to increase, you know, 17 pounds the next week and shit like that. Well, dude, I tell, I tell it like this all the time. It's like, if you are in California and you want to go to New York and you get in your car and you drive East,

you're going to get there, right? It might take you longer, but you will get there. However, there is one road that is faster. And if you take the road, you're going to get there faster. So, I mean, like, it's up to you. I'm not saying that you can't get results with varying intensities and modalities and different things. Like, you can. It's just going to take longer. And we all have different genetic makeup, so it might take you longer in that aspect as well than it takes someone else. It's like all three of us at this table are going to, you know, put on muscle and recover at different rates.

However, most likely there is a better route for you. And it's really up to you. And I like to tell people right now, because social media is so fucked, where it's like people are doing so many crazy things just to get attention. And it's like, that person has earned the right to do some dumb shit

because they did a lot of stuff right for a long time. And now it doesn't really matter what they do because they're in something called maintenance mode. Do you know what I'm saying? Like, right now, if all of us want to stay exactly the way we look, we can go roll dice to have movements on it for all we care, right? We can roll some dice and be like, hey, we're doing fucking

backflips and back squats today. And, like, we're all going to look pretty much the same. But you haven't earned the right... I tell people, you need to earn the right to maintain. I'm going to be dead if we do backflips. I'm going to land right on my head. I can't do a backflip either. I'll go earned the right. I tell people you need to earn the right to maintain. Yeah. I'm going to be dead if we do backflips. I'm going to land right on my head. I can't do a backflip either. I'll do a Jimmy House.

But I tell people that's an earned thing. Like to be able to do dumb shit and all that is like an earned thing. And a lot of people come into CrossFit and they've already been a prior athlete. Like I was bobsled or like someone else was a baseball player or a football player or whatever. And they come into CrossFit and they look like a savage. And then they wind up eating less food and doing more intensity workouts and they get super lean. People don't realize that they're not building that body from scratch doing CrossFit.

So because of that, you know, a lot of people think that, you know, they need to do all these insane workouts to get to a certain point. And it's like, you really could do some boring shit for a little bit. And then, you know, when you want to just go off the handles and have fun, you're ready to just have fun, then yeah, we can do all this other stuff. I think people are really underestimating the power of maintenance. But exactly like you're saying, the density days in your program are days where people can inject that fun. Because like, I look at my training in the past, my training was extremely regimented because I'm like, I'm gaining muscle. I'm getting ready for a show. I'm getting ready for a powerlifting meet. But now my training's

just like stuff that allows me to explore different levels of movement and try to get, I'm trying to be able to do like wild calisthenic type shit. Right. And a lot of my trainings kind of around it's, it's, it's fun. Right. But if my goal were to just gain muscle as fast as possible, I'd be much more regimented in terms of exactly what I'm doing all the time. But I've reached a point where it's kind of enjoyable. I want to have fun and explore different things there now. But I'm curious for you, you're not competing in anything right now. Is your training still, because it seems like you do like regimented type stuff. So is your training still that way? So a lot of times I, well, right now I'm following something pretty strict. And then a lot of times I will veer off. Like when I start traveling, like if you guys like,

Hey, you want to do this workout with me? Like I'll say yes. You know what I mean? I got, do I care that much if I have a little bit less body fat like next month or whatever? Like not necessarily. Yeah. If I got to a point where I didn't like the way i looked i would be 100 locked in um recently i started mountain bike racing so i do some mountain bike racing stuff um a lot of people don't know like i'll i'll randomly go out for like 100 mile bike rides on my road bike um how long does it take uh that's like five and a half to six hours depends on what you climb um unfortunately i can't run like i'd love to go run with mark and do a marathon but it's just not in the cards for me

I don't know if you guys know my left knee is bone on bone holy shit would that happen through CrossFit or a mixture of like snowboard accident and then the CrossFit stuff as well yeah so like on my right my left leg doesn't even go past 90 degrees

so one thing you'll actually see in a lot of my programs and a lot of the videos on me on social media, you'll see me like literally back rack lunge like 400 pounds, but I can't do like a body weight air squat. I can't like mentally squat down evenly. And I also can't go below parallel. So that was another one of the reasons why I had to stop doing CrossFit

because I couldn't get any reps for like a wall ball or a squat or any of that stuff. So, you know, step one to becoming an entrepreneur was, you know, that whole incident. And then step two was my body kind of broke down. So between all of that, it really pushed me into that entrepreneur category. But then also I'm thankful for the shitty scenario with CrossFit. and then I'm equally thankful for all the things that broke on my body because it helped me create these programs that I have now that are so successful. So I think it's all fucking gravy. You know, it's all good. So I'm trying to tell you, it's hard to give me a bad day.

Yeah. I got a speeding ticket on the way here, by the way. I heard. How fast were you going? 87. Oh. And 65. Yep, that's going to be a? 87. Oh. And 65. Yep, that's going to be a good one.

Yeah. Have you discovered anything on the nutrition side? As far as you're saying you want people to snatch and stuff, and then you're like, wait, with this full body stuff, people are getting a lot more success with it. Was there something where you were like, I think everyone should be zero carb or low carb, and then it's like, well, shit, actually, they're getting a lot of success on this carb cycling thing. Yeah, the carb cycling thing is really big for me. And I think it's just more of a lifestyle thing.

Like it's for me, like when I actually did CrossFit and I looked insane, like the most aesthetically pleasing that I looked and my performance was crazy was I was literally only eating three pounds of ground beef every day, 80% ground beef. I'd wake up, I'd have a pound. I would train for a few hours. I would, you know, have lunch, have a pound. And then at night I'd have another pound. It was so funny because I was a carnivore dude before anyone even said the word carnivore. That diet does mean that you're broke. Dude, for sure. 80% ground beef. 80% ground beef.

If I could get even fattier, I'd get ground lamb sometimes and all that stuff. So that was what I was doing every single day. And a lot of people thought I was nuts, but I was like, dude, I feel good. And no carbs. And then now I have a lot more carbs in my diet. I'm a lot more flexible in my diet and all that stuff. But it's interesting because you, you just have these like set everything in your life as a belief. The only reason we develop as human beings is because we, we break beliefs like all of it,

right? Like, I mean, if, if you think fat makes you fat, like the way you eat is going to be changed forever. If you think, you know, heavy squats give you a big booty, then you're always going to be doing heavy squats. If you don't, you know, you know, if you think making $10,000 a month is, you know, the most amount of money possible and you meet someone who makes a million dollars a month, that is like always going to be your belief. But as soon as you meet people who break these beliefs, like I always tell people, my favorite people in my circle are like belief breakers. Anyone who believes something that I don't necessarily believe to be true is one of my people that I envy the most. And I want to be around them more because I want to figure out

how to break that belief. Like, I don't want to believe in anything. I want to believe in like, just the, the things that literally just take you to the next level, whatever it is. Um, and I think that's, that's one of those things too. It's like, if I can just let myself accept different things, because at that time I was like could you carve there's no way like if i have carbs i'm gonna look like shit like uh and then like you know now i have all these different carbs and i'm fine um and then you know you you start to just you you everything that i create now is basically created off of all of the data in my mind of like what people want and what people need and that is like how i will always create everything from now on.

I call myself like the people's champ of fitness and nutrition. Um, you, you, uh, mentioned, uh, in the gym that,

you know, Alex Hermosi. So how is that having him in your circle? Because he's an entrepreneur and he's putting out a lot of great information. And I know people are, uh, you know, following him and paying attention to what he's got going on. He's the ultimate belief breaker. Um, he, I think he had like 6,000 followers when I first met him.

I sent him a DM and I said, Hey bro, do you want to, um, get on a podcast together? And he's like, yeah, sure. And I was like, I'm pretty spontaneous. I could, wherever you're at, I could be there tomorrow. And he's like, yeah, I. And I was like, I'm pretty spontaneous. I could, wherever you're at, I could be there tomorrow. And he's like, yeah, I live in Texas. And yeah, if you want to come tomorrow, do it. And I literally like three hours later, sent him a picture of my plane ticket. And I was like, I'll be there tomorrow.

And he's like, wow, you weren't kidding. I was like, nope. Showed up to his house. He gave me his address to his house, which was kind of weird because I'm used to like going to a studio or something. Going to someone's home just seems a little bit intrusive, but showed up.

And we just hung out for like 20 minutes and we were supposed to do the podcast that day. And he's like, do you want to work out? We like work out in his garage. And, you know, we start working out. Didn't even do the podcast that day. Was planning on going home that day. And he's like, so you want to hang out tomorrow? And I was like, yeah.

And then that turned into like me being there for like three days. And we wound up eventually doing the podcast. We wound up becoming really close friends ever since then we've been hanging out. But he's probably the first person who just like shattered beliefs for me in terms of what was possible in terms of business.

Like, man, like the way he thinks about business, it just makes you feel so small. Like he doesn't even think about anything on a small level. It's always a large level, even if he's not there yet. And then also he had so many different ways of looking at things that makes me never really want to look at things the same, like ever again. What are some core beliefs of yourself that like, maybe we're holding you back or maybe we're fairly general that by breaking those beliefs or getting around certain people, you've been able to reach the next level. yourself that like maybe we're holding you back or maybe we're fairly general that by breaking those beliefs or getting around certain people you've been able to reach your next level like

what are some things you see a lot where you're like i used to be like that so i mean i used to think like there was like a certain amount of money that i thought was like a lot and you know around all of my friends and stuff it was a lot but i was never around anyone who made more and even when you think people make more you don't understand how much it really is. Like, living in Newport, and I see people drive around in all these crazy-ass cars and stuff, you're just like,

yeah, they probably make, like, a million dollars a year. I don't know. Like, a lot. It's a lot. But then you, like, listen to someone. I think Alex makes, like, 13 million a month right now. It, like, fucking blows your fucking mind. You know what I'm saying?

So, like, you just hear numbers on a different level where it's just like, whoa. And you're like, okay, like,. You know what I'm saying? So like you just hear numbers on a different level where just like, whoa. And you're like, okay, like everything is not what I thought, you know? But then also you, for him, because he's such an entrepreneur, it makes me believe like what I'm supposed to do because I didn't realize like, dude, I like my, my whole team right now of everything for chalk is like, like I was telling you, it's like three people. Yeah. Right. And he's just like, oh, I like my, my whole team right now of everything for chalk is like, like I was telling you, it's like three people. Yeah. Right. And he's just like, Oh, you gotta have a person for this guy, a person for this guy, a person for this guy. I was like, fuck,

I don't even know how to hire people. You know, like, I don't know any of that stuff. And like, he's just like really helped with a lot of that stuff. Um, and just like, if I had met him earlier in my athletic career, I would have known that I didn't need the prerequisite of success to define who I was in business. Because he's just like, no, you just need a very good personality and someone that people jive with and a good business and a good selling proposition and different things like that. I mean, the guy was able to build a $50 million business

in like two or three years, $50 million a year recurring business called Gym Launch, which he sold this year. And I mean, he was able to do that as someone with 6,000 followers on Instagram. Which is like based off a phone call he had with Grant Cardone or something like that, right? That was actually later on. So what he has now is something called acquisition.com, which is basically he acquires businesses and helps them grow like 10 X and then hopefully they sell. And then he takes a percentage of that. And that was basically kind of a collaboration of things he was thinking

about mixed with like, you know, the grant card. I think he paid him like 135 grand for three hours or something. Right. But it's funny when you hear him talk about it. Cause he's like, you know,

if I make X amount of dollars, you know, let's just say, you know, if you make X amount of dollars and for you to go out to a five-star dinner, it's equivalent to someone paying like $5. Like, wouldn't you do it? And he's like, well, what if, you know, you make X amount of dollars and a conversation with this person, let's say it's 135 grand, but it's equivalent to like 135 bucks. Like, what'd you pay for? And it's just like, he thinks about it on that level.

Like, I remember talking about like maybe getting rid of my car like i have a fancy car and he's like well you know what actually he would break down like how much money do you make and then you break it down by like hour and then he'd be like yeah it's actually cheaper for you to do uber and then you'd be able to make money while you're in the uber like he like he breaks it down like that yeah you know so it's crazy and he's not like laughing when he says he he's like, oh, you want to sell your car. So blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And just like breaks it all down. It's insane. It's pretty sick to have somebody like that.

It's pretty incredible. In your back pocket. Did you at least kick his ass when you worked out? In some things, yeah. Oh, there you go. In some things, yeah. He is incredibly jacked as well. Yeah.

That's actually just a couple of days ago. Five days ago. Yeah. He's very jacked. And then my other buddy there, that's Sonny Webster. He went Five days ago, yeah. Very jacked. And then my other buddy there, that's Sonny Webster. He went to the Olympics for weightlifting for the UK. That's fucking awesome. Let me ask you this because early on, I mean, Andrew told me that he's, even before, he was seeing a lot of advertisements for your app.

My ads, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So what, I guess, were you doing that earlier than other individuals in terms of getting that out? Because your app has a lot of members. Yeah. So way earlier. That was like one of the things that really projected me really fast was I started doing the ads very, very early. Because I knew nobody else was doing them.

And I had this weird, you know, the prerequisite to be an athlete, to be able to tell people to listen to me, was something that was tough. So, like, when I first launched the app, I told you I made $4,000, and it was, you know, the same I was making in the gym, and I realized this was going to be a thing, but I didn't really accept it in terms of, like, I should tell everyone. Like, I didn't go on my social media and start shouting, like, from the rooftops and say, hey, you guys should follow my program you guys are following my program you should do this you should do that I kind of like just didn't say

much because I was like I didn't win the CrossFit games I didn't like I wasn't the best athlete and I felt insecure about being the person who was making money because even like the four thousand dollars a month was more than like everyone in like the freaking world of CrossFit like nobody was making any money and I was actually telling him before on that social media at the time didn't even have stories yet it was just like

I make a post and then I would sell things like in my DMs and then eventually the Chalk Online got up to like $20,000 a month and then eventually

I still didn't say anything I would say something like maybe once a month and it got to like $40,000 a month. This probably took like a year and a half to two years, something like that.

And then I was like, that was when I officially stopped doing CrossFit. My knee was all fucked up. And I just was like in a bad place for like three months, just really, really upset and depressed. Like, man, I'm not going to be competing anymore and like all this stuff. I'm like, yeah, business is good,

but like it doesn't mean shit to me because I just like loved... Dude, my favorite thing to do was to snatch and to back squat. Those are my two favorite things to do. And I literally to this day, I cannot do a back squat, period. It's probably never even going to happen again

because I'm shit so fucked up. And then snatches and all that stuff, I was like, fuck, this just sucks so bad. Yeah. But then once I got over it and I I was like, fuck, this just sucks so bad. But then once I got over it and I just was like, dude, you can still lunge. You can do this. You can do that. You can ride your bike.

You can still go surfing. There's so many things that you're still good at and you can still do. Just fucking get over it. And I got over it. And I would say like three months after maybe that $40,000 thing, I hit six figures a month. And I was like, all right, we got a real business here. Let's fucking try to figure out how to grow this thing. And, um, that was pretty much where everything kind of started for me. And I was like, wow, this is like really cool. And, um, I think if you follow me now on social media, like more than just

being a coach and all that stuff is I put a lot of like inspirational content out there because when I graduated college, it was like, I got a kinesiology degree, I got a nutrition degree. And to, and to me, like, you know, the ultimate job was to be a strength conditioning coach for a college football team or NFL team. He like maybe make a hundred thousand dollars a year. Yeah. There was no like entrepreneur side of fitness, you know? And it was just like, now that there is, it's like, I feel for the person who's younger and like wants to do something really cool, but doesn't know how, or hasn't had his beliefs broken yet in a way to understand what's possible. You know what I mean? Like for me owning my gym in Newport beach, California,

like I remember making my $4,000 a month and going on a run for the one mile mark at my gym. I was doing a workout where, you know, I would run a half mile outside my gym, turn around, run back. That was the one mile mark. And I remember running a half mile out and I saw a for sale sign by owner right down the street from my gym, right at the half mile mark.

And I was like, when the workout was over, I called my mom. I was like, mom, I found the perfect house. I'm going to buy this house. It's like half a mile from the gym. It's this little tiny little shack thing. It's going to be great. My mom's like, how much is it? I'm like, I don't know, but it's fucking two bedroom little shack thing it's gonna be great and i was like how much is it i'm like i don't know but it's fucking it's two bedroom one bath can't be that

much i called up and it was 990 000 and i was like holy fuck like i thought it was like 300 grand you know maybe 200 i thought it was way lower you know and then that was when i was like i'm never gonna make enough money to live here and i'm just gonna accept the i was like i'm never going to make enough money to live here and i'm just going to accept the fact that like i'm just a poor person and like that to me versus now i'm the same person with the same passions and the same thing but i have met people in my life that have changed the way i thought about that and my definition of like what's possible is just no longer the same and it it literally, I, I, it would not have been the way it is if I didn't meet certain people. I wasn't just going to stumble

upon shit like randomly. Like I meet, I met people who took me to the next level. And then I met people who broke those beliefs and told me that what I was doing really wasn't really that impressive at all. And even to this day, I'm like, I don't really think what I do is all that impressive until I get to a certain point. Um, and I'm probably sure I'll meet someone at that point. It makes me feel even less impressive. But, you know, for the person who's in his entrepreneurial journey right now and he's somewhere where he's on a half-mile run and he sees a house that he thinks he can buy and there's absolutely no fucking chance of him buying it,

I would like to give you the tips to at least give you the belief that it's possible. Because if you at least have that belief, then you can walk around with a different type of poise, right, where you're just like, you know, I can do this. Ryan did it. Fuck, Ryan was stealing shit and was sleeping on a couch and crying himself to sleep and fucking whatever. I think when someone has a business or they start making money in a particular avenue, then it's sometimes hard for them to think outside of that avenue. So even someone who's wealthy, who's doing really well,

sometimes gets like stuck in there, like this is working really well. And they just stay there. And they're not really thinking about progressing somewhere else or pushing into something else. So comfortable. Yeah. So for you, are you trying to get your app to be in like different languages? Like, are you messing around with like, you know, various things? Because most likely it's, it's probably pretty popular here in the U.S., and then once you get outside the U.S., it probably gets a little complicated. But have you been considering other moves like that or things outside the box? I've lost like tens of thousands of dollars trying to create my own app,

kind of getting screwed by developers and different things like that. I would ultimately like to have my own app that had all sorts of different things, kind of like what you're talking about. But I'm just like I haven't really found that yet like right now my big thing is um my girlfriend and i were actually we like started like the vip vip version of chalk whereas like it's a one-on-one service we get to work with me and another coach like directly so i make you a custom like everything and it's nutrition and training and all that stuff and you get access to a coach and like we do calls and like all that stuff it's like a we call it like a lifestyle recalibration so we

like really tune you into all of the things that makes a great fitness person like great right beyond just the weights and it's like the why behind everything as well um that's like a lot more in-depth program it's taken me a while to build but that's available now and like that's kind of our our top tier thing it's that thing's a little bit quite a bit more expensive so i'll have these two different routes but i'd always like to just stay in fitness like maybe we'll get into supplements at one point debatably but i don't really necessarily care like i'm i'm happy to grow my app as big as possible and i mean people have done some really cool stuff like i don't know if you guys know kayla

it scenes she sold her app the sweat Sweat app, for $400 million. I've heard of Sweat. I've heard of it, yeah. Chris Hemsworth, he owns the Center app. He just sold his for $200 million or $250 million like a couple weeks ago. I mean, you can make a lot of money just staying in your one lane. I will never be somebody who needs a billion dollars. Like Alex, my friend Alex, he wants a billion.

And nothing in life matters until he gets there um for me i would give up significantly more money to go ride my bike and to go paddleboard and to go on really cool trips i think zoe's sitting over there and she knows that for sure um i'm like a super experienced guy like for me everything is experience like i will spend a lot of money on like fun shit yeah and then I'll I'll be cheap as I'll get out on so many other things is your gym at this point um is it just to kind of have like so you have a place to train type of thing and you have a good community or is it uh still like really beneficial in some other ways I mean I used to love filming there and being there all the time

and all that stuff and that's gotten a little bit harder just because I can't hang out in the gym for like four hours a day like I used to, four or five hours. And like now I don't I'm not in there so much where I'm up to speed on everyone's life. So if I just go in even for like an hour training session, it turns into like three. And then the rest of my day, I'm like really stressed out because I'm far behind. And then even when I'm in there, I'm like at work in my mind, I'm like, uh, that coach is doing something wrong. Um, that person has like my really expensive competition plates and he's outside and he's ruining them. Oh my God. It's like, I can't get a good workout in. Yeah. So like I'm at the point now where I literally can't work out in my gym and people are always like

saying like, I can't believe you don't work out at your own gym. And I'm like, dude, I like, I can't mentally. Um, so yeah, I mean mean it's it serves its purpose because a lot of people aspire to go there and I love having it and people are so pumped to go and actually be there um and it's a great place to film like to this day like Zoe always makes fun of me but it's like I get embarrassed to go film at other gyms like I get embarrassed to like take my shirt off and then like be like someone of authority like talking on camera yeah in front of other people because it's like i don't like being that like attention guy where it's like i'm the shit and you guys should listen to me and everything but in my gym it's so easy to do like i feel very confident but then um

in other places you know not the same so i like having it for those purposes what's the deal with zoe she's pretty jacked dude she's fucking jacked you said that people just go talking to her they don't talk to you no i'm invisible no one can even live their life anymore when they see her they can't go to the grocery store they can't i mean like if wherever they are they're frozen in time and they're just like that girl is jacked yeah i'm like full body statics bro how'd you meet her um we actually met in the gym um and i actually give her a lot of credit. She's a super heroic person.

The last couple months has quit her job to be a fitness entrepreneur and live a new lifestyle, which has definitely been— She had an amazing job before that, you said. She had an amazing job as a PA, physician assistant, which is harder to do now than it is to be a doctor. So she's worked really, really hard at that, And then now it's taken like a big leap of faith to do this, to help me with the brand. Um, and to do something where she's a little bit more has her own schedule. Like, I don't think she realized how much different her schedule was

than mine. So we like, we started dating and it was like, I would always be like, I'm going to go on a trip. I'm going to go somewhere. Like, do you want to come and she's like i don't can't get off of work yeah um and then like it was just like a lot of these little things started to creep up and then we went on a vacation to cabo with alex and leila and they really hammered yeah you would you know you would do so well like you're such a strong like good worker and all this stuff and i think she got really excited about it and she went all it was it was it was it's like interesting to me because I never had one of those jobs but I could see how hard it was and I mean like you know I'm sure school costs a lot of money and like all the stresses of all that stuff and to

see her do it is I mean I'll never I'll probably never meet another person like that you know it's interesting because at the beginning of the podcast, you were mentioning how you wanted to be a pilot. You went to school for all these things. Whatever happened to all that stuff in terms of wanting to be a pilot, I guess you got some stuff in kinesiology, so you learned some stuff there, but whatever happened

to the pilot stuff, is that still something like you want to be able to fly shit, or is that just eh? Yeah, it's kind of eh now. Okay. I think Kobe really ruined it for me. Yeah. You know, oh yeah, that sucks. Um, it is what it is, but you know, I, I am really curious about this cause in the gym we were talking about how there's like so much opportunity now and you know, Andrew, you have a stepdaughter and it's hard to tell a kid, uh, you know, that, you have a stepdaughter and it's hard to tell a kid, you know, that college isn't absolutely necessary for everything. Right. So what would your advice be for, let's say,

a teenager who does want to do something in fitness or who does want to do something in terms of entrepreneurship? Like what should they try to actually be learning? Because some of these things, most of these things, you're not going to be learning in school. You're not going to be learning in high school or college. Yeah, it's unfortunate, right? So, I mean, I think if I could do it over again, I would just work for free for someone. I would like literally go to the most dope person, start with him, go to the second most dope person, third most dope person, and just see what happens. Yeah.

I mean, if I had a really – people ask me all the time, like, dude, I'll work at your gym for free. I'll do this. I'll do that. And I look at their page. I'm like, yeah, they kind of look like a little sketch. I can, if I had a really, people ask me all the time, like, dude, I'll work at your gym for free. I'll do this. I'll do that. And I look at their page. I'm like, yeah, they kind of look like a little sketch. I can't really tell. But if it was an awesome person where like, I knew they were dope and they wanted to work for free, I'd be like, yeah, let's do it.

And then you're going to learn so much along that way. It's a little bit hard for me at this point. A lot of people want to come to Chalk and learn from me and stuff, but I'm not there all that much. But when I was there all the time, man, you would have learned so much, and it would just be, I've had people that were coaches

and wouldn't have opened their own gyms and stuff like that, or they started their own thing. But that's really what you need to do. You need to be around somebody because that person breaks that belief barrier for you. And it's like, you might not think that, you might think that you need a lot of money

to open something, or you need a lot of education, or you need a lot of this. And it's like, no, you need a lot of money to open something or you need a lot of education or you need a lot of this. And it's like, no, you need a lot of people skills and you need a really good person to give you the loan or whatever it is. Whatever your actual limiting factor is, there's a way to work around it. I mean, a good example is real estate people. They figure out ways to leverage tons of money so they can buy tons of real estate. examples like real estate people they figure out ways to leverage tons of money so they can buy tons of real estate it's like there's ways that you can leverage your friends and leverage you know whatever you do have to create whatever lifestyle that you that you want or aspire to

you just don't know so you meet someone who knows how how do you uh eat nowadays um i try to stay mostly like meat and vegetable kind of style um not by like any other thing any other like main reason just other than like i know if i eat a lot of meat and a lot of vegetables and or not vegetables but a lot of fruit then uh i don't really eat a ton of vegetables if ever not for any other like particular reason though they're just like i just like fruit more um but if i eat a lot more meat and a lot more fruit then i feel like i'm just gonna eat less calories overall um for me, it's always like, I'm a hungry dude, right? And if I eat too many calories, I'm just going to eat too many calories. So if the food's available and it's

there, I'm going to eat it. So I try to just buy mostly meat and fruit and I won't really go over. What about fasting? Have you ever messed around with some of that? I am not a fasting individual. Only a couple hours can go by, and for me, it's like, nah. Like, I got to eat. I mean, I've had mornings where I'll work from, like, 5 in the morning to, like, 2 in the afternoon, and I won't eat, just because I've forgotten because I'm so into what I'm doing. But when that 2 o'clock hits, it's time to go.

I've always wanted to try, like, a full day off, but I just, I don't know, it doesn't sound fun to me. So like if it happened by chance, I'd be like, oh, cool, I did it, but I'm not going to like. And I don't really think that there's really any benefits to fasting like just intermittently as much as there is for like long periods of time. Yeah. It's just, it's literally just the caloric restriction that happens since you're not eating all day. That's. Helps break you of food though a little bit too, you know, like break you away from it.

So you don't have to be feeling like you need something every three hours. Yeah. As it gets you a little uncomfortable and it could change your belief system in yourself a little bit. You were mentioning about your knee. So I would encourage you to break that belief system that your knee is uh forever the way that it is i think that you can you can i think that you'll figure it out and you'll you'll change it dude if you have any recommendations i mean i've tried everything i've done prp stem cells multiple times how about a figure four leg lock like rick flair you know the finishing finishing move i mean a lot of people have talked about the

knees over toes guy stuff but i don't know i've actually messaged him and i was like dude i don't know if your stuff would work for me because i'm bone on bone like i we're not really like you feel that shit well when we're done with the podcast i'll show you my knee and like i just i have more bone growth on that one because the bones have been rubbing together for so long like i just don't know if there's any sort of rehab that will be good for me in fact actually zoe's she was a pa for orthopedic surgeon and she did knee surgeries and even she's kind of like yeah you're kind of fucked do you think you're gonna end up replacing that knee because i know some people like matt vincent kelly stirret um who they ended up getting total knee replacements and they have that range back

like you'll see kelly just sitting in a deep again. Is that something you think you might do or you? I've been a candidate for that for a long time and I just keep putting it off because I just figure you have to get them like every 20 years. Oh, right. They don't really last like forever. So I'm like, ah, most doctors will tell you like, just deal with the pain until you can't anymore. And then, then you can get it. So, I mean, I'm not complaining about my knee, like all day, every day, but like, if I went on like a 400 meter run, I'd be limping around. If I did some box jumps, I'd be limping around. If I do any Olympic lifting, that impact of exploding off the ground,

I'll be limping around. It's been that way for a few years. Oh, yeah. Damn. Since 2016, maybe? 15, 16? You said you couldn't squat, but what about a high box squat? Even with that, I wind up putting a lot of pressure on one side and my hip will get all sore.

Yeah. So yeah, but that was a good one. That was something I was trying to do for a while. But it's so weird. Like literally right now in my program, my one progressive lift on my full body training program is Bulgarian dumbbell split squats. Dude, I'm doing like sets of 10 with 120s in each hand like i can split squat a shit ton and i've back squat it i've back rack lunged 417 pounds for one rep on each leg no belt no shoes no nothing just done that um i did it in

sweden actually with the olympic training coach training coach and it was really cool with the barbell shrug team actually. Yeah. It's not that lift but I mean still. Oh yeah there's me doing like 275 like fairly easily with just like split squats. Jeez man. But yeah I'm really strong at the split squat. I just cannot do two legs at all. You seem like you have the body

of someone who would be amazing at Olympic lifting in general. I was always pretty good. It was weird. I was always pretty good. It was weird. I could clean a lot and I could snatch a lot, but I could not jerk very well at all. My best snatch was like 295 pounds when I was 175. That's a lot.

So it was 295, and then my best clean and jerk at the time was like 305. Shit. So they were very close, but I had cleaned like 350. That's interesting. I want to go back close, but I had cleaned like three 50. That's interesting. I want to go back to something cause I do find it interesting. You mentioned how like you didn't grow up with your dad, but you ended up being exactly like him. And I knew my dad for a few years when I was younger. And then I met him again when I was like, uh, I think like 21 at an airport a little bit, but everyone in my family that like has known him knows and says i'm exactly like him even though he didn't raise me i just find that to be a very funny thing how those

types of genetics work but do you have a relationship with him nowadays like or i tried like we tried a little bit but he's like got remarried and he's like i think he's like embarrassed to say i have like this 35 year old kid So I think I'm just invisible in his life basically, which is fine. Like it would be worse if I never met him at all. But the fact that I got to meet him, we've had like some pretty decent times and I'm okay with it. Fair. Okay. You were mentioning when you were younger how you didn't want to be like your brothers and sisters and how you didn't want to be home.

Do you think that was kind of steeped in like not wanting to disappoint your mother? Like you maybe want to take on more responsibility. I don't know what your brothers and sisters were doing. I don't know if they got into like crazy stuff like drugs and alcohol and stuff like that. But did you kind of just see that chaos and you were like, I just want fucking nothing to do with that. Yeah, I just was like I – so my grandmother when I was young, she was like wealthy. She's the only person I knew that had money.

And I just knew that like when I got older, I wanted like a lifestyle kind of like what she had and I just knew I wasn't going to get it with like what they were doing. And I didn't even know how to do it. I didn't know anything to this day. Like no one's really like taught me a whole lot about business or anything like that. It was just stuff that I've kind of acquired from other people around me you know what i mean like not much into a lot of reading and stuff like that i read a shit ton now oh okay yeah i do a lot of that stuff now like now i'm like all into it but like you know all of this kind of built up before

i had time for anything i just kind of was building things off of recommendations from other people and um when i tell you like the whole business story like whenever i'm around other people. And, um, when I tell you like the whole business story, like whenever I'm around other people who are really business savvy, they're just like, I cannot believe that you built that is unbelievable with no coach, no skillset, none of that. Um, I always tell everybody like literally I just had a product that was so good that like it just spoke for itself. Like I'm so lucky that I had a product that was just that good. Um, because the rest of the heavy lifting kind of went for itself. But if I actually knew real business stuff right now,

I would be like 20 times, 200 times bigger. Even now, I would love to have someone kind of help me with some of the things that I really need help with, like building a huge team of people to do all these little things would be awesome. And that's something I'm definitely aspiring to want to do now. But yeah, I think when I was younger, just did just, just knowing that I needed to be the opposite of what they were. It was like, it was pretty easy for me to just kind of be like, I'm just going to do the opposite. I'm just going

to do the opposite. And man, to this day, I don't think I've even taught, I haven't talked to my brothers and sisters for a long time. And it's like the regiment thing about me, right? When I was younger and I want to be in military school, like I can get to the point where it's like okay like I know you're my blood and this and that but you're not actually adding anything to the life so boom done and like I can just do that with anything just boom done everything's done like if I don't feel like it's helping or anything like that I can just be out um and I'm happy for that um just because it's it's easy for people to hang on to things for a really long time. Um, and even like, it's the same thing.

Like when I get really upset about something, it's doesn't really last that long. Kind of onto the next thing, which is great as a business guy. Cause you can hang on to like bad decisions or bad investments that you made. You lost 50 grand doing something. You want to fucking cry about it forever. But, um, yeah. How'd you really make the app grow? You did mention like social media advertising. Was there some other things in there?

I mean you mentioned your background and people were already following you a little bit. But there's got to be other strategies, right? Without even knowing anything about like real ads and stuff, I would always – I would just sit home and I would make ads in my kitchen. And I would try different things. Like before, obviously,ck wasn't out. Like everyone talks about hooks now and like ways to keep people engaged and all that.

And I was just kind of doing all that on my own. And I was just geeking out on it and I'd look up different ads that like really stole people's attention. One of my favorite ads of all time is actually the Squatty Potty. Have you seen the ad? Oh yeah.

With the unicorn? It's the fucking best ad of all time ago vaguely remember it it's so like a unicorn's like all constipated and stuff they like put his legs up and all of a sudden like poop is flying out like in rainbows okay i remember it yeah yeah and i'm like fuck i have to make crazy ads like this and like i literally have ads for like some of my fitness or some of my nutrition challenges. Like one of my nutrition best ads of all time, I'm wearing a turtleneck in my kitchen, just a white turtleneck. And I'm just staring at the camera and I'm like, I don't know what's hotter.

The 50,000 bodies I've changed with the earn your cards lifestyle challenge or this turtleneck click link below, find out. And like, I'm like dead serious. And like the fact that like I would launch that like people just were like bro I saw this ad it was ridiculous like I have ones of me like jamming on a ukulele like trying to sing I can't sing for a fucking shit yeah um and it's just hilarious and people will click on it um and I think that stuff helped a lot um and I a lot of things that you know a lot of people don't like to do discounts or do free trials and stuff like that,

but I've always found that a big free trial always worked really well for me. I'd always give people a month to try it for free instead of a week. And whenever I did a big month, that would always help a lot because people would be like, you know, the first week sometimes, a lot of the most successful apps in the world right now, whether it's the Sweat app or Center app or a lot of these really really big ones i can go off for days i can compare companies and stuff but like a lot of them always do a seven day free trial and it's what i do even now yeah but the first seven days sometimes it's like you're trying to figure out how to

fucking use the thing right but it's like you get someone a little bit longer it sucks because you might not find your uh return on ads on your your spend really right like I'll have months where I'll spend I think like last month I spent $145,000 on ads and a lot of that was like just throwing out a Hail Mary for people to sign up for a free month and I still don't really know what's going to happen yet it could be terrifying it could be great it could be I don't know so we'll find out but like yeah I've done stuff like that where it's like, I really just hope that, you know, people make it a, they make it

you know, something that's automatic in their life. Like all the things that we just do every single day. And it's like, if I can just make my program part of like that, that automatic thing for you, then I'm really happy with it. I've lost a lot of money fucking around trying to do some of this stuff. But like I said, like for me, it's the lifestyle, right? Like I, I fucking, I love my life. I love love what i get to do you know how pumped i am to be here

right now i'm fucking pumped like this is so cool you know you kind of mentioned uh that you had a before covid you were doing a really big podcast but it's yeah it's called real chalk real chalk so what are you still do are you going to be doing that again is it something for sure i want to bring it back. It's like on my priority list right now. Yeah. I think so. Like when I was part of the Barbell Shrugged Collective, when they used to have the collective

and I was their, their highest watched podcast, I think on the collective. And then even when we broke apart, I kind of told him, I was like, Hey man, like, you know, like some of your ads are getting kind of mixed in my ads and like there's pictures of me on some of your guys' products. And like, I kind of have to like separate myself because my shit's getting kind of big and, I was like, hey man, like, you know, like some of your ads are getting kind of mixed in my ads and like there's pictures of me on some of your guys' products. And like, I kind of have to like separate myself cause my shit's getting kind of big and I want people getting confused. Yep. Well, it kind of sucked because like people would meet me up and they'd be like, bro,

um, like I'm following the barbell shrug podcast has a photo of you on it, but like, I don't think this is what you do. I'm like, it's not. So then like, you know, I had to like talk to Anders, which is like is like you know when i was broke and i didn't have anything he's let me train in his gym he's like literally like my brother um i i felt horrible telling him about it but it was like you know i got to do my own thing and then a lot of people came off and kept watching me like i was getting like 40 50 000 downloads on a on a podcast like when that wasn't even like that was a really unheard of numbers um and then literally

when covid happened i had to like really step on the gas for the online program because the gym closed down um so we had to all close the gyms for i think it was like four or five months i only closed mine for one month and i got two fines for staying open i wasn't sure what was gonna happen with that i wasn't really super public about it because i didn't really want to like draw a lot of attention to myself, but I stayed open, just put like some paper up. And like during that month, I had to start making programs that were like limited equipment, body weight, all this stuff. And I didn't really want to make it. I didn't really like that stuff. I didn't really believe in that stuff, but it's what the, it's what the brand needed to stay alive during that time and get people to not cancel their membership yeah so dude like i'm so obsessed with making like one-of-a-kind style programs that

like i wanted to make something so cool so like i spent all my time doing that and i just didn't do any podcast for like a year and then i got kind of used to just like not doing the podcast so you know it just kind of got took a back seat but people all the time are just like dude i'd miss your podcast so much like i see people in airports all over the world they're just like dude i used to listen to the podcast it's like the number one thing i'm so surprised at how strong a podcast is do you listen to podcasts not as much i listen i listen to a lot of audiobooks a lot of audiobooks what about tv you watch some tv. Never? You don't watch, like, any series, like Game of Thrones or anything like that? I got really into Yellowstone because I just, like, love mountain towns.

You keep talking about that one. Never watched it yet. I'm actually actively, actually, you know, Zoe and I, we flew into Reno, drove here, and then after here we're going to go back to probably Lake Tahoe, and then I'm trying to buy a house there. Cool. Because I love the mountains so much. And, like, I just loved Montana a lot

and I just like I just think like when you're watching the show it kind of just brings the mountain vibe in I just think it's super cool yeah but that's probably

the only show I've watched in years and years have you ever seen 1843? I have not that's like a prequel it's like a spin off show of that show and it's better

than Yellowstone I've heard that it's fucking really dope it's really really good yeah yellowstone gets to be kind of funny because it gets to be like a country western yeah um like music videos to a certain extent you know you're like murder mystery i'll still watch but i am curious are there any um are there any black people in yellowstone i'm just curious huh There is. Yeah, yeah. There are? Yeah, yeah. Is there? Yeah. In both shows, there's black people. I was just curious because back in those times.

I think it's just to make sure they're covered. Yeah, I'm pretty sure. It's like, you got to have one sprinkled in there. See that affirmative reaction. But he's not in a wheelchair. There we go. Oh, man. Is he at least gay?

Yeah, right? Yeah. I don't know. I don't know if you're allowed to be gay back then. I don't know. Probably not. That's a bad combo. There we go. Oh, man. Is he at least gay? Yeah, right? Yeah, if he's gay. I don't know. I don't know if you're allowed to be gay back then. Probably not. That's a bad combo for that time. Gay and black.

You're dead. Straight up. Straight up. Have you ever been to Sharky's? Sharky's is in your area. Yeah, that's what I was thinking about in my mind. I was like, is that what he's talking about? Yeah, that's actually really close to where I live.

I love that place. That's where I met my wife. Really? But not at the Newport Beach one in like Redondo or Hermosa or whatever. Okay, yeah. I live right on like Lido Island, if you know where that is. I do. Yeah, that's where I live now.

We're going to get smashed if we don't ask you, though. But the books that you've been, because you said you've been getting into books a lot more recently. I don't know what recently is for you. But what have been some books that you've really liked that have had a good effect on maybe your mindset, the way you look at business, the way you look at, I don't know, entrepreneurship? Well, the best entrepreneur book right now is probably Alex Ramosi's book, 100 Million Dollar Offers. Honestly, it is fucking really, really, really good. Yeah. He writes it.

He's just an incredible writer. And it's just a it's a great way to create your offer that basically is such a good offer that it makes people feel stupid to say no um and it's it's a great book um and then in terms of training uh dr mike israelty rp strength guy yeah his uh principles of strength or principles of hypertrophy yeah fucking ins i mean i've read it three times i'm actually i'm probably just gonna read it a fourth time because it's so fucking good i have it i'm gonna revisit it now that you say it's dude it's so fucking good like i've read all of like mark ripito's um i've read i mean i've read like all the training books but i just love how he breaks everything up from like you know like

maintenance volume to minimal effective volume to max recoverable volume and then like explaining to everybody that like all this stuff that you're doing in the gray areas in between is just extra work for no reason. So for those of you listening right now, it's like we all have a maintenance amount of volume in our body that we need to hit to maintain where we are at. And it is way, way lower than you think it is. It's like we could work out twice a week and do like two exercises per body body part and we'd be cool i enjoy wasting my time totally right i mean like yeah we all a lot of us do and it's a mental thing yeah we don't even i don't even believe in maintenance volume i'm like oh this is perfect and you guys should all listen to it like do you believe in it i don't know so it's like you would just feel uncomfortable doing that low amount of

volume yeah right yeah lose all my gains i can't do that um so it's like i think that's like super super interesting um and then he has like the minimal effective volume and the max effective volume so i almost feel like a lot of people are in the gray area between uh maintenance and minimal effective and i think the rest of the population is above recoverable. Like the interval people are at max recoverable volume. And then the other people who aren't really getting results,

who bits at their hard gainer and all these different things, they're all like in this low end. And a lot of people just aren't really in that mid range. And I just think it's just a, it's a great way to define it. I think if you're a strength conditioning coach

on any level, you train, not even strength conditioning, but you're just a coach for people. You create programs as a, as a trainer. I think it's the best book on the market. I think that you, you do need to have some general knowledge from some other books, probably just like practical programming, probably from Mark Rippetoe. I think it's, I think he's the one who made that book. Um, that's probably like a good general. The guy that owns Legion supplements, mike matthews yeah he has a book called bigger leaner stronger and beyond bigger leaner stronger they're both really really good

but they're very very like they're like basic knowledge stuff like for all like for if you read it you'd be like oh yeah i know all this stuff but if you're someone who doesn't know this stuff it's probably the best book for a beginner okay what's your stack because i know people are gonna ask what do you mean well your steroid stack. Your cycle. I told you, like, I would really love to do testosterone. Actually, I'm glad we're revisiting this topic because I was going to ask him the same thing. I would love to. Yeah, bro, what are you on?

Like, just, Andrew, you stopped recording, right? Yeah, yeah, we're good. The internet's off. Yeah, everything's off. You're actually making me blush because I actually don't, I genuinely don't feel like I look anything. Just please, just tell us.

It's okay. There's only a few million people't, I genuinely don't feel like I look anything. Just please just tell us. It's okay. There's only a few million people listening I think. You know what I'd like to know? I mean I'm sure you guys have either taken testosterone or maybe currently taken testosterone or anything like that. Do you guys think at someone with me who has 350 levels do you think, and I'm

35, do you think it's worth me trying it or do you think I should just leave it alone? I think it would be a good idea to check in with some doctors and have them look at your blood and communicate back and forth with them and have them make the call for you. But I would also say if you don't feel like you have symptoms of any kind, like if you feel good and everything seems to be okay, I don't even know if there's a reason to check. Do you think aesthetically it would change very much or just like a little?

You're already really jacked. I mean, it might make the whole thing maybe a little bit easier. This is the thing I think about because I haven't done testosterone. People think I have. But I will do it at some point when really things start. I can tell things are going downhill. So he can cover his bases. Fuck you. When things start going downhill, then I do it but if like i look at it like this if you feel good you're performing well you're still able to make the gains you want to make then why do

something that you may have to do for decades right like i don't want to have to it's just the inconvenience part for me yeah it's for me it's like i really think it'd be dope to do but it's like literally just the inconvenience part of it i'm like it sounds like so annoying to have to jab myself all the time and there's a lot people have to take into account like you need to get blood work done you need to make sure all your health markers are in check like i think there's still uh with that stuff i think it's still kind of iffy um how to make sure you're still super healthy when doing at least that's what that's what I think about if you're on a hormone replacement it's not

that inconvenient it's a shot once a week it's about half a CC which is just not a lot of fluid isn't it better for your blood though just have more multiple shots though you can do that as well yeah there's some people that will do that they'll take two or three shots some people yeah do it every other day he's done some research if you're starting if you're starting to research for sure if you start to talk about you know performance enhancing that's when things can get a little weird because you start to take more testosterone you take you start to take more of maybe some other things and then you really do have to pay attention to your blood work, and then you might have to take other shit to kind of counteract the different things that you're taking.

See, I don't care about the performance. But if you're on just a base level, even when you're on a base level, coming off is less problematic. Yeah, there's always the balancing act, and for you, I don't think aesthetically or even performance, you'll notice anything um and i could be way off on this mark please correct me but it's of my opinion that it's going to benefit the person that's not quite there yet so like um if you got on there you might notice like oh i do maybe muscles are popping a little bit better but if you were like way out of

shape and then you got into like decent shape that jump is gigantic right because you went from like flabby to like oh shit i got some definition now fuck dude imagine if i was already jacked like well that jump's not going to be that big i could be way off but as far as a trt dose now if you up that of course then you're going to you know be on an actual like cycle dose but then that's when the uh the uh the balancing act comes into play and then it's like do you really want to have to get blood work done that often like no nobody does but you have to when i'm older like older older like to the point where it's like 50 40 50 60 like if my levels are down enough where it's like you fucking

really should do it i'm definitely gonna do it like i'm definitely not like against it like anyone who's just like what do you think and i'm like dude i don't know like if you're a fireman you don't sleep any you don't sleep and you get like shitty recovery and all this stuff and you really want to put muscle on you should probably think about it you know what i mean like i'm always like pro for anyone really doing it who needs it i don't have anything against it i feel like people are so weird about it it's just like who gives a fuck like it's like your your your body do what you want with it yeah and just don't do it don't do it and say you don't do it can't stand these motherfuckers on instagram that are just like oh yeah like all-time natural i'm like bro get the fuck out of here with that people think about me yeah but what i mean i mean

you could tell me you're natural and i'd be okay with it there's some dudes i'm just like come on dude i get you why thank you what i was gonna say was like if you know because you mentioned like oh if i'm like 40 50 my levels are down but if you feel good maybe you're still not even ready or not you still don't even need it you know because like um like sean baker like he posts his labs all the time and it's like his testosterone is like very low dump In the dumps. Yeah. But that guy works his ass off. Like, I mean, literally like, so I stayed at his house and I just remember hearing loud ass music at like six in the morning. What the fuck is going on?

And he is going fucking crazy on a rower, doing a bunch of shit on the slant board and he's jacked as fuck and his levels are in the fucking gutter. So like, and he's, I don't know how old he is. He's like in his fifties, I think. Yeah. Fifty four. And I searched. I didn't find any testosterone in the fucking gutter. So like, and he's, I don't know how old he is, like in his 50s I think. Yeah. 54, 54. And I searched, I didn't find any testosterone

in the whole house. I was looking everywhere. It was not there. I was looking for carbs and fucking tests and nothing was there. Yeah. Yeah,

just throughout my whole career the only thing I've ever taken was growth hormone. I've taken it up to like six months, probably two separate occasions. And then just like a ton of just stupid pro-hormone stuff. Notice anything from growth hormone?

I mean, I don't know. It's kind of hard to say. Because I was always injured during the time and I wasn't training super hard. I was training as hard as I could with my upper body. But I probably had the same diet and I was probably getting a little bit softer during that time because I wasn't really doing any legs

or anything like, you know, I wasn't really expelling a lot of energy because I'm like in crutches and stuff. I tore my ACL and different things like that was kind of when I was doing it. But yeah, I mean, yeah. Oh, we have a sponsor of the podcast and my buddy Smokey's over there. So we can have some doctors take a look at you. We go through a company called Merrick Health and they can just take a look at your blood work and then you can kind of go back and forth with them on that. But it's not like they're going to be like, yo, you need steroids. You know what I mean?

They're going to go back and forth with you and try to figure out what's going to be best for you. They're smart with that shit. Well, dude, the cool thing for me is, like, I'm so open about stuff that, like, for my followers on Instagram and stuff, if I ever did it, I'd be like, hey, guys, this is what I'm doing now, and we'll see what happens. You know what I mean?

Like, I'm always, like, about that. I think that's just the honesty is the best policy for all that stuff. I think people respect you so much more. That's true. Yeah. Awesome having you here today. Really appreciate it. Thank you so much.

Yeah. Andrew, take us on out of here, buddy. Sure thing. Thank you everybody for checking out today's episode. Please drop us some comments down in the old comment section for the algorithm. Seriously, it really does help. And make sure you guys hit that like button and subscribe if you guys are not subscribed already.

Please follow the podcast at MB Power Project on Instagram, TikTok, and Twitter. My Instagram, TikTok, and Twitter is at I am Andrew Z in SEMA. Where are you at? The Discord is probably over 1,600 people. So go to the description and go to Discord because we'll have some special links in there

that only Discord cats are going to be able to get. So go there right now. And see me ending on Instagram, YouTube. And see me yin-yang on TikTok and Twitter. Ryan, where can people find you, your app, and all the shit you do? Ryan Fish, R-Y-A-N-F-I-S-C-H on Instagram. Chalk Performance Training on Instagram. JimRyan.com, G-Y-M-R-Y-A-N.com because everything started with a Jim.

And it rhymes and it sounds cool. And, yeah, everything's on those websites or Instagrams or click links in the bio. Whatever. Cool. Does this guy look like a kangaroo to you? Does it look like a kangaroo? A little bit, yeah. Oh, what happened to the fucking punch?

But mostly a dog. Yeah, mostly. It's a fucking dog. Our last guess, is that a kangaroo? No, I would never say it's a kangaroo. He's in a kangaroo position. Yeah, he might have been. Maybe that's why.

Yeah, maybe he was high. I don't know. I'm at Mark Smelly Bell. Strength is never weakness. Weakness is never strength. Catch you guys later. Bye.