Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 1422: How to Build a Sexy Dad Bod

Episode Date: November 12, 2020

In this episode, Sal, Adam & Justin discuss the popularity of the "dad bod" and how to build a great one. Mind Pump discusses the popularity of the ‘dad bod’ and the stigma behind being ‘jacked’. (4:23) The science behind the ultimate attractive body type. (7:04) What defines a ‘dad bod’? (12:35) The positives of aiming for a ‘dad bod’. (14:40) The mirror versus performance, Mind Pump standards & MORE. (18:12) Why Mind Pump discourages striving for the “magazine look.” (24:17) How to Build a Sexy Dad Bod. (25:25) #1 – Build muscle. (25:42) #2 – Diet strategy. (32:31) #3 – Don't obsess. (39:34) #4 – Play and do stuff. (44:54) Related Links/Products Mentioned November Promotion: MAPS Ultimate At-Home Workout Bundle for Only $99.99 Visit Four Sigmatic for an exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! **Code “mindpump” at checkout Women prefer a 'dad bod' over six-pack abs, survey finds Waist‐to‐Hip Ratio across Cultures: Trade‐Offs between Androgen‐ and Estrogen‐Dependent Traits The Relationship Between Waist-Hip Ratio and Fertility Mind Pump #1420: Counting Calories Makes You Fat With Max Lugavere MAPS Fitness Anabolic - Mind Pump Media MAPS Macro Calculator Body Part Split vs. Whole Body Workout: Which Is Best? - Mind Pump Blog Mind Pump Podcast – YouTube Mind Pump Free Resources People Mentioned Max Lugavere (@maxlugavere)  Instagram

I can have a meal or two here and there that is, you know, I'm totally eating it just because I want to enjoy it as nothing to do with it's probably best for my body. With a remainder of the time when I have like a craving or want something, I don't just say, okay, I can have that because I'm okay with a dad bod. I still need to keep my diet and check. It's just not as strict. We are out on a weekend, we're all hanging together, have some drinks, I'm okay with that because that's not going gonna hurt me that much.

If you wanna pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mind, pop, mind, pop with your hosts. Salda Stefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. You are listening to Mind Pump the World's number one fitness health and entertainment podcast. Now, in this episode, we talk about how to build a dad bod. A lot of surveys have been done recently where women are asked, what kind of body they find

most attractive in men. And to many people in the fitness industries surprise, it was a dad bod. It wasn't the super shredded body. It was a guy that was around, I don't know, 12, it was a dad bod. It wasn't the super shredded body. It was a guy that was around, I don't know, 12, 13% body fat with good strength and good muscle. And here's the good news. That's a lot easier to get to and definitely easier to maintain. So in this episode, we break down all the things you need to do,

diet, training and lifestyle wise to get that sexy dad bod. Also, this episode is brought to you by our sponsor for Sigmatic. Now, for Sigmatic makes some of the best mushroom-based supplements around. These are adapted genic mushrooms that help the body deal with stress, thus increasing testosterone and many men, speeding up recovery, improving sleep, and improving performance. One of my favorite products from ForSigmatic is their ground coffee with chaga and lion's mane. So ground coffee obviously has caffeine, that feels good.

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This morning, you know, we're in the middle of baby mode, right? Babies still, you know, super early young. We're feeding them trying to get them to go to eat and you know, lack of sleep and the whole thing and you know the last few months was you know, Jessica was in her third trimester and It's getting cold outside. Anyway, I'm making excuses for why my diet isn't good. I see Where's this going? Setting the table. But I mean, I'm still working out. I'm still lifting. I'm gonna hold outside. Anyway, I'm making excuses for why my diet isn't good. I see. Where's this going? Setting the table, nice. Setting the table. But I mean, I'm still working out,

I'm still lifting, I'm doing that. Anyway, the past, you know, a couple of weeks, I get out of the shower and Jessica's like, she's like, man, you look really good. She's like, this is the hottest your body's ever looks since I've been with you. And I'm like, first I'm like, come on. Don't lie.

I mean, I've been ripped before, you know? Yeah, you've seen that. Yeah, like you're just trying to make me feel better. She was, no, I'm serious. I liked the way you look now, better than you did. You know, even when we first met when you were much leaner. Now granted, I'm not super overweight. I think my body fat's probably around 13, maybe 14%.

But she's seen me as lean as like eight or nine percent and she's like, you look way better right now. And here's why I'm starting to believe her. I'm believing her because when you and these surveys used to irritate me, but they've done them a million times. Well, they'll ask women what they prefer and they'll show pictures of men and they'll show them like shredded, a little heavier, overweight, and consistently women will point to the middle picture and they call out the dad bought, right? They say that that looks the best.

Muscular with a little bit of covering. Yes, and that's what they consistently will say is that that is the most attractive and used to annoy me before when I was, you know, lean and super-treat, whatever. But I mean, lots of them have been done. Do you think that's partially to though, like, the stigma that comes with being jacked? Right?

There's a bit of a stigma that comes with a plays of factor. Yeah, there's a bit of a stigma that comes with being, like, super ripped, that your body obsessed, neurotic. Yeah, your little neurotic. You spend too much time in the gym, you're probably no fun to go out on the weekend with, there's a lot of things that come with carrying yourself in baggage with it.

Yeah, so part of me thinks that that's why, and then there's the other side too, of also feeling secure about yourself, right? So when you're with a partner who is way better shaped than you are, you're probably constantly insecure and feeling bad about yourself. Whereas if you've got a partner who is a little bit on the softer side, it makes you feel a more secure

maybe with your own body. So there's probably a lot of factors going on. I think so because, well, first off, let's go with what the science says, because oftentimes what we consider attractive, let's go with what the science says, because oftentimes what we consider attractive, it's influenced by media, but there's also this kind of instinctual evolutionary aspect to it, right? So certain things that we think are attractive, and the reason why we consider them more

attractive is because they point to things like better health, better vitality, improved fertility, for example, if they've done these studies a couple times, and they've done things like better health, better vitality, improved fertility. For example, if they've done these studies a couple times, and they've done them around the world, well, they'll, different cultures find different sizes of people ideal in the sense of, you know, attractiveness. So they did one with women, right, where they said, okay, people from this region find women to be around this way, to be ideal, people from this region find women to be around this way, to be ideal, people from this region find women to be this way.

So there was this pretty wide variance of body weight. And so what they were trying to do is find consistencies and what they found was among all the cultures, there was this hip to waist ratio. So regardless if the women were 160 pounds or 120 pounds, it was this hip to waist ratio that they all considered attractive. And so then what they did is they went a little deeper

and they found why this hip to waist ratio and they found that it dramatically increases fertility and successful childbirth. So does that instinctual aspect of it? Now when you look at men, here's what the science says, and here's my own experience. If you get too lean or you get too fat,

your testosterone goes down. This is true, if you're natural. If you're natural and ask anybody a guy who's ever gotten himself or died it down or trained at the point where he got down to, seven or eight percent body fat. Every, every, I mean, that was one of the conversations I had to explain to Katrina when we got to that point, right?

Because she always thought it was so weird that when I'm all shredded feeling great about myself as far as my physique that The last probably I'd say two to three weeks heading into a show. We didn't have sex And it wasn't because I didn't want to it So I just had no drive completely lose your drive. I mean, you're unhealthy When you get that that lean your your body goes into survival mode It's not thinking about procreating. It's thinking about surviving and so you know You lose your sex drive so yeah that there's that two extremes like if you're lower than 6% body fat And then when you're higher than 15% and really the real healthy range is what's in the middle of that?

Yeah, so testosterone tends to be lower immune system tends to drop as well. This was very true for me I have gotten myself really really lean and when I do that, I notice that I have to be, and this is usually when I get down below 10%, I have to be careful because I'm more likely to get sick. I notice my heat and cold tolerance goes down. My sleep starts to get effective. In fact, talk to anybody who's done this. Now, of course,

there's individual variants. Are those extreme people who walk around and they're 8% body fat and they feel great, but for most guys, when they train and die at to that point, great as it looks in pictures, they'll tell you, y'all, my sleep is off. I feel like I'm more likely to get ill. So the science says that longevity-wise, you're probably better off walking around somewhere 13 to 14% body fat. So this may be why, one of the reasons why women instinctually will say, because I'm telling you, it's every survey, you look at it yourself, go on Google and you'll see them all. Well, yeah, and it's every survey you look at it for self yeah go on google and you'll see them all well yeah and it's interesting i i think there's obviously was a lot of those factors like you mentioned in terms of like them feeling better about themselves i think that it's

just it's really rare to see a six pack and i think that that statistic of of millionaires to people with six packs like was it more millionaires and people with six packs it you're odds of being a millionaire are far higher than your odds of getting a six. That's how rare it is. So I feel like it's a novelty thing. Like it's nice to look at. But I think that, instinctually,

like women are maybe more drawn towards somebody that is relatable to them. Yeah, that makes it, and here's a deal. What's life like when you are someone who trains and eats in a way to be that shredded. And so like to the point, you made Adam about, you know, they're also probably thinking, what kind of a person, what is this person like to hang out with? Right.

You know, I know what it was like when I got, when I get that lean, it's like, my diet 99% of time has to be perfect. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And the consistency and the gym and I mean, And I mean, bodybuilding was one of the most selfish sports I've ever played in my life. I mean, every other sport that I've been able to do, there's still off time, right?

Like you could be at the highest level in a basketball football. There's times in the day where you're off. You have hardcore practice and you gotta take care of your sleep and there's a lot of work that goes into being any sort of a professional athlete. But with bodybuilding, it's every minute of every hour of every single day. You're constantly aware of what's going in your mouth and we're eating all day long. Then you add in the fact that your training is extremely hard and you're trying to progress

show over show. I've never felt so selfish. And I remember all the shows that we are going through, always reminding Katrina that, this isn't forever for us, this is not a sport that I'm in love with and I wanna be doing forever, there's a plan behind all this and then we'll be done with this

because I think that it's really, really tough to do that and have good balance and have a, if you're a single guy all by yourself, then whatever, and you're into the sport, cool. But if you're trying to manage a relationship and then a family, it's kind of tough to do. Well, and I think too, we sort of glazed over the definition of it, because I think it varies

a little bit like what women consider a dad model. Because some people actually think like this fat beer belly is like a dad bottle. That's not a dad bottle, you're just fat. Yeah, like, let's be honest here. Like, pull up Doug, what's pull up dad bottle? Let me see what the internet deems a dad bottle because I agree, Justin, there is like this huge variance

of what. Yeah, because I mean, I mean, how I see it is, you know, if you actually have muscle in your muscular guy, but also you're not within that lean parameter where you could see the visible abs that stick out. Yeah, I'd say it's probably anywhere between, I don't know, 12 to 15, 16% body fat. You have good muscle, so you're not skinny fat, you're not... That's what comes up for jab on?

Generally overweight. Yes, that's skewed. Yeah, I agree, too. Yeah, because they're showing, who is that? Look up the surveys for Doug. The pictures that women will say looks most attractive. And then what you'll end up seeing is kind of like a muscular, but relatively lean, but not shredded physique.

In other words, you're still displaying good health. You're just not super physique. In other words, you're still displaying good health. You're just not super shredded. Yeah, you have some muscle definition. There's definitely signs you work out. That's important. That's how I feel, too. I feel like, to me, it means you look like you live. Like you've got shoulders to you, you've got arms,

you've got legs to you, so like that, but you carry a higher body fat percentage. You probably don't see a defined six pack. Yeah, see, there's one, okay, see. Oh Oh yeah that's a good example. Yeah so it looks like he's active looks like he's fit he's not super shredded but he's not there's a good right another simple your chest is sticks out further than your belly does yeah that's important right it is important no seriously I think you're just like the waist to hip ratio for women I think for men it should be you know chest to waist to waist. Yeah, our shoulders, waist. Yes, shoulders.

Yeah, yeah, right. I think that's, I think that, because sometimes you see these dad blogs and like Justin was saying, they have like this, like beer belly that sticks out further. Yeah, Justin, like, you're not in the category. You're in the obese. Yeah, sorry.

Now, one of the positives, right? Some of the positives of a dad bot, besides, you know, what we're saying, which is that it's considered most attractive in the real world, maybe not on Instagram pictures, but in the real world, it's considered most attractive. But here, what are some of the positives of it? You're probably healthiest around that body fat percentage. You've got good strength.

In fact, you're stronger. I'm stronger at 13% body fat than I am at 7% body fat for sure. I have less joint pain I feel pretty damn better energy and life is better energy higher testosterone levels. I sleep better and I'm you know, I've still got good confidence. I feel good and life is more balanced. I think this is a big one Right, so I don't feel like I need to watch every single thing that I put in my mouth. I don't need to like obsess about every workout that I do. I can be with my kids. I can still do my job. I can on the weekend enjoy a beer or hang out with my friends or have a nice dinner with my wife. I feel like this is a attainable, achievable, healthy goal.

If your goal is always to be shredded all the time, I think you're probably not gonna be as healthy. Either mentally or even physically. No, I think it still takes effort though. Yeah, so it's not, and it doesn't happen by itself. Right, I wanna, and I think I wanna caution like the message coming right now. Like I don't want to,

oh yeah, fucking don't try and be in great shape. Like take it easy, because it could work. It's gonna work down enough. Just gonna work a bunch of dads that try to justify where the fuck we're at. I don't want to come off like that at all. It's no reflection of where we're at. Yeah, because it really, it still takes effort.

Like, I have to, real quick, I go from dad bought to out of shape if I'm not consistent in the gym. I need to be lifting at least two to three days a week, right? So two to three days a week, I need to be lifting. I need to be making good choices 80 plus percent of the time still. So conscious of what I'm consuming, which also, by the way, goes hand in hand with the training. So my diet technically has to get a little bit

tighter when I let off the training. When I'm training six, seven days a week, I have a lot more flexibility in what I consume. When I let myself go, oh, you know what, I only need to get in the gym two, three times a week. So I'm taking more time with Mac, circuit training and I are traveling, doing things.

Okay, then I actually have to be very conscious of, okay, I am not training that much. I can't get away with very much of the diet, so I have to kind of tighten the diet up. But I still don't have to track. I of, okay, I am not training that much. I can't get away with very much the diet, so I have to kind of tighten the diet up, but I still don't have to track. I'm not weighing, I'm not measuring any of my food. I'm just conscious of the choices that I'm making. It's more like, okay, I can have a meal or two here and there

that is, you know, I'm totally eating it just because I want to enjoy it, has nothing to do with it's probably best for my body, but the remainder of the time, you know, when I have like a craving or want something, I don't just say, okay, I can have that because I'm okay with a dad body. I go, I still need to keep my diet and check.

It's just not as strict. We are out on a weekend, we're all hanging together, have some drinks, I'm okay with that because that's not gonna hurt me that much. I think that's part of it too. And I also like to think that another big component of it is just like seeking foods and things that make you feel healthy and are contributing towards your internal

health. And it's not necessarily this like really like a rigid amount of calories that I have to stay in this certain amount. It's more just like, I'm seeking healthier foods and I'm trying to promote, you know, good gut health and things like for my body for the long term and so a more sustainable approach towards nutrition and training. Yeah, now in my experience too, I noticed that I have to make a mental switch when I'm trying to get shredded

versus when I'm just maintaining relatively good health in my workouts. So when I'm trying to get shredded, I would have to make this mental switch where my focus is the mirror. And here's why, because I would get weaker. I would get weaker in my lips. As I'm working out, the weight that I'm lifting goes down,

I don't have the same, I don't get the same pumps. I'm not able to deadlift or squat or overhead press as much weight. And so rather than getting depressed in my workouts because of that, I start to wear my tank tops and look in the mirror and say, okay, I'm getting leaner, I'm getting more shredded, that's what I'm gonna focus on.

When I'm in the 12%, 13% body fat range, it's performance, how good do I feel? How strong am I? How good is my form? Now, one of those is healthier than the other. It really is. If you have to focus on it, if you had to pick one, and I'm saying that you can never focus on the mirror and do that kind

of stuff, and by the way, I want to make sure that I emphasize that. This episode doesn't mean you can never try to go get shredded. That's not the point here. No, and I also think it's actually healthy to do that. Yeah, I actually think that it's healthy to know that. You're right. I have what it takes. Yes, yes. I'll stand by that all day long. But if you had to pick one, or if I had to pick one for my clients, if I had to absolutely, someone held a gun to my head and said, pick one way for your clients to focus on their workouts,

the mirror or their performance and how they feel. Performance and how they feel, hands down. Hands out, it's much healthier, it's better for longevity, you'll enjoy your workouts much more. And so that's a totally different switch of my workouts. So my workouts actually become healthier for me in the way I train when I allow myself

to be a little bit looser with my diet and I'm sitting around like I said. Now 13%. Okay, so I have a question for you guys. And so when you guys, I know what it is for me, right? So I'm curious to hear if you guys have something somewhere. So when I make this switch of I'm not paying attention to how I look and I just want to maintain and be healthy and be strong, I have numbers like my bench, my squat, my dead of kind of where I need to be.

I know that obviously when I back off from training five, six days a week and I'm dieting hardcore and I'm strict like I was for competing mode, I know where near as strong as I am right now. So I know you're making the case that you're stronger with a little bit higher body fat. I know that I'm gonna lose that because of the volume of training. I'm just my volume of training is dramatically decreased since I've been a father,

but I still have numbers that I'm like, okay, as long as I'm moving this weight for squatting, I'm moving this weight for deadlifting bench press. I see, so you have like a baseline. Yes, I have that same mentality. And there's definitely certain lifts. Like I want to make sure I keep the amount of weight that I was doing before as the standard. And also to like the athleticism and overall movement for me is a big deal. Yeah. You know, like being pain free, but also having abilities. So if I could just like shoot hoops with my kids or like a pickup game or, you know,

throw the ball out at the field, you know, I have those abilities and I'm maintaining that. Yeah, I'd say for me, if I, if I can deadlift and this is a strong exercise for me, okay, but if I can still pull 500 pounds off the floor, I'm, I'm happy. Even 450 would make me happy. If I could squat three plates and feel like I'm pretty good with it, I feel good. If I can overhead press, 135 for sets of eight to 10 reps, I feel pretty good.

I mean, if I start to go way below those, then I'm like, okay, I need to pick up my volume and you can go back to my area. So very similar, right? For me, I go, I'm not maxing out when I'm the dad bod guy, so I'm like, what's what I'm working out with? So if I'm benching and working out with 225 comfortably, that's good for me.

If I'm overhead pressing 135 and working out with that, that's good for me. If I'm able to deadlift 400 pounds and work out with that, that's good for me. If I'm able to squat 300 plus pounds, that's good for me. So those are like my baseline. And there's obviously, and then in this last year,

there's been times where I've dipped below that and all those, and that's always my indicator of like, okay, I'm falling out of Tampa. So that is kind of my home-y-o-stasis or home-based, whatever you want to call it for, or baseline. For okay, I need to kind of pick up my kids' verses, go and look at them in the mirror and go like, oh man, I'm a little fat or a little soft right now, or I'm probably two more percent

body fat. I'm not paying attention to that at all. I'm paying attention to my performance. And then also with Justin said, maybe not as much as the, you know, playing sports although that's probably the desired outcome from it, is I, because I put so much energy and effort into my ankle and my hip mobility and my shoulder mobility, it's just being able to do those things, right? Like I know right away when I get down into a 90-90

and I start to cramp up that I've neglected that. It's like, okay, I'm not doing this enough that that's difficult again for me. So those are all kind of the things that when I'm managing, you know, the quote unquote, dad bod, I'm going, okay, I need to be able to do these things for performance reasons and for strength reasons. I know that I'm managing the quote unquote dad bod, I'm going, okay, I need to be able to do these things for performance reasons and for strength reasons. I know that I'm probably pretty healthy

and I feel better, which is weird and it's still weird for me to accept that. I feel better with where I'm at right now than I did before max. When I was training and when I was competing, training that way, like you said, so I was training and we're, Luna, I was competing, training that way, like you said, so I was getting sick a lot more often. I know that I was no fun to be around.

I know that I'm in the gym six, seven days a week, at least an hour to two hours every day. It's just a lot of commitment and a lot of extra stress in my life to do that. And it's just not a high priority. Yeah, and now make no mistake, a fit and healthy dad bod means you look better than 90% of the people around. So again, I want to make that point. It's not, you know, what you think,

the TV dad bod would be or whatever. Is there a mom bod? Yeah, fit and healthy, right? I think it would be the same thing. That's what I'm thinking. It's like I've got to be the same thing. Fit and healthy, but not shredded. Essentially what it is. You know, if you put on a t-shirt, people will look at you and say, you work out, you look like you're pretty fit. Like that's what a dad bod means. It's not veins, your abs. It's not super shredded, sucked up,

looking in the face or whatever. The thing I like about this message is that I think that part of what, at least when I think back to all the clients I trained, one of the things that was most discouraging. And I remember having a lot of these conversations is we look at magazines and today we look at Instagram, right, we look at these models and these people

in their peak shape and many of them driven by their insecurities and their own fucking issues. And so having a conversation like this, I think is so important because that's where most of my clients truly wanted to be. Yes. They didn't wanted to be. Yes. They didn't want to be, you know, four percent body fat or whatever, but they're being told that all the time

because that's what they're looking at an advertisement or that was what they're looking at social media. They just wanted to be healthy and fit. And when you're, if you're driving towards this magazine look or this Instagram model, that's extremely discouraging because the reality of it is not only is it not healthy to be that way, but even if you get to that point, it's very short-lived. Yeah, it's short. It's phony, a lot of what you see anyways.

There's lots of Photoshop, Doctored, you know, filtered images out there that look really impressive and amazing, but again, like to get to that pinnacle peak sort of look, it really is a short window to sustain. Yeah, it is. Okay, so let's talk about how to get a dad bod. Like, what does the training look like? What does your diet look like? What does it take to get a healthy and what surveys say women prefer

in terms of sexiness and attractiveness type of dad bod? I think number one, the most important thing is to build muscle, okay? If you're 12 or 13% body fat and you sit at a desk all day long and you never lift weights, you don't have the dad bod that we're talking about. You have skinny fat. In fact, recently we had Max Luga here on the show

and he talked about people who were normal weight but metabolically obese. That's the, I think, that the scientific term for skinny fat. Your health probably isn't very good, even though you're not overweight, just because you're to normal body weight doesn't mean you're healthy. Building muscle is number one with this look, and it's also number one in terms of the health benefits that you'll accomplish at that 12, 13, maybe 14 percent body fat. So number one, lift weights.

Now here's the wonderful thing about building a sufficient amount of muscle to give you that look and to be strong. You don't need to train all the time. In fact, for most men, this is no joke. For most men, anywhere between two to four days a week, full body will give you everything you ever want in terms of how you look. Most men, three days a week.

Most guys, if you're in the gym, you're training full body, three days a week, you're going to get the kind of results that we're talking about. In fact, that's how I currently mostly train. In fact, whether I'm shredded or not, that's usually how I train. That's how I get the best. Well, the beauty of that too is it gives you, when you focus on the building to strengthen and putting good muscle on, it gives you a lot more latitude in the other things too. So if you're somebody who likes to have a glass of scotch every once in a while, like Justin, or like have some dessert, like ice cream,

like me every once in a while, because you train that way and you've built enough muscle on your body, it gives you a lot more flexibility in the way you eat versus just somebody who's like, okay, I'm not gonna work out and I'm gonna try to eat good, but then have the occasional hiccup, really tough to maintain a physique that way that's healthy and healthy.

Yeah, and you look like you're actually strong, right? You look like you can actually move some weight. So exercises to focus on, the heavy compound lifts, your back squats and your dead lifts and your overhead press. By the way, these are important if you want to get shredded too. But they're especially important. If you're training three days a week and you're only training three days a week or even two days a week,

get good at those lifts. Well, I think that's why we highlight, the biggest bang for your buck type lifts, the biggest movers because you really don't have to stay in the gym forever. You don't have to do all the things all week long to pull this off. It's really about what are the most effective exercises

and how do I put that together? Three days a week is plenty to get a lot accomplished. I did, and you wanna do the whole body, three days a week. Maps at a ballac is a program, by the way, that's kind of modeled after this. You could also do trigger sessions on the off days if you want to go crazy and add more volume But the core foundational aspect of Maps and Obolic, which is our most by far most popular program is this It's this three-day week full body type of thing. Well, and this goes back to um, I mean how this all started man

You know so over six seven years ago when you first sent me a message on Facebook and showed me maps and a ball. One of the things that I loved about it so much was I realized that like all the magazines and all the workout plans that I had messed with and I'd seen, all of those were geared around intensity and motivation and, you know, these, you know, what's the thing going on? 75 hard and everything is this hype and around intensity and pushing and no days off and the messaging.

When I looked at it, I was like, man, this is so the opposite of the conversations that I was constantly having with my clients. My clients were, my clients want to go 75 hard. None of my clients want to train seven days a week. None of them want to go beast mode, none of them want to train their legs so hard they can't walk the next day, like that's the 1%,

that's not everybody else. Everybody else wants to know, hey Adam, how little can I spend in the gym and have a good physique, be healthy, be strong, be fit, and what that looks like is two, maybe three days a week, and in order to do it and be very efficient and successful with it, it's a full body routine. And mostly focused around the major compound lifts. And that was what, when you send over anabolic, I'm like, oh my god, this is, it's so, the part

about it with the hardest things to market and sell it, is it's simplicity. Is that we're telling you that. We're telling you that, hey, it's only a couple days a week that you need to lift this way. These are the main lifts. You're probably familiar with all of them, but this is the way you piece them together and how you train consistently. If you do this, you're gonna build a great physique.

You're gonna feel great. You're gonna be strong and you're only gonna be in the gym two or three hours a week. That's it. You know what this makes me? I'm thinking right now about the years I spent doing judo,

and jujitsu, and wrestling, and the guys that you would go against that would just, I mean, of course, they're very skill-based sports, but the guys that you would go against that would be just, that would feel like oxes. None of them were super shredded. I mean, there were definitely shredded people who competed, but they were shredded because they wanted to stay

within a certain weight class. But the guys that didn't really care about that, and they'd roll with them in the gym, they were relatively lean, but they were strong as hell. Like, they grab you and you'd feel it, and it's just they kind of emphasize that fitness that you get from being at optimal health, and optimal health for the most part,

for most men is around that you know, around that range and this is the kind of workout that'll accomplish that look and that health and two to three days a week of full body is very maintainable for most men, right? If you if you have a family if you're legitimately a dad, right? You got kids you have a job you're supporting them That's a doable long-term routine. Five, six days a week, that can be tough. That can be tough to stay consistent for very, very long. For most people, unless you're a fanatic, it's very difficult to get. Well, a point I want to make too about maps and a box, and we're talking about it right

now, too, is what I love about it is it offers this for me, but then it also offers, if I want to get shredded, my training doesn't have to change. It's just that this is where the diet part comes in. Correct. Right, so if I want this, this quote unquote, dad bod where I'm kind of hovering around this 12 to 15 comfortable range where I'm strong, I'm fit, I know that what all I need to do is train

like exactly like anabolic two to three times a week, and I have a lot of flexibility on my diet. Means I don't have to say no to a drink on Friday night, date night with my wife. It means that every once in a while I can eat out and not worry about the calories that I'm in taking. But most of the time I'm trying to make good choices. A lot of flexibility there.

But if I decide, hey, in two or three weeks I'm doing something where my shirt's gonna be off or summer's around the corner, I can still fall that routine and just tighten the diet up. You should get rid of the flexibility. Yeah, that's a little more rigid. That's it. Now as far as diet is concerned, this is what it looks like.

80% of the time, you're eating really, really good. 80% of the time, you're eating foods that you have, you know, good macro nutrient profile. Calories are appropriate. It's healthy. It's, you know, quote, unquote, clean. 20% of the time, you're not binging, you're not eating like an asshole, but you're enjoying yourself.

You're going out to dinner, you're having the occasional burger or the occasional, you know, few slices of pizza or the beer with your friends. And for me personally, and I love fitness, I love nutrition, I love all that stuff, this allows me to enjoy those times with my family, with my extended family. We go to my mom's house for Sunday dinner. I'm not sitting down saying, okay, I can't eat that mom, sorry, can't eat that. I'm gonna, I'll have a little bit of everything. I'll enjoy myself. So it's really 80% of time you're eating pretty well, 20% of time you're not eating totally bad, but you're eating because you're enjoying

the people around you and you're enjoying food for its taste and its enjoyment. And this is a diet that strategy that is totally maintained. I would say this, on all the clients that I trained, this is a maintainable diet. The shredded diet which literally looks like 95 to 99% perfect all the time. That's what it is. For me to get 7% body fat, 8%, I'm eating 99%, 95, 99% of the time perfect. That is not maintainable for most people.

It was really funny, the transition that I went through with my family after competing, because it was almost, it was about three and a half, almost four years of like really hardcore consistency. So for almost four years, my family got used to seeing me carry Tupperware, turning down, going out somewhere, like, you know, I just brought my own food.

So I show up or, you know, every once some of my family would ask and be like, what can I make you? So it's, you know, that you can eat it and you can have it. And so it took almost a body, I'd say two years after that, where I finally got to a place where people understood that that's not my like, just because I'm a fitness person, that doesn't mean like that's how I eat all the time.

I was in competition mode, like I was trying to accomplish something really, really hard to do with eating out or eating whatever you guys are serving. So that was the hardest thing, was to get through that transition, and I still would get family members That would be like oh are you are you not into fitness anymore?

Are you like making it? Yeah, I'm like no yeah, no, I can I can eat this way and still be healthy and fit I just can't this is what I can't do I'm also trying to be 3% body fat and get on stage So yeah, I probably just recently got over that maybe I don't know six months to a year ago did finally like it the it compute for the family It's I'm normal. I promise. Yeah, and also you know when you have kids too I think this is a way better example than the perfect 99% of the time die because it mimics more of what real life is supposed to be like and To be honest with you. I don't think it's a good, this is something I hated doing

where my kids and my family would eat a particular way and then my meal would be very, very different. And they're seeing dad do this thing where he's eating a, well, why am I eating this way and you're eating that way? And I would explain to them, you know, when they were real young, so I would explain kind of to the point

where they would understand. But I wouldn't wanna live that way. I wouldn't wanna live like that all the time. I don't think that necessarily is a great message and children definitely learn more from watching them. Yeah, and you got to think to them going over to their friends' houses, like other places where there has to be

like that level of relatability there. Like so it's not so far out of the norm of what they require versus their friends. So it just helps with the friendships and overall feel of hanging out. Like you're a lot more likely to be asked over to. And I think it's important while we're talking about diet too, that I don't want anyone to think

the people that are weighing and measuring or dial with their food, this is definitely not shaming you. I mean, and I see tremendous value in doing that. I still think that that's an important process of learning what you should be eating for your body. So this doesn't mean like, oh, if you're somebody who's thinking about getting in shape

and then you hear a mind pump guy say, like, oh, just eat this way or just do this, that I still don't think that everybody at some point in their life should track, measure, weigh, really learn about, you know, macros and calories and what their body needs and what a normal month or weeks look like of training and eating. So I see value in that. Even if I do another sports example here, we have seasons, right? And so the thing is like, you got goals. And if you have a goal, that's very intense and specific, that's awesome. That's amazing. But then, you know, what And if you have a goal, that's very intense and specific, that's

awesome, that's amazing. But then, you know, what are you going to do for all the rest of the time? And I think that, you know, people don't really think about that as much as when they're in it. Like, this is going to be how I'm always going to be in so rigid. You got to think longer than that. And that's important. I would say the one macro nutrient that I still pay attention to when I'm eating like the protein. Yeah. I'm just, I'm trying to get and make sure I eat adequate protein, which for me, for muscle building and strength purposes, is anywhere between 150 to 200 grams of protein a day. So the goal essentially is eat healthy 80% of the time, but also hit my protein targets.

So make sure I get those that many grants. I love that piece of advice and hack, because we, over all the years of training clients, one of the thing, protein is the most neglected. If you separate the body builder community and all the, and you just talk about the normal people that are trying to get in shape, protein is the most neglected macro nutrient.

And it's probably one of the most important and crucial when it comes to building a physique and getting stronger, building muscle, right? So I agree with you, Salon. What's beautiful about that is just focusing on that, as a side effect, you end up eliminating a lot of things. If I'm just looking at protein and going like, okay, this is how many grams of protein I need,

and I'm focused on that versus saying, I can't have this, I can't have need. And I'm focused on that versus saying, I can't have this, I can't have that, but I'm focused on what I need to get. It naturally eliminates a lot of the processed foods, a lot of the carbohydrates that I don't need, sugars, things like that, because I'm so focused on making sure I hit that number.

And then when it ends up happening because protein's so satiating, after I get my targets, I don't feel like I've got these cravings. Exactly. So if it's three meals in a day for me, then I'm aiming for about 50 grams of protein per meal. And I'll eat that first because that's a big chunk of protein.

It is, and you eat a big piece of steak or some chicken, you know, you're gonna feel relatively satiated. Then you're gonna go on and eat maybe your healthy carbohydrates, your vegetables. You're probably not gonna wanna, you gonna wanna eat a whole bag of chips or cookies or dessert afterwards. So it's a really, really good target.

Now the other 20% of the time, that's when I'm, oh, we're gonna have burgers and fries or, okay, meeting up my mom's house, she can make her homemade pasta or whatever, then it becomes less of an important thing. But 80% of the time, that's what's happening. And combine that with a good workout, you're going to look muscular and relatively lean, you're going to have a nice dad-bod fit type of

physique. Now here's another component that I think is real important, this is a big part of it, and I think this is a very important part of it, is don't obsess. This is kind of the big part of this, and now I'm speaking to the fitness fanatics, to those of us who have a tendency to obsess over diet and exercise. Don't do it. Learn to enjoy the other things in life, the important things in life. Now, I don't mean enjoy life in the sense that you're going to be, you know, hedonistic with your food. Sometimes people think that's what it means. Oh, enjoy life. That means I'm going to go binge. That's not enjoying life. I mean, enjoy life, that means I'm gonna go binge.

That's not enjoying life. I mean, enjoy the real things in life. Your family, your friends, connecting with the people around you. Where it's not super important that you eat absolutely perfect, it's not super important that you work out every single day. It's literally a more relaxed, balanced mental state way.

Yeah, I think even too. We're so stressed out in general, just from work and everything else too, and family, and relationships. You need to really focus on enjoying training, enjoying what you're eating, and those things that benefit you. I feel like it can teeter into a really unenjoyable experience where you're hammering and punishing yourself all the time to make those,

you know, those like really rigid restrictions and those windows of calories and, you know, being able to hit all your targets perfectly that you miss sight of what you're really, you know, needing to enjoy. Well, this is also why I love the two to three-day week full body type of routine is, you know, if you're a trolley training two to three days in a week, I mean, that's, that you used to still got four days, four to five other days of the week where you don't have to

train. So maybe I set it up where I say Monday, Wednesday, Friday are the days I prefer to train. But let's say Friday comes along and Katrina texts me in the middle of the day and says, hey, as soon as you get off of work and we shoot out and take Max to the beach. And I'm like, absolutely. Even though it's Friday, I'm supposed to get my workout after work is over. That's okay. I'll push it this Saturday. We're all pushing it this Sunday. And I still stay on track with my goals and my routine because I've allowed myself that flexibility like that. That's what I, versus doing like a body part split,

where I need to be in the gym, five days a week, missing a day because I wanna go do something with my son and Katrina all sudden throws off that whole routine. And now either what, I missed a muscle group for that week, and now I'm playing catch up the entire time or I'm stressing over, oh God, I didn't do this, and that's my weak muscle group. It's like doing a full body, two to three day type of routine

gives me so much latitude or being able to flexibility to move a day over if I wanna do something that all of a sudden takes a priority like my family. Yeah, and you said something too, Justin, you said enjoy your workouts. I enjoy my workouts more in this state than I do in the more obsessive, you know, get shredded state.

I talked about earlier how I feel stronger, I feel more mobile. I'm not worried as much about how I look, so I literally have my t-shirt or my sweater on, and I'm in the gym, and I'm just lifting heavy, listening to good music, having a great time, having a lot of fun, and feeling good, it's definitely a different feeling

in the workout, and it is almost therapeutic. It is, and it's less obsessive in the sense that I'm not focusing on the parts of my body that I need to change the way I look. I may say, you know, I know I need to hit this part of my shoulder or whatever, I don't care. I wanna do these overhead carries, because that's more fun, or I wanna do this farmer walk

because that's a little bit more fun. So the workouts take on a different feeling and it's along those lines of not obsessing as I'm in the gym and I'm just enjoying what I'm doing. Well, and then that's the lifting part. It also looks different like when you talk about cardio and movement. You know, when I'm focused on competing,

you know, you have scheduled cardio sessions and I'm getting up first thing in the morning and doing all this stuff, when I'm trying to stay in shape and just maintain that kind of 12 to 15% range, it just means being active and making that a part of my lifestyle. I mean, this is where I love the things. And again, this goes back to the average person that I would train, is starting to create good habits of, hey, after dinner, we go for a walk for 20 or 30 minutes, maybe on Saturdays, we'd love especially

when it's good weather outside, we'd like to go out and just go do for a hike for two hours, you know? It's easy, it's not like it's a strenuous and hard, we gotta get in the gym to do it, it's just making choices to be active and creating habits around things that you already currently do and creating movement. Now, the best form of cardio, we can label it cardio,

but the best form of cardiovascular or activity, calorie burning type activity, it's not resistance training. Our forms of walking, so walking, hiking are the best. And there's a few different reasons why. Number one, does it require equipment? Does it require tons of mental setup? Like I'm gonna go push myself real hard.

But also, most people can walk okay. Most people need to learn how to run properly. Most people need to learn how to do other forms of cardio properly. Walking means you just get up and do what we still do. It's still not like the world of Wally, the cartoon when everybody's in there, little floating chairs or whatever. Not yet, it was just.

People still can walk. Most people can't run, but, little floating chairs or whatever. Not yet, it was. People still can walk. Most people can't run, but people still can walk or hike. Those are my favorite forms of activity. And then here's a big one, since we're talking about dad bod, you know, means you could probably have kids, you don't have to, but you probably have kids if you're literally the dad, right? Play.

You go out and play. What a great way to get some activity. Take the kids out and play what a great way to get some activity take the kids Outside and play hide and go seek or tag or throw a frisbee or some kind of game that requires lots of movement It's one of the greatest ways to do your cardio and here's the best part Forget the cardio spend time with your kids and you have a lot of fun So this is like definitely near and dear to me right so when we were at where Sal's at right now, right? Like the first weeks and the first few months

of having a baby, everybody was telling me, oh, soak it all up and it's so amazing because he sleeps on your chest. Sooner or later, he'll be crawling and then he'll be walking and running all over the place and then you guys are gonna be running around. And people kept telling me that, it was gonna be so awful.

And I remember Katrina and I looking at each other going like, I don't know, man, this, where we're at right now, this watch a Netflix all day long and having the baby sleep on us and you feeding every two hours like crazy, like we are getting cabin fever. And you know, being health and fitness people

and people that like to be outside and exercise, I was so excited for when he got to the place where he was running around. And now it's become a new habit in my life. So what my routine looks like is, when I come home from work, the first thing I do, I walk straight in the bathroom, I wash my hands, I go right up to my son, I see my son,

and he's so excited to see me, I grab him, Katrina and I get ready, and then we head right over to the park that's around the corner from us. And then we spend like two hours, and what I'm chasing him around and playing with him and throwing the ball to him, I'm getting down in my squat and scroll position,

messing around in 90, 90, and doing like, and it's not a workout for me, it's just activity. And what it doubles as I like to think of being a good father, as being present with my son and being active and being a part of his life. And so because of that, it's such a huge win for me. I'm not stressed at it. Am I building a bunch of muscle?

Am I becoming the most mobile guy ever? No, none of that stuff. It's like, I'm addressing some of those things, but the most important thing is that I'm spending time with him. Totally. Here's another thing is go do shit, go fix stuff around the house, go mow your lawn. Like I remember this hit me kick in the face like years ago, right?

I remember I had to go do my yard work, which was like mow the front lawn, mow the back lawn, clean it the leaves, trim that whatever. And I thought to myself like, damn it, I'm not gonna have time to do cardio. And I remember I said that out loud. I'm like, wait a minute. This is the stupidest thing.

Oh, this dawned on me too. I've been preaching this, like, this is the latest thing over the last year too, where I'm just like, dude, all that energy you're putting on the treadmill could be used around your yard, could be used around organizing things in your house, like doing manual things that are productive

and moving your family yourself, everything moving forward, where otherwise it's just like burned energy out into the abyss. And you actually burn more calories. I know years ago when the devices that can measure actual calories burned, the first one was called the body bug. And remember, my clients would wear them,

and I would track their activity. And it was so wild to me to see that they would burn more calories. Crush the calories. Yeah, they would burn more calories on a Saturday when they didn't have any workout scheduled. They had no cardio scheduled. And I'd see their charts and I'd be like,

man, you burn. 30% more calories. Cateries washing dishes. Yeah, what were you doing? Oh, I washed my cars, and then we went to the mall and walked around, and you know, versus Thursday when they did 30 minutes of cardio, and then they trained with me.

And then it dawned on me like, you burn more calories and you got a bunch of stuff done, you know, like, that's the kind of cardio that I think you should seek out, especially if you literally are a dad, but even if you're not, go do some fun stuff. Like, you don't need to schedule activity. Just go outside, go hiking, go climbing,

go fix something, go clean something, and there you go, there's your activity. Go outside, do your yard work, wash your cars. There's three hours of cardio right there. Oh, it enhances your lifestyle, everything benefits. And if you're married, your wife will probably want to have sex with you because you did all the stuff that you're supposed to do.

It's a secret hack. Instead of doing a bunch of cardio. Look, MindPump is recorded on video as well as audio. So come check us out on YouTube, MindPump Podcast. You can also find all of us on Instagram. Make sure you search for us. You can find Justin at MindPump Justin. You can find me at MindPumpSale, Adam at MindPump Atom, and Doug, the producer at MindPumpDog.

Doug, the jug. Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy, and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB Superbundle at Mind Pump Media.com. The RGB Superbundle includes maps and a ballad, maps for performance, and maps aesthetic.

Nine months of phased, expert exercise programming designed by Sal Adam and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels, and performs. With detailed workout blueprints in over 200 videos, the RGB Superbundle is like having Sal Adam and Justin as your own personal trainer, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Superbundle has a full 30-day money bag guarantee and you can get it now plus other valuable free resources at MindPumpMedia.com. If you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five-star rating and review on iTunes and by introducing MindPump to your friends and family.

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