Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 164: Genetics vs. Steroids

Episode Date: October 12, 2015

Can steroids give you the added edge to take you from good to great in athletics and the muscle building game? How important are genetics to these pursuits? Sal, Adam & Justin reveal just how much of an edge steroids will give you and how to maximize performance and results. Please subscribe, rate and review this show! Learn more about Mind Pump at www.mindpumpradio.com

If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mite, pop, mite, pop with your hosts. Salda Stefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. Skapadoo, mulu, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batapoo, batap batapoo, bat Yeah, but you know what every once in a while when we start recording I Can tell when all of our testosterone levels are over 5,000 And it's not even my final form 9000 anyway, hey cartoon reference. I'm here with the the one and only small trap sell to Stefano. Big legs though. Small trap big. The Justin Andrews. And who you you you just heard talking is our own beautiful and wonderful immaculate starfish hole. Two point four. Get out. Adam shape. I almost said

you were going to fully compliment me. I was like, oh, no, I feel bad about saying it about your small traps. No, not that small. No, not at all. I don't know. I can almost see him from here. God, I'm sitting right next to you. All right, bro, what's your plan?

Oh, hey, so you had a plan. What's your plan? I, you know what I did yesterday. That's your plan. Let's hear it. No, no, no, I, um, I watched the CrossFit documentary. Oh, the one on, uh, what's his name, Froning?

Rich Froning, yeah, Froning. I'm Froning that you did that. Yeah, was it good? You're right. Yuck, yuck, yuck, yuck. Well, before you start, the dude is an animal. Well, let me, let me, uh, enlighten you guys. So he's not an animal?

First of all, um, I, I, I, you know, this, this reminds me of when I was a young kid. So we, everybody knows, if you listen to mind pump, we talk a lot of trash about CrossFit. Sure. Because we just for programed cars, we're all, okay, not talking shit about the athletes. No, we are all huge fans of the sport. It's a great sport. I love watching. Yeah. I love watching the sport of it. So isn't that such a backhanded compliment? Right. Ever.

Yeah. So you guys are so awesome, but you're so dumb. Yeah. At the same time. Hey, sometimes a little backhand creases the excitement if you know what I mean. Yeah. Capoe. So that being said, when I was younger, I used to, it used to always bother me when,

and I know this, I'm gonna take a real crazy left turn here. How do you get sad? No, no, no. You used to bother me when people would talk about their religion, and they would talk about how great it is, but then they know nothing about any other religion. And I just find that, I've always had a problem with that. And I grew up in the church and I've thought that.

So I grew up, uh... Well, can I say something real quick? Yeah, of course I know you have something to say. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, Ghosts not at all my wife's Catholic my kids go to Catholic school So I'm not talking shit. Here's here's there we go when you know when you watch an athlete and then they they do they win an event And the first thing they do is like I just want to thank God. Yeah, right? I would love because apparently God controls everything. I would love just for shits and giggles to see them blame God one time for a loss Just a bounce it out Adam Adam you just lost your competition. You got 15 play. You know how like, like, like, just a bounce out. Adam, Adam, you just lost your competition. You got 15 play. You know, how do you feel?

Yeah. Well, I would just like to blame God. I was just not trained enough for this. It was God. What's going on? No, no, it's God's fault. God didn't want me to win. So I just like to blame God on that.

You know, anyway, that was funny. Fair enough. Okay. So, that being said, I'm not somebody, you know, who just decided to pick on CrossFit, and I don't know anything about CrossFit. I did CrossFit for before, before most people knew what the fuck CrossFit was, you know, it originated here in Santa Cruz.

Yeah. And I'm connected to three of the top 10, you know, CrossFit guys in the world right now. So I know them, hey, and we're not like the best of friends or anything, but I have some very, yeah, definitely not. I have some really good friends that are connected to them. And we're not like the best of friends or anything, but I have some very good friends that are connected to them. And so, you know, I've got a relationship with those people, and I'm very familiar with it. And in addition to that, I like to all read articles about

that are that's pro crossfit, all watch documentaries and stuff like that. Because I'm fascinated by it, regardless if I'm a believer in it as a way of fitness, you know, I definitely 100% disagree with it as a way of fitness, but you know what, as a sport and I think it's cool. I think it's very cool and it's very neat and fascinating to watch. And some of these athletes like this guy are fucking unreal.

Like, so the title. The title. You can take punishment. Yeah, crazy. Dude, so check this out, okay. And the reason why I want to talk about this, because I think you guys will enjoy this topic because it kind of segues into a lot of things that we kind of talk about already. And it's a great way to revisit some of these topics.

Um, the dude, okay, if you don't know who rich front of it, he is one, uh, the mind pump. These one, the mind pump. These were the mind pump game. Yeah. He's going to say that. We start that. What would the mind pump will come up? What the best verbal assaults via Instagram? He drank five beers and held

us pissed for two hours. Because that's what we do. So he won the CrossFit Games four years in a row. And he's not this crazy massive guy. And he's definitely jacked. I mean, he's super ripped. He's five eight and a hundred ninety five pounds

and negative one. He's five eight. Yeah, he's five eight. Yeah, he's a little guy. Like that's little. I thought he was taller than that. No, he's only five eight. They actually do all his dimensions at the end of the thing.

They actually show you all his measurements. That's kind of cool. He's a brick. He's a little brick. Yeah. He's definitely a little bit gay, but he is only he's 5, 895, which 195 pounds and only 5, 8. I dance.

I usually weigh around that and I'm six foot and I'm not as lean as he is. Yeah. Dense, right? So he is dense as well. I mean, he is a he is a badass. So you have to what I love and I watch things like this. And it doesn't matter if it's documentary or if it's for something I have to, what I love, and I watch things like this, and it doesn't matter if it's documentary, even it's for something I'm pro, not I always,

I don't know why with this, and I know you guys are like this, because we're all weird like this. I watch shit like that, of course I do it when I'm high, so it slows everything down, it's my thing. If I'm watching, just so you guys know, I'll just put that out there right now. If I'm watching TV, which I don't do a lot of it,

it's I'm probably still. Usually it's a really stimpy. Yeah, I'm sitting down, putting my feet up, what's neat, uh, if, if those that are not so basically, you don't remember much of what you know, not it. I just, I disagree with that theory. I, you know, uh, when, when I, when I, uh, smoke canvases, and oh, yes, I see everything in slow motion. In fact, smoking and watching a show that is...

We don't advocate this by the way, just wanted to say. Thanks for the disclaimer. We do not agree with everything that I've said on the show. I'm so free to say that you do everything. Yeah, so when I watch shows, if I watch an ABC show or whatever, I can just see the bad acting.

It's like in slow motion, I can see it. It's crazy how it, but if I'm not, if I'm sober and I'm watching it, don't even notice it. You're right. Okay. I could totally, I could pick apart something like that. So, of course, I'm sitting here and I'm watching this, and that's what I'm doing to this. I'm like looking at all the little subtle things that they do. It's obviously a documentary that was probably finance. I don't know this for sure. Okay, so this is just my opinion of what I think. Oh, it's set on there. Oh, did it? Yeah, that it was promoted by CrossFit.

Oh, yeah. And it was obvious because all our journals are by CrossFit. All their articles by CrossFit. Yeah. Website, everything. CrossFit. And it's so, I mean, it's got the all American music playing in the background.

Every time they interview them and they're talking to them, there's a huge American flag as the backdrop behind them. I mean, playing in the background. Every time they interview him and they're talking to him, there's a huge American flag as the backdrop behind him. I mean, it's just like. Marry a kid. They adopted a baby, so he's like kissing the baby in himself. Like it's just like all these clips and it's like. Well, they're not.

Well, I told you this. I didn't even watch the documentary, but you told us you were watching it. They need, they want, because any sport will explode if they have a super star. Super hero star. Like look what happened to bodybuilding because of Arnold Schwarzenegger.

Yeah. Because of Arnold Schwarzenegger and pumping iron, bodybuilding went from circus freaks in the background to a sport that then influenced how others got on the outside. Are they fond? Yeah. Right. Let me tell you what I,

and so this is their Michael Jordan. They need this, they build them up and they want him to be this, and you could see that, okay, and that's why I find even like some documentary is funny because, you know, and I don't know. I have no idea what this guy's real home life. If he, maybe he is the all-American guy

and he just kisses babies and is great to his wife and he's just this perfect dude. I'm a dude. But when he described his training and I saw what he did to train to get ready for these competitions and stuff and I thought to myself, he's four weeks out and this happens, right?

He's four weeks out from his fourth, like most important win for him going after it, right? And they adopt a baby. And there's this like subtle part in it where he's like kissing the baby and the guys record him and asking so that and he mentions that it's the first time with the baby. And they do all these clips with him, you know, changing the diaper and doing this stuff. But you can, you can tell by the way he's with the baby that I don't know how much time he actually has spent. Yeah, with, but it's not how they portray it.

You know what I'm saying? They portray it completely different, you know, because, and I'm thinking to myself, I know how much he's training because he tells us and shows us how much he trains for this. And I'm thinking like, wow, that's pretty impressive to be able to do that while having a newborn. That's tough. So, well, the fact that he won, didn't he win it? Yes. He obviously, in dramatic fashion too.

Yeah, so he obviously trained. So, if you don't know how the CrossFit Games works, it works like this. So, there's, it's over the course of two or three days. I forget it's at least two days. It might be three days I'm not 100% off on that which to me that aspect of the of the sport is the most impressive to me because as with any sport you have to peak On one you know one day one event, you know with this He's got you have to peak maximum performance over three days.

And so here's what, and this is what makes him so impressive. And this is what everybody who competes against him, they what they say and what's known in the community, it's like everybody else, everyone there is competing for second place, rich dominates it. And even if he's losing or is behind on Sunday, he destroys everybody. So you got to like, whoa, what is up with this guy?

So his ability to hold with Stan Cushman. Like he's in the tank. So here's a couple of things that I learned about the guy watching this documentary, Fascinating. Okay. First of all, they actually had clips of him as a child like playing sports. The dude was amazing in everything. Of course. He was amazing in football. He was playing sports. The dude was amazing in everything. Of course.

He was amazing in football. He was amazing in basketball. He was amazing in baseball. He was amazing in anything that he did. Of course. And they have all these, they have footage of him like as a running back, breaking tackles, running, running for touchdowns, left and right. They have him baseball, stealing play.

But CrossFit turned him into a super athlete. And this is why I love to talk about this. So then it goes, that doesn't make sense. So then it goes better, right? So then I'm like, okay, so this guy was just a genetic freak from birth. And you can see, and they basically are proving that by showing you what he looked like.

And he was a Katrina and I were watching, you could see him at like nine, 10 years old. He already had a physique on him as a kid. You know, like he just was built. If you saw a picture of me at nine or 10, you'd be like, someone please feed that poor kid. Exactly, right? You see my ribs, right?

So the guy is genetic free. Then you find out, you find out how this guy trains. Okay, you guys have all seen like how a CrossFit Wad is put together and stuff, right? This motherfucker does four of those a day. Oh my god He blew it. Wait, wait. He blows four wads a day He blows for four wads a day That's more than that one time

But I can't do more than two nowadays. Yeah, after that. I get sore. I'm maybe one walk May I maybe one a day. That's my extra me Maybe it's a lot of toilet paper. The honesty of this podcast is just fucking amazing. It was unreal to see somebody be able to, and here's the thing, that's the reason why he's dominant, that's the way no one can touch him and catch him, is because he is literally a genetic freak that trains like he's a genetic freak. You know what's funny?

Right. When you're competing in a sport like CrossFit, which is just fucking brutal, brutal on the body. Right. The one who has the, the person who has the genetics who can withstand the most punishment is probably gonna be the best.

You know what I'm saying? Unlike other sports, unlike other sports where maybe the person with the genetics who's the fastest or person with the genetics who's able to keep calm, like archery or shooting where these people who can slow the heart rate down and aim and by the way, you know what a performance enhancing drug is for archery and for shooting?

A beta blocker. A beta blocker. Drugs that slow the heart rate. It's the same for anybody like a musician in the orchestra. Yeah, to calm them down, right? So for a CrossFit sport, you're the only person. Probably the guy that could do the most workouts

without getting injured and fucking it's fun. And what proves that point even more is, so they take you through all his events, it's kind of cool. So you get to see all his events on days one and two or whatever, I think it's two, maybe it's three days, two days, I don't remember, but I think it's a total of 10 events that he has to compete in over the course

I believe two days. And he, one of them throwing a softball. He's taking ninth, say, the first day, he takes like ninth place or 15th place in the swim. He takes ninth place with this rope climb thing they do. He takes, he doesn't take first in anything. He's like, I think the best he did in something was like second in like one of the, one of the lifts that he's better at than everybody else. Like his, his ability

to like overhead squat and clean and jerk stuff. Like he's just, he's a bad actor. He just can survive better than the rest of those. And because of how he trains to, he's a generic and then he trains like that to handle that every single day for to, I mean, he's got that already, right? So then here comes Sunday. Sunday comes around first place, first place, first place. Because everybody's fried. Yep. On all the events, they blew their watch.

He is just like getting everybody, dude, getting everybody. I mean, it was, it was, it was cool to watch. I mean, it's, it's funny. You know, they call them the fittest man in the world and everything. No, yeah, no. No, he's the best crossfitter in the world. Yes, I fucking hate. Yeah, well, it's, I mean, it's a documentary, right?

They're gonna put a nice title on it and make it look like it's awesome. Yeah, but they even had people come on and like talk about it to like, you know, oh, he's the fittest man in the world. Probably, they talked about saying too, he is, only had people challenging cross fitter on there. No, no, no, they did not have to make a course.

I don't know. Number one, cross fitter in the world enters in a amateur Olympic did not. Of course, of course. No, no, no, no. And CrossFit in the world enters an amateur Olympic lifting competition. Just 15 place. Yeah. Yeah. Probably a lot lower. Yeah, if that.

World CrossFit champion enters a triathlon. Loses, you know what I mean? Yeah. They're excellent at what they do. Yeah. But I think this is, this is. It's playing ping pong. There's people trying to make claims that he's

the greatest athlete that ever lived and all this stuff. I tell you, whoa, bro. No, there's been more dominant athletes ever lived and all this stuff like that. And we will, bro. If I get slow. No, there's been more dominant athletes in other sports. Look at Michael Phelps for fuck's sake. Oh, yeah. The guy was so dominant. It was like, it's almost scary. He's a phenom.

Look at Lance Armstrong. Look at, you know, any of these athletes that don't, I mean, you know, they're the best of what they do. He's the best at what he does. I mean, that there's no doubt about it. I mean, it just, it reminds me of just like the modern day gauntlet. It should just be called punishment games. Yeah.

That's all it is. You're surviving some gauntlet. Well, I'll tell you what, you know what this is? And I didn't die this time. How? That first place, this, this, this is great because you're bringing up that whole point about being a genetic, you know, genetic anomaly,

being that point zero zero one percent of the world that can perform at a certain level. I'll use an example of a sport that I followed since its inception that in the beginning it wasn't about that. It wasn't about, because there were so many factors, I'm talking about mixed martial arts. And when MMA first came to the US, I used to love watching it back in the news. It wasn't about who was the craziest genetic anomaly in terms of physical ability.

It was about who understood how to fight the best and how to make the other fighter have to fight your fight. And so you had this genetic weakling, which literally hoist Gracie, who won the first three, he would get his ass kicked in any sport. And that was dependent on strength, speed, and power. Gracie who won the first three, he would get his ass kicked in any sport. That was dependent on strength, speed, and power. The guy's not strong, the guy's not fast.

He was the skinny dude. The filthiest technique ever. But, but, but, is Jiu Jitsu, and his, no, you know, it's funny. You know, it's funny, for Jiu Jitsu, he's not even the best. His brother, Hixing, could fucking mop the floor with him. And even today, even if you took him in his prime and put him in a Jiu Jitsu tournament, he'd get his ass kicked. It's just that he knew Jiu-Jitsu and the other guys didn't.

And for a long time, MMA was dominated by these guys that understood technique, which is really what martial arts is all about. Cause look, you take 1,000 people, 1,000 random people, you're probably not gonna even have one person, one of them is gonna be in the top. 1% of the world in terms of genetic abilities. So most people are average, that's what average means. So martial arts are supposed to set you up to be in the top. 0.1% of the world in terms of genetic abilities. So most people are average. That's what average means.

So martial arts are supposed to set you up to be able to defend yourself against a bigger, stronger, meaner opponent. And that's what Jiu-Jitsu did very well and it was established. Now when you watch mixed martial arts because it's so evolved, you have to be well crafted in like five things, either.

Now everybody's good at everything. It's the best athlete. Now it's the genetic freaks that are winning. You said I'm saying. You're right. Like all of them are good at Jiu-Jitsu, all of them are good at wrestling, all of them best athlete. Now it's the genetic freaks that are winning. You see what I'm saying? Like all of them are good at jujitsu, all of them are good at wrestling, all of them kick kickbox, all of them kebox.

Now it's the genetic anomaly. That's it. It's made its way in. And it's gonna keep going that way. Now you're gonna have people who are like NFL athlete, caliber, you know, who now know how to fight. And they're the ones that are gonna win because when you have two people

who know how to fight very well and their skills very good, and they meet each other, it's the guy who's the better genetic freak. And that's what high level sports is. Well, it's, and now I'm sad. Did you, did you consider watch, did you ever watch that Ted talk together

that I thought was just so? Yes, we did, we discussed it. I wish episode on it. Did we do an episode on it? We did, we did. That was, I wish I remember the name of it so I could plug it again because it was so fascinating to me because I talked about this, just the evolution of science.

And I was, I tell you what, man, I used to say it. I mean, I for sure, in my head, I truly believe that the difference between the super athlete now and the super athlete 40 years ago was performance enhancement drugs. I would, I would have said that for, I was, I would argue that till I died until I saw that title. When I saw that it shattered my paradigm. No, what they did is completely shattered my paradigm. He proved it and he proved it very, very well.

And we should, you know what, we'll get the name Justin, maybe when you post on our Instagram page at Mind Pump, you could put like the name of it so people can find it. Very cool, very cool, that's awesome. But this guy proved that the major advancements in sports, the major reasons why records have been broken for so many years and why they continue to be broken, is for two reasons, and it's not performance and intention drugs.

One is better equipment, much more advanced equipment, more advanced pools, more advanced tracks, bike tracks, all that stuff. Number two is what they call the democratization of sports, where athletes are becoming specialized for a particular sport, not because they're training a specialized, but because they're born and picked for it.

Hands selected. Right, because 50 years ago, 60 years ago, the, or maybe even further before that, the perfect athlete was considered somebody who could do anything. So someone who is the best swimmer, they would try and pick out this guy who was like 5, 10, 170 pounds, and that was the model athlete for every sport, shot put, wrestling, boxing. Now, now the best shot putter looks nothing like the best long distance runner who looks nothing like the best weightlifter who looks nothing like

the best triathlete, you know, they're all born a specific way and then on top of that, they have all the training in the course. And then when you add performance enhancing drugs, that adds a little bit, but not a ton, but it adds a little bit, but we've said this before. But that's how the one percent competes against each other.

Exactly. It's not what got them there. Exactly. That's such a great point right there. That is such a great point is that that is what separates the 1%ers. Right. Right.

Well, that level then every little bit really gets them. Yeah. What really gets them to that level is they are genetically built for that. They've trained their asses off all their entire life to the technique. Everything. Yes, to get there. And then what makes superstar one better than superstar two could be some performance enhancement

drugs. It could tip the scale just that slight bit. Absolutely. But like I said, if you take me, for example, you could put me, and I don't have bad genetics, I have average, or maybe a little better than average, you could put me on the most scientific, crazy stack of steroids and anabolic hormones in the world, and I would never win, Mr. Olympia. I would never be an NFL. No, no, no.

I would never play in the NFL. You could give me all the drugs in the way. You could have the best scientists in the world construct the best drug concoction, put me on it for the next five years, and I would definitely look different, I'd probably, you know, I'd definitely perform better than I do now, but I wouldn't, I wouldn't be able to touch these guys at this level.

Because that's, I wasn't born that way. I've seen it firsthand with athletes that I played with that wanted to go to the next level, so bad that they just compromised, and they just, they got jacked, but they still couldn't compete. No, you could not compete with with their, you know, these genetic phenomenons.

Now, one thing that I did because I'm extremely, and you guys are the same way, I know you guys are. I'm very competitive, I'm very driven, I wanna achieve success in whatever I do, whether it's working out, whether it's, you know, business or whatever. Once I got old enough to understand that, at first I was kind of sad, like, fuck,

like no matter what I do, I'll never be able to be looked like Arnold or I'll never be able to. But here's one thing that I do tell myself that I firmly believe in. And whether I'm right or wrong, it doesn't fucking matter. Here's what I firmly believe in. I firmly believe in that I can work,

I can not work anybody, and that I have a better attitude than anybody. And whether that's true or not, really doesn't matter because the fact that I believe that is what propels me to be the best me that I'll ever be. Once you understand that, you can really hone in to who you are, you know, your skills, and you can keep refining that to be the ultimate.

Right. And that's all you have to be concerned about right. Yeah, so true Yeah, so so true. I was a genetically gifted with a big mouth or fucking cursed. We don't know yet You know, I just like us. I like us talking. I mean the other day we're all on you know our buddy Joe Donnelly One of my favorite guys if you guys don't follow him already. I think I've plugged in once before oh We've plugged in my five times. Yeah, you know, I buddy Joe Donnelly, one of my favorite guys, if you guys don't follow him already, I think I've plugged in once before. Oh, we've plugged in my five times, you know, I've got a slight man crush. Dude, it's, you know what, like, you have anyone, you guys haven't even had sex yet. No, no, no, no, yeah.

They talked about it. I just, I just love, I love people with no filters. I love people with no filters. I'd rather take somebody who's going to slightly offend somebody ever once in a while and is politically incorrect than the person who yeah, exactly. So I love the realness behind the guy. And you know, people, boy, they just love to come after him about being natural or unnatural. And he gets so much shit for being this guy who claims he's natural, he's 250 pounds shredded to to the bone and of a freak.

And I've met him in person and I can tell when someone is or is not for the most of time. Not always. Yeah, not exactly. You know, there's, there's people, but there's some things that I feel like it's sometimes someone who is on it. Sometimes you can or cannot or what that because depending on how well they use it. But somebody who is 100% natural, I can normally tell pretty for sure on what they look

like. And he in real-per-in-life, and when you meet the guy, he looks natural. You could tell that a lot of his, the reason why he looks the way he does in terms of musculariness, because he's, works out hard and he's got crazy genes. Yeah, he's incredibly dense. If you put it, if we stand next to each other, I look a lot bigger than he does, but he's crazy, he's bigger, he's, yeah, it weighs you. He's now, he's 250 pounds, I'm 230,

he's got 20 pounds, I mean, he's only got one inch on me. He squats about five times of what I can squat, but you also, I've seen pictures of him. It's another example of being able to take that like crazy amount of punishment. Like he, well, he'd be amazing at CrossFit. Didn't you play the NFL? Yeah, yeah. And you can well, he'd be amazing at CrossFit. Didn't you play in the NFL? Yeah.

Yeah. And you can see that he was, he's a perfect example of just like who we're talking about right now with the rich phony. If you look back at his pictures when he was 17, if you put his picture at 17, I mean, the dude was, I mean, he was a freak already. He looks sick. Now, I brought this up earlier, but you know, we earlier, but I don't think we did this on air. Here's something interesting that I've noticed.

This is not scientific, it's my own observation. I've noticed with people who build muscle lift weights and who are natural, they tend to be much stronger than they look versus the other way around. Now, that's not to say this guy's on gear who aren't strong as shit, obviously, the strongest people in the world are.

But I've noticed a lot of natural guys, like Lane Norton, for example, muscular, impressive looking, not nearly as big as, you know, the number one physique competitors. Oh no, he's a bodybuilder. Lane Norton is strong. Way stronger than he looks.

Way stronger than he looks. If he was in a polo shirt, instead of actually, you wouldn't even think he's like a hardcore lift guy. Right. he fucking come up to house and if you look at the old-time Muscle builders if you look if you read about some of the feats of strength of like Eugene sandow and you know Some of these guys way back in the day before steroids were even invented they do lifts that I don't think a lot of guys could do in the gym a crazy feats of strength deadlifting over 600 pounds squatting over 600 pounds Or the first 500 pound benches were all natural doing odd lifts like the bent press with 300 pounds crazy shit

That you you can even believe and then you go back enough far enough time Paul Anderson who was a famous Olympic lifter The guy had some ridiculous feats of strength and he was apparently he was natural for most of his life. And then let's talk about my hero, my number. No, not Michael, her, Michael herns a fucking beast though. I'm talking about Jack Lillane. Jack Lillane, he's the father of fitness, right? Jack Lillane is when it comes to fitness idol, just for pure fitness, it's Jack Lillain is when it comes to fitness idol just for pure fitness. Yeah. It's Jack Lillain. Yeah. That guy set world records and

Push up some pull ups in his fifties. Didn't he set one for swimming to I thought I I'm pulling pulling pulling yeah with his teeth. Oh, no, no, this is what he did This was on his seven 70th birthday and you could find this video on YouTube. They actually recorded it. He pulled Seven or ten robots with seven or 10 people and so 70 people in boats. He pulled them from, or Alcatraz back to San Francisco. That's nuts. With a harness attached to him with his hands and feet shackled.

So he's swimming like a fucking dolphin, 70 years old. 70. That's how he did it. I didn't know that. Yes. That's true. That took him a long, yeah, it's on video. Wow. And he just he just swammer the guy again of course genetic freak, but what lived the lifestyle? Oh, definitely natural. You remember I know you've

Then if you've seen all that you've seen like his daily routine right he did the like the craziest things ever when he was it was kind of funny Yeah, the silly like yes. Yes. Yes. He did. Yes. He is. He is one of his warm ups and foot warm I mean, he spent that he had this routine of what he did religiously. He did every day. And you know, the guys like, so that like going back to Joe Donnelly, the microherms, the people like,

like that, so many people want to say, oh, steroids, because they look so huge. You know, we don't know all these people. So no, we're not claiming, you know, yes or no, that they all don't know. Yeah. But it's to me, it's very, very believable that there are natural because, I mean, Michael Herne,

the guy's been lifting weights for like 30 plus. Well, he was also, he was a California, he was a powerlifting champion and then California judo champion or something like that. So, and he's, he has been lifting heavy and hard for a very, and that's just like, Joe, And again, strong as shit.

I don't know if you ever see us go on his Instagram. Michael Herne will do a frickin' demo where he's talking to people, telling him how to squat. Why, squatting five plates, like, 500 pounds on his back, and he's talking while he's doing it. And he'll go down and hold it up a bottle. You're just a bottom, hold it up. Yeah, you hold it up, this is where your hips need to be

and he'll come up, okay? Let's try that again, come down, and talk. Like, I would do 135. Yeah. And that type of strength, like that, like, nobody, you don't just take a bunch of antibiotics and then all of a sudden can do that. I mean, it takes years and years and years

to build that type of strength. I mean, and that's to me what makes me whether they are a hundred percent or not, which we've talked about who cares, doesn't fucking matter. Yeah, it doesn't matter. I think when you care, because I used to care when I was a kid,

it used to piss me off too, because I'd look at, ah, you're on tears. Ah, you're not. The reason why I used to care is the same reason why people care now, because it challenges you. All of a sudden,

you're looking at this person and you're thinking, you know, they're better than me. That's not cool. Oh, this is why they're better, because they're doing this, and I'm not doing that. And it makes you feel better about yourself.

News flash, okay? There's probably people in the world that are gonna be better at you. That are smarter than you, that are faster than you, that are better looking than you. Right. You know, that look younger than you when you get older, that whatever.

It's just, it's just fucking life. We're not all equal. It's just the way it is. So get over it. Be the best, you know, you that you can be. And the only way you can do that is by comparing yourself to you. Yeah.

Not to anybody else. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. We've talked about this a long time ago before too, of, I'm a huge fan of since I've done this whole Instagram thing. I love doing this like progress.. I love doing this progress. And I discipline myself to do this even when I don't feel good. So even if I'm not posting it on Instagram,

I have the most narcissistic volume of pictures of myself in my phone. But I do- I'm stretching up. I do this because I am. I'm always competing against myself. I don't scroll through a bunch of fitness and that's which people ask me all the time,

like, oh, who's your fitness inspiration? Or this, or that? My fitness inspiration is my fat ass two weeks ago. That's what I'm looking at. I'm looking at what did I look like a month ago, where am I at now, am I improving, am I regressing? And that's what motivates me and drives me. I-

This is crazy that you even brought this up, because I actually wanted to do a whole episode on what you're talking about right now. I just finished training one of my clients Jim who have been training for a long time the guy 69 years old For the last I don't know 40 years the guy has Exercised on a consistent basis. He swims an hour and a half non-stop every single night. Whoa. He lifts weights four days a week He eats very well. He's not a genetic freak in any sense of the term, but he's just super consistent, super. And, you know, I talked to him today because I look up to him and the this fucker doesn't believe me when I tell

him that. He thinks I'm blowing smoke up his ass because he thinks I'm like some kind of hero. And I always tell him like, no, you're way, you're like on a different level than me. You've been doing this for so long. You 69s is crazy. And I asked him, I said, what keeps you motivated that whole time? Like, what's your motivation? And you know what he said to me? He said, don't fall in love with the progress. Fall in love with the process.

Which to me was like, whoa, I was earth shatter. Because that makes a lot of sense. Like, he doesn't necessarily, yes, he's gonna progress, you know, he's progressed this whole time that he's done this. But, right, let that be the byproduct in a sense. Yeah, he loves the process. He loves swimming. He loves exercising.

He loves eating healthy. He loves the everyday of it. And as a result of that, he's done it non-stop for longer than I've been alive. And the guy is a fitness phenomenon as a result of that, he's done it non-stop for longer than I've been alive. And the guy is a fitness phenomenon as a result of it. At 69 years old, the guy, we just hit a PR in his squat last week at 69. You know, normally when you train someone at that age, you're happy to just not go backwards, just to maintain.

Right. So it's all about, you know, that was from his point of view. And for me, it kind of blew my mind. And it makes sense. It's a perspective. Yeah, just fall in love with the process. Love the day, the day to day of it. Love the fitness. I mean, and I don't think anyone in this room doesn't love working out. No, I mean, it's not you approach anything in life, you know, from that aspect, it'll change everything. If you can start aspect, it'll change everything. If you can start loving the process of adversity, when things are challenging, if you can start really focusing on the fact that you recognize this is a challenge right now that I'm going to overcome. After that, you just benefit

from the rewards of it. You do, and I'm gonna use myself as an example here because I'm extremely competitive and I do compete against other people, but I don't do it with some weird, like if I can't beat this person, then I'm a failure type of deal. Like I'll give you an example, okay.

I always talk shit to Adam about working out. We always talk shit to each other back and forth. First of all, we both love it, nobody gets offended, but I don't pretend to think to myself that I'm somehow gonna look or become more muscular than a me as a professional physique competitor. But I know it motivates me to try to compete against him to train myself harder.

Because you like to stay uncomfortable. I love it. This is how I feel. Yes, I love putting myself into uncomfortable situations that challenge me because I feel like that's the only way I can ever grow. Exactly. And I do want to grow. Exactly. You're almost never hear me talk shit to someone about to someone who I think who I'm already outperforming, unless they're coming up and I'm having fun with them and I want them to move up.

But usually I'll try to compete with someone who's better than me, even if I don't think I'm not gonna win, I know it's gonna push me to be a better me, but that I've identified in myself. Now if you're not that kind of person, if you're that kind of person that that doesn't work for you then don't do it. Then it's all about being a better, just being a better you. But at the end of the day, I think when we approach life with this whole,

everybody's going to be equal, everybody's, you know, that no, no, no, no, no, it doesn't work that way. In fact, societies that have approached life that way or approached policy, you know, public policy that way have resulted in deaths of millions of people and the loss of liberty and life for lots of people. I think what we need to understand is that we're not equal, but we all have a- Everybody has a little bit of fight in them. Right, we all should be treated equal, and that's in.

We're all treated equal, but we're not all gonna win the race. But at the end of the day, I'm nice to you, you're nice to me, and we fucking go for it and become a better who we are. Oh, that's absolutely right. The process has to be something that, nice to me and we fucking go for it and become a better who we are. Oh, absolutely. The process has to be something that if you're going to be successful at it, you have to love that. You have to enjoy that.

Because otherwise, it'll be short-lived. If it's just purely a goal and you're going to punish yourself to get to that goal, yeah, you might achieve that goal, but sustaining that forever, long-term, like it won't. You can't. It won't happen. You'll stop because you're not loving the process of it because we've talked about this before. You know, the body, it's not linear. You do not, that's why I love the pictures

because I'm always manipulating my program and my nutrition and trying. You enjoy it, you love the process. Yes, I love that, I love it. And guess what, a lot of times, it doesn't give me the result I want. A lot of times, I'm doing things that I think, oh, okay, I'm gonna start incorporating this,

I'm gonna try that, I'm gonna do this. And then I look at the picture, like two weeks go by, and I'm like, mother fucker. I'm calling backwards, you know what I'm saying? Or I don't like what I see, but I don't get down on myself. I don't go like, well screw this, I give up,

or I don't want to do this, it was a learning process, like, okay, well I know now that that isn't best for me. Maybe I should go and do this instead. And then I love playing with that and doing that. And there's a lot of stepping back. Absolutely. And you know what's interesting.

So check this out. So if you're ultimate goal, the only motivation, if the only motivation that you have is to hit a goal. Like that's it. I just have to hit this goal. That's the only reason why I'm motivated. Let me tell you what's gonna happen. If you're lucky enough to hit a goal. Like that's it. I just have to hit the goal. That's the only reason why I'm motivated. Let me tell you what's gonna happen. If you're lucky enough to hit that goal, okay?

You're gonna fail afterwards. Because you hit that goal now what? As a matter of fact, psychologists post goal depression where your motivation for something is simply to like, like all I wanna do is, you know, win this tournament coming up. That's all I wanna do. That's all I'm motivated, that's the only reason why I'm working out.

And then you win that tournament and guess what? Now what? You didn't love the process, you didn't enjoy the process. You actually, and I've experienced this myself. I used to compete and train in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, and I enjoyed it quite a bit. It didn't love it like I love the process of working out, but I enjoyed it. And I remember I trained going into a tournament and I trained my ass off and I got first place.

I was so unmotivated after that first place because the process wasn't what I really loved the most. It was the fact that I had to get this tournament. Now, if we rewind before that, I had entered a tournament and I had lost and that motivated the shit out of me because all I wanted to do was want to tournament. Once I got there though. Yeah, you want to get dudes, get back in there.

So, I have added. Yeah, so goals are very important, but what's more important is enjoying the process because you might actually hit that goal, and then what? You know? Oh yeah. It's true though too,

because it goes along with purpose. And it reminds me of people that, you know, they retire and it creates this. Yeah And it creates this depression, because they weren't so long to get to this point where they can do all this so-called free time, but they detach themselves from purpose and a reason to get up and get moving and be organized and achieve something.

So that's something that I'll definitely be challenging myself with when I get to a point where it's like, okay, I don't think I'll ever retire. I always have my hand in something that really motivates me and drives me every day to accomplish something because it doesn't have to be super demanding and absorb all my time, but it's something I'm always going to be vested in something because I want to be challenged. Right. And just to bring it back to fitness, you know, if you're listening to this right now

and you're having trouble being motivated to exercise on a regular basis, what you need to do is you need to find a way to enjoy the day to day of it, you know, enjoy the day to day. We've talked about the civilian times. Look, are you going to get great? Are you going to get better results, you know, enjoy the day to day. We've talked about this a million times. Look, are you gonna get great, are you gonna get better results, you know, running than you are maybe just walking a little bit maybe, but if you fucking hate what running,

then don't just walk, you know, find something that you're- Or if you're- Or if you're- Or if you're- Or if you're running due crossfit. Yeah, we promote you. Yeah, so if you find, if you, you know,

find what you enjoy about it, I have a client, I was just talking to about this the other day and he was telling me how, you know, he wants to start losing weight again. He's going to get real focused again. And he, you know, after one week, he had no progress. And he's like, so frustrating. I tried so hard. I came in here, I did cardio three times.

So I, you know, I explained to him the whole calories burn and it's not really that big of an impact. And I told him, I said, you know what? Why don't you do 30 to 40 minutes of activity every single day and he's like, oh, well, that's boring. Now he's a writer, he likes to write, and he likes to listen to podcasts and stuff. I said, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

So you think of it wrong. Don't come here and do cardio, because you fucking hate that. You're not gonna do that every day. I said, put your headphones on, listen to your podcast, bring a notepad in paper, and go for a walk somewhere that's inspiring, do that every single day, make it part of your routine,

but make it something that's enjoyable. And it's like a light bulb went off in his head. The look on his face was like, I never thought of it that way. I mean, that's the way you need to approach it. Yeah. You know? It's funny, I think we all kind of coach a very similar

because I was just having this conversation with one of my clients that I'm coaching. I know that's fairly new. And they're always like, what's next? What do I have to do this? Or what do I have to do that? And like, you know, want to know, wait, where are we gonna lose this?

And I'm like, it's not about that. You know, what this is about? And I spend a lot of time asking you, how do you feel? Do you, when they're like, what do you mean, how do I feel? I mean, are you enjoying how you're eating right now? Do you, does it work well with your lifestyles? That, you know, it's not like, I don't care

if you win up one or down two. Like, I want to know, like, what I've got you doing right now is it's something that you know, it's not like, I don't care if you win up one or down to like, I wanna know like, what I've got you doing right now, is it something that you see yourself being able to continue to do. And by the way, that is the, that is what a good, that is what an excellent trainer would say, cause a bad trainer would do the opposite.

Tell him, you need to do this, you need to do that. No, no, you gotta get that 10 pounds off or what. You're interested in the person's longevity, long, long, long life. You're interested in having fitness become part of their life. Yeah, and that's a good trainer. And I explained to them, you know, and I'm very good now. I mean, it took me a long time in training before I learned

how important this was to explain to clients is that, you know, this is about, this is about a lifestyle. And I, and it's very easy to convince, close them when you first start on, listen, do you want just to lose 10 pounds or do you want me to teach you how to live a fit healthy lifestyle for the rest of your life? And like nobody says they don't want that.

Nobody says like, oh, just lose 10 pounds and I don't care about being fit and healthy, like they want that, you know? And so when you make sure they commit that, say, well, let me explain to you then, I don't want to get all, I'm gonna have you give me your weight and I'm gonna be tracking all that stuff for my reasons, but I don't want you to focus on that.

I don't care about that. And I got this new girl right now and she's probably listening to this right now, so I won't put her name out there. But she came to me and she had listened, she'd been listening to Mind Pump for quite a while. And she's like, man, she's like, you struck a chord with me because I feel like I'm that person who's suffering from metabolic damage.

And, you know, when I looked at her calories and stuff, she's eating like 800 to a thousand calories. And yeah, and she's not a tiny little girl, you know, she needs a lot more than that. For her body type, she probably should be eating somewhere between 2,000 and 2,500 minimum. And so, you know, right away, right away, I see that right away. And then I see the balance of type of food and stuff.

And then on top of that, then she's coming and she's training hardcore in a class four times a week, super high intensity. She's pushing the shit out of herself. In addition to trying to be active on top of that and trying to cancel out the little bit of how she is doing. So, I was like, this is gonna be tough for you, but I want you to scale way back, way back. And then, if know, if I, if I see you coming in to Orange Theory and I

catch you running on the treadmill, I'm going to get after you. I want you walking. And when I'm yelling at everybody else, go faster, you're walking. And it was funny because the other day was her first day in there. And she was just looking at me like, do I have to just walk? Yes. Just watch. It was amazing, though. Already, right? Having her eat more food. She's up like 400 calories. She's exercising 50% less at about 80% less intensity already seeing a decline in her weight. And I'm like, I actually want you to do it. And then I go, I actually want you to bump your calories even more because I don't want to see any decline in weight right now. What? I'm like, yeah, more water, more food, less work, less activity, and you're already starting to see results with that. And right now, I don't care about your weight.

That's gonna come. Right now, I want you fed. I want you fed. I want you feeling healthy. I want balance. And just watch. This is all part of it, you know? So I love somebody who will stick through it

and get there because those are the ones you change their lives. The ones that actually have blind faith, they stick through the process, they make it through, whether it takes three months, six months, nine months, whatever, depending on how much damage we've done in the past, when they finally get there, and they actually get to see their metabolism working for them,

instead of against them, which they've been probably struggling with for months or years in their life, oh, it's so rewarding, it makes everything we do work. For those trainers who are listening and hearing everything Adam's saying, and you're thinking yourself, how can I communicate that to my client? Because that's tough, right? I mean, it's tough.

Adam is a great communicator, and so he can communicate that confidence and have people have that faith in him. But that's a hard thing for a trainer to do. And so I'll just tell you this, as a trainer, you need to believe in it and have passion behind it. And then your client will follow and listen and follow your advice. If you yourself are questioning yourself and you don't have that passion behind you, could you like, I don't know much about that?

Because they're already leery to do that. Right. Because it's like a contradiction to their go button. Right. That they're always going to go with. And they know that recipe has done such and such. So you really have to have conviction. Right.

So, you know, have that conviction, that passion, and then they'll follow you. Don't fall into the trap of because they want you to lose them 10 pounds so bad that you want to show them that as fast as you can to prove that you're a great trainer. Right. I did, I did, it drives me crazy. And the analogy I use, you can bite it right off of me, is when someone gives me a wake goal and I can feel that that's what's so important to them,

I flip it right back on them and I go, oh, you want to lose 20 pounds? And that matters so much to you. Yes, yes, yes. I say, easily, we could do that in a week. They're like, what? A week? Oh, yeah, perfect.

This is what I want you to do. stop eating and run on the treadmill every day Yeah, and they're looking me all crazy and then they laugh and I laugh and I go that sounds crazy, right? But that's just an extreme analogy of what you're doing So extreme analogy I'm going on one extreme, but it's really what you're doing you are starving the body so much You are pushing so hard that that's pretty much what you're doing. You may as well push if you want that in that amount of time. You can, you just gotta keep pushing that direction. And stop eating, you might die on the way.

And talk about enjoy the process, who the fuck's gonna enjoy that process? You was never gonna wanna do that again. Never, no one's gonna enjoy that process. And then you lose. And then you lose. And it's not the weight that you want, not the body fat. No, it's, yeah.

Awesome. So please do not forget to subscribe to Mind Pump and rate and review us. We love it. Adam loves it, Justin loves it. But you know who loves it the most? Doug. Doug loves it.

Do it for Doug. Do it for Doug. Yeah. Look at that face you've making. Do it for Doug. He's gonna keep saying it, so. We're gonna make sure you do it for Doug. Do it for Doug, right?

Very, very, very. Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. For more information about this show Do it for dogs. He's going to keep saying it, so we're going to make sure you reveal it for dogs. We're going to make sure you reveal it for dogs. We're going to make sure you reveal it for dogs. We're going to make sure you reveal it for dogs. We're going to make sure you reveal it for dogs. We're going to make sure you reveal it for dogs. We're going to make sure you reveal it for dogs. We're going to make sure you reveal it for dogs. We're going to make sure you reveal it for dogs.

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