Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 169: Joe Donnelly

Episode Date: October 21, 2015

Sal, Adam & Justin interview fitness icon Joe Donnelly for an extra bit of RAW in the RAW TRUTH. Please subscribe, rate and review this show! Learn more about Mind Pump at www.mindpumpradio.com

If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. MIND, MIND, MIND, MIND, MIND, MIND, with your hosts. Salda Stefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. I come along with the snores. Yeah! Sing along with the snores. Snorkum! Something something, NANI!

You're NANI! That's alright. I'm along with satan man, man, man, man. That's all right. That's a long, work hard to do. It's the first cartoon that's ever happened. I think it's the weird shit. It was, that was not bad. We have a Giuseppe, is that your full name, Joe? Giuseppe? All right, Giuseppe.

I mean, yeah, if I go to Italy, it is, yeah. Joe Donnelly's with us here today. And I didn't tell you this earlier, but Adam has a massive crush on you. Oh, it's weird. Does he ever, like, you guys is with us here today. And I didn't tell you this earlier, but Adam has a massive crush on you. Oh, it's weird. Does he ever think you're gonna stop talking about you? You're telling me something I didn't already said. Yeah, the, the,

he's excessive amount of sexting that goes on. And this was even before I had his number saved to my phone. I was like, who's sending me all these dick pics? Just more serious. This is weird. I think it's a nice looking penis, but I'm like, I mean, I have your number saved, It's kind of awkward.

He uses the panorama function. Oh, trust me. And he hits the Photoshop. Oh my God. What do you like a little like dear antlers on it? At Christmas time, this is awkward. Sort of God, bro. This is real sad.

I can see the duty makes it do. Like when he sends it to me, like makes it wink somehow. I did that. Now that's the man we are. It's only has one eye. Only got one eye, so. Well, it's a change of name to mind mine pinp in the eye and the logo will be

We might have after our last episode of coming after shreds do we got we might they might try and come soon So it's not like they have the money to pay the attorney right now Yeah, it's funny, you know, it's funny bringing it bring them up. You know, I don't know what we were we weren't playing on this direction But yeah, yeah, that's funny bringing them up, you know, I don't know what we weren't planning on this direction, but Yeah, that's how we fucking roll. I I'm fascinated by how many people fall into the facade. You know, I'm saying like how many people Those that are really attached to people in the industry and and the movers and the shakers of what we do Get it and understand but 90% of the people that are following so that just get so sucked in and bought into this whole thing. Well, and here's the thing.

So I'm gonna look at this a little bit objectively. That was by design. I give them a lot of credit and their business model is that they were gonna create something that hadn't been there. So you create this persona of shreds as like cool and as hip and you build these people who've really never done anything.

And you build, it's true. I think I think Paige, you know, she's a great business and whatever she does, but I think she did one show and she took like 18, 12 girls. And now she's hugely famous, so good for her. But they build these people out of nothing. They created this cool facade and people bought into it. And so it is, you know, whether you like shreds or not or you think their products are good or not, that's completely arbitrary. It's the fact that he created a market for himself through social media that have never been done before, which is ingenious.

I think if anybody could do it, they would do it. I think that the only difference we would probably is that I think once we came out with protein, we'd probably spell way correctly instead of. So, it's up to EY, but they, you know, I think GNC liked that much. So I heard this, I don't know if you know anything about this, but, and so what happened to me when I first started

and getting into the whole social media, because that was not an Instagram Facebook guy, very much so saw where it was going as far as business wise, I started building a brand around myself, right? And I thought, okay, this is perfect. I was leaving the cannabis industry at that time, and I'm getting back into fitness, which is my passion. I love to do.

At the time, I got fat. Thought, okay, this is perfect. I mean, my 30s, I'm fat now, I'm gonna do this whole show. You were Husky. That wasn't fat, so it's gonna be a- That's a punchy, a punchy. He's on a three-year book. You were punchy, yeah.

That's a three-year book. You were a book, right? So I just said, okay, this is perfect. As a trainer when I was young, and being a kid that had a fast metabolism, clients, we could never relate to me. They'd always say, oh, you don't understand. You know, wait till you get older, and you don't know, it's like to be fat. And so I remember looking at myself being like, holy shit, clients, we could never relate to me. They'd always say, oh, you don't understand.

Wait till you get older and you don't know, it's like to be fat. And so I remember looking at myself and being like, holy shit, okay, I'm here now. And this is a perfect opportunity for me to show the world that I kind of know what the fuck I'm doing. So I decided to document all this. And I document all of it.

Well, why that happened? A lot of these pages started to pick me up and they started to post me and stuff like that. Like, you know, you're, what are they? It's the shout out pages, right? They started shouting me out. Sure, for sure. shout out pages, right? They started shouting me out. For sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

They started shouting me out, which was great. And it's a big part of the reason why I started to grow. Well, then I grew to a point where I actually had quite a bit of people following me in some sort of control and the fitness. And I am knowing, like Joe, I'm also somebody who speaks out on my Instagram, especially at the beginning. And also, those pages weren't responding to me. And I was like, what the fuck?

They were plugging me like crazy and all kinds of love. And then I also, I grew to a certain point and now no love whatsoever. Unfortunately, we call this the individualistic phenomenon. Once you develop any kind of your own following or your own momentum, and any kind of individual message of your own, you magically stop getting love from those pages.

Now, I'm not gonna say that a certain company controlled all those pages, but I'm gonna say that they did. And so you weren't an employee of that company and you weren't benefiting them anyway and probably they'd worried a little bit that someone with an individualistic mind of your own and the message of your own could grow a little too big and cause them damage like you're doing now

with your own radio show. This is just a theory it's not proven by any facts other than the facts in my head. Which are all verifiable. My studies at Sal has references to that. I love how you have a written answer on that. It seems to me like social media has been just massively disrupting to the fitness industry. What I mean by disrupting is it seems to be flipping everything on set, changing everything. Shreds is an example.

It's a supplement company that doesn't sell supplements in stores. It's a marketing company. It's a marketing company. So they wrote the book on it now, whether they succeed or not, who knows, I don't know. That doesn't matter, right? But the future looks like that.

Well, they had a good run. Let's just say, they had a nice run. It looks like that's a future. People famous. I think the bigger picture kind of what South touched on is this is that you've got people who are unqualified to be viewed as professionals, fitness professionals, celebrities, giving advice that's not true. That's all. I mean, I've seen if I've seen one post, I've seen a million of them where people are giving incorrect information or portraying,

oh, you know, don't go out on a Friday night and you've got to stay in and eat your tilapia and your sparigas and you've got to do your faster cardio and it's like you're promoting this unrealistic lifestyle and some people the only way that they can be lean and in shape is if they have to do X, Y and Z. Well, you don't even know what it is you're talking about. You know what, you don't know any science behind it.

And I see people, I remember when they, they, I'm not knocking flavor God, the, you know, seasonings, whatever. There's nothing I'm sure they were great. They sent them to me and I tried them and I was like, this is fucking horrible. Because there, well, there was no sodium in them. And it's like, it's like, I taste good. Well, it didn't taste good, but also it's like, why do I not want to have sodium in my diet? It makes you bloated. Does it really? Right.

You know, if you want to have any of that science, like sodium and getting enough water about it, it's like what keeps the hormone and the stone at bay. That's what, and so when you cut sodium out, you cut water out, that hormone caused you to actually retain the hormone. You get rebound. Exactly, so it's like, people are so worried

about having any sodium in there, but I'm like, oh, I have no sodium in the week of my show. Yeah, that's why you look soft on stage. You were great 10 days out, and then you did the wrong thing, leading up, you did cardio the day before you show and you cut your water and I'll say, oh, you look soft. You know what, next time try the night before having 4,000 milligrams of sodium in some carbs

and pull a watch, how dry and good you look. So it's all these people that are unqualified that are now self-proclaimed or proclaimed because they're social media following built up. People view them as they know what the fuck they're talking about. Can I curse? I'm, yeah. Can you fuck this?

Can you? Can you curse? At 8.30 in the morning, my whole office heard about this ball sweat. I'm not. Sorry. I get a text from Joe, and I send him over. He tells me to play this episode. And I'm like, you're the worst.

I didn't mean on the fucking loudspeaker. I want to be able to hear it. Dude, we put that in. I was a cautionary thing. Like. I want to be able to hear it. Dude, we put that in. It was a cautionary thing. We used to do that all the time. Mine, please don't play this at work. Never should be listening.

It's not a work for the whole of the human resource complaints come to me. It's good that you own the company. Exactly, because he was suddenly involved with me. He was playing something about ball sweat and talking about asthma, and it was just not good. It was. ATM. So speaking too mouth, ATM.

So speaking of sodium, I make deposits. Did you guys know that science has just come out showing that people with low sodium intake actually die earlier on average than people with high sodium intake? They're actually, they're reviewing those types of recommendations that we've been giving people for so long. It might not be a good idea to have a such a low sodium diet unless you're directed by your doctor or some kind of strain.

That's what I was just gonna say. So it's only if you have high blood pressure or you're overweight, but if you're someone who's active and you're drinking a lot of water, you need, so you know that's sodium. And sodium helps you, helps you train harder. If you don't have sodium in your diet, you can't burn as much body fat. You can't build, I mean, sodium has such a negative view. People are like, oh, if I eat a hamburger, if I have this, I blow up the next day from all of sodium.

No, it's because you're fat. But it's true. It is true. People are like, I had a donut and I got fat. I'm like, you also said you had a scubaway protein and you got bloated. No, you're just, you're fat. Like, come on.

You're over-consuming, it's a 7,000 calories you had. Exactly. It's actually, you're bulking on 30% body fat. That's theuming. It's the 7,000 calories you had. Exactly. You're bulking on 30% body fat. That's the problem. It's true. Sodium has been demonized, and the truth is, wars were fought over salt. Thousands of years ago, massive wars were...

Because sodium is essential. If you don't need any sodium, you're gonna die. I have to say, you know what? I read a post, you said it. I don't remember what day it was when you said it. We have to talk about this because you just said it. The bulking thing. Oh, yeah, yeah. The bulking thing to me said, I don't remember what day it was when you said we have to talk about this because you just said it. The bulking, the bulking thing. The bulking thing to me is, I mean, we, and we talk a little bit about this how, you know,

sound I do a lot of many, many cuts and many bulks. And by many, we're not trying to live in a surplus longer than about three or four weeks at a time like that. And yeah, you got these guys. Okay. So yeah. So I'll try to be, it's unoffensive about this is. No, please be a, dude, I thought you were gonna be like,

all crazy. Hey, is that, you have a chance to do it? You put four and more on the shut the fuck up. Do you not see the fucking smile on leather? Do you think I'm not gonna be unoffensive? I'm all the way down here. You're right, you're right,

you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right, you what I basically said is that if, when people post about bulking, you're either stupid or you're a moron. That's kind of the same thing.

No, but here's why. Now, I don't want to know bulking is just being in surplus of 500 calories or a thousand a day. When I say bulking, I mean, for men, it's like over 15% body fat. Like, studies show that over 15% body fat, your testosterone levels start to decrease. We all know as test levels decrease, you build muscle at a slower rate. In addition, if you go up to like 15, 18, 20% body fat

and you put on 20 or 30 pounds, you think you're bulking, you're building muscle faster, you're not because at what point, you have to start stripping that body fat down, doing cardio cutting calories, and you're gonna lose muscle no matter what. So people confuse that with like, well, wait a minute,

how do I build muscle, dude? You can be 700 calories surplus each day in working hard and not be 15% body fat. You can be 10 or 12% and be bulking, but do it in a healthy matter. And the other thing is so it's like when I see these guys that are like, off season, time to bulk and they're getting fat,

well, you're either on drugs or you're an idiot because you're testosterone. If you're're natural your testosterone levels can't be stimulated at 22 or 25% so the general rule of thumb is Just don't lose definition of your abs. Now if you're a pro bodybuilder. Okay, that's that's that's that's that's your, you know, pain The bills that's fine Um, but for the average person, you know, to go like that's why I said the other day. I was talking to Whitney read about this I said they should call all those men's physique guys to compete in the Olympia back on stage three weeks after the show.

And they should do a confirmation round because they all gain like 30 pounds after the show. Like I said at the show that kid Ryan Terry, and if you guys saw comparisons, the kid from the UK, it's fourth. If he was American, he would have won. He looked at he's the most ridiculous. So you said that. He just posted a picture the other day shooting the cover of magazine.

He looked as good as his day. He said that asked for it. And I'm like, that's a men's physique champion right there because he lives it year round. And he's a nice kid, he's not a douchebag. But it's like, what, what kind of role model are you if you can only get in shape one day a year? Well, you know, here's the things we need to clarify too

with X-S body weight. Now, X-S body weight or even excess body fat can be beneficial for certain things, right? If you're playing football and you're in a certain position where extra mass helps you, sure, if you're a lifter and you're not in a weight category, sometimes gaining weight makes you stronger, has to do things with leverage, you know,

types of energy production. But what you're saying is absolutely correct. And let's just take the average person. Let's say we take the average natural lifter, they would be blessed. They would be absolutely blessed. It would be a miracle if they could gain one pound of lean body mass a week. That's a lot, right? Four pounds of lean muscle a week.

Let's just say that they were able to do that. How many calories do you need to build a pound of muscle? You don't need much. How many grams of protein are in a pound of beef? You see what I'm saying? Maybe a hundred. Divide that over seven days. You don't need to eat a thousand extra calories a day to gain muscle. It's just not, it's just not, not true. And so that's where you get these bulking myths. And as some, a lot of it was perpetrated by supplement companies. You know, back in the

day, I think when we were kids, the most popular supplements were the weekend. I remember mega-mush, 25-hundred calories. Bro, do you remember the big bucket? And it was like the serving scoop was like half the bucket. For serving scoop was like the thing used to make like sandcastles with. Yeah, I remember my mother to buy a bigger blender. She's like, it's like sludge. You can't even drink it. No, I'm like, yeah.

And then you shit yourself afterwards anyway. It doesn't make any sense. So that, you know, that same thing with, you know, cutting, you know, if you start to die it for too long or start to diet for too long or in a deficit for too long, your body adapts. I mean, we know stories of athletes who are able to somehow live off of under a thousand calories a day because their bodies are so damaged.

I mean, it's crazy. I'll say it right now. I could feed one more drink, I could call it. A bunch of very famous Instagram people. What do you mean one more drink out of could call a bunch of very famous Instagram. What do you mean one more drink? Literally people that post pictures of like, oh pizza or cheat meal, listen to it. And they literally, they they wouldn't even sit too close to it. You know, like they can't go a day without doing like two cardio sessions, but they'll

post pictures because they're trying to relate to the general public of, oh, here's cheat meal day or getting these gains, but literally their whole diet is like asparagus and fish and chicken. It's like, it's like ridiculous because their metabolism is so damaged for doing these there. And they're afraid to like step outside and try to fix it. You know, they're afraid to be like, well, wait a minute, I got a reverse diet. I have to add in some calories, like actually eat. They're so scared to do it.

Well, because they have not, it's, I guess that I think they don't fucking know. They don't know. Well, I mean, I had friends I've tried to like, council, this is what you scared to do it. Because they have, I think they don't fucking know. They don't know. Well, I mean, I had friends I've tried to like count, but this is what you have to do. They're like, no, I mean, literally took a girl out on a date once. She was a very well-known fitness girl. And ordered sushi, and she was like picking the rice

out of your sushi roll. And I'm like, why is this order so she's like, well, I just can't eat just the raw fish. I'm like, so we were gonna eat like the seaweed and the little piece of vegetable. I'm like, so we were gonna eat like the seaweed and the little piece of vegetable. I'm like, this is like the worst date ever. The real question is that she let you have anal sex afterwards. I was so turned on.

Yeah. That's the real question. Well, you knew that was coming, Joe. I'm on my way. You with me, bro. I love it. She was going to let me, but I was kind of annoyed. I kind of annoyed.

I kind of chastised her in the car about eating like that, and I told her it was a complete turn off, I don't care how hot she was, or how big her ass implants were. No, you passed on the analogue. No, no, I didn't take care of it later. But I definitely annoyed her for a while. Bravo. Did you talk to the man?

I am. But it's a close man. I almost took my money for that sushi. You know what I'm curious, me? I am. But it's a close man. I almost took my money for that sushi. That embarrass me. I almost took your man. My server thought that she was retarded or something. I'm like, he's like, why did she take the chopsticks and not eat the food, but pick a bar at the sushi roll?

It's just like the best. It was like a little bit of crab meat and just, she's like, there's a lot of cholesterol on this. I'm like, eat it. You need cholesterol. Just go through all the play in the bathroom, but don't embarrass me. Go through. Like, don't be like in a ragsick, adopt,. Just go through all the play in the bathroom, but don't embarrass me. Go through it.

Don't be in a Mexican adopte bleemia. Just throw up in the bathroom. I'm serious. It's a better version of eating his sorbic. I don't have to see it. Just rinse your mouth out and then we got here. Yeah. Don't have your way protein, W-E-Y.

W-E-Y. We had a Q&A up on your page or you're telling people you're gonna be on mind pump, they're asking questions and a lot of the questions had to do with, you know, if some people are natural, if is this athlete natural? Good Lord. Are you natural?

I'm gonna say something, I'm gonna say something right now. Now meeting you in person. Who the fuck cares? Well, first of all besides that. You're gonna say Joe's natural because he's not nearly as impressive as a person. Thank you very much. I know my physique is mediocre at best.

No, that's not. That's not even when I'm a beast. He's significantly bigger than I am. That's not even when I say. Not even close. Here's what I'm gonna say. Here's what I'm gonna say. Joe is, first of all, you in the NFL, right?

You play professional sports. Briefly. Whatever. Like a cup of gatorade. Okay. Good for better. Here's the deal. Like your Michael Vick, here's your drink.

I'm not here. No dark fights. I'm good. I'm looking, your Michael Vick, here's your drink. I'm out of here. No dark fights. I'm good. I'm looking at you right now and you're just a big dude. Muscle or not, you're just a big guy. That's the way you're built. If you didn't work out, you would still- She looked athletic though.

Right, but he would still be bigger than me. Looks are the same. And when I wore a whole lot of stairs, it was not athletic, I just mean. We'll see we have the kids playing getting drunk. We'll see we have the kids play dance off-lay. Yeah, we'll do that. We'll do that on our athlete, where we tap the feet together. Yeah. We'll see we have a kid play dance off later. Yeah, we'll do that.

Well, no one actually, where we tap the feet together, right? Yeah, we do. But you get my point. My point is, you know, jeans play such a huge role, massive role. And I'm looking at you and the guy's just a big dude. If he didn't work out, he'd probably be bigger than me anyway.

I'd be like a 200 pound version of Screech from Say By The Bump. Right, yeah, I live, listen, let me tell you something. I train my ass off, I'm scientific about everything. I fucking max and I wait 200 pounds. If you didn't live with you, be 200 pounds. I'll be honest with you. I think it's holding you back.

It's why I told you the Arnold Schwarzenegger story. I think getting married helps me back. I'll help you back. You know, like Arnold said. Yes, he did. Arnold was like, listen, he's like, you, you are, you are, you are a good looking guy. I don't know why I'm doing it in the ex.

That's weird. So I was talking like my anesthesiologist. You are a good looking guy. You don't know why I'm doing it in the X. That's weird. So I was talking like my anesthesiologist. You are a good looking guy. You know you don't get married. Okay, so pretend I'm talking like Arnold but he is just like, why do you want to get married? You know, it'll screw up your life. All right, so I want to ask you this.

This is a good question. I know some about you I talked to you earlier. You're very successful in the fitness industry. And there's not a lot of people who are truly successful self-made people in the fitness industry. What kind of advice can you give people? Because we have a lot of people that listen right now

that want to make money in fitness. And what they do is they look at social media, they see these people who are quote unquote sponsored by whatever company, and they think that's the way to be successful. Is that the way to be successful? Or what do you think? What's the good approach?

I think, first of all, I appreciate the compliment, but second, I think it depends how we define success. So if you define success as you have a big fan base and you have a lot of followers and you have a notoriety and fame, okay, then just being with the right company and getting promoted can make you successful. I don't define success like that. If you have a half a million followers or a million followers

and you're not converting ridiculous amounts of income every month, then you're not successful. Because otherwise, why are you doing it? You're doing it because you want to have your ego floated, you want to have people tell you how great you are at the aftermix. That's what leads you in the wrong direction. That's why we have so few relationships in the fittest industry and bodybuilders that are successful because people get all this attention from all these subjective third parties and they're cheap, they're fidelity and they just, their egos get blown up proportion.

By a large part, it's people that have never really created anything, they've never really done anything in life. So when people go overnight celebrities, it goes to their head. Someone like myself, I worked my whole life to get to college scholarship and get a shot to play in the NFL and things didn't work out,

but it's like I busted my ass to be where I am, to get there. So now to be the status I have in the fitness industry, it's, I like it as a business. I don't care how many followers I have, I don't look at compliments. People always talk about, oh ignore the haters or use haters for your motivation.

That stuff doesn't, that's a stupid comment in itself. I can dress that later, but the biggest negative is when you listen to the yes men and the compliments and the kiss asses, because they start telling you how great they think of. Right. And here's the truth, you're never as bad as they talk about you. You're also never as good as they say.

So it really depends on how do you define success. And so you gotta be careful about how you look and how you idolize people. A lot of these people just have these huge massive followings, but they can't make any money. They can't sell anything. Or they're like, oh, I'm sponsored by five companies and blah, blah, blah.

Okay, but do you own anything? Because, sure, maybe you've got five companies and you're making 10 or 15 or 20 grand a month, but those contracts are six month contracts, year contracts, company shifts the bad. I mean, look at like company like muscle farm, quarter million dollars in sales, they could be gone tomorrow. They've cut all their athletes,

people that were making five, 10 grand a month. So here today gone tomorrow. So be careful when you put all of your income into these sponsors, but you don't actually own anything. So it's cool to make maybe 10 grand a month of fitness industry. It's really cool to make 100 grand a month, or 200 grand, or 300 grand a month.

But you have to build your brand with the idea of, this is where I'm going with things. So it's like for myself, I'm not a selfie guy. I don't post that stuff. I don't do it one because, I noticed that, man. Well, but I'm safe. I'm not as good looking as you are. So it's like, I don't take pictures. I mean, a selfie guy. I don't post that stuff. I don't do it one because. Yeah, I notice that, man. Well, but I'm saying, but I'm not as good looking as you are. So it's like, I don't take pictures.

I mean, it's hard. You know, you gotta take 30 selfies with this. You take 30 selfies and you're like, Jesus, they're all one's worse than the next. You know? I gotta keep it in black and white. I keep it blurry. I use like the default.

I got you. But really, so it's like I use social media to convey information, to make people laugh, to ruffle some feathers, most of us do. It's a business. So if you're following me, it's because you believe in something I'm telling you. Not just the way you look.

Yeah, exactly. And if I ever do post a gym picture, or ever do post a picture from a magazine or something, it's always tied with something about like some type of workout. I'm giving you information. I'm never it's never just like, Hey, photo taken by someone. So like that's to me that's like I do the word gay because that's not negative. But that's just like the stupidest should ever.

Right. Like just like, Hey, look at me. Give me attention. Like I'm driving my car and traffic. I can't stand that. And maybe I'm just like overly, you know, negative about that. But like I'm my friends were fitness guys know, negative about that, but like, I mean, my friends were fitness guys,

and they post pictures, they're like, hey, what's up? Here's something like, do don't post that. You're fucking douchebag. No, it just looks stupid. Like if you're gonna post something, like make it worthwhile, like great, like say something, you know, connect with people.

So you're talking about bringing value. We'll have to bring value. Everything is value at least. But you know why you have that is because you played football. Well, it's because you have that is because you played football. Well Because you have that instilled in you and then you went into that. No, what he said that I think What's all of us is that the business mentality was first well before any of this social media stuff

We all at one point in our lives whether it be football degrees or businesses that we've started up and ran We all had to figure that shit out well before any of this bull shit happens. So then when even when that came out, I think I know I can speak, I mean, I was the one who told Sal, finally get on, I was like, I remember hitting that. We were talking about it for a year before ever did. Correct me if I'm wrong,

wasn't your first Instagram name, we love to hate Adam. Yes. Someone told me, I should've brought this up at dinner, but somebody told me a story, talking shit about you, and I went to your Instagram, I should have brought this up, did it with somebody told me a story, talking shit about you and I went to your Instagram, I go, wait a minute, his Instagram name is we love to hate Adam,

and they were trying to give me like, be mad at you or something, but no, wait a minute, his Instagram name is we love to hate Adam, how can I be mad at this person? He's already an asshole and I feel like I shouldn't bite him over for Thanksgiving. It's funny, awesome. It was the greatest thing ever. He knows it. A lot of

it. A lot of it. Well, and you guys are going to explain that text message like the first interaction like you showed me something about like what Joe and I. Yeah, yeah. The one where he's talking about like he's going to, you know, if you're a girl, I would bang me if I was you. Well, that, that, which the funny part is that I totally see. No, I think I said if I can't find this girl, on my menu. I'm just kidding, no. Gotcha. You know, that was the moment I think when we just saw eye to eye on a bunch of stuff,

which is the same conversation that I had with Sal. When Sal and I first started talking to Sal, it's the same goddamn thing is that it's very rare, especially in our industry. It's rare to find people like ourselves that kind of see it like that. Yeah, absolutely. Well, people are unfortunately, and I hate to say so this is not such a negative thing, but the majority of people are slaves to their sponsors or slaves to

being politically correct. They're blind sheep to master. Nobody wants to have any original thought, any audacity, any kind of courage to really stand for anything. That's fine. If you want to go through life being normal, you want to go through life, you know, living under the guidelines of someone else dictating to you, that's great. The world needs people to go with the flow and do that. But if you want to be a leader in this world, you want to do something, you want to create your own legacy, it doesn't happen by chance. You have to fucking have the balls come out and do something, okay? So, you know, it's like the, you ever like see people as movies when they climb Mount Everest. Everybody sits at base camp, right? And they've got all these people,

and all these fans, all these people, and it's only the fucking people who have the fucking balls to attempt to climb to the sun. That's how life is. The winners make it to the top. The ones that the balls have to try. It's sure, you might fail along the way. I'd rather fucking fail and die on Mount Everest than just fucking be someone who is too scared

to fucking stand at base camp. Laring up at people jealous because I was too scared to be there. I'd rather die on my feet than live on my knees. And the truth is, like, the truth is most people are not like that. They're just not. Most people want somebody to follow, to listen,

to idolize, you know, whatever. And fitness is probably a magnification of that. Actually, it is a magnification of that. And so you have companies and people that take advantage of that They take huge event all the myths in fitness were perpetrated by These types of people the myths of eating you know, you got to eat every two hours You're gonna go you know you're gonna go cataballup right supplement companies trying to sell you meal replacements and protein powders Like that that's just one example the myth of if you work out a certain way, you only tone

muscle instead of build it. That was pushed by gyms to sell memberships to women. No women don't want to build muscle. We're going to invent the word. This is the saying, this is how this is what it's all been about. And luckily because of technology, because of things like podcasts and and you know, we're able to post and counter some of this bullshit now because before we are voice wouldn't get out, man, we would have to get in these magazines that were sponsored by this company. So I think the natural migration right now should be,

let's talk about our favorite fitness myths. Oh yeah, okay. So we'll start with what you touched on the second ago, is the IFD every two or three hours to avoid going catabolic. Now for you listeners don't understand catabolic, go away with catableness, it means, you start breaking down muscle tissue for energy

So the idea is that if you don't eat you know every two or three hours You will start looting you know using muscle for energy Which is fine. Okay, that's one philosophy, but then it's the same people that also say okay fine I have to you sleeping for eight hours. I want you to wake up in the morning doing hour fast the cardio Don't eat it don't need after two hours of I'm gonna be losing muscle. And after sleeping for eight, you're gonna be able to wake up completely kept three times, four times as catabolic and do an hour of cardio. Right. That makes a lot of sense.

So when I started hearing things like that, I was like, you're all fucking more. Well, I don't know what's worse. The coach said saying it or the athlete that hears that it actually goes right into your mind. You know, I'm, the coach that's saying it or the athlete that hears it and actually goes right into. They're all blind. You know what I'm going like. That is what, it's funny you say that, because I had no intentions to get myself all wrapped in this whole IFBB league and get into this whole coaching thing.

That was not the vision of what I was doing whatsoever. But I felt like I would be an idiot to not. And plus there's a part of me that I love what I do and I feel like I want to share that with the world And there's so many people that are blind sheep and when I got to the shows and I started hearing all these athletes tell me that Holy shit. It's great. Well not only that but he's a you saw it as an opportunity Well, and I see okay, these are the people. I'm standing in this back room and all these super rip dudes and everything That getting ready. We're all getting ready to hit stage and you know got got all these, you know, cover a magazine guys and this guy's this

and this guy's got all these Instagram. Just, they're basically the people that everybody looks up to in the fitness world and the health industry. And I'm thinking, these are the motherfuckers that people are following and looking for direction. I'm going like, and I'm quiet. I'm not saying nothing to them. Ooh, we're quite weak.

You were temporarily quiet. I'm sorry, it's harmful quiet. That's fine. It must've been like eating some meat. What's that is mouthful of it? I'm quiet back there. And I don't want to insult anybody. I don't want to insult anybody yet.

So I'm just kind of taking it all in. And I remember coming back to these guys and being like, holy shit. You guys, the world that everybody in the fitness industry that believes that this is, oh, this guy, this, and that guy, this, oh, this is the way you do this. I'm like, it's such a facade. It's unreal. It's on real. It's on real.

Well, to their defense, to their defense, when you're doing something new, you're going to listen to the experienced person. Correct. Okay. So to their defense, they're just listening to the guy who's done it before them. And that guy heard it from someone else and so on and so forth. What's funny is, when you hear about the frequent meal myths, on one hand they say it makes sense because you're getting protein all day long.

But the truth is it really doesn't make any sense because if we look at all of human history, probably the last 0.1% of it, we had refrigerators and food accessible all the time. You had to eat it. If it was there. If the body evolved to be catabolic after two hours or no food, the human species would not be here.

We would not be here exactly. We would not be here. We would not be here. We would not be here. We would not be here. We would not be here exactly. We would not be here. We would not be here.

We would not be here. We would not be here. We would not be here. We would not be here. We would not be here. We would not be here. We would not be here. We would not more muscle mass. We're not living 30 years and stuff. But yeah, and people think they're like, oh, if I don't get my calories in by the end of the day

or if I go over, it's not what you have in a 24 hour period. It's more of what you have in a seven day period. Correct. People don't get that. And part of the thing that drives me so crazy and Lane was going to talk to me about this is that for some reason, people think that your metabolism is like a fire. You put a piece of wood on it. It's not. We used to teach that. That's why I know. I know. We've got to start. So all of you people listening.

That furnace. Here's why here's what a myth of that started. If you eat a small meal every two hours, your metabolism was gonna be on fire because somebody did that. They had like a 200 calorie meal and they were still hungry, and they're like, oh my God, my metabolism must be on fire because I'm starving all the time. No, no, you're just stupid. What happens is when you don't get enough carbohydrates at a sitting, and you're gonna have calories,

right, like I said, you're insulin level stay elevated. What does that do? It triggers the brain into being hungry, make it force you to binge. There's a great study. I think it was like Dartmouth, I did a study like a year ago. They talked, they put them on 2000 calorie diets. They

broke them over three meals or people did them over seven meals. The people that ate them over three meals were like 80% more likely to binge because they were eating such small meals. Whereas people that they had larger meals spread further apart were less likely to binge and also lost more weight. Well, it also has to do with your leptin levels too. So your leptin is the most important whole life. It is the most important. It is the most important hormone when it comes to burning fat. Every time we consume, and this is where the people

get mistaken is that when you eat this small meal, the leptin gets shot up. It tells the brain, okay, we've got this fuel, it's time to start bringing. That's that feeling of, wow, the metallical, people feel the metallical, now the thing with people understand is that effect is larger based off

of how large the meal is. So if you have a small 200 calorie meal, it's a small feeling of that spike. When you have a 900 calorie meal, it's a much larger grade. So it's all relative. So if you have three small meals at 300 calories versus one meal at 900 calories, it's fucking this thing. Well, the thermic effect is the same. It was a thermogenic effect.

And here's the thing too. When you're like you said, you don't, it's not necessarily, it doesn't have to be over just 24 hours. In fact, some studies are coming out now showing that especially athletes perform better when they undulate their calories. When they eat, yeah, you're sick. Undulate their calories. I'm saying that word by man. My fault's like in Google that. I can't even like comment. Come on bro. Yeah. When your calories are higher on some days

and lower on other days. So they average out to the same thing. But it's not the exact same thing every single day. That's ridiculous. And so here's another thing. This is one thing. You're a shoter now. I'm important.

No, I'm good right now. I got my crown. I appreciate it. This is on professional learners drinking on air. Are you kidding me? This is an only one just like you said the other day. We're lucky. We're all in a drink. The beauty of this is our fucking radio show, bro. Do whatever we want. We don't add to anybody. Let me say something serious question.

I was the one that grabbed the bottle of vodka. There's only one reason why Adam has pants on. It's because we have a guest. Normally he records you totally bottomless. He just likes that air out that way. Listen, don't because we have a guest. This is normally he records you totally bottomless He just likes that air out that way, but listen Don't serve me as a guest. It's gonna be family take your fucking pants off Shit get weird. He's out to he's too close to me. I don't I'm gonna start going off about Cheymanian the iff. He be I'm tick my ass out. Oh See if you're listening right now, but you have no ideas right now. We okay. We all had lunch together I like telling I like telling our audience like what's going on we keep shit real in this radio show that woman next most of the table is still thinking about okay so we can we tell you I was

right next to her it's getting awkward we have to share we have to share okay so so I was talking about GMO and we were talking about how if you don't know what it is you're talking about you know don't comment a friend of ours probably was on the show and they were talking about GMO and he didn't really know what it was talking about, but he kept talking and made himself look stupid. I'm like, if GMO's not my forte, I don't know. I'd be like, yeah, GMO, like give mom's orgasms. And I am a little loud.

I'm a little tiny, a little New York. And that lady at the table next to us was a little too, except accepting of the comments. She looked at him and she said, she's like, mom, I'll orgasm, hope, hi guys. The best part was I'm sitting here. I'm the perfect view. I'm sitting right next to Joe, and I'm facing her.

So I see her. She totally peers up, looks to her, and Joe looks up and realizes that someone's sitting right next to him pretty much, and they make eye contact and she just smiles. She smiles, so I'll tell you, I'll take one. So I had an instant fear.

So the Facebook message convoy posted last night where the girl was like, hello. We'll tell people that we're done. Okay, so Justin's been attacked. So some random girl, it keeps mess. I don't know who she is. No, no, hold on. Before you get into this, you must get a shit ton of messages that are crazy like this.

You're gonna be, you want to be honest. I don't, I don't, I don't put out like, I don't flirt with a women on social media. So I don't get too much of it. It's more of like 16 year old, like teenager from like India that is like, I am huge fan. Tell me how, what I eat, how I get ripped. That's most serious.

Yeah, that's like a lot of this. You know, he doesn't have the same range of good ideas. But anyway, okay, I mean, there is, I try to ignore the way that we do it. Four Cox, one of the judges is just, you know, it's not healthy. Adam gets lots of lot of this. He doesn't have the same reason he goes. But anyway, okay, I mean, there is. I try to get more of the one in the genus. It's just, you know, it's not healthy. Adam gets lots of pictures of talks of a genus. I get four talks of one in the genus.

Because of the way you market his song. So anyway, so this girl was like, she can't lay it. There's a whole like over like two months, I the threat of she's like, please talk to me. Hi. And you're ignoring her.

Of course, I never respond. Yeah, she like six and a half. And so then literally she's like, what do I have to do to get you to talk to me. Hi. And you're ignoring her. Of course, I never respond. Yeah, she's like six. Yeah. And so then literally, she's like, what do I have to do to get you to talk to me? And so if I'd ever spotted and I go, just be somebody else. And so when I posted that online,

I said to him, he's like, you gotta post that. And so yeah, I'm apparently not blocked on Facebook for like three days. I can't post. All the Facebook. What? I love you, bro. So anyway, so when I posted that,

and then when that, I mean, that comment and the woman looked over, I love you, man. I really reported it. So anyways, when I posted that, and then when that, I mean, the comment and the woman looked over, I was like, I got nervous for a second. I'm like, was she had that creepy look in her eye? I'm like, what if, oh, the girl said, don't forget what she said. The girl said, she's like, what do I, she's like, I want you in my butthole.

What do I have to do to get you to talk to me? That was it, like, I'll go to the butthole contest. This is literally what she said. She literally said that to you, and you posted it. And then, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the,. When you say the information, when you send it out there, um, you can't sue somebody because they posted a strange up. So well, that's a violation of Facebook guidelines. I go, you take that into a court and sue the judge says to you.

He's like, listen, I'm sorry. You're a whore. I'm sorry. The guy didn't want to put in your butthole. And he called you out. Yeah, call Facebook. Now you're embarrassed in two forums. Yeah.

Get the fuck out of here. But thank you, Adam, for getting me banned on Facebook. Yeah, you have your days. So you have to in two forms. Get the fuck out of here. Yeah, sort of. But thank you Adam for getting me banned on Facebook for a few days. I haven't, we're getting back. We're getting much money I make off that Facebook page. No, I can't post for free. We told you not to listen to him. See, all I have is invitations to flex nude for people. Can you please flex for me and put oil all over your body?

So don't you know how most males in small- You might get on that, share their bills as they know that. I know that now. Was you guys in the middle of that? The dude oiled up and they flex that now. Was you muscle in there? Yeah, they do it. They do it. They do it. They flex for people. Bro, he offered me like, how much money you offered me? Like $200 for like a four minute video?

I did the math. I had a guy private message me once. I think I told Craig the person about this because the same guy I hit up Craig and he's like, you know, I'm big fan of yours. I know your lifestyle is probably, you know, expensive, you know, with meals and training. And he's like, I would like to sponsor you.

And you know, and help you out with your bills. I go, awesome. All right. And this is what is my head, I had a black Ferrari sound. Well, the day the time I listen, I had like a $6,000 car payment, my $9,000 mortgage. I go, I have about 40 grand of expenses a month.

So if you could like leave it like 20, that'd be great. And he's like, that's not what I was talking about. I'm like, what? And he's like, well, I was thinking more of like a given trade. I'm like, yeah, I'm like, you read a check for 20 grand. I'm like, we'll stay friends on Facebook. I need to get a response after that. So apparently, I think he was, you know, looking for the,

I give you $500 and you get oiled up and flex for me. I had somebody offer me a bunch of money to fly down and host a party down in Mexico. I need, we're gonna pay for my expenses. Oh, I remember that $10,000 a day I'm like, okay, I'm listening. Keep talking to me. You're saying like, all right, you know, fly me down in Mexico I'm kind of party. I host a party 10 grand like okay, cool. Well, you know, there's one thing though You got to have no shirt on this then I'm like, I don't give a fuck half my shit smoke sure Oh, little by little. Yeah, I'm not a homophobia. I don't care. That's cool. I'm cool with that. Well, you know

More than likely you're gonna be proposition like I deal with that shit all day long. I don't care Well, you know part of the deal though It just came going further in for them like what's the guy? What's the guy? Like Dave he works for me Which I gotta get you to host our party with the fuck man you can come down 15 Long story short Adam got got had to get David Schwimmer for $800. To make a long story short, the party was not fun.

What's the matter? Yeah, exactly. He couldn't walk for a week, it was fun. He had to stay at the sandals resort. But I bought a new watch. So, saying what? It's fun. Let's talk to it's a real watch.

So let's talk about what's going on here. Here with the new like, federation or something. Oh man, it's great, great, great. So what's the deal with it? So it's a new bodybuilding federation. So Lee Thompson, who was the head of NPC Texas, was basically the right-hand man of the NPC and I, if you'd be for the last 10 years. If you know anything about the NPC, the most profitable shows have been all Lee Thompson shows,

you know, in Texas and stuff. And Lee's a very, very independently wealthy business man he's taken three companies public over past 25 years. And so Lee's been playing this for a while. He got tired of the corruption and all the problems with the IFBB. Arnold started this back at this year at the Arnold Sports Classic when he just, he attacked Jim Manion,

saying he's ruining bodybuilding and the corruption and talked about how bodybuilders have these big guts. And the reason bodybuilding is not marketable anymore is because the way the guys look. Jack Jim Manion, singing's Rooney Bodybuilding and the corruption and talked about how bodybuilders have these big guts. The reason bodybuilding is not marketable anymore is because the way the guys look. Oh yeah. Bodybuilders like Milo Sarsov and Arnold, all these guys were dentists and these guys were good looking

guys back in the magazines were successfully at Frank Sepi and Michael Herne. And now to be a pro bodybuilder, you have to like a freak. I'm not knocking those guys because like Phil and kind of they're doing what they have to do to compete and God bless them, they're being great businessmen. But it doesn't translate. Look at Flex Magazine.

You used to see all the time we were kids. That was the bodybuilding magazine we bought. Now it's nowhere. It's a horrible magazine. I mean, no one cares anymore. You know, fitness is mainstream. They don't look human and nobody wants to be that. Does anybody want to be that?

Yeah, nobody wants to be that. It used to look like, man, if I really tried hard, I could probably be like that if I tried really hard. Well, forget that. You don't want to look like that. No, nobody wants to be used to use to look like men. If I really tried hard. Yes. I could probably be like that. I tried really hard. Forget that. You don't want to look like that. Nobody wants to look like that. No. Yeah. Yeah. And so, um, you know, and plus the corruption in the sport. I mean, there's no fair judging. The stories I've heard in the past six weeks have just been ridiculous about, you know, placing's being bought and contest. I get it. I get it. It's not really a sport. The IFB NPC is not really a sports federation. It's a private entity. And so there is no fair play. There is no fair judgment. So money talks.

And so Lee was like, you know what, here's the thing. You never wanna have somebody running a federation who that's his source of income. So Jim Manning, this is what funds him. Lee's got, Lee's got, what a great player, I think. But it's true, Lee's got fuck you money, okay? But he could buy all of us over easily, probably five, 10 times.

And so he's starting this federation because, remember Lee, I have no money about Lee, he's like 330 pounds, bodybuilding got him in shape. He's got this gorgeous wife and he's a great man. And he wants to create a federation. He is, he is creating a federation where there's fair play. They, he's got the software package where all the scoring is gonna be transparent.

It's gonna go up on monitors. There's no fixing, there's no judges. Where you can change it to the last minute. So what do you mean by this? So as they're judging, you could see what's going on. So I'm gonna be a judge at tables. And we're gonna be mic'd up. So as we're seeing stuff, we're gonna have scoring criteria.

And we're gonna be immediately be typing into our laptop and it's gonna go up onto the monitors. And people are gonna see it in the preliminary judging. Now, why is this a good thing? Is it because, it's a good thing because right now everything gets changed. You see people, I was just gonna say that.

I've heard stories from three IFBB judges. I'm not gonna blow them out because they're still off IFBB judges, but they're told ahead of time, these are gonna be your first callouts. Wow. I mean, it's ridiculous. I'll tell you a story right now.

It's my very first show that I ever did. My very first show I ever did at MPC. I get up on stage and at that point before I had decided to ever get on stage, I have a lot of buddies that were already pros. So I had told myself, I'm not even gonna compete until I feel like I have a physique that can be with my buddies that are pros. So I continue to building this physique, getting myself conditioned ready. So when I went into this amateur show, you know, it's gonna be okay, can I pose and all that bullshit, whatever, right? So I get out there on this stage

and the first call outs come out and I don't even get called out the first top five, which I'll be the first person to say, like, hey, you got a great physique, I definitely give a better physique than me. I'll tell somebody that, 100%. And then there's people that it's like, it's not even a fucking close call.

I don't even make top five. There's two guys up there that literally look like they've never lifted away before. And I'm going like, and I'm thinking of myself, whoa, okay, so it gets better, right? So I'm like, this is the pre-judging. And I'm like, what the fuck? So I'm a little frustrated.

And in my mind, I wanted to prove to everybody that it isn't as political as I thought it was. And I'm going to myself, what the fuck? So I'm a little frustrated. And in my mind, I wanted to prove to everybody that it isn't as political as I thought it was. And I'm going to myself, what the fuck? And then I go to the night show. Well, the night show, I happen to have one of my buddies who actually works the show. So before I hit stage, he leans over to me and he goes, you got fourth place. I go, I have any hit stage. He goes, don't worry, you got fourth place. I'm like, no, bro, I wasn't even first callouts. He's like, yeah, they don't know that they move you up to fourth place.

Because I fucking had to because I look better than the first place guy, but it was like, they weren't even gonna put me in the top five and then I'm sure some shit happened and they're like, well, I'll give him a fourth place. He won't be qualified for nationals, but at least he'll get the top five and maybe he won't say anything about that.

Well, because here's the thing, like they, now there's so much coverage online. It looks really bad when you have comparison pictures. And it's like the guy who's like in fourth place or fifth, he doesn't have ads with the guy who's in like six or seven. So it's like they have to be a little bit more. And that's what I look like. I smoked everybody and everybody told me before I even hitstage, everyone's like the athletes and when I was backstage were coming up to me. Who's your coach? Who are you? It's my first show. I've never been anywhere and they're like, because I looked at I already had a pro. Well, the most

the most the most famous story that I can think about of controversy like this was when Arnold Schwarzenegger came back in 1980 to compete in the Olympia. He only gave himself like three months or something to prepare, showed up something like 10, 15 pounds lighter than normal. And everybody got pissed off because he won.

But of course Arnold, you know, Arnold is the spokesperson of bodybuilding. And it only makes sense. And so judging in this sense, like you're saying Joe, you even talk about Arnold's book. He even says, like he's like, I'm a fair stage. I shouldn't have won, but he says, my most favorite thing is about how Arnold always wins. He goes, but I'm Arnold, but he goes, I'm Arnold. So I find a way to win.

And so I get it in the bigger sense is to like, because he's good for the sport, but it's like, like you're talking about. He not only should you have not have placed, second he should have maybe placed third, next one. Can we share the story about Arnold? Oh, fuck, come on. I want it.

Come on. I kind of alluded to it earlier. Let me preface this before he starts. I mean, there's not a lot of people. One of the things I love about Targon and Joe is that one, he's extremely humble for all the success that he's had in the industry. He's also been around fucking everybody and met some of the fucking biggest names

You guys are thinking of Arnold Schwarzenegger being the biggest in it and it's been in a fucking hanging out talking to him before and he told us a story at lunch time It was a good back to Max girlfriend. All right, and she is listen to mine. Pondori. It's true. It's social media small play. Okay, so long story short I was in a I got to be very scarce of the details now I was in a, I gotta be very scarce for the details now. I was in an event two years ago in California and for Arnold Schwarzenegger invited by some friends that work with Arnold Schwarzenegger. And anyways, long story short, I get introduced. They're like, this is our friend of ours named Joe,

played pro football blah blah blah. And it looked at me, I introduced my girlfriend who's smoking hot. Who's smoking hot. Smoking hot. And Arnold has no filter. Like, my tip on no shame, nothing. And he's looking at me.

And oh, by the time Arnold is his best friend. And Tom Arnold's cool too. He's like, little I thought he was going to try to proposition my girlfriend. And he might have. I wasn't even listening when Arnold was talking. But anyways, Arnold is just, he is the most charismatic person I've ever.

So he proceeds to look at me, listen to that, and he's talking to my other friend. And he goes, are you married? And I go, no, he's like good. And now she's crazy Latina and kind of listening. And he goes, he goes, don't get married. I'm like, what do you mean? He's like marriage ruins lives.

He takes good men and makes them terrible men. Arnold's sure. And so now everybody on the table is kind of listening. And he's like, let me tell you right now. Arnold could be like, you know what, if you guys wanna be real men, like go have sex with a donkey, like he is so convincing, you'd be like,

yeah, I'm gonna go fuck a donkey. He's just like, he just literally is so captivated. And I've never been like, like verbally swindled like that ever. And he's just like, it may tell you some, he's like, you can make an honor, swim in out of her, you can try to do the, I keep wanting to do an Indian accent,

it's weird, my ass to go, I wanted to be like, hey Joel, you know, okay. But he's like, yeah, make a honest one out of her treat her great, he's like, but don't get married. He's like, you don't have to, he's like, it ruins you. He's like, he's like, look at me. He's like, Arnold always wins. He's like, look what I've done and I keep winning.

And I'm like, I'm like, fuck this guy's kind of right. Now he goes, listen, he's like, if you were me, he goes, if you tried to be me, he tried to be, he's like, no, you would not win. He's like, if I was goes if you tried to be me You tried to be like no you would not win. He's like if I was in your shoes I would find a way to win because like but you're not Arnold and I'm like fuck. He's right. I'm not Arnold And he's just like he's like she's a beautiful girl But he's like I see lots of beautiful girls. He's like you're a good-looking guy. You seem intelligent He goes he goes if you're intelligent don't be stupid don't get married

And now my girlfriend she's listening. That must have been a wonderful evening. Oh, she was so angry with me. And she started a fight with me later. And she's yelling and screaming. And she's like, you do I and you stick up for me and stick up? I'm like, what did you want me to say? I'm like, this is a great man. We were talking about like, he came to America and he became famous for bodybuilding. And then he's like, I'm going to be a movie star. I'm like, can't speak English. And then I'm gonna be the governor. I'm gonna marry a Kennedy. And then I'm gonna cheat on my wife with a maid who has a peg leg and a glass eye and a goatee.

And I'm not gonna apologize to the world and no one's gonna hate me. They're still gonna love me. Like, she had the biggest marriage cheating stand on a fucking Kennedy. The Kennedy's our American institution. And he lost no fan base. It was unbelievable. It was like this, he's a fucking a fake man. We can't wait for Terminator, whatever. Kennedy the Kennedy's our American institution and he lost no fan base

Unbelievable it was like this. He's a fucking a great way for Terminator whatever He's like I am Arnold and I always win. I'm like you are you always win I Feel his win. I said it probably 80 episodes ago when we started this thing is Jesus before I call I call the bodybuilding era BC before Jesus is the Arnold time right before him and out there's bodybuilding, before Arnold, yeah, a part of the week before him and out there. Here's my problem. Close to seeing that Jesus we've had. Obama, it's almost been proven Obama was not born in the United States.

Okay. He was brought here in the first tip. Here we go. I'm so hungry right now. If we could do writing votes for Arnold to be president, he'd probably get like 70% of the money. He'd win. And all he would be is like Donald Trump,

but with like biceps, not racist, but equally as aggressive. I just wanna see him yell at Putin at the United Nations meetings, you know? Like, our president is such a pussy and Putin just like bits that to him all over the place. I mean, look at how many pro bodybuilders, other than guys like Jay Cutler

who are really, really business-saving most and when they're done competing, or even when they're competing out, they're broke. I can't tell you how many guys I know that are like, that if you know, place top five in Olympia's one big shows, if they lose their supplement contract, they're done. Well, you were telling me times I have to defend myself with people on fucking social media, like, I don't understand, like, you don't have all these sponsors, you think this about yourself,

blah, blah, blah, just like you call me out all the time about fucking, I think so the world of myself, or what are that? And you don't have any sponsors or this and you have a bit on the Olympia stage and I just laugh I'm like dude seriously. I have businesses. You've never even fucking heard of that make more money than any of your fucking Olympia And here's the fuck off and that's great and because you're You're silent about you know talk about you know if we if we wanted to be asked for to prove the world We could all disclose everything that we do and people like fuck, but that's not who we are. That's not why we're doing this show. But that's part of the problem with the fitness industry is everybody's trying, I want to show this, and I want to show that.

They're like, I'm driving a 200,000 hour sports car, but bitch, you still living in an apartment. You don't own anything. You're living, you're living, you know, check to check on your sponsorship money. You don't own anything. So like two years ago, when Steve Blackman came to me, who, you know, remember when, when, twin lab, twin lab was the biggest supplement company. Right, yeah, yeah.

Steve Blackman was one of the creative rip fuel. He was a CEO of twin lab. That was a great product, but, it was great. He was one that put, he was one that brought a Fedron to the market. A Fedron is one of the greatest ingredients ever in any supplement.

It just happened to be that some fucking picture for like the Mariners or some shit. Can't do much. Yeah, he had a fucking heart problem and he died. A fedron is awesome product. Never should have got scheduled one should have got banned. But Steve was the one that made RIP fuel. It was so successful. And and Twillab was a huge company. And you know, now Steve owns, you know, a muskete development finish arcs. When he came to make two years ago and he's like,

I'm going to get back in the industry. He's like, don't sign your current sponsors. Don't sign other contract. He's going to be the face of my brand. I'm like, no, I don't want to work for anyone. I don't sign your current sponsors, don't sign other contract. Is it on you to be the face of my brand? I'm like, no, I don't want to work for anyone, I don't want to be your partner. And so we went into business together. And I tell you, not everybody can do that. However, if you want to create some type of longevity, you want to create some type of staying power, you have to be willing to take a risk. And if you're going to sell yourself out for two grand a month or four grand a month,

take the easy way out to take a check that six months from now, right now be there a year from now. I tell you right now, I have friends that they're talking about, you know, working for companies like shreds and stuff. They're supposed to make X amount of dollars. All of a sudden those contracts get changed. I have friends at Muscle Tech who are making 10 grand a month

and all of a sudden it gets changed to five or even gin. You're at the mercy of your sponsor and they know you're not gonna get an attorney and go to court, you know, it's that. So it's like, if you wanna create a legacy in life, you wanna build something great, you gotta have the balls to do it. Amen.

So this new organization that you're talking about is you were telling us they're gonna be paying like even amateur, if you were saying. Yes, so Lee believes in profit sharing. He believes, and this is why I told you is that you never wanna be part of organization where the man is using that money to line his own pockets because that's the source of income.

Like I said, at least he got fuck you money. So he didn't need to make money from this. Which is ridiculous. I mean, we have the ghost negotiation. We were talking about it at the encore. I was like, I've never set out anybody for business and I'm not asking for money. And when I'm sitting there with Javan Walker from the Green Bay Packers, and I'm like, how can I help you?

I'm like, I'm so, what do you want from me? I was expecting some kind of financial commitment. He's like, nothing. What do you mean? I've never sat down with anybody about a business when they haven't asked me for money. I tried to throw money at him and he got insulted. He wouldn't even let me buy the drinks.

I've never had anybody pick up a tab for stuff like that. It doesn't have a lot. So he's doing this purely out of the passion for the food. And why do you think the bodybuilding.com dumped the IFBB and then a 24 hour period signed with NPC Global and then also farm jumped on and then G&G. What can you share a little bit about his, is the oil store are you told this?

Or anything like that? Yeah, so we can take you on ideas about how bad asses do this. So remember during the golf war, when they had all of those oil fields, those oil spikets, they were just burning oil nonstop. And if you think about that, you can't put them out with just water. So I guess this company came up with a solution

that was water mixed with some type of chemical that was able to put those fires out. And I guess it was something, you could look it up online, but I guess it was something ridiculous, like $500,000 a minute or of oil was being burned from those big gas fires. I remember this. This is when the Iraqis were retreating at a Kuwait, and they just lit all the oil.

And the Kuwaitis were losing so much money, and so these company came in, and they were putting out all these fires, and the Kuwaitis were literally so excited. They were leaving them like pallets of money. And God bless Lee Thompson. There's an article you can look it up. It's online. When he sold the company, he turned like 67 or 70 employees into millionaires overnight. That's what you know. You're a fucking boss. Absolutely.

You make wasn't like he walked away all the money. He turned every one of those employees into millions. And if you think I'm lying, look it up online. Well, so in the past, in the past, in the past, when an organization would come out and try to compete with another organization, it especially in bodybuilding is difficult because in order to compete, you had to have the magazines. Well, the magazines were owned by... They're most of them were dictates.

They were like IFBB magazines, muscle fitness, flex magazine, all that stuff. But now with social media with the internet. It's a relevant. It doesn't even, as a matter of fact, you don't even have to win contests to get your name out there and to get popular and to get known. And so I can totally see, especially a company like you're saying, like Bodybuilding.com,

which by the way, how long ago was it Doug? We went down to Southern California where we were looking at websites and how popular they were or whatever. And I think Bodybuilding.com was like one of the most visited websites online. I mean, we're not talking small. It's massive. And if for them to leave and to back this new organization, I can see it actually. Here's the thing. What you want to talk about an organization that's run like a bunch of fucking douchebags. So most of you may be listeners know

about this, but the reason all these big sponsors pulled out of the Olympia this year is because AMI, which is the company, look it up online, look up David Pecker AMI. It's probably the worst run media company in the world. They're like $600 million in debt. They own the National Enquirer Men's Fitness, Muscle and Fitness Flex Magazine, and while David Pecker, you know, lines is pockets with $5, $6 million every year. They lose, you know, $60 million wherever every quarter. But anyways, so they bought part of the Olympia and they told every sponsor, whatever money you spend for your booth at the Expo, you're gonna have to also spend that in a year of advertising space.

So crazy. So the same amount of money. Crazy. People are like, strong aren't you? Yeah, strong aren't fucking boss. Like really? Like who the fuck, like,

I'll be honest, if I'm Quest Nutrition, I just spend a half a million dollars on that booth. And you're a company that's worth, I'm Wall Street almost 1.8 or 1.9 billion dollars right now? Why do I want to, I just don't print it alone. Why do I want to waste money in a magazine and nobody reads? Because Flex Magazine is horrible. Muscle and fitness is just turning into a joke. I mean, it's just nobody cares.

We just call it muscle and fiction. It's just terrible, you know? I mean, it's like, we just call it a muscle. Literally, it's called the WWE Magazine, because there's a professional restaurant at every other magazine. We should call it muscle infiction. That was the fucking terrible. Well, as personal trainers we did, because of the advice in that. Do they have the same staff writer who's been trying to get his, you know, like personal

training certification since like 98, like writing all the workouts. He's like, why grip, why grip, let pull down sports sets of talent? Like I've seen that since the 97 issue of like, oh, it's just the worst workout. So it actually sounds like, because when Adam first told me about this, I thought back to the WBF, which back then it was a completely different landscape,

completely different atmosphere. Let me tell you though, just to put it up real quick. Yeah, WBFF did extremely well when they introduced in the American market. I remember going to both their world shows in Toronto and there was like five, six thousand people. Went to the Olympia, there was probably 700 people

on the Friday night show. I love this guy, this old turd has been around for everything. It was a terrible time. He's been around. He was mind pumped before mind pumped. He was mind pumped. Okay, 2012 was like three years ago.

Yeah, yeah. Better, but you know what I'm out. Yeah. But you know what I'm just saying with the WBFF me it worked for a little bit. Um, but I got Mike, but you said is that originally before social media really blew up is supplement companies like the cellular cores and stuff. It was like, um, you for you to have valued had to be on like covers of magazine. Right. But not anymore.

Not anymore. So but you couldn't get published because the the I.F.E. was like, wait a minute. She's a WBFF girl We're not putting her on a magazine, right? And so the WBFF they moved overseas and they're killing the I.F.E.B.N. NBC overseas like it's just they're doing unbelievable So yeah, so like that's what that's kind of what they had to do But now with social media, I mean, it's like fuck. I mean if you had if you had to realistically put the top 10 highest pay people in this industry On paper outside of someone like

J. Cutler who owns his own line and stuff. I'll tell you right now the top 10 are probably people that don't even compete. Don't even compete. Not at all. Yeah, it's a, and that's completely changed the landscape. I mean, 20 years ago, 30 years ago, if you competed and you won Olympia, that's how you kind of got up into the, that's how you started earning a living as by doing that but not anymore. No. And now you've got companies that are extremely successful that have never sponsored a competing athlete.

Have never been at a, you know, at Olympia or whatever. A perfect example. One of my best friends owns BPI and he doesn't, Derek doesn't believe in sponsoring athletes and BPI is quietly turned into almost a half a billion dollar a year, you know, sales company. But he doesn't see the value in it. And he's he was thinking ahead of the curve. He's like, he's like, I have no problem with the sport of bodybuilding or competing, but he goes, it's such a small segment. We were talking about this earlier about being mainstream. Outside of Quest Nutrition, remember the largest supplement company in the United States is still EAS. Can anybody name one EIS and-

Not in the body building? No. Can you name one supplement? No, other than the big bag of protein, that's the only supplement we can think of. The reason EIS still has huge sales is because they sell at Costco and BJs and Sands, the big bag of protein.

And that's a mainstream product. So pre-workouts and post-workouts and fat burners and all this stuff blah, blah, blah. That's great, but it's a small market. Right. You know, and sponsoring bodybuilders like, Hey, man, it's great fill heats. You know, pushes gift nutrition. How many people you know, use a gift nutrition product? Right.

Nobody. Yeah. How many people do you know actually use like a shreds fat burner? I know shreds people don't even use shreds fat burn. I'm not talking about that. But I'm not even saying there's anything wrong with that. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that. Obviously, dude, dude. It's just a small world.

You've never really seen it. I've never even seen it. But if you're not in brick and mortar stores, you're not in the vitamin shops and the G&C's and all that stuff, you don't have market share. That's where you want to be mainstream. We're talking about doing supplements that are organic. Yeah, I was just going to say, because if you look at, I was just going to ask you the future of this industry.

It looks to me, and we've talked about this. We're one of the first, I'd say, fitness people to really even bring this up. We think that the future of fitness supplements is the melding of wellness health with performance and fitness. In the past, performance supplements were, they prided themselves in looking as chemical as possible right well you mean when you have you know major retailers say no safe way and lucky is all having or organic sections and you have Chipotle voluntarily they don't want to go on your own to your one thousand is there a couple other

counter well well you know well you know well it's going well it looks like that's the direction of that industry and I can't I'm actually happy about it because I think it's gonna bring people who aren't super into fitness, more into fitness, and it's gonna bring people who are maybe unhealthy in the fitness side, maybe look a little bit more into longevity and health. There's always gonna be a bodybuilding crowd.

There's always gonna be a market segment for pre-workout and post-reouts, those specialized items. But let's look at one thing. Five years ago, there wasn't even a company called Quest Nutrition, okay? Right. Four and a half years ago, Tom and his wife, Lisa, those guys were owning a software company.

On their own time at night, they were making these bars, they were cutting them by hand in the kitchens. So awesome. You're kidding me. Yeah, that's how it started. And they're like, oh, this doesn't taste good. They kept redoing it, redoing it. Holy shit.

Four and a half years later, Wall Street values I'm in almost $2 billion. Okay. Now, that kind of growth is unprecedented. We haven't seen that since the software boomers. Yeah, but it's not the bodybuilders that have made it grow. Right, but listen, we haven't seen that anywhere since the 2000s of when those tech companies

and stuff grew, but this is a company actually has physical products. They don't make a creatine. They don't make a pre-workout, they don't make a post-workout. They have a healthy nutritional bar that has caught market share in mainstream America. It's awesome. And I'll tell you right now, it's only the beginning. In five years, they're going to be a $10 billion valuation. I'll bet $10,000 on around it because they're moving into mainstream food products,

cereals, and protein ice cream with no carbs. There you go, believe it or not. This is the melting that I'm talking about. This is the melting that I'm talking about. What I went to the grocery store yesterday, and there was an organic almond milk from, I forgot the name of the company, it's a big company. And it said, super protein almond milk,

and it's for like families. That was $14.99. Yeah, yeah. But my point is, you're right, it's all, they're totally melting, it's moving into, they're moving into each other. And that's a good, I think that's an awesome thing. I feel like, if you're listening right now, I love hearing predictions from other fucking intelligent

fitness people in this industry. It's very, very good to hear that. So like that, like it's, it's the direction it's going. You're an idiot if you don't see it. And if you're not willing to adapt and evolve, like you're gonna get stuck with all the rest of the idiots. Well, like I said, here's the thing here today, gone tomorrow.

And we've all seen enough. There's people that were hugely popular in the fitness industry, but the company for whatever reason went the wrong direction and they lost their contract. And I can tell you right now, 90% of these fitness Instagram celebrity people, the majority of their income comes

from their supplement company sponsorship. And we had this conversation earlier, five of the 10 most well-known supplement companies are probably on shaky ground as far as sales right now, where they're, I mean, muscle farm might not be here in six months. There's a couple other, I mean, Gisparri, I mean, Rich doesn't even own any more.

He's just an employee that has to stay at like $90 hotels a night. I mean, that was a company that was approaching $100 million in sales. And they just sold for under 10 million. I mean, that's like, it's ridiculous. Is it because the industry's evolving so quickly that they're not even in the state? I think it's mism- I think it's different for every company. But I think a lot of it's mismanaged. Egos get too big.

I think that it's great to be an innovator. It's great to be a creator, but when a company grows to a certain size, you need to bring in a real CEO. And so I think that, you know, you've got most of the companies in this industry are created by guys who are really in the fitness, guys who are in the body building, they know a little bit of science. That's great. That's great when you're in five million dollar company or ten million dollar company.

There is something to be able to talk about on your page a little bit. There is something to be said for having an MBA, understanding how to run a business and being a true CEO. Well, a smart CEO in my eyes, like if I owned a company and it became $10, $20, $30 million dollars for $100,000,000, $50 million. I would go higher the dude that knows all that shit. Absolutely. And the good that knows all that shit. Absolutely right. And the good businessmen do that.

I remember, you know, Derek who ran, you know, created BPI. I remember when he brought in the guy who used to be the CEO of Ben and Jerry's. I was just like, you brought like Walt, like, Ray's a guy. And he goes, but he goes, he goes, I'm not a real CEO because yeah, I built this company

but he goes, and me tearing now. So humble to be that way. Well, think my father was a vice president of Kodak and he told me he's like, and I remember when I was going through grad school and he said to me, he's like, the worst kind of company manager is someone that thinks they know everything,

or he gets in the way. He goes the best kind of leader is someone that takes, that listens to everything and takes it all in and then evaluates what he's hearing. Because the minute you think you know everything, you're dead in the water. It's true. And that's the reason why most of these supplement companies, they blow up, they get big money,

then they fail, it's because it's ego. They don't want to be able to say, hey, listen, hear the red flags, watch out, listen to that or maybe you shouldn't dump $30 million into expanding protein worldwide and stuff like that. It's like people are like, no, no, I gotta have this supplement. Well, listen, there's no margins.

Stick to what you're doing. Grow here here, don't spend a half a million dollars on a booth here, don't no, I gotta have this supplement. Well, listen, there's no margins, you know, stick to what you're doing. Grow here here. Don't spend a half a million dollars on a booth here. Don't do this. Don't do that. People get ahead of themselves. It's so fitting for the industry that we're in. It's ego-driven.

It's ego-driven. It's so ego-driven. It's so fitting for what we do, you know what I'm saying? It's like, the writing is on the wall, what do you think about that? I got a question about this new, not to keep going back to it, but these keep popping on my head.

This new organization, this body, are they gonna change the ideal of what they're looking for? Absolutely, yes, we, okay. It's a really great question, thank you for bringing it up. And I know it, Lee asked me to be a judge, and one of the things that if I do decide to judge, in addition, I'll be sitting on the board, it's,

but I also, I don't wanna see men's physique guys get up there that have gyne, don't want to see men's physique guys get up there that have gyneau I don't want to see men's physique guys get up there. I'm just saying. Yeah, I don't want to see guys that look Overly juiced up for their physique and that just looks, you know, they're so stringy and so dry I don't want to see guys get up there. They've been wearing a screen for six months, and I can't see the definition of their abs One of my good friends, you know Logan Logan has in my opinion the ideal men's physique. That's Logan's one of those guys that he just trains hard, he can just walk on stage, pass a drug test right after, he just looks ridiculous. That's why I want to use this model.

It's like a healthy lifestyle, clean line. Now this crazy vascularity and un-proportioned and you wore a squeam and you're all sucked in and you look like a fucking moron. And nor do I want to see bikini girls emaciated on stage with lines to their abs. That's not, you know, it's not- So you're looking for them.

There's more of a healthy fitment and I'll look. And Lee gets it. And he's like, yeah, he says, you're gonna have the audacity to mark people down for me of the, yeah, I have the audacity. Trust me. Well, you know what's funny is that's actually more marketable. That's really smart.

Well, so in addition, like Lee said, he goes, we're gonna have the traditional athletic, he's gonna call that athletic bikini category but also like the Hawaiian tropic, like beach body bikini. And that's so more curvy, more curvy. Girls in our could have a six pack. Now, this isn't genius to me. This is why I wanted to throw money out of me

and want my money because here, look at all the girls. That's my favorite category already. Instagram, Instagram famous girls have four, five million followers. Those are all curvy girls. So you start giving these girls appearance fees. Come compete here and invite in, you know, compete in this category and start, you know, trying to build business with them. One, you've given

yourself instant legitimacy and a huge following. But now you're giving yourself a platform for girls who are curvy and attractive to compete. Right. The average American girl doesn't want to have an eight pack, doesn't want to have lines through her serratus. She just wants to get in shape. Right. And she doesn't want to have lines through her serratus. She just wants to get in shape, right? And she doesn't want to have to take drugs and she doesn't want to take, you know, clean and anivar and her clitoris gets the size of atoms forehead. You know, and

I'm just saying I mean, I'm just having a big forehead, you know, but I'm just, it is a five head, but I'm just saying like, you know, she you don't want like the average girl doesn't want to take all these drugs and ruin herself. Right. She just wants to get in shape and have a platform to do it and she doesn't want to take all these drugs and ruin herself. Right. She just wants to get in the shape and have a platform to do it. And she doesn't want to feel like she has to be part of a team and just to post naked or be part of a federation or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG or FMG Absolutely phenomenal. Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. For more information about this show and to get valuable free resources from Sal, Adam, and Justin, visit us at www.mindpumpradio.com. Until next time, this is Mind Pump.