Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 207: Why we pick on CrossFit

Episode Date: December 24, 2015

The topic of CrossFit comes up fairly frequently on Mind Pump. What's with all the attention that Sal, Adam & Justin give them? Are they really secret admirers? Well, they do acknowledge their masterful job of marketing, creating community and making squats and deadlifts popular once again. However, personal experience and concern for the health and safety of fitness minded people has compelled them to reveal the downside of this type of training. Please subscribe, rate and review this show! Learn more about Mind Pump at www.mindpumpradio.com

that what is all that on the board what it looks like what well i just want you guys to know exactly what we have it's take here what is it to we have about two weeks left maybe a little less to sell the bundle then it's gone so to be clear after two weeks were no longer selling this

amazing deal more to go and all more but nobody no more bundle of the map satellite program the no bs six pack formula the nutrition survival guide or the intermittent fasting survival guide and The free forum access for life because after that you're gonna have to pay this is a lot of content everybody It's huge so if you bought all the in other words you bought all this stuff separately How much would it cost Justin if we bought it all separately? Oh my God. Too much because it's terrible. Probe. Yeah. He's asking the non-math. Yeah. Well, it's on the board.

Yeah. It's $248. I wasn't looking. That's what I was fucking pointing to it, Justin. You're like this, like with your hand, like you're always very, you know, hey, authoritarian. I'm a leader. We can't even do our commercials right. Jesus. So normally 248 for all that stuff, The bundle is 147. It's going to be over January 1st is the last day. That's the final day after that. I'll never be offered ever again. By the way, in roll now, you also get a 30-day money back guarantee. Try it out. If it doesn't blow

you away, we'll refund you. And that's 41% off. Right. Last time this bundle, 248 dollars everybody. 1% off right last time this bundle $248 everybody down to 147 down to 147 boom pump radio dot com big yellow button click on it if you want to pump your body and expand your mind there's only one place to go mind up with your hosts Salta Stefano, Adam Schaefer and Justin Andrews

she's the one that co-authored the fear god she's the one that makes a fear all right Salda Stefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. She's the one that covered the fear God. She's the one that makes her feel all right. Whoa, I didn't know the Bee Gees sang that song. Yeah, they did. They're the ones that you love. Ha, ha, ha, ha. God.

Well, you can't tell by the way I used my walk. Damn, how do you get those high notes? I punch myself in the balls. Oh, right before you. I just do that for fun. I don't know what makes you sing like that or you can twist them Come here Adam let me put you the nuts. You know, nothing could make Adam hit that note Very true Adam has one time Adam has one note When it's done is done it's the same it's the same octave I do what it's done is done. It's the same it's the same octave

You guys so I started smoking cigarettes the other day because I was like I want my voice to sound more like Adam's I'm like you too because everybody's like you sound like Kermit like fuck. I want to sound like Adam I made sure it was meant I ripped the I ripped the the filter right off and just smoke it straight and hopefully it'll it'll affect my voice It only lasts for like two seconds. So I can sound awesome. Do you have a try-sickers as a kid? Did you try-sickers as a kid? Of course. Did you go through a phase?

Did you go through a phase where you actually smoke for a while? Here's the thing about cigarettes. I don't get it. Let me tell you why I don't get it. The high last like fucking five minutes, which is okay. So now you just did something bad for you and it's a waste. It doesn't taste very good. It's terrible.

Yeah, it makes you smell like shit. You don't like you don't you can't give cigarettes to like people around like, Hey guys, it's smoked some cigarettes and then we're all going to connect and communicate and have this great. No, it's like we're a bunch of asshole smoking outside. There's just nothing about it that I get. So that's why I never got into it. They sure hand stink. Yeah, you're getting to sure hand stink I did I think I think for almost almost two years. Oh my god

Why is voices like this? Yeah almost to you. Yeah, man. Just a marble reds really? Yeah Why did you smoke cigarettes? Yeah, you know, but it was very I think I think the I think the most, I had, I started like social smoking. I think that's how it probably everybody does, right? Like you're drinking your own. Yeah, I drink your own. I do. And it was probably in my early, it was somewhere around 21 to 24 or somewhere in that age bracket.

I don't remember what it was. And it was, and when I say it was, I was, I, I, a pack would last me like two months, dude. Yeah. You wanted a smoker. Yeah, I was smoking every day. I would have me like two months, dude, you know? Oh, okay. Yeah, so I, You weren't a smoker. Yeah, I was smoking every day. I would have a cigarette every single day. I don't think I've ever done that. But you'd have someone you went out.

Yeah, yeah. I had someone I'd go out. Oh, yeah, I've done that. I had some of my house, too, so I got through a stressful day of work. I'd come home and that was like the thing on my deck. I would smoke my cigarette before I was a bad or something. Yeah, I was like, So it was like a phase that I went through for almost two years.

Give me a drag. Off and on in that time. And then at one point, I looked at myself, what the fuck am I doing? Yeah, that's what it was. It was just this awakening one. You're like, what am I doing? I don't even like the high. Give me the joy.

Yeah. That was part of the, I never, I had never smoked, but I wouldn't smoked marijuana at all. Yeah, that's right. You know, so I told you that wasn't until the cannabis clubs. When I was involved with the cannabis clubs in, that was shit. I was already 29, you know't until the cannabis clubs, when I was involved with the cannabis clubs, that was shit, I was already 29, 29 years old, 28, so we're out there. No, I see, I went to Italy, we go to Italy, we try to go to Italy every two or three years,

and there was a one summer, where, because everybody smokes up. I was gonna say, everybody smokes up. So where, my wife's friends husband he you know He would smoke and he'd say do you want one and I had probably three cigarettes while I was over there But I remember I would have the cigarette it would be mine So I wasn't sharing with anybody right and I like after like three or four hits I was like Yeah, like I gotta smoke the whole thing now

I don't know if I do like migraines from that like the next day I just like had the worst headaches. You know what? Cures that another cigarette. I was going to get that. What about chewing tobacco? Do you guys ever look at it? I can even throw it in the throat.

Even shorter phase. That was like maybe a chewing. Yeah. It was worse like a month. Yeah, I don't get that all. And I tried like multiple times, dude. Yeah. I wanted to.

I was like, I want to be that guy. Yeah. Exactly. I was like in the in the dugout, you know, hey, here's you're some Copenhagen, you know, whatever I'm like all right, I can do this, you know, don't swallow it Don't swallow it, you know, and you just keep telling yourself that and you spit and I was just like Every single time puke like not just puke it was like death puke time puked, not just puke, it was like death puke. That's the sweet thing, right? I mean, I just say, I just say,

everything in my intestines, I even try those packets, you remember the little the packets that they had so you could, and it's still, just the little puts you on. Just swallowing your own. It's too much nicotine at once, oh, yeah. Oh, it just would, yeah. So here's what I would kill me. Here's what happened to me, I turn 18, and so when you're 18,

there's really not much you could do other than go to the strip club and buy tobacco, right? So you gotta do both right? So I do the strip club. That's awesome Then I'm like, oh, what can I do? Well, I've tried cigarettes or kind of gross. Oh, I know I'm gonna try chewing tobacco. So I go to the gas station. I'm 18. I think I'm a bad ass I buy some fucking mint flavored. I don't know what it was the shredded one was cool and You know my buddy used to chew debacle all the time. So I'm like, okay, I know he does.

And I put it in my lip and I'm chewing it and I'm driving. And I start to get kind of a buzz and I'm like, this is kind of weird. And I start to get dizzy and I'm like, this is not cool. And I just fucking hurled. Brrrr. And I remember thinking like, what the fuck?

Why? Why would you do that? There's no reason to do that. I'm not fun. What's crazy though. I think everybody has that similar experience somewhat. Their first time, I've never heard someone tell me a story like, oh man, I put you in my mouth and it was just meant to be.

It was just, yeah, it's some of those guys, or everybody gets over that. Yeah, right, exactly. Everybody, I never got over that. And you go kind of through it, and your body gets adapted to it, and it gets used to it, and you tell it, then you're addicted to it, right?

That's how it works. It's like, whoa. It's, you know, it's funny, that's an interesting point. Is Then you're addicted to it, right? That's how it works. It's like, whoa. It's, you know, it's funny. That's an interesting point. Is that what's happened with alcohol too? It's an interesting point. It's like people had to try to like it before they liked it. I believe that.

I believe that. And it actually takes some fucking work. I know there's somebody who's listening to like that would totally debate that and say they're not that way because they want to be the exception of the rule. See, not all drugs are like this. Like you hear people's experiences with taking like Molly or something like that

You never have them come back away. I took Molly the first time. I was fucking horrible. I had to take it ten times before I liked it I don't know who you guys talked They're all They're hurting you this stuff. You know I'm saying usually people. Oh my god I tried it for the first time. I have the greatest experience of my life. You don't hear that about about chewing tobacco You're not advocating you. I gotta say that Doug's looking at me. We're not advocating games. Please, disclaimer. It's rocks.

Okay, I'm sorry. They're all freely talking about it as adults. Yeah, they're all right. I think it's, I mean, it's 100%. I hate that we do stray away. I know people like to hear our opinion on a lot of things like that. And I feel like not enough people do talk about that openly.

I feel like it's such a taboo subject because it's illegal, it's drugs, but it's reality. Well, the fucking most people listening have already done a bunch of them themselves or they're going to if there's some really young kid to try and experiment, she like that. I mean, I think it's important to share.

They didn't know the truth. Yeah, that's all I feel like share a share. Share, I mean, in fact, I wish somebody would share with me a lot of my experience I've now gone through. Like, I wish someone would have told me that shit before, you know what I'm saying? Well, I'll tell you what I wish. So I, even though I'm a tie and we didn't have alcohol in the house,

so we didn't drink wine or anything like that. So I had no experience with alcohol whatsoever. So here's my first experience with alcohol. I go to drink, I'm drinking, and I'm starting to get happy and little drunk, and I'm like, this is fucking awesome. So I keep drinking, I keep drinking, and then I get sick of shit,

because I didn't understand that you got to wait a second bro. It hasn't even hit you fully. Yeah relax Yeah, just chill because I think that the good feeling that I'm getting from the South calls only get to get better if I keep drinking You know what I'm saying? So it's important to know like to be smart and to educate like, you know people on this I'm gonna tell my kids that like this is like ice cream man My my my kids when my kids turn 21 They're gonna drink with me for the first time Yeah, you know, I'm saying hopefully they haven't drink before that What do you think?

Well, I'm on the road. How are you when you had your first beer? Well, I'm on the radio. I can't I'm on this pod. I can't be like Yeah, when my son turns 15 I'm like Give him his first shot of Kila Because then you know Protective services. I know, but I so I had to call that bullshit out. You what I'm doing. I'm so gonna have my first beer with my son in 21. Okay dad I'm gonna show I'm gonna take you hold out. I'm gonna show him his first titties when he's 18 He's not gonna see them like today on the internet at all. Yeah, no way possible

No, listen, I wouldn't you know, I don't want to switch gears too fast on you, but I wanted to bring up this. Because you burn up my clutch. So, and the reason why I want to bring it up is it's actually the third time this has happened to me in the last month and a half or so. Is there a burning sensation? No, no.

Every day I see, in the gym, I see lots of people that are fans of the show and they listen and I love when people come up and say hi to me and they make comments about you know Latest episodes or something that they really enjoyed or whatever So I totally appreciate feedback like that when people when they we like a good feedback Yeah, yeah, that's what we focus on. I appreciate it when you say good thing But that's what I'm actually listening. I have had a handful of people ask this, like, why do you guys always pick on CrossFit? Oh, no. And you know, well, the first thing I always ask

when I always ask them, they listen to like, you know, I forget too. That was like one of the first episodes. We're episode 200 and something, right? And that was episode like three. You're right now was, if it was like the beginning of this year. Yeah, it was a long time ago.

It was. And, you know, and I think that's just it is, they've listened to a lot of like maybe the last 50 episodes more Previous they didn't they weren't at the very beginning and so we always do like these little subtle jabs About Crossfit, but then we never really what I mean to some of these new listeners We never break down the science we never talk about this because we brought up past experiences with substances Let's talk about our first experience with CrossFit. Yeah, when do you guys remember when you first heard about it?

Oh, absolutely. Yeah. For me, so at the time, I was doing Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, and the Jiu-Jitsu school that I trained at in San Jose, but their headquarters school was in Santa Cruz, and Santa Cruz is where CrossFit was invented. Yeah, okay. The originator there.

So before it became popular, before anything ever got big, a lot of the Jiu-Jitsu guys from Santa Cruz would sometimes come down and Sam is training with us and then they talk about this new workout that they would do called CrossFit. That's when I first heard about it. So I'm a trainer, right?

I understand fitness. So I'd ask them, like, well, what do you guys do? And they'd, oh, it kicks your ass, dude, you fucking get hammered. Okay, okay, but explain to me, like, what you do? Yeah, I'm like, what is it? Like, what is the workout? Like, do you guys lift weights? Well, yeah, we do, but we don't rest and we go back and forth and then we go real fast. I'm like, okay, so it's like a circuit. No, no, it's not a circuit because we do Olympic lifts, but how do they put it together? So they kept explaining it to me. And I slowly realized that this is just,

this is what I thought it was back then, because back in those days, boot camps were getting popular. And we're trainers, we're just stringing a bunch of exercises together and get everybody fucked up. And that's what I thought it was, because that's what it sounded like. And it actually is kind of like that. So when they, when they, when they,

it's kind of spot on. When they would tell me about that, I remember I was thinking in my head like, no, that's not really a, that's not really, yeah, that's not good. You just, so you, so you basically feel like throwing up at the end and you feel, and it's beating the crap. But yeah, it's awesome.

Like, well, that's not really that good. So there were a couple of them. There were a couple of them that took a side who, you know, I was, I was kind of close to. And you know, I have a of close to and you know, I have a it's very difficult for me to keep my mouth shut obviously. So I tried as much as I could and I took them aside and say that's actually not a really good way to work out. And so one of the guys was like, well, what should I do to work out? So I gave them kind of a little bit of a programming, you know,

I broke it down made of your basic forum and he fucking loved it and he never went back to the to their CrossFit school but that's that was my first experience with CrossFit and that was before I before I started hearing about people coming up to me with injuries and stuff like that so okay I have to share this with the listeners because the listeners will appreciate this you know we keep it raw and real in this show so just like I don't know maybe 15 20 minutes go whatever sounds like. Sal is taking a shit. And, uh, thank you. Just, it's just, it's just real again. Wow. And, uh, check the point of what you're gonna say. Yeah.

Oh, it's important. Okay. That's why I'm not going in there. So, so Justin and I, uh, are bullshitting back and forth. And we're actually talking about this, this actual conversation that we're having right now. Yeah. Without Sal, Sal wasn't in the room.

And, and Justin and we're sharing like, man, I remember the very first time I was introduced to CrossFit in the very my first experience in Him and our laugh and we're sharing our experience and they're like, oh my god. And then after we're done laughing, I go like, hey, what do you think Sal's experience is like and just and I both agree like, oh, you know, I mean, Justin, what'd you say you said, uh, you look at the like you would like you would like immediately pick it apart and be like, oh, what's the programming you know what are you actually doing what was the benefit of this you know and like to the tea and he was like you said it so Justin and I both actually have

physical stories of how CrossFit came it was and we actually gave it a whirl yeah good college try and that was just it we both decided that it's sad we probably would be like he would have looked at it from the outside. You dismiss it immediately. Yeah, just. Yeah, that's true. Yeah, that's true. Yeah, that's stupid. I'm not even gonna do it.

We're at least just what I did. I mean, because I thank you for living up to that. You know, it's funny. If they asked me to, they said, you gotta come try it, Sal, you'll love it. I remember thinking to myself, why? You're telling me what you guys are doing. I know I'm on a few afterwards.

Right. It's not gonna make me any better at Jiu Jitsu. It'll give me more, any more stamina aside from what I'm doing on my own. It's not gonna make me any better at Jiu Jitsu or give me more stamina aside from what I'm doing on my own. Why? Why would I go do that? I never went. But you guys, your first experience was taking a class. Yeah, I'll share my, it played into my athletic,

competitive bone. I was like, oh yeah, back then. And we admitted on the show multiple times when we first got started, like I was very much intensity driven and you know, I wasn't crazy with my clients or anything, but like the way that I trained personally, you know, I definitely hammered my body, and I think that's why, you know, I tend to voice the opposite now. So heavily is just because like, that was definitely something that I did, you know, and I'll admit it 100% because you know coming from different football programs and you know,

basketball, baseball, whatever it was, like we always was like as hard as we train, that equates to better. So anyway, basically like we were talking back and forth and it mean Adam actually One of Adam's friends I believe Oh, so you guys you guys you guys knew each other during this time Well, so my buddy's tied to like all that's how I know all right big names and stuff and the CrossFit guys because they're at all originated here and a lot of these guys are buddies of mine You know like the Neil Mannick's when it was like first forming. Yeah we, like Adam actually showed me, and he was talking about his friend Austin, who had been running it, this place in Milpitas.

And so like, we actually did a couple of workouts. And between me and Adam, I think we are more reasonable with it. So it was like, oh, yeah. I see, it's kind of like a circuit, you know, and it's tough, you know, whatever. But later when I, when I, when it got more popular, maybe a couple years later, I was in golds and there was this trainer there that like really, really was all about it. And he stood out like a sore thumb. And I'm always like the guy that pays attention to the guy that's different, you know, because I, at the time I was, you know, I was tired of the whole bodybuilding mentality myself. Like I don't, I don't like

training like that, you know, I want more athleticism myself. I don't like training like that. I want more athleticism. I did a lot of stuff that was athletic specific. I would watch him train and everything. He took me through one of his CrossFit workouts. The first one I did, I believe, is called Fran, where you do these thrusters. It's like, I don't know if it's like 185 pounds, something like that. And you basically, you front squat,

and then you thrust up into a push press. So this is apparently one of their coined exercises that they came up with. So it obviously fatigues the shit out of you. You do like 21 of them, then you do like 21 pull ups, then you do like 15 and 15 back and forth, back, forth, anyway, like four rounds, right? I get to the fourth round.

I get through the thrusters. You know, I immediately had to sit down. I sat down, you know, the room, the walls started coming in. Like I had tunnel vision. I was like so close to blacking out. I was just like, what the fuck? You know what sucks? This is what's in the face. Let me finish.

Well, I was gonna say right now you're selling it. People are listening right now, oh, I wanna do that. Stupid. Yeah. Damn it. I don't know. We rounded all together. It will fit.

Okay, it's coming in. Well, all is are coming in. I'm like, claim, I'm about to pass out and I can barely breathe. And like, you know, I was pretty conditioned at the time too. It wasn't that. It was that I was driving so hard for time that I personally overexerted before I even got there. And so I stopped and I'm like, oh my God, you know what?

It's crazy, right? You feel like you're gonna die, huh? I was like, yeah, I do. I think this is the stupidest shit I've ever done and then I walked away. And then from then on, it was just like, I just was 100% against it. So he's sharing that.

I'm like, that's so crazy because I just recently, it was just a recent episode I talked about that I've bonked before and that was my first real experience through it. Just like Justice had, I had a buddy, Austin McGeeving, had ran the Milpitas CrossFit and he was part of when Jason Calipa, I watched Jason Calipa flip and flip and tires and shit in the parking lot before he was ever anybody in the CrossFit world and stuff. And he was with my buddy Austin over in Milpitas.

And these guys, he would show me some of the workouts. I would bring him back to my facility in Justin, myself, Ron, and a couple of trainers. We would do it. And just like Justin said, same process is going through my head. I'm going like, man, these are some kick ass circuits. And I'm like, I like it because they're putting some good compound movements in there.

That would normally like your circuits were more curves like, right? The circuits that you would see that were done after curves were modeled a lot after curves. They were just all these little machines. Yeah, machine circuit. We used to remember at 24, we used to have the zone, whatever first line of machines is all to do this once. With numbers on it and you go on and that's it. It's this body part, this body part.

I mean, I remember we got as fitness managers, I had to teach this, which I think back to that now, this is so crazy to hold on their episode itself. Thinking back to my boss teaching me to take clients through a circuit of machines over and over and over and over and over as we're going to we used to sell that as like a training program. Like you pay.

So remember that. Oh, dude, it was crazy. It was crazy. And it's so ridiculous that we did that. But that being said, when I when I saw this program, I'm like, Oh, cool. It's not machines. You know, you're doing thrusters and dead lives and pushups and pull up some like, Okay, I like this. This is cool. Yeah, I kicked your ass. And I saw the competitive fun side to it. But I hadn't really officially gone through like one and actually tried to compete with somebody or really push myself. And then my first experience was doing it against one of my other trainers who I introduced us to was Ronnie.

And you know, Ronnie and we're going back and forth and this is where I blocked and we're doing some fucking, I don't even know the name of it. It was some row and burpee, you know know a bajillion of them till you till you die type of deal. And it was for time how fast you get there. And he went first so I was competing against his time. And so I had and just like Justin I was in I was in good shape at this time. I was in a lot and I was in better uh fitness and fitness shape then then I am like and performance shape. Right now I'm in better aesthetic shape. But I was in great performance shape. I was playing ball and everything back then and I fucking literally bumped I couldn't

move like my body completely shut down and I remember afterwards like my it was the trippiest feeling like I had to get up on the treadmill and my heart was pounding so hard and fast I had to walk my heart rate back down because when I tried to sit and completely stop I got all fucking crazy and dizzy and it was it it was a nightmare dude. And afterwards I go like, okay, I pushed you hard on that. This is a workout that these people are teaching other people that are not trainers or not athletic. They're not smart enough to know when to stop, not to stop. And then I was, that's when I had known, I had like in my mind, so I'm okay. This is kind of stupid like I was over But then I wasn't but I had made my stance on you know I was anti-crossfit until I realized that like now they were starting to build this empire

Around it like a training facility like it's a way of getting in shape right because I'm totally okay with the athletes That want to get fucking crazy because in the beginning that's what it was in the beginning in the beginning In the beginning was athletes in the beginning it was people who you know would want to go fucking crazy. Because in the beginning, that's what it was. In the beginning, in the beginning, it was athletes, in the beginning, it was people who, you know, would want to go challenge themselves to that level who are also very, very fit. And I'm like, look, if you're, if you know what you're doing and you're super fit

and you want to go run a hundred miles, go for it, or you want to go climb a mountain, go for it. If you're every day person, I want to get in better shape, you shouldn't do those things. That's how I view CrossFit. And so, really, here's the problem. Here's a deal. The exercises are not really the issue in CrossFit. There's a couple, there's a few exercises in there that are issues, like keeping pull-ups and shit that they make up, or that they turn into a workout, which really...

Just really the overall concept of... They're not made up, it's a genius combination with sprinting. Yeah, it's not really exercises because in reality, the vast majority of exercises, I'd say 99% of the exercises in CrossFit are the best exercises you could do. They just are.

That's the lure of CrossFit and that's why a lot of people see better results doing CrossFit than they do doing machine-based workouts. It's not the programming, it's the allure of CrossFit. And that's why a lot of people see better results doing CrossFit than they do doing machine-based workouts. It's not the programming. It's the exercises. The problem with CrossFit is the programming. That's where I have the problem.

And let me explain something to those you listening, ladies and gentlemen, I love it when I say that, Adam. I'm gonna hate these. A workout, an effective routine, is as much about the programming as it is about the exercises. Okay. I need you to really let that sink in. Think about that.

It's not just the exercises, it's how you put them together. It's the order that they're in. It's the tempo that you do them. It's the frequency of how you do them. It's the length of time of your workouts. It's the speed of the reps. It's the intention of how you do them. It's the length of time of your workouts. It's the speed of the reps. It's the intention of each repetition. This is the science.

This is the real science. It's angelating. It's adding all these like phases. There's so many variables. But this is the real science of an effective routine. It's the programming. Because I could take anybody and within three months teach them effective exercises, maybe not Olympic lifts, but I'll explain and I'll

understand the Olympic lifts within a few months, but it would take a lot longer than that to teach people effective programming with specific goals in mind. And this is what CrossFit throws out the fucking window. There is no programming. They make up programming. Their programming is, let's combine these exercises because they're going to kick your ass. That's their programming. That's not what effective programming is all about. Effective programming takes your body from your starting point and moves you up a step ladder with a specific goal in mind. That specific goal is either explosive strength or maximal strength or maybe increasing your agility and proprioception

or maybe increasing the ability of your body to be durable, to have that durability with strength. Those are the kinds of things that you program specifically for because just anybody can take a few effective exercises to throw them together and kick your ass. I could do that all fucking day long. No problem. I will just that all fucking day long. No problem. Yeah, I will just to not split those in general

and to combine them all within the one thing, right? I wanna get hypertrophy and I wanna add it in. All the ones. Fatigue, yeah, endurance component in there, plus strength, plus power. It's like in one workout, are you kidding me? Yeah, I think the body works like that. It doesn't it does not It doesn't you're better off in that's way we phased, you know the original maps as well

Even though it wasn't specifically performance based but we that's the way we designed that that's that's what good Program is good programming focuses on different facets Specifically for periods of time and then at end, it tends to bring them together and enhances the overall. So you go through them again, and guess what? Right. The first wave, and I still get into healthy debates with my buddies that are tied deeply into CrossFit.

Because I like to. I like to hear, especially guys that have been in it for very long and have been a doctor in big time. So they know all the CrossFit science. So I love listening to their... They won't come on our show. They'll explain things. Sudo science.

Yeah. Well, and they like to, the thing is that they like to explain all the benefits, like, which I feel like we've shared multiple times, all the benefits and the great things about it. But here's where, and this is what they use as one of their arguments, is that, just like in the training facility in a gym, there's bad trainers too. There's lots of bad trainers. How often do you...

I hear that all the time. So that's kind of their defense, is that well, there's really good coaches or really good CrossFit trainers out there. Well, here's the problem that I have with that, and this always shuts this down, is that you're right. But when you're talking about programming design and this always shuts this down, is that you're right, but when you're talking about programming design and being a really programmed design,

like what Sal is talking about right now, that's an individual thing. It's impossible to do it. So even if you're the best trainer at like kicking and consideration of that, they need to kind of de-load a little bit and because that's what they think of, because oh, I have this trainer and he de-loads us

and then one day we focus just on, you know, tempo and we go really slow and we don't, because they don't- See, that's not CrossFit anymore. That's what I'm saying. Like, my rebuttal to that is always, well, then tell me what the CrossFit philosophy and concept is. Like, explain to me the programming because a good, because then I get, I hear people saying that too. Well, I know a good CrossFit trainer. I train people and I change, well now you're not a CrossFit, you're just a personal trainer. You're just a personal trainer that's doing Olympic lifts and power lifts and bodyweight stuff. What is the concept, what is the philosophy and concept to CrossFit?

Here's what the philosophy and concept is. If you really want to know what the philosophy and concept and breakdown across it is, look at the CrossFit competition. What does a Crossfit competition look like? Does it look like they're specifically focused on one thing or does it look like they're trying to exhaust the fuck out of people and see who lasts longest? At the end of it, that's what it is.

It's a gauntlet. Right. It's 100% a gauntlet. And it's just displaying the fact that people are resilient. You know, like the human body is pretty resilient. And you can train in such a way where You know you can just get through it. You can just get through it and survive. Well, let me let me explain Let me give you one

Small detail like easy detail to understand right. Let's use Olympic lifts for example Olympic lifts do one thing very well Olympic lifts do one thing very well. They train explosive, what's called explosive power or speed power. In fact, Olympic lifts, aside from being extremely technical, let's just pretend that you know how to do a lift. Let's say you know how to do an Olympic lift with perfect form, so that's not an issue. That's what it does best, is it makes you, your strength,

it helps you apply your strength faster, to power exercise, okay? Now, any good coach will explain to you that your strength faster, the power exercise, okay. Now, any good coach will explain to you that you don't train power to fatigue because you no longer are training power. Now you're training endurance. You're training durability, you're training conditioning. So, are Olympic lifts then good to be used in that fashion?

No, because they're so technical. And if I'm training endurance, and durability, and conditioning, I'm gonna do a different exercise that doesn't require the form to be so fucking perfect. Because with Olympic lifts, if your form is off a little bit, it went from safe to not safe, real fast.

You see what I'm saying? So the proper way to use Olympic lift is to do, is to pick a weight that you could do with perfect form, and your goal is to be able to move that weight as fast as you fucking can. And then you put the weight down, you compose yourself, you catch your breath, and you do it again. And then you rest, and you compose yourself, and then you do it again. The goal is not to do it as many times as you possibly can within a certain period of time, because now you're just, you're not training power anymore, you're training conditioning.

Two different things, and you're using the wrong exercise for it. So I just wanted to use that example, because I think a lot of people can kind of understand that. Same thing with plyometrics. I've seen, you know, CrossFit gyms utilize plyometrics, like they'll do like, they'll sprint, then they'll do a bunch of burpees, then they'll do a bunch of this, and then jump on this plyo box. Yeah.

Well, now you're just jumping. You're not, you're not training to increase your ability to jump. You're eating chins. Yeah. It's fucking be serious. Yeah, because the proper way to do a plyo is. You're eating chins. That's fucking be serious. Yeah, cause the proper way to do a playo is like you do an Olympic lift. It's too, it's purposeful.

It's purposeful. I'm gonna jump as fast and hard as I can. Get down, I'm gonna concentrate 100% on being as explosive as I can now. Exactly. That's why I find it funny. I find it funny that they're slow in is the fittest man in the world,

or fittest woman in the world, and what all that. When it's like for what yeah Exactly for what because I take it what you'll never find a crossfit man or woman that is the best at any one of the one things that they do in their Best games they're there they may be really good at crossfit, you know, but you they'll know There'll always be someone who runs run faster than them run longer than them There'll always be somebody you can do more pull-ups and to do more. They're the best at unorthodox punishment. Yeah, it's an endurance, it's completely endurance is what it is, you know, if they, and it's amazing.

It's like it's strength endurance mixed with, you know, a bunch of different things, but it's really specific to the sport of CrossFit. It's like, again, it all boils down to the program. And guys, literally, gentlemen, if we looked at there, if we looked at CrossFit and just took the exercises and put them on a piece of paper, I think there's probably,

there probably be two exercises where all of us would be like, those aren't good. But the rest of the exercises, I can see the best. The best program with a lot of those exercises. Yes, if we took those exercises, and put them in smart programming, you'd have a great, you'd have a great program.

Well, let's be honest, we've talked about this before that that's the reason why we the number one thing they have going for them and why they why they did really explode because that's where even some trainers some for some reason justified because they do they see all these great movements and they're like wow these are really good movements and they can argue how much better it is and all this other stuff but it is it goes it comes down that well even in their certifications, they're so movement based, right? And so there is, I mean, they're part of it

that why, you know, also it appeals to somewhat of the intelligent type trainers is because they break down movements in their essence, right? But they're not talking about the competitive, the conditioning, like all the elements combined in the program. I mean, what they're doing is they're extracting, yeah, these are good exercises. Yeah, no shit, but it's all in how you apply it.

And that's where they're dropping the ball. You know what crossfit is? Crossfit is circuit training with better and more dangerous exercises. That's what it is. It's literally circuit training with, you know, exercise. You shouldn't do circuit training. Well, I was, I was, when people, when I first decided, okay, this isn't good, I'm not a fan of it.

And I didn't realize how big it was gonna be. I didn't really talk much about it and then I didn't care, to each the wrong. And there's this, if there's an elite group of guys that like to fuck and punish themselves like that, that's pretty badass. I, for one, I was like, I couldn't do that on a regular basis and work a normal job.

It was just too taxing on my body. I just didn't have that switch. And, sure, I could have trained the body to adapt to that and go through that punishment. But then the logical side of me is why? What would that do for me? It's not going to build me a better physique. You know what I'm saying? Like, it's so to do it, just to do it or to say, I did, you know?

And I was like, no. And then when they signed with Reebok, I actually got really excited. I thought, okay, this is cool. They're signing with a huge shoe company. They, the commercials they ran. Yeah, maybe they're going to transfer entirely into just the sport. Exactly. Exactly. And that's exactly what I was thought and was predicting was because even on the

commercials, they labeled it as a sport. They Reebok, you know, Reebok, you know, this and that. It was all sport. This sport that and and CrossFit. I'm like, cool, this is cool. This is where it belongs. It's football, it's soccer, it's basketball. It's awesome.

And it should be awesome. And I like watching it on TV. And that's just it. It's a sport though. And you can get in great shape playing soccer, football, basketball, and most certainly playing CrossFit. But that's what you're doing. You're playing.

You're not training, you're not training the body in the most efficient manner whatsoever, you are playing. And that's totally fine if you like doing that and you enjoy doing that, I think to each their own. But I had the problem when they started to push it like a business and people are trying to get as many members as they can and it's, you know, that's how they make their money. And so they have all these big group classes of 80% of them

are your average mom who's got, you know, had three kids never really worked out, carrying about 40 pounds extra weight on her. And she's doing fucking, you know, keeping pull ups and shit, you know, I'm saying like, come on dude, like, no, that's, that's terrible. I just remember like I said, you know, the Jiu-Jitsu guys did it, then they come back and they continued to do it and I

remember distinctly that their performance in jiu-jitsu drop was not better and they'd be fried they'd come in and they'd say that they were fried like oh I'm sore or who my shoulder hurts or I remember hearing that and it's like you're not getting any more fit for your particular goal which was for jiu-jitsu I'm not seeing it and you guys are all complaining of injuries. Then I remember, you know, having friends of mine that were trainers who looked great, looked healthy,

started doing tons of crossfit and little by little, exhibiting all the signs of over-training, exhibiting all the signs of over-stressed under-bodies. And then my last experience was owning a personal training studio and having people come in to my gym, fit people, come into my gym and hire me, and these are people who have been working out for years, hire me because they injured themselves doing CrossFit.

I had a guy who come in who was a fireman, very fit, very muscular guy, herniated his discs, severely injured, had to have to miss work for a long time, came to hire me to correct some of his imbalances, was planning on going back to CrossFit and I explained him it wasn't a good idea, and then the light bulb went off and he's like, God, you're right. Did I had to work out my whole life

and that never happened to me and all of a sudden I had these problems. I had the same exact experience. I was actually like at this place that was like a functional gym. And then obviously like a CrossFit gym right across the street opened up. And you know, they were there for a couple months and not within like maybe two, three months. I had somebody coming over and seeking me out because they found me online and then asked me, you know, my rates, all that

stuff is like, look, I'm doing CrossFit, I got her, you know, I wanna, you know, try something that's gonna build me back up and, you know, repair and level up. I'm like, great, you know, I'll take you on. Same exact experience, you know, coached him out of it. Basically, it was like, you know, you're doing yourself a disservice, like, you're just gonna get back and get into the grind of it

and get injured. And then, like, the guy that was like trying to kind of personal train because they had like personal train and group classes and they would still try and run them through the circuit, you know, the water or whatever. And so the guy comes in and he's looking for me, you know, he's just like, because he knows it like he just lost two clients to me. And so he meets me and I'm like, hey man, he's like, yeah, yeah, I'm over at the CrossFit gym over there. I'm like, oh, okay hey man. He's like, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm over at the CrossFit gym over there. I'm like, oh, okay, great.

It's like, yeah, you have two of my clients, you know, like a rich and I'm like, oh, that's cool. Interesting. Yeah, and then it was like super awkward. And he was just like trying to kind of scan, you know, the place and all the stuff, what I was doing different. And it was just so funny, because I was probably charging double

that he was for that, but they were coming up. But they're staying with me. But it's a thing, it's like, it's great on a surface level. It appeals to people at first because it is. It's hard. It's hard. You feel like something happened.

And you go through it with the group of people. It's like a martyr thing. Well, I think it's an answer, it's the industry's answer to a problem that existed before it, which was moving away from effective exercises, focusing too much on machines, focusing too much on the body builder mentality of exercise,

but I think it was the wrong answer. And I think the right answer will present itself eventually. And this is, and CrossFit is, they say performance oriented performance based. Well, it's not the most effective way. And I think that the answer will come out eventually. Definitely. Subscribe to Mind Pump, please leave us a five star rating and review. We love you.

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